Minnesota College Bans Nobel Laureate Tutu From Talk On Peace and Justice
Last week’s visit by Iran’s president to Columbia University symbolized to many the openness of American higher education to hearing controversial ideas and individuals. An incident coming to light at the University of St. Thomas, in Minnesota, illustrates that some speakers are denied campus platforms. In this case, the would-be speaker isn’t a Holocaust denier. Nor does he run a government that routinely denies basic civil rights to scholars, journalists or gay people.
The speaker barred at St. Thomas won the Nobel Peace Prize.
Archbishop Desmond Tutu, who won the prize for his nonviolent opposition to South Africa’s apartheid regime, was deemed unworthy of appearing at St. Thomas because of comments he made criticizing Israel - comments the university says were “hurtful” to some Jewish people. Further, the university demoted the director of the program that invited Tutu after she wrote a letter to him and others complaining about the revocation of the invitation. (She retains a tenured faculty job.)
While the incident happened several months ago, it has only just become public, when it was reported by City Pages, the alt-weekly in Minneapolis-St. Paul. The revoked invitation has some faculty members at the university seething.
“There isn’t any academic freedom here when this happens,” said Marv Davidov, an adjunct faculty member who has taught courses about nonviolence for 15 years at the university. “This is cowardice.”
Tutu was invited to the university through a program called PeaceJam International, which organizes conferences for high school students on issues related to peace. While the program is not officially a part of St. Thomas, many faculty members — especially in the Justice and Peace Studies Program - are involved in it, and major speakers sometimes appear on the campus, reaching those at the university in addition to the high schoolers in the program. Tutu, invited through the Justice and Peace Studies Program, was to talk at St. Thomas about issues of peace and nonviolence and there was no expectation that his talk would focus on the Middle East.
Doug Hennes, vice president for university and government relations at St. Thomas, said that when administrators were informed of the invitation, they did some research about Tutu, and found that some of his comments had been controversial. Then, the university consulted with some Jewish leaders, and concluded that Tutu had made remarks that had been “hurtful” to Jewish leaders.
“We had heard some criticism of him in the past that he had said things some people judged to be anti-Semitic. We talked to the Jewish Community Relations Council. We know a number of other people in the Jewish community, and they said that some of the things he said had been hurtful and there was a feeling - and this isn’t among all Jews - that he had said things that were hurtful to them,” Hennes said.
“We never made a judgment that he is anti-Semitic. We have not made that judgment. We have only been told by members of the Jewish community that his words have been hurtful,” Hennes said. He stressed that the university sought out the views of Jewish leaders, and that the revocation of the invitation was a university decision, and not one that was sought by anyone outside St. Thomas.
“We make decisions every day on a regular basis on whether to invite people to campus,” Hennes said. Asked if disqualifying people from speaking for being “hurtful” might block many speakers, he said, “That’s not the case at all. We have speakers on a wide variety of issues and interests, including sensitive issues within the Catholic church.” (St. Thomas is a Roman Catholic university.)
“I don’t think this squelches academic freedom,” he said. “We made one decision about an individual.”
The individual in question won the Nobel Peace Prize in 1984 for his work promoting equality in South Africa through nonviolent means. While St. Thomas doesn’t want him to speak, he has been honored by numerous American colleges with honorary degrees.
The comments by Tutu that appear to have set off scrutiny of the invitation came in a 2002 speech in Boston about Israel’s occupation of the West Bank. The Zionist Organization of America has criticized the speech and said that in it, Tutu compared Israel to Hitler. But a transcript of the speech raises questions about that interpretation. In the transcript, published by one of the groups that sponsored the lecture, Tutu is harshly critical of Israel’s government and of the pro-Israel lobby in the United States and expresses regret that some Jews in Israel and elsewhere do not identify with the oppression of Palestinians. But Tutu also explicitly talks about Israel’s right to exist within secure borders.
The transcript released by Sabeel, a Palestinian ecumenical group, does not show a direct comparison between Israel and Hitler. The mention of Hitler in the speech comes during a section in which Tutu urged the audience not to assume that the status quo lasts forever, and in which he urged those listening to challenge to “Jewish lobby” in the United States. “People are scared in this country [U.S.], to say wrong is wrong because the Jewish lobby is powerful, very powerful. Well, so what? This is God‘s world. For goodness sake, this is God‘s world. We live in a moral universe. The apartheid government was very powerful, but today it no longer exists. Hitler, Mussolini, Stalin, Pinochet, Milosevic, and Idi Amin were all powerful, but in the end, they bit the dust.”
Davidov, the adjunct at St. Thomas, said he knew that some people were offended by such comments, but he rejected the idea that all Jews were offended. He noted that he is Jewish, and agrees with Tutu’s remarks and frequently criticizes Israel himself.
Cris Toffolo, an associate professor of political science and until recently director of the Justice and Peace Studies Program, questioned the idea that anyone who makes hurtful comments should be barred from speaking. “There are some things in the world that are just hard to talk about, but when you get past the hurt, you can get to the real issues, and explore those in a way that could move the world to a more just place,” she said.
Toffolo said she believed in the guidelines on controversial speakers distributed by the American Association of University Professors, an approach that says that controversy should never justify keeping away a speaker.
She said that even if some find Tutu’s ideas offensive, that’s no reason to keep him from being heard. Exposing students to controversy, she said, doesn’t endorse any particular point of view. For example, her introductory political theory course, she assigns students to read an excerpt from Mein Kampf. Well aware that Hilter’s manifesto may be hurtful to Jews and others in the course, Toffolo said she has asked students how they feel about the assignment, and she’s been pleased that students find it valuable - and understand why the reading is included.
“They understand that this was part of the debate at that time and we need to know about it,” Toffolo said. “It’s only by confronting all of the realities that we can come to a deeper understanding of any period,” she said.
Toffolo said that she was informed that she was losing the directorship of the program she led, and received a negative evaluation, right after she spoke out against rescinding the Tutu invitation. She said that administrators were very clear with her about the relationship between their decision on her leadership of the program, and the invitation. (Hennes, the St. Thomas vice president, confirmed that Toffolo was removed as chair shortly after she defended the Tutu invitation, but he declined to say why she was removed, citing the confidentiality of personnel decisions.)
“It’s outrageous and it infringes on my academic freedom,” said Toffolo of the university’s decision to strip her of the program director’s position.
While Toffolo’s work does not focus on the Middle East, she said that she saw what happened to her as part of a pattern in which professors who are critics of Israel face difficulty with their careers. “This case is interesting because there are so many faculty members running afoul because of their views on Israeli policy in the occupied territories or U.S. foreign policy in terms of Israel,” she said. “We need to be able to have serious discussions of these issues.”
© 2007 Inside Higher Ed
Perhaps the Catholics of St. Thomas who favored this ban could invites someone to talk about the church’s abysmal failure to speak out against Hitler and the Nazis in WW2, or the current Pope’s Nazi background, or just what the hell they’re doing today to stop the apartheid in Palestine. The University of St. Thumbuptheirass just earned themselves a tidy footnote in the history book of hypocricy.
This coming from the university that employs a lawyer who helped write the Bush admin torture policy. His name is Dilahunty, he teaches at St. Thomas law school at the Mpls. campus.
Torture and the Jesuits-the history goes back to the Inqisition. Is that hurtful or would discussing it help St. Thomas make better choices?
Perhaps St. Thomas can invite him and then berate him with lies in the introduction. Or maybe Tutu can cross the street and speak at Macalester.
More evidence that these folks pander to the Jewish lobby…..Welcome to the United States of ISRAEL!
If you don’t feel sure you understand the history of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict, then here is a great source to read and pass along to your contact lists:
http://www.wrmea.com/jews_for_justice/index.html
Perhaps Tutu should be thankful he doesn’t have to step into such a hateful lion’s den of hypocrites.
Why do they not call University of St. Thomas the University of AIPAC?
LOL, he made comments that were “hurtful”…Why does the old adage keep popping into my head “the truth hurts”…
Jeeze! This has got to be in the “you can’t make shit like this up category”!
Every now and then I get this wierd feeling that people in the US are going collectively off the wall and into the trashcan bonkers!
If Tutu was to speak within fifty miles from where I live, and the car was broke, and the trains and busses were on strike and it was snowing, I would walk my 66 year old butt over to see him and be glad just to get in even if I had to stand in the back of the auditorium.
This is getting crazy. Why not just contract out the whole US university system to the Israel lobby. It would make the system much more efficient. They could design the programs, hire the professors, invite the speakers. Once they replace Middle Eastern Studies with Israel Studies, filter out the Finkelsteins and Al-Hajes at the job application stage, create a list of “acceptable” guest speakers before anyone gets mis-invited, run all academic freedom policies by the Likud Party before they’re promulgated, all this “controversy” would be eliminated.
Desmond Tutu has committed the one great unforgiveable sin in the eyes of the Greater Israel (USA). You can lie, torture, invade sovereign countries, slaughter thousands but you cannot utter a critical word against Israel.
It might be pointed out the Israel’s support for apartheid was “very hurtful” to the majority of South African. It is also “hurtful” to education for them to bare anyone who may make “controversial” statements. It could also be “hurtful” to Jews to be seen as censoring all criticism of Israel.
And the Zionists complain about the undue influence of the Christian right! All extremes are sickening. Money from religion should be kept out of education because it poisons the philosophy of the institution. Higher education should be financed like public education. Tax supported based on enrollment. That might keep lobbyists and their pressure out. If we ever get rid of this administration and stop corporate based warring, there will be plenty of money for this. Especially if the corporations were made to pay the taxes they should be paying.
GAWD SAVE AMERICA?!
Let’s get the nuns’ take on this.
Awww, their widdle feelings were hurt because Israel was dared to be criticized. I guess we know who runs the United States, and it’s not the American people.
Didn’t the UN ban the peaceful, nonviolent Dalai Lama a couple of times for fear of Chinese displeasure? It seems peace and nonviolence are bad things in today’s America. After reading some of the Dalai Lama’s writings, it’s safe to say that he has never said anything bad about the Chinese. He teaches forgiveness and compassion. So why ban him??
St. Thomas is a great university that seems somewhat ill informed about recent events, if the law professor who helped John Yoo write memo(s) justifying illegal and immoral acts of torture and the refusal to allow Bishop Tutu to speak the unfortunate truth about Israel’s treatment of the Palestinians are any indication.
I would suggest that it ask its own Peace and Justice Studies Department to offer informational workshops for faculty, staff and perhaps members of the local Jewish community. St. Thomas, like most of America, unwittingly accepts the propaganda that AIPAC et al. have put forth for half a century. AIPAC teaches Americans that to disagree with Israel’s ACTIONS is to hate Israel and all Jews. Hence all the virulent charges last year that Jimmy Carter was anti-Semitic because he wrote a book telling the truth about Israel’s illegal land-grabs and its brutal occupation and subjugation of the Palestinian people. He was not harming Israel, but rather seeking simple justice for the Palestinians.
I hope St. Thomas will consult with Jewish peace groups in the US and Israel that seek Israel’s removal from every piece of Palestinian land; the right of return for refugees; the release of the 10,000 prisoners held in Israeli jails; and the right of each person to a decent life. Having educated themselves, I hope they then beg Bishop Tutu to visit and speak.
Look one more time at the first sentence of the article: “Last week’s visit by Iran’s president to Columbia University symbolized to many the openness of American higher education to hearing controversial ideas and individuals.”
What an unbelievable crock. The Columbia event was more like a lynching, than a symbol of “openness.”
The article also says up-front that criticizing Israel is in effect forbidden: “Archbishop Desmond Tutu….was deemed unworthy of appearing at St. Thomas because of comments he made criticizing Israel - comments the university says were ‘hurtful’ to some Jewish people.”
Just imagine if this standard were applied to Bush, or to the Iraq War — both of which are “hurtful” to “some people.”
My e-mail to St. Thomas last night:
“To Whom it May Concern,
I just read the Star Tribune article that St. Thomas canceled a speaking appearance with Desmond Tutu. How is it that we can criticize Greenland, New Zealand, Brazil, Timbuktu, even the United State of America? But somehow Israel is above all critical commentary?
I’m a lifelong Minnesotan, and branches of my family settled here in 1857 before Minnesota even joined the Union. I’ve got a couple young kids. Needless to say I won’t be sending them to St. Thomas until you can demonstrate a commitment to free inquiry — and do not insult a Nobel laureate this way because of a small (wealthy contributors I assume) group of people. They are not even Christian. Holy mackerel. “
“In this case, the would-be speaker isn’t a Holocaust denier.”
And neither was President Ahmadinejad, OK? He is merely questioning the unique and mythic status it has been conferrred for the purpose to quash any criticism of Israel or Zionism.
But back to the matter at hand, we need to clog this this St Thomas Universities phone lines and e-mail server with expressions of outrage.
Timely:
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/10/04/4306/
If you haven’t already, contact these people NOW!
http://www.stthomas.edu/academicaffairs/
They barred Desmond Tutu? They’ll be a laughing stock throughout the English-speaking world.
Why was Archibishop Tutu denied while President Ahmadinejad was accepted?
Well, we’re not looking to go to war with South Africa any time soon.
Let us not forget that Israel gave military support to the apartheid-era regime of Rhodesia. When are we as a nation going to have enough of this hypocritical, whining crap? Tony Vodvarka, Hartly DE
Why not turn the table on St. Thomas University? They are discriminatory against Africans.
secretarybird - you took the words out of my mouth. Dear God. In America black is white, up is down, sane is insane. Now turn up the volume on the magic roundabout and help me pack sand in my ears. Its getting harder and harder to keep the reality out.
So, the purpose of a University is to make sure nothing is controversial or hurts anyone’s feelings?
Sounds like the guy with low self esteem crumpled up in the fetal position in the corner.
It is time to remove the tax exempt status of all religious institutions. This college is free to insult whomever they want, but not while spending our money.
What Horse Shit. It makes you wonder why they would invite any prelate given the “hurtful” and even culpable way Church Leaders suppressed the child molestation cases and criminal aspects of reassigning priests who abuse children again and again. The Catholic Church is becoming entirely irrelevent!
Shame!And we pretend to be the gate keeper for freedom.
That is why I have to read HAARETZ online to keep up with impartial news on Israel - where there is no AIPAC or ADL.
When the educational institutions of this country can not tolerate ‘other’ views they 1. deny them access or 2. invite them and them clobber them in the introduction. Both methods are childish and as far removed from enlightenment as one could get and still be on this planet. Another way to put down other ideas is to just declare the persons dead, no longer viable, as Mr. Bush did with Mr. Mandela. Step right up and you too can receive a place in the idiot corps for twenty or so thousand dollars a year. So much for the liberal arts………..
U.S. universities and colleges are experiencing “intellect” cleansing.
Because corporations (and the the rich that they benefit) are the major donors and many times they are represented on the governing boards, non-profitable or controversial people, topics and subjects are subject to dismissal.
It is part of the restructuring of U.S. (and other nation’s) institutions to better fit the New Global Order.
Think of it as intellectual streamlining. Anything or anybody or any group or any nation that threatens to frictionally stress the working and expansion of this magnificent global machine has to be restructured or eliminated. It’s a form of lubrication.
balakirev,
I work in a Big-10 myself, and agree with your commentary. The sad part is that when the transition to Corporation you discuss is complete, the University will then be totally redundant on the landscape.
“Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence.”
“Whoever undertakes to set himself up as judge in the field of truth and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the Gods.”
“I am convinced that some political and social activities and practices of the Catholic organizations are detrimental and even dangerous for the community as a whole, here and everywhere. I mention here only the fight against birth control at a time when overpopulation in various countries has become a serious threat to the health of people and a grave obstacle to any attempt to organize peace on this planet.” [ letter, 1954]
Albert Einstein
Good post ezeflyer.
I sent my email to http://www.stthomas.edu/academicaffairs/
I wonder if St. Thomas consulted the Arab or Palestinian communities to see if Tutu’s visit would have been “hurtful” to them?
Good old Erasmus would certainly speak in praise of this folly!
abbybwood - The link you posted above is fantastic, very informative! I urge all to give it a look. Those more educated than I on the subject may not find anything new there, but I found it extremely informative!
BTW - Tutu is better off not speaking there. Catholics are responsible for a great deal of grief and turmoil in the world, and are after all just another power crazy religious sect.
Just pointing out…Israel and Judaism are not synonymous. Israel, and zionism, are respectively a state and an ideology. Judaism is a religion, and being jewish can be a religious or an ethnic identity. It seems important to me to keep these distinctions in mind so when we castigate a jewish political lobby we are not indicting everyone with jewish ethnicity. See my point?
All that being said, the college should have been honored to receive Mr. Tutu, people could have learned something…censorship is for sure alive and well at St. Thomas.
The criticisms of the church in the other posts here bear witness to the hypocrisy and cruelty of the church.
If those Jewish leaders felt “hurt” it’s because the truth of Israel’s war crimes is hurtful. Imagine how the Palestinians feel–but then, St. Thomas doesn’t give a damn about them. The Catholic church is an anachronism. The sooner it’s gone, the better.
Hopefully the “Tommies” will realize their error at some point and perhaps invite another Nobel peace prize winner, say Dr Kissinger?
Shameful and Disgusting !
First of all, baring Bishop TUTU from speaking because someones feelings might be hurt is assinine. Second, this crap has been going on for years on campus, since at least whenformer Ambassador Jeane Kirkpatrick was barred from speaking on campus in 1984.
Just last year the University of my town tried to bar a Supreme Court Justice (Thomas) from speaking. When did Universities become such narrow-minded free-speech-free zones.
>Kirkpatrick, Thomas, Tutu
War criminal, neo-con lapdog, international delegate for peace. I think I get what you’re saying.
lol
Desmond Tutu is one of that small band of people who give religious faith a good name. He’s also one of the small band of people who deserved their Nobel Peace Prizes.
I am a Minnesotan, and am usually very proud of it, because of the traditional progressivism of my state. However, there are some religious trolls that screw it up for the rest of us, just like in the rest of the world. Very sad indeed.
The catholics wanted to deny him of speaking because it would have taken time away from them while they were looking for some young boy to rape
..
How dare he criticize the 51st state!!!!!
St. Thomas — has lost all credibility and any link to anything even remotely regarded as higher education. It, like so many other intitutions of its type have become just a series of hollow buildings and empty brains. Plenty of concrete structure and puffed p.r. — but no soul — certainly no guts or heart. It should be closed and put up for sale — except that it has already sold out!
You know, I see opportunity in this:
It’s time to create the “Criticism Crash Helmet.”
I think every American will find this invention essential.
You see kids on scooters today with kneepads and crash helmets.
Why not protect people against unwanted ideas, or criticism with “Criticism Crash Helmets.” Moreover these could be fitted with special blinders, ear protectors and speakers that generate loud noise to bleep out unwanted phrases or words.
These helmets could be programed to just go off emmitting bleeps anytime unwanted syllables were detected.
Americans are a dainty lot indeed.
Bombs away my fellow Americans.
I’ve got the name now: “The Original American Ideological Crash Helmet.” “A.C.H.” in abbreviation, also to be pronounced like the German syllable “Ach!”
The headline alone outrages the senses … and then we read further and become really insensed … Another load of “sreaming manure” from the bush administration … he and cheney have made it possible for every bigot/jerk/hypocrite to come out of the shed and parade around as if they were/are acceptable. This is digusting !!
as for someone’s comment about “seeing what the nuns have to say” … Nuns don’t run St Thomas college!!
Gene McCarthy taught at St. Thomas for many years. He must be rolling over in his grave about now.
“Tutu had made remarks that had been “hurtful” to Jewish leaders.”
Why that dude is doggone insesitive! Whatever was he thinking?
Please, folks, don’t make any remarks that might be “hurtful to Jewish Leaders” such as how the Zionists went across Canaan/Palestine with tanks and bulldozers and bombs, destroying some 300 towns, killing the residents that didn’t flee their homes fast enough, and stole their land. And don’t mention how they keep stealing more bits of land and keep killing the former residents in their three separate reservations. It is not nice to hurt peoples feelings even if they are murderous, land-stealing, genocidists.
And please, never utter words like “Inquisition” or “Crusades,” or “altar-boy molestors,” or “Nazi collaborators,” in public where those words might be “hurtful” to Catholics such the administrators of St. Thomas U.
And while I’m on the subject, please don’t make any remarks that might be “hurtful” to the sensitive souls in the US leadership such as Dick Cheney and George Bush II. Remarks like some folks have made referring to them as murdering thieves, torturers, and war criminals might so upset these tender fellows as to give Dick a heart attack and cause George to be so distraught as to turn once again to the bottle and coke pipe for solace.
Don’t ever say such “hurtful” things, unless you are willing to lose your job, risk an indefinite vacation in Guantanamo or, like the Dixie Chicks, you’re not ready to make nice.
President Ahmadinejad what a show he put on eh? Feisty little devil. Boo Columbia.
Normon Finklestein got screwed out of his job, hope he got a decent settlement.
Archibishop Desmond Tutu? Banning Desmond Tutu? These people would beat up a nun.
Three such headlines involving Israel and USA schools, things don’t look so good for freedom in the USA.
Leonard Cohen may have to redo the democracy song.
NONSENSE! This proves that nothing terrifies the Zionists more than comparisons with South Africa, hence why they must ban Tutu from speaking as much as possible. As hard as I try, I can’t think of a country in the entire Middle East with a weaker claim to independent existence and nationhood than Israel. The fact is, virtually every other ethnic group in the Middle East, regardless of how politically and culturally “backward” they may be, have been living there without interruption for several hundred if not thousands of years. This goes for the Arabs, Persians, Assyrians, Egyptians, Palestinians, Turks and Kurds; and yet the Kurds don’t even have their own independent state.
While I do not wish to see Israel get destroyed, I find its “law of return” to be inherently unfair and racist; native Arabs who lived there for a thousand years are denied land and rights while Jews can come move there from anywhere in the world and they enjoy a superior status in Apartheid Israel. After the Roman destruction of Israel nearly 2,000 years ago, the Jewish presence in Palestine had been too small to be considered historically important. Way too small to be used in the “continuity” tall-tales that Zionists still spin.
While Israel is no worse or as bad as some brutal regimes in history, this “special” “saintly” status it often seeks is troubling, especially when you consider their treatment of the native Palestinians. It does not, however much it may like to pretend to, occupy the moral highground. Unlike most of the states in the Middle East, it was founded largely on terrorism by colonialist outsiders, from Europe especially. I don’t believe any nation in the Middle East or any in the world should deserve special exempt status from criticism, no matter how “democratic” it may be.
I’ve always found the Palestinian claims to be far stronger than the Zionist claims, all too often founded on outdated Zionist propaganda. If anything, the comparisons between apartheid Israel and apartheid South Africa appear weak because the white South Africans didn’t have the benefit of a powerful lobby working on their behalf in Washington. If they did, Apartheid South Africa would still be a reality.
p.s - Unfortunately many Israelis and Zionists don’t like Nobel Peace Prize Laureates very much. Don’t forget what they did to Rabin!
You can’t make stuff like this up. “Minnesota College Bans Nobel Laureate Tutu From Talk On Peace and Justice” should be sandwiched in between “bat boy lives” and “Elvis spotted on international space station”.
What a joke the United States has become.
The land of free speech, democracy, freedom. Such hypocrites!!
Bush is leading American down the drain and into a sewer.
America has lost its moral authority.
One more pieces of evidence that the murderous and slanderous Apartheid South African secret police (BOSS) is still alive and thriving — and they are friends of the Bush Cult! and very rich from the gold and diamond mines their patrons own.
Oh I am sure the Apartheid-in-exile bunch (pro-Nazi during WW2) are gloating and having a real hoot over this incident, pitting Jews against Africans, and humiliating Desmond Tutu contributing to the fall of their Nazi glory.
I can see Desmond Tutu laughing himself silly. He din’t even have to find a diplomatic way to answer a question. This sort of thing gives even more weight to Jimmy Carter’s book does it not? I’m sure that that is what they wanted to prevent, but I just love watching these idiots shoot themselves in the foot.
For a great read on the comparison of apartheid S. Africa and Israel it is well worth seeing these not too recent articles : Worlds Apart and Brothers in arms - Israel’s secret pact with Pretoria, by Chris McGreal:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1703245,00.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1704037,00.html
“There are things we South Africans recognise in the Palestinian struggle for national self-determination and human rights,” says Kasrils. “The repressed are demonised as terrorists to justify ever-greater violations of their rights. We have the absurdity that the victims are blamed for the violence meted out against them. Both apartheid and Israel are prime examples of terrorist states blaming the victims.”
By the way, It is interesting to remember who was doing the nuclear proliferating back then! The dirty little secret.
“Unfortunately many Israelis and Zionists don’t like Nobel Peace Prize Laureates very much. Don’t forget what they did to Rabin!”
Good point, peaceistruth. Maybe Tutu is safer NOT speaking in the US.
One more pieces of evidence that the murderous and slanderous Apartheid South African secret police (BOSS) — friends of the Bushes — is still alive and thriving — and still very rich from the gold and diamond mines their patrons own.
They and the rest of the Apartheid-in-exile bunch (pro-Nazi during WW2) are undoubtedly gloating and having a real hoot over this incident, pitting Jews against Africans, and humiliating Desmond Tutu in revenge for the fall of their NeoNazi glory and bank-account figures.
With a little Bush/CIA-aided genocide (AIDS maybe?), and some publicity stunts discrediting Black South African leaders, the Apartheid Boers-in-exile might take back control of South Africa after all?
One should read some of Mother Jones’ magazine articles of the 80s to recall how Inhumanly Vicious and treacherous the Apartheid regime was…. its history should be reviewed along with that of the Nazi Concentration Camps, so similar.
This is another evidence to the deep rooted belief in “exceptionalism” of Israel and the US. This view is controlling not only politics, academics (both “secular and sacred”), human rights, but also the worldview of general American public. This is the cause for the American-Israel sponsored terrorism, wars, civil wars, genocides…. around the world.
Banning Desmond Tutu from addressing an academic community by an American academic institution demytholozises some of the pet American myths, such as freedom of speech in the US.
More Zionist BS. It is getting quite old seeing our country endlessly bossed around by Zionists.
Long live USrael.
wait a minute, mu passport says United States of America. Do I have to get my new passport with the correct name?
Shame on U of St. Thomas.
“…when administrators were informed of the invitation, they did some research about Tutu, and found that some of his comments had been controversial. Then, the university consulted with some Jewish leaders, and concluded that Tutu had made remarks that had been “hurtful” to Jewish leaders.”
Too damned bad some Jews can’t take criticism. They sure can dish out death and suffering to the Palestinians. And when Sharon called the Palestinians rats, he apparently forgot the Nazis dehumanizing the Jews in the same way. Those who forget history are certain to do it to someone else.
As for the administrators et al responsible for the decision to ban Tutu, what the frig are they doing running a university in this country? They should be tossed out on their arrogant butts. “Controversial comments”? Omigod, somebody with a brain dared to agree to make a speech at their precious little university! It’s the end of civilization! Oh me Oh my! Maybe next week they can burn some books to show how frigging American they are.
How about an award for the Most Frightened University In America? Terrified of open discussion of ideas.
Morons.
Folks, the real story here is that universities are actually breeding grounds for neo-liberalism which has morphed into modern conservatism (which many liberals practice). Colleges and universities are about making money and churning out more corporate fodder, not about providing a well-rounded capacity to question and reason.
Oh, and also - Israel beat us again.
I bet they’d let the likes of Donal Rumsfeld, or Grover Norquist speak, no matter who it offended.
Oh, well. Pity St. Thomas’s students and faculty. they missed a powerful and marvelous speaker, because their administration is foolish beyond all belief.
as an alum of St. Thomas and the Justice and Peace Studies Program, i am sad to say that this story comes as no surprise. I witnessed and challenged, along with other dedicated students, many cowardly and foolish decisions made by the administration. the university is awash in corporate money and influence [not particular to UST], ultra-conservative Catholic pressures, and basic incompetence and spinelessness. now UST can add AIPAC to its list of stringholders.
and as for demoting Cris Toffolo, UST doesn’t deserve such a fine professor.
I am soooo sick and tired and disgusted of most of your replies. You are all a ravening bunch of Jew-haters. If you had actually bothered to read the article, you would have seen that, yes, some folks, some Jewish folks were upset at Tutu’s remarks, but their hurt did not cause the University to rescind its invitation. What any of this has to do with the Israel lobby in the U.S. is beyond me. By the way, for the record, I am Jewish, I don’t necessarily agree with Tutu’s comments, I criticize Israel whenever I feel it is doing something wrong–just as I would criticize the U.S. Why don’t all of you Jew-haters just come out of your closet and admit what you really are!
One misunderstanding to clear up here — this article doesn’t mention it, but Tutu WILL be speaking at Metropolitan State University instead. That’s a public state college not too far away.
Next point about Catholicism. They have turned out some interesting people in the past — Thomas Merton, Romero, and Father Kaiser (killed in Kenya), as well as groups like Pax Christi (I don’t really know much about them).
St. Thomas is a fairly conservative preppy type school, located in the heart of Old Money in St. Paul (Guilded Age homes), not too far from the Governor’s mansion, etc.
Confidential Agent (1945)
Brief Synopsis:
A Spanish spy and an American heiress battle fascists in England.
http://www.tcmdb.com/title/title.jsp?stid=1870
Help get this movie out on DVD. VOTE at
http://www.tcmdb.com/title/title.jsp?stid=1870
zoya October 4th, 2007 6:54 pm
“Unfortunately many Israelis and Zionists don’t like Nobel Peace Prize Laureates very much. Don’t forget what they did to Rabin!”
Or Arafat
rogomo,
The critics of Israel are not a “ravening bunch of Jew haters”. For far too long there has been a phobia about criticizing Israel for fear of being labeled anti-semitic. It is a welcome sign that people are seeing the disgusting behavior of the state of Israel and speaking out about it.
The Zionist/neocon/Bush fascists are bringing suffering, fear, and death to innocent people and must be stopped. To hell with anti-semitic, unpatriotic labeling.
If the citeria to speak publically is that one never said anything that anyone ever found “hurtful”, then it would be a damn quiet planet.
rogomo,
I was בר מצוה in 1968, so shut the hell up!
BTW, you do your point of view a disservice by mouthing the same tired “Jew-hater” blather.
countess - “Desmond Tutu has committed the one great unforgiveable sin in the eyes of the Greater Israel (USA). You can lie, torture, invade sovereign countries, slaughter thousands but you cannot utter a critical word against Israel.”
Israel, as far as I know, has only reacted to attacks on itself. Now I will be accused of being a Zionist which is absurd for a number of reasons.
countess, can you substantiate your accusations, from a reliable source, that Israel has “slaughtered thousands”, etc, without provocation?
iammyself - “BTW, you do your point of view a disservice by mouthing the same tired “Jew-hater” blather.”
Thank you iammyself. Yours was the only comment, at least of the ones I read, that made any sense.
rogomo - The fact is that the modern state of Israel really has no claim to legitimacy. The governments and international institutions that created it had no right to do so in the middle east. That is not “jew-hating” it is just the truth. Furthermore Jewish history especially the holocaust should have provided the Jewish people, for whom the modern state of Israel was supposedly created, with empathy for oppressed people, to see Israel treating the Palestinian people this way is particularly distressing. This link http://www.wrmea.com/jews_for_justice/index.html posted earlier in this tread by abbybwood was written by Jewish people interested in truth and justice, why don’t you email them and tell them what a bunch of Jew hatters they are?
Letter written to academic affairs at the University of St. Thomas:
To whom it concerns:
What a sad state of affairs when a Nobel peace laureate of the stature of Desmond Tutu is banned from speaking at an American University. I’m sure that any candidate for a speaking engagement could be found to have said something “hurtful” with regard to some group or another, and anyway what better way to explore the justification for whatever “hurt” than to allow for said individual to address his critics? And does some comment or two about Israeli-Palestinian relations, true or not, really overshadow a lifetime of work in freeing his nation from the tyranny of Apartheid? If indeed this is the logic used by your University, I have to wonder about your University’s academic standards, as there’s no logic in this whatsoever, as it seems to say that no one at all is qualified enough to speak at your campus.
Are we to be like East Germany pre-1987? Are we to add fuel to the fire of antipathy felt around the world towards the U.S.? Or are we going to be dedicated to creating an atmosphere of openness and dialogue and tolerance as a way to dispel the view held by many that this country is the most dangerous “rogue” the world now faces?
I mean, really. Your decision to bar Archbishop Desmond Tutu from speaking at your campus is more than an embarassment; it’s a disgrace to the institution of the American university. It’s spit in the eye to anyone who strives for a better world. It erodes our already eroding democracy, inasmuch as our youth are being denied the opportunity to come to their own decision about what makes a comment “hurtful” or not.
Aside from all that, however, what makes me really sad is that your student body won’t have the chance to size the man up for themselves, to develop their own critical faculties and absorb, by a kind of osmosis, the energy of the man–to experience someone for whom freedom for his fellow human beings has been more important than his own life. By denying Tutu’s presence on your campus all you’re doing is reinforcing the view that the Jewish community has become paranoid of anything that hints at “anti-semitism”–as though the situation between Israel and Palestine were somehow black-and-white, when the truth is the truth is never black-and-white, yes?
“University” comes from the word “universe,” which means “one song” (uni- = one, -verse = song). By this logic, a “university” should be endorsing and promoting a free and open forum for ideas and views that inspires the human community to the “one song” of this universe.
How about doing your job.
*******
additional footnote: I’m glad to learn that a local state college is providing a place for Tutu to speak.
It is frustrating that all I can do, since I’m far away from the twin cities, is to send an email to the office of academic affairs. But hopefully if enough of us do that it will atleast let these folks think twice about recinding the invitation of such a great man as Tutu. It is a disgrace to US universities at large that such a thing could happen, but even more so for the Catholic tradition. This Zionist lobby in the US is quit shameless in its decisions about who to blacklist. Shame on them.
Rebelnow–I have no problem with people criticizing each other, whether it’s Israel’s current position vis a vis the Palestinians or the Bush administration’s stance on everything and everyone who doesn’t agree with them. But have you read some of the above comments? Israeli’s should all get nose jobs and make their ugly culture prettier? (Sir Melvin Cleophus) Every article I have read in this forum and in every reply there are at least three or four plainly Jew hating, Jew bashing comments. I appreciate discussion and differences of opinion. But some of you simply take advantage of the forum to spew. By the way, iammyself, as long as you can deny what I see and you can’t, shame on you! I am not paranoid about Israel, I am not a Zionist, but I know anti-Jewish bullshit when I read it. So, shut up yourself and gayen kockenoff en yam.
The reaction to Tutu’s snobbing by St.Thomas administrators as indicated by the preceding letter-writers is probably a mirror of reactions felt by liberal-thinking college professors and administrators across USA.
The publicly-verbal counter-stroke would be a thunderous call for him to speak at those colleges.This strategy would relegate St.Thomas or at least its administrators to their rightful place as back-woods pariahs or lepers with wimpering protests completely drowned out by those thunderous affirmations.
Johnny Mercer wisely wrote and sang ” accentuate the positive;eliminate the negative “
rogomo, thanks for your sane comment.
Chunga’s Revenge - “The fact is that the modern state of Israel really has no claim to legitimacy. The governments and international institutions that created it had no right to do so in the middle east. That is not “jew-hating” it is just the truth.”
Is that so, Chunga’s Revenge? How is that a fact? It sounds like an opinion to me if I didn’t know better.
Sir Melvin Cleophus, Your comments were not only bigoted but some of the stupidest comments Ive heard in a while.
I’m still waiting for a substantiation of your accusations and insinuations, from a reliable source, that Israel has “slaughtered thousands”, etc, without provocation?
The Israel Lobby
John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt
London Review of Books, www.lrb.co.uk/, March 23, 2006
For the past several decades, and especially since the Six-Day War in 1967, the centrepiece of US Middle Eastern policy has been its relationship with Israel. The combination of unwavering support for Israel and the related effort to spread ‘democracy’ throughout the region has inflamed Arab and Islamic opinion and jeopardised not only US security but that of much of the rest of the world. This situation has no equal in American political history. Why has the US been willing to set aside its own security and that of many of its allies in order to advance the interests of another state? One might assume that the bond between the two countries was based on shared strategic interests or compelling moral imperatives, but neither explanation can account for the remarkable level of material and diplomatic support that the US provides.
Instead, the thrust of US policy in the region derives almost entirely from domestic politics, and especially the activities of the ‘Israel Lobby’. Other special-interest groups have managed to skew foreign policy, but no lobby has managed to divert it as far from what the national interest would suggest, while simultaneously convincing Americans that US interests and those of the other country - in this case, Israel - are essentially identical.
Since the October War in 1973, Washington has provided Israel with a level of support dwarfing that given to any other state. It has been the largest annual recipient of direct economic and military assistance since 1976, and is the largest recipient in total since World War Two, to the tune of well over $140 billion (in 2004 dollars). Israel receives about $3 billion in direct assistance each year, roughly one-fifth of the foreign aid budget, and worth about $500 a year for every Israeli. This largesse is especially striking since Israel is now a wealthy industrial state with a per capita income roughly equal to that of South Korea or Spain.
Other recipients get their money in quarterly installments, but Israel receives its entire appropriation at the beginning of each fiscal year and can thus earn interest on it. Most recipients of aid given for military purposes are required to spend all of it in the US, but Israel is allowed to use roughly 25 per cent of its allocation to subsidise its own defence industry. It is the only recipient that does not have to account for how the aid is spent, which makes it virtually impossible to prevent the money from being used for purposes the US opposes, such as building settlements on the West Bank. Moreover, the US has provided Israel with nearly $3 billion to develop weapons systems, and given it access to such top-drawer weaponry as Blackhawk helicopters and F-16 jets. Finally, the US gives Israel access to intelligence it denies to its Nato allies and has turned a blind eye to Israel’s acquisition of nuclear weapons.
Washington also provides Israel with consistent diplomatic support. Since 1982, the US has vetoed 32 Security Council resolutions critical of Israel, more than the total number of vetoes cast by all the other Security Council members. It blocks the efforts of Arab states to put Israel’s nuclear arsenal on the IAEA’s agenda. The US comes to the rescue in wartime and takes Israel’s side when negotiating peace. The Nixon administration protected it from the threat of Soviet intervention and resupplied it during the October War. Washington was deeply involved in the negotiations that ended that war, as well as in the lengthy ’step-by-step’ process that followed, just as it played a key role in the negotiations that preceded and followed the 1993 Oslo Accords. In each case there was occasional friction between US and Israeli officials, but the US consistently supported the Israeli position. One American participant at Camp David in 2000 later said: ‘Far too often, we functioned . . . as Israel’s lawyer.’ Finally, the Bush administration’s ambition to transform the Middle East is at least partly aimed at improving Israel’s strategic situation.
(cont.)
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Israel/Israel_Lobby.html
TuTu was the promoter of the truth and reconciliation commissions in SAfrica and convinced Mandela the president to go that route instead of the route of vengeance.
SAfrica was spared a blood bath.
He has never been afraid to promote the truth in his search for peace.
To be banned from speaking at an American University is nothing new for him .He was banned during apartheid and I’m sure he can live with rejection and forgive.
I worry though about the land of the freee and the brave who are less and less free given to such fear they take away your shoes and even your water bottles befor boarding an internal flight.
McCarthyism was nothing compared to the hysteria now gripping your country.
You are destroying your own freedom through your own fears.
Neither Tutu nor Mandela nor martin Luther King could help you at this stage as you persist in believing in a power that is declining and a freedom that hardly can listen to someone you might not agree with.
How pathetic a country you are becoming.!
Isael is a nasty, coniving, treacherous little nation with it’s hands down the pants of our “leaders”. They murdered U.S. military men, attacked our ships, straffed our lifeboats, spied on this country, committed acts of terrorism which ALMOST equal the Evil Empire, ( insert United States here). The only friends they have in this country are the oil companies, the religious right and other mindless fanatics looking to get rich off of Muslim oil, ( blood), or buy a stairway to heaven because the fence-sitting swine mis-read the bible and believe Israel is still God’s chosen. In addition to being murderous swine, they’re, (along with the mindless drones that support them), pathetic. This horrible little nation of fat-bellied ex christian killers cum terrorists have gotten much of western europe as well as Canada and the Evil Empire to either pass laws putting academics in PRISON for even SAYING their “Holocaust” never happened the way they present it to the world to make un-counted BILLIONS in reparations or, ILLEGALLY extradite these political victims of this nasty little nation to countries where they can BE whisked away to our “Democratic” ally in the Persian Gulf. Remember Drones, Poland has already taken down the 6,000,000 “victims” plaques, replaced them with 1.5 and is considering going below that number. Can we say the same for the millions Eisenhower murdered after the war? Will he be prosecuted post-mortem along with Kissinger and Bush for the millions upon millions THEY slaughtered? Or does Israel have a monopoly on the word as it pertains to their “persecution” so much so that we can continue to turn a blind eye to the horrors they are laying upon the Palistinians? Call a black person a nigger, an indian a savage, an asian a chink, you get a finger wagged in your face. Say, just SAY the holocaust has been blown out of all proportion and you get sent to PRISON for YEARS. Do ANY of you mindless Drones even WONDER how a nasty little “clan” of murderers that make up a TINY fraction of the world population can wield such FRIGHTENING power over huge nations like Canada,….Great Britain… or our OWN Evil Empire the United States of Corporatica?? For the love of christ THINK!!
From the comments I read here it is all too apparent that we and the world need to hear much more from Archbishop Desmond Tutu, President Jimmy Carter and other peacemakers. You might want to watch Bill Moyers Journal on Friday evening on PBS for an interview with another of those noble peacemakers, Rabbi Michael Lerner, editor of “Tikkun”, prolific writer and leader of an ecumenical peace movement. “Blessed are the peacemakers for they will be called sons of God.”
“Comments hurtful to Israel”
What a laugh. That’s like insisting that calling Bush a numbskull is making “comments hurtful to America.”
I love Israel and hope it lives a long life. I hate the Zionists and their hold over America. It’s disgusting.
Bishop Tutu’s tactics were wrong. If he wants success in criticizing some of Israel’s policies he should quote some of the debate that goes on in that country’s parliament, The Knesset. In that chamber there exists the only criricism or condemnations of their government’s policies anywhere on earth other than in the Islamic nations. Any American politician after reading such comments in the Israeli newspapers and then repeating them openly would soon suffer the wrath and power of their powerful lobby. This is unique as this is the only subject accorded such immunity.
Further evidence American Main Stream has genuinely “gone to hell in a hand basket”..
Enough said about this appalling decision….
Hillary, Edwards and Obama all genuflect before the AIPAC rulers, therefore we can expect no change whatsoever if any of them are elected.
Israel and their biblical manifest destiny of Middle East territory will soon bring the entire world into a nuclear nightmare. Might be easier if they tried to get along with their neighbors instead trying to dominate them.
Amazing how there financial contributions have managed to silence political criticism of their imperialistic goals and their brutal suppression of the Palestinians.
In the midst of all this censorship and our downward spiral back to medieval theocratic intolerance, just a reminder to my friends in the choir of how perceptive Dennis Kucinich was back in 2002 when most of the country was paralyzed with fear after 911 and supported the draconian assault on our constitution.
Dennis Kucinich had the courage and the good judgment to speak out loudly against vigilante justice in response to the attack on the world trade towers.
Unlike any of the candidates running for president today, Kucinich had the foresight and the wisdom to see that we cannot foolishly dismantle our cherished American principles in the face of fear.
It might be worthwhile to re-read a speech he made back in 2002 called a Prayer for America.
His profound judgment and his incredible understanding of the consequences of going to war without clear justification is a reminder that he is really the only candidate in the race that can heal the wounds of the nation and restore our good name throughout the world.
I found a copy of that brilliant speech in the Common Dreams archive, give it another glance and pass it along to Hillary supporters and remind them that she was wrong in her senate vote authorizing Bush to go to war and she is clueless now about how to solve Americas problems.
http://www.commondreams.org/views02/0226-09.htm
I realize that Kucinich has little or no chance of getting the nomination, especially when the media is constantly ridiculing him; it is very distressful that his grand ideas are being ignored.
What will it take for someone who promotes peace and understanding to become a main street candidate???
Academic freedom has always been a hoax. Nothing new here.
I am a parent of a St. Thomas student and am appalled by this news. St. Thomas is making the classic mistake of allowing the corporate entity of the university to dictate to the real university of learning. Pinhead administrators should worry about buildings and money and stay out of the business of learning. They’ve proven themselves unfit yet again.
I am going to take a course of action beyond this public discourse. First, I am going to suspend any further donations to the school. Afterall, I find their actions “hurtful”. Second, I am going to inform someone who has a well-known bull pulpit of these development and see if we can bring some national attention. Third, I am challenging the students of St. Thomas (and others who care about real academics) to band together, rise up, and make yourselves heard in a meangingful way. In toher words, take action beyond this blog.
I would assert that administrators at the university loathe negative attention and need financial support. The only way to force adminstrators back into their offices where they belong is to (advanced apologies) hit them where it hurts.
I would start with the faculty. The St. Paul Pioneer Press ran an article here:
http://www.twincities.com/ci_7076331?IADID=Search-www.twincities.com-www.twincities.com&nclick_check=1
The article mentions that even one of the adjunct faculty (Marv Davidov, Jewish himself), was incensed at the decision, for many of the reasons already mentioned in this forum.
The weird taboo’ing of the topic of Israel in America will be its own undoing. America has long had a realm of forbidden conversational topics: marxism, socialism, conspiracies, criticism of Israel. By putting Israel into this category, America is setting Israel up for great failure: it provides the illusion that it can do no wrong when, in fact, it certainly can.
And this is the way it works. A Catholic school bans Tutu because they are worried he might offend some Jews. The article bends over backwards to point out that he doesn’t offend all Jews, that it “was a university decision, and not one that was sought by anyone outside St. Thomas”, they quote Jews who work for St. Thomas who say Tutu doesn’t bother them; and the result is, the usual bucket full of comments about how the damn Jews control America, etc. etc. etc.
Gee, I wonder what makes the Jews would so touchy about antisemitism.
The position of St. Thomas, an all-male, uptight, buttoned-down reactionary Catholic fortress, located just a few blocks its sister institution, St. Catherine’s is quite fascinating. Curiously, Pope Pius XII during World War II was considered to be one of Hiter’s most useful allies in his oppression of the Jews. And now, the Catholics are taking their marching orders from the Jewish community (can anyone spell “AIPAC”?). Having resided in Minnesota for all but two years until 1986, I began to witness its decline in the early 1980s, coincident with the advent of the Reagan Revolution.
The proud progressive tradition that once existed there (names such as Humphrey, Eugene McCarthy, Mondale come to mind)has mostly fallen by the wayside. They have been replaced by the likes of Sens. Coleman, whose opponent (i.e., the late, great Paul Wellstone)was conveniently killed in a plane crash just days prior to the election in 2002, and Klobuchar, a DINO who seems to have adopted the color purple.
Although a few pockets reminiscent of Garrison’s Keillor’s beloved Lake Wobegon can still be found, the people of Minnesota, unwittingly or not, have abandoned this cherished tradition, casting aside an inherent sense of civic duty, community and shared responsibility to the wellbeing of all toward the mantra trumpeted so shamelessly by the Republicans–the “ethic” of “I’ve got mine so screw you.”
Occasional visits to the state are a bittersweet experience. Although connecting again with friends and relatives has its appeal, visiting a state that continues to undergo such a state of ongoing decline and decay (the I-35W bridge collapse is but one of many examples) is a wrenching experience.
The Mississippi River Valley, once one of the most beautiful parts of the country, is at times filled with smog, a putrid brown haze not unlike that found in large urban areas such as Los Angeles. Although I never saw this during my more than thirty years in that state prior to 1986, it is now commonplace. The coal-burning electrical power and ethanol plants would seem to be a likely culprit, however, the locals ascribe this phenomenon to humidity, apparently believing that humidity today is different than it was in the 1950s, 1960s, or 1970s. Oddly enough, a good rainstorm seems to clear the air for a few days, even though the water on the ground, evaporating would seem to add to the humidity. Tragically, this diminished air quality can be found in other sparsely populated, rural areas of the state, curiously in those areas where ethanol plants are located.
Those residing in other parts of the country could be forgiven for confusing Minnesota with Mississippi–the politicians from either state would most likely feel equally at home in the other.
I’ve lived in Minnesota my whole life, but have taken numerous roadtrips across the country in the 1-2 decades. I also concur that Minnesota is a sinking state. One of the possible reasons is that we experienced a huge influx of outsiders (~400,000!) in the late 80’s to the early 00’s. We were percieved as having a good economy (especially medical devices, the parasitic insurance “industry” and IT, etc.) relative to a lower cost of housing than the coasts especially. So it could be that Minnesota’s politics changed as we got more people from other parts of the US.
I also think that something extraordinarily fishy occurred with the death of Wellstone. I find it downright impossible to believe that the state which elected Wellstone also elected Norm Coleman. I’e got no evidence that Wellstone’s death (like Carnahan’s against Ashcroft) was anything more than an accident, but I’ll always suspect it was anything but an accident.
checksandbalances - I see your point. What I should have said is:
The historical facts lead to the inevitable conclusion that the modern state of Israel really has no claim to legitimacy. The governments and international institutions that created it had no right to do so in the middle east.
Just who the fuck were the British, the US and the UN to force the state of Israel down the throats of t=of the peoples who had inhabited that land for thousands of years? A bunch of imperialist oil hungry bastards that’s who. They did the Jewish people no favor.
And that is my opinion, based on the historical facts!
Sadly, for many millions of American jews, the primary national allegiance is to Israel as a jewish state rather than to their own country. The Israel lobby in the US has always been powerful, and has gained greatly from the Bush II presidency. The only president we have is now planning nuclear strikes against Iran, primarily because the state of Israel regards Iran as a threat.
We can’t expect action to curb the power of lobbys and corporations from the government as now constituted. The forefathers anticipated the need to make changes in our government by means of a new constitutional convention. The driving force for this has to come from the states and the people, since the Washington crowd will not willingly give up their power and influence.
Difficult to find:
president of the University
Shouldn’t he listen to some of these comments?
DJDEASE@stthomas.edu
DJDEASE@stthomas.edu
As a graduate of the University of St. Thomas’ MBA program, I am shocked, saddened and embarrassed by the university’s banning of Desmond Tutu.
Bishop Tutu’s tactics were wrong….
What “tactics”?
Many of those writing her don’t seem to know much about Bishop Desmond Tutu.
First, he isn’t Catholic - he’s Anglican - the former bishop of the black township’s diocese.
Second, he is the Gandhi and Dalai-Lama combined of the anti-apartheid movement. If you have heard him speak, he conveys through his gentle words a loving-kindness like I’ve heard nowhere else aside from the Dalai Lama. He is one of the true living saints or bodhisatvas on our planet right now. If only one Nobel Peace Prize was given out every 20 years, he would be the most worthy recipient.
That such a gentle wise old man like Tutu he could be demonized like this by a university ib a country that purports to be some kind of beacon of freedom is positively phantasmagoric!
checksandbalances … your checks don’t balance! The remark about “the only comment that made sense” is ridiculous and shows your own predjudices …Many posters here said absolutely nothing about Israel or the Jews … Perhaps you need to read a little closer .. before you make the same kind of judgements that you are accusing others of making!!
You might be interested in reading Fr. Dease’s comments on the last controversial speaker that the St. Thomas did allow speak, Ann Coulter. http://www.stthomas.edu/bulletin/news/200518/Monday/Dease4_25_05.cfm
Nobel Peace Prize Winner - Too controversial
Purveyor of Hate - Okay
Is it just my perception that AIPAC and its fellow travelers are getting more prickly than usual? Could it be that it’s a sign of increasing desperation that the old “Criticize Zionism = Anti-Semitism” ploy is getting a bit threadbare as evidenced by the appearance of mainstream criticism of Israel echoing Finkelstein (eg. Carter, Mearsheimer and Walt…)
It also occurs that AIPAC and Co. would especially bear down on an invitation to Desmond Tutu as just his very presence would be “hurtful” to Zionist mythology. Even if he were to show up at the University of St. Thomas and stood mute his stature as as anti-apartheid fighter would draw too close an analogy between former apartheid South Africa and the apartheid Israel presently inflicts upon Palestinians. Exposure of criminal acts is always “hurtful” to the criminal who wants to stay hidden.
As for the University of St. Thomas … a college tier-rating system paralleling the annual U.S. News & World Report should be established listing the most craven campuses who capitulate to right-wing intimidation. These university administrative pimps should be given the recognition they deserve, and prospective students and donors should be able to make informed choices.
All you need to know:
ZOA: Anatomy of a Smear October 5, 2007 at 12:54 am http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/category/jews-judaism/
A news release from the Zionist Organization of America, which condemned Tutu’s remarks, cited a report from Ha’aretz that quoted Tutu as saying that “Israel is like Hitler and apartheid.” A transcript of the speech available online does not include the Hitler quote.
First, it’s simply not possible that Haaretz could’ve “quoted” Tutu saying that because he didn’t say it. Second, this is not a “Hitler quote” since it is not a quote and doesn’t exist except in the perfervid mind of the Jewish right-wing propaganda machine. So let’s call this for what it is: a fraud. An entirely made-up smear of Nobel laureate Archbishop Desmond Tutu. Why JTA couldn’t have spoken more forthrightly is a mystery. Doesn’t it owe Tutu an apology?
And where did this fraud emanate from? The ZOA first manufactured the quotation for an April, 2002 press release. David Horowitz (of course) repeated it in Frontpagemagazine in February, 2003. Charles Jacob of the David Project repeated it here in August, 2007. The popular rightist Powerline blog also repeated it here in November, 2006. The National Christian Leadership Conference for Israel repeated it here. This smear is like a deadly virus. Not deadly in the sense that it destroys one’s body or property. But deadly nevertheless in that it attempts to destroy a reputation and credibility of a political opponent. Mort Klein manufactured the virus in his hate lab. But all those who spread the virus deserve a share of blame and their credibility must also be questioned.
I have no problem with those who disagree with Archbishop Tutu and argue with his views or ideas which he actually says. But I have a great problem with ideologues so desperate to nail their victim that they’d resort to trickery like this. I lay this at Mort Klein’s doorstep. How JTA or any other Jewish media outlet can take anything he says for truth is beyond me. Caveat emptor!
“I love Israel and hope it lives a long life. I hate the Zionists and their hold over America. It’s disgusting.”
I neither love nor hate Israel. It is a sovereign nation, albeit, an oppressive one. (Note: the U.S. is an oppressive nation too, so epithets of anti-semitism had better be balanced).
What I find heinous is how Israel (and its proxies both there and here) threatens, berates, castigates, and denigrates anyone who lifts a finger in dissent. If they want to do that to their own people, that’s one thing, but to do it by proxy in other sovereign nations, they invite scorn and enmity and deserve no protection for doing that.
Another thing that gets my goat is how some Jews fall into the trap of calling anyone with a hint of a dissenting opinion as anti-semites and Jew-haters. Do they not realize, 1. How tiresome people find that, and 2. how in invites enmity upon them? I can certainly empathize with the feelings of bigotry, as I have been at the receiving end of it, but I’m smart enough not to go looking for it.
Shalom.
What I find the most interesting – or perhaps distressing — is that the topic of Israel so conscribes U.S. intellectual and political discourse that a university would see fit to ban no less than a Nobel laureate from speaking on its campus.
Desmond Tutu appeared in the off-Broadway play Guantanamo and has been a harsh critic of the Bush regime, yet NONE of that factored into St. Thomas University’s decision to ban him from speaking, (which, of course, I still would have found objectionable). The message is clear: it is ok to criticize the US, but not to criticize Israel.
As a nation, we cannot come to a reasonable consensus on what constitutes “hate” speech or “hate” crimes. Just ask the families of Matthew Shepard or Yusuf Hawkins or Gobind Singh Sikh Gudwara or Joseph Ileto or James Byrd, Jr. Or ask yourself why there has been no uproar from any governmental body or human rights organizations about Robert Gate’s Deputy Assistant Secretary Debra Cagan’s (a Jewish surname, I believe) comment that she “hates all Iranians.” Shouldn’t the Simon Weisenthal Center concern itself with such hateful comments.
Yet St. Thomas University ventures into the murky-murk of determining whether speech is “hurtful” and instead of seeking to evaluate the situation independently from a variety of view points, it sought opinions ONLY from a select group of like-minded individuals who stand to benefit by denying a podium to Desmond Tutu, and who supported their position with lies and distortions of the facts.
So much for a university whose mission is “Inspired by Catholic intellectual tradition” and to educate “students to be morally responsible leaders who think critically, act wisely and work skillfully to advance the common good.”
Of course, the truly delicious irony for us lapsed, lost and lethally literate Catholics is this: St. Thomas, a university which bans a speaker and inhibits the free interchange of ideas, is named after none other than St. Thomas Aquinas, the supposed “angelic” mind of the Catholic Church. Somewhere in hell, Torquemada is laughing.
Sadly, this is not an isolated incident of the free exchange of ideas being sacrificed on the altar of Israel’s immunity from not just from criticism but from any topic that Zionists deem uncomfortable, whether it’s the production of “My Name is Rachel Corrie” or President Carter’s recent book. And it insinuates - no, imposes itself, upon our nation by instilling fear into elected officials that they must toe the Israeli line or end up like former congressman Earl Hillyard of Alabama.
Consider that Professor Norman Finkelstein (himself the son of concentration camp survivors) was recently denied tenure and subsequently forced to resign his position at DePaul University because of his criticism of Israel. His denouncers included the usual suspects, led by that paragon of US jurisprudence, Alan Dershowitz.
Dershowitz, as you recall, defended Claus Von Bulow, and I suppose we can forgive him if he cannot see the similarities in brutality between Von Bulow’s actions toward Sonny and Israel’s policies toward Palestinians.
As others have noted, what a terrible irony!
The misnamed … *University of St. Thomas*…
Were he to turn up on their doorstep, would *Saint Thomas’s University* also ban Saint Thomas, and then other Saints, - and then Christ himself?!
Desmond Tutu may not be entirely sainted, but he’s not such a long way off the mark.
Maybe the university ought rename itself? - perhaps ‘The University of Blighted Bigotry’? or ‘The University of Very Tiny Minds’ would be more appropriate?
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Oh, a new world of *broadened consciousness* ~ where are thou?
Who do you write to ???
http://www.stthomas.edu/academicaffairs/
Academic Affairs ?? acadaffairs@stthomas.edu ??
Thomas R. Rochon, Executive Vice President, Chief Academic Officer trrochon1@stthomas.edu ??
Angeline Barretta-Herman Associate Vice President for academic affairs a9barrettahe@stthomas.edu ???
Joseph L. Kreitzer Associate Vice President for Academic Affairs
jlkreitzer@stthomas.edu ???
imotomar … You hit the “real” nail on it’s head ….
“Desmond Tutu appeared in the Off Broadway play “Guantanamo” and has been a harsh critic of the bush regime”
This and this alone is the reason for St. Thomas’s kiss off, not Israel, not the Jews! To critize his royal high ass is the kiss of “goodbye” in America!!
Just imagine, they kissed ann coulter’s ugly butt “hello” … and kissed Desmond Tutu’s beautiful face and message “goodbye” because of pub influence at St. Thomas … and probably a call from the “decider” … Israel is the scapegpat here … nothing else!!
Here’s a copy of the letter I sent via email to the St. Thomas academic affairs office listed once again a couple comments before this one. I hope others will contiue to write as well!
I am writing to express my outrage that your university would ban a
Nobel Peace Prize winner, a man who has spent his whole life
struggling against the mostly ghastly oppression of basic human rights
and civil liberties, from speaking on your campus as he was originally
invited to do. The idea that members of St. Thomas university
administration have the right to ban a speaker from speaking merely
because someone MIGHT find “hurtful” something that the speaker MIGHT
say represents a truly egregious violation of the most basic principle
of free speech enshrined in the U.S. Constitution. Indeed, employing
such a ridiculous criterion consistently would imply that no one would
ever be entitled to speak publicly, since there is simply no way of
being assured ahead of time that someone in the audience might not
find something said to be “hurtful” in some manner.
Quite frankly your blatant disregard for Archbishop Tutu’s basic right to speak his opinions openly and publicly, and for the St. Thomas
community’s equally important right to hear such opinions, is
profoundly disturbing, indeed truly HURTFUL, to me. Why doesn’t my
actual hurt at watching you trash the Bill of Rights count as much to
you as the hypothetical hurt that someone might, or might NOT,
experience upon hearing Tutu speak? Who do you think you are
arrogating to yourself the right to police public speech, and to do so
on the basis of nothing more than slanderous rumors about Tutu’s
previous public statements? You are a disgrace to the entire American
academic community of which I am a part. Your actions not only make a
laughing stock of your institution, but reinforce the widespread
public impression that American universities in general are no longer
interested in open and honest debate of important political and
cultural issues, but seek instead to censor all opinions that are not
“politically correct” as sanctimoniously defined by self-appointed
keepers of the truth.
I remember hearing remarks that if the Jews don’t want something to happen then it won’t happen because they control the world. This type of action supports that kind of view. Because some Jewish leaders felt his true remarks were hurtful he cannot speak? How very interesting.
Concerning hurting Jews the Catholic church has no ground to stand on as they have done more to repress Jews than anyone, with the only possible exception being Hitler (remember that Hitler was around for only a short time and caused great damage while the Catholic church has been around for a much longer time and caused great damage).
As an alum of St. Thomas’ graduate program in critical pedagogy (now defunct, surprise!), I am ashamed to admit where I studied. I thought a university was where the universe of ideas could flourish. Now Zionist tunnel vision silences one of Africa’s greatest leaders of human rights. When there isn’t even a will to let Tutu speak and to debate his criticism of Israel, this once great Catholic university has sunk to a disturbing low of irrational fear and loathing.
The truth sometimes hurts, particularly if you are a hypersensitive denier of it. I can tell you, based on the considerable time I have spent in East Jerusalem and the West Bank, that nothing said by Bishop Tutu on that count was false. In fact, he understated the case. It is the reflexive “anti-Semitic” charge by people such as those who found Bishop Tutu’s remarks “hurtful” that has cowed so many gentile writers, leaving the best writing on the egregious abuses of Palestinians to some very good Jewish writers such as Ilan Pappe and Norman Finkelstein. Read their books — they know whereof they write.
As a Twin Cities member of the Jewish Community, I would have loved to see Archbishop Tutu at St. Thomas. I have frequently expressed similar dismay over Israeli actions to other Jews and non-Jews alike. Moreover, I have heard similar dismay expressed by many Twin Cities Jewish leaders. I saw the reference to the Jewish Community Relations Council, and the careful insistance that this decision was made by St. Thomas without pressure from them, and I, for one, believe it. The people I know at the JCRC are generally a lot more thoughtful than that, but even if they weren’t, their job is Jewish / Non-Jewish relations, and they are way too good at that job to make a stupid mistake like this.
Having said all that, I would like to amplify what “rogomo” pointed out: many of the responses on this site have tended toward the extreme “the Jews are running the country and they are taking us all to hell” end of the antisemitic spectrum. Words like that do not hurt Jews, they scare the $#!+ out of us. They have been used throughout the ages to justify that which can never be justified.
I am not much of a conspiracy theorist. It is my belief that people are inteligent and far sighted in inverse exponential proportion to the size of the gathering. I believe that nations are the most shortsighted of all possible entities, and I believe that politicians will do anything to appear to be looking out for the short term safety and economic best interests of their constituents, even if it means destroying any chance of long-term stability or security. This is no different in the U.S.A or Israel.
If, in spite of that observation, you want to believe in an evil religious conspiracy, keep in mind that the strongest Zionist lobby in the country today is the radical evangelical ‘Christian’ right (represented by the people that the Republican party calls their ‘base’). These folks need a Jewish homeland in Israel (and, particularly in Jerusalem) so they can convert the Jews and ‘bring back’ the Messiah. How come the the uptick in U.S. support for Israel in the ’80s coincides so strongly with the entry of the ‘Christian’ right-wing into American politics? Extreme Zionist Jews have embraced this support, in my opinion, at their extreme peril.
Everyone who says, “the truth hurts,” is absolutely right. The truth hurts when it is about hurtful acts, and it should. The Israeli government has a lot to answer for. The Palestinians have a lot to answer for too. As a Jew, as long as I don’t speak out against Israeli misdeeds, I have a lot to answer for. I accept that.
A large proportion of the Israeli people, and a huge proportion of American Jews, though, don’t want any of this and ARE actively speaking out against it. Before we condemn another nation, or an entire ethnic group, for the actions of its misguided political leaders, perhaps we should look to our own nation, and remember, all the Jews in America, even if they voted in a single block, couldn’t elect a single official to national office without a lot of non-Jews voting along side of them.
After discovering this article, I felt inclined to write St Thomas and protest. Below is the URL which was shared in a previous comment, and the letter I wrote to the school.
http://www.stthomas.edu/academicaffairs/
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Dear Students and Faculty of the University of St Thomas:
This email is to inform you that an article has been posted regarding the banning of Desmond Tutu’s speech at the University of St Thomas in Minnesota on the Divine Earth (www.divineearth.org) e-community website.
If banning speakers because they “offend” a certain group that has an obvious amount of power, control and influence, then the public should know that you are weak and are in fact enslaved to their whim. It is very tragic that an educational institution, which should set an example for freedom of speech and freedom of thought, is reduced to being a political-racial pawn. This equates to nothing less than thought control for your students and faculty.
I urge all students and faculty members who have not been corrupted by your institution’s narrow-mindedness, who wish to maintain their dignity and conscience in the name of freedom, to revolt and protest against this censuring. Make your voices heard, lest y