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TechnoratiAn Open Letter to God, From Michael Moore
Sunday, August 31st, 2008
Dear God,
The other night, the Rev. James Dobson's ministry asked all believers to pray for a storm on Thursday night so that the Obama acceptance speech outdoors in Denver would have to be cancelled.
I see that You have answered Rev. Dobson's prayers -- except the storm You have sent to earth is not over Denver, but on its way to New Orleans! In fact, You have scheduled it to hit Louisiana at exactly the moment that George W. Bush is to deliver his speech at the Republican National Convention.
Now, heavenly Father, we all know You have a great sense of humor and impeccable timing. To send a hurricane on the third anniversary of the Katrina disaster AND right at the beginning of the Republican Convention was, at first blush, a stroke of divine irony. I don't blame You, I know You're angry that the Republicans tried to blame YOU for Katrina by calling it an "Act of God" -- when the truth was that the hurricane itself caused few casualties in New Orleans. Over a thousand people died because of the mistakes and neglect caused by humans, not You.
Some of us tried to help after Katrina hit, while Bush ate cake with McCain and twiddled his thumbs. I closed my office in New York and sent my entire staff down to New Orleans to help. I asked people on my website to contribute to the relief effort I organized -- and I ended up sending over two million dollars in donations, food, water, and supplies (collected from thousands of fans) to New Orleans while Bush's FEMA ice trucks were still driving around Maine three weeks later.
But this past Thursday night, the Washington Post reported that the Republicans had begun making plans to possibly postpone the convention. The AP had reported that there were no shelters set up in New Orleans for this storm, and that the levee repairs have not been adequate. In other words, as the great Ronald Reagan would say, "There you go again!"
So the last thing John McCain and the Republicans needed was to have a split-screen on TVs across America: one side with Bush and McCain partying in St. Paul, and on the other side of the screen, live footage of their Republican administration screwing up once again while New Orleans drowns.
So, yes, You have scared the Jesus, Mary and Joseph out of them, and more than a few million of your followers tip their hats to You.
But now it appears that You haven't been having just a little fun with Bush & Co. It appears that Hurricane Gustav is truly heading to New Orleans and the Gulf coast. We hear You, O Lord, loud and clear, just as we did when Rev. Falwell said You made 9/11 happen because of all those gays and abortions. We beseech You, O Merciful One, not to punish us again as Pat Robertson said You did by giving us Katrina because of America's "wholesale slaughter of unborn children." His sentiments were echoed by other Republicans in 2005.
So this is my plea to you: Don't do this to Louisiana again. The Republicans got your message. They are scrambling and doing the best they can to get planes, trains and buses to New Orleans so that everyone can get out. They haven't sent the entire Louisiana National Guard to Iraq this time -- they are already patrolling the city streets. And, in a nod to I don't know what, Bush's head of FEMA has named a man to help manage the federal government's response. His name is W. Michael Moore. I kid you not, heavenly Father. They have sent a man with both my name AND W's to help save the Gulf Coast.
So please God, let the storm die out at sea. It's done enough damage already. If you do this one favor for me, I promise not to invoke your name again. I'll leave that to the followers of Rev. Dobson and to those gathering this week in St. Paul.
Your faithful servant and former seminarian,
Michael Moore
MMFlint@aol.com
MichaelMoore.com
P.S. To all of God's fellow children who are reading this, the city New Orleans has not yet recovered from Katrina. Please click here for a list of things you can do to help our brothers and sisters on the Gulf Coast. And, if you do live along the Gulf Coast, please take all necessary safety precautions immediately.
125 Comments so far
Show AllTo those on the right who find Michael Moor'e comments distasteful or otherwise inappropriate ... ask anyone in New Orleans who they would like to help them in a crisis -- a President Bush or a President Michael Moore.
It goes without saying that no one wants anyone to be the victim of a hurricane. But the right-wingers -- guilty as they are for a host of cruelties and gross insensitivities to human suffering -- POUNCE on what is obviously a satirical commentary by Michael Moore.
Finally to those who believe in God ... how do you think God will judge those politicians who, time after time, have voted for the continuation of funds to support the Iraqi War, the Iraqi death toll now 1,000,000? (NOTE: That group of God-fearing politicians would include Barack Obama who, ironically, Michael Moore supports.)
Sorry Michael your wasting your time, God does not exist, lol
See the proof http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4iIo1tUtW0&feature=related
If I exist how can he, lol
once again the trolls have succeeded in turning the gist of this thread toward a bickering about religion and the "rightness" of either side, instead of commenting on the issue (how the right has hi-jacked religion and supports outlandish and outright evil men masquerading as clergy),well done.. i see them do this in 90% of postings on CD...
belittle the ideas, not the man who espouses them
simplify
keep your money , starve the beast of food
ignore the fear mongering ,be selective in your media consumption, starve the beast of air
we can still win!
I wonder what God thinks of the failings of humans to listen to his messenger Al Gore?
I mean, isn't Al speaking for God about the consequences of our doing, global warming? Or undoing rising sea levels and rising tropical systems, as it may be?
The real joke is that men like Micheal, an acolyte of Al, just aren't quite smart enough to become followers of their own belief system of humanity's salvation. Even as they find a living off of finger pointing without a mote of remorse for their own blindness.
If Micheal was a true believer or even the ironic voice of God, I think he would stop trying to help humans survive hurricanes that will kill them and destroy their homes and instead create a new documentary about why it's suicide to try to live in any of the lower coastal lying cities in a world of scientifically rising oceans, in a human stronghold of denial.
Sometimes putting two and two together is beyond men of God or men of Reason, the new God in the garden of technology and science that it seems must have man eating megabytes of this new apple of wisdom before he can learn his next hard lessons of reality.
Dear Michael:
God does not concern himself with the petty details of life on your miserable little planet. In fact he is not even aware of your planet. You and the rest of your fellow beings were created for other purposes and by other forces quite remote from God. However, by diligent efforts at humility, kindness and clear reflection you can approach nearer to God. Your political activities, attempts at humor and sarcasm and other human activities are mostly the result of habit, imitation, self-involvement and ignorance. None of these faults has even the slightest effect on God or the universe, but can serve to make your miserable lives even worse than they are at present. My advice is to drop the sarcasm, self-righteouness and low humor and just concentrate on kindness and listening to the resonance of the creator. You will find yourself becoming quieter, kinder, more intelligent, more tolerant of, and more tolerable to, your fellow beings.
Sincerely,
Archangel Aloof
UPDATE!
2 ships and a barge have broken loose. A barge is hitting the storm surge wall in the NOLA Industrial Canal.
That means the wall/levee system is in a worst case scenario threat.
Major flooding (again) of NOLA is a distinct possibility.
Walk in peace.
Apparently God did not get Mike's memo.
CNN is just reporting that the storm surge walls and levees in NO Lower Ninth Ward have been over-topped and NO is flooding. With Hurricane Gustav as a Cat 2. There are also reports that the levees are 'spurting water' through cracks. That means the levees will again fail catastrophically.
The UA Army Corp of Engineers said that the levee repairs would be sufficient for a minimum Cat 3.
Can I say 'I told you so'?
Walk in peace.
It would probaly be wise adn kind if you did not.I cannot believe how politicized ths has gotten. I know its Dubyas fault that it is. But praying to god about it, etc. just strikes me as BS to the extreme! Why not ask "god" to not let there be anymore hurricanes??
SEE ANYTHING FAMILIAR???????
14 CHARACTERISTICS
COMMON IN FASCIST REGIMES
1) Powerful and continuing nationalism
Fascist regimes tend to make use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia Flags are seen everywhere as are patriotic symbols on clothing, public displays, and cars.
2) Disdain for the recognition of human rights
Because of the fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights and civil liberties can be ignored in certain cases because of "need". The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, long incarcerations of prisoners without trial, etc.
3) Identification of enemies/scapegoats as a unifying cause
The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy .over the need to eliminate a perceived a common threat or foe: ethnic or religious minorities, liberals, communists, terrorists,
etc.
4) Supremacy of the military
Even when there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected.
5) Rampant sexism
The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Opposition to abortion is high as is homophobia, and anti-gay legislation as national policy.
6) Controlled mass media
Sometimes the media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in war time, is common.
7) Obsession with national security
Fear is used as a motivational tool over the
masses.
8) Religion and government are intertwined
Governments in fascist regimes tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government's policies and actions.
9) Corporate power is protected
The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship for the power elite.
10) Labor power is suppressed
Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government. Labor unions are either eliminated entirely or are severely suppressed
11) Disdain for intellectuals and the arts
Fascist regimes tend to promote and tolerate hostility to higher education and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts is openly attacked, and governments often refuse to fund the arts.
12) Obsession with crime and punishment
Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations.
13) Rampant cronyism and corruption
Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures, to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders.
14) Fraudulent elections
Sometimes elections in fascist regimes are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and the manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also tend to use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections.
Not much.
To whoever flagged KDelphi's post containing foul and offensive language. Yes it is and we don''t need any here, no matter what language its derived from.
But speak up and say so, don't start flagging someone before you tell them you'd prefer thay keep the dialog civil. We all slip here and there. Flagging should be reserved for really abusive or repetitive behavior or language.
Heck, we all slip with one good Anglo Saxon word occasionally.
Thanks, but you MAY some day NEED it---to protect your own right to say as you wish--about god, about anything! People who do not defend others' free speech, have no right to theirs. Yeah, it was "blue" language--gro up! I WAS making the point of what I THINK of the GOP--that dose NOT mean i have to be an Obama cheerleader, not to be called a rovian fascist! True--if you want to confront someone--do it to them--otherwise , yo act like a fascist! I find alot of stuff offensive online--so the F what???Its not MY problem!I find Moore's cal to god to do anything offensive--but i dont cal for his article to be censored. I find faithbased initiatives unconstitutional. And I DO cal for the end to those!If you care about your religious freedoms, you should do the same!
I'm quite grown up, I just believe the use of foul language to make a point is sophomoric. But if you need to use it go right ahead. Your privilage or anyone elses for that matter.
McCain is not even on my radar. However, as I watch Obama….the powers that be have him on a leash …and they are drawing him in as they did with the Clintons. The thing it’s self is almost visible for those who are willing to look with their eyes and not their hearts.
He promises and he promises. Once he is elected, it is vital that he be forced by the peoples will to do the people’s will.
He actually doesnt promise that much anymore! Listen to how his speeches have CHANGEd..he "describes" prob--but really makes no case for solving them. "There are 40 m ..w/out health care..and we'll make it affordable.." Everyone cheers. Why? What does "affordable" mean? If you include the health/death insurance cos.--you KNOW it wil be to much for hte peoe that really need it!
I love you Mike!
Hello Mike,
You are on the money.
American right wing Christians don't believe in abortion , its murder.
But, they have supported the Bush/Cheney preemptive illegal occupation and War of two sovereign nations.That's not murder.
Do they have any idea of how many people are now dead, because of this action?
No.
How many people are refugees?
No.
How many women and children are living in poverty.
No.
Abortion is Murder. War is not Murder, its what Jesus would do?
We rushed to War based on false information and an improper murder investigation of the 9/11 attack by a group of criminals, not two sovereign nations.
Thanks to the Patriot Act,any one person or group or nation that speaks out against the American government is considered a Terrorist.
So , all you folks who value your religion,you have now have been warned. If you allow our government to continue its Patriotic War on Terrorism, you will not have a Constitution left that protects your Freedom of speech ,Freedom of Religion and your privacy to do both.
Hell, if you read the Patriot Act , as I have, you will come to the conclusion that the Constitution has been replaced.
After all, its religious Islamic groups that are Terrorists. There is no such thing as Christian Terrorists, yet. You religious fools , you are next.
Our national media does not report the truth.The Natzi/Stazi propaganda machine does not want Christians to know whats was happening in Iraq and Afghanistan, they would be screaming for withdrawal.
The news blackout of the War after the surge began is proof. But , not to worry, our Winter soldiers are speaking about the truth.
God does not pick sides, Wars for the righteous, storms to punish us.
He just lets us be the makers of our own destiny's.
Gos knows we humans have done a great job of manipulating each other, people with power and greed, dictating what the rest of us should think and do.
Thanks Mike, if God has a place in Heaven for true Patriots, I will see you there some day.
If he does not, I hope that after I die he sends me back as a category 5 hurricane, cause I would like to visit the Capital.
You know, Clean up !!!!!!
BornFreeMen
Thank God or the Flying Spaghetti Monster or whoever.....
That the nation has one intrepid lampooning billionaire!
LMAO!
How true the irony is....
Thanks Michael
Ben F.
"To criticize those in power, is the highest form of patriotism" - Thomas Jefferson
Well it shows me one thing, people have turned to GOD to stop the repubicans as they know the true democratic way of voting doesn't work. I am sure people turned to God during the second world war or some other genocide they had no control over. It is to bad even Moore has left the fate of America to something that lives in a cloud and eats Philidephia cream cheese
For me, the "choice" betweeen Nader/McKinney/whatever third party or distant hopeful and Obama is like choosing between the person who has all the right answers and good ideas but wants me to swim with them to shore from the wreckage of the Titanic vs the person with some very bad ideas who has a LIFEBOAT.
Also...damnit...it is TIME. We will NEVER get to where we progressives want to be by losing to another Repug. Even Nader points out that THERE ARE differences between the Dems and the Reps...socially more progressive, etc.
Obama is the 1st Black American with a chance to actually be elected....and it ain't Colon Powell or another republican....not so Black as to scare the pants off most white folk, Black enough to have a BIT of street cred, and is part of a world those of us who lived in the time of MLK NEVER REALLY IMAGINED...where the multi-racial kids are not a 'tragic consequence' but a new demographic ... folks who don't even have to go anywhere to find diversity...because it is in their blood.
~zz
"Hope has two beautiful daughters. Their names are anger and courage; anger at the way things are, and courage to see that they do not remain the way they are."
There are NO life boats! Swim. Run Ralph. Run!
God has given human beings free will. Free will to make their own choices in life. God has seen all things but human beings still have free will to make all their choices. If a single human being, many human beings, or nations of human beings choose to do evil with their free will God will not necessarily stop them, but that thing called death will.
Jesus taught his Father's Spiritual Kingdom that is not of the world of man, nor worldly things. Jesus did not teach religion, nor did Jesus give any indication he came to start a new religion. Before Jesus ever came into this world educated men had already learned how to manipulate others into what was/is nothing more than their own evil ambitions upon the earth by using the name of God in what would be in modern day terms "Branding" such as a tv that then becomes Sony, RCA, Samsung, Toshiba, ect. Educated men learned to "Brand" their evil agendas upon the earth with God, their God or Gods.
Thus a modern day leader in the modern day will say, God told me to go kill those people, just as leaders had learned to do several 1000 years ago with the reality being God never told them to do any such thing.
All educated men did was take Jesus & turn him back into religion then combined that religion with politics thus the Religious Political State. Instead of warring, murdering, stealing, & torturing in Caesar's name they started doing those things in Jesus's name. They merely marketed "Branded" Caesar or their Kings, Queens, & Emperors with Jesus & Religion doing just as Jesus said they would do choking The Word with their worldly deceits. False Teachers. False Prophets. False Religion. What is referred to as the False Apostacy that will be killing thinking they are doing God a favor.
Jesus already knew they were going to do all of these things as surely as he knew men would put him to death, but that was still their freewill choice that any of them could have turned away from at any time.
Worldly human beings, political human beings, & religious human beings at that time didn't have any idea what Jesus was teaching anymore than they do at this time that his Father's Kingdom is not of the world of man, nor worldly things.
People high up in politics, business, religion weren't going to follow him because what good could he do them in this world since he was telling them to sell their possessions, give the money to the poor, & follow him. He couldn't do them any good or be of any help to them in this world because regardless of what your own personal problems may be, what your family problems may be, the problems of your neighborhood, community, State, Nation & the world in general, no matter how much of all that is screwed up you still know that without money your really screwed in this world.
"God" is the ego's word for saying that "I" am what I worship while not being opening insane admitting that the ego IS "God". Religion is a disease. Violence is a genetic defect.
Tad,
Solve this:
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
The answer to this riddle is really very easy. Evil is not of God, evil is of man. God gave man a free will. God cannot prevent evil without taking free will back from man. Free will is our greatest gift and our greatest curse.
When man realizes it is not God but he that has the choice, then evil might end for all times.
If man cannot realize this, perhaps God will do what he is able and willing to do.
No, actually you didn't answer it all. If God created us, then he created everything about us, including our evil.
If God gave men free will but prevented all men from doing evil then it wouldn't really be free will would it?
Lobo Gris
LOL. Good. But likely wasted.
Tad,
Why wouldn't you be a bit more staightforward and call yourself 'TadOvertopBiblethump'??? 'Skeptical' does not really appear to be part of your DNA.
Getreal,
You assume much. I am not a Bible Thumper, nor do you have any idea about the things of which I am skeptical. Of Jesus I am not skeptical. What human beings turned Jesus into, "Religion & Politics" is two of the things of which I am skeptical.
Tad, I think we have a problem of semantics here. 'Skeptical' means to doubt, not to disagree. I'm not a mind-reader and don't care to be, but there are obvious logical conclusions to people's words and actions. Your words indicated clearly that you believe things that are exceedingly unlikely and even ridiculously superstitious like all that business about God and Jesus, etc. Your words are very clear that you show no doubt (skepticism) there whatever.
That you 'disagree' with what different religions and political institutions have done with Jesus has nothing to do with 'skepticism'. That's political disagreement. I'm skeptical of what the Catholic church says about a God, the pope's infallibility, etc., etc. (In fact, I know they're out and out lying.) But I disagree profoundly with their policies of carelessly hiring (and providing no effective supervision with) perverts who abuse kids and then shirking their legal and moral responsibility. I disagree that a repulsive criminal like Cardinal Law should have been allowed to wiggle off the hook, much less given a prestigious position in Rome, and a gorgeous historic place to live that is worth a fortune. And I disagree profoundly with the behavior of the protestant nut-case preachers who want to force religion into political institutions.
Your words are of a very religious person who doesn't have a hint of skepticism.
This is yet another dumb joke from Michael Moore. A hurricane is headed directly for New Orleans...
Isn't that hilarious!
Jacob Freeze
Again, it's called SATIRE, Jacob. Please reference my earlier post @ 4:36.
The category of dumb jokes includes the sub-category of dumb satire.
But maybe you're right, and what progressives really need is a slovenly bozo like Michael Moore yuk-yukking at his own dumb joke about Hurricane Katrina.
Jacob Freeze
Yo God! Please stick it to those evil Republicans by destroying a DEMOCRATIC city!!!! That will really show them.
While I'm thinking about it, why don't you take your sorry-a** up to Minneapolis/St. Paul and put your a** on-the-line with these kids, Mike? How about it? I've never seen you REALLY challenge The Man. Are you up to it? Right, you're probably gonna let the kids do all the dirty work, huh Mike?
Good point! These people almost never do that--Sean Penn, Susan Sarandon, etc. being exceptions
Guess you missed the part in the article above where he mentioned he helped to organize 2 million dollars in aid relief for the Katrina effort while FEMA trucks were driving aimlessly around Maine. But YOU were there pulling people off their rooves all by your lonesome, weren't you moonpie?
As to challenging "The Man" (your post reads like the script of a "Beavis and Butthead" episode, only absent the humor), I'm guessing you've never seen ANY of his documentaries or TV shows, have you?
Do everyone a favor and just stop "thinking about it." You've clearly blown a few gaskets already.
Well, the people of NO learned their lesson--have it during a caqmpaign season!
US National Guard? Try BLACKWATER, Michael Moore. They aren't trying to help -- they are trying to penalize these people AGAIN!
Obam supports Blackwater--or, at least, says that we need them. Not Obama bashing or race bashin--just a factoid.
CNN just reported that some of the concret storm surge walls have their seams sealed with shredded newspaper instead of the rubber compound mandated by law.
And several of the 'repaired' levees are actually lower than they were prior to Katrina, and are built to the same pre-Katrina standards.
Which means that even Cat 3 Hurricane Gustav *could* be enough to flood New Orleans again.
If this is true, then truly, God help NOLA.
Walk in peace.
America would be just a little nicer if James Dobson would focus on his own damn family.
Errr god, if you're still listening, do me a favor please. Give Michael Moore the wisdom to see that he and Ralph Nader are natural allies and that his pandering to and fawning over the democrats may be good for his bottom line but is bad for theprogress of this nation.....thanks in advance ma'am.....
We see things, not as they are, but as we are.
Anais Nin
New Orleans has been kinda 'whitewashed' after Katrina. I suppose now they will get all the help the Govt can muster and then some.
The kep to getting help from anyone in govt seems to be to have your natural disaster occur during a campaign season! Note to self: NEVER have a huge tornado in Ohio again during April!
Adding insult to injury, this is just in time for the Muslim holy month of Ramadan.
Have America's 'True Believers' finished building their Arc?
Dear creature of mine:
Your letter was delivered to me, the God, in the Seventh Heavens by a flying angel. Up here we use that as our UPS. In your letter you are whining about a few things, which is confusing me. Next time try to ask for only one thing at a time.
My reasons for sending another storm at this time to Katrina are twofold:
1) I am trying to remind the Americans with short memory span that my rogue creature Bush has been responsible for failing to take action on my first storm.
2) I am also trying to punish Bush and other Republican enablers for committing crimes against my other creatures.
BTW, I did not send him to be president as he has claims. It was the Supreme Court and the Diebold machines.
Signed: Almighty God
WHY did you make thsi rogue creature, gawd?
Incidentally, I am punishing Bush by visiting death and destruction upon a mostly Democratic, anti-Bush city. That will show him!!!
If James Dobson is trying to invoke a higher power to reign fire and brimstone on the Dems, can't I ask Santa and the Easter Bunny not to deliver goodies to his house this year?
Michael Moore is in charge of the Rescue Committee this time? Well,I never!
And the Very Reverend Dobson spake unto Him saying "O Lord, visit upon these Democrats (and Galen) a most terrible scourge and pestilence and smite them asunder but protect Us that we might keep slaying the heathens in Iraq, Afgahnistan, S.Ossetia etc.etc... And HE spake saying "Verily, it shall be done". And a great roar and calamity ensued, followed by "Hell and damnation! Missed again!".
Don't leave ~KDelphi~ stay and annoy the bastards!
Flagging for language?
Its probably in the "rules" but jeez!
If there are children trolling this site, they should be mature enough to absorb the content and therefore mature enough to read some Saxon-derived English words.
If there are adults trolling this site who are incapable of reading Saxon-derived English words without succumbing to a bout of apoplexy then they should loosen up.
~KDelphi~'s post was making a good point about how many Pro-Democratic Party commenters here -and everywhere seemingly- accuse everyone who criticizes the Dems of being Republican Party supporters or even members and paid shills.
I find this to be only a minor annoyance because I find their subtextual "us or them" attitude so ignorant and simplistic- I think of it as Manicheism for Dummies.
But I can also see how really rude and offensive it is -and how destructive it is to respectful and peaceful discourse.
~KDelphi made this same point in a much more humorous and pithy way through the use of "offensive" Saxon-Derived English words.
I see nothing wrong with that.
Have Fun,
-matti.
thank you for commenting...excellent points. i also find it annoying when people accuse others of 'working' w/ the darkside (repub trolls etc..) i don't agree w/ all, but i cherish free speech. those who question and comment -KDelphi- should participate however they wish...if it annoys you read past it...
vote your conscience...
...peace...
Whoever flagged KDelphi's comment because it contained the words motherfucher and asshole: Thanks for trying to keep the rest of us from being offensive. By the way, I hear the FBI is looking for informants.
"Whoever flagged KDelphi's comment because it contained ..."
It might have been the name calling.
Fascists and cowards. That is how you lose us. Bye. Go play FISA> HAD to finish this--dont worry , I probalby wont be back. Alot of people are very angry--if upi ;et them speak , you may learn why. If not--you might lose. Anyway, you called (or hinted that I was) a REPUBLICAN troll, Rove , I thin k you said! To a member of SP-USA (Socialist)--I MEANT that it is the SAME as calling me what i said before that you belivers in free speech flag. Call me a GOP--getr cursed out--its that simple.Grow up! Censor no one-- no time , no place, no where, no how. No GOP! NO time, no place, no where, no how! Libre from the thougth and word police
Good God, what a humorless lot we have here on CD today. Of course Michael Moore doesn't want New Orleans flooded again. This is called SATIRE, folks. Read it again. He's sticking it in the eye of our (meaning, progressive's) TRUE enemies, what I like to call America's very own Christian Taliban--folks like James Dobson and Pat Robertson.
As to charges that Mr. Moore is in the documentary film business just for the cash (!)-- that's just ridiculous on it's face. First of all, he's probably the 1st and only one to have ever made a good living from it, and secondly here's a few links on his charitable work to get you started:
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0702-07.htm
http://www.looktothestars.org/celebrity/1402-michael-moore
http://www.slashfilm.com/2007/05/18/michael-moore-help-his-biggest-nemesis/
And another thing: Just because a progressive chooses to support Obama doesn't make that person personally responsible for US foriegn policy, NAFTA, the FISA bill or whatever else. Many have decided they'll have a better chance to influence an Obama on policy matters rather than a McCain. You're perfectly right to make a CIVIL case as to why that's not preferable to voting a 3rd party ticket, but for GOD'S SAKE STOP DEMONIZING people who are for the most part on the SAME SIDE AS YOU... or why would they be getting their news and views fix from a site like CD?
Those of us on the left need to BUILD coalition with one another and STOP the in-fighting. It's PRECISELY the reason we've suffered under conservative rule lo these 2 score years.
That is a good point about Obama supporters--we are NOT the enemy! I dont bother to go to GOP sites and bitcvh about McCain--it would be hopeless. But, lately , it seems that criticizing Obama for almost anything atr all is a crime against humanity.I actually start posting almost every day thinking "I should not let them make me say things I'm not sure I mean about Obama or Pelosi, etc." Laugh if you like. I'm of the generation that, if you keep teleing me to sdo something and shut up about it--i'm pretty likely to tell you to go to hell. A fault in me I spose.If I thought it was hopeless,. I'd be at he Nader site. Iam also TIRED of voting for "not as bad as". If you people feel that Obama would respond to positive pressure--great! It did not work for FISA. I stil have nodesire to fight with an Obama supporter--I am not the enemy. When the enemy hits (GOP) you wil know it!!PS--Moore is not, in my opinion, funny these days. He sems to be all about himself.
Fair enough, and thanks for the reply. For the record, I haven't personally decided whether I'll vote for Obama or Nader. The answer seems to change on a day to day basis. After his speech on race delivered after the Rev. Wright made a complete ass of himself, I was totally ready to vote for him. It remains the most potent speech delivered in this country since the days of JFK and RFK... or in other words, in my whole life (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWe7wTVbLUU). But then I was just CRUSHED that he voted for the FISA bill, so I'm keeping an eye on Nader, too. I was an enthusiastic supporter of his in 2000.
I really, truly believe that Obama the man has the best interests of the country in his heart, and wants to push the US in a more progressive, humane direction. But Obama the politician has proven to allow himself to be susceptible to the darker elements--justifiably pointed out here on a daily basis at CD--that exist within the Democratic Party.
Isn't this what Moore has accused Bush of doing? Placing God of his side of the argument. God wants Obama not McCain. But wait, God is responsible for everything. That means he elected Bush, started the Iraq War, and hates poor people everywhere!
What makes this even more stupid is that Moore actually believes in God. He's a Roman Catholic!
Very well put. Or maybe just go dpoint. LOL Totally see what you are saying.
In mocking 'God', and incidentally breaking the commandment to never 'take the Lord's name in vain' in this way, according to Catholic Church doctrine (especially now under Pope Benedict XVI, aka Joseph Ratzinger, former member of the Hitler youth and Nazi Party member, one time head of Opus Dei, the most right wing branch of the Catholic Church), that would make Mr. Moore a heretic, and subject to excommunication and prevented from ever being buried in a Christian cemetery, or receiving Last rites, without which, again according to Church doctrine, condemns Mr. Moore's soul to Hell for eternity.
Okay, remind me again why society still listens to the ramblings of senile old men who subscribe to the beliefs of a successful Middle Eastern death cult?
Walk in peace.
Um, I don't think he is a Catholic anyway...
Apparently, God is not too happy with China either.
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/afp/080831/world/china_quake
Must have been the underage gymnasts...
Walk in peace.
you have to wonder...
god, mammon, darpa??
a few links....
http://dcuben.newsvine.com/_news/2008/05/21/1504068-weird-colors-in-sky-before-chinese-earthquake
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weather_control
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAARP
"HAARP: VANDALISM IN THE SKY?"
http://www.orgone.org/articles/ax6-harp.htm
U.S. Military Wants to Own the Weather, By Leonard David, Senior Space Writer
posted: 31 October 2005, 06:24 am ET
http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/051031_mystery_monday.html
The Ultimate Weapon of Mass Destruction:"Owning the Weather" for Military Use
by Michel Chossudovsky
http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO409F.html
---"Weather Warfare
The significant expansion in America's weather warfare arsenal, which is a priority of the Department of Defense is not a matter for debate or discussion. While, environmentalists blame the Bush administration for not having signed the Kyoto protocol, the issue of "weather warfare", namely the manipulation of weather patterns for military use is never mentioned.
The US Air Force has the capability of manipulating climate either for testing purposes or for outright military-intelligence use. These capabilities extend to the triggering of floods, hurricanes, droughts and earthquakes. In recent years, large amounts of money have been allocated by the US Department of Defense to further developing and perfecting these capabilities.
Weather modification will become a part of domestic and international security and could be done unilaterally... It could have offensive and defensive applications and even be used for deterrence purposes. The ability to generate precipitation, fog, and storms on earth or to modify space weather, ... and the production of artificial weather all are a part of an integrated set of technologies which can provide substantial increase in US, or degraded capability in an adversary, to achieve global awareness, reach, and power. (US Air Force, emphasis added. Air University of the US Air Force, AF 2025 Final Report, http://www.au.af.mil/au/2025/ emphasis added)
While there is no firm evidence that the US Air Force weather warfare facilities have been deliberately applied to modify weather patterns, one would expect that if these capabilities are being developed for military use, they would at least be the object of routine testing, much in the same way as the testing of new conventional and strategic weapons systems.
Needless to say, the subject matter is a scientific taboo. The possibility of climatic or environmental manipulations as part of a military and intelligence agenda, while tacitly acknowledged, is never considered as relevant. Military analysts are mute on the subject. Meteorologists are not investigating the matter, and environmentalists are strung on global warming and the Kyoto protocol.
Ironically, the Pentagon, while recognizing its ability to modify the World's climate for military use, has joined the global warming consensus. In a major study (pdf) , the Pentagon has analyzed in detail the implications of various global warming scenarios.
The Pentagon document constitutes a convenient cover-up. Not a word is mentioned about its main weather warfare program: The High-Frequency Active Auroral Research Program (HAARP) based in Gokona, Alaska --jointly managed by the US Air Force and the US Navy."---
...peace...
btw:
there's no way the military used these weapons to destroy wtc on 9/11
no way
cheers, b
Michael Moore is serious.
Since last night, the hurricane has gone down from a borderline category five to maybe an expected high category three when it makes landfall. Even with a direct hit, New Orleans now has a chance of not breaching a dike and flooding out.
Watch out for the massive rain flooding inland all week long, though.
If God really wanted New Orleans not to flood He would send a Congressional junket to the Netherlands. The Dutch currently design their dikes for an expected 10,000 year storm. They're not stupid. The Dutch will also buy time versus rising ocean levels.
God is not involved. Except that we have been blessed with the capacity to do right.
Joe
God is not involved. Except that we have been blessed with the capacity to do right.
Joe
Michael MOore is seriously about Michael Moore. And $$$
I see that the Rove stooges are really out in force. Of course, they have nothing new to say, just the same old "DON'T VOTE FOR OBAMA!!!!!!" crap that we've been seeing for months now.
I live in the country in Georgia whose schools just lost their accreditation due to a fractious and dysfunctional school board. This country became majority black about 10 - 15 years ago and, as expected, some of Rove's clowns posted messages on local sites claiming that this school board's failure is proof that people shouldn't vote for Obama.
Republicans have absolutely no shame.
q
Democratic voters are the real Rove stooges, no question.
Obama was handpicked by Rove to run against McCain, the same way John Kerry was in 2004.
Not saying it ain't so. I myself often wondered which side Kerry was on. He said so many inexplicable destructive things and then folded without a battle on the stolen votes. But do you have any evidence or only suspicion that Karl Rove was behind this or could it be explained Kerry's own Skull and Bones patrician loyalty and the domination of the Democrats by big money? I don't see Rove getting over his white-man stuff enough to promote Obama, but am willing to listen to evidence.
Joe
Rove/Pelosi--whats the diff? I'm NOT serious!
What has God got against New Orleans?
The death culture we live in will not change until the value of LIFE is raised. Wars, degradation of the environment, abortions, poverty, excess commercialism, and greed are all death tokens. Democrats cannot let go of abortion on demand, Republicans cannot let go of war and the war economy, yet each criticizes the other without seeing their own contradictions, so we continue down the road of planetary destabilization and death, each pointing the finger at the other. Each side is blind to the futility of this approach and neither side feels compelled to compromise or change. Both sides seem to be saying I am willing to destroy the Earth if I do not get my way, and they will.
Only a LIFE culture can eliminate the death culture. An organism cannot be partially alive, it is either alive or dead. The same is true for a culture, it is either living or dying. Our culture is clearly dying. Since change does not happen overnight, if we have any chance of survival we must change to a life culture now and that can only be done one person at a time.
There is no more time for political debate about life and death. You must choose now and you will get what you choose.
Well put, Stone, and I agree.
There are other ways to describe the two cultures: Elder & Younger, Leavers & Takers, etc. And yes, it can only be done one person at a time. However, I think what is necessary is that people start to understand the differences between the two cultures. Not that either culture is perfect or more noble, just that one works and one doesn't. Ours clearly doesn't.
The most difficult part of this for me is knowing that I must change my cultural perspective, yet still live in this culture and do the best I can to help change come in the best way possible. I don't advocate for the "perfect" way, because there is none (a fool's errand if ever there was one), but I vote for what I can get and work for the rest.
Very well said Stone. You hit the nail on the head.
Hmm. Ok. What about the life being taken away by having children. You do not see the connection between the wars being waged and the lifestyle all the new humans being popped out will live. Or the species going extinct as we plow over their habitat to make way for the space necessary to support all of this wonderful life you speak of.
Abortions have been carried out throughout human history. Not, of course, so people can be irresponsible - abortion should never be used as a form of birth control, we have actual birth control for that - however, tribal peoples recognized when the tribe could not support further life, and would not sacrifice the life of the tribe for the life of one fetus. They knew how to induce abortions. I do not view this as negative, I view this as being realistic.
Today, we need to be realistic. The earth can not support any more human beings. We should practice birth control first and foremost, but we should recognize that bringing children into this fucked world is a torture far worse than any mere abortion.
It's silly to say that "Democrats can not let go of abortion on command"... what they can't let go of is the woman's right to make this choice for herself. There are folks that support a woman's right to choose but may not agree with abortion. They just realize that you can't make something like abortion illegal and expect it to go away... you need to go after the social situations that make people want to have abortions... mainly poverty and lack of community.
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
I am pleased that someone noted the demographic problem in all this!
And I am one that does not like abortion, but would never, under any circumstances take away a womans or couples right to choose. Its not my right or any others to make this decision for other people.
God is punishing Republicans for their hate of half of Americans, for their genocide of brown people in the Middle East so they can steal their oil and for the torture of prisoners in Guantanamo and other dungeons around the planet.
It's rewarding to see their hate fest in Minneapolis being spoiled like this. At least Bush found the perfect excuse not to attend, he'll be happy to stay behind and drink himself to a state of stupefaction.
PLEASE dont say God is killing people in NO , to help promote your political agenda--it makes you sound like Bush! I hear what you are saying--if we had our civil rights back, the many protestors might have been ablt to disrupt the Convention. That si why FISA, etc. was so important
My goodness how brainwashed can people be. First, you're not very good at understanding sarcasm, second, you're assuming that I think God exists.
Let's get down to your preschool level and assume for a minute that God exists. Isn't He the all mighty deity? If so, why is he allowing yet another tragedy to befall humanity? Isn't He the all powerful? Do you see now the absurdity of your idea of a supreme being?
tetti;I just love people who don't believe in a Creator.As for disasters all we have to do as a world peoples and we we see why they happen.The main tenent of the Creator is free will and that means we did it,we own it.
WE AND ME
TONY 9/3/05
SITTING HERE WONDERING WHAT I CAN SAY TO OTHERS AND TO MYSELF ABOUT WHAT "KATRINA"HAS EXPOSED ABOUT US AS A COUNTRY AND A PEOPLE.I'M BEGINNING TO THINK THAT THE NEW DEAL UNDER FDR WAS AN ILLUSION AND THAT DEEDS DO NOT MATTER AS MUCH AS WORDS.HOW,I WONDER,CAN THIS COUNTRY BE A NATION OF ME'S,A COUNTRY THAT THINKS IT IS MORE IMPORTANT TO HAVE THAN TO SHARE.
THERE ARE MANY PEOPLE STEPPING UP TO HELP AND HAVE DONE SO IN THE PAST.BUT AS SOON AS THE CRISIS IS OVER EVERYTHING REVERTS BACK TO THE ME.I'LL BET THAT THE REST OF THE WORLD IS HOPING THAT SOMEONE YANKS US OFF THE WORLD STAGE.OTHER PRIMA DONNA'S HAVE COME AND GONE AND I'LL BET MY ASS IT WILL HAPPEN AGAIN.
THE WE LASTS AS LONG AS THE CRISIS DOES AND NO LONGER AND NO COUNTRY,NO HOMELAND (I HATE THAT WORD,IT SOUNDS SO NAZI)NO PEOPLE CAN LAST IF IT IS "ME" THE PEOPLE.
IF IT IS NOT WE THE PEOPLE THEN WHAT?
I understand Moore's words. He's funny AND a great filmmaker. Its his personal PR--getting his press--at the expense of fostering more discourse within the citizenry that bothers me.
However, the fact that such an intelligent man could back such a party of fakes and warmongers only tells me he does it for the money... for we all know there is no difference in his business associate's party and the republicans.
With Mike, its all about the money.
Same/same
Perfect/Godot '08!
New Orleans is a reminder of how deeply rooted this nation is in racism and classism. The world saw the suffering and the disregard for human life on part of the Bush Administration and the local officials. Makes me proud to be an American!
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http://www.votenader.org/media/2008/08/29/minnealpolisrally/
Fresh from a 4000-person super rally in Denver, the Nader/Gonzalez Campaign team has hit the ground in Minneapolis and will be out in full force over the weekend to focus attention on the need for opening up the Presidential Debates for third party and independent candidates, working towards the crescendo: a star-studded open the debates super-rally on Thursday.
Ralph Nader, Matt Gonzalez, Jesse Ventura, Cindy Sheehan, Justin Jeffre, Nellie McKay, and other surprise guests to be named soon to be announced will all appear at the Nader/Gonzalez "Open the Debates" Super Rally September 4 at 7.30 p.m. at the Orchestra Hall in Minneapolis.
The Nader/Gonzalez independent presidential candidacy will be on the ballot in 45 states, is polling at 5-6 percent nationally, and a new Time/CNN poll shows Ralph Nader polling 8 percent in New Mexico, 7 percent in Colorado, 7 percent in Pennsylvania, and 6 percent in Nevada -- all key battleground states.
.
Thank GOD there is Nader and McKinney to vote for in Colorado.