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The Newest Fear-Mongering Campaign From the Right and the Media
But the real fear-mongering is focused on all of the attacks that American communities will suffer if we imprison dangerous Terrorists inside the U.S. rather than in Guantanamo. House Majority Leader John Boehner wants you to be frightened: "I think the first thing we have to remember is that we're talking about terrorists here. Do we bring them into our borders?" GOP House Minority Whip Eric Cantor warned: "Actively moving terrorists inside our borders weakens our security. Most families neither want nor need hundreds of terrorists seeking to kill Americans in their communities." The always frightened Wall St. Journal Editorial Page shrieks that any place that houses Al Qaeda Terrorists will become a "target" for attack:
The military base [at Ft. Leavenworth] is integrated into the community and, lacking Guantanamo's isolation and defense capacities, would instantly become a potential terror target. Expect similar protests from other states that are involuntarily entered in this sweepstakes.
National Review's Jim Geraghaty spent all day yesterday fantasizing about all the scary things that could happen if we have Al-Qaeda Terrorists in our communities (near nuclear facilities and airports!). Former Bush aide and chief speechwriter Marc Thiessen warned yesterday in The Washington Post that if there is a Terrorist attack on U.S. soil, Americans will blame Obama because he stopped torturing and closed Guantanamo, and Democrats will be "unelectable for a generation." Today, at National Review, Thiessen, citing yesterday's Executive Orders, declared Obama "to be the most dangerous man ever to occupy the Oval Office." And yesterday, of course, The Washington Post's Fred Hiatt echoed the standard claim that our regular federal courts were inadequate to try dangerous Terrorists.
All of this is pure fear-mongering -- the 2009 version of Condoleezza Rice's mushroom cloud and Jay Rockefeller's "we'll-lose-our-eavesdropping-capabilities" cries. Both before and after 9/11, the U.S. has repeatedly and successfully tried alleged high-level Al Qaeda operatives and other accused Islamic Terrorists in our normal federal courts -- in fact, the record is far more successful than the series of debacles that has taken place in the military commissions system at Guantanamo. Moreover, those convicted Terrorists have been housed in U.S. prisons, inside the U.S., for years without a hint of a problem. Here is but a partial list of the accused Muslim Terrorists who have been successfully tried and convicted in U.S. civilians courts and who remain imprisoned inside the U.S.:
- Sheik Omar Abdel Rahman, convicted, 1996, U.S. District Court (before then-U.S. District Judge Michael Mukasey) -- plotting terrorist attacks on the U.S. (currently: U.S. prison, Butler, North Carolina);
- Zacarias Moussaoui, convicted, 2006, U.S. Federal Court -- conspiracy to commit the 9/11 attacks (currently: U.S. prison, Florence, Colorado);
- Richard Reid, convicted, 2003, U.S. Federal Court -- attempting to blow up U.S.-bound jetliner over the Atlantic Ocean (currently: U.S. prison, Florence, Colorado);
- Jose Padilla, convicted, 2007, U.S. Federal Court -- conspiracy to commit terrorism (currently: U.S. prison, Florence, Colorado);
- Iyman Faris a/k/a/ Mohammad Rauf, convicted, 2003, U.S. Federal Court -- providing material support and resources to Al-Qaeda, conspiracy to commit terrorist acts on behalf of Al Qaeda (currently: U.S. prison, Florence, Colorado);
- Ali Saleh al-Marri, accused Al Qaeda operative -- not yet tried, held as "unlawful enemy combatant" (currently: U.S. Naval Brig, Hanahan, South Carolina);
- Masoud Khan, convicted, 2004, U.S. Federal Court -- conspiracy to commit terrorism as part of Lashkar-e-Taiba and Islamic jihad (currently: U.S. prison, Terre Haute, Indiana);
- John Walker Lindh, convicted, 2002, U.S. Federal Court -- providing material support to the Taliban (currently: U.S. prison, Florence, Colorado).
That's just a partial list. Both pre- and post-9/11, there are numerous other individuals who have been convicted in U.S. civilian courts of various acts relating to terrorism inspired by Islamic radicalism, including many alleged to be high-level Terrorists, who are now serving sentences inside the U.S., in U.S. prisons. Moreover, terrorists accused of being members of Al Qaeda and affiliated groups have been successfully tried in the regular courts of other countries -- including Britain and Spain -- and currently sit in those countries' regular prisons, without a whiff of a problem.
If it were really the goal of Terrorists to attack American prisons where their members are incarcerated and if they were actually capable of doing that, they already have a long list of "targets" and have had such a list for two decades. If U.S. civilian courts were inadequate forums for obtaining convictions of Terrorism suspects, then the above-listed individuals would not be imprisoned -- most of them for life -- while the Guantanamo military commission system still has nothing to show for it other than a series of humiliating setbacks for the Government. As is true for virtually every fear-mongering claim made over the last eight years to frighten Americans into believing that they must vest the Government with vast and un-American powers lest they be slaughtered by the Terrorists, none of these claims is remotely rational and all of them are empirically disproven.
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106 Comments so far
Show AllQuite simply, it seems that if TPTB keep Gitmo under their control, the truth of 9/11 will never be revealed. Put these folks who are probably innocent for the most part in civilian prisons and the truth will be revealed. Give them access to some independent media and civilian attorneys.....can't have that, eh? The TRUTH may set THEM and US free!
And that "false flag" may be lowered FOREVER!............. Apologies..please read this after my previous comment...I meant to add this on under "reply".
"the sky is falling! Help! Help! the sky is falling!"
The GOP 7 their reich-wing supporters in the media(Faux snooze, Blush Limdick, Trannie Coulter, Beck, Brillo, Hannity, etc) are a bunch of chicken littles.
I think it's all they have left.
We surely cannot expect anything intelligent or clever from them can we?
Those in the right places are making the most of these people too. I never saw Coulter once in the eight years of the bush reign of terror, and only knew of her through CD and other like sites. In the past week, I've seen her on two tv shows only days apart. She was on Dr. Phil's show yesterday. They're working as hard to discredit Obama before he even gets started as some here have been - or are.
I quit watching the Today show and NBC and MSM in general because they were giving way too much air time to Trannie Coulter to spew her vile venom, but never had differing views, from a Molly Ivins, Jim Hightower, Howard Zinn, Noam Chomsky, or others.
My main source of news is from CD, huffpo, think progress, alternet, z magazine, the progressive, and similar sources.
The mind is like a parachute: It only works when it is open!
Have you tried Scoop (out of New Zealand)?
Sioux Rose
WILMOOR: It really pissed me off when Oprah made a star of Dr. Phil, if he is not a cross between a football coach and a Baptist minister, the poster child for authoritarianism and directing lives towards the same one-size-fits-all false destination, I don't know what/who is! No offense to Virgos in the forum, but this guy is a class-A Virgo of the sort Phil Hartman mocked so well in his Saturday Night Live sketches: "The Anal Retentive Chef," and "The Anal Retentive Fisherman" for two examples. So he's tying it up with Coulter. My instincts were right about him all along. Some of my friends think I am too hard on Oprah but I see her as THE icon for conspicuous consumption, a particularly sickening position at a time when people of good sense, who truly care about the longevity of this planet's life-sustaining ecosystems would be teaching conservation IF they had the kind of pulpit she does. That Dr. Phil would give that blond reptile air time repulses me.
The first time I saw Ann Coulter was when Geraldo Rivera had a night time show where lawyers discussed issues, and at the time THE issue was the OJ Simpson case. Then the subject became Bill Clinton's affair with Monica. Coulter was so cruel towards Monica I wanted to slap her face through the television. She sneers when she speaks. I got hold of her birthdate to do up a profile as I am looking for common traits that make for these authoritarian personality types. Two key patterns (as above, so below) have thus far emerged. When Jesus suggested "Judge not that ye not be judged," these two judges sure missed the boat. Compassion is not in either one's vocabulary.
These sychophants of the right get paid big $ to foment hate,fear and lies. Just think if Rush and the rest were told they had to stop aiding and abetting the terrorists ( in the Government and the Media ) and were painted with the same brush as they try to use on the rest of us,maybe their $ would dry up.
Sioux Rose
I have a couple of visceral reactions to this article. First, the PRESUMPTION that the people in Quantanimo even qualify as "terrorists" is its own convenient fiction. It would be great if the media, no longer under direct threat/control of Bush and neocons (not a bad title for a punk band?) actually TOLD THE TRUTH about who's in that offshore prison, how many were collected by bounty hunters in the way a drift net catches a lot more than the intended tuna fish!
Secondly, everything about this illegal prison reminds me of the script in the film "Fargo," where the character played by William Macy has a devious plan that goes awry, so he keeps having to score kills to cover it up. This whole operation strikes me as a larger version of the same type of operation.
Third, the right wing, as loyal salesman for the military industrial complex must foremost keep prominent in American minds the active belief in enemies, danger, and the fear so instrumental to funding a gigantic monstrous apparatus that already has enough weapons to kill everyone on this planet MANY times over. Hard sale if intelligent human life actually knew the score!
Your second and third points are very well-taken.
It's not clear to me the author actually does believe these people are terrorists. His point is that these people, who were convicted of crimes, were convicted, tried, and are being held wholly within the USA.
So all this "lions and tigers and bears...oh My!" crap is just that....crap.
Having written articles myself you are sometimes forced to focus on a given point.
I am not yet prepared to judge him regarding any opinions of true innocence or guilt of the people he mentions.
I cannot emphasize enough how important articles like this are for me.
I have relatives in the heartland and for reasons I just cannot fathom they seem particularly open to this kind of crap propaganda. But I also notice that if you can counter them immediately and forcefully and then quietly point out that surely, the place you got that 'news' source is suspect...they do start to think.
That's the enemy of the right these days, a populace that actually thinks. Those of us fighting this fight really need information like this just as soon as it is available.
Good point. I've so often wished I had such information to counter some of the idiotic crap the programmed idiots run with.
The list in this article made me think of something that might be a counter to this particular line of bull, and something the brainwashed masses can relate to without having to think - CHARLES MASON AND HIS GANG OF TERRORISTS HAVE BEEN LOCKED UP IN US PRISONS FOR HOW MANY YEARS NOW, AND WE'VE HAD NO REPEAT OF THE TERROR THEY WERE LOCKED UP FOR.
And who expects anything from Republican propagandists other than childish prattle designed to fool the weak-minded and ill-informed into acting/voting against their own interests?
Millions dying from tobacco products has always been A-OK with the Republicans (even if from second-hand smoke, where there is no "choice" involved), as were the millions dying and injured from other dangerous consumer products (again the consumers often did not know the risk, so no real "choice"), and the millions whose lives have been shortened by the presence of unnecessary and unregulated fats and dangerous chemicals in foods on the supermarket shelf (again unknowing, and without "choice"), and certainly the millions whose lives were shortened or limited because of insufficient resources being devoted to medical care or research (finite resources instead were put into the military budget, the GWOT, or other wasteful but lucrative, for the well-connected, projects).
To the Republicans and far too many Democrats, "freedom" merely means the freedom for them and their cronies to make money in any way possible, regardless of the harm to others or the environment. It would seem to me that one of the most important freedoms would be the freedom to form a government, or implement a government policy, to protect ourselves from predatory corporations, but somehow they do not see it that way.
At some point one would think even the most gullible rube would begin to tune out drivel such as that Greenwald mentions, but we will see.
Don't these people ever stop and give us a break? Is Robert Worth really afraid, is he just trying to get attention, or is he trying to stir up the fear thing again? Shame on the Times for even printing such a piece of junk. I'd probably return home from a stint in Guantanamo so full of anger at being caged in there and hating the U.S. even more than when I was sent there, that terrorist or not, I'd become one upon release. This Times article reeks of Willie Horton.
Now, if something bad happens, the right will say it's the fault of the liberal democrats. 9-11 happens on their watch, and they leave off with this whole "keeping us safe" smell? Whatever.
It must really suck to be a republican... to have your leaders be so mindless and foolish that they do nothing but live in fear of everything and everyone must really be terrible. And especially when it's pretty clear that they only stand for the love of money, and don't stand for much of anything else.
I for one am really sick of being told that I need to live in fear. What kind of life is that, really? And I keep remembering the words of Eisenhower, the last GOOD republican, who told us that the military/industrial complex would be trying to make us fearful so they could bankrupt us with it. He was right, and we SHOULD have listened to him instead of listening to those who live for HUGE profits at our expense. I suspect that an awful lot of the negative things that have happened in our history since Ike wouldn't have happened if we had been smarter about it.
Time to send them packing and to apologize to the rest of the world for being nothing but a bunch of cowards, and for trying to force our "way of life" on all of them, not to mention propping up one dictator after another to keep them in line. If we allowed others to live their own lives they wouldn't be seeing us as the reason their lives suck, and wouldn't be coming here to kill us in our own country. Nothing happens in a vacuum, and unlike what the righties want to tell you, a lot of what happens to us IS our own fault.
Recently, Rethugs were polled about who was the BEST Republic party president. Ronnie Ray-gun won hands down. To my knowledge, Eisenhower did not even get honorable mention.
And you thought Barry Goldwater was nuts in 1964 when he uttered these words:
"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. And moderation is no virtue."
Yoh. Right winger, "good" Christian people: do unto others what you want them to do to unto you. You are reaping what you sow. What goes around comes around. It's coming around.
If the U.S. is attacked I will have little doubt who the attackers are.
Me too!
Me either. The network that the US and the West set up to fight secular (usually leftist) nationalism and social revolutionary movements in the Mid East will have attacked. The US and Britain helped foster the Islamist movement, as did Israel with Hamas (remember Arafat calling Hamas a "creation of Israel?") for its own benefit. We stand in the way of any fundamental change to social relations and economics (look at the bi partisan corporate looting of Afghanistan and especially Iraq) and align ourselves with horrible dictators like the Saudis who have for decades fought against any change to the status quo. They fought Nasser and the ideas behind the "free officers" in Egypt, who had a large influence in Saudi Arabia, and the Saudis set up a network (with the help of the West) to fight similar currents, based on fundamentalist, reactionary religious fanaticism. When there are large differences in wealth, when local elites collude with Western capitalists to loot and pillage the wealth of their countries and when democracy and social movements are attacked you have a power vacuum, and that vaccum has been filled by reactionary religious movements. Think about the fact that South Yemen and Sudan used to have large Communist and leftist parties. What right did the Arabs have controlling OUR oil under THEIR ground?
Has anyone stopped to think about WHAT IF all those guys we released were originally innocent. We didn't have evidence nor could we convincingly invent evidence. But what do you do even if you were innocent and undergo a year or two of horrific treatment. The American government can't simply say, "oopsie, we didn't mean to water board you and force you to join those naked homoerotic pile ons." There is a good chance that released prisoners will intensely hate America the rest of their lives if not join Al Qaeda or the Taliban.
Weren't we supposed to be eradicating terrorists instead of creating them?
So what is the option here, keep them imprisoned forever due to the terrorism they will hypothetically be involved in the rest of their lives because they were originally innocent?
This stuff doesn't pass the smell test. It stinks of Republibabble, in the same category as Rush Limbaugh's latest provocative news that he hopes Obama will fail because he is going to create big government. Excuse me for noticing, but Bush has built gargantuan government over the last 8 years and I guess Rush was too busy sucking on that cigar to notice.
Maybe the Times is trying to be able to say that they present all view points, including conservative. They are competing against the Washington Post, who have quality conservative columnists like George Will. The problem is it looks like they are presenting poor quality right wing Republibabble that is easily debunked and makes the left wing columnist look good in comparison.
i can't comment on all those cases g.g. mentions, but the padilla and lindh cases were both travesties. both were tortured before trial, padilla for years.
having a 'legitimate' venue for a trial is no guarantee of justice. prosecutorial and police misconduct is rampant; presumption of innocence is a joke; defense attorneys are unaffordable, unavailable, or incompetent for most; and the climate of fear, inflicted on the u.s. for a long, long time, infects judicial proceedings. just being accused of a crime can utterly destroy your life.
The impact of the right wing propaganda push now underway that Glenn Greenwald discusses hinges upon a single, simple assumption: because George Bush managed to get out of Washington without a second 9/11 style terrorist attack on American soil taking place, whenever there is another attack it will all be exclusively Barack Obama's fault.
This is more than just fear mongering. The neo-con militarist spinmeisters' theory (Marc Thiessen's WaPo and Review offerings as a prime example) claims that because Bush successfully kept America "safe" for the last 2,668 days he was in office, if something does go boom in the night tomorrow this second incident has nothing - nothing whatsoever - to do with blowback.
To me, the fallacy of this line of reasoning is as self-evident as it is self serving. The Bush doctrine, torture gulag and all, is declared emphatically to be a success. Therefore, any alteration of the Bush/Cheney global war on terror policies by the Obama administration will be the "cause" of any subsequent act of international terrorism that takes place inside the United States. Barack Obama will be held totally at fault automatically by the American electorate simply because he took the oath of office, according to this right wing framing effort.
Never mind that 9/11 itself happened - and the nation's military command center was hit in broad daylight - on Bush's watch. Never mind that Bush's war and torture policies abroad have radicalized and multiplied our potential enemies in the Muslim world a hundred fold. It will all be entirely Obama's fault.
I really do not believe the people of this country are so stupid they cannot see through this pathetic propaganda set up.
Bill from Saginaw
Never mind all those things, indeed. The far right has planned this setup from the day Obama won the nomination, and well before, for whichever Dem won. They have one focused agenda: restoring the blood-soaked legacy of Bush as one of our greatest presidents, and the only way to do that is present the Dem as counter-example.
So no matter what Obama does it will be "proof" to them of how superior Bush was, in protecting us from terrorists and literally everything else. Rove taught the likes of Limbaugh, O'Reilly and Hannity well. They are committed Stalinists, American-style. Nothing matters but pushing the party line, and that means glorifying Dear Leader, no matter how incompetent and brutal.
Everything Obama does will be cast by these fascists as evidence of "socialism" and how he's "soft on terrorism." The tragedy is that they will maintain their powerful media forums on Fox, CNN and other MSM fortresses so they can spew their bilious lies and twist every move Obama makes into unrecognizable shapes to suit their propaganda purposes. The fact that they are thoroughly discredited makes no difference.
Major media is as biased toward their far right ideology as it was immediately post-9/11. Fox's cheerleading for unrepentant American imperialistic criminality will remain as fierce as ever. All the decrepit left will have is Olbermann and Rachel Maddow, Greenwald and a few other lefty bloggers, and Common Dreams. But the braindead megaphone of the fascist right will blare its murderous idiocies long into this adminsitration's term in office, no matter how centrist and utterly non-progressive a direction it takes.
As for this from Bill: "I really do not believe the people of this country are so stupid they cannot see through this pathetic propaganda set up." Well, "the people of this country" are not one monolithic block. Plenty of them, at least half and probably a lot more, are decidedly stupid enough to not see thru this propaganda or any other the far right sets up. Rove's liar brigades have worked tirelessly for 8 years to insure they're that stupid. They're eager to be duped again. They live on little beside the fear meme and are terrified of abandoning it. Believing the Democrats are determined to open the borders to Islamic terrorists who will kill us all is a central tenet of their psychotic faith. Obama will only kick that fear meme into overdrive.
Bill, the statement of no attacks due to Bush is in of itself a fallacy. I live in DC. We were attacked with Anthrax, people died, gov't building were closed for a year due to contamination. Anthrax was sent to other cities too. They have not caught the people behind these terrorist attacks and are no longer looking since they got a suicide scapegoat last year.
The DC/Beltway Sniper is another terrorist incident, the pair were on the loose for three weeks, shooting 14 and killing 10. (As a bonus the ringleader had a Muslin name and they still discount it!)
I know, technically DC is not part of the USA, we are a territory. Still, these are CLEARLY terrorist acts, ignoring them does not make it otherwise. The fear mongers pick and choose their truths and the media backs them up. The general public is largely ignorant of the readily available facts and too lazy to seek out a reality that does not fit their narrowly defined perceptions.
A previous poster mentioned 'what if' the people held at Gitmo are innocent. I believe they are, as stated, they were sold for a bounty to the USA. We will not release them.
That simple assumption fails any logic test. In the 8 years preceding the reign of Bush the Terrible there were no 9/11 attacks. And 9/11 happened on his watch.
Were any future attack to take place, and it is statistically inevitable that there will be something even if it is domestic a la McVeigh, it is also a non sequitur to connect that by default to the administration of the time.
Why, with years of education and life experience, are people so stupid and why is this pursuit of stupidity a national avocation?
Bill from Saginaw January 23rd, 2009 12:17 pm, good points, Bill. The Right-Wing Noise Machine is losing its audience -- Bill O'Reilly alone has lost close to three million viewers since 2005 and his radio show is kaput. Similarly, Rush, Hannity and the other blowhards pushing fear and hatred are falling in the ratings. In most major and middle markets, voices like Thom Hartmann and Randi Rhodes routinely beat these guys in the same time slot. All of their fearmongering vitriol is the last rattle as the snake dies. (I've even heard that Rupert Murdoch wants to sell Fox News as it's starting to make less of a profit.)
You wrote: "I really do not believe the people of this country are so stupid they cannot see through this pathetic propaganda set up."
While they may not see through it necessarily, Obama is immensely popular and most of America, drowning in Bush's ruined economy and manifold failures here and abroad, want him to succeed. A depression is an excellent device for clearing the mind of dumb opinions and focusing it on reality. The neoconservatism of Reagan and Junior is a luxury for good times, when people have disposable cash. Remember all of those 'Reagan Democrats' the Big Media bloviated about in the last few elections -- that group no longer exists -- they were mostly union members and voted for Obama this time around.
The Right is dying off, and the proof is this recent outrage perpetrated by Rush Limbaugh: He once went apoplectic criticizing liberals as ‘unpatriotic America-haters’ because he had convinced himself they wanted the Little King to fail in Iraq -- now he has, according to his lights, joined the ranks of unpatriotic America-haters. On his radio show the other day, he confessed openly, referring to Obama, “I hope he fails.”
Aside from the fact that about 83 percent of the public doesn’t agree with him, even some of the brain-addled rubes who still give any credence to the great blubbery gasbag, suffering under the GOP economy and dying in the senseless Republican wars Rushbo helped peddle, had to be appalled by this statement. He wants the country to go down the drain to what – make the era of conservative Republicans look good? That’s some patriot; George Washington would be proud. Prediction: This is the sort of nasty, psychotic hypocrisy that is losing ratings for the neocon hustlers of the broadcast media and it’s going to result in Limbo being dropped from the airwaves across the country. In eight years, Rush will have lost his syndication deal and will end his miserable existence shouting through a tin can at a little 1000-watt daytimer in North Peckerwood, Alabama. (“Hey, Limbaugh, y’all forgot to take out the trash last night!” “I’ll get it, boss, I’ll get it!” “Yeah, and don’t forget to mop them washrooms extra good while you’re at it.” )
Sioux Rose
RSJ: Thanks for sharing the new good news!
Very good. Thanks
You have to feel sorry for the people in North Pecckerwood, Alabama. I would rather see Rush join his comrade in Wasilla, Alaska!
Paul Revere January 25th, 2009 12:11 am, LOL, the 'Voice of Vanilla from Wasilla' would be fine, as well.
I would not be surprised if there were a fresh terrorist attack on US soil in the near future. If you were Osama Bin Laden and had just enjoyed all of these years of fantastic recruitment and growth, wouldn't you want to blow a little something up in the US to take the wind out of Obama's sails and turn the helm back over to the Repugs? No one has done more for the cause of fanatic Muslim terrorism than George Bush and his millionaire posse. He will be sorely missed by his enemies.
If you were a "real" terrorist that wanted to destroy America's freedoms,the Constitution, the Bill of rights, and the American financial system, you would have to love what Bush,Cheney and the rest of the traitors to America, accomplished in the last eight years for you! Talk about aiding and abetting the enemy!
It appears as though the republicans are the biggest scaredy cats on the planet. "Home of the brave?" What a joke.
"none of these claims is remotely rational and all of them are empirically disproven"
I know there's a dead progressive somewhere who will roll over in his grave when I say this, but at some point we have to realize that Rationality and Facts have no meaning to a vast number of US citizens. Fear-mongers know this, and use it to their advantage. Progressives need to too, but in a positive way. It'd be like trying to convince a dog not to poop in the house, by explaining to him all about germs. Not gonna work.
I couldn't disagree more. Neither political party is for universal healthcare, the Democrats might have a decent amount of members who are, but it is not in the party platform or plans in the short term. The media and entrenched interests are against the idea, entirely control information on a mass scale and use fear mongering, yet the people here support universal healthcare even if it raises taxes by a large majority. "Free trade" has been supported by both parties, Obama included, the media and entrenched interests. Obama wants to, at most, moderately change NAFTA and similar deals, my guess is that they'll put broadly worded and largely unenforceable changes into NAFTA (like the Clintonites did, who largely make up Obama's administration), there's little hope that there will be fundamental change. Yet, a majority of people here fundamentally reject NAFTA (job losses, wages, the negative effects it has on democracy, some worry about the large increases in immigration thanks to NAFTA's destruction of Mexico), hell a poll of Republicans revealed that a small majority are opposed, for somewhat different reasons than the left. The public is "to the left" of either party on Iraq, the environment, foreign policy, amongst other issues. Over 80% of the people in the US think the economic system is inherently unfair, they don't trust the media.
The problem isn't people's opinions on the issues, it's that we have no direct democracy here, we have no way of making people's opinions match governmental policy. We really don't have a well functioning democracy as a result. Essentially, we vote out of touch, or soon to be out of touch, elites into office and after in office we pray and beg them to listen to us. That is US democracy, it's outdated and doesn't work. Unless there is an increased role for citizens in the actual workings of government, this won't change. We have rule by elites, our hallow democracy simply allows us to choose which ones will run our lives.
What we also have is irrational and harmful hero worship. I am glad Obama is in office instead of McCain, despite my problems with him and his administration’s ideological makeup. His election is a sign of progress, and should be reflected on. However, when I here “liberal” radio now, they talk almost nonstop about how Obama is essentially a living god. The debate isn’t about issues, and how much the left should push him in a direction (according to most we should shut up, like with Clinton, allow only the right to push and put our faith in Obama), but whether of not Obama is as amazing as Washington, Lincoln or JFK. Obama is a man, a smart man, but a man. He has an ideology that does not square with public opinion and he has surrounded himself with like minded people. His ideology and preference will at times get in the way of better policy options. He will make mistakes and will not fundamentally change what needs to be changed, unless he is pushed. If we had an actual functioning democracy we’d elect Obama, reflect for a moment, then start pushing, struggling, organizing, educating. Instead, we have rule by elites, and if the people are deluded and think illogically, it’s in how much faith they put in elites and not themselves to run their lives, country and government.
In Bolivia, they elected a poor, indigenous peasant farmer as their president, for the first time in a country in which the majority is indigenous. They celebrated, were proud, then began the struggle with the right wing and never stopped pressuring Morales. They know what democracy is, we know rule by elites.
If BHO dares to reach out to the Palestinians, the Arab world, Iran. The U.S. will be hit by another false-flag attack, from the same neat people that brought us 9-11.
You know, the ones caught, set up ahead of time to film the impacts, with absolute fore-knowldege who filmed the first impact from the Jersy shore, "cheering and high-fiving each other" The Mossad. Israel and Cheney, Abrams, Kristol, Wolfowitz, Feith got their war. The U.S. lost 3,000 human beings. I guess they were sacrificed for a Higher Cause.
(Larry Silverstien, the Tower's landlord, insured the Towers w/German insurers two months b4 9-11 against the ridiculous possibility of total destruction from terrorism for several Billion Dollars. He Collected.)
Remember the USS Liberty. Where Americans were machine gunned to death in the water after abandoning ship due to being bombed, torpedoed and strafed first. (NSA intercepts show 100% the unique ship was clearly identified as American b4 the hours-long attack commenced.)
Another 9-11? The Republicans/Neocons(Israelies) motivated? "The Democrats will be unelectable for a generation"
Sad. It will happen.
As always, I wish to say I love my Jewish brothers and sisters who speak out for Peace. But what is real is real. It was not the Boy Scouts of America set up ahead of time on that Jersey shore. That the Mossad Agents got caught is what it is. Busted.
azjoe.
If you're going to blame Mossad, you must first learn to spell.
You may want to start with Silverstein.
Hope that helps.
Well, waiguoren, I did not know Larry Siverstein was a member of the Mossad, the quite clear inference of your first two sentences. Are you sure about that?
Pardon my spelling, I'm not very smart. But I'm smart enough to know the Five Mossad Agents who got their Dumb Asses Arrested had prior knowledge of the impacts on 9-11. That is 100% definite.
Or waiguoren, do you think the undercover Israeli's (spies) in their fake "Moving Van," had their video cameras set up on that frigid New Jersey shore, trained on the WTC's that morning to film sea-gulls and sailboats against the Manhattan skyline? Then just happened to burst into cheers of Joy when the first jet slammed into the WTC. What a Laugh. (How's my spelling now?)
Walt & Mearsheimer.
azjoe.
Better.
Now it's time to work on apostrophes.
"Or waiguoren, do you think the undercover Israeli's (spies) in their fake "Moving Van..."
These Israelis do not take an apostrophe in this sentence.
You have incorrectly utilized the possessive case.
Try harder.
Silverstein, and all the Silversteins (no apostrophe), are rooting for you!
Waiguoren, I admit, you are funny, and I appreciate levity. However, considering what I've alleged, that Israel played a principle role in 9-11, you being cutesy if you will and distractionary says this to me. You can't touch the logic of what I say. Or you would. I invite you and "all the Silversteins(no apostorophe)" you say are rooting for me to actually respond to the unequivocal accusation I've made!
Remember? (nice obfuscating), That Israel helped bring down the Towers! Nice taking it off topic. But, you got any thoughts on those "Five Dancing Israelis" who filmed the impact? The Spies?
Remember? Like I asked before, but instead you've preferred to discuss punctuation.....hey, it's okay. I don't blame you one little bit.
azjoe.
When you can't get the content, pick at details of style.
I like your posts just fine, regardless of the odd appostrophe that might not be where the anal crowd would prefer to see it.
(And BTW, I'm a stickler for details, as no doubt you are as well. But content still rules.)
waiguoren, I retract my generalized accusation that Israel played a role in 9-11. Allow me to amend that. 1. Cheney, and a U.S neoCON element, in certain conjunction with 2. A small group of Mossad agents, and possibly, maybe, even al-Queda, Did bring the towers down.
Israel is made up of many different people. Many who would seek peace, many who long for it. Israel is not the insane actions of it's leaders or intelligence community. Any more than America is it's foreign policy, murderous for sure, which many loathe. I wish peace for Israel, from my heart. I wish the war to stop so the healing can begin.
Imagine how Israel could blossom if instead of pariah it was all it could be in an embracing international community. Isolation hurts the isolated. And Gaza? You cannot go into the darkness like that, without it going into you.
Peace to All. azjoe.
Dear waiguoren, as an old grammar teacher, I do appreciate your taking on the education of the masses. However, your tone borders on obnoxious pedantry even to my grammar-loving mind. I am concerned you may be falling victim to some temptation to passive aggression. Is there some problem other than apostrophes on your mind?
You appear to be applying for a job with 'azjoe'. He does good research and brings forward very important info (content) while you piss around with details: appostrophes, the placing of 'e' before or after 'i'...etc.
Maybe he could use your services for minimum wage to add the odd comma here and there and run for coffee when his research energy runs low.
I still do not know if 9/11 was perpertrated by Neocons or just allowed to happen. You failed to state that it was the israelis who purposely attacked the USS Liberty, in order to frame the Eygptians ala Bay of Tonkin.
Hi Glenn Ford. I did not know about the desire to frame the Egyptians. I figured since it happened on the 3rd or 4th day of the Six Day War and the Liberty was an eavesdropping and electronic intercept ship in intl. waters but close, the Israelies smoked it because they did not want to be listened to, observed...Not so different from the IDF head shooting journalists with sniper fire in Gaza. Corollaries over time. azjoe.