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TechnoratiBritain and other European governments should break from the US over the international embargo on Gaza, former US president Jimmy Carter told the Guardian yesterday. Carter, visiting the Welsh border town of Hay for the Guardian literary festival, described the EU's position on the Israeli-Palestinian dispute as "supine" and its failure to criticise the Israeli blockade of Gaza as "embarrassing".
Referring to the possibility of Europe breaking with the US in an interview with the Guardian, he said: "Why not? They're not our vassals. They occupy an equal position with the US."
The blockade on Hamas-ruled Gaza, imposed by the US, EU, UN and Russia - the so-called Quartet - after the organisation's election victory in 2006, was "one of the greatest human rights crimes on Earth," since it meant the "imprisonment of 1.6 million people, 1 million of whom are refugees". "Most families in Gaza are eating only one meal per day. To see Europeans going along with this is embarrassing," Carter said.
He called on the EU to reassess its stance if Hamas agreed to a ceasefire in Gaza. "Let the Europeans lift the embargo and say we will protect the rights of Palestinians in Gaza, and even send observers to Rafah gate [Gaza's crossing into Egypt] to ensure the Palestinians don't violate it."
Although it is 27 years since he left the White House, Carter recently met Hamas leaders in Damascus. He declared a breakthrough in persuading the organisation to offer a Gaza ceasefire and a halt to Palestinian rocket attacks on Israel if Israel stopped its air and ground strikes on the territory.
Carter described western governments' self-imposed ban on talking to Hamas as unrealistic and said everyone knew Israel was negotiating with the organisation through an Egyptian mediator, Omar Suleiman. Suleiman took the Hamas ceasefire offer to Jerusalem last week.
Israel was still hesitating over the ceasefire, Carter confirmed yesterday. "I talked to Mr Suleiman the day before yesterday. I hope the Israelis will accept," he said.
While being scrupulously polite to the Palestinian Authority president, Mahmoud Abbas, and prime minister, Salam Fayyad, who represent the Fatah movement, he was scathing about their exclusion of Hamas. He described the Fatah-only government as a "subterfuge" aimed at getting round Hamas's election victory two years ago. "The top opinion pollster in Ramallah told me the other day that opinion on the West Bank is shifting to Hamas, because people believe Fatah has sold out to Israel and the US," he said.
Carter said the Quartet's policy of not talking to Hamas unless it recognised Israel and fulfilled two other conditions had been drafted by Elliot Abrams, an official in the national security council at the White House. He called Abrams "a very militant supporter of Israel". The ex-president, whose election-monitoring Carter Centre had just certified Hamas's election victory as free and fair, addressed the Quartet for 12 minutes at its session in London in 2006. He urged it to talk to Hamas, which had offered to form a unity government with Fatah, the losers.
"The Quartet's final document had been drafted in Washington in advance, and not a line was changed," he said.
Earlier, Carter, told Sky News that Hillary Clinton should abandon her battle to become Democratic presidential candidate after the last round of primaries in early June. Like many superdelegates, he has yet to declare his support for either Clinton or Barack Obama, but he suggested the outcome of the race was a foregone conclusion. "I think that a lot of us superdelegates will make a decision ... quite rapidly, after the final primary on June 3," he said. "I think at that point it will be time for her to give it up."
Last night, before a packed crowd at Hay, Carter spoke of his "horror" at America's involvement in torturing prisoners, saying he wanted the next US president to promise never to do so again.
He left an intriguing hint that George Bush might even face prosecution on war crimes charges once he left office.
When pressed by Philippe Sands QC on Bush's recent admission that he had authorised interrogation procedures widely seen as amounting to torture, Carter replied that he was sure Bush would be able to live a peaceful, "productive life - in our country".
Sands, an international legal expert, said afterwards that he understood that to be "clear confirmation" that while Bush would face no challenge in his own country, "what happened outside the country was another matter entirely".
© 2008 The Guardian
68 Comments so far
Show All'If humans woke up tomorrow and became sane, and determined to build sustainable communities, leaving the war machinery and corporate controls behind…"
You mean 'abandon 5k-years of Civilized-Progress&Conquest', and just 'share the Plenty' in a sustainable-fashion, instead? [We'd best not 'hold our breath'!].
Most of our current-Cards are being held, and over-Played -- and both the Mythos and Resources of the ME/C.Asia are the Kitty and at-Stake (with Africa's, Asia's, S.America's being bet/bluffed-with, also). The Truth holds no-cards in a rigged-game, and the People have no-choices in their proxy-Players -- as fortunes wax&wane.
I'd like that 'cake/cheez-burger' someday, and the stories that might-accompany...[stay-well, until then...].
"Have you considered any bio/book/doc/publication, or do you participate (in more-detail) in some other Forum? Have your lawsuit(s) progressed, at all?]"
I tend to focus my limited resources where they are most needed, as best I can. My first interest is the Herbivore Awareness Project (100 million sentient creatures are slaughtered each day in the US alone).
Once that communication is successfully accomplished, I may return to a book I began years ago called Karmic Cow. It is my personal history (plus reflections), an adventure story to be sure, about what happens when one seriously asks, "What is the cause of war?"
"Please continue to expound upon what you were actually privy-to in/of Iran (you are 'in' ass-deep, already, so you may as well "get it all out-there" — your best security being 'having little left to tell'?)."
:) Exactly. But, after an intense amount of stalking, I also published my address on indymedia... it did help a bit... but harassment continues, broken windshield, breakins, petty theft, paychecks denied, etc.
It seems counter intuitive but the secret services really do not want the general public apprised of their continuing COINTELPRO programs against activists or those who have seen too much. They especially do not want to be 'in process' and get caught in public view...
As for law suits to recover stolen properties… we have encountered a well oiled slander machine determined to keep covered the crimes that have been committed. I could never get a 'fair' day in court… not today, maybe never. I don't consider it.
If humans woke up tomorrow and became sane, and determined to build sustainable communities, leaving the war machinery and corporate controls behind… I have no idea what would be my personal interests… trek a few thousand miles to unwind? Maybe.
Or maybe just open a vegan café and serve cake and my delicious vegan cheez burgers.
"Not 'recent', afaik [front-agencies in Argentina were used 'by' Reagan during Iran-CONTRA for systems/weapons shipment, and transported from there via Israel (covertly) directly to Iran"
I understood you to be speaking of an Argentinean connection. I did not understand you were speaking of US military support from its established bases in Argentina and Israel.
Yes, the US military runs Argentina so of course and oversees Israeli operations in the Middle East that includes well-established Israel-Iran connections.
"As far as Argentina and the Israelis, if such a connection is pronounced it is certainly very recent and I have no special knowledge of Israeli or Argentinean influences"
Not 'recent', afaik [front-agencies in Argentina were used 'by' Reagan during Iran-CONTRA for systems/weapons shipment, and transported from there via Israel (covertly) directly to Iran]. Perhaps your familiarity with some details of Iranian machinations/'usefulness' (through your ex?) dried-up shortly after the 'revolution'/1981?
Still...your viewpoint is 'fascinating' (as are your family-history&'adventures'). Like Me/many, you fell-afoul of the Chinese-curse of 'living an interesting-life'...but, you seem to have learned Much from your experiences -- bad-or-otherwise.
Please continue to expound upon what you were actually privy-to in/of Iran (you are 'in' ass-deep, already, so you may as well "get it all out-there" -- your best security being 'having little left to tell'?).
[Have you considered any bio/book/doc/publication, or do you participate (in more-detail) in some other Forum? Have your lawsuit(s) progressed, at all?]
"And details of ties, extant, between our, Israel's, and British covert-Intel with the current/recent-Past 'religious-leadership' of Iran…and/or such as Dr. Yadzi]"
You are covering a huge amount of territory here. As many know, US and British secret services did run Iran while the Shah was 'king'. I know something of Israel's role in this but it was not deterministic but rather supportive of US and British programs there. I tend to believe that this continues to be their role.
As for Dr. Yazdi, he is a personal acquaintance. I am not sure I could say enough bad about this person to do him justice. I believe he was selected by the CIA for being just the sort of slime bucket they like for these types of operations.
Considering that Yazdi was hand picked by Khomeini, does tend to suggest that the whole 'revolution' was just another orchestration to dupe the Iranian people and the rest of the world...
I believe it was Yazdi's followers, (some I also personally knew) who accepted Bush's gifts.
In any case, collusion is the name of the game. And the intended victims are always the poor or those selected to be further impoverished.
"insights/commentary into Iran's Central-Bank remaining as one of only three, now (Cuba and Libya being 'last hold-outs'), NOT directly controlled by the Rothschild's, and their Ilk."
I am not sure that I entirely buy into the Rothschild myth either.
I had a strange encounter a few years back. Sometimes I learn things because the people with whom I am speaking never assume that I do not already know the things about which they are speaking... (I am dumber than I look)
"You know that there is no substance to money, it is simply a vehicle for control."
The man who said this to me was actively involved in the acquisition of a large number of properties following the fall of the peso orchestrated by the US military, a 'low-intensity' operation against Argentina.
Ultimately, those who control the resources by virtue of controlling the military, will decide the value and distribution of currency. Does Rothschild control the US military and or the European military (and its police structures)? If so, he is critical. If not, he is a very useful distraction.
Everyone always wants to know where the money is. A better question is who is substantiating the currency (by controlling the military industrial complex).
"Also, would you characterize Iran, currently, as being more "at-risk of attack by violent/competitive-Interests",
Being in Iran was like being able to visit Western society in its infancy. I did not see a different culture when I was there; I saw our culture in a more exposed (less concealed) condition.
So competition is schooled into Iranians just like it is taught here, thus factions do exist and at least when I was there, competition in some was fierce.
"or more as a "controlled/contrived puppet-Enemy, used as Rationale for furthered Western-Interests, "
This is exactly as I perceive Iran. And, I think its factions and the personalities of those involved are well-studied and used.
"whilst knowingly-'immune/safe' from same"?""
I do not believe that the Iranian people, unaware of the games and who the masters are, are safe in anyway. Quite the contrary, I feel that their lives are in extreme danger. Furthermore, Iran is a class society. There are the rich and there are the poor. And few Iranians who are of the wealthier class consider the poor worthy of consideration.
"Yes, but you should not worry about these wars. They do not really affect the upper classes."
Wealthy Iranian now living in the US
"The corporate-ties between Halliburton/Boeing/LM/Westinghouse/etc."
The high-tech and defense industries are really one. The obvious symbiosis was much more pronounced in the fifties, sixties and seventies when the focus seemed to be more on weaponry (guided missiles and such) and less on refining surveillance and population control technologies.
There is no real separation between any of these industries. Competition exists but it is much more about deal making than anything else... As far as Argentina and the Israelis, if such a connection is pronounced it is certainly very recent and I have no special knowledge of Israeli or Argentinean influences.
But, my parents were right at the cutting edge of (precipitated in fact) major shifts in these industries and our family room was the place where companies such as Siliconix initially took form.
"To those Who attack former President Carter, I say he, or she who is without sin may cast the first Stone."
Nice philosophy. But, it is not stones that are being hurled. It is understanding. And, it is not being hurled at Carter but at everyone including Carter.
Furthermore, I am appalled at many of the commentators here. The need to justify idol worship (even when those who are presented as idols are designed by a military police state) is amazingly pronounced. Scary.
"Yes Carter saw the world much differently than he does now, and he has more than paid for past mistakes."
9/11 also plays strongly in the facts of this matter. And that has resulted in the deaths of how many?
metooalso,
You raise some really important questions. I have to be gone for a few hours. I will answer what I can when I return.
To those Who attack former President Carter, I say he, or she who is without sin may cast the first Stone. Yes Carter saw the world much differently than he does now, and he has more than paid for past mistakes.
itsaNaziWorldOrder[Cheryl?]:
People naturally respond to Mr. Carter as a 'nice guy' [and he-is, which I can attest as a woodworker who has corresponded with him, and as a Habitat volunteer]...but EVERYTHING you've written-here is incontestable...and almost surely 'the Truth' (and I, for one, greatly appreciate the considered and insider-view you so openly-share).
However, I have much greater-interest in any 'light' you'd care to shed re: your Ex's-insights/commentary into Iran's Central-Bank remaining as one of only three, now (Cuba and Libya being 'last hold-outs'), NOT directly controlled by the Rothschild's, and their Ilk. [And details of ties, extant, between our, Israel's, and British covert-Intel with the current/recent-Past 'religious-leadership' of Iran...and/or such as Dr. Yadzi]
Also, would you characterize Iran, currently, as being more "at-risk of attack by violent/competitive-Interests", or more as a "controlled/contrived puppet-Enemy, used as Rationale for furthered Western-Interests, whilst knowingly-'immune/safe' from same"?
The corporate-ties between Halliburton/Boeing/LM/Westinghouse/etc. (and Argentinian/Israeli-Interests) and the Shaw's nuclear&covert-programs (or, Iran's more-recent/related) would also 'interest'...
"However, there are different wings of this oligarchy."
I think you are finally making my point. This IS an oligarchy. And, it is founded upon ancient and rigid principles for military rule. And, those include all the deception scripts that are practiced against the people of this world; including the ones that foment genocide to devitalize peoples and regions to maintain that rule.
From my perspective, the fundamental 'evil' of human society is elitism because it bars our ability to commune with the rest of nature and also bars the door to discovery (humility) of our most basic self and our rightful place within nature. (and it weds us to an elitist power/privilege paradigm)
"Bush Jr. represents the most extremist wing; Carter represented a more moderate wing. That doesn't mean he was a boy scout, but it means he was different than Bush. He was ALWAYS a far less dangerous president than Bush is, and he had a capacity for morality that Bush lacks."
I think the people in this world are being treated to a show that serves the purposes of military rule. Everyone looks for the person they should support… choosing from those offered. But none of the choices are right and stepping back and discovering that within this pyramid; all choices are contrived for the sake of the continuance of the pyramid is essential.
My comments are meant to help each of you realize this for yourself and to indicate what choices need to be made… and those do not require ignorant admiration/devotion to anyone. Instead, it opens the door of the truth regarding human nature (a commonly shared trait) as scripted by nature and easily verifiable…
This fact and what it prescribes for human interaction can be equally possessed by all. It stands in total (and nature determined) contradiction to the elitist and deceitful military structures that Carter has always participated in and supported.
"If you are saying there are no 'good' men, no good women in and of themselves, I'd agree."
Actually, what I am saying is that goodness is natural. And pointing out, using the case of Carter, that within in our militaristic and elitist society, it is not possible for any who do not support this system to advance.
I am also using this case to demonstrate the inherent deceptions that define the system and those who are selected to speak for it, on any side.
"You have told us your special knowledge and seeming hate of Jimmy Carter"
I am not sure that I communicated 'hate' for anything but ongoing ignorance and the unnecessary violence that it produces. If I hate anything it is those who for the sake of their own vanity refuse to entertain that much of what they wish to believe is just wrong and injurious to the whole.
As a decades long vegan, dealing with such people is not entirely new.... I am related to several.
"What was your involvement in the "October Surprise" that got rid of the "bad guy" Jimmy Carter and gave us Reagan?"
I was not involved in "October Surprise" but I was told about it when I was in Washington to meet my husband who was there in part for an interview with a famous talk show host.
We were approached, not by the Bush people but by Kennedy's people who wanted the hostages turned over to him. I almost threw up after hearing the proposal since many of my illusions were still intact in regard to our representatives and 'how things work' in our 'democracy'.
In the cab back to our hotel, my husband said, "It is worse than that, Reagan's people have offered nuclear weapons to the hardliners if they will hold the hostages until he is elected."
Now, just like there were factions within Washington, there were also within Iran. And the offer of weapons was a plum given to the most radical elements in Iran, not just to hold the hostages but to bolster their credibility with Khomeini... which it did.
Not long after that, Banisadr's government (considered moderate) was routed and my ex and many of his associative were thrown out... many were killed, tortured, etc.
Now, this would tend to make Carter sound like the good guy, but events are not always what they seem and I had not yet learned many of the things I would later discover.
Also this is a great article and Whatever the Nazi world order lady thinks and says, Carter is doing more for world peace now than any body I know of.
itsaNaziWorldOrder,
You have told us your special knowledge and seeming hate of Jimmy Carter is due to the fact that you were involved in many conspiracies.
If you knew the big wigs in Iran, What was your involvement in the "October Surprise" that got rid of the "bad guy" Jimmy Carter and gave us Reagan?
I read three or four of the naziworldorder guy's hysterical posts and people responding to his nonsense as if it merited it, then scrolled down looking for intelligent people to directly comment on this article. There are a number of good ones, but many of you are being driven to distraction by this silly, self-important flagellating insect. He's a fool who is not going to get over it. I hope the rest of you do.
I think Carter has changed since he was in office. His faith and morality have developed, and this is admirable. It is unfair to talk as if people are incapable fo change, or to say that because Carter supported the mujahadeen in Afghanistan (among other imperial endeavors) everything he has done subsequent to being president is false or hypocritical. On the other hand, it is true that Carter belonged, (and perhaps still does?) to the Trilateral Commission and as such was among an elite of men from the powerful countries who sought to impose an imperial agenda on the less developed nations of the world. However, there are different wings of this oligarchy. Bush Jr. represents the most extremist wing; Carter represented a more moderate wing. That doesn't mean he was a boy scout, but it means he was different than Bush. He was ALWAYS a far less dangerous president than Bush is, and he had a capacity for morality that Bush lacks.
I do believe however that the office of the presidency is corrupting of human beings in and of itself. Carter's trajectory since being in office suggests to me a man of genuine faith who wants to do what is right. To see him as presently part of some vast conspiracy with Bush and his ilk is, I think, foolish. Carter has gone through some serious changes since 1980, and those should be acknowledged. Of all the living and recently living ex-presidents, none have demonstrated the courage or vision that he has. Not even close.
itsaNaziWorldOrder: If you are saying there are no 'good' men, no good women in and of themselves, I'd agree. What we see outwardly really has an inward cause. How can we expect to create a harmonious world order when we--when the majority of human beings on this earth--are fragmented inwardly? Spiritually asleep human beings will NEVER elect a spiritually awake leader (one where his own ego and self-image are subordinate to the needs of those he serves), even if one were to exist. One cannot understand the events of the world merely from a chessboard perspective, he or she must understand the nature of the players as well, in this case human nature. And human nature can only be fully understood from a holistic perspective.
mikepeters,
"The radicalization of Islam has RESULTED FROM Western & Israeli aggression."
That's the story you have learned from Western media. And it is partially true, but NOT sufficient to bring it about.
"So disavail yourself of the notion that America engineered Islam's Radicalization; We could not stop it. You had that dead wrong."
Sorry, I am correct. Do a little research. I am certainly not the only one that has divulged these things.
"PostScript; you are condescending and patronizing when you 'explain' things to us lesser minds, ya know, Chomsky does not find that necessary."
I am as patient and determined as I am able. Sorry that you are missing that. Please don't compare me with Chomsky. I have found him deceitful, insincere, stupid and unlike his stage performance, very callous in regard to the affairs of others.
"If you read your post and the word "I" is in there more than once or twice, you are fucking up."
Good English 1A advice. This is a discussion about genocide, present and potentially expanding. So I'll cut myself some slack.
"Throw your martini in the sink and go buy a homeless dude a beer. And drink it with him. From the same 32 oz bottle."
I don't drink and have never even tasted a martini.
"You know nothing of helping homeless people. So shut-up about that subject."
And either do you. But, I have been homeless and I do know something about the subject... and probably a lot more about what happens to those who seriously challenge the military police state than you do.
"Islam has become radicalized as a tool for the survival of Islamic peoples."
Islam has become radicalized as a tool to justify genocide; in Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, and many other places. It is part of the effort to demonize particualr groups to encourage those who are intended to commit violence against them.
"radicalizing Islam is 100% against American and Israeli interests."
That is a matter of who those Americans are. It has certainly served to sell, test and fund development of lots of weapons and other police state technologies has it not?
Radical Islam is also a great justification for Israeli acts of aggression.
I am afraid you will miss the connection but maybe you should study GLADIO.
" "Deception is a state of mind and the mind of the State" - James Jesus Angleton, Head of CIA Counter Intelligence 1954-1974
Originally aired on BBC2 in 1992, 'Operation Gladio' reveals 'Gladio', the secret state-sponsored terror network operating in Europe."
Remember when a few Iraqi insurgents were caught and they turned out to be MI6? Now, if 'radical Islam' is sooo bad for the empire, why would there be additional impersonators just to make up for any slack?
Carter replied that he was sure Bush would be able to live a peaceful, "productive life - in our country".
Behind bars.
"Shotgun blasts hit everything."
Yes, they do. Especially if one keeps turning and if you learn anything from me, you will see this turning that eventually hits all with genocidal blasts... and then maybe you will stop entertaining this false reality (created by military leaders) and embrace the facts... and change those that are most easy to change, and that underpin this brutal culture of the war-makers...
"We should also be aware that the same arms merchants who ran the Cold War are still in power, and probably will be when the next election cycle ends, no matter who wins."
Consider that Brezinski, who believes chaos is the ONLY alternative to a one world military dictatorship, is advising Obama.
"Obama's foreign policy advisor and vocal supporter is Zbigniew Brzezinski, Jimmy Carter's national security advisor, who says that Obama offers 'a new definition of America's role in the world'.
This is the same Brzezinski who created the Illuminati's Trilateral Commission with David Rockefeller in 1973. The Trilateral Commission is dedicated to a world government dictatorship and closely connects with other strands in the web like the Council on Foreign Relations (member: Barack Obama) and the Bilderberg Group.
Brzezinski's foreign 'policy' during the Carter administration, as he has since admitted without regret, was to entice the Soviet Union to invade Afghanistan in December, 1979. The idea, he said, was to weaken their rival superpower and the result was a ten-year occupation that cost the lives of an estimated 1.3 million Afghans and spawned the Mujahedin, Taliban and Osama bin Laden.
Deep breath: he's now advising Barack Obama on foreign policy ..."
excerpt from: http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message487849/pg1
"Of course, the dirty Reds didn't like that, and stole all our murderous technology, and launched the non-stop arms war that continues to this day -"
Or, 'our' (secret service technology transfer agents) shared it with them (continuously) to encourage a 'competitive spirit' to focus the nation's energies on building the militarized and totally-secure surveillance society (One World Nazi Order) in which we live today.
"You said, incredibly I feel, "Jimmy Carter was behind Afghanistan's transtitioning to an Islamic society."'
This is true. Though the people of Afghanistan were Moslems, its political institutions were secular just as they are in the US or were.
Once the Taliban came to power (a program of the West that has been amply covered in many places), that changed as everyone knows.
mikepeters,
I never said that Afghanistan was not Islamic. I said that the nationalistic and radically fundamentalist version of 'Islam' was encouraged, supported and even largely engineered by Brezinski and Carter's programs. Textbooks for Afghani school children to support a new radical Islamic world and national view were even written in Michigan.
In the same way, Iran was NOT principally a radical Islamic nation prior to the its 'revolution'. It was principally Moslem of course. But these are very different things.
Most people in the US may be Christian but they are not KKK or even KKK supporters.
Most Moslems are not gun toting warriors any more than Catholics are. But the Islamic religion was being manipulated and re-interpreted to fuel rabid nationalism to increase violence in the society.
Jimmy Carter did not spring newly created onto the political scene in 1976. He was a graduate of Annapolis [very bright, at least] skippered a nuclear sub and was an engineer by training. He was and is a product of the Cold War.
The Cold War was installed to protect the USA's claim to sole ownership of nuclear power. Of course, the dirty Reds didn't like that, and stole all our murderous technology, and launched the non-stop arms war that continues to this day - even tho we could destroy the entire world three time over, as could Russia and possibly The Ukrainians.
Apparently the Israelis are pikers and couldn't do as complete a job, but who knows how many bombs Pakistan has? Or India? Not to mention China and North Korea. Do you suppose our staunch allies in South Korea have none of their own to play with?
I didn't support Carter in 1980 because he was going down the same path of Cold War saber rattling that every President since Truman has followed. Reagan was certainly not my choice either.
Carter is right about the Palestinians, but that doesn't make him right about every thing. Nor does it give him a pass when it comes to taking responsibility for the excesses of his own administration.
We should also be aware that the same arms merchants who ran the Cold War are still in power, and probably will be when the next election cycle ends, no matter who wins. Talk about milking a job...
I am PERPLEXED by those who miss the reality of Mr. Carter's jaded career, and the veneer that dupes so many by the fraud of his acclaimed "humanitarianisms"
I left you a reference above, use it dam-it, and thank me for disillusioning you as necessity has it!
Or disregard the chance and continue to be a dunce!
Bill
"I see him building houses with Habitat for Humanity for poor people, and I see his center wiping out diseases in Africa. I see him overseeing elections. I see him as a Nobel peace prize winner."
I do not share this naiveté. Habitat for humanity may have helped some to a better home but this is hardly the type of comprehensive solution to homelessness and substandard housing that is required. Carter knows that. This project is nothing but tokenism as are all of his public efforts.
And he shares the Nobel 'honor' with two well-known butchers; Kissinger and Menachim Begin?
Give me a break!
I will applaud Carter's determination to work for peace (and the courage that is required) when he discloses the extent to which the CIA (and other secret services) and offices of military affairs secretly have scripted war events around the world!
(Frankly, Jimmy, since you are a man of 'God' what are you waiting for?)
>>itsaNaziWorldOrder - "I see Carter in all of the behind the scenes negotiations on peace in the Middle East."
Pray tell… in what behind the scenes negotiations have you participated?<<
Well if you were involved in so many behind the scenes negotiations with "Ali", considering the state of things now, you really screwed the pooch. If you know so much, write a book and then advertise here rather than claim some "special" knowledge. You remind me of every security guard on every podunk college campus that used to be a "navy seal" or "92 Bravo"
Thank God for Jimmy Carter.
"I see Carter in all of the behind the scenes negotiations on peace in the Middle East."
Pray tell... in what behind the scenes negotiations have you participated?
And were they held in the courtesy suites of Haliburton or Boeing?
I have always admired Carter. He restores my faith in what is possible for an American President. Not that whore Bill Clinton and the torturer Bush. I hope Europe will listen and stop following our lunatic-in-chief.
"And yet, you want me to believe he is part of 'the evil plot' because your father was involved in black market transactions, and your ex ran a bank?"
This is either pretty shallow thinking or you are very green as in lacking in experience.
Any observer of world events would understand that commanding the treasury of a major country during a very rapid transition phase in its history or being a famous entrepreneur that is also tied to high-tech secret weapons transfers with the Soviet block might give a different and potentially illuminating perspective.
I glanced at the CNN News while in the breakroom this evening. Glen Beck and guest were busy calling Carter an anti-semite. Nothing like having Corporate Media coming to defend Israel and the US's policies.
"please explain to me how your ex being a Governor of the central bank of Iran would give him any special insight as to the mind and goals of the President of the United States?"
Since the hostage crisis resulted in the freezing of Iran's assets and my ex-husband was in charge of un-freezing (recovering) those assets, he was in tireless negotiations.
As you may recall, after a direct attack on Iran was averted (if ever it was contemplated) by the opening of the World Court (something for which I can accept some large degree personal responsibility)... an economic attack was launched.
Thus Ali was at the very center of that economic war on Iran and had intimate knowledge of Carter's administration in the handling of this affair.
Also, Carter (and his policies) was a subject of some great deal of study not just by my husband (and me) but many others in this country with whom I was associated before the Iranian affairs that brought my husband and myself into personal involvement.
"you can't condemn any president based on the opinions of someone who worked under him. "
I am certain that I have not done that.
"I don't know what Brezinski said, or what he might have meant by re-engineering an entire society."
Transforming it from a basically secularist society (with help from Pakistani Intelligence, the Bin Ladens and other secret service agencies) to a radical 'Islamic' and violently nationalistic one.
"Something that would have been pretty difficult to do in an Islamic nation at war."
Gaining influence in a 'nation at war' is about the easiest thing in the world to do. Any moron can realize that the biggest arms dealer on the block has a potentially huge amount of influence… as the US arms dealers and advisors did.
Jimmy Carter was one of the best presidents this country has had. We were too stupid to realize it. Instead we were fooled by the performance of that actor Ronald Reagan, who could deliver his lines oh, so presidentially, but who was, in fact, a fool. Jimmy Carter is truly altruistic and his presidency reflected that. He wanted the American people to be better, to do better, and to be good citizens of the planet. He encouraged us to turn down the thermostat and put on a sweater. Such chic advice today, but in the 1970s it was mocked. What morons were we, that we failed to re-elect this man for a second term, and instead put the traitor Reagan who was negotiating with Iran (our enemy at the time) orchestrating the release of the hostages to coincide with his eventual inauguration. Carter has proven his humanitarian ideals by his actions over and over again in the last decades. He is a man of peace.
Carter have taken millions of $$$ in bribe money from various Arab dictatorships (Most from whom Oil rich OPEC countries), therefore he can't be regarded as an unbiased bystander.
Carter has a track record as a long-time critic of Israel who has often displayed pro-Arab sympathies.
Millions of charitable dollars have flowed into the Carter Center from His Majesty Sultan Qaboss bin Said Al Said of Oman, Jordan, from the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, and from the Government of the United Arab Emirates.
Furthermore, hundreds of thousands of dollars have been donated to the center by the Kuwait Fund for Arab Economic Development. H.R.H. Prince Moulay Hicham Ben Abdallah of Morocco has also contributed tens of thousands of dollars.
There are no corresponding contributions apparent from Israeli sources, however.
http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/4/28/112225.shtml
itsaNaziWorldOrder - you can't condemn any president based on the opinions of someone who worked under him. I don't know what Brezinski said, or what he might have meant by re-engineering an entire society. Something that would have been pretty difficult to do in an Islamic nation at war.
I may be wrong, but..... please explain to me how your ex being a Governor of the central bank of Iran would give him any special insight as to the mind and goals of the President of the United States? I doubt the presidents of Capital One or Bank of America have that knowledge, let along someone leading a bank in a 3rd world country.
And I'm a bit confused as to how the crimes of your father would figure into your knowledge of just who Jimmy Carter really is?
You may very well have knowledge and experience, but those two qualifiers you offer don't sell me on your insider knowledge.
I see Carter in all of the behind the scenes negotiations on peace in the Middle East. I see him meeting with Hamas against everyones desires. I see him referring to Israeli policy against the Palestinians as apartheid. And I see him appealing to Europe to break with the policy of his own country because he knows the numskull in the oval office right now will not change course.
I see him building houses with Habitat for Humanity for poor people, and I see his center wiping out diseases in Africa. I see him overseeing elections. I see him as a Nobel peace prize winner.
And yet, you want me to believe he is part of 'the evil plot' because your father was involved in black market transactions, and your ex ran a bank?
Hmmmmmmmmm
No one wants to wake from the dreams they think will continue to bring them benefit...
But the world is one... and I wish I could demonstrate this for you.
For if I could, you would all be seeking much higher standards before giving praise.
"Jimmy Carter, private citizen, speaks truth to power. It's hard to find another person in the world who has his level of integrity."
Jimmy Carter, private citizen, lied for the sake of war-making and empire in the wake of 9/11!
Jimmy Carter, private citizen, speaks truth to power. It's hard to find another person in the world who has his level of integrity.
"You tend to forget that we were in the cold war and the Soviet Union had invaded Afghanistan when he supported the Islamic insurgency, which by the way, was the only organized resistance in the country at that time."
We did not 'support the Islamic insurgency'. We literally re-engineered a society as confessed by Brezinski. The Taliban was a secret services creation. I believe that you know this.
aquietman,
I have not read too many conspiracy articles as you suggest, I have been intimately caught up in too many...
My ex, Ali Reza Sadegh-Nobari was the Governor of the Central Bank of Iran while Carter was in office.
My father was involved in black market technology transfers and many other horrible crimes. I have a very unusual background that would take books to properly reveal.
I offer here what I can so that others may get benefit of these experiences and not suffer unnecessarily simply because it is preferred by our 'leaders' that those who do not 'need to know' don't. Kapische?
Nothing shocking in regards to US, but SHAME on Europe.
And then we wonder why we have "terrorism"? The question is though who the terrorists are.....
Words are Important,
I like your post and agree with it except:
"What is it going to require to make the necessary social, political, economical changes that are necessary? No one knows the answer to that..."
I do know this answer or I would not be bothering to post here... I would be out looking for it as I did for decades.
(1) The other Israeli occupied territory = US Senate
(2) The root of all evil today = USrael
itsaNaziWorldOrder - I think you've read a bit too many conspiracy articles.
Carter is not the monster you make him out to be. I believe he is honorable and has made moves that brought him great condemnation in an attempt to broker peace.
Anyone who uses the word 'rubbish' as often as you do in response to the opinions of others comes across to me as a know-it-all, so caught up in what he has read that he truly believes he knows it all.
Carter is the best former president we have ever had, and he was a pretty decent president as well. You tend to forget that we were in the cold war and the Soviet Union had invaded Afganistan when he supported the Islamic insurgency, which by the way, was the only organzied resistance in the country at that time. I would have used them as well to get the Soviets out. No sane person would think that he could have known that many years after he left office the Taliban would take over.
He lost the 1980 election simply because he was not the 'insider' you are pretending he was.
My guess is there is no American leader or prospective leader alive today that you honor in any way.
"So tell me, what world leader, former or present day, meets your exacting standards???"
Frankly, I am not sure why I must support any. Maybe I have been closer to the action than most but to quote a lady who recently died:
"I hope you don't think those people in Washington care anything about peace. I lived there. All they care about is partying."
I have seen this myself and heard similar things from others. Although the thought of heroes may comfort us... because we are taught that we must have strong and good leaders, I have discovered that we will lead ourselves out of this mess... by first refusing to accept that which is untrue.
I remember Carter back when he was president and how he was not only attacked by the conservatives, but also by the democrats (like Ralph Nader is today).
Did Carter, or anyone, do things perfectly? No. But who did?
Is he now doing things, stating things, standing up for important issues when no major presidential candidate is? Yes.
Is our country going to hell in a handbasket economically, politically, environmentally, socially, ethically? Most definitely.
What is it going to require to make the necessary social, political, economical changes that are necessary? No one knows the answer to that, but what we are doing currently is clearly not enough.
Why are some people opposed to the status quo? Because the current system (that is 1,000s of years old) ensures that the powerful can act in any selfish ignorant manner that they want to the detriment of humankind and the planet.
What will it take to make a change? More people demanding a change and changing themselves.
A good start would be not giving carte blanche suppport to any candidate that doesn't have a plan for change, especially Obama, Hillary, and McCain. I don't see any of them willing to change the status quo.
What happens if the status quo continues? A further slide into the global abyss of injustice, environmental damage, continual war, and concentration of wealth and power to the very people who don't give a fuck about the well-being of society.
so it goes...
"Your arrogant condemnation of Jummy Carter show you to be a self righteous, intolerant human being."
There is simply nothing arrogant in my condemnation. It is fact-based and not founded upon prejudice.
If I am intolerant, it is of those who tell lies in the service of criminal acts of violence.
In fact, until I knew better, I was a Carter admirer.
"Tell me please, is there anyone on the planet today ( besides yourself, of course) who meets your exceedingly high moral criteria?"
My 'exceedingly high' moral standards include not lauding those responsible for pre-meditated murder or genocide. Are these standards really TOO high for a community leader?
It is not my high standards, I fear, which is the problem, but that we are taught to accept/acquiesce to outrageously low ones.
starofthesea,
You remind me of a conversation I had with my niece last night...
She called to tell me that she had been cornered and verbally attacked by co-workers after refusing an offer of beef-jerky.
She said she thought it was the guilt in them that made them lash out at her. (this did not begin because she was lecturing them …as she says, it is useless anyway, the ignorance is too great and the defensiveness in regard to it immediately triggered).
I suggested that it may also be that we have a conformist society... No matter how outrageous a behavior, if it is being generally accepted, non-conformists may well expect to be attacked.
I am an independent thinker. I believe that it is essential to my own health and the health of the whole that I am.
Like you, I was reared inside this conformist military empire. It is involved in outrageous criminal acts everyday. My goal is to expose these, the fallacies upon which they rest and continue, and the manner in which we can all live more fully and with much greater personal satisfaction, freedom, creativity, etc, while also being totally sustainable.
That is my standard. To support what is easiest to accomplish and in everyone's common interest.
True, I do not have murder, robbery and/or conspiracy to genocide in my history.
GeeWhiz, I guess I must be a saint;)
Maybe you are right, that is really toooo much to expect from a spokesperson or community leader in this society!
itsaNaziWorldOrder--- Tell me please, is there anyone on the planet today ( besides yourself, of course) who meets your exceedingly high moral criteria? Your arrogant condemnation of Jummy Carter show you to be a self righteous, intolerant human being. So tell me, what world leader, former or present day, meets your exacting standards??? Your comments are fit for a rubbish bin. I am so sick and tired of people who have twenty twenty vision when it comes to everyone else's failings but their own.
If all we look for is blame, that's all we'll find. If all we find is blame, no solution can ever be found because all our energy will be used up and the goal of blame attained.
Maybe if we can get out of the blame game, we can find a few changes which will make things better. There's no guaranty things will be better, but we can take hope from the trying. There are some things which seem obvious to the casual observer, but can we even agree on those matters -- we can't even choose a nominee.
"Did Carter make mistakes when he was President? Sure.
Can he be compared to Bush in any sort of logical way? Of course not."
This is rubbish! It was the CARTER administration that was behind the transitioning of Afghanistan to a fundamentalist Islamic society... and this resulted in the destruction and genocide of many. Are the lives of Afghanis less important than anyone else's life? Not to me! Does this policy of imperialist expediency somehow not indicate who Carter really is and for what team he is playing?
Either you support imperialism or you do not. If you don't, then none of their apologists are even to be considered. Do you want peace and justice? Then insist upon it and stop slovenly supporting these despicable spokesmen who confound the evident and the obvious to predictable applause!
Carter did not 'make mistakes'. They may appear to be mistakes because you can not see the connections between expressed 'intent' and contrary actions. But of those of us who were actively involved in civil rights, other people's right to self-determination, militarism, etc., Carter's grandstanding and reasons for support were very apparent, and are equally apparent today!
Bush and Carter are alike in most ways except the way they are differentiated in the American public's mind and that is by design.
Has Carter expressed openly to the American public the reasons behind 9/11? I rest my case! He is a war-maker for the elite.
From "Let Me Stand Alone" by Rachel Corrie, written when she was 10 years old.
Dear Soldier,
I guess I don't really understand the world, because I don't see why you aren't here. Why people can't make compromises. Why peace is still a vision, and war is our reality. I must be ignorant, because I believe that it's unnecessary for forty thousand children to die every day. I know I am just a little sixth grader who writes poetry and worries about grades and makeup, but I worry about bigger things. I worry about the whales dying, about the ozone layer depleting, about the trees being cut down. I guess everyone worries about those things somewhat.
The ice has been creeping onto the puddles with cold jutting hands. As I walk on the grass in my yard each morning, it crunches from the stiffness of the frost. The sky is a canvas stretched gray from one edge of the horizon to the hills. It is spattered with circling white seagulls glaring down with yellow eyes onto the earth. There is such beauty in the way the gulls turn their wings and soar in turning tranquility.
There are a thousand things that echo through my mind when I think of this planet. Peace and cooperation are at the front of my mind."
The Courage of Rachel Corrie
By Amy Wilentz, Truthdig. Posted May 26, 2008.
"The journals of protester Rachel Corrie, killed by an Israeli bulldozer in Palestine, reveal her untimely death all the more tragic."
Some heroines standup to oppressors while others only hide in attics. It seems that 'heroism' is a point of view.
Did Carter make mistakes when he was President? Sure.
Can he be compared to Bush in any sort of logical way? Of course not.
Does the fact that Carter made mistakes when he was President negate the fact that what he's saying now is right? No.
As far as Carter's mistakes in re Israel when he was President are concerned and as far as Britain's role in carving up the Middle East are concerned, do they matter in a historical sense? Of course they do.
But do they matter NOW? No, they don't. What matters NOW is what the US, Europe, Israel and Palestine do NOW. And Hamas proposing a ceasefire and Israel accepting it is a darned good first step.
I find it amazing that no one seems to know the role of the British Empire in carving up the Middle East and helping create the state of Israel as well as many other political institutions...
Nor that US Mid East policies have simply followed the same lines set in motion by these interests (and still are influenced by the original architectural firms) .
You can hang the 'soldier' for atrocities but another one is always being induced/scripted to commit the same… until you go after the organizations that bring soldiers into being and create outrageous situations.
Who genocided the people of Indonesia in '67? Suharto or Rockefeller and his cronies?
Same deal here. I think the real problem is a lot of intellectual laziness and not enough interest in realizing that at the root of the problem is our own strongly held cultural myths that together involve us in wars and genocides without end and support of the very institutions that prevent real solutions from being realized.
"itsaNaziWorldOrder attempts to equate Jimmy Carter with George W. Bush in order to deflect Carter's criticism of Israel and the west's disastrous pro-Zionist policies."
What rubbish!
I too have criticized Israeli genocidal and racist policies since first understanding them (going back to the '67 'war')...
I am trying to tell you that you are being fooled! AGAIN!
Carter is a staunch supporter of this imperialistic war-machine. And, just like Bush, knew very well that 9/11 was an inside job by military planning agencies! Criticizing/analyzing the policies of Israel SHOULD RESULT in a better understanding of those who have orchestrated those policies.
Carter's criticism of Israel is absurd given that he too supported strengthening Israel while in office, not because he gave a damn about any of the people there (Palestinians, Christians, or Jews), but because Israel was very useful in controlling (and helping disguise) the politics (and those who controlled them) of the Middle East.
itsaNaziWorldOrder attempts to equate Jimmy Carter with George W. Bush in order to deflect Carter's criticism of Israel and the west's disastrous pro-Zionist policies.
Carter definitely has his faults but trying to tar him with the sins of presidents whose records are far worse is a sin in and of itself.
jj
I'll repeat another post as it applies here even more than elsewhere. Apology in advance.
It`s Time for a Declaration of Independence From Israel
http://www.israelenews.com/view.asp?ID=2137
Filed under Israeli politics, Christian Zionism, Opinion Editorials, Anti-Israel academics, Iran's nukes, USA foreign policy, Iraq war, Christian Fundamentalism, Iran, Zionism - on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - By: Hedges, Chris
Speech delivered on Thursday, May 22, 2008, at Princeton University by Chris Hedges
This speech was first written as an article in 2007 in truthdig.
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20070702_a_declaration_of_independen...
It's Time for a Declaration of Independence From Israel
"The fact that a former president even hints that Bush could face war crimes is a major event. And it takes balls to do so. My respect for Carter is greatly increased."
I think that all of them should be up for war crimes. Carter included. It is just toot ridiculous to point the finger at Bush when the whole gang is guilty.
Remember, the Brezinski admission that it was the Carter administration that was behind the decision to create a nationalistic fervor in Afghanistan by promoting radical Islam?
All of these liars need to have their masks torn off.
Also, the idea that Europe would provide some brake on the US is absurd. The ruling elite of Europe is AT LEAST as involved in setting the stages for conflicts as our own secret services.
Folks, let's not have a replay of the Hitler script... many who helped orchestrate WWII went on to become the most powerful people in our land such as Harrimans, Dulles, etc.
Go for the nest, not the one that they throw out to satisfy your desire for justice...
Bush, a disgusting person to be sure, is still just a stage hand. And so is Carter... and he is playing you yet again and playing on the same team as the Bushes.
Carter has my respect and admiration.
Too bad he didn't act when he had the power to act and most of his words now fall in deaf ears.
Israel itself is a crime against humanity. The sooner it returns the land stolen from Palestinians, the sooner the horrendous 1948 mistake can be erased from humanity's memory.
The fact that a former president even hints that Bush could face war crimes is a major event. And it takes balls to do so. My respect for Carter is greatly increased.
Bush never showed an interest in leaving the U.S. - or even Texas - before he became president, so it'll be no problem for him to avoid war crimes prosecution afterward.