General Betray-Us and MoveOn.org
I have often been critical of MoveOn.org, basically because I feel, for the most part that they support Democrats to the detriment of democracy. However, MoveOn.org was a big help to me at Camp Casey in August ‘05 and organized the thousands of candlelight vigils that occurred across the country. I will always be grateful to them for that.
I had a policy when my children were younger. I would always try to catch them doing something “right” (sharing, being kind, etc) and I would praise them and give them a treat. In that vein, I have to give my 100% support to MoveOn.org in regards to their right-on ad in the NYT that has become even the object of a Senate denouncement.
It must be hard for MoveOn.org to have 21 Democratic Senators vote to denounce the ad when MoveOn.org has been so supportive of the party. However, I don’t think that it’s appropriate for the Senate to be voting on newspaper ads, when it is a clear 1 st Amendment right of anyone in our representative republic to place such ads, whether one agrees with them or not, and with almost half the Senate Dems voting to denounce MoveOn’s freedom of speech and the Dem leadership taking impeachment “off the table” and giving BushCo more latitude to spy on us, I wonder which part of our Constitution the Dems will defile next?
Today, George, in his unbridled and un-matched arrogance and just abject stupidity called the MoveOn ad “disgusting.” What I find more disgusting is a cowardly Commander in Chief and all of his supposed underlings lying to our country and the world and sending our young troops to fight, die, be wounded and kill innocent people when they were too “busy” to do the same in their mistake of a war: Vietnam.
What I find disgusting is CNN (where I just saw Eli Parisier of MoveOn debate a pro-war person) rarely criticizes the occupation or shows the tragic consequences of this war and they are raising money so a poor Iraqi boy can have reconstructive surgery on his badly burned face. That is great, but what about examining the reasons little Youssif was burned in the first place and start calling for an immediate withdrawal of troops? What about the millions of other Iraqis who have been wounded or displaced? Who is telling their stories and raising money for them to be whole and have homes?
What I find disgusting is General Betray-Us allowing himself to be used as a political force field for the lying administration and lying himself. Sectarian violence is not down 80%, the General Accounting Office report and the fact that hundreds of Iraqis are killed every month 50,000 leave their homes on a monthly basis directly contradict those “facts.” The only reason some places are safer in Iraq is because the neighborhoods have been ethnically cleansed and the sectarian militias are providing security to small geographic areas. In the very violent south; Shi’a Mahdi are fighting Shi’a Badr. It is a disaster that needs to be faced and solved now, not put away until the spring or prolonged so Dems can get the White House back in ‘08.
General Betray-Us has not only betrayed America and his oath of service, but he has betrayed the very troops he should care about more than being an “ass-kissing little chicken-shit” to a Commander in Chief who has spent years betraying the troops. It is time to truly support our troops and start withdrawing them immediately. Not to “pre-surge” levels but to “pre-invasion” levels. It is time to listen to the people of Iraq and force the mercenary killers and other contractors to leave and give the people of Iraq back their jobs (50% unemployment rate in some areas, some areas higher) and their country.
The occupation of Iraq is a disaster and I applaud MoveOn for moving a little closer to the true “anti-war” movement and encourage them to come with us farther.
Anyone who is concerned with the rapid slide to fascism should be supporting MoveOn in this battle.
Anyone who cares about democracy over Democrats (or Rethugs) should join me in supporting MoveOn in this particular struggle and in bringing MoveOn more fully to the table with the peace movement.
Thanks MoveOn for speaking for the majority of Americans and please stick to your so-called guns. The struggle is worthwhile!
Cindy Sheehan is the mother of Spc. Casey Austin Sheehan who was KIA in Iraq on 04/04/04. She is a co-founder and President of Gold Star Families for Peace and the author of two books: Not One More Mother’s Child and Dear President Bush.
Cindy is right and the pre Magna Carta Cro Magnons are wrong. This congress is a collection of cowardly murderers, and need to be dealt with as such. They must pay for raping the progress we have all spent our lives working towards.
Peace to you, Cindy. Citizens arrest on you congress assholes, and I AM serious.
Great article Cindy. Why don’t we ever see your articles in the NYTimes or Washington Post?
Everybody, GET A GRIP.
This resolution is MEANINGLESS.
It doesn’t hurt MoveOn.
It doesn’t prolong the war.
It helps to keep the “General Betray Us” taunt in circulation.
Many of the same Senators who voted Yes on this silly resolution also voted Yes on Feingold-Reid to cut off funds for the war, and on the Webb motion to relieve tours. Those are the votes that count. Why the ten-minutes hate toward Dems who voted to condemn an ad?
Only military idiots who want to be offended at the slur on Petraeus and avoid the issue of the war itself care about this stupid resolution.
And apparently some purists on the left as well.
Cindy,
Well-stated. I agree with ezeflyer: why do we not see your articles in the MSM? Would it be fair to say that MSM journalists also are “ass-kissing little chicken-shits” because they are so deep in the pockets of the Bush Administration and Congress? I think so. You certainly have my support. Nancy Pelosi needs to go, NOW!
Also, for those interested in supporting Cindy’s bid to run for Congress, please check out our self-organizing group at http://www.sheehanforcongress.us
nader2000,
While you are correct to note that the resolution in question has no legal power, the vote is important for what it reveals about the feckless Democrats who felt the need to decry someone’s free expression: they’re playing politics instead of meeting their responsibilities.
jj
This the comment that most caught my interest, “Anyone who is concerned with the rapid slide to fascism”.
Here is a link to very good article on that very subject.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article18426.htm
Nader 2000, maybe you’re the one who needs to get a grip. The “meaningless” resolution displays Congress’ disregard for the first amendment, its disregard of American public opinion which is much closer to Cindy’s position than it is Bush’s, and its disregard of the factual nature of the ad which points out the betrayal of our troops by Petraeus as Cindy points out; what more do you need? And so what if some of anti-MoveOn gang then voted in favor of cutting off funds or in favor of tour-relief? Those votes are mere stunts designed to make it look like they’re doing something. If they wanted to cut off war funds they could have done it long ago; they want this war to keep on going because it’s good for the companies they represent (they sure as hell don’t represent the American people) and they have to posture against the war from time to time to hoodwink the public. This “meaningless” resolution is yet another outrage committed by our criminal congress and to dismiss it as meaningless is to cave in to the war-monger’s way of thinking. Cindy is right in fighting these bastards every step of the way, not letting them get away with any of their crap. And just where does the line lie between meaningless and meaningful? The right is chipping away at all of our freedoms, and this is a great example of their chipping. Meaningless indeed.
Indeed, manipulation of public sentiment–as epitomized by the president’s press conference comments about MoveOn.org and the Democratic Party–lies at the very heart of the White House’s entire Iraq war enterprise. For those interested in a psychological analysis of this warmongering, I have recently completed a 10-minute online video entitled “Resisting the Drums of War.” It examines how the Bush administration’s messaging has targeted five core concerns that often govern our lives–concerns about vulnerability, injustice, distrust, superiority, and helplessness. Looking ahead, the continuing occupation of Iraq–or an attack on Iran–will likely be sold to us in much the same way. The video examines these warmongering appeals and how to counter them. It’s available for viewing HERE.
Cindy’s a powerful engine for truth and good. Keep it up.
I too had been critical of MoveOn pretty early on for their continued support of the “Dems”, but like Cindy must praise them for once.
But Betray-Us is too mild a name. This general is a General War Criminal (for illegally invading and occupying a sovereign country and causing the death of so many innocent Iraqis)
it is only meaningless to someone who thinks a college student asking a question of his royal pompousidity without the attendant humble deferrence to ruling aristocrisy, got the torture he deserved.
It matters to me that we can exercize our fundamental rights without the senate voicing their official disdain on record.
Sent a donation to Moveon.org last night. My very first, so a pox on all those cowards who voted for the resolution. Reminds me of all those who voted to give Bush the authority to invade in the first place. Bastards.
This resolution had nothing at all to do with outrage at MoveOn.org. It was simply an attempt by the GOP to force Democratic politicians into the Republican camp, thereby separating them from their own voters. The Republicans succeeded, and they will continue to succeed at this game until Democratic voters start booting out phony Democrats like Jim Webb, Max Baucus, Mary Landrieu, etc.
It’s actually time all Americans woke up and realized that the real problem with this country is THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY, not Bush and the GOP. Republicans have always been a bunch of warmongering old businessmen, but these people have always been kept in check by Democrats, who served as the counterweight to that ideology. Now there is no counterweight - and just like a scale out of balance - the country is tilting to the right. Face it, unless we take on the Democrats - and yes I mean THE DEMOCRATS - it won’t be long before the U.S. descends into real fascism, and I’m not talking moneygrubbing corporations here, but the kind of insanity that leads to world wars and concentration camps.
“It doesn’t hurt MoveOn. It doesn’t prolong the war. It helps to keep the “General Betray Us” taunt in circulation.”
Bullies don’t respond to petitions, pleas, facts, or complaints.
They do respond, angrily, to taunts — and so they have to be baited by taunts. Remember the gasps when Stephen Colbert dared to mock Bush at the Lapdog Press affair in 2005.
The gasps of indignation and the cluck-clucking over impropriety reveal the violent frauds in a way that mere recitation of arguments never does. They sit at ease before a spectacle of blood, and get in a snit when someone befouls their clean DC lawns.
“Many of the same Senators who voted Yes on this silly resolution also voted Yes on Feingold-Reid to cut off funds for the war, and on the Webb motion to relieve tours. Those are the votes that count. Why the ten-minutes hate toward Dems who voted to condemn an ad?”
There were only five who voted for both Feingold-Reid and the anti-Moveon resolution.
“And apparently some purists on the left as well.”
I’m really tired of the “purity” strawman. It’s not about “purity”. It’s about a pattern of behavior by Congressional Democrats. Every Republican except for Chuck Hagel, Arlen Specter, and Joe Lieberman voted against Barbara Boxer’s resolution that would have denounced Swift Boat Veterans for Truth. The Democrats all go their own way and they turn around and expect unity from progressives.
While the Move On ad was something of a tactical blunder, its moral message was clear. Petraeus, by all accounts, is an intelligent and able person (he comes off that way in the book “Fiasco”). He knows that the occupation of Iraq is a catastrophe and admitted as much by telling congress that he didn’t know if it made the U.S. safer. That’s as close to getting someone like him to saying the whole thing is horse shit as we’ll ever get. But the man wants the American political brass ring and a few more tens of thousands dead isn’t going to deter him from grasping for it.
Rapid slide to Fascism? Haven’t we already arrived, or is only for us to wait for Bush to declare martial law, arrest Cindy and make an example of her and any who support her?
Bush went to war with no intelligent reasoning, he Cheney and Rumsfeld had no idea of what they were getting into. The prize of controlling the oil and taking most of the profits was their primary goal, greed overcame any reasoning. Persons defecient in judgment, hasten to undertake that for which winged celestials hesitate to assume responsibility.
The Senate vote is a typical reaction by Reactionaries, whereby they announced themselves as such. It’s now very clear who is on which side, just who is a member of the Death Party.
Here’s a thought, how about a push to have the money we’re paying to private contractors for protection and actually hire Iraqs to do the protecting. They’d have something better to do than be pissed off and shooting AT AMERICANS, they’d make a hell of alot more money than they’re making now, which shouldn’t piss them off. I’m going to contact my reps about this and get their view of why this would or would not work. With the people in-charge of our government, the first thought will be “what about the kickbacks”.
I agree with Nader2000 here.
Moveon’s ad was a publicity stunt designed to shock and anger the warmongering right. In that regard it was a success.
The non-binding Senate condemnation was also a publicity stunt aimed at embarrassing Democrats by forcing them into a Hobson’s Choice of not condemning the ad (and giving right-wing bloviators and their MSM enablers another opportunity to regurgitate the “THEY HATE PETRAEUS SO THEY HATE THE TROOPS AND WANT AL-QAEDA TO WIN” meme) or condemning the ad and looking cowardly and hypocritical in the process. It, too, was a success. The Senators who chose the latter were indeed cowardly and vacillating.
That said, let’s move on (no pun intended). Condemn the condemnation and get back to issues that matter. There are hundreds of reasons to be angry at the Democratic Congress, to funnel that anger into activism and keep trying to fight the war machine in every way possible. This stupid little resolution pales in comparison to most of them.
The warmongers want something, ANYTHING, to distract the public’s attention from the disaster in Iraq, from Blackwater, from warrantless wiretapping, from the death of habeas corpus, from the U.S. Attorney firings and every other of the half a hundred criminal acts that infest this administration. Don’t give them the opportunity.
Why does this mess remind me of the whole Schivo fiasco?
And how many more people died in Iraq while the Senate was wasting time on this nonsense?
The Congressional Dimms are “eating their own” by even participating in these kinds of antics.
P.S. Welcome back KEM and PJD! How was the DC protest?
Was the “taunt” a success? A long line of analysis from the ministry of information will author most of Chimp’s statements, directing his popular podium slump and cowboy vernacular. So, when the executive war criminal says “disgusting”, a big fan base is usually in agreement.
Boo Hoo…Whaaaaa wineeey Whaaa!
Why don’t you attack Britenny and OJ? …
But let General Betrayus alone! … Whaaaaa Whaaaa!
He is just a General… whaaa whaaa Boo Hoo ……. Whhaaa… leave General Betrayus alone!!!
Whhaaaaaaa…Wineeeey
Please,
Senator Leiberman
Cindy Sheehan Is Right And Has Been Right !
She deserved 100% support from the Democratic Party instead they avoided her issues and helped foment “The Lie”.
The U.S. Senate has abrogated its Constitutional Responsibilities for over fifty years to Conservative and Neo-Conservative Policy Groups in the public and private domains and to leaders like Henry Kissinger.
Those people have led us into the invasions of Viet Nam, Afghanistan, and Iraq. Those people have advocated Coup d´etats in Chile, Argentina, El Salvador, Guatemala,Nicaragua, Panama, and Indonesia….and, those actions have resulted in the deaths of well over 8 million human beings.
The dollar has devalued 54% since 2001. Yes 54% !!! In 2001 $.89 American would get 1 Euro….Today September 21, 2007, $1.40 gets 1 Euro. That is a difference of $.51 and divide that by 89……..
The U.S. Senate is made up of 100% Capitalist Conservatives….They have made their millions. They could care less about the people of the United States. They could care less about the Constitution of the United States. They, like Cheney and Co., have polarized the American people and rendered them useless and apathetic.
Good luck with demonstrations, but “Evil” has won and has total control.
I was very surprised when combat veterans, regardless of their personal politics, did not denounce the behavior & antics of republican convention attendees when they started sporting those purple band-aids, in effect not only mocking Kerry’s service to the country, but the fact that he was wounded, while doing so. Not to mention Coulter’s comments regarding Max Cleeland. Where was Bush’s outrage back then? Or could someone explain the difference? Personally, I’ll never forget that image from their convention.
What a reaction we got from the Republicans with a small ad from the Flying Toaster Screensaver folks. I sure got my money’s worth with a small donation to MoveOn!
Move on is just another status quo entity built to elect Hillary and promote DLC values ad nauseua. They started out right, but then got a little too cozy rubbing elbows with the powers that be to offer legitimate critiques. I seen their latest add as an attempt to bring back into the fold people like me who intend to vote independent or GREEN!
Even CNN’s promotion of the reconstructive surgery for Youssif is disgusting. While he certainly needs the surgery, CNN is motivated not out of compassion but out of a sense of duty to the capitalist establishment, promoting high-tech and/or high-dollar professional services, which if you notice, most mainstream US media does systematically. The beast capital is exploiting both Youssif’s misfortune, and the public’s sense of compassion in this regard.
Be careful trying to drag Moveon into the peace movement. You may find yourself instead bitten and dragged under the evil wing of the triangulating DLC. The answer is socialism, not triangulation.
Cindy is right; we need to support people or organizations when they do the right thing in opposing the Iraq war, even though we may disagree with them on other issues. As the Senate votes revealed, the problem is not really a partisan one: witness the votes of California’s Democratic Senators on the resolution to condemn MoveOn (Feinstein, yea; Boxer, nay). Whatever their party affiliation, Senators have no business utilizing their Article I legislative powers as a platform for telling Americans what they may or may not say — and that applies especially to criticism of patently incompetent (this man was in charge of the failed effort to train an effective Iraqi security force, and was in charge when 200,000 weapons were handed out to now-unknown recipients) and servile (this man was selected by the President only after several senior Generals honestly told the President his “surge” would not work) Generals such as the one MoveOn chose to criticize. As a Korean War veteran, I have certainly paid any dues which might be required to call a military officer a fool when he acts like a fool. But nobody — veteran or not, citizen or not — is required to pay any dues in order to qualify as a “person” whose speech is protected by the First Amendment to our Constitution. Any Senator (Republican or Democrat) who does not accept that proposition is violating his/her oath of office and should resign immediately.
This morning, in a Nestcape poll taken, 63% of respondents agreed with the Senate on the resolutions. It seems like it is treasonous to question the motives and integrity of General Betray-Us. Today, it is a “harmless” resolution. But, tomorrow it might be turn into law to curtail freedom of speech and dissention.
What is wrong with us? First, we sit quietly, like good citizens when a college student is taken down by 3-4 rent-a-cops and is electricuted because he dared ask the Senator the wrong question. An analogy I have heard to describe this incident is from the move the Body Snatchers. The audience were pod people; they had been transformed. The student blew his cover by getting emotional and was taken down.
Now you have the majority of Americans agreeing with the Senate’s resolution. Did we not learn anything about the track records of our generals in Vietnam? Each and every one of them lied to us.
Simple fact: The General Betray-Us is an employee of Mr. Bush.
We all know what has happened to the past generals that have disagreed with Bush’s illegal activities; they were fired. What makes Americans believe that he will go against Bush?
Richard Young…most eloquent. Amen
Dichterfreund…”They sit at ease before a spectacle of blood…” is about as precise a discription of Congress as we are going to hear. Thanks
Cindy Sheehan is eloquent as usual and uses her eloquence to speak the truth. Imagine the effect on American politics if we would read the day after the 2008 election “Speaker of the House loses Safe seat to Political novice”
Cindy Sheehan for Congress!
Cindy Sheehan is a brave woman who steadfastly decried the injustice of the war in Iraq and is now being given the persona non grata treatment by the warmongers in the press and in the government.
The country needs her courage in Congress.
Thanks, Cindy. I’ll vote for ‘ya!
I agree with Cindy that the MoveOn “betray-us” ad deserves credit and I also agree with rtdrury’s advise for caution. There are two considerations for this:
(a) MoveOn has been performing under the guise of the “progressive” wing of the Democratic Party in an effort to keep the progressive-left forces within the fold of the “two” party electoral trap.
(b) The “betray-us” ad appeared when things were not going well for MoveOn and their role as instruments of the Democratic party became increasingly apparent and real progresive members started pulling out.
Did they do the Ad to reverse their losses
through a sort of “shock” strategy? Or,cincerely they realized the folly of pursuing progressive goals by acting on behalf of a reactionary capitalist party like the Democratic? I want to hope that the latter is the case and that true progressive minds in the leadership of MoveOn prevailed.
I’m sure there’s a simple answer to this question.
How was it, under the rules of the Senate that applied when the GOP ran things, that it was impossible to force a debate or floor vote on anything even mildly critical of George Bush, and yet Harry Reid let this cheap resolution stunt take up the Senate’s time and attention even for a moment now that the Democrats are the majority in charge?
Bill from Saginaw
Our military leaders deserve to be attacked aboout their lies, they have BETRAYED us. And president Bush is nothing but a criminal himself, so for him to use the military as a shield,(a Repug constant),by pretending that he, and they, are honorable is totally repugnant. The Republicans are the far more dangerous terrorists to the world than all the Muslims put together.
It’s absolutely nauseating that there are still Democrats, after all the lies and crimes and carnage that have come down, who are still afraid of being labelled “unpatriotic” and “against the troops.” God almighty, support the troops by bringing them home!
It must be fun to be Mitch McConnell. He’s effectively the Senate Majority Leader. He can stop just about anything with 41 Republicans (and blame the Democrats!) and he can count on enough Democratic support to make the Bush agenda look bipartisan.
The Bush team routinely intiminates those who disagree or question their policies by branding them unpatriotic or worse. Their assaults against those who question the logic of continuing the course in Iraqis a continuation of that prctice. Now that the opposition has fired back, they cry foul.
> No assult from the liberal wing or press can match the unprecedented character assassinations against Senator Max Cleland, a decorated triple amputee Viet Vet with an honorable senate record. These assaults were in response to Sen Cleland’s sponsorship of an investigation into the causes of 9/11, which was opposed by Bush. Among other things, they displayed his picture with Bin Laden and falsely demeaned his war record, even blaming him for stepping on the mine. With these crude tactics they succeeded in unseating Sen Cleland by one who shunned military service, & was compatible to Bush’s secretive policies.
>
> Despite its degree of deception & importance, a critique of that abuse was avoided by the mainstream media. No republican has even expressed remorse for it.> The most alarming aspect of these horrific intimination tactics is not their methodology–but their successes.
>
> Blame falls on apathetic & gullible voters who succumb to such rhetoric; and our legislators for allowing themselves to be intimidated into permitting this reckess zealot to impose such damage to our nation and the world.
The real question is Cindy Sheehan ever on the wrong side of the issues…not to my knowledge. Cindy 4 Congress!
I don’t answer my phone anymore unless I know who is calling because every time I pick up, some candedate wants money and I really have not made up my mind. Except maybe for Hillary because she did not vote to condemn the add…I get emails galore and after what has happened to Move On, I decided I would support them with all that I can spare so they can get this slimy republican administration to fall to their knees and ask for mercy, which I will never give them. Move on gets the attention needed to make people aware of what is going on. It is very sad that such a decoreated general stoops so low as to “kiss the president’s ass”, (does not deserve a capital P), and ruin his his legacy of his good service to this country, but he dug his own grave on this, no sympathy from me.
Donate to Move on, let them do the talking for us because the media will not and it is time that we be heard…!!!!!
Since when do the Republicans have a problem with name-calling or any other playground tactic to get their way? The term “Slick-Willie” fair and balanced, “Betray-US” totally uncalled for; now repeat it until everyone believes it.
Just received this info from MoveOn.Org:
Dear MoveOn member,
Yesterday, an amazing thing happened. After the Senate’s shameful vote, and after President Bush called MoveOn “disgusting,”1 our email started to fill up with messages like this one:
I’m currently in Iraq. I do not agree with this war, and if I did support this war, it would not matter. You have the RIGHT to speak the truth. We KNOW that you support us. Thank you for speaking out for being our voice. We do not have a voice. We are overshooted by those who say that we soldiers do not support organizations like MoveOn. WE DO.
YOU ARE OUR voice.
And then came the donations. By midnight, over 12,000 people had donated $500,000—more than we’ve raised any day this year—for our new ad calling out the Republicans who blocked adequate rest for troops headed back to Iraq.
The message from MoveOn members was loud and clear: Don’t back down. Take the fight back to the issues that matter.
So today we’re shooting for a very ambitious goal: Reach $1 million so we can dramatically expand the campaign we launched yesterday going after politicians who support this awful war.
All day, messages from vets and military family members kept pouring into our email, many of them aimed at the Senate:
I have given a son to this country. My brother, my father, my uncle have all served honorably and bravely. I am a loyal American. I am outraged and sick to death of the tactics this administration uses to try to silence dissent to a war that is unjust, built and maintained on lies, political power, and greed. I was content to let others fight more loudly, but no more.
–Sharyn W., NC
I am a prior soldier who served in Iraq for 13 months, and am now an expecting mom with a husband who is deployed in Baghdad. I don’t think I can ever forgive the Bush administration for the lies that tricked America into this war and hurt my family so badly. I am ashamed of those American politicians who would condemn an organization for practicing the Freedom of Speech that so many soldiers have died for.
–Danielle B., OH
As a US Navy veteran and an Iraq war veteran of over a year I want to ask, What has happened to us? What has happened to our voice? Where is this country going with stopping free speech and free press? … Every time I think of the long nights I had in Anbar remembering what I was fighting for, well here it is….
–Ahmad H., LA
These folks have made sacrifices many of us can’t imagine. Their charge to us was clear: keep speaking the truth about how President Bush and the Republicans have betrayed our trust.
So we’re going to expand our ad campaign—keep it on the air longer and run it against other politicians who helped block adequate rest time for our troops.
And still the messages kept coming …
I’ve had three nephews serve since 2002, one of whom was killed in Anbar Province. I have a fourth nephew at Quantico training. I want this war over before he is deployed and before any more of our soldiers are sacrificed.
–Michele R., NE
Three members of my family are military. Two Marines have served in Iraq and an Army Lt. is deploying in November. If we had all spoken out when the administration used General Powell perhaps we would not be in this mess.
–Carol B., PA
As a Marine I served for many reasons but one of them was to allow people the freedom of speech, whether I agreed with it or not. Wearing a uniform does not mean someone isn’t a shill, is spewing propaganda, and downright lies. MoveOn has every right to buy an ad and say what they want about a public figure. This administration has lied to us, deceived us, misled us and when posed with a challenge this is how they respond?
–Keith G., VA
The Senate won’t pass a policy to end the war or even to make sure our troops in the field have enough rest time between deployments, but they hold votes to crack down on millions of Americans who are upset about the war
Do you know what you get when the Government is not permitted to critisize the Military?
Pakistan today
Germany 1940
Italy 1939
Spain 1930-1970
Argentina 1960’s
Etc
Etc
Etc
Hell, even in Soviet Russia the government could critise the military.
Resolved, That it is the sense of the Senate–
(1) to reaffirm its support for all the men and women of the United States Armed Forces, including General David H. Petraeus, Commanding General, Multi-National Force–Iraq;
(2) to strongly condemn any effort to attack the honor and integrity of General Petraeus and all the members of the United States Armed Forces; and
(3) to specifically repudiate the unwarranted personal attack on General Petraeus by the liberal activist group Moveon.org. ( but not Petraeus’s Superior, who routinly calls him a “Little ass-licking chickenshit”
(4) to clearly state that the US Congress love our Mommies and their delicious Apple Pie
(5) Zeig Heil Bushie!
Cindy, you’re my kind of purist! ♥
the great embarrassment of the antiwar movement is its inability to hook up with each other.
it is truly embarrassing. its devastating.
the other side is united and that makes them stronger.
besides, if we can’t work with each other, - how can we expect the public to buy into our counter theory of, not just the war, but much deeper and philosophical questions about some very fundamental life poses.
there is a deep sickness in the united states.
this country has been - without parallel in the modern age - running roughshod over one country after another for 60 years, since the end of the second world war.
you have killed a lot of people and destroyed many countries.
why?
for what?
while there are a lot of people in your country who are against all this endless killing, and that is good, there are many many more who like it.
(in one of today’s other articles, a writer notes; there are a lot of posts on the msnbc boards in favor of blackwater. people there, he says, are sorry that blackwater is not running the entire war because they feel blackwater would make a better job of it.)
the murder rhetoric is always about freedom and democracy, the reality is destruction and inhumane massacre for money.
mussolini, who coined the term fascist, was talking about a state where the corporations owned and ran everything.
the fascist states of america.
allowing the private armies to grow and prosper, ironically on the public tab, is one of the truly dangerous trends in the us today.
only a very sick country would allow this to happen.
working through the iraq issue is the one most at hand, obviously, but the greater issue is what to do with this military monster you have created. especially as it privatizes.
blackwater are the boys who will be herding you into the fema concentration camps.
watch it.
so, its good to see someone with cindy’s influence offer the olive branch, but it is more than embarrassing that it needs to be offered at all.
if we can’t make community then forget it.
I am so angry at this dust-up over the MOVEON ad I could throw the remote right through the tv.
Let’s talk betrayal of the troops. Not enough troops to do the job they were sent to do…even though I personally object to their objectives, the least our troops should expect from our gov’t when sent to do a job is enough of them and with adequate materials to do it…sending the same persons into harms way unendingly…and then cutting benefits, refusing to care adequately for their wounds and battle related illnesses…is this not betrayal worthy of condemnation?
It is like when the nattering nabobs rail on about how the ‘Nam vets were spit on and abandoned…who exactly abandoned them?
It wasn’t the Left that refused to acknowledge the illnesses resulting from Agent Orange; it wasn’t the Left who abandoned thousands of vets to the streets or the woods and mountains when their war experiences unhinged their psyches and left them unable to live in society and then called their PTSD “a personal / personality / drug problem”, it wasn’t the Left who failed them while using their patriotism to subvert the very freedoms they fought for with endless cries of “no more Viet Nams” to justify entering into, and escalating, and extending every war since.
More recently, the “Swift Boating” of Kerry and the slander of Max Cleland are certainly far more egregious attacks on Military personages. All moveon said about the good general was that, in his testimony, he contradicted the evidence of every other source, and instead reported that the war and the surge were going swimmingly. And they called this representation “betrayal”.
As should every soldier in Iraq.
not all democrats are evil. i vote green often, but am regestered as a democrat so i can participate in the elections. ya there is a way out of the 2 party trap, its called proportional voting and drop ballot voting. but how do we get from here to there? we have to work with what we have, so sure vote green if there are no good democratic candidates, but register democrat so you can vote in the primarys and get representatives on the democratic ticket (which is more likley to win) that will implement democratic policies.
move on needs to poll thier membership and pick a candidate to support in the primarys. hopefully it will be Dennis Kucinich. they are wasting their time fighting republicans. i think they may pick a candidate to support soon, they sent out an email asking if they should. and btw, just because clinton didn’t condem moveon doesn’t mean she is the candidate to vote for. sure she will stand up on a unbinding resolution, or a vote that is destined to loose. but she sat by when we got into this mess in the first place. Dennis Kucinich has been aginst the war right from the start, he has proven his integrity.
MoveOn.org. A piddly little website with unknowns driving the debates of “progressives”of the United States of America. They blew the last (2) elections and people still look to them (whoever the hell they REALLY are) and still send them money. You gotta love it. MoveOn.org: Proof there’s plenty of suckers around in 2007. Well, gosh, I guess you have to believe in something, I suppose. At least Cindy Sheehan has at least some promise. Otherwise start planning to vote green or independent in 2008.
the post above by okeedokeeuall is exactly the kind of gutter sniping i am talking about.
if moveon is “a piddly little website” then how can it be responsible for losing 2 elections.
is this post a right wing plant, i wonder.
where better to grow hard feelings than gutter sniping in the middle of a conciliatory article.
it destroys everything cindy wrote about.
Can we equat General Petrayas with General Westmoreland in the body counts and many civilian deaths they are not held responsible.
Also on another note…
Mr Bush our selected president said at his manufactured consent press conference “I heard somebody say, ‘Where’s Mandela?’ Well, Mandela’s dead because Saddam Hussein killed all the Mandelas.”
HL Mencken was right on target in that America has evolved to produce a moron for a president.
As for Move On dot org they are needing to back the right presidential candidate like DK and not a warwhore like Clinton and the rest of that sorry bunch of Democrats!
I will vote for DK in the Florida Primary and then convert back to being a Green if he is passed over and leave this place for Canada and learn to say hey after each sentence.
Who is to blame for Bush’s ill fated policies?
Blame clearly lies on every voter who helped plant him in office–especially those who voted for him a second time. The five justices who violated the trust placed in them and handed him the elction also are guilty.
They got the governmment they deserve. Unfortunately those who voted against this disasterous administration must also suffer the consequences.
Bastille Day July 14
“We announce to the world the true principles of our actions. We wish an order of things where all low and cruel passions are enchained by the laws; all beneficent and generous feelings awakened; where distinctions arise only from equality itself; where the citizen is subject to the magistrate; the magistrate to the people, the people to justice. Where industry is an adornment to the liberty that ennobles it and commerce the source of public wealth, not simply of monstrous riches for a few families. We wish to substitute in our country morality for egoism, probity for a mere sense of honor, principle for habit, duty for etiquette, the empire of reason for the tyranny of custom, contempt for vice for contempt for misfortune; the grandeur of man for the triviality of grand society. We wish, in a word, to fulfill the course of nature, to absolve providence from the long reign of tyranny and crime.”
Maximilien Robespierre
ALOHA !!
I am still amazed that two Vietnam “draft-dodgers” managed to get themselves elected to the top two political positions in the USA not once but twice! Since when did it become acceptable to even nominate such idiots? When I was 19 I registered for the draft headed to Vietnam but Bush hid out in the Air National Guard. A well known tactic back then to avoid being shipped off to Vietnam. Then there’s Mr 4F himself … Cheney! I mean don’t any of these military officers feel any sense of betrayal to the Vietnam era soldiers who died in the jungles while these two losers were too busy kissing Daddy’s ass and partying? I believe I would rather resign my commission than shake hands with those two imposters! How is it possible to salute a “draft-dodger”?
That said there is ample historical proof that it does not matter which of the two party aristocracy(Dem & Rep)you vote for. Both parties have this “entitlement mentality” that it is their God given right to rule over us! I am sick of them both … The last time I voted for either party was in 1984. I sleep very well at night knowing I did not vote for any of the worldwide atrocities committed with the aid of my vote. I am sorry that my tax dollars were used to fund this miserable rable!
What this all comes down to is “money” … more to the point our “monetary system” … As long as a government can create “money” out of thin air(fiat) to fund a “pre-emptive” strike at the President’s whim we will always suffer the majority of the consequences. It is our sons and daughters that these people’s political careers are built upon and it is this fiat monetary system that allows this evil.
Over 200 years ago the founder of the famous Rothschild Banking empire said this …
“Give me control of a nation’s money and I care not who makes it’s laws.”
- Mayer Amschel Bauer Rothschild
Sooner or later Cindy Sheehan will eventually come to the real truth of her search.
GOVERNMENT IS ONLY AS HONEST AS ITS MONEY …
Go, Cindy!
It’s a good thing that they didn’t call the guy a “doo-doo head”. Been hell to pay if they did.
Worth the watch, I think ..
MoveOn’s Pariser Responds To Petraeus Ad Distraction In Senate
http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/09/21/moveons-pariser-responds-to-petraeus-ad-distraction-in-senate/
The problem with this country are the politicians-Democratic or Republican. The resolution regarding the ad may be meaningless to some, but it’s very telling. The ad was perfectly appropriate under the First Amendment. I find it interesting what people of Bush and Congress’s ilk find ‘offensive’. No where is it written in the Constitution or Bill of Rights that Americans cannot express disgust for a general who clearly has made himself part of a political manipulation of the facts. These politicians cherry-pick these issues for political purposes. Where, for instance, was the outrage over some of the libelous ads put out by the GOP over the past eight years? Why weren’t “meaningless” resolutions passed then?
This vote concerning the MoveOn ad was the last straw for me. This Senate would not even support Russ Feingold in a censure of a nefarious president and vice president who clearly, at the very least, should have been impeached for so many high crimes and misdemeanors that I’ve literally lost count. Yet, they waste Senate time to criticize a political ad, which is supposed to be protected by the First Amendment? Are you kidding me with this? Does the First Amendment only apply when it does not offend the Bush Administration? How dare this bunch of elitists ridicule a liberal and truthful ad, when they’ve sat idly by and done nothing through seven years of lies and propaganda disseminating from the Bush Administration and Republican party, a conscience-challenged group who couldn’t care less about “supporting the troops” in their pathological and profit-driven quest for more power. What good is the First Amendment then? Why even keep an Amendment that guarantees the people the right of political dissent when, with the current support of the Senate, the people are becoming increasingly afraid to speak truth to tyranny? Maybe that’s what they really want.
So, they’re offended by MoveOn’s political ad? Well, let me recite just a few out of the hundreds of shameful and often illegal acts committed under the Bush Administration, with supposed oversight by the 109th & 110th Congress, which offends me:
Under this administration I’ve watched the Fourth Amendment, Fifth Amendment, Sixth Amendment, Eighth Amendment, Fourteenth Amendment, and Writ of Habeas Corpus become irrelevant. I’ve seen the First Amendment right of freedom of speech obliterated and the guarantee of the separation of church and state impugned. I’ve put up with constant propaganda designed to manipulate the public into believing that the enlightened principles upon which this country was founded are actually un-American. I’ve witnessed a president who lies as easily as I breathe turn signing statements into line-item-vetoes, cover up the treasonous outing of a CIA agent, illegally spy on Americans, appoint himself “the decider” and claim himself the lone arbiter of who gets due process and who doesn’t. I’ve watched this president lie repeatedly about our presence in Iraq while he disingenuously hides behind the flag and his supposed “support of the troops” and “American values.” I’ve heard him vow to get the “evildoers” who attacked us on 9/11, but instead invade an unarmed country that never attacked us. I’ve heard him announce, “Mission Accomplished,” four-years-ago during his arrogant and narcissistic display—replete with flight suit—on an aircraft carrier on San Diego Bay. Yet, this illegal occupation of Iraq has lasted longer than World War II. I’ve sat witness while he and his cronies have thrown billions of tax payer dollars away on questionable no-bid, cost-plus defense contracts in Iraq to other Republican cronies in effort to assure perpetual war, perpetual reconstruction, and perpetual profits. I have listened to our attorney general try to justify torture and rendering. I’ve seen White House employees perjure themselves and/or refuse to honor congressional subpoenas; Congress sits on its collective hands. I’ve seen millions of dollars in cash end up “missing” in Iraq. I’ve watched the phony pretense of democracy (by US occupation) pushed on poor Iraqis. I’ve heard the ludicrous assertion that the destruction of Iraq that was clearly created by the U.S. is actually the fault of the Iraqis! Though Bush assured Americans that our time in Iraq would not be permanent, I’ve watched the U.S. spend millions on permanent “superbases” and a palatial embassy in Iraq, while the rest of the country lacks food, water and electricity, and basic infrastructure. I’ve cried over the more than 3,000 U.S. service people and thousands more Iraqis who’ve died in the Middle East as nothing more than pawns in Bush’s contrived little war game for dollars. I cannot witness the flag-draped coffins of our young service people as they are returned home becaus our “news” media won’t broadcast or photograph these oft-repeated events. I’ve witnessed the evolution of privatized mercenary armies. I am disgusted by the fact that our tax dollars pay one mercenary soldier more in two months than most U.S. military personnel make in a year. I’ve watched as veterans’ benefits are slashed and post-war healthcare is either non-existent or mediaeval. Support the troops? How so? Explain to me how Bush supports the troops? We have oil companies making obscene profits while Americans can hardly afford the cost of living increases associated with the ever-rising cost of oil. The stench of war profiteering is unbearable. I’ve watched as this administration has permitted the deregulation of corporations to reach a point where they, in collusion with our government, actually control nearly every aspect of our lives. I’ve seen the once-respected news media become nothing more than a shill and propaganda arm of the White House, willing to lie and subvert the truth to assure their own profit-based agenda. Shall we even discuss the lobbyists, ‘K’ Street, and Wall Street: the fraud, scandals, and corruption that all seem to lead straight to Washington DC? Oh, yes, that’s right, as Bush said, his base is made up with those with money, the “have mores,” as he affectionately refers to them. The “have-mores” have access to power because they can pay for it; the rest of America gets nothing, and is supposed to like it.
Capitalist China is exploiting its industrial revolution as American capitalists did in the early 1900s, and American corporations can’t wait to help them, all the while reducing their expenses, increasing their profits, exploiting poor Chinese, and putting Americans out of work. Shall I mention the dangerous and often toxic products that these American corporations are now shipping back to the U.S.? If they don’t get caught, they don’t care. Hey, with that “invisible hand,” who needs regulation, right? Meanwhile, here at home, the poor are invisible and racism, sexism and classism expose their ugly heads once again under a regressive, reactionary and neo-conservative regime that disguises itself as republicanism. Homosexuals can’t wed. Equal rights? What are those? Whistleblowers and truth tellers are vilified; the ‘player’ is glorified. People are living on and depleting their savings to meet day-to-day expenses. The minimum wage does not even meet the federal government’s set poverty level. Americans go without healthcare insurance and can barely afford to send their kids to college (healthcare and education are only for the elites, right?). Thanks to the Bush Administration our economy is like a house of cards waiting for the next mild breeze to knock it further into the abyss. Years of unprecedented and irresponsible borrowing from China, Saudi Arabia, and others of their ilk have left our dollar so devalued that even Dick Cheney pulled his money out of the American bond markets and invested in the European markets. After all, he needs to protect all that money his war profiteering from stock in Haliburton has made him over the past four years. No conflict of interest, there, huh? Both our trade and budget deficits are so far out of control that it is nearly impossible to comprehend how the U.S. will ever survive economically if we continue along this destructive path. Once again, I’ve seen deregulation of the lending industry lead to fraud and corruption that requires another taxpayer bailout. When we taxpayers need help, who bails us out? Oh, right, when it comes to ordinary Americans, socialism is replaced with social Darwinism.
I could go on, but I won’t. I’m tired and depressed. AND our Senate is disgusted by a political ad? What a bunch of hypocrits.
What is wrong with this Congress? The rarified air on Capitol Hill must be preventing them from finding a conscience. What’s it going to take before people in their position, other than Russ Feingold, are willing to stand up to these fascist criminals who not only fail to defend our Constitution, but unlawfully destroy it with arrogance and impunity on a daily basis. This is not the enlightened America I believe in. Sadly, perhaps, it never really was. Maybe the folks in Congress and the Bush Administration have all become the solipsistic “hucksters” that Theodore Roosevelt warned us about–so brazen and drunk with power and their senses of entitlement and self-importance that they don’t even bother wearing the cloak of democracy anymore. Why not quit with the pretense altogether? Just declare the United States what it really has become: a one-party, fascist, oligarchic, plutocracy–a country of the elites, by the elites, and for the elites. Of course, to help out their corporate ‘wealthfare’ cronies, they’ll still continue to take what’s left of the people’s tax dollars. After all, they only support socialism when it’s time to bail out capitalism, right?
I want to remind them, though, that these things that offend me, but are apparently lost on them, could not have been achieved without their complicity–the 109th and 110th Congress—Democrats and Republicans, alike. They have all failed to remember the prescient words of Justice Louis D. Brandeis:
“The government is the potent omnipresent teacher. It teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. When the government becomes a lawbreaker, it breeds contempt for the law. It invites every man to become a law unto himself. It invites anarchy.”
If nothing else, maybe this will spur them into action: if Congress does not put up a stop sign to this lawlessness, corruption, and hypocrisy soon, they’ll be able to assume responsibility for the eventual irrelevancy of Congress. They are practically irrelevant now, and they only have themselves to blame. Bush can just appoint himself king; Congress allows him to behave like one, anyway. Ironically, we’ll be right back to where we started, pre-1776, looking to start a revolution. Where is a Thomas Jefferson or a Thomas Paine when you need one?
Sadly, I’m starting to realize that, with a very small exception, Democrats and Republicans are really just two sides of the same power-hungry and, at times, nefarious coin. Their agenda has nothing to do with keeping the social contract and representing their constituents. They could not care less about civil liberties and the ethics of process. Their agenda is simple: maintain their jobs, gain more power, and collect more money. The rest of us, well, we can just eat cake, right?
Giovanna, don’t be bashful– tell us how you really feel.
PS: Beautifully and comprehensively stated, although please consider more paragraph breaks next time– without going all Russell Mokhiber on us, of course!
not having read the comments, i probably echo some of them when i find disgust that the senate found time to quickly condemn us for exercising our freedom of speech but will not censure bush or cheney for their many violations of the law and the constitution. i should think lying us into a costly, deadly war would be an impeachable offense. even violating fisa is serious. the executive branch hides its wrongdoing behind a veil of secrecy that claims to protect national security.
Gen. Petraeus is supposedly a battle toughened soldier, are we to believe that he got his feelings hurt by that comment? If it did, too bad! And linking the insult of Petraeus to being an insult to all the armed forces I believe is call false inductive reasoning. Reactions such as this display that our representatives are not picked because of their exceptional minds.
I regret something like MOVEON.ORG was not around to have warned us about the falsehoods made by Colin Powell at the UN. Powell eventually recanted and expressed regret for his role in starting this misadventure in the distant sands. Too late for the thousands killed and maimed, of course. Will we someday see Gen. Petraeust do the same thing?
Cindy, you have a very good chance of replacing the-impeachment-is-off-the table witch, but I am sure you will not make it to the Congress UNLESS:
1) They use voting machines that leave paper trail.
2) You also demand UN election monitors.
Little Brother. Thanks for the nice words. Sorry for the lack of paragraphs–I was aware of it too. I’m usually very careful with my presentation style when I write. Lack of time and lots to say, I suppose. These politicians really get to me….
Giovanna,
I feel the same way. You articulate it very well. I had dinner with a friend last night, and we were discussing politics. I had to change the subject a couple of times because the conversation got rather depressing.
At Camp Casey there ought to be a large 10-acre monument to the million Iraqi civilians slaughtered in the abattoir Bush built.
It seems we ought to ask for design considerations from the public at large
Bravo Cindy. Though we may not be able to count on MoveOn 100%, let’s also give them credit for revealing what Dems we cannot count on 100% so we can substitute them for those we can.
Claudius
We have the same problem at home. We now try to limit how many of the bad things we bring up for discussion whilst moving about the house or throughout meals etc. But we need to remember that all of us need to grieve from time to time especially about things we feel powerless about. I consider that whining to each other about the government is often actually one of the types of grieving that we need to do.
However to actually change those things we grieve about, of course we need to face them and work out ways of getting others to share in our concerns.
It might sound like the obvious but we often end up preaching to the converted - “preachng to the choir” as you say in the U.S.. I get to send many emails about the wars and other bad things to those who like to get them from me. But there are some friends and relatives who threaten to block emails from me if I even send one political or anti war email to them. I sent one to my brother-in-law for the first time in well over a year and the reaction was completely over the top.
Many people who support the U.S. government policies just do NOT want to be personally confronted with ANY criticism AT ALL despite their giving lip-service to “freedom of speech”. (This is one reason MSM also gives why it doesn’t carry too much critical material - they claim people wouldn’t buy their paper/program etc if it was too critical)
But how much should we respect many people’s wishes to not have their day spoiled by a strong criticism of their views? After all their views are supporting disasters inflicted on many innocent people. Well I think we should be guided by what works.
Many people would best be approached by a quiet low keyed appoach and if they respect you as a friend they start to take your views seriously. But in the public arena, to crack the brittle walls of many of the hardened cases, or to even be reported, we need to “shout” to be heard. For such hard cases, there must be more “in their face” symbolic activities and/or statements. Courageous public figures like Cindy Sheehan making “loud” and uncompromising statements also provide an important anchor for those of us who prefer to engage people in friendship.
.
Take responsibility for yourself and your actions, President Bush; stop looking for subordinates to defend you and your actions; take responsibility for yourself, President Bush, take responsibility for your actions.
Cindy Sheehan’s prospects for changing the political scene in the U.S. for the good figure to accomplish nothing more than Ralph Nader did in the disastrous elections of 2000. This is because, as with Nader, her “a curse upon both your houses” approach is weighted in exactly the wrong direction, with the lion’s share of her attacks being delivered against the Democrats, while the real culprits, the Republicans, are less often mentioned.
In this article she referred directly to the Democrats several times, including right at the start when she criticized Move-On for the apparently horrific crime of supporting the Democrats. But she referred to the Republicans directly only once and then only as a passing mention shut off from her main thought in parens.
I suppose that for various reasons it isn’t convenient for Sheehan and her boosters to recall that the attack on Iraq was a notion set into motion by a purely Republican administration backed by a majority Republican Legislature, a majority Republican-installed Judiciary, and a large number of nearly comatose supposed-to-be citizens.
If Sheehan continues to show the same lack of awareness about who the real enemy is, she runs the great risk of harming the nation next year and later as Nader did seven years ago. But I doubt that she will change her off-tune. She has too many urging her on who see things in the same distorted way and whose credo must be, “Slap the Democrats but leave the Republicans alone. They’re too tough.”
On the contrary, Cindy’s ire for the Democrats is well-founded because they are the ones who “leave the Republicans alone”. That is to say, when they aren’t voting to help the GOP rend the Constitution into tiny bits.
Thanks Rick for the link !!!
I am sending it out….10 Steps to Faschism..
also
Philip Roth’s It Can’t Happen Here”
Rick September 21st, 2007 12:47 pm
This the comment that most caught my interest, “Anyone who is concerned with the rapid slide to fascism”.
Here is a link to very good article on that very subject.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article18426.htm
:
Petraeus ate a booger the size of a small apple on national TV during the Senate hearings, but apparently all the networks cut away from it.
Read all about it here.
This is the Democratic Party’s war, and Democrats are the real problem. Cindy Sheehan is right in attacking them, I just wished she were more aggressive.
Not only did the Democrats in Congress who voted YES on this revolting resolution against the first amendment betray us, but they also revealed themselves as the Republican clones that they’ve always been.
Until we have idiots who keep supporting and voting for the WAR PARTY (DNC), we’ll stay in Iraq forever.
I agree with Cindy that moveon could be tougher. However, with the Blue Dog Democrats and others of that ilk the party has been co-opted. In order to win more seats the party has supported the election of Republican leaning Democrats. These so called Democrats will never support our most progressive legislation. MoveOn has asked it’s membership if the organization should support progressive Democrats who will run against these blue dogs in the Democratic primary. I think that needs to be done.