Pentagon Targeted Iran for Regime Change after 9/11
WASHINGTON - Three weeks after the 9/11 terror attacks, former U.S. Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld established an official military objective of not only removing the Saddam Hussein regime by force but overturning the regime in Iran, as well as in Syria and four other countries in the Middle East, according to a document quoted extensively in then Undersecretary of Defence for Policy Douglas Feith’s recently published account of the Iraq war decisions.
Feith’s account further indicates that this aggressive aim of remaking the map of the Middle East by military force and the threat of force was supported explicitly by the country’s top military leaders.
Feith’s book, ‘War and Decision’, released last month, provides excerpts of the paper Rumsfeld sent to President George W. Bush on Sep. 30, 2001 calling for the administration to focus not on taking down Osama bin Laden’s al Qaeda network but on the aim of establishing ‘new regimes’ in a series of states by ‘aiding local peoples to rid themselves of terrorists and to free themselves of regimes that support terrorism.’
In quoting from that document, Feith deletes the names of all of the states to be targeted except Afghanistan, inserting the phrase ’some other states’ in brackets. In a facsimile of a page from a related Pentagon ‘campaign plan’ document, the Taliban and Saddam Hussein regimes are listed as ’state regimes’ against which ‘plans and operations’ might be mounted, but the names of four other states are blacked out ‘for security reasons’.
Gen. Wesley Clark, who commanded the NATO bombing campaign in the Kosovo War, recalls in his 2003 book ‘Winning Modern Wars’ being told by a friend in the Pentagon in November 2001 that the list of states that Rumsfeld and Deputy Secretary of Defence Paul Wolfowitz wanted to take down included Iraq, Iran, Syria, Libya, Sudan and Somalia.
Clark writes that the list also included Lebanon. Feith reveals that Rumsfeld’s paper called for getting ‘Syria out of Lebanon’ as a major goal of U.S. policy.
When this writer asked Feith after a recent public appearance which countries’ names were deleted from the documents, he cited security reasons for the deletion. But when he was asked which of the six regimes on the Clark list were included in the Rumsfeld paper, he replied, ‘All of them.’
Rumsfeld’s paper was given to the White House only two weeks after Bush had approved a U.S. military operation in Afghanistan directed against bin Laden and the Taliban regime. Despite that decision, Rumsfeld’s proposal called explicitly for postponing indefinitely U.S. airstrikes and the use of ground forces in support of the anti-Taliban Northern Alliance in order to try to catch bin Laden.
Instead the Rumsfeld paper argued that the U.S. should target states which had supported anti-Israel forces such as Hezbollah and Hamas. It urged that the United States ‘[c]apitalize on our strong suit, which is not finding a few hundred terrorists in caves in Afghanistan, but in the vastness of our military and humanitarian resources, which can strengthen the opposition forces in terrorist-supporting states.’
Feith describes the policy outlined in the paper as consisting of ‘military action against some of the state sponsors and pressure — short of war — against others’.
The Rumsfeld plan represented a Pentagon consensus that included the uniformed military leadership, according to Feith’s account. He writes that the process of drafting the paper involved consultations with the outgoing Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Henry Shelton and the incoming Chairman Gen. Richard Myers.
Myers helped revise the initial draft, Feith writes, and Gen. John P. Abizaid, who was then director of the Joint Staff, enthusiastically endorsed it in draft form. ‘This is an exceptionally important memo,’ wrote Abizaid, ‘which gives clear strategic vision.’ In a message quoted by Feith, Abizaid recommended to Myers that ‘you support this approach’.
After the invasion and occupation of Iraq in 2003, Abizaid was promoted to become chief of CENTCOM, with military responsibility for the entire Middle East.
Neither Myers nor Abizaid, both of whom are now retired from the military, responded to e-mails asking for their comments on Feith’s account of their role in the process of producing the Rumsfeld strategy.
Rumsfeld’s aides had also drafted a second version of the paper, as instructions to all military commanders in the development of ‘campaign plans against terrorism’.
That instructions document was a joint effort by Feith’s office and by the Strategic Plans and Policy directorate of Abizaid’s Joint Staff. It followed the broad outlines of the paper for Bush, arguing that the enemy was a ‘network’ that included states that support terrorism and that the Defence Department should seek to ‘convince or compel’ those states to cut their ties to terrorism.
The Pentagon guidance document called for military commanders to assist other government agencies ‘as directed’ to ‘encourage populations dominated by terrorist organizations or their supporters to overthrow that domination’.
That language was adopted because the campaign planning document was issued as ‘Strategic Guidance for the Defense Department’ on Oct. 3, 2001 — just three days after the Rumsfeld strategy paper had gone to the president.
Bush had not approved the explicit aim of regime change in Iran, Syria and four other countries proposed by Rumsfeld. Thus Rumsfeld adopted the aggressive military plan targeting multiple regimes in the Middle East for regime change even though it was not White House policy.
The Defence Department guidance document made it clear that U.S. military aims in regard to those states would go well beyond any ties to terrorism. The document said that the Defence Department would also seek to isolate and weaken those states and to ‘disrupt, damage or destroy’ their military capacities — not necessarily limited to WMD.
The document included as a ’strategic objective’ a requirement to ‘prevent further attacks against the U.S. or U.S. interests’. That language, which extended the principle of preemption far beyond the issue of WMD, was so broad as to justify plans to use force against virtually any state that was not a client of the United States.
The military leadership’s strong preference for focusing on states as enemies rather than on the threat from al Qaeda after 9/11 continued a pattern of behaviour going back to the Bill Clinton administration (1993-2001).
After the bombing of two U.S. embassies in East Africa by al Qaeda operatives, State Department counter-terrorism official Michael Sheehan proposed supporting the anti-Taliban Northern Alliance in Afghanistan against bin Laden’s sponsor, the Taliban regime. However, senior U.S. military leaders ‘refused to consider it’, according to a 2004 account by Richard H. Shultz, Jr., a military specialist at Tufts University.
A senior officer on the Joint Staff told State Department counter-terrorism director Sheehan he had heard terrorist strikes characterised more than once by colleagues as a ’small price to pay for being a superpower’.
© 2008 Inter Press Service
Hi
None of this is new and has been known for years.
In simple terms pre-emptive war is illegal so why has the United Nations not explicitly outlawed it outright?
Nothing will stop the Neocons while the US citizens continue to believe the corrupt MSM and if they have not wised up by now they never will.
I guess the US will just destroy itself and the only question is how many other will go down with them.
Is’nt this what the messanic nuts want - their second comming?
I’m sure glad the Democrats are stopping these insane plans.
Oh….never mind.
Want a lot of war? Vote Republican.
Want almost as much war? Vote Democrat.
Want Peace & Justice? Vote Green Party. www.GP.org
meanwhile our military is considered no more than useful pawns in the machinations of the gods–they, of course, being the gods who somehow have the right to manipulate world events to accomodate their own greed and megalomania. Somewhere along the way, they have forgotten that the military consists of young men and women between the ages of 18 and 32, on average, and that they are exceptionally brave self sacrificing human beings who are willing to put their lives on the line to defend us. Also, they have forgotten that they are civil servants–just like a postal employee, except that they get paid better and are given a lot of leeway because of their responsibilities. So what we have is a group of arrogant, self serving, power hungry creeps on our payroll sending our young off to wars to serve their corporate buddies and their own greed and pride–and we let this happen. Who is to blame when the employee screws up? The employer, that’s who….that would be the American public.
“Defend us?” from what?
Iran again? Haven’t we learned our lesson from history? We did this in the 1950’s, in the 1980’s and again this century. All our leaders have accomplished in the name of U.S. citizens is a deep distrust by many countries, and a hatred by the Iranian people.
It appears that the U.S. government wants to again install another brutal dictator that will be friendly to U.S. interests (big business), and could care less about the people.
The form of Democracy that the U.S. peddles is nothing but a sham when the result is to allow the theft of other coutries resources, and the economic enslavement of it’s people.
2 QUESTIONS FOR THE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATES :
1. What on earth are Israel’s 200 nuclear bombs for if they can’t protect it from a nation with an economy the size of Finland’s and an annual military budget of $4 billion?
2. Don’t you think :
-snuffing out Iran’s democracy with a CIA-sponsored coup in 1953,
-imposing on the people of Iran the bloody dictatorship of the Shah for a quarter century,
-orchestrating Saddam Hussein’s 1980 to 88 war of agression on Iran with US weapons of mass destruction causing around 1 million Iranian victims,
is enough abuse from the United States for a nation that never harmed us and never attacked anyone in modern history?
I was heavily involved with Iranian opposition leaders prior to Khomeini’s return and also related to many who held positions of influence under the Shah.
And, it is without question that what was being sold on the world’s stage, in our CIA run and corporate run media is very far from the truth.
It is a matter of accepted history that MI6 and the CIA orchestrated a coup to oust Mossadegh and replace him with the second Pahlavi.
This puppeted government of the Shah was completely administered by foreign secret services and business interests. During the Shah’s tenure, a brutal domestic secret service operation kept dissidents and opposition in check by the use of torture, assassinations, strict information control (prison sentences could even be meted out for having the wrong book in possession when crossing the border into Iran) and just as strictly controlled access to economic and social advancement.
Iran was a country ruled by an elite for the elite.
When the revolution came, it was a surprise to many to see the sudden and overwhelming popularity of Khomeini. And many Iranians living outside Iran as students, etc. were surprised by the sudden dominance of Khomeini.
And I think it has to be asked, why Khomeini? Was it because the people were so devout they would only accept a religious leader with opposition credentials? What about Khomeini’s time of exile in Iraq? Saddam was actually assisted to power (like the Shah) by foreign secret services including the CIA. Why would Khomeini be so much safer in Iraq?
My own observations and years of experience since have convinced me that the Islamic ‘revolution’ was entirely staged for the same reasons that the Taliban was created, to revision a society and ready it for war-making programs and demonizing on the world’s stage.
Furthermore, my personal involvement with these events has revealed how deceitful the histories written have been… such as complete fabrication of events with believable but entirely fallacious character profiles.
Iran is a pawn in the game of genocide. The Iran-Iraq war, largely administered for the fun and profits of the world’s elite was being run in Iran by German secret services and in Iraq by the CIA.
Iran today, like times before, is an exercise in the war-maker’s art. And the people of Iran have as little to do with events unfolding in their lives as you and I do with the GMO programs that put sub-standard food on our shelves and bankrupt local economies around the world.
Don’t kid yourself; the US has targeted Iran for “regime change” ever since it was unceremoniously booted out in 1980 and the hypocrisy of client statehood exposed by the Iranians reclaiming their land. Alas, Iran has since been an obsession for US leaders and their faithful far-right and zionist followers.
The evidence is stacking up and it’s ugly:
They didn’t plan regime change “after” 9/11, but before. Indeed, many believe 9/11 has all the tell-tale signs of being a massive crime to instigate an aggressive foreign policy, a “new Pearl Harbor” which is to say, a staged event, just like Pearl Harbor was allowed to happen by the highest offices. In the case of 9/11, it is even more disturbing to read about the details and unanswered questions.
It’s all about the OIL. Who was part of Cheney’s Energy Task Force and what was the nature of those meetings? Why were they pouring over maps of the middle east?
Why was the Patriot Act written BEFORE 9/11?
This tidbit from this piece may give some clue about who is controlling whom:
“Instead the Rumsfeld paper argued that the U.S. should target states which had supported anti-Israel forces such as Hezbollah and Hamas.”
And this right after 9/11 - ?
Madness, sheer madness. That’s all I can think of to say.
What I want to know is when will we have A regime change in the U.S.?
Isn’t there a law against making money off of your crimes? Feith is so typical of those in government who take part in criminal activities and then get religion or a book deal. And we are supposed to admire him…??? If you want to read the book, get it in the library, don’t pay for it.
Feith says: Rumsfeld and Deputy Secretary of Defence Paul Wolfowitz wanted to take down included Iraq, Iran, Syria, Libya, Sudan and Somalia. Why didn’t Feith say something when it could have made a difference and before so many Iraqi and American lives are lost?
The lunatics who are running our country must be stopped. Why should we the people pay for and die for these mad schemes of domination by a handful of evil old rich white men? It is totally insane.
Thanks to anyone in the press who prints stories or airs stories about this. (For TV, that means thanks Amy, John, Steven and Keith - end of list). Thanks to any politician who exposes, denounces and refuses to support such goals. (I have not heard that from Obama, Clinton, or McCain).
…Syria, Libya, Sudan and Somalia targeted. No blood for oil! (Olive oil?) Israel’s partisans are the problem.
There is no doubt in my mind that the neoconmen knew that the 9/11 attacks were coming and allowed them to succeed to the degree that they did. I’m also convinced that they enhanced the damage in NYC through controlled demolition. I am not entirely convinced that they arranged for the attacks in the first place.
However, if the identities of the hijackers were contrived, as some say, then why would the official stories have 15 of them Saudis, two from the UAE, one Egyptian, and one Lebanese? If they were being made up, why not make them Iraqi, Afghani, and Iranian?
“War is still the only game worth playing.”
Cyrus Samrad, Iranian industrialist, foreign secret service collaborator and US State Department favorite.
The war games of the elite consider the ‘riff raff’ of nations, disposable goods.
Said with a grin, “My people are happier when they are hungry, they don’t complain so much.” Cyrus Samrad
Could the international elite find a better ‘comprador’ to administer their interests?
What do you think such people think and do when they operating in this country and other places outside Iran? Their money is being used to bribe local officials, and engage in many other heinous crimes to defeat community vitality and maximize their own profits and fun.
But, these are not the Iranian people, they are the parasitic Iranian super-elite and the very ones who help set the stage for the Iranian masses to be genocided.
I knew it…after mission accomplished was proclaimed the same charges were levied against Syria and when I pointed out they were next in line, everyone said I was crazy.
The IMMANENT attack on Iran was planned years ago. Just like the invasion of Iraq. And there have been plans to occupy Saudi Arabia on the drawing boards ever since the Oil Crisis of 1975.
Why else do you think so much air time is given to the saber-rattling rhetoric of Bushco cronies, as documented by the now revealed depths of former military officers acting as a MSM echo chamber? Why do you think so much military hardware is floating off the coasts of Iran and Syria? Why do you think Hillary Clinton is so enthusiastic about the HYPOTHETICAL chance to ‘obliterate’ Iran?
Even if Iran immediately allowed US (CIA) weapons inspectors into the LEGAL nuclear facilities, the US would still be arguing that the government of Iran was hiding something.
PNAC planned for all of this, but knew the American populace, disillusioned by the Viet Nam debacle, would be gunshy to commit to a land war in Asia without being SPECIFICALLY GUIDED by an act of well orchestrated outrage, ‘a new Pearl Harbor.’
Then 9/11 happened.
Right on cue.
And this ENTIRE enterprise ABSOLUTELY DEPENDS on one thing.
Petroleum. And the access and control of it. Oil is passing the point of easy extraction and refining. Those of you who are sure to doubt me, ask yourself why NO new oil refineries have been built in 25 years? Ask why in November of 2007, OPEC quietly announced that ‘world demand had exceeded world supply’? Ask why no new ‘monster’ oilfields have been discovered since the 60’s?
Our ENTIRE Western Society DEPENDS ON OIL!
Without oil, and without unfettered access to oil, the Western Economies crash to the ground.
The events of 9/11 were a carefully staged false flag operation. In truth, the US military turned a blind eye, as ordered, while the Bush cabal attacked and murdered 2800+ citizens. Then blamed the entire event on a KNOWN AND DOCUMENTED CIA ASSET!
The so-called ‘9/11 terrorist attack’ was nothing more than a carefully staged and then covered up event to make the invasion and occupation of Middle Eastern oil rich nations ACCEPTABLE to the VERY gullible American public, who desperately want to believe that their government is not capable, or indeed culpable, in the commission of that terrible attack.
1) If you plot this on a map, it draws a nice protective circle around Saudi Arabia. Of course that’s silly now that the world has gone global and borders are more mythical than ever, but it’s interesting.
2) Many elements of the so-called “PATRIOT” act had been rejected before 9/11 as going too far, and eliminating civil rights. Only in the (illusory) panic afterwards were the Bushies able to rush it through, mostly unread by congress.
3) Betraying your country for personal gain, especially when you are an elected official is Treason, pure and simple.
IMPEACH!
Indict and imprison Rumsfeld!
“And this ENTIRE enterprise ABSOLUTELY DEPENDS on one thing.
Petroleum. And the access and control of it.”
Wrong again! Oil dependency itself was a planned outcome. Truly one needs to go back yet further to watch how various programs in different parts of the world perfectly dovetailed to bring about near world-wide oil dependency.
Oil production in the Middle East has ALWAYS been a highly controlled industry. Puppet regimes are in place to provide a credible shield for the machinations of international corporate interest. And they have no power whatsoever to affect oil production, pricing or distribution.
You are told they have but it is false. What moneys Saudis (and others) receive for oil, is spent according to strict guidelines established by international elitist interests; what they consider innocuous or beneficial-to-themselves expenditures.
Since early last century, all Middle Eastern oil (and the phony political institutions set-up to provide cover) has been controlled by the same European cartel and their American partners.
The economic justification for political unrest (fostered by the elite) is just another smokescreen and one being used to make war (genocide) more palatable to those being sent to fight it or being taxed to support it.
These ridiculous lies have all have one thing in common; they help create the illusion that war has some economic or political justification outside the interests of a tiny group of elite war-planners.
War profits are huge! But the exercise of totalitarian power is the real interest of those who orchestrate wars. Those who are its victims are left completely incapacitated and readied for ‘new’ scripting. Think about it.
Genocide is the process whereby the aspirations and potentials of individuals and/or groups are defeated. It involves numbers of community-defeating programs, all of which we can witness being used to defeat any hope of sustainability or individuality in people around the world, and Iran is certainly no exception.
Until the idea of government as a good for the people is replaced with an understanding of our actual government as a protection for an elite power model to maintain and extend control, we have no hope of understanding the total lies from which all wars (genocides) spring.
Indeed, 9/11 (as pretty much everyone knows) was an ‘inside job’. It helped provide justification for intensifying the genocide in Iraq and facilitated the surveillance programs and terror programs that have all but silenced genuine opposition to this international Nazi War Machine.
All of the real people are screwed. It seems pretty damn clear that all governments and all military assets are controlled by the rich filth of the world. And this has been going on for 100 years or longer. We are now just at the “end stage”. It’s not just about control of oil. It’s not just about money or power. It’s about TOTAL control of EVERYTHING!
And I don’t know what to do about it anymore.
One thing the rich filth hadn’t counted on was food shortages coming so soon. They also are probably a little surprised by the timing of the upcoming worldwide economic collapse. Maybe we can’t collectively turn this gigantic monster of a ship around, but the iceburg of reality is coming into view. I really think this Titanic is going down soon. It’s time to man your community life boats! It’s time to get out of steerage and get up on deck!
The best laid plans of mice and men…….Look out below!
itsaNaziWorldOrder: Thanks SO much for your input today. You are definitely contributing to my knowledge of “reality” and how to make the puzzle pieces fit together.
“One thing the rich filth hadn’t counted on was food shortages coming so soon. They also are probably a little surprised by the timing of the upcoming worldwide economic collapse.”
They not only count on it, they have orchestrated it! Recently a documentary called “The World According to Monsanto” came out, and then was removed from Google video. Try to find it. It is one of the most important documentaries you will ever watch.
I also generally post this link on hunger from Food First http://foodfirst.org/en/12myths It is an excellent treatment of the subject and quite credibly reveals that most of the assumptions we have been taught regarding food shortages are balderdash.
As for economic collapse…
I was in Argentina a few years after the peso collapsed. There I met a man, Jim Sass, who was a retired naval officer and whose wife was a former US embassy attaché’ and who had worked in US embassies in Russia and China.
Wow! What stories I could tell! Suffice it to say that they were in Argentina picking over the recently fallen plums (farms, wineries, etc.) and making international deals with the spoils. One day after taking us to see his new and fabulous estate, he said rather proudly, “I was the one who came up with the plan for the collapse of the peso!” (So, those of you who thought it was due to Argentina’s corrupt politicians and other bunglers of state… well, they would not be there if they were not willing to be complicit… but Argentina’s peso tanked due to a ‘low-intensity warfare’ hit, plain and simple!)
What benefit does this have for the people of the US? Absolutely none! For, it is also in the interests of these megalomaniacs to insure uncontested markets for their ill-gotten goods… which means local economies are undercut to insure a market monopoly/dominance.
__________
Thank you Rebel Farmer.
For more on the “Big” picture:
www.shareintl.org
A new world is in the making, and we are all invited to partipate.
To Rumsfeld:
You are cordially invited to come over to my house to play Xbox.
You can make all the wars you want, you’ll never die because you’re always “born-again” and the controllers vibrate when you blow stuff up, which is neat.
And in order to make it all end, all you have to do is push “Power.”
Please bring dip, ’cause I’m out.
XOXO
The current war may be about oil, but let’s not forget that conflict with the Middle East now is a thousand years ongoing and it’s about religion. When George Bush calls the invasion of Iraq a “crusade,” when 30% of Americans are Christian evangelicals who think Muslims should be killed, and when the U.S. government is perceived as infiltrated by Jews, what are Muslims to conclude?
It’s a free-for-all in Iraq for oil - the U.S. and its corporations want it, the Chinese want it, the Kurds, the Sunnis and the Shiites are all fighting over it. But in the broader war of cultures, Christian vs Muslim, Osama bin Laden, or his ghost, has the U.S. exactly where he wants it: moribund in a losing war that will bankrupt the U.S. - and the Muslims are winning this war. When they have destroyed the value of the dollar, or led the U.S. to destroy the dollar itself by its own foolishness, only then will the thousand-year war be over.
Every U.S. occupied country on the planet and the people of every U.S. imposed dictatorship are cheering for the Iraqis in this fight. If the U.S. withdraws or threatens to withdraw from Iraq then a new 9/11 will be executed on the U.S. mainland to drag the U.S. back in for its destruction. Muslims can manipulate the moronic U.S. population as well as BushCo does.
Bush wants war, bin Laden wants war, and the war will go on for many years. It will definitely expand to Iran and will engulf the entire Middle East, driving the price of oil to phenomenal levels and destroying the U.S. economy. Make your plans accordingly.
America sucessfully Targeted Iran for Regime Change decades ago. Just ask Kermit the Roosevelt or any Persian who remembers the torment of our Shah.
By the Rules of Recopricity it is America that should be overthrown.
It’s looking like that is happening and Iran has not needed to lift a finger, not even an opinion finger, because we have done ourselves in - unaided by anything but greed and hypocracy.
“The current war may be about oil, but let’s not forget that conflict with the Middle East now is a thousand years ongoing and it’s about religion.”
Wars throughout the world including the Middle East are certainly more than a thousand years old and they have NEVER been about religion… but, religion has certainly been used time and again to embroil the unwitting in the war-making machinations of the empire builders.
Let’s look at recent history… Afghanistan.
The Taliban are being funded with American and British funds distributed with the help of Pakistani intelligence. Brezinski is generally credited with the plan to convert Afghanistan to a nation of ‘Islamic’ fanatics.
Textbooks to help revision Afghanistan to a ‘fundamentalist’ Islamic state were written in Michigan!! Sociologists, psychologists, anthropologists and others are often involved in research and projects that are funded and/or guided by military interests.
Minority tribes in Vietnam were studied by US professors at Berkeley for instance during US involvement there to better understand how to approach minority groups (and enlist their support) to facilitate the general chaos being implemented across Indochinese societies.
Religion is a tool of social demarcation, factioning. It is played and highlighted as the case may be to increase mis-understandings between and fear in target populations. Another useful tool in the war-makers chest is Gladio-style terrorism. Random acts of incredible violence that can then be blamed on the group one is attempting to demonize (9/11 is a perfect case in point).
A few years back, as many will remember, Iraqi terrorists were caught and Oops! They turned out to be British agents!
Check out documentary on one of the biggest users of petroleum - and makes many death dealing chemicals from it.
‘The World According to Monsanto”
Here is the youtube link to the MONSANTO WORLD documentary part 1
Shocking World By Monsanto - Must see!!! - Part 1
http://youtube.com/watch?v=CiPW7EKn8nY
Wow- the conspiracy afficionado’s really came out of the woodwork on this one.
Still waiting to read the TRUTH about chemtrails!!!! LOL!!1
“By the Rules of Recopricity it is America that should be overthrown.”
‘America’ is being overthrown. Our currency is being eroded, and since I had been told it would be brought to ten percent of its current value (that was three years ago), I think we are only in the beginning phase.
Opportunity (capital investment) outside the corporate structure is tightly controlled by a banking establishment that is fully integrated within the military/polices state hierarchy.
Everywhere across society the military is stepping in to offer ‘jobs’ to those who can’t find work.
The sustainability of communities is under complete attack and the corporations have nearly vanquished all independent operators… FBI surveillance is regular around the clock with high-tech laden reconnaissance flights over all major US cities.
And on and on and on…
What can we do? First, nothing stupid. COINTELPRO is alive and well and much better funded with many more agents at work and much more surveillance and offensive tools at its disposal, and government sponsored assassinations are still undertaken in American society.
http://www.monitor.net/monitor/9905a/jbcointelpro.html
Iran will be attacked by the criminal regime of G.W. Bush, et al before summer.
Two hundred dollar a barrel oil is a certainty.
itsaNaziWorldOrder You speak like a former foreign service officer… is that the case?
“Wow- the conspiracy afficionado’s really came out of the woodwork on this one.”
My credentials are very solid. I have to go to a meeting but you can ask whatever you like by way of verification and I will answer when I return.
My reports (commnets) are focused on experiences I personally had with some of people who were certainly key players behind the scenes of community shattering events.
Hollywood has made too many Rambo movies ! You Americans believe that bullshit crap that comes out of the make believe world of movies. You wanna take down Syria, Iran, Iraq, and as things yturn out all that gee whiz bang weaponry is all such expensive kids’ toys. They don’t do nothing ! Just a lot of aimless explosions that killed millions of civilians !
The GI is a worthless chicken shit nothing fighting soldier ! You GIs are best for the HEN HOUSE. Fighitng ? Leave it to our glorious PLA (People’s Liberation Army of China).
Keyinside- So what is your take on all that has happened in the past 8 years? Please detail what you think is behind the recent events and invasions.
And remember, the DEFINITION of conspiracy is two or more people agreeing on a course of action. ‘Conspiracy’ literally means ‘to breathe as one’.
The term ‘Conspiracy Aficionado’ or ‘Conspiracy Theorist’ is an intellectual slap in the face meant to shut down an argument you refuse to participate in. Doing so is little more than an admission of close-mindedness and an unreasoning reliance on the status quo.
Remember Tom Wolfe’s phrase, “masters of the universe?” He’s pretty conservative, but I’ll bet he would agree it applies here.
Galen: You go guy! Well said. I was speechless after reading Keyinside’s remark. I just took him for a troll.
itsaNaziWorldOrder: I agree with most of what you say. I also believe that it will be impossible to stop “sustainable communities” when people can’t buy food at the local grocery store. That can be caused by the fact that they can’t afford the food or the shelves are empty. The reasons don’t matter much. The effect is the same. For me it is interesting to know how and why we got here. It’s even useful to know what these monsters will do next. But the fact is that an empty belly trumps even the fear of a nuclear attack. Relocalized communities will be the only hope for survival.
I have not yet watched The World According to Monsanto”, but it is on my to-do list. Link here: http://bestdocumentaries.blogspot.com/2008/03/world-according-to-monsanto.html
I also suggest that folks learn about how the Russians managed when their economy collapsed in the 90’s. A good start is with Dimtry Orlov. His blog is here: http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/ . Go down to his articles on the right side. I think he has a lot of good insights about what America is going to face in the not to distant future.
Another interesting read is James Howard Kunstlers “World Made by Hand”. It’s a fictional story that takes place about 30 years from now in upstate New York after the collapse of America.
The U.S. government is just a tool used by the elite to make more money and get more power.
wise guy
“There is no doubt in my mind that the neoconmen knew that the 9/11 attacks were coming…”.
Well, I suppose that could be, but considering their track record, their incredible ignorance of the Middle East, the fact that they have seriously fucked up everything else they have tried to do, and a propensity for stupidity above and beyond the call of duty, I just don’t know. I mean, when the odds rendered by statistical analysis says these guys should get something right occasionally, strictly on the basis of chance, and they still fuck it up - That is like a reverse ‘Midas Touch’ - Everything these assholes do turns to shit.
I think you are giving them too much credit.
Galen
“And remember, the DEFINITION of conspiracy is two or more people agreeing on a course of action. ‘Conspiracy’ literally means ‘to breathe as one’.”
See, Galen, this is where you and logic part company. The only way for you to keep a secret is to tell nobody.
You ask us to believe that a secret held by thousands has been perfectly kept (and in the utter absence of proof to the contrary). It simply beggars the imagination and defies human nature. Nixon couldn’t keep a secret limited to 5 people, and he was one of the most paranoid people that ever lived.
“Feith reveals that Rumsfeld’s paper called for getting ‘Syria out of Lebanon’ as a major goal of U.S. policy.”
Has this little tidbit been mentioned in the investigation into the assassination of Rafik Al-Hariri?
paxforall, Sudan, Somalia, Libya and Syria do have oil, in varying degrees. Before you accuse Israel of controlling US policy, explain why Sudan and Somalia are a threat to Israel?
wise guy- I too used to wonder why they made the 9-11 hijackers Saudi instead of Iraqi. I now think it’s part of a longer range plan.
The yahoos didn’t care that it was Saudis and not Iraqis said to have been the hijackers. They actually still believe it was Iraqis. Those who pay more attention have been screaming for years about the Saudis. Remember Farenheit 9-11?
The US owes Saudi Arabia and China trillions of dollars. How are we ever going to pay our debt?
Say there is no plan to. Say Saudi Arabia demands payment, or switches to euros instead of dollars to trade in oil. Bingo. The ground has been set. All of a sudden, the corporate media will rediscover the Saudi connection! Outrage will ensue. Saudi Arabia will be bombed and the sheiks overthrown.
And the people of Tibet, who became part of China in 1959 will suddenly be found to be oppressed. Oh wait, that’s already happening.
You think they can’t manufacture outrage years later? Look at Saddam Hussein. He gassed his own people!! He gassed his own people!! Ad nauseum. And you never heard in the corporate media that he gassed his own people 15 years before, with American approval.
What is Feith trying to do here? Spread the blame to the uniformed leadership so he and the neocons can rehabilitate themselves? Its pure BS. George H W Bush had to hold these nuts at bay for four years and they must have gone crazy waiting for the Clinton years to end. I’ll bet the only thing he’s got right is Rumsfeld. (Now that he’s used up, why not?.)
Yes! Blame it on Rumsy and the Uniforms! Poor neocons just wanted to help with the policy.
The neocons got their stooge, Dubya, in the White House, their minders in the Pentagon and State Department, and they got what they wanted. But it turned into a big mess and now they are trying to wriggle out.
Any truth to the story that Rove told Charlie Rose the democrats wanted to start the war and the White House felt obliged to go along?
what a wonderful world we live in…………..you better start loading up on non perishable foods and water…NOW !!!!!!!!!
This one is carrying me away. I will be required to respondumadseriatum.
This is much more than we’ve “known for years” TonyR. This makes prevarication out of lies. It’s the difference between saying something is true and being too stupid to know it isn’t, and calculating the circumstances in which the lie is to be told so as to achieve the intended effect. It turns ignorance into malice, for instance, what did Colin Powell know if this when he spoke to the UN?
I can confirm that the tale itsanazi tells as being the same told me in 1963 by a group of semi-ex-patriate Iranian lads I met as a young college freshman in a sewing circle. The Shah’s government existed entirely for the purpose of managing various US business and political activities in service of the best interests of those “americans”.
Curmudgeon, you’re just too much, though you do seem to have changed stripe since last I wrote. As to the innuendo in your piece, it may simply be the generalization which means to provide plausible deniability of the document, rather than the inference you wish to be drawn. Something which makes it Tony’s “same old story” in terms of trying to rouse public awareness. It begs the question of whether either interpretation makes the world a safer place.
But, to iterate and reiterate, cousin Revere: Any effort at the regime change of which you speak, other than maybe the general election, is the trap the neocons have set for W to declare open martial law while adding to his 32% approval rating. I fear the answer may lie at best in the oathes some of these folks have taken, with particular emphasis on the military. Extra-constitutional acts of certain sorts maybe that which flips the military one way or the other. There are more than a couple brass hats who are pretty fart smellers, I mean smart fellers, and have discipline, integrity, loyalty and so forth. They all hated Rumsfeldt. The last thing we need right now is a bunch of trust fund babies with bombs. Hell, we don’t even have a leader of the loyal opposition yet. So, not knowing our direction we increase speed? Let’s just get our pices in order, first things first, and be able to say we tried the high road as hard as we could. Go read Smedley Butler.
““Defend us?” from what?”
From an unhappy AIPAC. What else?
“You ask us to believe that a secret held by thousands has been perfectly kept (and in the utter absence of proof to the contrary).”
My personal experience with the ‘need to know’ community is that they keep secrets incredibly well. One of the reasons that has occurred to me for this is that they love identifying as one of those ‘in the know’ (and chosen to play ‘in the game’ too).
Somehow this translates into making them feel ’special’ and empowered.
BTW, these qualities are a matter of assessment for many psychological tests. So there is not as much risk as one might guess.
Do you really suppose that FBI undercover operators go to the local bar and talk about their top secret stalking and surveillance operations? What about top secret biological warfare experiments? Or past MK-Ultra experiments? etc., etc., etc.
Being a part of a ‘team’ so to speak is sufficient generally to make people WANT to keep those secrets with which they have been entrusted… a matter to many of personal ‘honor’ or accomplishment but also as one very necessary ‘entrance fee’ for be allowed to remain within that select group.
Reporters working on a newspaper often have this sense of ‘being on the inside’ as do many people in many professions. No, keeping a secret, especially one that you share with friends (co-conspirators) is not only easy, for many it is great fun, and important to personal and group bonding.
Thousands of people in on the planning of 9/11? You mean the Ten Thousand Club? Those who managed to pass every security test? Hmm… It’s a badge of personal honor even if only the select initiates can recognize each other.
And, opening ones mouth about a state secret (after taking an oath of secrecy) could get one killed…
US and Israel are the root cause of most evils we are facing today,
In reference to the Iranian ‘revolution’:
“In the end, you will find that England was behind it.”
Cyrus Samrad, 1983
Please consider what role England played in genociding thousands of Indian tribes and nations in the Americas (not to mention the destructions of the natural environments) and the subsequent establishment of ‘democratic’ institutions… and even the funding of BOTH sides of the ‘American’ ‘revolution’…
And now consider England’s role in establishing Israel… a plum by any standards in the war-maker’s tool chest…
If one could look at the picture from all global sides; the US and Israel seem more like instruments than architects, each with their own specialized functions.
As we all know, targeting regime change in Iran is business as usual for the US. Remember how Kermit Roosevelt engineered Mossadegh’s overthrow in l951? You know Kermit - Teddy’s grandson and a CIA agent.
Kinda’ reminds me of the type of female who wonders if she should openly start dating the guy she’s secretly seen behind the scenes, now that her “beloved” husband is dead 3 weeks.
We are essentially just another commonwealth nation of the British Empire, we do the dirt work for them, and our leaders that do good get knighted by the Queen.
You should read “A Century of War” by William Engdahl.
http://nyc.indymedia.org/en/2008/02/94746.html
“It Began in November 1978 with a White House Iran task force that recommended Washington end support for the Shah and replace him with Ayatollah Khomeini, then living in France. It would be by the same type coup that overthrew the Iranian government in 1953 along with broader aims that again are in play in the region.
Key then (and now) was to balkanize the Middle East along tribal and religious lines - a simple divide and conquer strategy that worked in the 1990s Balkan wars. The aim was to create an “Arc of Crisis” that would spread to Central Asia and the Soviet Union. Another 1978 event highlighted the urgency. At the time, the Shah was negotiating a 25-year oil agreement with British Petroleum (BP), but talks broke down in October. BP demanded exclusive rights to future Iranian output but refused to guarantee oil purchases. The Shah balked and was on the verge of independently seeking new buyers with eager ones lined up in Germany, France, Japan and elsewhere.
Washington and London were alarmed and acted. They implemented destabilization plans, starting with cutting Iranian oil purchases. Economic pressures followed, and trained US and UK agitators exacerbated them by fanning religious discontent and overall turmoil. Oil strikes as well were used. They crippled production and made things worse. American security advisors recommended Iran’s Savak secret police use repressive tactics to maximize antipathy to the Shah. The Carter administration cynically protested human rights abuses, and BBC correspondents exaggerated anti-Shah protests to rev up hysteria against him. At the same time, it gave Khomeini an open platform to speak and prevented the Shah from replying.
Things came to a head in January, 1979 when he fled the country, and Khomeini returned to Tehran and proclaimed a theocratic state. Chaos was unleashed, and by May the new regime cancelled plans for further nuclear reactor development. At the same time, Iran’s oil exports were cut off, and the Saudis inexplicably cut their own in January. Spot prices skyrocketed, and a second oil shock ensued that was as deviously conceived as the first one. Then it got worse. In October, newly appointed Fed Chairman Paul Volker unleashed a new scheme that turned calamity into catastrophe by design.
It was a radical new monetary policy on the pretext of “squeezing inflation out of the system.” In fact, it was made-in-Washington fraud to preserve dollar hegemony, make it the world’s most sought currency, and crush industrial growth to let political and financial power prop up dollar strength. Volker succeeded by raising interest rates from 10% to 16% and finally 20% in weeks. World policy makers were stunned, economies plunged into the deepest recession since the 1930s, and the dollar began an extraordinary five year ascent.
The combined effect of oil and Volker shocks took “the bloom off the nuclear rose” and ended its threat to Anglo-American oil supremacy. And if more was needed it came on March 28, 1979 in the middle of Pennsylvania at a place called Three Mile Island. Conveniently, at the same time The China Syndrome was released that fictionalized the ongoing event. The combined effect was public hysteria, and later investigation revealed critical valves had illegally been closed. In addition, FEMA controlled all news to create panic. The scheme worked, and Anglo-American supremacy was reasserted over the industrial and financial world. Nothing is stable forever, however, and within a decade new rumblings would be felt.
Imposing the New World Order
The combined effects of two oil shocks and resulting inflation created a new US “landed aristocracy” while the vast majority of Americans saw their living standards sink. It was the same type scheme Margaret Thatcher imposed on Britain when she declared “there is no alternative.” Preaching free market hokum, she claimed deficit spending was the culprit, not two oil shocks causing 18% UK inflation. Her remedy - kill the patient to save it by cutting the money supply and government spending while sharply hiking interest rates to 17% in weeks, thereby causing depression she called the “Thatcher revolution.” Engdahl had another view saying: “Never in modern history had an industrialized nation undergone such (a counterproductive) shock” in so short a time, except in wartime emergency. Thatcher crushed the economy by design the way Volker did in America.”
The Bilderbergers and TLC want 200 dollar a barrel oil. Striking Iran will get us there, and then they will Volckerize the US economy with high interest rates as in the 80’s and destroy whats left of it, and set the stage for martial law to quell the food riots and One World Government will be ushered in to fill the vacuum.
At the beginning of the Petroleum Interval (say, early 1990s) there was an upward spiral of power: countries fought WITH oil (”oil is the red blood of war”) and they fought FOR oil (WWI was an example). The more you got, the more you could fight, and the more you could fight the more you got. You got strong, you got rich, etc. Now, about 100 years later, we have overshoot and overextension, and a downward spiral is setting in: you fight for oil, but in fighting for it you accelerate your depletion of it; you attack the Middle East (U.S.) but can do so only with an airforce massively dependent on oil; you secure the oil but since you are not a landpower in the ME and are vulnerable without your air power you lose power as your oil runs out…which it has started to do, effectively, since we’re now at the peak. Meaning, you’re stranded in a place where people don’t like you and you’ve screwed their societies and you’re trying to run an air force on coal-derived oil and ethanol and the empire is melting away with surprising speed…
It could all be handled differently. But there are criminals at the helm.
This article prompts the idea that readers think of themselves as viewers of a spectacular cautionary tale, a myth coming to life before their very eyes.
Three patriarchal religions, each with strong dictates that lend enormous suspicion to outsiders, have been holding to their specific belief system, cultivating elaborate rituals for more than 2 millennia. Now the zone each originated has become the world’s foremost hot spot for dangerous conflict bordering on an effect that can easily trigger a calamitous 3rd world war.
This is the moment the belief systems that have led us to this conflated “end zone” MUST be examined by ALL followers. Christian Zealots who think Jesus is about to show up if they kill enough brown people. Jewish zealots who think this holy land idea can lead to some kind of salvation or right to pocket others’ real estate, and Muslim Zealots who similarly adhere to rigid beliefs that exlude the HUMAN rights of others.
Clearly… if we do not learn to put aside our differences in the INTEREST that all have a RIGHT to live, in the HUMILITY that NONE of us can speak for The Infinite (i.e. God, Creator, the Deity, etc) than we may well bring this fantastic human experiment to a sweeping halt. It is THAT serious… again, once religion crosses the line to advocate for another people’s destruction, it has inverted against its intended purpose… there is a MAJOR karma in using the NAME of ANY God (but Mars, that’s his schtick) to go to war. Ignorance of Divine law provides no impunity. Let us stop being polite with fools who tout the beliefs of these institutions as they are courting disaster, deciding on Armageddon for those who do NOT intend that outcome.
““It Began in November 1978 with a White House Iran task force that recommended Washington end support for the Shah and replace him with Ayatollah Khomeini, then living in France.”
I have some points of agreement with this article but, I know the foregoing to be inaccurate. The plan to remove the Shah was in full swing ( a ‘fait accompli’) long before November 1978.
And, the State Department instructed its highest level Iranian collaborators to transfer their assets at least 6 months before the Shah left Iran.
GALEN: I see it exactly the way you do… down to the “luck of the draw” supposed timing of 911.
ITS A NAZI WORLD ORDER: Good postings.
STIV WHITMAN/WISE GUY: You raise important questions, hopefully not rhetorical ones!
MiMiCCS: But you know, plans often have a way of going awry… poor Columbus headed to India thought he discovered the Indies… there are higher forces, greater ends that can shape human means. “There is a Divinity that shapes our ends,” Shakespeare related.
These guys are a little worried now…..
If anyone can, Obama’s the Man!
Much of what Feith says is pretty well laid out in the Project for a New American Century. Their September 2000 report, Rebuilding America’s Defenses, calls for “a revolution in military affairs,” increase in military spending, domination of space, constabulary forces and bases in strategic regions that are combat ready but independent, long term, able to deal with petty tyrants and maintain a strategic peace, nuclear supremacy, military domination so complete that NO country, ever, would be able to challenge the US. It calls for a Pax Americana.
It admits that in the absence of a catastrophic, and catalysing event, a new Pearl Harbor, the changes envisioned would be long and difficult to implement. One year later, we had a new Pearl Harbor with the September 11 attacks, and what followed is nothing less than a revolution in military affairs with many of the bullet points in the report being acted upon. And yes, it pre-dates 9/11 by several years. Cheney and Wolfowitz were working on the basic outline in their Defense Guidance planning years before.
What collapsed WTC 7? How can a 110 story buildings collapse at nearly the speed of gravity? How can a second 110 story building collapse at nearly the speed of gravity in exactly the same manner as the first having suffered damage in a very different way than the first? And building 7, not hit by a plane at all, collapsed at nearly the speed of gravity into its own footprint from fire alone?
Jim Glover wrote: “These guys are a little worried now…If anyone can, Obama’s the Man!”
That’s right. Obama is our savior. He went into politics to help all of mankind. He regularly earns over $1 million a year ($4.2 million in 2007 alone) and gives it all to charity. His record of public service is second to none. Obama IS THE MAN, come to save America and save the world.
Tony Blair was “THE MAN” in 1997, after 18 years of a right-wing government in the UK. He turned out NOT to be the man, but an admirer of Margaret Thatcher.
Obama has already praised Reagan.
Obama is also NOT the man. No one running for president is “the man”, and while everyone thinks democracy means one individual ruling over the rest of us, we will remain enslaved to a corrupt political and economic system waiting for a savior who will never appear.
I am beginning to think the majority of people deserve to be treated like dirt - by politicians and the hyper-wealthy - for being so naive and stupid.
Bush was voted back into power in 2004 to save America from “imminent destruction”, and now Obama is the focus of so much misplaced faith.
Good comments from Galen, ITS A NAZI WORLD ORDER, Siouxrose, and others.
Just for the record, I’ve had my comments blocked in the past for being too explicit and providing links. So now I usually just ask questions. But after years of reading the dark details about 9/11, I have no doubt that it was orchestrated by a faction of the US gov’t. Dick Cheney was running NORAD that day; they changed the rules about who would run NORAD in 2001. Able Danger was tracking/preparing the patsies. No steel frame structure has ever collapsed because of fire. Never.
To get news about that issue or peak oil, I go to other web sites.
9-11 on this site: you can talk about in the comments, but don’t expect it to be discussed in the main articles. I’ve written to complain: no answer, no results, nothing.
It’s not as if I expect Commondreams to adopt the same view as mine on 9-11 (inside job). I don’t care what view they adopt. But I think it’s a disgrace that they won’t publish a single article by a single one of the leading resesarchers on 9-11, while they have no hesitation in publishing drivel by “debunkers” who don’t know the topic well at all. So much for open discussion.
My mind’s made up, don’t bother me with facts.
1. The only thing that hit WTC7 was smoke.
2 And it fell into it’s own footprint at free-fall speed after Larry Silverstien said “Pull It.” On camera.
3. But WTC7 was not addressed in the 9-11 commission report.
4. Israeli’s were set up AHEAD OF TIME in New Jersey to film the impacts. These ZIO-NAZI’S WERE VIEWED CHEERING THE IMPACTS AS THEY OCCURRED, AS THEY FILMED THEM, (FROM ATOP A VAN WITH FALSE MARKINGS)
5. They were apprehended then quietly released.
These are known facts.
They leave little to the imagination except the details.
“…you can talk about in the comments, but don’t expect it to be discussed in the main articles. I’ve written to complain: no answer, no results, nothing.”
I’ve written to complain as well… same no response.
“Just for the record, I’ve had my comments blocked in the past for being too explicit and providing links.”
Me too. Then someone else asked me to email my comments to him so that he could try to post them… and the same thing happened to him… and then he sent me the results of his search that revealed that this problem is not so unusual… CD has even been removing comments days after they were published… and in one case… believe it or not, EDITED my comment! allowing only a part to get published!
I call it the “Semblance Society”. What is important is what can be made to ‘seem’ actual, rather than what is actual. It ‘seems’ there is free speech… so there must be. It ‘seems’ that there is an alternative press, so there must be…
@greenerthanthou May 6th, 2008 5:26 pm
You seem to have a very good understanding of how our media works.
You must have read 1984.
I see that the Pentagram’s surge is working.
“US withdraws 3,500 troops amid surge in Iraq violence”
Are they on their way to Iran?
Fasinating and scary comments tonight by NaziWorldOrder. But like Siouxrose mentioned, there are higher authorities in charge, and a larger plan is taking shape, the march of the ages.
The yuga’s as postulated by Sri Yukteswar, are the ages our planet passes through in their totality, every 24,000 years. There are the decending and ascending element to the Yugas, or great ages. We are in the ascending side of this cycle now, having passed through Kali Yuga (the age of darkness) and into Dwapara Yuga (the age of energy).
As the age of energy ushered in the discovery of electricity, atomic energy, silicon miniturization and global communications, it also brought the ability of mankind to destroy himself with the weapons of his own creativity.
So should the human experiment be allowed to continue?
Are we just playthings for some egotistical game players, who’s God is Mammon?
The Universe is INVESTED in Mankind progressing toward his own self discovery and self realization. If the laws of the ego, the darkness of hate, war, greed, selfishness and murder are to give way to the laws of the soul, Love, kindness, selflessness, hope, charity, temperance and chastity - then the old ways must die. The fall of Kali Yugo is upon us. Lo, watch it fight for its last dying breath.
So as we are witnessing the first signs of cancer in the body of humanity, the question is will it progress like wildfire and consume us in months, or will it creep across us like a long evening shadow, hearlding the end of days.
The Himalayan masters are watching, and waiting. Make your peace now with whatever higher power fancies you, because if you invite God into your life when you are in the summer of your days, he will be there with you during the long winter nights, to comfort you to your last.
First of all, thanks to NaziWorldOrder and Staying_Sane, and all the others who have taken the time to talk about what really happened.
We can talk for ages about UK/US interference in Iran, the fact that going back a hundred years, the UK was raping Iran of it’s natural resources. I would take issue with one point though, and that is the one about the UK being behind all of this. I would say we are involved in it, and are complicit in the lies, subterfuge and violence, but I would suggest that we are following rather than leading.
Tony Blair said something after 9/11, which went a bit like this - the kaleidoscope has been shaken, the pieces are in a state of flux, before they are allowed to settle, we have the chance to change things. I believe that Blair was referring to some kind of “new World order”.
When I voted for Blair and New Labour in 1997, little did I know, that he was more Conservative than the existing Tories. He came to power, by courting the City of London, and by getting the Murdoch press on his side. He distanced himself from the trade union movement, ignored the ideals of the Labour party and shunned the working class electorate who voted for him.
A couple of years ago, a UK TV channel showed a documentary about the secretive “Bilderburg group”, and one thing which stood out, was the fact that, if you were to be in the running to lead a country, then you would be vetted by this group.
Something very evil is in our midst, a controlling power, which crosses borders, religion and race.
Is it possible, that the main reason for the current crisis surrounding Iran, has little to do with it’s nuclear programme, but everything to do with Iran’s decision to stop trading oil in US dollars? I ask this question, because Sadaam Hussein was going to do the same thing, Chavez in Venezuela may well consider it.
Regarding the Iranian Revolution;
Their was no ‘plan’ by the US to remove the Shah and replace him with Khomeini.
When the Savak could no longer suppress the masses they rioted in Tehran Square,
The Shah ordered his Generals to machine gun the waves of people. They refused. The Shah left.
The only plans America had were contingency plans to deal with this; something they abhorred and did not facilitate.
Persia….
AndyUK wrote: “…thanks to NaziWorldOrder and Staying_Sane, and all the others who have taken the time to talk about what really happened.”
I think you’re confusing me with someone else, Andy. My post was pretty short and I didn’t say much. Perhaps you meant “sdemetri”.
However, you’re pretty much correct when you say, “I would take issue with one point though, and that is the one about the UK being behind all of this. I would say we are involved in it, and are complicit in the lies, subterfuge and violence, but I would suggest that we are following rather than leading.”
We are definitely following and assisting America, but we are also acting on our own behalf to assist UK corporations pillage other nations.
I believe wanting to “re-make” the world in one’s image also plays a part. We always fear what is alien to us - and what can be difficult to deal with - so wouldn’t it be nice if the whole world were re-shaped to look the same? At least, that is, if you’re part of the political and economic elite.
So, if Iran acquires nukes, the “re-shaping” of that country possibly goes out the window.
Mark Curtis is a British historian and journalist. Visit his site, www.markcurtis.info, and click on the “UK declassified files” for UK’s involvement in Iran and in other countries.
In his book, “Web of Deceit”, Mark Curtis writes:
“A web of deceit is obscuring…[the] picture. People in Britain are largely unaware of what has been done in their name, even as government policies undermine our own interests. The public’s understanding of Britain’s real role in the world is being obscured by an ideological system – principally, the mainstream media – that is largely accepting at face value New Labour’s rhetoric on its moral purpose.
“The reality is that Britain under New Labour is a systematic violator of international law and ethical standards in its foreign policy – in effect, an outlaw state. It is a key ally of some of the world’s most repressive regimes that is consistently condoning, and sometimes actively aiding, human rights abuses. During a so-called ‘war against terrorism’, Britain is in fact one of the world’s leading apologists for, and supporters of, state terrorism by allies responsible for far more serious crimes than Al Qaida or other official threats. And, in the era of globalisation, Britain under Labour is championing a fundamentalist economic ideology that is promoting the increasing takeover of the global economy by big business.
“Never before has the public of a democratic country been subject to such an extraordinary ongoing tirade of propaganda. For the government is, quite generally, promoting actual policies that are directly opposite to this rhetoric.
“Britain’s real role in the world is a great betrayal of people in this country. I believe they expect the government to uphold the moral values abroad that most people uphold in their daily lives. This is partly why, as I argue in this book, the public is in reality seen by elites as the great threat to pursuing their priorities.”
-
However, I don’t believe there is an unseen “evil power” pulling the strings. Large corporations are in charge, and they are the ones determining the direction of our domestic and foreign policy. Those in power are immoral, so it’s no wonder they commit atrocities to keep corporations happy. CEOs have the power to discredit the government, to cause it much trouble by, for example, threatening to take jobs abroad. Those in power want to stay in power, so they play along.
That said, the government is not merely acquiescing in all this - it is knowingly implementing policies that cede control to corporations (such as the wholesale privatization of everything, which, in Britain, means knocking down perfectly good hospitals - among other publicly owned buildings - so that new ones can be built, owned by corporations), creating a vicious downward spiral that gains more and more momentum as the “game” progresses.
Just something I want to add: “privatization” is really a misnomer in many instances. Before the British railway system was privatized, the government said it couldn’t afford to subsidize this particular form of transport any longer. Privatization was to bring in an infusion of capital. Well, it did! After privatization, the government tripled its subsidies to the railways, money that now went to boost the performance of companies. The CEOs of these firms were then praised for doing such an “excellent” job, and rewarded huge sums by way of a thank you.
- apologies for straying from the topic :o)
It is interesting to read that others have faced the same censorship on this forum as I have–and have fought it. I was unable to post a comment on the last foolish hit piece written by David Rovics that was an Ad Hominem attack on those who are skeptical about the ‘official conspiracy theory’. But it has been a long tradition here on this forum to manipulate the ‘discussion’ to achieve an appearance of agreement or a ‘balance’ that the editors of the forum feel reflects their readership.
As itsaNaziWorldOrder wrote: “The ‘Semblance Society’. What is important is what can be made to ‘seem’ actual, rather than what is actual. It ‘seems’ there is free speech… so there must be. It ‘seems’ that there is an alternative press, so there must be…”
I’ve also had comments removed. No explanation, no apology. Perhaps they are on vacation on this article.
As I’ve suggested to the censors previously, they ought to ADMIT that this forum is moderated and edited. They also ought to lay out their RULES about what words, ideas, and web sites are allowed in the comments and which are banned. The secrecy and bizarre behavior of the editors of the comments is utterly creepy and sickening. I’ve written directly to those people as I’ve tracked them down and they would NOT respond to me.
Who do they think they are? What arrogance! It doesn’t matter if I’m a professor and they are a petty bureaucrat, the mentality is that they don’t even need to respond to me in a civil manner, just silence.
Power, that’s the microcosm of it. Some of us wield it, most of us don’t. I’ve no doubt that people with power often believe that they are doing what is in the best interests of everyone that they have decision-making abilities, that they can silence some, and allow others to speak. Dick Cheney and the censors of this forum have that in common I believe. Call that a common dream.
That said, I am still here, still fighting on a forum where there is a CHANCE of getting a word in on the articles that are published, even though those articles can’t touch some of the critical topics of our era. I’m used to standing above a freeway overpass with a handmade banner. I know what ‘freedom of speech’ means for those who don’t own the press.
Shucks, Pa; If I’m to believe everything I read in these hyar newspapers, I’d get the idea that our country’s tryin’ to take over the whole world.
Well, son. They’re gonna have to do just that cuz when them crooks that’re runnin’ our country right now get done with it, it ain’t gonna bet fit for man or beast. If we rule the world, then we can go anywhere we want and spread our cancerous society. I’ll betcha there are places in the world where some of the folk don’t even know what hate mongering is all about and somebody needs to show ‘em, by golly.
Shucks, Pa; If I’m to believe everything I read in these hyar newspapers, I’d get the idea that our country’s tryin’ to take over the whole world.
Well, son. They’re gonna have to do just that cuz when them crooks that’re runnin’ our country right now get done with it, it ain’t gonna bet fit for man or beast. If we rule the world, then we can go anywhere we want and spread our cancerous society. I’ll betcha there are places in the world where some of the folk don’t even know what hate mongering is all about and somebody needs to show ‘em, by golly.
Here’s my view on this forum and 9-11.
1. The forum frequently deals with topics (like the current article we’re responding to here) in which 9-11 is a key event.
2. So those in charge of it have a duty to try to understand what 9-11 was: who did it, why, etc.
3. They don’t need to take an official position on who did it but if they are a liberal media outlet (in the U.S. these days it’s often going to be called left-wing but in most of the world we’d call it liberal) they owe it to their readers to allow more than one view.
4. That means they should give some space to those who have radically questioned the official narrative. Let the editors be conservative in who they choose: let them demand the writer have a Ph.D.; led them demand the article they reproduce be previously peer-reviewed.
5. If they aren’t willing to do this, and yet in the meantime keep telling us they’re interested in the truth and want our financial support, we have a right to denounce them.
Using 9/11 to play Risk with the Middle East while ignoring bin Laden.
Doesn’t this just piss you right off?
Rummy bragged about standing 10 hours a day. Wonder how many hours he has spent hanging from his thumbs.
The only government that needs replaced is the one we have in Washington! These people are over the top! They already have torn up two countries with their nonsense, made millions homeless, ruined our economy, run the deficit into oblivion, turned us into a rogue nation and killed millions of hapless people! When are American’s going to say enough and put a stop to this????? At one time Saddam Hussein was our friend and look what happened to him!
itsaNaziWorldOrder
“Thousands of people in on the planning of 9/11? You mean the Ten Thousand Club? Those who managed to pass every security test? Hmm… It’s a badge of personal honor even if only the select initiates can recognize each other.”
Three people can’t keep a secret and you’re trying to tell me that ten thousand Americans thought that killing thousands of their fellow citizens and inflicting major damage to the economy was okay, and that no one has had any regrets since.
I agree with you that there are evil people, that want to/have destroyed our civil liberties, dominate us, and create a serf class. But you hurt your credibility by asking me to believe something that is so contrary to my own personal experience with human nature.
I refuse to even discuss the towers with people (the free-fall idiots) that have no engineering/science/physics background because it is like trying to teach a pig to sing - It is a complete waste of your time and all it does is annoy the pig (thanks Robert Heinlein).
Lots of good comments.
Don’t forget the 911 article recently posted drew in over 900 responses! There was NEVER a response in the forum that lasted that long with that many responses. It is definitely a DYNAMITE and thus explosive area of unaddressed inquiry!
JJ PETER: Good post, particularly about the Yugas, a time cycle few Westerners know about or thus understand. My only area of departure is your mention of God as a HIM… I think we should call the force the Infinite or Creator, the word God carries too many patriarchal and limited projections of human male qualities.
As is outlined in the UN Charter, and also the Nuremburg Charter and Geneva conventions, the pre-planned invasion of a sovereign nation for any other reason than responding in self-defense (as in when that nation initiates aggression towards you first) is a War Crime. Further, even the PLANNING of an invasion of a sovereign nation is itself a War Crime.
Thus, there is literal documented proof - aside from our planning and invasion of Iraq - that the U.S. and its neo-con leaders, all the way up to the President himself, engaged in documented War Crimes in direct violation of established US law (since we are signatories of the UN Charter, the Geneva Conventions, and the Nuremburg Charter, they are thus US Laws as defined by the Constitution).
Tell me, again, why impeachment proceedings haven’t been initiated against the Bush administration and all of its senior officials? They are - LITERALLY - War Criminals, and this is not conjecture, it is literal truth, as defined by the Law.
Demonstorm - I totally agree with what you have said. The architects of the Iraq invasion have broken many parts of the UN Charter and Geneva Conventions. It is as if they are laughing at them, and consider them to be inconsequential.
The choice of John Bolton as a former US representative in the UN just shows how much contempt the US shows for the UN. The choice of Tony Blair as “special envoy” to the Middle East just shows how disingenuous we are about trying to bring about peace in the region.
Sorry for those repeats… didn’t think my posts were posting. Moderator can delete the second two.
“Three people can’t keep a secret and you’re trying to tell me that ten thousand Americans thought that killing thousands of their fellow citizens and inflicting major damage to the economy was okay, and that no one has had any regrets since.”
(Not only must we consider the ability of secret service personnel to keep their activities secret, we must remember that NYPD, firemen and many others have been issued gag orders. Also, one only needs glance a short way back into history to see some fairly major projects undertaken quite ‘successfully’ to note how easily the majority can be kept completely in the dark… read; Babi Yar, of particular note the story of a woman escapee from a death camp.)
And we must also understand our global society better. It is not one of ‘nation’ states as much as it is one of ‘states of privilege’. I always find it shocking when I am told that it is not necessary to concern oneself with the entire world, only ten percent of the world (and that ten percent includes no animals outside the human monkey species).
There is something called the ‘ten percent club’ who believe that the interests of the elite are of consequence and the interests of the disenfranchised, of no merit. The ten percent club always wants absolute control over the potentially unruly mob. This was the guiding (and expressed) philosophy of Brezinski.
And now that I have mentioned Brezinski, this name came up surprisingly in a meeting yesterday (in reference to the taking of the hostages in 1979), “I heard that the entire plan was the decision of only three people, Brezinski, a banker and another very wealthy person.”
Now, I was not there and I do not know if this is true. What I do know is that Brezinski has already claimed credit for the program to introduce radical ‘Islam’ into Afghanistan in the 70’s. And I do know that a banker was at the meeting because he personally told me so a day after the hostages were taken.
If this three person meeting actually did occur, I also think I know who the other person would have been. Finally, the safety of the hostages was certainly better assured while they were ‘in custody’.
I am not going to claim that this three person meeting took place because my previous understanding was that there were several people in attendance when the decision was taken… but the meeting about which I was informed could have been the second phase that introduced it to those who were chosen to enact the plan.
“By deception, you will make war”
I really want to understand better what some of you seem to hint at bbut don’t put it into terms that the average person who is informed but has never had personal experience with the “powers that be” can relate to and decipher.
It’s like people who for years have been afraid to mention the word “revolution” when it is at the tip of everyones tongue.
Are we so afraid to come out with what we know? Isn’t there a way people on blogs like this to email each other and get the real story put together?
We’re going to be in a very large hole very soon if someone doesn’t step up tho the plate.
“It’s like people who for years have been afraid to mention the word “revolution” when it is at the tip of everyones tongue.”
The ONLY necessity for positive change is understanding.
Every problem gripping our world finally comes down to operations undertaken in ignorance.
The most ghastly realities; wars (genocides), GMO crops, environmental destruction, and human slavery are symptomatic of a fundamental fallacy regarding human nature and nature in general.
Do you remember the stories of the court societies (in Japan, China, etc.) becoming so disconnected from the general society, so insular and finally so corrupt that they collapsed basically from internal insanity?
That is our situation today. The insanity (dis-association) of the world’s elite has reached a feverish pitch. The crimes enacted each and every day are enough that if there were a GOD he surely would long ago have closed up this shop.
Our problem is not principally that we have madmen running amuck (although the seriousness of this problem cannot be underestimated), but that we are ourselves mad by virtue of inculcation in an insane culture.
If you want a revolution, you must personally lead it (but, this does not preclude natural associations and organized actions with others who are also leaders). As soon as we all accept responsibility for the affects of our actions (and non-actions), peace (and our natural freedoms) will be impossible to forestall.
We have nothing to counter except institutionalized ignorance and the policies that grow from it.
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
Joseph Goebbels
What’s the biggest lie? The one upon which all others rest? The one that has underpinned all elitist war-making societies? http://allinharmony.org
(It took decades of experience, research and reflection to uncover and understand this relationship. And, I do not expect most readers to understand its significance, but, it is correct.)
“It’s like people who for years have been afraid to mention the word “revolution” when it is at the tip of everyones tongue.”
The ONLY necessity for positive change is understanding.
Every problem gripping our world finally comes down to operations undertaken in ignorance.
The most ghastly realities; wars (genocides), GMO crops, environmental destruction, and human slavery are symptomatic of a fundamental fallacy regarding human nature and nature in general.
Do you remember the stories of the court societies (in Japan, China, etc.) becoming so disconnected from the general society, so insular and finally so corrupt that they collapsed basically from internal insanity?
That is our situation today. The insanity (dis-association) of the world’s elite has reached a feverish pitch. The crimes enacted each and every day are enough that if there were a GOD he surely would long ago have closed up this shop.
Our problem is not principally that we have madmen running amuck (although the seriousness of this problem cannot be underestimated), but that we are ourselves mad by virtue of inculcation in an insane culture.
If you want a revolution, you must personally lead it (but, this does not preclude natural associations and organized actions with others who are also leaders). As soon as we all accept responsibility for the affects of our actions (and non-actions), peace (and our natural freedoms) will be impossible to forestall.
We have nothing to counter except institutionalized ignorance and the policies that grow from it.
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
Joseph Goebbels
What’s the biggest lie? The one upon which all others rest? The one that has underpinned all elitist war-making societies? http://allinharmony.org
(It took decades of experience, research and reflection to uncover and understand this relationship. And, I do not expect most readers to understand its significance, but, it is correct.)
“It’s like people who for years have been afraid to mention the word “revolution” when it is at the tip of everyones tongue.”
The ONLY necessity for positive change is understanding.
Every problem gripping our world finally comes down to operations undertaken in ignorance.
The most ghastly realities; wars (genocides), GMO crops, environmental destruction, and human slavery are symptomatic of a fundamental fallacy regarding human nature and nature in general.
Do you remember the stories of the court societies (in Japan, China, etc.) becoming so disconnected from the general society, so insular and finally so corrupt that they collapsed basically from internal insanity?
That is our situation today. The insanity (dis-association) of the world’s elite has reached a feverish pitch. The crimes enacted each and every day are enough that if there were a GOD he surely would long ago have closed up this shop.
Our problem is not principally that we have madmen running amuck (although the seriousness of this problem cannot be underestimated), but that we are ourselves mad by virtue of inculcation in an insane culture.
If you want a revolution, you must personally lead it (but, this does not preclude natural associations and organized actions with others who are also leaders). As soon as we all accept responsibility for the affects of our actions (and non-actions), peace (and our natural freedoms) will be impossible to forestall.
We have nothing to counter except institutionalized ignorance and the policies that grow from it.
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
Joseph Goebbels
What’s the biggest lie? The one upon which all others rest? The one that has underpinned all elitist war-making societies? http://allinharmony.org
(It took decades of experience, research and reflection to uncover and understand this relationship. And, I do not expect most readers to understand its significance, but, it is correct.)
“It’s like people who for years have been afraid to mention the word “revolution” when it is at the tip of everyones tongue.”
The ONLY necessity for positive change is understanding.
Every problem gripping our world finally comes down to operations undertaken in ignorance.
The most ghastly realities; wars (genocides), GMO crops, environmental destruction, and human slavery are symptomatic of a fundamental fallacy regarding human nature and nature in general.
Do you remember the stories of the court societies (in Japan, China, etc.) becoming so disconnected, so insular and finally so corrupt that they collapsed basically from internal insanity?
That is our situation today. The insanity (disassociation) of the world’s elite has reached a feverish pitch. The crimes enacted each and every day are enough that if there were a GOD he surely would long ago have closed up this shop.
Our problem is not principally that we have madmen running amuck (although the seriousness of this problem cannot be underestimated), but that we are ourselves mad by virtue of inculcation in an insane culture.
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
Joseph Goebbels
What’s the biggest lie? The one upon which all others rest? The fundamental ignorance regarding human nature at the root of every elitist-based war-making society?
http://allinharmony.org
(It took decades of experience, and research and reflection on violence and its psychological and social roots to uncover and understand this relationship. And, I do not expect most readers to understand its significance at first, but, it is correct.)
please accept my apologies…
I was not intending to spam this discussion… the repeat posts are due to the fact that I kept getting error messages each time I tried to post and no indication that my post was accepted… so I persisted… and then someone walked in and took my time… until it was too late to undo the damage…
itsaNaziWorldOrder
Even as successful as Goebbels was, there were plenty of people who knew he was full of shit.
….End of Days are most certainly upon us, as our Rogue government lines up Iran next in the crosshairs…but this illegal incursion, as I think we all truly feel deep in our guts, will likely serve as the symbolic tipping-point to America’s pathetic slide into that oh so predictable status of….’just another once great nation only to end up being the latest failed Imerial power’…so who will we pass the imperial torch to now that we are just floundering and are heading in such a wayward direction??….Babylon gave it to the Egyptians, who passed it to the Romans, who advanced it onto Britain, who gave it to us (on loan…really, Britain is still technically the most recent Imperial Power…but couldn’t continue it’s greedy ambitions and misdeeds under its Flag, abroad as it once so eassily could because everyone saw them coming a mile away; so they invented America, and made it seem like it was a refreshingly new Land and altrustic sovergn country that stood for all the mumbo jumbo we have to recite in our pledge of alliegance in our schools….brilliant scheme….except that America got too carried away like a kid in a sandbox with the power-broker-role like a junkie addicted to crack and squandered almost all its credibilty as a moral, upstanding Country to be modeled af