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TechnoratiHealthcare Horror: Care Denied Over $7 Debt for Insured Patient
On Friday, my husband was denied a blood test because a computer record from some distant time past and some other state showed he had a $7 balance with LabCorp. I am not making this up.
My husband had a heart attack this week. He woke up one morning sweating profusely and with a heart rate dropping. I watched his color turn first ruddy then ashen, and then he felt as though he was going to pass out. He would not allow me to call 911 as he slowly began to feel sick to his stomach and he believed his symptoms were digestive rather than cardiac.
We have learned over the years to wait to seek care - it is expensive to do otherwise and dooms us to the endless loop of bills and collection notices and more damage to our already badly bruised credit rating. So we always wait to seek care until there seems to be no other option. We are not alone. Millions of Americans do the same. We do not want to use the emergency rooms or doctors' offices. We don't want anything to do with the whole mess.
We moved to Maryland in March, but have fought Humana insurance and Medicare transfer since then to even make sure my husband can get any care at all. And, by God, we were paying the premiums the whole time the insurance folks hemmed and hawed and stalled. It took three months to get that all straightened out, during which time they repeated over and over, "we're not denying treatment," and technically I suppose they weren't as they want us all just to get out our checkbooks and debit cards and pay up. And in the meantime, my husband waited for any doctors' appointment and got meds by calling back to Chicago to get prescriptions refilled.
My husband is a cardiac patient and a vascular patient with a complicated medical history and needs follow-up care on a regular basis. He is a responsible guy who has always maintained his insurance coverage and who avoids seeking care unless it is needed. He does not seek to overuse or abuse the system. To stay relatively healthy, he needs regular check-ups and decent intervention when necessary.
But, I insisted my husband follow up in the way we all are told is more sensible and cost effective. He went to a primary care doc on Wednesday who shuffled him off to a cardiologist after a visit barely long enough to be billed as an "extended, new patient visit." An EKG showed the grim reality. "Abnormal, negative T-waves. Inferior infarct."
Blood work was ordered in advance of the cardiologist visit set for Friday. He was to fast overnight, see the cardiologist and then get his blood drawn. Seems to be progressing, eh?
Well, only until he sat down in the LabCorp office to get his blood drawn. The LabCorp employee typed in my husband's Social Security Number, and promptly told him he could not have his blood drawn or have his test administered until he cleared up his old bill with LabCorp. The bill? $7. That's right -- $7.
And my husband has been covered by insurance for many years. But now he sat - post myocardial infarction or heart attack - being told by a laboratory employee that he would be denied care due to an unpaid $7 bill. He did not have $7 with him. He was fasting. He tried to explain. They did not budge. They did call the supervisor. She confirmed and stood her ground for LabCorp. No test for Larry Smith. He owes $7.
David King, the CEO of LabCorp, made $8.2 million in 2008. He's one of the people and LabCorp is one of the companies President Obama is celebrating who will help transform our nation's healthcare system. Indeed. And LabCorp's political participation committee donated funds to several candidates in 2008, including Sen. Max Baucus and Sen. Charles Grassley, both of the Senate Finance Committee that is working on the nation's healthcare reform.
Lest we think the insurance giants are the only people hurting, harming and killing Americans like my husband as they shore up their profits, follow the money in this story alone. One doctor's office, another doctor's office, one insurance company and finally a lab - all worked together to make what they could individually off my husband and then ultimately denied his care for $7. Everybody got their bite of the apple and then left him in the dust as they moved on to the next source of revenue, oops, I mean the next patient.
Where do we stand today? Still no blood work drawn. Waiting for next week to see what we can do to set the tests and exams the cardiologist ordered before she got busy with another patient. Did my husband return to the doctor's office to tell them what happened and ask for their help? Yes. And he said not one person, not one, would reach into their pockets and give him the $7 or pick up the phone and try to help him resolve this. So what was his life worth? $7.
We'll get the tests done somehow. But the point is, we'll have to fight for it. And his heart will be stressed more and so on and so on and so on. This is the travesty of healthcare in this nation. And this Congress and this President are so damned concerned with their own political futures they cannot even see this reality for the rest of us. I am so angry.
And don't tell me that a single payer - publicly funded and privately delivered system -- wouldn't stop heart attack patients from being denied care due to old debts of $7. It's the only system that could stop that sort of abuse.
The LabCorp supervisor who denied Larry Smith's test on Friday, June 26, in Elkridge, Maryland, is named Shirley Smith (no relation to Larry) at LabCorp's Maryland office: 410-365-1264. LabCorp's customer service line for billing can be reached at: 1-800-845-6167.
79 Comments so far
Show AllThe first half of the story builds up a life threatening situation where someone must get to see a cardiovascular specialist or have his life in danger.
Then, rather than pay a $7 bill out of his own pocket, he walks out and goes home. He expects an employee to pay his bill for him. He apparently had money for gas or bus fare to get to the lab, but doesn't carry $7 on him? And rather than go home, to the bank, or to a friend for his $7, he's demanding a supervisor from a lab company pay HIS outstanding balance...??! And somehow this is LabCorps fault...?
If expensive health coverage is half the problem of America, the entitlement mentality is the other half: people who expect others to do everything for them.
Yes, I want to see healthcare reform. But one worry with a more socialized system is that the dependent people will becomes even more dependent, suckling on the teat of Big Government. And those who work hardest and are most successful pay the most taxes so that others don't have to cough up even 7 bucks towards their own care. The bigger picture is that the biggest killers of adults (heart attack, stroke, and cancer) are ALL stongly linked to lifestyle. We don't want anyone keeping us from eating our T-bone steaks and spending nights plopped in front of the TV, but we want someone else to pay for our health when it fails. Type 2 Diabetes is totally diet related, and one estimate puts 1 in 5 kids born today to develop it eventually. Yet nobody wants to stop going to fast food restaurants, and if anything Americans are eating out more often than before.
Sorry to disagree with the author, but I feel that we really can make a difference in our individual health & health expenses if we take more responsibility it.
Hmmm. I wonder why you entertain such a faulty premise? That, those who are "most successful" "work hardest"?
That's not what I see among the successful members of our Congress, who don't work hard at all, and yet, enjoy first class socialized medicine at the taxpayers' expense whenever THEY need it:
"Health services provided by the Veterans Health Administration (VHA) are truly socialized medicine, because the doctors and other health care providers who serve veterans work for the government and the government owns and runs the hospitals and other health care facilities where veterans get treatment. The VHA treats over 5 million veterans a year. (PDF)
"It may surprise you to know that in the U.S. members of Congress and Presidents have a long history of also enjoying the socialized medicine taxpayers provide for them. In fact, members of Congress have the choice many of them want to deny you. They can choose a private health insurance plan through the Federal Employees Health Benefits (FEHB) program or they can get top-notch medical care at government facilities, like the Bethesda Naval Medical Center in Maryland.
"Many regularly choose the public option. For example:
"When John McCain (R-AZ) found a discolored blotch on his left temple he headed to the National Naval Medical Center in Bethesda to have the spot checked out.
"Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) had his heart bypass surgery at the National Naval Medical Center in Bethesda.
"Former Senator Jesse Helms (R-NC) went to Bethesda Naval Medical Center in Maryland complaining of fatigue and subsequently got a new heart valve there.
"U.S. Presidents also have a long history of using the socialized medicine provided to them by taxpayers, including George W. Bush and Ronald Reagan."
http://www.ourfuture.org/blog-entry/2009031218/who-prefers-public-health-insurance-option
Really, I'm tired of these dependent people suckling the teat of Big Government. Including the blood-sucking health insurance and pharmaceutical industry for whom this health care debate in Congress is just one more example of their weeping for the Nanny State to bail out their useless Anti-American derrieres.
You know, I go about 1/3 of every month without $7 either on me or in my bank account. I get paid little at my job, and I always pay my bills and withdraw money for the necessities of transportation and laundry the moment my paycheck goes in. Then the rest goes for food, and I always run out before my next paycheck. It's easily imaginable that he didn't have $7 on him.
It' easily imaginable for me, too. I was just at the doctor's office last week for my government hand-out for me and my child, from those who work so much harder than myself. And you know what? Golly gee, I left my checkbook at home for the co-payment. I did not have cash on me either because we live hand to mouth. I stood there wondering if my child would not get in to see a doctor, or myself. In this case, however, they did not deny me medical treatment, but said they would send me a bill. (How 'bout that? A bill! 'Mazin'!) And I wasn't there for life-saving tests, either (at least in the immediately apparent sense).
This may hard for some of the "successful" "hard working" to fathom, but guess what? They're not the only working hard or taking preventive health measures. Plus, it is against the law not to provide medical care on that basis.
Nor does John McCain and his family, enjoying their socialized medicine, never eat at McDonald's.
People should be able to walk into a doctor's office when they need to, have any required tests, surgeries, etc. without paying a dime.
That's the way it is in every other civilized advanced nation in the world, including the less civilized, who are now outpacing the U.S. in the SUCCESSFUL delivery of health care.
Yep.
Dear Donna Smith,
Thank you for your leadership on single payer health care in America. I think you and John Conyers are national heroes on this issue. The story about your husband makes me sick, as well, because I think you've done so much for our country, and yet, while your husband can't get a 7.00 test, our tax dollars go towards first class medical care for all the sold-out do-nothings in Congress and their family members. And even after they've left Congress.
I have written more than once to all my representatives, and phoned them, too, concerning H.R. 676. I have signed and shared on-line petitions. I have also spread the word, as able, on internet forums and discussions. I have convinced friends to do similarly.
I also asked one of my elected officials, in the House of Representatives, when I phoned, why he never responded to my two letters asking him to support single payer health care. I have yet to hear back from him on that phone call, as well. And, I have voted for him twice, and he is aware of that. I anticipate that he will be running for re-election, in my district, and yet again, as a Democrat. However, I will not be voting for him anymore, even if he is a lesser-of-two-evils, as a result of his great disinterest in my views as one of his constituents, in the very serious issue of health care.
Thank you again for your work on health care. I really think you're a Great American. If I were a teacher posting pictures of Great Americans on a bulletin for American public school children, I would put your picture up there too.
God bless you and your family. I hope your husband is o.k. And I wish our tax dollars were paying for you and your family's health care instead of Congress' (with the exception of John Conyers and a few others brave enough to support H.R. 676). Because I think Great American Women like you really and truly represent The People.
Single Payer healthCARE not health insurance is what would solve our problem, yet the lobby owned O-Bomb-A won't hear of it. This is pathetic.
The same society that FORCES a parent to inject their child with toxins (chemo) refuses to treat a heart patient for $7.
How much crazier does it need to get?
It's time for revolution my friends.
Hi Donna--I just called Shirley Smith and left a message. I wonder how many others have done the same??
And please tell Larry we are holding him and your family in prayer and all the best thoughts.
Maybe prayer will be our next Healthcare System at the rate we are going now. Of course Pray Single Payer is another good strategy. Kinda like Pray Rain, allowing all unseen forces and higher guides lead the way!!
A friend of mine had an idea- We should all use small claims courts against health insurers== make them have to pay lots if many of us do it? I am not sure if this would work-- any thoughts?
Donna, May I use your article on my web site where I am fighting Medicares cut off of oxygen funds ? I know no other way to reach you. Thanks ,Belle
Of course, in any way this situation and my writing can help, please use it.
I appreciate all the comments and all the support very much.
Donna Smith, American SiCKO
Google H.R. 676 and check PNHP web sites for accurate information on single-payer, and more links to other groups.
This past weekend OFA (the Obama support network) held a "health fair" - soliciting blood donors, collecting healthful foods for a local mission, and asking people to sign a pledge in support of President Obama's three principles of health care "reform" 1-reduce costs 2-guarantee choice 3-ensure affordable health care (no mention of guaranteeing universal health care).
His own suggested public option will not reduce or control costs, on the contrary, it will be an insurer's wet dream, considering the package comes with mandated purchase of insurance, with the government assisting lower income people.
I'm not sure which choice he's guaranteeing - physician/hospital, or insurer. Affordability will be a challenge if there is no way to strictly control costs. Even if the public option is not watered down until it's ineffective, the insurance profiteers will cherry-pick the more lucrative patients, leaving the more expensive, sick people to the government option. Also, it's good to remember here that when questioned about the practice of rescinding coverage at whim, in a recent Senate hearing, insurance executives were adamant in their refusal to stop the practice. So under even the "public option" system, there would be minimal peace of mind for those earning enough to be thrown to the mercies of the profiteers, knowing that their coverage could be rescinded, retroactively, in mid-treatment, as it often is now.
We need single-payer. There will be a rally on July 30th in Washington D.C. to celebrate Medicare's 40th anniversary. We're going to try for press coverage (I looked in vain for information on the June 25th event). Check the PNHP web site for details.
We need to fight for this - and not let the bad guys win...again.
It is time people asked "What will my country do for me?" Don't we pay a lot of taxes and fees to the banks and corporations? Just exactly what do we get for all of our money spent on expenses.
If people on medicare do not have money for a Dr. visit the bill will increase by $20.00 next time they see the DR.
Is it any wonder people are dropping dead because of the hastle?
The USA treats everyone like a piece of meat. Michelle was right when she said it is a cruel country.
If you are not a consumer dropping down a lot of money you are useless in the usa.
Wonderful country if you are rich. Most get free healthcare also.
Predators have control of our so called Health Care business. This has got to change and soon.
As far as I'm concerned Labcorp acted criminally and should something bad have happened to your husband because of their inaction there would have been millions of dollars less profit to shove up their CEO's a**. What a disgusting and perverse anomaly these creatures have made of the US medical industry. Every other country knows that decent medical and healthcare are a right for citizens not a privilege. Somehow where there is money and profit to be made the US will find a way to twist that right into a money making bonanza for every perverse, greedy character who comes along. If people die along the way they couldn't care less, so long as their money keeps rolling in. Like the former president, they don't lose a moment of sleep at night because their actions have killed someone.
Donna, like everyone else, I wish your husband a speedy recovery, and am angry that his tests were held up because of $7. And no one at the doctor's office would even help him out!!!!
An ambulance should have been called when your husband had exhibited symptoms of a heart attack for more than 15 minutes. You write: "He woke up one morning sweating profusely and with a heart rate dropping. I watched his color turn first ruddy then ashen, and then he felt as though he was going to pass out. He would not allow me to call 911 as he slowly began to feel sick to his stomach and he believed his symptoms were digestive rather than cardiac."
Anyone having a heart attack is, first of all, IN DENIAL, and doesn't want the ambulance to be called. But since time is of the essence in preventing permanent heart damage or even death, an ambulance must be called even if the patient doesn't want it. And even if you know you can't afford it, thanks to our predatory health care system.
A heart attack may be caused by a clot that is cutting off blood circulation to part of the heart. Medical intervention, which starts in the ambulance, can restore the circulation before permanent damage to the heart muscle is done. And heart attacks may be caused by electrical arrhythmias in the heart conduction system, causing the heart to pump ineffectively. Again, the ambulance team can prevent death or permanent damage. But time is of the essence, and is measured in minutes, not in days or hours, which is why you can't just wait for a medical appointment.
Just to remind everyone, here are the warning signs of a heart attack, from the Swedish Heart Institute in Seattle:
Early signs of a heart attack may feel like flu or indigestion. Other signs include:
Pain, pressure, fullness, burning or squeezing sensation in the center of your chest behind the breastbone,
Radiating pain that starts in your chest and spreads to the arms, neck, jaw, shoulders or back,
Chest pain accompanied by nausea, sweating without fever, light-headedness, faintness or shortness of breath,
Any prolonged discomfort in your torso, arms, abdomen or jaw that is associated with shortness of breath, troubled breathing or nausea.
IF YOU HAVE ANY OF THESE SYMPTOMS FOR MORE THAN 15 MINUTES, CALL 9-1-1 AND GET TO THE NEAREST EMERGENCY DEPARTMENT--FAST!
Again, Donna, I'm hoping for the best for you and your husband. Thank you so much for all you do to try to get single payer health care for us all. With single payer, no one would have to be afraid that calling the ambulance would financially devastate his/her family.
As to calling an ambulance, where I live, that would result in a $800-$1,000 bill. Most policies allow $50 or $0 for ambulances, so most people hesitate or refuse to call an ambulance, often resulting in further damage or death to the patient. It seems that in the richest nation on earth, that is simply obscene; however, we have plenty of money to build F-22s and wage useless war. On the whole, I believe our politicians don't give a damn about America's citizens except in their ability to vote them into office,after which they become deaf and dumb except to lobbyists of the corporations who line their pockets with cash to have them make legislation favorable to their businesses' bottom line. How tragic--I guess that "Land of the Free" only applies if you're rich or a corporation.
Many insurance plans don't cover ambulance services, which are expensive. There are also huge holes in emergency care too. Invariably, the attending emergency doctor, and often even the hospital is not on the "preferred provider' list, and the patient must pay the full fees - up to tens of thousands of dollars.
The reality that Donna is trying to convey is that in any kind of cardiac-type medical emergencies under the US healthcare system, most people find they most choose between:
1. Making the most conservative decisions to seek medical care - surviving, and possibly facing financial ruin.
2. Making the same conservative decisions, but dying anyway, and leaving ones family in financial ruin.
3. Deciding on a wait-and-see decision on medical care, finding it really was just some heartburn, and saving a lot of money; or
4. Deciding on wait-and-see, dying, but at least sparing one's family the financial ruin.
So, as you can see, in the USA, when a person gets chest pains, options Nos. 3 and 4 are, for many, the most rational ones.
It is a sick system.
This will show why single payer will not work . Please read it and think about it .
Many of us remember when Ronald R. became Governor of California he hated domestic programs and proceded to end as many as it was politically possible . When he and his VP , GHWB , took over the reins of the US Government as a team they began to close many of the US Government domestic programs also . An assault which continued through the GWB Presidency . During the Ronald R. , the GHWB , the WJC , and the GWB eras many health care programs were closed and in some cases putting many institutionized people out on the streets where many remain today and leaving many low income people with no place to go for health care . Prior to Ronald R. the AMA group had competition from the many local , county , State , and US hospitals and clinics and kept their charges low enough for many Americans to afford health care from them . Once the many public clinics and hospitals were closed or shifted to higher income groups the AMA group began to increase the amounts of their charges and to continue to make profit the health insurance companies increased their charges also and both have increased at a rate greater than any wage increases or inflation increases . These rate increases are a burden for medicare and some of it's recipients as the annual Social Security check deductions for medicare insurance increase to cover the AMA increases . Presently a trip to the doctor's office or the hospital is a terrifying experience for any medicare recipient . The bill always exceeds the amount the medicare insurance and the out of pocket supplimental insurance pays . So the AMA is really giving the seniors a mental illness to go along with their other aliments . As you can see another insurance will not work . What is needed is to re-establish the pre Ronald R. health care system . Americans did not have this problem before Ronald R. and his tax cut cancelation will pay for the re-establishment .
Hey, I remember Donna Smith and Michael Moore. They both gagged and endorsed Obama over Nader and Mckinney. Now that you got Obama and the same varmits in Congress, single payer is in the twilight zone !
Dear Ms. Smith,
Thank you for writing this piece -- I am so sorry. It is appalling what happens in the absence of simple common sense!
PLEASE SEND YOUR LETTER TO PRESIDENT OBAMA!
With all good wishes to you and your husband,
inge
And, like little children, we still wait for Big Papa in Washington to give us what we need. Isn't that how white folks slaughtered the native peoples of this continent? Isn't that how slavery contines to this day?
Wake up, people. If you want something, you've got to make it for yourself. Organize. It's your only chance.
"Wake up, people. If you want something, you've got to make it for yourself. Organize. It's your only chance."
And don't forget to arm yourselves too. I may be a moderate liberal but I say to hell with gun control. Our government's gettin' more fascist and it's high time we armed ourselves.
Donna, I think we have to be realistic here and remember if free market healthcare providers let your husband get away with not paying his $7, well, the system just isn't going to work.
Observe:
LabCorp's CEO, a Mr. David P. King, only made $5,147,207 in 2007 (This counts his salary, stock options and other incentives like retirement.)
LabCorp's CEO in 2006, a Mr. Thomas P. Mac Mahon, only mustered $21,508,873. So you see, Donna, we all have to do our part to make denying health care profitable. Labcorp only had revenues of $4.5B in 2008, so it's important to cut corners by denying care to people like your husband. There's no free lunch, you know... unless perhaps you sit on 38 boards of directors like Mr. Mac Mahon does.
Website for checking these guys out at companypay dot com.
The umbrella group that Van who posted here requested:
http://www.guaranteedhealthcare4all.org/
Join and support any of the groups today.
There are a couple of issues I have with this group. First of all, it does not include two of the most militant, vocal, and active single-payer groups: Single Payer Action and 1payer.net.
Second, it encompasses a number of groups that are not serious about single payer--such as PDA, which is pushing the public option scam, as are other groups listed on the Web page. Sorry--but if you analyze the concrete public-option proposals carefully--as opposed to the amorphous fantasies retailed by some corporate liberals--this is an either-or: the public option is designed to scuttle, not promote, single payer and to keep the private insurers in business.
Third, what I had in mind was an ACTION coalition formed around a specific demonstration, not an unwieldy, large, general coalition that doesn't actually DO anything.
Van
I get newsletters from PDA, and I've only seen them push for single-payer, not the public option.
Their "official" position is to support HR676. In practice, they've been promoting the public option--Borosage has written several articles plumping for it, and see the following:
http://www.pdamerica.org/articles/news/2009-06-15-10-44-21-news.php
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-l-borosage/private-muscle-and-the-pu_b_216570.html
Democrats of any stripe are hopeless. PDA types want to be Beltway "players"--when the chips are down, they almost always sidle up to the corporate consensus, notwithstanding the progressive pretensions of their official program.
Thanks for the links.
The Health Care Industry is not in the business to heal people.
They are in the business to make profit from not providing care for people.
The Defense Industry is not in the business of defending our country but to make a profit from killing and war.
The U.S. Government does not protect you and your families or the Constitution or Bill of Rights, it protects and serves the Corporations, for profit.
Once we all realize this things become very clear what our next steps should be. Until then, we all just are shuffling chairs on the Titanic.
Little to the left and that one too....
When my mother complained of abdominal symptoms to her primary doctor in her HMO, she was dismissed as having normal pains, "you are an old lady" she was told. Finally, a rich friend took her out of system to NYU, and she was operated on for a tumor the size of a grapefruit. That was after two years of being dismissed and sent away by her doctor.
She received chemotherapy for about six months, then as stage IV progressed she began dying and within 8 months she was dead from ovarian cancer. The HMO referred to as HIP in NYC denied the claims for treatment at NYU and my father sued them.
I am ready for single payer health care and so are small businesses and self-employed persons. The only things that stand between us and good health care that we all can afford are private, for-profit insurance companies, HMOs, healthcare corporations and politicians who allow racketeering to continue because they are corrupted by campaign contributions. Let the civil disobedience and boycotts and primary election challenges begin.
$7!!! They wouldnt draw blood for because of 7 freakin dollars!!!? For-Profit Medicine at is worst! My prayers go out to u and ur husband Donna.
Who was it that said, "it is not a question of too few resourses. Rather it is a question of too many people."?
Donna Smith:
Thanks for your continuing contribution to fighting for Single Payer. Best of Luck and Health to Larry Smith.
LabCorp is a particularly henious corporation, as Larry Smith's story reveals. Heck, the folks in the room could have dug $7 out of their pockets if they were half human.
My own dealings with these wonderful people included dirty needles and a simple lab test that had to be redone after my insurance comapny (United Health) ordered that I use LabCorp, rather than the lab in my clinic.
Eventually, for reasons I don't understand, United shifted the work back to my clinic lab and I haven't had a test problem or billing problem since.
The fact that LabCorp continues to exist at all tells you as much as you need to know. It's is a "low-cost" contractor that uses unqualified staff and cuts corners, stealing hundreds of millions of dollars of public money while endangering peoples' health and lives.
Welocome to the GREATEST COUNTRY ON EARTH.
As I read this story, I am looking at three LabCorp nastygrams telling me that I owe for doctor ordered lab work suppossedly covered by my insurer (Principle--adminstered by Aetna).
The most galling things about this entire episode are:
Calling both the Labcorp and Aetna lines and getting some bland recording saying "your call is vewy, vewy, important to us, pweese hold for the next available operwator")
The realization that I am talking to one of several hundred anonymous cubicle warriors none of whom have last names or direct call back lines to enable them to be recontacted with any certainty.
The insurer explaining that, yes, Labcorp is their designated provider and Labcorp explaining that, yes, they did submit the claimn to the insurer as designated on my little plastic card and no one being asble to explain why the designated proivider cannot get paid by my designated insurer.
Single-payer cannot be worse than this mess.
Poet
For anyone who needs a heart transplant - I know just the Senator to take it from. It's hardly used.
I didn't know they had hearts and thought it was the brain that was hardly used.
The billing department of LabCorp was practicing medicine without a license.
Best wishes, Donna.
However, looking at the crew assembled to "reform" the health-care (sic) system, I fear we'll be looking back on this period as "the good old days."
Over the top? Well, good luck to you and yours -- the next time you have a heart attack. make sure you check your wallet before leaving or stop at an ATM or leave and drive to get some money if your EKG looks abnormal.
I really do wish this was a way out of line example, but it isn't. It just isn't. People are being stopped from getting care in many ways and by many companies and providers.
Just so we know that what we want and are advocating to protect is a rigid system in which we blame patients for not carrying money (as you are free to do) rather than the lab for not having a reasonable policy with which to handle a situation like this.
I will hope you are never faced with one of these situations -- thanks for commenting.
Donna Smith, American SiCKO
Donna--
Kudos for your unflagging devotion to serious health-care reform.
I have a couple of points that I hope you might consider addressing:
1. This public option scam is a huge diversion--it's siphoning off vast amounts of energy that could and should be invested in fighting for single payer. Moreover, the whole concept is so amorphous--very few people have any clear idea of what is meant by a public option. The often-cited Times poll that garnered at 72-percent approval rating for the public option asked if respondents favor a "Medicare-like" public option. But, as you well know, the Waxman/Rangel/Schumer proposal is radically UNlike Medicare--yet people seem to think that the "public option" will be some kind of free or nearly free program. It's critical to counter this scam and not give an inch to it.
2. One of the problem in mobilizing action on behalf of Medicare for all is the diversity of single-payer groups: Healthcare-Now, Single Payer Action, 1Payer.net, PNHP, your group, etc. Has anyone contemplated forming an umbrella coalition of these groups to pool resources and initiatives? If we prescribe resource-pooling for the health sector, we ought to be able to implement it in our own backyard!
3. I think that an independent mass demonstration for single payer is both feasible and necessary. There's no time to mount anything serious before Labor Day, and the summer is a lousy time to mobilize such actions, with the college campuses--a reliably fertile source of activist energy--dormant for now. Ideally, if the major organizations could project an action for mid-October or early November in Washington (before the cold weather sets in, yet allowing enough time to build on campuses before the holidays and finals)--and perhaps a corresponding demonstration in San Francisco--on a SATURDAY (people have to work--what were people thinking scheduling a demo for Thursday???)--could be a great educational/organizational tool that could have real impact if done properly. The idea would be to recruit as many big names as possible to speak--you and Rose Ann, of course, but also some top people from PNHP, Conyers/Kucinich/Sanders, celebrity endorsers, etc., etc., maybe even Michael Moore if he can be jolted from his Obamoid complacency.
I was involved in building some of the large antiwar demonstrations in the 1960s--I don't expect that we would match those turnouts, but we need to think big and plan professionally and well in advance--above all, in a coalition of all the major single-payer groups to pool limited resources and manpower (personpower?).
I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on my thoughts--either in an answering comment here or at van_mungo@yahoo.com.
Van
"One of the problem in mobilizing action on behalf of Medicare for all is the diversity of single-payer groups: Healthcare-Now, Single Payer Action, 1Payer.net, PNHP, your group, etc. Has anyone contemplated forming an umbrella coalition of these groups to pool resources and initiatives? If we prescribe resource-pooling for the health sector, we ought to be able to implement it in our own backyard!"
Excellent point, and it applies to many if not all progressive causes, including, critically, the fielding of presidential candidates.
It's understandable that people start out fragmented into so many groups covering the same issue - a lot of these spring up locally, or among different professional circles, or have slightly different slants. But it has to be recognized that political power comes with uniting, and the internet, which fosters the creation of so many choices, should also be a uniting factor.
Sometimes I wonder how much ego or power jockeying are factors in the continued separation of these issue groups.
This is not to diminish the hard work of people like Donna Smith. And her story today makes me angry all over again.
To Captain Queeg -
Ms. Smith's story may seem over-the-top; but until you've had a problem, you don't realize just how bad the health care system is.
Several years ago, I got a great job for a very small business that did not offer health insurance to its employees. Since I was young and in good health, I figured I would be fine for a few years until I could afford to buy my own. Unfortunately, one night I woke up with horrible, stabbing pain in my stomach. I couldn't breathe for the pain (and I have a very high pain tolerance). My husband drove me to the ER, where I was told that I would not be treated unless we made some kind of "deposit," as a guarantee that we would pay (since I didn't have insurance). My husband ran to the ATM and cleaned out our meager savings of $200, and offered that. Because I was emergent, they reluctantly accepted the $200. $12,000 later, I had the required surgery and spent the next 7 years paying that hospital.
Insurance is no guarantee of anything. Last year I declared bankruptcy due to medical bills, despite having insurance. If you have an on-going medical problem, it can still cost many thousands of dollars in co-pays, deductibles, medications, and uncovered expenses.
So Ms. Smith is right - whether you're insured or not, be prepared to be required to pay up front for treatment. Single-payer is the only option to provide health care for all. The current system cannot be "reformed" - it must be overhauled, so that all Americans can get a blood test so they can be treated for their heart problems.
>>He did not have $7 with him. He was fasting.
Since when is carrying money against fasting rules? Sometimes over-the-top anecdotes like this one do more harm than good. Just sayin'
For Jews, it certainly is against the fasting rules.
fyi
//s//
Way to miss the forest for the trees, Cap'n!
Maybe you've been squeezing those little balls of yours too hard!
Just sayin'.
· Yr Obd't Servant
Ten thousand people were in Washington, DC on Thursday, in support of universal health care yet no one I talked to knew anything about it-- which tells me there was little or no media coverage.
Those who rallied on Thursday last week were brought in to shore up support for expanding insurance options not fixing the healthcare system. Under what Congress is proposing so far, you could still have an insurance company decide not to pay a bill and your family member could have a heart attack or stroke or cancer and be denied for a small outstanding debt.
There was another rally on Friday evening in DC during which scores of people spoke out for healthcare as a human right.
As far as I know, the media made little attempt to cover any of it.
I support a single payer system. Everybody in, nobody out.
Donna Smith, American SiCKO
Sioux Rose
DONNA: My heart goes out to you. It must blow your mind that you received such unquestioned generosity in Cuba, but in your own native land you and your spouse are treated like dirt. That illustration of "your life or $7" is quite telling. It would make for great anti-US P.R. in those parts of the world the U.S. is always trying to win over in "hearts and minds."
I am dealing with some dental problems, and I see the same mechanisms operating. The dentist demands all sorts of diagnostic tests each at an exorbitant cost. They force a treatment program that does everything but handle the problem I instigated help to offset! And they try to send me to OTHER specialists. I was going to go to Hondurus to get some work done and now there's a coup. When I went to a dental clinic in Mexico a few years ago it was full of Americans, some from as far away as Hawaii!
In astrology Virgo (August 23-September 22) is the sign related to health concerns and I think a protest scheduled for 911 would make sense. We could call it "America's medical 911!" and educate people as to how many die each year from absence of care, compared to the numbers that died on the original 911. The astrological climate is VERY stirred from September 15-24, and those dates favor upheaval of old systems. Florida would not be a good location for a planned event as the probability of hurricane activity will be HIGH that week.
Many are called, but few are chosen. On a spiritual level, you have the stuff that makes you endure and fight for others' health care needs in spite of your family's own ample and undeserved suffering. How this nation makes war and hands over embarassing riches to bankers and militarists while denying basic services to citizens must make the angels weep. You ARE appreciated.
Sioux Rose--
Nice symbolism, but it's too soon after Labor Day to get anything organized. The reality is that most people tune out over the summer, and you need more time than a week or two to tap the reservoir of student activism on the campuses. Mid-October to early November would combine the best climatic/circumstantial/tactical factors.
Van
Siouxrose June 29th, 2009 4:49 pm..If you have extensive dental problems, I would recommend the Philippines. It's incredibly reasonable and the money saved compared to the prices in the US are well worth the fare. Last year, I went to Cebu (Dr. Meriam Yap), had 18 veneers and 8 crowns installed, plus a triple root canal and various fillings. With the fare, it came in under $10K...and the people are wonderful. They are not into these extensive rip-off diagnosis crap. Just an idea. They did it all in less than 30 days. Metro Park Hotel...Cebu....Dr. Yap's husband owns the hotel..very reasonable and the food is great.
Sioux Rose
UNDAUNTED: Hi. Thanks for the tip. I just need 1-2 implants... not THAT extensive! Still, if I can get a cool trip and dental taken care of rather than deal with local rip-offs, it's worth doing. I think all sorts of pricing systems went up with the housing boom. Everyone felt rich with so much equity! Now that homes have lost what, 20-40% of their values, you'd think the medical & dental "vultures" would adjust their cost scales equivalently. Otherwise, I'll head elsewhere for teeth. Maybe in a generation or two the geneticists will employ what sharks do... they have rotating teeth and as soon as one goes, another is there to replace it. Sure beats the current alternatives!
Siouxrose June 29th, 2009 11:43 pm.........Implants are incredibly reasonable in Cebu...BUT, you need a six month or so waiting period between procedures. This means TWO trips to the Philippines, which really cuts your savings. Mexico does have much more reasonable implants than the US. It might pay to check with some docs there.
You seem to be completely out of touch with how ordinary USAns live.
Going on a $10,000, one-month vacation to the Philippines (spewing lots of GHG's into the upper atmosphere end exploiting poverty wages along the way) is entirely out of the question for ordinary working class USAns. They shop around for cheap dental work or simply get the teeth pulled and replaced with a bridge.
pjd412 June 29th, 2009 11:06 pm....I know of little more important than ones personal health. and will not be a victim of outrageous medical fees..dentistry and otherwise....in this country. I'll live on the edge and take care of my personal health in my own way. What know YOU of how I live my life and the sacrifices I made to take care of my own health? If every member of CONgress can have the best medical and dental care available, so can I. Have your own teeth pulled, if that's YOUR choice. I made mine.
By the way, my wife is from Cebu, and had her partials put in while visiting her family. But to travel there and back again (the Hobbit), takes more than small change. Cuba or Mexico sounds like your best bet if you can get quality dental care there.
If you book in advance, you can likely get a round trip as low as $1500. I paid about $500 more because it was a last minute decision. As I said, it only pays if you want to save money on extensive work. Mexico was not as reasonable when I checked.
Wow, just under 10K? Who has that many free clams?
chessgames56 June 29th, 2009 8:10 pm...Still paying, but the quality of work and money I saved was still worth the bucks. For instance, just one crown in the states is about $1000...and add another $800 to $1000, if you need a root canal. Forget about veneers.....$$$$$$$$$$$$$. Root canal in the Philippines.........4000 Pisos....approx. $100.
Donna, is it possible that your situation is a bit more complicated? Considering your role in Michael Moore's Sicko?
I have worked in healthcare for 14 years, I agree that we need a complete system overhaul, but to even begin to support Single Payer as the sole source of our citizen's healthcare is short sided.
I've read HR676 in its entirety and I know that the specialty clinic that I work for would not be able to exist with the reimbursement of Medicare or Medicaid. We see many, many patients for free...sometimes because Medicare only covers a short list of procedures for payment and we don’t think seniors should have to sign waivers to pay for the testing on their own (did you know that a Medicare patient cannot have a screening/medical colonoscopy for the diagnosis code of constipation, even if their primary physician orders it?) and sometimes because our patients don't have incomes to cover their medical expenses. HR676 as it stands would force our clinic to sell our Ambulatory Surgical Centers to the gov't (our surgical centers are state of the art AND 1/3 of the cost of an outpatient procedure in the hospital) and require physicians to see patients even after their capitation allotment each month. That’s just not right…
How is our clinic expected to keep our private research center open and continue to develop cutting edge techniques, which our clinic is known for throughout the country? How are we expected to keep paying our staff a fair wage or provide the same benefits that our physicians believe we should have? How are we supposed to pay for all the expenses that are far and above the cost of family physicians and internal med clinics pay? We will not be able to provide the same level of care or be able to keep staff with Single Payer. But no one ever talks about the specialty physician, other than that they are a greedy bunch and there's no reason they should make more than a General Physician...REALLY? Specialty docs aren't required to have more education and more expense than GPs? Better yet, how would you like future physicians to pay for medical school with single payer reimbursement?
The bottom line is that I, as an American citizen, DO NOT want my medical benefits to change with the back and forth of political parties in power, it's not fair and it's not right...
I have a friend who just found out that her sister (under the age of 40) has breast cancer; her diagnosis is added along side with her mother, maternal grandmother, and maternal aunts. She is currently residing in London after been transferred for work from the states. Her sister's physicians back in the US advised her to have testing done to see if she has the BRCA-II gene, and with positive testing she would need to decide on her level of care since the risk of breast and reproductive cancer with this gene is staggering. She was told that in the U.K. this type of testing was not done nor found necessary, she was forced to fly back to the states to have this important testing done, luckily her company still provides medical insurance here in this country for her. She wasn't even able to have a mammogram done for baseline purposes, which is standard here for pt's with such a family history.
We're a sick nation, we've done many many devastating things to our bodies since being industrialized, and we are unique in that Americans have been our own guinea pigs in many ways with what we create, consume, and waste. Our health issues are only coming to light and there will be many more battles to face, do you really want a government only option to healthcare in the face of these future issue we face? What happens when the federal budget does not support enough funding for the solutions? Where do we go from there?
I think we can have healthcare reform, keep the system we have AND insure everyone. And to think Single Payer is the answer to all our healthcare problems is short sided and will bring only more devastation when the gov't denies care based on cost and utilization of care. Is the Bush administration so far removed that we don't understand just what lack of compassion and protection our gov't can and will do in the wrong hands?
If you don't want to be denied for medical services in the meantime, try moving to one of many states in this great nation that do not allow refusal of care for past owed bills and stop masking the real problem here...everyone is abusing the system and now it's time to get back to fixing ourselves and this private insurance. Instead of throwing the baby out with the bathwater by pretending that the government will always make the right decisions about each of our bodies and our rights. It just isn’t always so…
rachelh27, the reason BRCA-II (and BRCA I) gene testing is not done in the UK or anywhere else outside the US is a horror story of gene patenting. Myriad Genetics has the patent rights to both genes and is the sole testing laboratory and threatens suit to any lab who tests for, or examines this gene, in any patient.
As far as I know this is a unique situation as most patent holders issue non-exclusive licenses allowing testing to be widely disseminated and supporting quality care through cooperative laboratory control testing.
Oh - what a good idea. I'll just pick up, quit my decent job and move to another state and hope I can find a job, a place to live, etc. No problem. Of course, I have very little money in savings because I spend so much every month in co-pays for medications and dr. visits. Plus I'm paying off the deductible and co-pay from my most recent hospitalization. But I'm sure it's no big deal to pack up and move, just so I can find a state that won't refuse to provide me with medical care because I still owe other providers. I sure do wish I had thought of it sooner.
And I want to know who's abusing the system (other than maybe illegal aliens)? The only abuse I see and hear about is the insurance companies, the doctors, the hospitals, and the pharmaceutical companies. How does a patient abuse the system exactly? Oh, I'm sure someone will have some anecdote about some guy they know getting an unnecessary test. But it's nothing compared to the fraud and abuse by those who are getting rich off the current system.
And by the way - that genetic test your friend so desperately needs? My insurance company won't pay for it, even though I live in this country, have similar risk factors, etc. They will pay for the mammogram once a year, but nothing else. Your friend must have really great insurance. Wouldn't it be great if we all did?
I understand you're concerned about your job, because you think it depends on the current health care system. What you maybe are not seeing is that under Single Payer, we'll still need health care providers and researchers. Your job is not going away.
I think you meant "short-sighted" twice.
The other many mistakes were in the facts.
Your conclusion is therefore flawed.
My goodness--your comment is a farrago of every canard floating in the virtual ether about single payer; your post is a case study in systematic distortion and HMO propaganda.
First of all, as to your claim that your facility would be forced to sell its Ambulatory Surgical Centers--ABSOLUTELY FALSE. Under the single-payer system proposed by HR676, all entities that are now private--hospitals, labs, medical practices--would remain private. HR676, like the Canadian system, would be publicly financed but PRIVATELY administered.
Moreover, your assumptions about physicians' incomes are completely unwarranted--just more HMO-inspired disinformation. See the following to correction your misconceptions on this score:
http://student.pnhp.org/content/what_about_physician_salaries.php
As for your anecdotal scare stories about care in the UK--the World Health Organization has scrupulously evaluated the health-care systems of the world, and it found that the U.S. system ranks 37th, dead last in the industrialized world, and only two notches ahead of Cuba. The UK ranks 9th. See http://www.who.int/whr/2000/en/whr00_annex_en.pdf. In that statistical annex you will find that all the other industrialized countries of the world have BETTER health outcomes than the United States--better life expectancy and lower infant-mortality rates.
Moreover, the United States ranks dead last among industrialized nations in deaths from preventable diseases. According to a Jan. 2008 Reuters reports, "France, Japan and Australia rated best and the United States worst in new rankings focusing on preventable deaths due to treatable conditions in 19 leading industrialized nations, researchers said on Tuesday. If the U.S. health care system performed as well as those of those top three countries, there would be 101,000 fewer deaths in the United States per year, according to researchers writing in the journal Health Affairs." Note that ALL the countries at the top--and all those ahead of the U.S.--have variants of nonprofit single-payer health care.
Moreover, those countries attain those superior outcomes at an average of HALF the per capita costs of the U.S. health-care system--see http://www.kff.org/insurance/snapshot/chcm010307oth.cfm.
Your errancy on so many critical matters of fact is so sovereign that it makes one wonder if you have seriously studied ALL the data on these issues, whether you have really read HR676, or whether you are simply a willful purveyor of HMO-industry disinformation and scare tactics.
If you have an open mind and truly wish to acquaint yourself with empirical reality, I suggest that you read the sources I provide--for a more general corrective to your rampant misconceptions--especially about HR676--please see the FAQ at Physicians for a National Health Plan:
http://www.pnhp.org/facts/singlepayer_faq.php
And one also hears this bugaboo of this or that exotic test or treatment that is not available in Europe or Canada. But in many cases it is because the test has been found through studies to simply not be effective. Many tests and treatments are ordered in the US just because they make a lot of money doing them.
For example, a recent Canadian study found that the much-promoted PSA test has done nothing to improve prostate cancer survival rates, but instead have caused many people to pursue dangerous and debilitating surgery for a cancer that often grows so slowly that the person is going to die of old age first.
I should add that if we had free university education, like Europeans enjoy, the whole issue of doctors and particularly specialists needing more income to cover their student loans would not exist.
At any rate, remuneration in any occupation should strictly be based on effort and sacrifice. The idea that someone "deserves" better pay for less work just because they posses a talent, or took additional training (which would be free in a decent society) is simply not just.
And all jobs should be structured so all include empowering and intellectually challenging tasks.
Thanks for clarifying, Donna. I also support Single Payer and am disgusted that, in 2003, Obama said he supported it- and all that was needed was the Dems to have control of the executive and legislative branches. Now he doesn't mention Single Payer.
I didn't hear anything about the rally Friday night, either. If I turn on the TV or radio all I get is condemnation of "government-supported" health care and "socialized medicine."
Ugh, I live in DC and don't hear of these things :-(
This makes me want to puke.
Donna, I brought this up in a different story on this site...why do you think that proponents of single-payer have seemingly done nothing to counter the generations-long all-out conservative assault on Medicare? Defending single-payer as medicare for all does little good if the media is allowed to demonize Medicare, as it has been doing for probably decades. By watching the MSM, an uninformed citizen would learn that Medicare is both bankrupt and is bankrupting our country, pays doctors so little they're forced to take on thousands of patients to make ends meet, is highly prone to fraud, etc. I have not seen anybody debunking these, only pointing out the Medicare has only a 3% overhead compared to the 30% of private insurance.
zmann my friend, I invite you to read this article and pass this along if we are to take down the M$M:
http://www.moderateindependent.com/v3i6tv.htm
Maybe not a perfect article but society will have to cooperate somewhere.
Too bad I'm forced to watch TV as part of my job. Or at least, watch Rush Limbaugh on his webcam *shudder*
And check this out:
http://www.theonion.com/content
/news/report_90_of_waking_hours_spent
Force you to watch TV and on webcam? What kind of a workplace setting would let you do that? Where I work at, the TVs are out in the hallways and gym and even then the volume is rather low. And our office is strict on audio and video. It's either headphones or it's off.
I don't really mind the TV but I think it's the lack of quality content that makes it horrible. Between Cox Communications and DirectTV, to get some of the good channels, I purchase them in the bundle offers which includes more filth channels.
Haha, I work for a media watchdog, it's kinda part of the job.
Oh dear. No wonder the progressive and liberal infrastructure just cannot blossom. And to think I went through all this trouble years ago taking a master's program in IT Management and dynamic thinking a few years before data warehousing and mining became common. I would do more than be a media watchdog if I owned a business like the one you're working for. We know what the conservatives are most likely to say and we have a better sense of their patterns and all. Ok, so I spent a couple years busting my brains on database warehousing and mining projects so I'll probably sound confusing. But I'll tell you what. It's not hard to take the knowledge mined and form a counter media the likes of which even George Lakoff would be surprised. Now that you got me thinking and I feel bad that you'd subject yourself to such degrading media, I think I might have what it takes to counter it and I think I can do it without waking up the sleeping giants such as the MIC.
Jason Grant Garza here ... type my name into a google search engine or www.sfbg.com/entry.php?entry_id=3956&catid=4 or www.tortdeform.com/archives/2007/07/access_denied_no_health_care_n_1.html to see how I too am in my own private Guantanamo since the government (Medicare, Social Security, Federal court system, etc) have all screwed me out of my rights and NOT been accountable. What this individual (in artice above) went thru by the hands of our own government happens daily to the poor and disabled AMERICAN citizens. Now after years I have an agreement that admits fault and liablity; however, NO JUSTICE, NO RESTITUTION, NO CONTRITION and certainly NO HUMANITY. Yet as in Guantanamo, the individuals responsible still have their jobs, will still collect their pensions, will still continue to lie and state that they care, etc.
When our own government will not fully and correctly investigate (since they know they broke the law and would have to live up to their false rethoric)itself thereby creating the environment and culture of deceit. Please read the articles ... ask yourself what is different ... would it be the ten to 20 agencies that I went to that all told me I was wrong or would it be that after winning the other side still doesn't have the honor, dignity nor respect to do the "right" thing? Define right and right for who? I can show you how my rights didn't apply ... how even Medicare failed, how the Federal Court System failed and how the Medical system failed. What the difference ... my case has been on going since my illegal arrest and denial of emergency services in 2001 (with the gold card - Medicare) ... and as the vindicated victim - I will continue to speak and point out the truth and show the injustice till I die ... sort of like the individual that the article speaks about. TORTURE IS AS TORTURE DOES; but, at least I was an AMERICAN citizen with rights ... NOT! Type my name into a google search engine, read, educate and realize that you are NEXT! Ah, the audacity of FALSE HOPE, BROKEN LAWS and RIGHTS, and "the ENLIGHTED SOCIETY." First, let's TURN on the light ... P.S REMEMBER, I HAD THE GOLD CARD (MEDICARE) AND THE FULL FORCE OF THE US GOVERNMENT (at screwing me) that is; but, if the city (SF) can (Screw me) do it and NO CONSEQUENCE ... why shouldn't the government ... it's NOT LIKE THEY HAVE A DUTY TO THEIR CITIZENS ... at least, NOT the ones that are not COPORATE. Ask Valerie Plane or Jose Padilla or John Walker (they are not being tortured by lies, deception, and inhumanity ... CORRECT?)
Jason Grant, you're not alone. I've seen plenty from the military returning home and finding themselves screwed similar to your case. The plight of the troops especially on healthcare needs to be raised more often. They elites will have all sorts of divide-and-conquers to maximize their wealth regardless of innocent bystanders who are casualties from this.
Best wishes to you, Donna, and for Larry's speedy recovery!
With Obama's robust public option, that $7 would entitle you to a tax credit that would actually reduce the amount that denied Larry service down to $3.50!
· Yr Obd't Servant
Donna Smith has told us the facts of our present health care system. It is about profits, it is about money---not about health care. And our Congressonal Representatives have put single payer off the table? Haven't you heard enough?
Isn't this story enough to put you over the top? Are you going to quietly allow your Representative in Congress to vote no on HR 676 for Single Payer? What happened to Larry Smith is what can happen to all of us. We need health care, not health insurance. Do something! Get in your Representative's face and DEMAND HE/SHE VOTES YES ON HR 676.