Torture and Treason
It's a word I associate with the McCarthy era and patriotic fanaticism; its commission is the cardinal sin against the nation-state and, as such, not only too easily flung at an ideological opponent but a frayed, simplistic concept, in that humankind ought to be reaching beyond national identities for global allegiance and a security that doesn't devalue life anywhere on the planet. It's a word I avoid. Certainly I've never accused anyone of it. Till now.
But as I have pondered the recently released torture memos and the sudden, long-delayed trickle of national soul-searching they have provoked over the crimes of the Bush era, I find myself shocked into new emotional territory.
Consider this little item from a McClatchy Newspapers story last week: "The Bush administration applied relentless pressure on interrogators to use harsh methods on detainees" - commonly known as torture - "in part to find evidence of cooperation between al-Qaida and the late Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein's regime, according to a former senior U.S. intelligence official and a former Army psychiatrist."
Indeed, Guantanamo interrogators, in 2002 and early 2003, were under pressure from way high up to "produce evidence" - can you feel the moral drift here? - that Saddam Hussein helped bring down the Towers so we could go to war with Iraq. This was when Khalid Sheik Muhammed was being waterboarded 183 times and Abu Zubaydah 83 times.
"The more frustrated people got in not being able to establish that link . . . there was more and more pressure to resort to measures that might produce more immediate results," the psychiatrist, Maj. Charles Burney, told Army investigators, according to the McClatchy story.
Let us pause the news cycle here and strip away the desperate delicacy of this language. The Gitmo intelligence crew was being told, from the highest levels of the Bush White House and the Pentagon - think Cheney, think Rumsfeld - to keep slamming these guys' heads against the wall, to keep pouring water down their throats, to keep tormenting them with dogs and insects, until they blubbered, in their pain and terror, a word or two that would justify the long-planned (and completely pointless) invasion of Iraq.
This drags the torture "debate" out of the fog that mainstream pundits are paid to generate - does it work? is it legal? is it cruel? is it counterproductive? - and exposes something that is troubling at the level of the soul, and begs only one question.
Is it treason?
As I say, this is not a word I use with any comfort or certainty. It's a word I distrust. But I use it now, summoning not its legal or constitutional meaning (though I don't doubt that the U.S. Constitution was flushed down the toilet along with the Koran); but rather, the emotional core of the word as it bubbled up from Latin and French into the English language in the 13th century: to hand over, to betray a sacred trust. That was an age that, if nothing else, was serious about its values. Are we serious about ours?
Raise your hand, stand up, step forward if you think a deep moral violation has occurred in this scenario: An American president, or at least his primary advisors, circumvent international and domestic law to permit the use of cruel and occasionally fatal interrogation techniques on Muslim detainees (sometimes randomly arrested and completely innocent), not for the purpose of mining them for actual information, which might have national security value, but to get them, sheerly, to lie as instructed.
The question of the moment is now, no longer: Is torture un-American? It is: Are we, as a nation, bigger than our transgressions? Can we establish a commission or an investigation with a moral force greater than the trust that has been debased? Can we face up to what has been done in our name, establish accountability and find a way to atone and change?
Politically, the answer is no. Politics as we practice it these days - as the Democrats practice it, I should say - is just another form of market-based consumerism. It is trend-focused and desirous most of all of not offending. While the Republicans are masters at creating wedge issues and harnessing hatred in order to govern, the Dems lack the skill to harness the opposite force, compassion and empathy, so they govern without clarity or fervor. In the words of Michael Dukakis, they aspire to "manage."
As citizens who are sick of the treasonous assault on our values, we can't let up in our demand for a serious investigation into torture and other crimes of "the war on terror." Finding and addressing the root causes of what we have done is the psychological equivalent of sustainability.

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39 Comments so far
Show AllFraud, murder, treason -- most likely the charges that can stick will vary with official and position. The point is to prosecute what can be prosecuted.
I will call these techniques "Torture" when we STOP doing them To our own Navy SEAL and Army Green Beret candidates
Everything used was right out of the S.E.R.E. Curriculum....
All the Left has done is to define down the meaning of torture
Obama has already said he wasn't going to punish CIA Operatives who did it and there is no statute on the books that makes it a crime to write a legal opinion that Eric Holder disagrees with.....so the Lawyers in OLC can't be prosecuted....not to mention the fact that the "other methods" Obama alludes too were tried unsuccessfully before enhanced interrogation was used
Just a side bet...this all goes away over the next few months....no show trials, no truth commission ...nothing
Oh...and happy "May Day" to all the "Comrades" here...that is all
and Happy Mission Accomplified Day to you.
'Consider this little item from a McClatchy Newspapers story last week: "The Bush administration applied relentless pressure on interrogators to use harsh methods on detainees" - commonly known as torture - "in part to find evidence of cooperation between al-Qaida and the late Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein's regime, according to a former senior U.S. intelligence official and a former Army psychiatrist."'
Unfortunately, this very important piece of information has been largely ignored in the recent "debate" over torture. Today's "He said, she said" media insists that there must be an "equivalence" between two sides of a debate. If there is no equivalence, the media goes out of its way to create one. When the evidence overwhelmingly favors one side, they will simply ignore most of it and simply accept the lies of the other side at face value no matter how many times they have been refuted.
The very existence of an active debate over whether torture is good or bad shows just how far we have sunk in the past few years.
Speaking of treason--stealing two Presidential elections strikes me as treason--or at least an act of war. If you follow the implications, this means America is in a state of undeclared civil war.
But it looks like we're gonna just let it all fester, as with the use of torture. Burying your problems always works so well.
Wow!!! bobv....did you write that poem? If so, it is amazing! Very very good job. Your words evoke a powerful picture and stark emotion that tells truth to this very sad world we live in.
Yes. I admit it. It is mine. Thanks....
Curse from the Family of the Tortured.
The next time you try to take my eyes out
I will use the bludgeon of the greater law
to slap your book of excuses and secrets into smoke
and bury your breath in ice and vacuum.
The next time you break my daughter's
hopes, the next time you deliver her girl
to the secret funk of the rape of war
I will take you to the court
of the trenches of bodies
in the rotting walls of Fallujah. Fine,
tell me to lie, chew my son's seed
into landfill, threaten my wife's last dream
with torture to make me keep the secret safe
of who pulled her ribs apart
until her connection to the divine
was a soup of screams. Shall I forgive you
for demanding that I admit a false culpability
for your wicked glowing bombs in the new deserts
of Persia where our rice once grew and where
the ghosts of Darius' chariots
fog and thunder you down in my trauma dreams
and I can stomp again? Until my brothers' useless legs
are returned? The next time you take my grandson's love
by strapping his holiness in the naked positions
of the pig and the dog
I will not blink before I give you what is left
of my own heart, dripping. Take it. Lie all you want.
Save face among the nations of liars
if you must. Say your secrets protect you while you lie
piles of my progeny in the blasphemous piles
and make me see it over and over and over.
This is a world of torture.
You have proved it again and again until I can no longer pray.
This I know: I will let you lie until you lie down yourself
and then I swear I will call up the mold lizards of the Styx
to suck your soul from your ocular stems
and pour my fathomless well of grief
into your fetid grave and you will well up
as well and stay forever in the prisons
of the sick and shallow murky streams of your sin.
The next time you try to take my eyes out.
-- bobv
Sioux Rose
BOBV: Powerful imagery. Although I tend to be a proponent of healing & forgiveness, you do justice to the horrors and losses of those that have been on the receiving end of America's false and violently corrupted concept of itself.
thanks. I make distinctions between forgiveness and letting go, and about what and how to practice forgiveness as opposed to how to "give it".
bobv, Beautiful.
Epanalepsis is a powerful underutelized device.
The poem is graceful, powerful and true.
I too wonder, bobv, did you pen this? It matters not-you kindly shared it, it is a fine poem...
Epanalepsis. Wnderful sound, wonderful word, wonderful new definition of it for me. Thanks. Historically, all chants, the basis of most poetry, used epanalepsis... a wonderful way, like rhyme, to aid memorization prior to mass literacy.
Church goers support torture in larger numbers than non church goers.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/04/30/religion.torture/index.html
"WASHINGTON (CNN) -- The more often Americans go to church, the more likely they are to support the torture of suspected terrorists, according to a new survey."
Is this something that should surprise us?
It seems that this is really part of the basic teachings of the Abrahamic religions - all three of them with Christianity leading the pack.
Do the words "Inquisitions" and "Crusades", witch hunts and intolerance have significance?
No country is without blood on its hands. Torture is a moral issue which supersedes any and all state positions on the subject. In point of fact it renders them moot.
Ah, but it is so much nicer to contemplate that it is forever in the past. Our new forward looking government does not allow torture and in fact it has disappeared off the face of the earth. All wrong doing gone forever, all crime, gone forever. That is all that matters now and all you people who think digging into the crimes of the past just are not able to enjoy the purity of president Obama and the total change of all that was wrong to right. You just can't see the glory of the present through the fog of the past, can you?
When a nation loses it's soul collateral damage is just innocent women and children, genocide is just the deaths of thousands of black people, reproductive health care is just the planned death of 50 million children, torture is just bringing a person as close as possible to death, pornography is just free speech.
When a nation loses it's soul....there will be no...
Peace
LeeAnnG
"It's" is a contraction, not a possessive.
How I See It
http://www.gpln.com/howiseeit.htm
.
No! Really?
1) Nixon didn't sabotage the peace talks with North Vietnam to win against Humphrey?
2) Bush senior didn't sabotage Carter's efforts to free the embassy hostages in Iran so Reagan could win?
3) Reagan wasn't shot by Bush senior's orders so he could be president?
4) Bush junior didn't have John Kennedy junior's plane destroyed as a pre-emptive strike to win in 2000?
5) The Supreme Court didn't commit treason by deciding Bush junior was the president in 2000?
6) And what about Wellstone?
Treason is old hat for the elite. Power, power, power and more power. Any justification will do. They buy or bop anyone in their way. This ain't Disneyworld folks. These are EVIL people.
"Are we, as a nation, bigger than our transgressions?"
Here's your answer:
"According to the latest Gallup Poll... 55% of Americans still believe in retrospect that the use of the interrogation techniques (torture) was justified."
What else would one expect from a country where the torture-tainment series "Saw" (1,2,3,4,5 and, soon, 6) has grossed nearly $750 million so far...?
Forget investigations and indictments and prosecutions - I smell Medal of Freedom for Yoo, Bybee, et al any day now... maybe even a Nobel Peace Prize for Darth Cheney!
We. Are. Number. One.
Sioux Rose
FRANK : As history buffs in our forum have pointed out, Nuremberg held influential journalists who made the case for Germany's imperial aggression accountable. I wonder if future historians, or some international court of law will ever draw legal links to Hollywood? After all its violent sagas, and popular shows like "24 Hours" (if I got the title wrong, I apologize. I don't watch TV) massaged the public consciousness effectively blurring the lines between fiction and reality, to ease government policy into the abyss.
It did not bother our precious VP, Cheney to label anyone a traitor, whether it was someone in the government that did not go along with the administration mis-policies or demonstrators in the streets. In fact he probably was the first one to mention that word and seemed to enjoy using it.
That is why it seems premature to spend so much time being critical of President Obama already, as he is doing his best, and has only had 100 days to work miracles, as people evidently expect. At least he will surely not drag our nation through the mud, as the last lawbreakers did.
so long as he does not fulfill his obligation to investigate/prosecute the bush gang, thereby exposing his disdain for law, he's no better.
we are not discussing the degree of criminality, but the fact.
for 0 to shirk his sworn duty is criminal.
While the Republicans are masters at creating wedge issues and harnessing hatred in order to govern, the Dems lack the skill to harness the opposite force, compassion and empathy, so they govern without clarity or fervor. In the words of Michael Dukakis, they aspire to "manage."
The principle problem with the Democrats is that they're cowards who are expert at "managing" cowardice. Or the problem could in fact be worse. Perhaps they don't really believe in democracy, liberty, human freedom and the constitution any more than the T-Bangers do.
Sioux Rose
MORDECHAI: You selected the quote I intended to respond to also. Tapping into this idea that the Republicans naturally harness hate, a useful emotion if war is your ultimate product; and asking why democrats lack the will to summon the opposed virtues of compassion and empathy segues directly into the idea of polarity as expressed through the natural opposition between Mars (war/violence/self-interest) and Venus (love/caring/compassion/empathy). Mars is manly and Venus is associated with the feminine. Because American citizens have been taught for decades to worship Mars, they demean Venus in every way. (Of late I offered the compelling evidence of a substantial link between the growing "consumption" of pornography and the moral lassitude shown towards the banality of torture.) The democrats dare not be associated with traits consistent with Venus, the Divine feminine principle. They're afraid to hear Arnold Schwarzenegger whispering "girlie man" in their collective ears!
Dissing the Goddess goes way back to the Bronze Age. Ishtar, the Great Goddess of Love and War, was insulted by Enkidu to his peril. She was banished to the mountain tops by Moses as I recall. That's what goatherds do. Now we really need to get back to the Mother Goddess and growing our own food or it's our own peril.
¡NUREMBERG TWO!
If getting a predetermined answer was the motive I honestly don't understand why they bothered. Why not just tell the lie that confessions had been made? They had to lie about the nature of those confessions any way. In for a penny in for a pound.
So I can only conclude that the torture was done for the sake of doing it. If not the end in itself perhaps it was meant to terrorise potential terrorists. I really think that the Bushies would be hard pressed to find a clear answer to why. Their moral thinking is a hopeless muddle that is hostage to their emotions. The means justify the end.
The interrogators didn't lie because they were willing to do anything okeyed up above to elicit the proper data bytes. Just filling in the squares on the page. We are talking about the rule of diminishing returns regarding the factibility of technological culture's endless development.
It's the end of the road for the perfectability of our civilization. Isn't it time to deconstruct the USA back to its roots as a collection of States, de-financing the feds, the pentagon, the whole weary mess of well-meaning but ultimately insane bunglers who have taken over the biggest baddest business in the world? So we can get on with the job of actually solving some of the real life threatening disasters crashing down all around?
There MUST be indictments, trials, convictions and incarceration. If not, than ANY law may be violated without fear of punishment. It's as simple as that with no need to complicate it any further.
The next time you are summoned to do jury service, just tell the judge to get back to you when America becomes a nation of laws again. For me I will never serve again till they put these scum bags on trial. Which means I will never serve again.
I agree with the sentiment, but consider serving anyway, by answering that you'll be able to set aside your prejudices and rule fairly, then vote to acquit.
No matter the charge, the proof, or anything.
Because it will not be a banker in the dock, but a potsmoker, a burglar, or even a violent offender.
But it will not be anyone from the elite, or their middle-class enablers.
So vote to acquit. No Matter What.
Certainly you should vote to acquit if I'm in the dock. If Bush and his fascist henchmen don't have to obey the law, why should I?
I agree 100%. Until about fifty lawyers, politicians, officers are in prison the word LAW is just the punch line in a joke.
Not to worry, the whole discussion of torture will disappear from the news cycle shortly and we won't have to (or get to) hear it anymore.
"Swine flu!"
"Swine flu!"
"Swine flu!"
All Media get on board now! The Elite have spoken.
You got it !!!!!!
Diversion Technique Number 25......No World Series, No BCS Championship, no Super Bowl......"Swine Flu Panic" will do and don 't forget to let Rumsfeld's drug company get the vaccine!!!!! We, The American People, are utterly stupid!
100 Detainees disappear(Probably Murdered).....27 are tortured to death (MURDERED)! They were being tortured to confess to things the CIA wanted them to say !!!! That includes Khalid Sheik Mohammed, the guy who confessed to planning the 9/11 attack.....So, Sheik, explain to me how you got the "Thermite" and how did you place it in World Trade Center #7 when the CIA had its offices on Counter-terrorism there????????
I double dare President Obama to ask for an International Independent Investigation of 9/11 and start with a subpoena to Philip Zellikow, the Director of the 9/11 Commission.....one question to begin with, "Why did you allow testimony from The American Enterprise Institute that claimed there was a link between Al Qaeda and Saddam Hussein?"
Let's immunize everyone from any crime they commit !!!!! No, just those in the "Power Elite" Too bad Mike Connel, you were just a pawn to be used and done away with!
Excellent Article by Koehler.
Time to raise the ante from torture to Treason.
Do not be too cynical the debate is moving in the correct direction.
Peaceful demonstations now !!!!
The trick will be to get appropriate penalties.
Stay away from those shots, friend...they are deadly.