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The Betrayal of Generation Hope
As I sit here preparing for my final college exams, I can't help but think back on the ups and downs of the past two years. Ups: the defeat of the Republican Party in 2008, my own graduation from college, and the formation of progressive student and veteran movements; and downs: suffering through a war and hospitalization due to post-traumatic stress, watching my friends die in foreign countries, and now, the betrayal of my generation by a President who we put our utmost faith in.
From Apathy to Activism
On election night in 2008, thousands of students in Bellingham, Washington reacted to the news of Obama's victory by noisily and merrily marching through the cold streets to drums and bullhorns. For the first time in my life since returning from the Iraq War, I proudly carried an American flag right-side-up, broke through police barricades with hundreds of youthful, jubilant demonstrators, and partied in the middle of a street till early in the morning. The elation of the crowd of young people was matched only by the distasteful negativity of the dozen-or-so old Republicans gathered at their headquarters around a TV playing FOXnews.
Billed as the opening victory of "Generation O," the momentum of the progressive campus movement felt unstoppable. Socialist, anti-war and counter-culture groups suddenly proliferated across the area. Pro-Obama graffiti appeared on buildings and walls everywhere; articles in student publications praised progressive values. The City of Bellingham seriously considered granting sanctuary to war-resisting AWOL soldiers-- a student-led initiative.
Within weeks, the conservative reaction was underway. Letters appeared in the local paper calling for the closing of Western Washington University and the drafting of all students into GOP wars. The chairwomen of the local republicans, Luanne Van Werven, appeared on FOXnews bashing college students and demeaning the higher education in general. Conservative groups sent salaried workers to organize a young-republican group at the college, unsuccessfully. Supporters of the Sanctuary idea were shouted down at a town-hall meeting by angry republicans with signs reading "Shoot the Traitors." All in all, it seemed that with every passing week, more youth were demanding their political empowerment and more old conservatives were angrily impotent. Led by a progressive president, it seemed like the generation of Hope had reached its peak.
That was in 2008. Fast-forward one year.
The Failure of "Dumb War Theory" and Capitalism
Last week, hundreds of students again gathered to march noisily. Unlike November of 2008, however, their signs now are angry and there is no dancing. Speakers railed against the latest Bush-like troop surge, and the crowd noisily and angrily rallied against the Obama administration's failure to capitalize on any political victory. Tired of waiting for the promised change, the young, it appears, are turning to that last-resort, dirty-word: Socialism.
And why not Socialism? Young people today cannot even remember a time without war, crushing student-loans, environmental catastrophe, torture and terror. All of these, according to Marxism, are necessarily end results of unbridled Capitalism at work. It seems obvious to any kid having grown up under the Bush regime-siblings in Iraq, parents in debt, education in ruins-that the two percent of "haves" are destroying the lives of the ninety-eight percent of the "have-nots." Socialism makes sense to us, if only because Capitalism does not.
Most disappointing of all to the youth, though, is Obama's betrayal of their values. Particularly, his extensions of Bush policies and war-mongering. Obama's "dumb war" theory (i.e. that some wars are just and some are just "dumb") is, to us, a complete abomination of the concept of peace. By evoking the Reverend Doctor King in his Nobel acceptance speech while in the same breath dismissing non-violence, Obama has bastardized the concept of peace and alienated us, anti-war youth, permanently from his politics.
For myself, I have come in my time in college to an understanding of the beauty of MLK's philosophy of world peace. That violent force cannot ever be justified --that two wrongs don't make a right-- seems like second nature now. Obama's twisted pseudo-intellectual rationalization of war-mongering stands in strict opposition to the teachings of Jesus Christ (love thy neighbor, turn the other cheek, blessed are the peacemakers, thou shalt not kill, et cetera) and make this veteran sick. I would not feign to argue with the leader of the free world, but then again I have seen war from the ground up, and he has not. I know that I speak for the young anti-war movement when I say that Obama has betrayed us. I also speak for the anti-war youth when I say that we won't forget it.
Last week at an anti-war rally I met two marines preparing to go to Afghanistan. Though they were skeptical of the "hippie" protestors, they listened closely to me as an experienced veteran. I explained to them that real courage doesn't need to hide behind an M-4 and body-armor. They asked me about pacifism, and were surprised when I told them that non-violence and pacifism are two separate things. These two young marines, both misinterpreted the teachings of non-violence (the same way Obama did in his Nobel lecture), gave me the familiar "we should kill them before they kill us" argument, but they had no response to my question: why not change their minds instead of killing them? I almost expect to hear misinterpretations of non-violence from a pair of 20-year-old marines at a peace protest, but I did not expect to hear it from Commander-in-Chief Obama a week later in almost the same words.
That Obama and his generals think the cultural and ideological problems of Asia can be solved with drones and surges is a testament only to their failure of imagination. That Obama could stand up at the Nobel podium and defend his mass murders (less-dumb wars?) is a complete abomination. I know I am expressing the collective concern of my fellow students when I wonder why doesn't Obama get it? The reason Islamic extremists hate American culture is the same reason we voted for change: the world is tired of war, globalization, exploitation, and the other trappings of the for-profit American culture. There is a common denominator in our politics that Obama would rather not let himself see: the failure of our way of life. The youth of today see this from the bottom of the heap looking up, whether they are soldiers interrogating Afghani villagers, or students working the night shift to get through college. Why can't Obama see it?
The Future of Politics
As I prepare to take my first college degree and enter into the world of the Great Recession, I look back on a time of great turmoil. Not only have we students roundly rejected the Neo-Con worldview, but we have been betrayed by the leader we helped to elect. I also look forward to a time of re-generation. Though our generation is the most democratic and least republican one since the civil war, don't be surprised if we turn away from the Democratic party soon. Fool us once, DNC, shame on you. But beware: it may not happen again.
My generation can't afford not to have health care. We can't afford to live on minimum wage. We can't afford to allow CEOs to rape our natural resources. Unlike some older folks, my generation understands the differences between communism and socialism. My generation understands that war is not the answer, and we are beginning to understand who President Obama really is. We will tirelessly dedicate ourselves to fixing the planet and realizing the ideals which our parents have rejected, but we will not forget which party promised us hope and which party failed us.
We the youth will bear the yoke of tomorrow, and we the youth are quickly learning that the best way to bear that yoke is to cast it off. Real change can't be far away, with or without Obama.
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137 Comments so far
Show AllQuestion! Indeed, at the WTFcom CC!! Carry on!!!
You Go youth--and thanks for your service for real change and peace.
Amen! This generation of young people are indeed a reason to have hope! What a great bunch! Ya'll keep on keepin on!!!
I've printed out multiple copies and sending the hard copies to the Democratic Party members in my area. Thank you for this amazing piece. I remember LBJ's betrayal of my father, a decorated captain in WWII. Carry on, my friend.
Good luck with the insights that disappointment has brought you, Evan. Frankly, if you and your peers had listened more carefully to our hustler-in-chief, you would have heard that he promised nothing but another version of "Morning in America", more Bernaysian feel-good black propaganda. So, join the rest of us who have been suckered by this crap for the last forty years, and, yes, great idea, let us fight for democratic socialism with a new third party or "one big union" that represents working folk across vocational lines. Eugene Debs lives!
Tony Vodvarka
There was no Generation Hope forming by voting for Obama/Biden. If people around my age were to actually examine all the candidates on the issues and not on personality, polling, and money they would have turned to people like Nader or Mckinney in the general election or at least Kucinich or Gravel in the Democratic Primary. All 4 of them were persecuted and left out while Obama was elevated by the media so that he could lie and seduce his way into office with his followers acting nastier than even Dubya's supporters. I feel sorry for this author at such a young tender age but I hope that this is a lesson that he learns and corrects his voting come 2012.
I disagree with you. I'm a teacher. I spent many hours in the classroom in the spring of 2008 warning my students that Obama is actually a Neocon. I also spent many hours in 1999 warning them that Ralph Nader was lying to them when he said the difference between Gore and Bush was Twiddlydee and Twiddlydum. I say lie because he knew the difference, as did you, but those coming into politics for the first time might not have and I know many whom he duped. I also said that Nader was wrong when he explained that it was okay to vote for him even if it meant Bush would be elected, Bush's presidency would unify the Left. So, with Nader we have 1) A blatant liar as a candidate, not merely a lapse in judgment but somebody capable of looking youth in the face and repeating a bald faced lie. (Don't think I have any delusions about Al Gore but to conflate the two candidates takes a liar. ) 2) An unforgivable lapse of judgment, an inability to recognize that if you elect a man bent on destroying the constitution, he might well succeed and his successor might continue the process. Without constitutional rights, without privacy, with permanent war and with a shift toward even greater corporate power of the individual, the left is more splintered than ever. So, no, Ralph Nader was not an alternative to Obama. Ralph Nader betrayed youth already. Ralph Nader should stick to writing fiction. He's a tragic figure, somebody who preyed off the very youthful optimism and idealism that Obama did for his own self gain and will forever go down in history as the spoiler in the most seminal point in history in our lifetimes. I say this knowing I agree with his policies more than any other candidate but knowing that his moral fiber is often overshadowed by his narcissism. Choosing a candidate is more than merely looking at the issues. Obama is a one-off. Nobody has ever, and will likely ever, be so deceptive and manipulative of his constituents. Though I hated the man, the desire to see good in him was not the problem. The problem is and was that he is the greatest deceiver in US presidential history, unlikely to ever be matched, somebody who used his skin color, his fabricated background as a community organizer and his rhetoric using phrases like "the mindset of war" to hide his warmongering.
I think I take your point, Fenner. While I do see Nader as a narcissist, I do not see him as a spoiler in any manner. He had/has a constituency and they have every right to believe in him as any other candidate. And, there were several reasons Gore lost the election, not the least of which were a poorly run election and an outright theft by the Florida and Federal Supreme Courts.
Pied Pipers abound. It takes a certain "personality" trait to want to put one's self out there and run for public office, especially in such a huge arena as the presidency. The problem is, the system requires psycophants and that's generally who runs. Certainly, it is the character trait of those who make it all the way.
But it also takes the willing cadre of the easily deceived. Not so much that this president did this, or that president did that, but that we are so willing to believe that ANY president can do much at all given the current state of MIC affairs.
So, we've all been duped again! Yeah, so, what are we going to do about it? At least the young writer of this piece has come to the realization that he, personally, has to do something. I would venture to say that a very small portion of posters here on CD go that far. And then they have the temerity to wonder how the hell they got suckered again. Unbelievable!
Well, it's been another learning experience for the Left. And once again, I ask: So, what are we going to do about it?
Oh, wait, another election is coming up... That's the answer!
Sheesh.
The young writer will do what he can for his part but at some point, he will have to realize that his valiant efforts are being TRASHED by the rascals in Washington abusing their powers. Now I have said this to others and I will say it here. No amount of efforts will amount to anything as long as society continues to TRASH its own efforts by allowing mediocre leadership to prevail. Electing mediocre leadership in place of quality driven leadership is like foolishly choosing to buy a used car that is broken beyond repair and will cost more to maintain than buying a new or used car with a better foundation. Let's apply this back to politics. I cannot speak for every former Nader voter of 2000 now calling him a spoiler but perhaps they forgot that judging candidates by money, faux "personality", corporate polling, etc... gives us mediocre leadership and higher maintenance and repair costs compared to picking a leadership that actually sides with the people so that people can actually move on and not have to waste as much time, money, and energy trying to beg their pols to listen. Elections are all about choosing the foundation to shape society's direction. Are you proud of having voted for mediocre leadership that resulted in wasted efforts and costlier maintenance?
"Elections are all about choosing the foundation to shape society's direction."
No, Jennifer, this is where you have it backwards. Elections do not shape society's direction, you and I do that. Or at least, we're supposed to.
What is democracy (or even a representative republic) without you and me? Well, it currently isn't either of those, it's a plutocracy. If we don't like it then WE have a duty to change it no matter who is in power.
Elections are about keeping the status quo. Hard work by people acting more as citizens and less as consumers are what shapes our direction.
I just hosted a meeting with my permaculture group to pare down our consumption and lower our carbon footprint. That's the kind of work that will shape a new direction, in my humble opinion.
"Are you proud of having voted for mediocre leadership that resulted in wasted efforts and costlier maintenance?"
No. Are you proud of voting for someone who will never be president, and if he ever is, will fall into the same trap as every other president before him?
The game is rigged, Hon. We can't depend on any of them to fix it. It's up to you and me.
So, what are you doing?
"Elections do not shape society's direction, you and I do that. Or at least, we're supposed to."
That is not true. You do not have the power pols have to shape policies or the direction of this country unless you just so happen to be a high paid lobbyist which I don't think you are.
"What is democracy (or even a representative republic) without you and me? Well, it currently isn't either of those, it's a plutocracy. If we don't like it then WE have a duty to change it no matter who is in power."
True and that's why we need the right foundation so that our efforts will have meaning.
"Elections are about keeping the status quo. Hard work by people acting more as citizens and less as consumers are what shapes our direction."
That is not true. You can talk all you want about "hard work" but none of it will matter as long as you reward having your hard work and everyone else's for worthy causes trashed by mediocre leadership. It's like working so hard to build your own car only to have the CEO of GM smash it because he has the power to do so thanks to Big Auto puppets in Washington bailing them out and rewarding them for bad behavior.
"I just hosted a meeting with my permaculture group to pare down our consumption and lower our carbon footprint. That's the kind of work that will shape a new direction, in my humble opinion."
That's nice but will those efforts mean anything especially if they are rendered useless thanks to Obama and Congress continuing to reward the corporate polluters?
"Are you proud of voting for someone who will never be president, and if he ever is, will fall into the same trap as every other president before him?"
Whether he wins or loses is irrelevant. When you voted for Nader in 2000, I know that you did not get distracted by all this "winnability" stuff. I don't know how you managed to trash that good spirit of yours that probably used to put quality driven progressives over DLC hacks. If all you care about is which lesser of the evil can win, then you are making yourself part of the problem and it sickens me when people apologize for the rotten status quo like that. Please snap out of it. I know you can do it but I can only guess that you have been brainwashed into believing that we should just turn a blind eye, judge books by their covers and not their contents, and gleefully be proud to have our efforts being trashed !
"So, what are you doing?"
Just how can you think of trying to divert anger away from the status quo and towards having us working class voters fight each other out? Are you trying to tell me to ignore the devils running this country onto the ground and be "happy" to see our hard work getting trashed? It is irrelevant what each of us does compared to what our leaders do for or against us. You cannot expect to defend the status quo by trying to tell people to ignore the devils behind the curtain running the country. THEY ARE NOT ABOVE THE LAW. I'll continue to do what I have to but I will not put up with valiant efforts of mine and others to survive this Great Depression being trashed. Maybe I am too sensitive to this. If you can convince out of it, I am all open ears.
I'm going to start with your last two sentences because it seems to me, Jennifer, as if your sensitivity and anger are getting the best of you.
I am NOT trying to divert anger away from the status quo, I am trying to focus it to where it will count.
You keep referring to our "leaders." They are not our leaders - we are their leaders. At least, we should be. That is the trap that the system wants us to believe, the trap that subverts democracy and our participation in it.
As far as what we do as being irrelevant, you are dead wrong. Time will instruct you on this. No, you are not all open ears. I've been following many of your posts for the last year and you've hammered one note: Obama bad, Nader good. That won't do the trick - not by a long shot. Not that the power structure doesn't affect us, but that we cannot, nor should we (if we have any sense at all) wait for the power structure to change.
Jennifer, please let go of some of your anger and sensitivity - it is working against you. Believe me, I am not against you. I have gone down the road you're on and I can tell you that it hasn't worked. Maybe it will for you, who knows, but it hasn't worked for many others.
Not to say that THEY are irrelevant or that Obama is any different from the rest, just that the system will not be in our favor until and unless we do the work, including the working class.
Let me refine what I've said before: It's ALL important. Voting is important if only for the reason that if we're not strategic about it, we can make things worse. Oh yes, it can be worse!
""Elections do not shape society's direction, you and I do that. Or at least, we're supposed to.""
"That is not true. You do not have the power pols have to shape policies or the direction of this country unless you just so happen to be a high paid lobbyist which I don't think you are."
By myself, there is very little I can do. Multiplied across millions of people, there is a lot of power. Deny the system its life blood - our energy and money - and the system will realize our power. Voting wisely is only the first step. Getting off our asses is the next and essential step.
""Are you proud of voting for someone who will never be president, and if he ever is, will fall into the same trap as every other president before him?""
"Whether he wins or loses is irrelevant. When you voted for Nader in 2000, I know that you did not get distracted by all this "winnability" stuff."
Okay, look. I'll make you a deal, alright? I will vote for Nader or the GP candidate in 2012 if you start doing one thing that you think will change your world for the better. Not just sending a couple of bucks to a charity, but committing sustained time and energy to something that you really believe in and that you feel with move this society in a positive direction.
Deal?
You raise a lot excellent points about her being too angry but I can't blame her for being frustrated at this mess. We older ones owe younger people like her and this author more than a simple apology for allowing our leaders to drag them into the mess we did not have to go through. I fear that the more young people find out what lead them to where they are at, the more of them we will find as angry as Jennifer at us and never forgiving us even if it is customary to respect the elders.
Let's face it. You and I both voted for Obama. Obama may have won but what did we win out of it? The more time passes by, the more I felt like those of us who voted for Obama or for that matter Mccain have lost more than those who voted third party and won one big thing that may have looked like a small thing before, the fact that they were right. I think Obama and his party in Congress are doing their best to fail and their wish may be granted. I agree with you that we should do our part but at some point, we might just have to let the chips fall where they may and if the result is no good, go for a new thing. What do you have to lose?
Max, I may be angry and upset at what is going on but I will not lay all of the blame on the older generation. I understand the brainwashing and conditioning that they went through and similar happenings to younger generations but I am trying to find ways to help overcome it so that people like me and Evan don't feel left out and rejected while everyone else drowns in blissful ignorance. As to yours and Ted's voting, I already said before that I forgive both of you.
I'm not sure where to start as a reply, because I'm not sure where you're coming from.
First, I owe no one an apology for voting for Obama. I did so with a clear mind and a clear conscience. If you're in my age ballpark (54), you know that things can be worse, and they can we worse in a hurry. McCain/Palin would have been worse in a hurry!
Having said that... While I didn't have huge hopes that Obama would change our direction, I did have some. He sure sounded pretty! While I knew full well of the sell-out nature of the Democrats, I thought that after 8 years of Bush, even they would not be so stupid as to continue their spineless ways. I was wrong.
I am prepared to vote for a third party candidate, if that candidate is truly about building a new movement. Nader is not about that, and I can't sit here and lie about that. He may be a good man, but he is not about forwarding anything. My opinion.
Having said all this, I am not prepared to spend much more time on how bad Obama is or how great Nader could be, or any of that other horse manure. It is a distraction of the highest order. It takes us, you and me and Jennifer and the author of this piece that we are all blogging about, away from our real work, which is to do whatever we can to turn this country around. If that means marching - march! If that means writing - write! If that means organizing - organize! But if anyone thinks that this will all change just by voting in a 3rd party candidate or ever Ralph Nader, well, the Republocrats are dancing and singing at that notion! They have done everything in their power to make sure that will never happen.
I don't behoove Jennifer or anyone else the right to be hugely pissed. I am hugely pissed! Anyone who isn't oozing their brains from their ears is hugely pissed at what has gone down in the name of representation in this country. But being hugely pissed must be followed with concerted and effective effort.
Hey, you know, it's all good. If Jennifer can change things electorally, then that's what she should do. As well, with you, maxpayne. Go and do it. You have my blessing. But don't you dare tell me that my vote for anyone is wrong. I am working my ass off, and being thanked by others who don't seem to have the wherewithall to do it themselves, for giving my time and effort to organize people. And you know what? What I'm organizing for is "for a new thing." I'm organizing for what happens after this all comes down. Because believe me my friend, this house of cards is going to come down. Now ask yourself, how many chances do you think we have? And when the shit hits the fan, do you want to still be knocking on the door that never opens?
Yeah, I'm pissed. But I'm using that anger to open as many doors as I can.
Godspeed.
Ted, I used to be a staunch Democratic supporter but that has changed since 2007. I voted very reluctantly on the last minute for Obama despite my support for Ralph Nader. The more Obama screws up, the more I regret my vote for him.
There is nothing distracting about discussing Obama's and Nader's strengths and weaknesses. We can't afford to make the same mistakes repeatedly and ignore the problem. If the presidency is going bad, we can't ignore the problem and afford to allow the ship to sink. Either we try to pressure him into fighting for our cause or we prepare to throw him out come next election. Already the voters of NJ and VA spoke out and it ain't pretty especially for Jon Corzine who lost big.
I don't think I can change things electorally but I don't see anything wrong with bringing up the issue. I understand that I voted for Obama on the last minute because as one who has been eligible to vote for 2-3 decades, I realized that Nader had no chance against Congress or the corporate media. The only way that Nader would succeed in pushing forth his agenda is if he had a supporting Congress but then we would have to turn to state and local levels to prepare better leaders to later take over Congress and eventually the White House.
I understand that you are doing what you can and all as you have been discussing on this thread but if you actually think about it, you're sounding just like some of the conservatives in 2005 who made a big deal about church donations and Walmart being helpful and that we should not depend on the government to help us when we're in need. They even blamed the victims of all people. Think about it.
There is nothing to feel angry about admitting that your vote was wrong. I admit that my vote for Obama was wrong but only after he won and happily betrayed us. Now I respect your decision to deny that voting for Obama was wrong but that's like saying that voting for more national debt, more giveaways to Wall Street, more wars and funding, and similar aren't wrong. We may have anticipated different than what we are getting now but that doesn't change the fact that our votes for Obama turned out to be wrong after all.
Now I don't know much about your organization and what goes on and all but I'm willing to help you succeed on climate change talks in your local area since my place is a poopoo but I take it that your place listens to all sorts of ideas on cutting down carbon footprints. For your next meeting on climate change, how about bringing up algae for oil and discuss the benefits of green crude. I will be happy to assist you and help make your next meeting truly interesting. Algae for oil can be done on almost any location on the planet and can generate the chemical equivilant of light sweet crude oil and is carbon neutral. What do you think of opening that door?
"They even blamed the victims of all people. Think about it."
I am not blaming the people, I am exhorting them to do something about their situation! Waiting for those on top to fix it for us is a fool's dream.
"There is nothing to feel angry about admitting that your vote was wrong."
I am not angry that my vote was wrong - it wasn't. I am angry that the system is so corrupt that it keeps hurting us no matter who we vote for.
I have said several times that we need to do it ALL. Meaning, voting for the best candidate as well as doing what we can personally to change the system. What I get back is that my way is wrong and that if only I would vote for the correct candidate, the foundation will be laid. This is dangerous because it leads us into a false sense of security AND entitlement that someone else will fix things for us. That's just not the way a democratic (either direct or representative) works. Indeed, the people have grown complacent and exhausted and democracy is slipping away.
Are there any others on Common Dreams who agree with me, or am I just a single lunar out here flapping my gums? Is there any merit to what I say? Can I get just one, Amen, or should I go away and leave things to those who want to elect our problems away?
Ted, I agree with at least some of what you say even if everyone else on this forum doesn't. There is no reason to leave. I have plenty to disagree with others here too but we can find some common ground and use these forums to strategize and work out our thinkings and differences so that we can face life better. I don't expect to get an AMEN on everything and nor do I want to. Disagreements aren't necessarily a bad thing if you can justify them well enough to get people to respect them and I think you're doing a great job on it. This is a public forum and I share some of your concern on the outrage JenniferB, Beforkids, SiouxRose, RichM, etc... have and agree that they can sound a bit too overkill. Still, if things get worse no matter what we try to do for ourselves, who can blame them? Sometimes, they provide great talking points so that when I confront political opposition in a typical conversation, I am better prepared to counter their prowar pro-corporate talking points. I don't think I would have been as good without these people to dish it out.
Max,
Please don't try to paint me into a corner. Whether I leave or not depends on my needs, not on whether you agree with my point for doing so or not.
What I would like to see is whether I really am the only one here who agrees with my points. Perhaps I am, and if so, this saddens me much more than what our "leaders" are doing or not doing. If this is true, then we are truly beaten, and I'm not sure we will be able to constructively recover. I would hope that at least some of the elders on this board are not too cynical and burnt out to do some work themselves to change things and then advise younger people to do so.
I know I'm not alone here because I know others who are doing hard, personal, work. I will concede that the majority of people is not doing this - the majority is still waiting for things to come to them from the top. I'm happy to know that I'm in Howard Zinn's camp in my belief that Democracy works from the bottom, up. Tyranny works from the top down, and that is where we are headed.
You know, being a progressive is though. We just don't seem to like one another enough to work together. I have seen this over and over and it has been confirmed in many instances. We like to think that we are this way because we are independent, but I'm not so sure. I'm not sure why, but my theory is that we just don't see the value in doing the hard work that is necessary to create change. But occasionally, I see progressive folks doing things that take courage and conviction and I am inspired. So I keep going.
In short, for the most part, what I have found is that the people on Common Dreams do not inspire me. Some do, but I see far too many "elders" who are cynical. This is incredible. Our young people are fed a steady stream of shit by our culture and they have no elders, or precious few, to say, "Hey, there is something you can do. If you would just do something you believe in it would give you would see the power you have!" Young people today did not grow up being a part of huge, popular movements that changed the course of our society, one person at a time. They need people who have been there to say that it is possible - hard work, but possible. And it takes time. Boomers and other elders - we are needed! What the hell are we waiting for? Copping out is not an option!
I guess I was hoping that someone other than me would just give that notion some recognition - an Amen. Not for an "attaboy" but just to know that there are others who see what I do.
Finally, I'm not a Democrat either. Nor am I a Green. Been there. I fluctuate between believing that the best I can do electorally is to vote for the lesser evil and then do some hard, individual work, or to not vote at all. Yeah, I'd love to see a third party candidate take it, but the stage has not been set. Congress and the MIC would eviscerate anyone like that and we'd be royally screwed - even more so than we are now.
Can I get an Amen?
I'm not painting you into a corner. You are painting yourself into a corner and denying that and we're trying to help you snap out of it.
Do you want someone to agree with all of your points or only some of them? I agree with some and disagree with others.
If you still think people are lazy compared to you, then that is where your problem lies at, not giving credit where it is due and that may explain why JB gets angry at hard work getting trashed. Nobody is waiting for something to come for them but that does not excuse top leadership from lying and betraying as if they are above the law. You, me, JB, and each of us have different views of what really defines "hard work". I am tolerant of all views while most on this forum might not be as far as "hard work" is concerned. With reference to young people, today's young people do not share the luxuries of a true safety net that your generation and even mine had. No popular movement will work if we can't get some leadership to actually represent us. I think that both the individual/collective efforts combined with voting for proper representation is the answer. People during the Great Depression had pro populist leadership to honor their efforts in the form of FDR and Truman. Contrast that to today's Herbert Hoover-esque leadership in the form of Clinton, Bush, and Obama.
I understand the tough spirit among most posters on CD. I share some of it myself but I am willing to accommodate. I would be glad to honor your efforts but I don't know you. Furthermore, if you are expecting an AMEN on a silver plate, I don't think you will get it easy here. Alternet is usually more accommodating but not too Obama crazy unlike Huffington Post. Have you ever been to Alternet? I would be happy to meet you there.
Don't feel left out. I think that we all fluctuate but most either don't realize it or deny it out of fear of embarrassment.
I'll still give you some of that AMEN if not all of it. :)
It seems like the Palin/McCain ticket FORCED a lot of Americans to vote for Obama, rather than Nader.
This reveals a simply way to control American politics: make sure one of the two corporate parties is fronting idiots/maniacs. That makes voting for a third party "irresponsible" rather than a democratic choice like any other.
Ted, you don't have to make any deal. Maybe I am getting too hard on myself thinking that some of my efforts are useless. I will need to step back and fully examine this. Who you vote for has to come from the heart, not from some obligation. If I sounded too harsh, my apologies.
"Voting wisely is only the first step. Getting off our asses is the next and essential step."
That is true. The problem is that without getting the first step correct, the second step will amount to nothing. It is like building a house on a poor foundation and with "cheap" materials rather than building it on a better foundation and with better quality materials. The former will cost the owner more in maintenance and repairs that will more than cancel whatever he or she saved by taking the "cheap" route versus less in maintenance and repair and some peace of mind.
Similarly, if we had a Congress and White House with more people who thought like Nader, Kucinich, Mckinney, Gravel, etc... rather than Clinton and Obama, think of the hassles we could save ourselves. Kucinich and Sanders are the types of pols I like because progressives and liberals can trust them to be themselves and not have to be made to do the right thing unlike most Democrats who won't budge no matter how much pressuring gets put on them. Worse, those Democrats not listening to us "boldly" and shamelessly listen to and side with our enemies such as Wall $treet, James Dobson, Big Military, and the rest of the monied elites. Again, I will have to sit down and think this all through about wasted efforts and my bitter and upset feelings.
I was also jealous that people like Conyers possess the political powers that none of us have that he could use to improve things such as economic justice and health care while Kucinich never mind us has none of it and is thus marginalized. I don't know that even all of us put together could attain anything close to Conyers's powers. Maybe he has a big tradeoff that I don't know about that none of us have and I wished I knew more about what that was. I was reminded that he got into office at a time when the Civil Rights Act was being passed. Maybe the tradeoffs developed from there. I am still upset and bitter that all of our efforts to get single payer back on the table went nowhere and that Conyers added insult to the injury by voting yes to that rotten HR 3962 package and then having the nerve to show outrage on Obama when it is too late. But then if he ended up in the same risky position as MLK, oh I don't even want to think about it since it all gives me a throbbing headache. :(
"...if we had a Congress and White House with more people who thought like Nader, Kucinich, Mckinney, Gravel, etc..."
Well...well, look, I understand how you feel. I was where you are. I'd like to think that I didn't grow cynical with time, but maybe I did a little.
Still, the "what if's" have never served me well, nor do I believe they will serve you well. I hate the fact that Yahoos keep winding up in places of power. T'was ever thus.
I see my part now not in wondering why or what would happen if only, but in doing whatever little I can, no matter who does what or what could have been. Not to do so just adds to the burden.
I guess you and I will continue to come at this from opposite ends. And maybe there is more to the generational aspect than I cared to admit. Apparently, there is no better teacher than a few hard knocks. I'm sorry that you're headed for a few more. Maybe we all are.
Anyway, you keep doing what you do, Jennifer, and being fired up about the state of affairs. I know of too many others, of all generations, who don't give a fig or are just plain too flinty and cynical to even do that much. More's the pity for us all.
I'll wrap up with this rather trite, but unassailable, saying from the heyday of the 60's: You're either part of the solution, or you're part of the problem.
Good night, Jennifer.
"You're either part of the solution, or you're part of the problem."
I'll take the former and I still believe that step 2 will be useless until step 1 is done right. In the meantime, I'll keep up the enlightenment with others on this forum since I believe that our posts will eventually reach out to the masses on the Internet and may eventually help the electorate snap out of their tendencies to judge books by their book covers rather than by their contents. Plus, I take great ideas from the articles and comments and use them in face to face conversations. That in itself is plenty enough action on my part. The burden of responsibility still rests on the pols for whom we give them money in the form of taxes.
"I'll take the former and I still believe that step 2 will be useless until step 1 is done right."
Then Howard Zinn knows nothing.
What you are describing is Totalitarianism, not Democracy.
I don't believe you are ready to work for what you believe, Jennifer. Never fear, you have a lot of company.
Exactly what makes that totalitarianism and not democracy? Howard Zinn made the same mistakes you and I made in voting for Obama and there have been plenty of speeches from Howard Zinn begging for Obama to listen but what does it matter when Obama won and is happily giving you and me the middle finger. Does it ever occur to you that people on the Internet come across these public dialogues everyday? That said, there are plenty of very useful talking points people such as RichM, JenniferB, SiouxRose, BeForKids, and similar leave for the rest of us progressives to pick up on so that we can better confront the rightwing talking points in our daily lives. I share some of your concern at the way these people express their outrage but the worse things get, the less easy it is to ignore. I see nothing totalitarian about what she is prescribing. Democracy may involve both voting and working but true democracy involves sharpening our voting skills and getting a bang for the buck on our work. Totalitarianism is only possible when people continue to ignore the fascists in power selling our country to hell and dragging people into wars. Fascists can count on citizens to look the other way and try to turn others away from blaming the fascists who are the real culprits. Is that what you want to continue? If so, it ain't gonna happen. I made my mistake in voting for the wrong man but this time, I'm out to correct it and Obama is making it way too easy for me. You owe everyone on this forum a sincere apology for trying to discredit their enlightenment.
"Democracy may involve both voting and working but true democracy involves sharpening our voting skills and getting a bang for the buck on our work."
Okay, but how are you going to sharpen your skills when the system is rigged and so many of your fellow voters don't see it your way? And what of all the third parties that tried to break into this game? And what of the Green Party of the "We The People Party" of BeForKids' Party?
"You owe everyone on this forum a sincere apology for trying to discredit their enlightenment."
No I don't.
Follow from those who seek enlightenment, run from those who claim they have found it.
If the system is rigged, nothing you or I do will make a difference as far as individual efforts are concerned. A few people can thank you because you only served them. We're talking about leaders who have a higher set of responsibilities to follow but won't even follow their basic responsibilities. You can brag and boast about your hard work and so can I but none of it matters when we are trying to crack the rigged system. You cannot ignore the fact that the rigged system is killing you no matter what you do. If you read the novel "Animal Farm" by George Orwell, you would have come across one of the characters who is just like you. The pig leaders are just as fascist as the prior farmer but Boxer the horse doesn't mind trusting the pig despite the pigs stressing Boxer out worse than the prior farmer. What did Boxer receive for all his hard work on the farm despite the tyranny? A one way trip to the slaughter house.
I don't share Jennifer's views that third parties will win anytime soon as far as Washington is concerned. It will take at least a decade to see any signs of it. The same can be said of BeForKids's "Main Street Party" which I like but she and I agreed that the party will take a lot of organization and unity just to barely compete against the two party system. That doesn't mean that we should write them off though and stick to getting cheated. JenniferB, myself, and most of us on this site have acknowledged voting for third parties on local and state levels. Furthermore, this also does not excuse bad leadership in any way. There is no way you can justify telling others to forget about the Obama administration killing us all from behind the scenes and then blaming people for not doing enough in your personal opinion. It is disgraceful and self-defeating.
"It is disgraceful and self-defeating."
I think you feel threatened by what I have to say.
Do you feel threatened, Max? You shouldn't. If your beliefs and stance are true, you should not feel threatened.
And yeah, people are not doing enough. In another situation, I'll bet I could find you deriding Americans for being soft and having a sense of entitlement. I'm not talking about any one group, but the American people as a whole. Not true? Then how do you explain the fact that our nation has military bases in over 100 countries all fighting for our way of life? Yours and mine, Max! OUR way of life! Is this a sustainable way of life? Do you think our MIC "leaders" are going to address this? No, I think we need to man up and start doing things for ourselves. Not one thing, but everything, including voting wisely (however you define that - I'm not as myopic as you).
See, I never leave myself out of the equation, as you seem to do. I am as much a part of this problem as anyone else, including you. And you know what? There are many cases of poor people fighting and organizing and doing things and working for change. Indeed, in the history of social change, it has always been the downtrodden who have had to fight and scratch their way to the table. While I am not poor, I look to their struggles and willingness to organize and work for what they believe.
And I take courage and encouragement from them.
So, no, I don't believe that electoral efforts will yield much. Instead, I am throwing in with those who are organizing and working for change. If that makes me disgraceful and self-defeating, then I'm guilty. If that is the case, I'd rather be guilty with them than innocent with you.
I cannot believe you are acting this stubborn. You think it's fun to make people ignore the real culprits don't you? I don't expect to convince you but I will let readers from all over the world judge who supports totalitarianism vs democracy on this forum. In the meantime, please head on over to the Monsanto article and feel free to defend "Greg R" and the rest of the Big Agri shills ! :(
But Jennifer, I have conceded that both electoral actions and individual actions are necessary, and _I_ am being stubborn?
I don't think any of this is fun, Jennifer, so please don't conflate my belief and actions with what others on this site are doing with Big Agri. I'm not a fat cat - I'm feeling the effects just like everyone else.
I didn't mean to say that I think you support Totalitarianism. My bad if it sounded like that. I meant to say that top-down approaches are not democratic - actually, they are anti-democratic. Hence my use of totalitarian. Bad example perhaps, but that is how things work.
You know, I've offered to meet you in the middle and vote for Nader, but you refuse to meet me there. Why? Why can't I get you to talk about what you do, or plan to do? I'd love to hear what moves you to action, because you are about to inherit this world. I have two children (25 and 21) and I grieve for the world their elders are handing them. It isn't right or fair, but then, fairness has never really entered into the equation. What really matters is what we do about the situation at hand.
Jennifer, whether we vote for Nader or Obama, things are going to get worse. I don't say this because I think it's fun, but because I'm afraid that most people will not be prepared. Vote for whomever you want, but please prepare yourself. What I have done, and am doing (permaculture, transition towns, sustainability, community...especially building community) will all be very necessary in the new world, possibly a world made by hand. The "leaders" are dicking around while this planet burns up and our economy comes down and a whole host of other things swirl around into a perfect storm. We need to toughen up, and the best way is to get to work with others to change things in our own communities.
Alright, I think we've discussed this enough, so I'm going to stop. I bear you no ill-will, Jennifer. To the contrary, I like you and I like your intelligence and spunk. I wish I had had your spunk when I was your age but I was too involved in raising my family and my own life. What can I say, I'm a late bloomer.
Peace.
Interesting. I shall take this post into account. No hard feelings. By the way, thanks for standing up to Monsanto in that article. I guess we all want the best but will have to find some way to agree on the steps and how to approach them. Sigh. :(
Nader didn't cost Gore the election. Gore cost Gore the election. The last person I wanted to vote for was anyone associated with Bill Clinton. Democrats voted in mass for Bush because they were sick of the Democrats selling them out on NAFTA, health care, having the props knocked out from under them with the repeal of new deal legislation (Glass Steagle act, Welfare reform)etc. That fucking Clinton administration was the best republican administration that ever existed. That's why Gore lost. Obombya was cloned from Clinton cells left on a blue dress. You can tell it's true by looking at all the Clinton Administration officials Obombya has surrounded himself with. What we are looking at is four more years of the Clinton Gore Administration. I'm sure idiots like your self that think Gore was a good choice are in a masturbatory euphoria about that. You shouldn't be teaching and indoctrinating students with your fairy tale bullshit. God I'm sick of phoney ass liberals like yourself.
Hounddog4
Very well said. Fenner reminds me of other liberals who complain about Nader such as Eric Alterman and Todd Gitlin in the documentary An Unreasonable Man which detailed Nader's life. Perhaps Fenner is saying that Nader does have the right to run for president but then becomes quite worked up and distraught when someone like Nader dares to actually go ahead and exercise his constitutional rights.
Here is a news flash for Mr. Fenner. When people are in a voting booth not only can they vote for Nader but they also have a right NOT to vote for him if he or she so wishes. Nader believed that he was offering voters an alternative to the Democrats and the Republicans and, despite Fenner's misguided belief, he has every right to do so. As you imply, that is what Fenner should be teaching his students instead of brainwashing them into believing that third party candidates do not have a right to run for office if they so desire.
News for you. My objection is to his lie, not to his running for office and offering an alternative. No, my objection is to lying. He lied repeatedly about Gore v. Bush and tried to create a false paradigm in people's minds. I never heard Kucinich or Gravel voice such an outrageous lie nor any of the other great progressives. You must understand that a public servant conflating facts is egregious. Bush conflated Hussein and Al Queda. Obama conflates Al Queda and the Taliban. In a court of law, they could and should be convicted of murder. Nader did not commit a crime because he did not hold public office but his lie was as morally reprehensible as Gore's lie when he voted for Gulf War One.
What lie? Nader pointed out that there was little difference between the two political parties. They both work for capitals interest not the publics interest. Nader was talking truth to power. There was no false paradigm in what Nader was saying. The facts being conflated are the ones your putting out about Nader costing Gore the election. People have had enough of our one party system in this country. It doesn't matter who you vote for you get Bush. That's exactly what Nader was saying and history has proved him correct. It's a corporate run duopoly. Obombya is proof that you can blow smoke up the electorates ass, promise some change and continue with the corporate rape of our country. The facts are that phoney ass liberals like yourself really aren't interested in changing the status quo. You have tenure. your income is guaranteed. Your retirements are safe. You don't want real economic reform that might threaten your fairy tale life. You don't want equatable retirements, health care, job saftey because you find a true socialist economy threatening. Hence you support corporate candidates like Gore, Kerry, Obombya who truley are the lesser of two evils. Fuck that I want a voting system that allows me to vote for who I want without electing who I don't want.
Hounddog4
Ka-boom! You nailed it. Intelligently and persuasively well stated.
Hounddog - what/whom do you see as our likely options in 2012?
Power relinquishes nothing. You take power. You can't put yourself into debt peonage. If your borrowing money to go to school they own you. We have to realise that the corporate educational system is not the only source of knowledge. We have to reject this corporate economic system by not participating in it. We need to create our own systems of currency, employment, agriculture, education, art, music etc. that doesn't feed this profit driven corporate controlled system. Drop out of the current system. Tune out the corporate blather. Tune into a new way of thinking that doesn't reward profits but values life. The most importatant thing we have in life is our time and the ability to control that time. Why use it enriching some Wall Street crook? use it for your own enrichment. You should be rewarded for your own endeavors. The current system is based on preying on your inherent fears. If I don't get a good education I won't get a good job. If I don't get a good job I won't have a good wage. If I don't have a good wage I won't get a good house. I won't have a retirement. Hell the current economic collapse shows you you aren't going to get that anyway. In spite of your fears. I think we have to go back to small community units that value social values. I don't know what our options will be. I do know it's not going to be in the current system.
Sioux Rose
HOUND DOG: Great post and out of the box thinking.
I take your point. But it appears you probably trusted Ralph Nader enough to give him your vote when that was a possibility - or have I misunderstood you? And if Ralph Nader represented enough of a corrective to the politics-as-usual of Bush/Gore to garner your vote, then whom might the next corrective be, for 2012, assuming some of us will still want to trudge to the polling station for our quadrennial exercise in futility? Or assuming that some of us are /finally/ sufficiently motivated to start laying the groundwork for a takeover by better heads than those that now make ruinous decisions in our name?
Why do we need a leader? Why can't power be shared? Why can't we control our own decisions based on our own needs? Democracy depends on an informed electorate. That's why we have a corporate media system. The last thing corporations want is an informed electorate. I don't think it would matter if God was president of our government. It's a failed system. The quicker we can accept reality the quicker we can start to take action to change it for something other than corporate profits. We need a system based on life needs not profits at any cost.
Hounddog, come November 2012, /someone's/ going to be elected to succeed Barack Obama. And we all know that the range of potential successors ranges from the awful to the godawful, and there's a difference between the far ends of that spectrum - a difference I'm willing to take note of and craft a vote accordingly. Aren't you?
The system is surely a failed system. But like it or not, a still-powerful Executive Branch is going to oversee and shape its collapse, and not all landings are equal.
Again I ask: do you see anyone on the horizon who just might stem the tide at least a little, were enough desperate progressives willing to build a movement to get him/her elected? I've got a lot riding on this: I have a 26-year-old son.
I see no one capable of changing this thing. Like I said above it's going to become a matter of how will we survive. The current system won't provide for peoples needs. Please reread what I stated above. It's up to you to get your own life in order. It's up to you to develope the skills you need to cope with what's coming at us. Your wants can be insatiable. Your needs can be met. Learn how to be a human being.
"Power relinquishes nothing. You take power. You can't put yourself into debt peonage. If your borrowing money to go to school they own you. We have to realise that the corporate educational system is not the only source of knowledge. We have to reject this corporate economic system by not participating in it."
Well said. You said it better than I've been saying for over a year now, so thank you.
This is the tack I'm taking and I invite all willing and able citizens to join this leaderless movement.
Power never cedes power - it has to be taken. While I would not like to see it taken violently, it may come to that at some point. In the mean time, we, individual citizens, can do our part peacefully by withholding as much of our life energy from the system, the power.
With each election, we lose more power and control over our lives. The freedom to withhold our energies and money is still our right. Let's use it while we can.
FMI, check out (or form) a local permaculture or transition towns meetup (www.meetup.com and search for one). Join (or form) a time bank. Join (or form) a simplicity circle. People are hungry for community and alternatives to this current dis-eased culture.
Well, it's not just Gore who isn't different from Dubya but the entire party has gone out on a limb to prove Nader correct. Nader did not betray the youth. Most of the youth never gave him a chance because they fell for the lies from the Democrat Party. Algore would have allowed Joe Lieberman, his VP pick, to destroy the Constitution anyway. But all that aside, the President can trash the Constitution but only if Congress too easily allows him or her to do so. The Democrats had plenty enough in 2001-2006 to filibuster but they allowed the slight GOP majority to prevail. Even when the Democrats had the majority in 2007 and 2008 but they refused to use it to stop the president from further trashing to Constitution or even reverse some of the trashing. This year is no different. Nader never was a narcissist nor will he ever be one. I'm not going to get too deep into the politics for I'm not in a mood and I have already exhausted my energy doing that a few days ago.
Since you are a teacher, why don't you try a new method of training your students to put quality before quantity? To successfully overcome the seductive nature of criminals such as Dubya and this president, you have to convince people to think beyond politics and actually look at the issues non-politically. If you were to examine a little closer how Nader discusses the issues vs Gore/Kerry/Obama, you would have noted the difference being that Nader is non-political while the other side is too political.
Nicely said, I also agree with your other comments. I think you are spot on concerning Nader as well as Obama. It's very frustrating for those of us who were onto this fraud from the beginning.
I'm glad that Generation O is starting to wake up but I still have to live with the consequences of their inability to think their way out of a paper bag.
The worst part is that the ease with which they were fooled sets a terrible example for future unscrupulous politicians.
I used to believe that Al Gore would not have invaded and occupied Iraq. However, after the revolting disaster of FUBARack H. Obama, I am now convinced that he would have.
Get rid of the Republicans! Get rid of the Democrats! Or there is no hope!
Fenner. Haven't you learned ANYTHING over the last year? Everything Bush did Gore would have. You still fall for the rhetoric. Gore supported the dismembering of Yugoslavia under our bombs because they wouldn't allow themselves to be plundered by the Anglo-American banks. Yugoslavia was getting prosperous and, as Chomsky said as the Berlin Wall came down, eastern europe will be "underdeveloped", by force if necessary. Gore was an enthusiastic backer of the continual bombing of Iraq's civilian life support systems (electrical plants, water treatment facilities, etc), all in violation of international law (killing an est. 435,000 children). He supported the destruction of Welfare, imposition of NAFTA, and the repeal of Glass-Steagall (Gramm-Leach Bliley act) Don't you get it? They are 2 wings of the same party. Ask yourself; has Obama (Oh god this list is endless)... sought repeal of the Patriot Act, broken up the Too-Big-To-Fail banks, re-instituted Glass-Steagall, closed Gitmo, stopped rendition, ended 2 wars against people who never did ANYthing to us, reduced (real) troops in Iraq, held international torture criminals legally responsible (as our treaty obligations demand)... I could go on but you Nader-haters are one step up from Glenn Beckheads, it's like screaming at a clam.
I know one thing for sure and that is this: nothing will split the posters on this site into two nasty name-calling factions faster than the mention of Mr. Nader.