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TechnoratiObama’s Military Is Spying on US Peace Groups
The infiltration appears to be in direct violation of the Posse Comitatus Act preventing U.S. military deployment for domestic law enforcement and may strengthen congressional demands for a full-scale investigation of U.S. intelligence activities, like the Church Committee hearings of the 1970s.
Brendan Maslauskas Dunn asked the city of Olympia for documents or e-mails about communications between the Olympia police and the military relating to anarchists, Students for a Democratic Society (SDS) or the Industrial Workers of the World (Dunn's union). Dunn received hundreds of documents. One e-mail contained reference to a "John J. Towery II," who activists discovered was the same person as their fellow activist "John Jacob."
Dunn told me: "John Jacob was actually a close friend of mine, so this week has been pretty difficult for me. He said he was an anarchist. He was really interested in SDS. He got involved with Port Militarization Resistance (PMR), with Iraq Vets Against the War. He was a kind person. He was a generous person. So it was really just a shock for me."
"Jacob" told the activists he was a civilian employed at Fort Lewis Army Base and would share information about base activities that could help the PMR organize rallies and protests against public ports being used for troop and Stryker military vehicle deployment to Iraq and Afghanistan. Since 2006, PMR activists have occasionally engaged in civil disobedience, blocking access to the port.
Larry Hildes, an attorney representing Washington activists, says the U.S. attorney prosecuting the cases against them, Brian Kipnis, specifically instructed the Army not to hand over any information about its intelligence-gathering activities, despite a court order to do so.
Which is why Dunn's request to Olympia and the documents he obtained are so important.
The military is supposed to be barred from deploying on U.S. soil, or from spying on citizens. Christopher Pyle, now a professor of politics at Mount Holyoke College, was a military intelligence officer. He recalled: "In the 1960s, Army intelligence had 1,500 plainclothes agents [and some would watch] every demonstration of 20 people or more. They had a giant warehouse in Baltimore full of information on the law-abiding activities of American citizens, mainly protest politics." Pyle later investigated the spying for two congressional committees: "As a result of those investigations, the entire U.S. Army Intelligence Command was abolished, and all of its files were burned. Then the Senate Intelligence Committee wrote the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 to stop the warrantless surveillance of electronic communications."
Reps. Barbara Lee, D-Calif., Rush Holt, D-N.J., and others are pushing for a new, comprehensive investigation of all U.S. intelligence activities, of the scale of the Church Committee hearings, which exposed widespread spying on and disruption of legal domestic groups, attempts at assassination of foreign heads of state, and more.
Demands mount for information on and accountability for Vice President Dick Cheney's alleged secret assassination squad, President George W. Bush's warrantless wiretapping program, and the CIA's alleged misleading of Congress. But the spying in Olympia occurred well into the Obama administration (and may continue today). President Barack Obama supports retroactive immunity for telecom companies involved in the wiretapping, and has maintained Bush-era reliance on the state secrets privilege. Lee and Holt should take the information uncovered by Brendan Dunn and the Olympia activists and get the investigations started now.
Denis Moynihan contributed research to this column.
64 Comments so far
Show AllWe don't have/use weapons. All we do is protest against the existing order in ways that jam up the economy, even though our total "damage" is less than what any drug cartel/street gang does to a city.
For all this, leftist protest groups are considered the most dangerous domestic "terrorists". We're infiltrated by military and police spies while the real terrorists, skinheads, ultra-"Christians", and corporatists, infiltrate the police, military, and "citizen militias".
I think most of the men making decisions in the military and related businesses know that to most people, their actions are reprehensible, and they can't hide forever. Their own designs have backfired and they're getting more desperate. Certainly, NORTHCOM's desperate intentions are more dangerous, but they can't pretend they are in total control anymore if they have to resort to crude plans like this.
jh the reason they don't investigate corp. boardroom's is that's
command central.the govt. is just middle management taking
orders from on high.sioux rose yes that thing with rod serling.
reread robert heinlein from the 50'-60's and its stunning
how much of this came true! one more reference to thomas
jefferson. he said that we need to have revolution every
20 yrs or so just to keep our govt. from becoming just what
is happening now.apparently he was a psychic as well!
his vision was truly unlimited. well done netbud. we all
probably have had a post disappear here due to some
maybe questionable statements. this is wrong. wouldn't
be funny if this is really a secret govt. spy collection
site. even if their righty plants like henry the8th
its still supposed to democratic. right?
Full disclosure, I wasn't patient enough to read all the 50+ comments, but I saw a lot of good ones. I have to throw in with a little something for the spies, if I may.
To the watchers, busy reading and watching sites like, well, this one. To all you out there, all of you willing to spy on us...please remember...the watchers are always watched. Always.
Because, if they happen to see the truth from the inside, spies can be embarassing and sometimes they change their minds about what they're doing and change sides. So you (insert spy identity here) are being watched. By people more dangerous than you.
Just something to think about, while you laugh at us and our worries and our fears of being spied upon, while we know full well it's unconstitutional and basically illegal as hell, in all it's spying forms and our taxpayer funding of it. You're at more risk than we are, internet spy, because you're closer to it, and you're doing the dirty work. Just in case it hadn't occured to you. You might want to think about it. The watchers are always watched.
You might not care about defending your country, or upholding and defending the Constitution of the United States, but you might care about your own ass. So, say HELLO to the camera, and THINK about it. Please.
Whatever4,
Good message for the spies and for everyone.
Don't try to communicate with the hovering spies. They simply execute software loops, one to earn their mammon and another to spend it.
I suppose the various investigating committees will be about as thorough and accurate as the Warren Commission and the 9-11 Commission. I'm also certain that anything burned or deleted in public has been stored on discs at an "undisclosed location" for future use, "eyes only."
The WTO "riots" in Seattle in '99 interested me at the time. I noticed two things. One was a lot of gratuitous violence by the cops, which we saw on live TV, but never again. The other was the fact that the demonstrations were mainly peaceful civil disobedience even in the face of police overreaction. Then, suddenly, the masked, unidentifiable "anarchists" showed up, breaking windows, etc., always where the police weren't. Peaceful demonstrators asked them to knock it off, that they weren't helping, but they were ignored. Before the police arrived, they were gone, to turn up somewhere else the police weren't. The cops used this to really lay into the peaceful demonstrators with gas, batons, etc.
My statement at the time was that these were probably cops or double agents acting as provocateurs. They were told where to be, and when to leave, to promote disruption and reaction. It pretty well worked.
I'm sure the playbook has been revised and updated many times since then.
Interesting and informative comments about banning, CD censorship and the like. I think we have to be on guard AGAINST all forms of censorship and appreciate the many who share their views and experiences here.
This place (CD) NEEDS to be an open forum FOR the people. I want to thank ALL those people who are participating and making it so and also wish to WARN those who might censor (anything) to be EXTREMELY cautious about doing so.
How do you achieve freedom except by loving it and encouraging it above and beyond all other considerations?
FREEDOM.
thanks folks,
nedlud
Amy Goodman wrote, "The military is supposed to be barred from deploying on U.S. soil, or from spying on citizens".
That was once true, but the Bush administration established NORTHCOM in October 2002 and began deploying it in the U.S. during (I believe) fall 2007 or 2008.
Following are a few articles that'll provide readers of these with more and better information than I can.
""Defending the Homeland", Major Counterterrorism Exercises: What Is NorthCom Up To?",
by Matthew Rothschild, The Progressive, Nov 12, 2008
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=10992
QUOTE:
This week and into next, NorthCom and NORAD are conducting a joint exercise called “Vigilant Shield ’09.”
The focus will be on “homeland defense and civil support,” a NorthCom press release states.
From November 12-18, it will be testing a “synchronized response of federal, state, local and international partners in preparation for homeland defense, homeland security, and civil support missions in the United States and abroad.”
...
The Pentagon’s “Bulwark Defender 09” is also involved ....
Something called the “Canada Command DETERMINED DRAGON” also is participating, as is the California National Guard and California’s “Golden Guardian.”
...
NorthCom is being shy about giving out additional information about Vigilant Shield ’09. When I called for a fact sheet on it, I was told there was none.
But the Pentagon did issue such a fact sheet for Vigilant Shield ’08.
END QUOTE/EXCERPTS
"Militarization of the American Homeland: Suppression of "Civil Disturbances"
ACLU Demands Information on U.S. Military Domestic Operations",
by Tom Burghardt, Oct 25, 2008
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=10683
"Militarizing the "Homeland" in Response to the Economic and Political Crisis
NORTHCOM's Joint Task Force-Civil Support",
by Tom Burghardt, Antifascist-calling.blogspot.com, Oct 11, 2008
QUOTE:
Antifascist Calling reported, ... that nine months prior to the 9/11 terrorist attacks, Donald Rumsfeld signed off on revisions for the Pentagon's secretive Continuity of Operations Program (COOP).
Based on a document (AR 500-3) published by the whistleblowing website Wikileaks, it described "all hazards COOP planning" as the mechanism by which "the Army remains capable of continuing mission-essential operations during any situation, including military attack, terrorist activities, and natural or man-made disasters."
The Wikileaks document is all the more relevant since a September report in Army Times described how the 3rd Infantry Division's 1st Brigade Combat Team (BCT) would be deployed October 1 "under the day-to-day control of U.S. Army North," the "service component" of NORTHCOM.
Since that article appeared September 8, Army Times has done a partial climb-down and now claims that the "non-lethal crowd control package" ..., "is intended for use on deployments to the war zone, not in the U.S., as previously stated."
But this mendacious claim by Army Times is belied by current political trends in the U.S. ...
...
A highly-disturbing report by Christopher Ketchum in the May/June 2008 issue of Radar Magazine, outlined how the top secret Main Core database linked to Continuity of Government contingency planning, "includes dissidents and activists of various stripes, political and tax protesters, ...."
Reporting in July for Salon, investigative journalist Tim Shorrock was told by a source that Main Core is "'an emergency internal security database system' designed for use by the military in the event of a national catastrophe, a suspension of the Constitution or the imposition of martial law. Its name ... is derived from the fact that it contains 'copies of the 'main core' or essence of each item of intelligence information on Americans produced by the FBI and the other agencies of the U.S. intelligence community'."
..., "forward thinking" ruling class factions are openly preparing a "Pinochet option" for the American people.
In this context, the militarization of domestic law enforcement is now coupled with the military's own rapid development and deployment of "non-lethal weapons" systems which inevitably, will be "shared" with civilian police for "crowd control." As with data mining, DHS spy-satellite surveillance, blanket CCTV coverage of American cities, illegal FBI deployment of infiltrators and provocateurs, "mission creep" by the Pentagon into civil affairs are signs that stronger measures to blunt the crisis may be in the offing. ...
During the recent Vibrant Response exercise at Fort Stewart, Georgia, three units of NORTHCOM's Consequence Management Response Force (CCMRF, pronounced "sea-smurfs"), including two combat units from the 1st Brigade Combat Team, 3rd Army Division and the elite 82nd Combat Aviation Brigade participated in mock drills designed to "coordinate with local governments and interagency organizations such as ...," according to a report on U.S. Northern Command News.
Interestingly enough, Fort Stewart is also the site of a top secret NSA listening post that routinely "intercepted and transcribed satellite phone calls of American civilians in the Middle East for the NSA," according to a whistleblower and ..., Wired reports.
...
..., current Army doctrine is heavily-weighted towards contingency planning for "civil disturbances." While these programs are not new and in fact, plans such as Garden Plot and Cable Splicer have been integral to military doctrine since the late 1960s, what is new -- and highly disturbing -- is the launch of NORTHCOM's Joint Task Force Civil Support (JTF-CS).
Located at Ft. Monroe in Hampton, Virginia, JTF-CS is described on NORTHCOM's website as "a subordinate command of U.S. Northern Command, a unified combatant command formed in October 2002 to plan, organize and execute both homeland defense and civil support missions."
END QUOTE/EXCERPTS
What a cowinkidinkie - fr: the AP, today:
"The internal bulletin — reviewed by The Associated Press — says the FBI and the Homeland Security Department are very worried about the danger posed by little-noticed Americans traveling abroad to learn terrorism techniques, then coming back to the United States, where they may be dormant for long periods of time while they look for followers to recruit for future attacks."
AKA - "The Return Of The Dreaded Sleeper Cells!"
And, if you're a smart anti-America jihadist with plans on taking down the largest and deadliest military in the known universe at some point in the future, where would you hide, er, I mean sleep?
The nearest 'peace group,' of course!
Woo hoo! I hit the trifecta today. Every time I read an article about how Barak "Brownbush" is carrying on the legacy, I save it and add it to my list. Today I read about the rejection of immigration detention rules (which I posted on), protecting illegal DoD propaganda and now this. And the day is young! Here's the list:
War On Drugs re. Chavez
Support Israeli crimes
Rendition
Executive Secrecy & Privilege
Immunity for Illegal Wiretapping
Maintain Illegal Wiretapping
Troops/War In iraq
Increase Debt
Capital Punishment
Fight Gay Marriage rights
Offshore Drilling
Corporate Bailouts
Drone Strikes In Pakistan
Protect Torturers
Cut Veterans Benefits
Silence On Gaza
Appoint Industry Insiders
European missile shield
Boycott UN Session On Racism
Support "Clean Coal"
Protect Israeli Spies
Polluters Over Polar Bears
Drop White Phosphorus On Civilians
Military Commissions Trials
Oppose Valerie Plame's Case
Mum On Israeli Nukes
Oppose Single Payer Health Care
Outsourcing Intelligence/Interrogation
Unlawful enemy combatant status & prolonged detention
Mountaintop Removal Coal Mining
Privatize War
Use DOJ to Help Repugs Not Dems
Secret White House Visitors List
Criminalize Legal Dissent
Secret Meeting w/ Energy Execs
Protect Saudis From Terrorist/911 Links
Increase Military Spending
Let NSA Spy On Private Internet Traffic
Keep Cheney Interview Secret
Falsely Claim Iran Aids Taliban
Militarize Africa For Resources
Don't Support Privacy and Civil Liberties Oversight Board
Support Cheney's Concealment of Assassin Program from Congress
Reject Immigration Detention Rules
Protect Illegal DoD Propaganda
Military Spying On Peace Groups
In other words: Bush III/Neo Con/fascist with a "D" after his name.
"appears to be in direct violation of the Posse Comitatus Act preventing U.S. military deployment for domestic law enforcement "
If the government acknowledges at all, it will probably say that domestic surviellance is not accomplishe in order to enforce any law, but rather to determine if activist groups are being infiltrated by agents hostile to the American way of life. Each service member must take an oath to 'defend the Constitution from all enemies, foreign or domestic' and as such it is not difficult to convince any of them that such surveillance is not only lawful, but patriotic.... The government can easily point to past "peace groups" that have planted bombs and injured people, (some innocent bystanders), or distroyed equipment (economic warfare), or other actions that the public would WANT the government to protect them from.
There is a fine line that a free society must protect which separates government surveillance for the purpose of national security and for the purpose of political profiling. The intelligence community knows that elected political leaders come and go, and therefor may tend to, shall we say, have loyalities to a 'shadow government' (if such a thing exist).
The answer, in my opinion, is that we must strive to educate ALL Americans as to the wording and intent of the Constitution itself. We have deviated so far from the words set out by our founding fathers that we accept that it is a good thing to have surveillance cameras at each interstate interchange, outside public building, inside public buildings, in our schools. We allow voice pick up monitors in our convience stores so that managers can listen in on shopper's conversations, all in the name of protection from crime. The Constitution specifically prohibits expost facto laws, yet we accept them all the time now... why? The laws should take effect AFTER the vote, not retro-active to before the vote was taken... we're just too ignorant of what the Constitution says, so we accept what is done. We accept "news" reports that tell us, not what was actually said, but what the reporter believes will be the effects of what was said.
Bottom line I guess, is that not everything the government does is evil, but as citizens we need to take responsibility for our government and our elected officials, NOT be responsible to them.
Three things:
1. This is terrible, yet in a way good,since it has been exposed.
2. Editing mistake: The Capitol Police in Oly are State Patrol Officers, not "federal" (Its the State Capitol). Unless this was meant to refer to the Captiol Police in the Other Washington for some reason?
3. The PMR and their relations are a bunch of naive, childish, counter-productive idiots. As they ably proved by working with someone who actually TOLD them he worked at Ft. Lewis! I don't want to take the space to explain this better here, or repeat myself, so I'll just say: please refer to my post under Matthew Rothchild's article on this same topic in Tuesday's CD headlines for the view of a former Olympian on these folks.
-matti.
How nice to find a prosecutable gaffe in this so persistent abuse.
A crowbar right there will shake some nasty stuff loose.
To spies lurking on CD:
Welcome. We're just messing with you.
Obama's administration, including "his" military, is spying on EVERYONE at ALL TIMES.
Why don't they infiltrate the vast conspiracy in corporate board rooms? That's where the real threat to our way of life is. The destruction of our security and right to the pursuit of happiness occurs when people are in bondage to their medical bills, usurious mortgages, and fear of losing or quitting jobs they hate because their employer provides "health" insurance (is this indentured servitude?).
Our military is obviously being used as a private army to protect those very corporate interests who must protect their rights to subjugate.
Oh my God, Obama is breaking the law again with illegal spying? But if he does that the next prez will, oh yeah, look the other way.
Henry 8, I'm guessing your mind is just easily boggled.
Cheney, Rumsfeld and the Pentagon have compatible goals and work well together. I use the present tense because Cheney and Rumsfeld are still working closely with the military under the table.
War-all-the-time is a cornucopia for those pulling the stings, and the military-industrial complex is running stronger now than ever. It pays handsomely.
If you really want your mind boggled, however, read "War is a Racket" by Gen. Smedley Butler. He knew more about the military game than you do, and so do I.
Headline aside, the military is not Obama's military.
The commander-in-chief is the nominal head, but he doesn't own it or have much direct control over much of what it does.
It is a law unto itself, and seems to have been that way from the very beginning. (General Jackson invading Florida and then having to give it back.)
Lots of yes-sirs down the line, and then it quietly, secretly, does pretty much what it wants.
From time to time there's a show of someone getting their knuckles rapped, and then the Blue Curtain of protection closes around them and the game goes on.
In the United States we have an autonomous, mercenary military that makes it's own laws.
Is that how it works? And Obama gets the blame. Cute. Not that he isn't to blame for plenty on his own. But everything?
Cheney seemed to have plenty of control over the military. Or maybe he just agreed with everything they did.
As for infiltrations, I've read before that infiltrators are ardent supporters of whatever they are snooping. Makes sense. The Russians dealt with it by only trusting lifelong friends. I realize at times, I have been too trusting myself. Even here.
When the people fear their government there is tyranny,
when the government fears the people there is liberty.
~ Thomas Jefferson
"In the United States we have an autonomous, mercenary military that makes it's own laws."
This statement is such an absurdity its mind boggling. Gald you know better. And pointing out that Cheney and Rumsfeld seemed to exert plenty of control over the military should be enough proof for everyone.
Waiting for Obama to clean up CIA and Homeland Security, promote prosecution of those who authorized illegal domestic spying, or even stop the illegal domestic spying still going on, say anything at all about repealing the Patriot Act, is like waiting for Godot. You'll wait and wait and wait...
Obama is bushier than Bush.
"Obama is bushier than Bush."
If only my fellow Oklahomans could figure that one out. Most of them, the ones who vote Republican anyway, still think that Obama is more liberal than Clinton !
Tell me about it. I live in Texas and all day long I hear all about how Obama is the demonic reincarnation of Karl Marx. If I talked myself blue in the face I couldn't convince them that Obama is only slightly more liberal than Bush, and only on the field of culture wars. I lose my temper when they start with the marxist-socialist stuff though, since Obama has been talking about cutting social security and medicare since the day after his inauguration, while handing out the corporate welfare.
Gore Vidal article? Hey I didn't know about that.
Bring it back.
This thread is shrinking rapidly.... In defense of Common Dreams, they are responsible for all postings on the boards. Other web sites have been sued for slander for allowing thread to continue..etc. etc. etc...
BUT, I do wish that they would ALLOW more divergent view points. Even though they may be non-profit affiliated, and irrespective of the fact that they promote themselves to be a progressive news site, the fact that they quite often quell conversations not in their line of reasoning contributes to an ignorant population. I believe that it is important to listen to ALL view points, try to be respectful and try to stay on topic... not always easy, but we can all try. CD has the right to censor the boards, but often I wish they'd be more open minded... just an opinion
This is probably the article you're looking for:
America the Great ... Police State
July 28, 2009
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/
20090728_america_the_great_police_state/?ln
Yep, that's the one. It was on CD earlier this morning, long enough for me to read it and post a comment and then it was 'disappeared'. I don't know why but it was. I saw it, read it, and commented. Still MIA so far as I can tell. Did anybody else see it besides me? I mean on here (CD)?
Thanks guys.
nedlud July 29th, 2009 11:44 am...Yeah, I saw it and am pretty sure I commented on it, too. Where the hell did it go?
A REALLY GOOD ARTICLE, TOO!
...the Church Committee hearings, which exposed widespread spying on and disruption of legal domestic groups, attempts at assassination of foreign heads of state, and more.
-------------------------
...and "more".
The "more" that the Church Committee exposed includes the revelation that the media (virtually all of it) had been infiltrated with HUNDREDS of CIA agents.
From Carl Bernstein in Rolling Stone, 1977:
"...During the 1976 investigation of the CIA by the Senate Intelligence Committee, chaired by Senator Frank Church, the dimensions of the Agency’s (CIA) involvement with the press became apparent to several members of the panel, as well as to two or three investigators on the staff. But top officials of the CIA, including former directors William Colby and George Bush, persuaded the committee to restrict its inquiry into the matter and to deliberately misrepresent the actual scope of the activities in its final report."...
Full and unedited at:
http://www.carlbernstein.com/magazine_cia_and_media.php
** For CD'ers interested in media manipulation by the government I STRONGLY recommend this forgotten article from Carl Bernstein.
"the media (virtually all of it) had been infiltrated with HUNDREDS of CIA agents."
It still is, especially the "progressive" media. They infiltrate the management of these boards, and even camp-out on them.
Now that the internet has become the path of least resistance for all public discourse, I would imagine that most public political discourse now takes place over the internet, where it can be easily monitored in real time by human agents and computers. Everything we're writing is being monitored and our addresses can be traced back to the computer of origin. With the latest computers this is very easy to do, and it's getting even easier very rapidly.
Investigate, investigate, investigate; and do nothing with the findings. They spend a lot of time and money investigating. What will be the charge if they find that the military has, in fact, been spying on anti-war activities? Who will be charged? They can't seem to mount an investigation on chargeable crimes such as crimes against humanity or treason; they don't "want to take focus from bills that need to be passed like 'healthcare reform'(what a joke)". This is the worlds largest illusionist act. There are so many magicians on stage that one can't keep track of what is disappearing next, whether it be constitutional rights, or tax dollars, or trust in our elected representatives. And, while the show goes on we keep hearing how they are protecting and striving to serve us, and how our well being is foremost on their hearts and minds. BULLSHIT! All the while, WE the PEOPLE are being pitted against each other; being polarized to such a degree that if the Central Government were to faulter, we would be killing each other! I consider myself a proponent of peace but haven't met a right wing conservative christian type that I don't find easy to want to strangle(that might be stretching it a bit)(but not much)(I'd like to give them a kick in the ass)(maybe more), and I'm sure the feeling is mutual. There is no rational discourse, no offer of compromise. One side sees it as the life or death of the economy, and I see it as the life or death of humanity. The world is on the brink of just about everything, or so it seems to me. Maybe that is the problem. The media loves drama, and they have been pushing for a long time. Maybe things aren't as desperate as they are made out to be. I don't know, but I have been on edge for over a decade.
Sioux Rose
JOHN: A lot of us feel (and think) what you do. You are NOT alone. Of course if you read yesterday's article about the "cult of happiness," a new inroad by the authoritarians to make happiness the new "norm" in the face of unbelievably tragic and trying conditions suggests that being IN the know may soon become dangerous. Only those who wear the requisite smile and don't notice the injustices taking place everywhere around them may soon qualify as "normal" or "good" citizens. I don't know how Rod Serling gained prescient insight into all of these machinations of modern life, but he sure had his intuition on the button years before the American version of the beast of totalitarianism got so well fed.
What happened to the Gore Vidal article appearing, then disappearing (here on CD) just minutes ago?
What is that about, editors?
If it's the article about "stupid police", it came from Truthdig. You can still see it there: http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20090728_america_the_great_police_state/
Thanks but still wondering: why did it get removed from here? And, does this happen frequently? I've never witnessed it before. The disappearance of a posted article on CD...
nedlud July 29th, 2009 11:47 am.............Strange things happen on CD. I have lost count of the number of times I have been banned for no apparent reason than mentioning the false flag of 9/11 too many times. Looks like the same thing happened to the "namaste" person.
Sioux Rose
Easy: He misses this forum deeply, and asked me to post a link for him. I have had some difficulty doing so as a result of my limited computer skills. I will try again. I wrote to Craig Brown asking that Namaste be allowed back. Maybe others could also do so?
Siouxrose July 29th, 2009 1:43 pm...........I'll do so, thanks. Cannot understand CD's problem....as yourself, he was one of the wiser and most honest posters.
Sioux Rose
EASY: Thank you. As to the poster below (PDG), Namaste is far more savvy than I with computer tricks, and he has used probably 10 names; but he told me he cannot get back on. I suspect it had to do with postings regarding 911, but it seems there are foul types ON this site on a fairly regular basis, who move through the radar. I have had some posts disappear. Perhaps at some point the site will PUBLISH its protocols? Of course that would lend evidence to the fact that some censorship does go on. I am unsure who that protects? Perhaps there are liabilities we are unaware of? Luckily the articles are powerful, and we have a huge pool of talent that posts here. In a nation that's largely gone mad, I look forward to the virtual company this site provides.
Exercise in futility.
There are endless nicknames and e-mail accounts that one can set up to get back on here. That's what I've done.
The CD server may ban by I.P. address.
If so, you need to use anonymity software like Tor.
Background:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tor_(anonymity_network)
Free download:
https://www.torproject.org/
Yes, sending a TOR'pedo with the flavor of Allium .onion
pjd412 July 29th, 2009 2:39 pm.............Same here. Could be Namaste is taking a stand...Who knows.
Hmm...I see the Obama voters here are strangely quiet.
I'm Back.
And I'll bet it is Obama voters who are exposing this.
Of course this has been goin on before I was born.
Is this news to you?
Did I touch a nerve there, Jim? I hope so.
My point was: if any of his voters had had any life experience at all and/or an IQ higher than a small soap dish, they should not have been ignorant to what Obama was about from his Senate record, and especially given the content of his speeches after his nomination and his pick of Biden as running mate. That is, IF they had been paying attention and not entertaining delusional fantasy scenarios.
But no, anything was better than Bush/Cheney Redux, right? Well, not really.
The same dysfunctional mantra existed in '04 with Kerry, who, if he had been rightfully placed in the White House, would have netted us not much different than what we have now. The lesson being: most candidates, R or D, are simply bought-and-paid-for corporate whores/shiny TV glamour boys & girls that have little interest in the average person's well-being, and thus do not deserve their votes.
Is this news to YOU?
So one of the questions becomes: have these facts penetrated the thick skulls of these voters yet, enough for them to change their mindless voting habits, even after all of the embarrassment and remorse they may now feel in having voted for these thugs?
I would say they have not.
The only nerve you touched was blaming Obama voters like me, when you guys couldn't get elected to anything that could change US Policy. The call to investigate this in Congress is coming from Obama voters.
Get real.
Organize so you can do something.
Nader now wants you to make sure your politicians know about how you feel, I hope you take his advice and do something constructive instead of acting like voting for Nader or splitting progressive votes again is gonna change anything.
I want to know what you are gonna do about it now, not what a 3rd party candidate could have done if only everyone joined your fantasy and voted for them.
It seems rather likely that Amy Goodman probably voted for Nader. And the Olympia and Seattle anarchists did NOT vote for Obama - or probably anyone else.
And the newsworthyness of it is that it is the Army that is spying on US civilians on US soil under a coordination scheme with local law enforcement - a clear violation of posse commitatus.
I'd bet you 100 bucks at least half of these "anarchists" talked about voting for McKinney or Nader for almost a year and then spaced out on voting AT ALL.
Don't flame me, I'm from Oly and I know some of these people and these groups pretty damned well.
Useless post.
Like Wanderer, I think that the shot against Green Party activists was unfair. However, I think that Obama voters and Nader voters need to stop beating up on each other. We need some good, constructive dialogue, which is sometimes difficult on an online forum.
I voted for Nader in 2000 and took a fair bit of heat for it, so I can sympathize with many a Nader voter. I then voted for Kerry in 2004, and Obama in 2008. Although Obama sickens me and I would have rather voted for Edwards or Kucinich (and I caucused for Kucinich in 2004), I have become a pragmatist because the possibility of a Palin/McCain presidency would have been an utter disaster. Yes, the Democrats are spineless and pathetic, but the damage that Palin and McCain would have done to our country would have taken years to undo. I have decent computer skills, a college degree and a job with health insurance, so I can survive a Republican presidency. However, for some low-income families and unskilled workers who have no computer skills or internet access like the rest of us, a Republican administration can mean the difference between keeping their apartment and living on the street. For my brother with autism, a Republican presidency would have meant more funding cuts to the nonprofit that serves him, and I can't bring myself to do anything that might result in that happening because I love him too much.
We have a lot of work to do before the Green Party gains traction here in the U.S. What Green Party activists need to do is what the conservative Christians did in 1994 -- run for school board elections, local offices, and all of the unsexy positions are less glamourous than the presidency. I've voted for Green Party candidates here in San Francisco because I know they have a chance and getting elected and because my vote against a Democrat won't mean that a Republican might wind up being my representative and cutting social services for low-income San Franciscans.
"I have become a pragmatist because the possibility of a Palin/McCain presidency would have been an utter disaster. Yes, the Democrats are spineless and pathetic, but the damage that Palin and McCain would have done to our country would have taken years to undo."
Ah, yes, but will the Democrats undo the damage that Bush has done? Or are we just going to tread water until the next Republican enters the scene and damages this country further?
For the record... Nader voter.
Aye.
Sure, we can only guess who Amy voted for and this has been going on since the red squads in most police depts.
"Reps. Barbara Lee, D-Calif., Rush Holt, D-N.J., and others are pushing for a new, comprehensive investigation of all U.S. intelligence activities, of the scale of the Church Committee hearings, which exposed widespread spying on and disruption of legal domestic groups, attempts at assassination of foreign heads of state, and more."
I am not saying it is not newsworthy, it is big if we do more than talk to each other.
There was an Army intel division that was asked to stand down in Dallas for example.
They were supposed to help check all threats with local police... Spying domestically using military personnel is not new but Bush sure did increase it. Now we need to write to Obama so he knows we won't be silent.
It takes guts to speak truth to power.
Considering that:
1. Amy was quite critical of Obama during his presidential campaign,
2. She has long interviews with Nader a number of times during his campaign;
3. New York was a "safe state" assuming she wanted to paly that gme.
I say it is a terribly safe bet she voted for Nader.
As far as the anarchists - I don't begrudge them at al for not voting - I came close to such a decision myself.
They're, uhhhhh, just beginning to 'wake up'. ;)
Thank god.
I was getting SO tired
of putting up with their abusive nature
towards third party voters.
I haven't been posting on Common Dreams for very long, but I noticed, almost immediately, that people were receptive to third parties, and ready to discuss third parties.
I, myself, voted for Ralph Nader.
After his FISA vote, and his decision, if elected, to escalate the war in Afghanistan, I couldn't vote for Obama.
EVen though I was too young to vote last year, that's what did it for me too.
Yes,
It's like buying a lemon automobile. You drive around in stunned silence for a few weeks until it sinks in.
When are we ever going to learn?
Campaign contributions never lie.
Wealth MUST BE protected. It MUST BE protected from you, the public, who won't use it for the right purpose.
Only the people who have the wealth know what it is for. It is to keep them happy and 'safe'.
So wealth MUST BE protected at all costs, by all means, to keep the wealthy 'safe'.
From you.