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UN Protects Israel From Racism Charges
BETHLEHEM, Occupied West Bank - As the wreckage from Israel's recent siege on Gaza continues to smoulder, international civil society organisations are assembling this week in Switzerland to address Israel's crimes of military occupation and racism.
But any discussion on Israel's actions in Palestine will be excluded from the formal framework at the Durban Anti-Racism Review Conference in Geneva Monday. Israel-Palestine has been deliberately eliminated from the official programme, structured by the UN Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights (UN OHCHR). Civil society groups believe that the United States, countries within the European Union and Israel pressured the UN to omit a review of Israel's racial discrimination against Palestinians.
Hundreds of delegations from non-governmental organisations (NGOs) and human rights organisations will converge in Geneva for the Durban Review Conference on Racism. The conference is a follow-up to the 2001 World Conference Against Racism (WCAR) in Durban, South Africa, that outlined an international legal and political concept to deal with global issues of race and human rights.
Immediately following that conference, the WCAR NGO forum recommended an international campaign of isolation towards Israel's institutionalised "brand of apartheid and other racist crimes against humanity."
The Durban Review Conference website states that the 2009 Geneva symposium is designed to "review progress and assess the implementation of the Durban Declaration and Programme of Action (DDPA)." Adopted by general consensus at the 2001 WCAR in Durban, "the DDPA is a comprehensive, action-oriented document that proposes concrete measures to combat racism, racial discrimination, xenophobia and related intolerance. It is holistic in its vision, addresses a wide range of issues, and contains far- reaching recommendations and practical measures."
In order to assess and review any progress made since the 2001 WCAR in Durban, Palestinian human rights organisations planned several side events that were to take place within the schedule of the conference.
However, two weeks ago, the UN High Commissioner's office unilaterally cancelled all side-events pertaining to Palestine issues. Ingrid Jarradat- Gassner, director of the BADIL Resource Centre for Palestinian Residency and Refugee Rights in Bethlehem, one of several Palestine-based organisations attending the Durban Review conference, tells IPS that BADIL and the other NGOs had organised a side-event specifically about how and why they see Israel as a "regime of institutionalised racial discrimination on both sides of the Green Line."
"As Palestinian NGOs and other NGOs working on the issue of Israel and its violations against the rights of the Palestinian people, we were expecting that there would be a possibility for us to organise these side-events during the official Durban review conference in Geneva," Jarradat-Gassner says. "We were informed by the UN itself that this would be possible."
Jarradat-Gassner says that on Apr. 3, less than three weeks before the Durban Review Conference, the UN High Commissioner's office called BADIL's representative in Geneva into a meeting at the UN, and verbally informed her that all side-events pertaining to the specific issue of Palestine and Israel had been banned.
"We were not even informed in any sort of direct of official way. In fact, we have no record of the decision of the UN not to let us work on such side- events," says Jarradat-Gassner.
According to the UN's Durban Review Conference agenda, other side-events focusing on indigenous rights, women's rights and the link between racism and poverty will have an official platform.
Jarradat-Gassner says she knows there is a specific apprehension within the political UN body towards Palestine issues. In the draft document for the Durban Review Conference, she points out, there are particular recommendations for victims of HIV/AIDS, for victims of slave trade, Roma people, people of African descent, but, Jarradat-Gassner says, "there is not a single reference to Palestine, Palestinians or Israel in this whole document."
BADIL, Al-Haq (a Palestinian human rights organisation) and Adallah (the Legal Centre for Arab Minority Rights in Israel) wrote a joint formal complaint to the UN OHCHR, but have not received any reply. The UN OHCHR did not respond to IPS's request for a comment either.
Dr. Richard Falk, the United Nations Special Rapporteur for Human Rights in the Occupied Palestinian Territories, tells IPS he had not known about the disallowance of side-events pertaining to Palestine/Israel by the UN's OHCHR. "One has to assume it was part of an effort to meet the objections of the United States that the event was discrediting to the extent it engaged in 'Israel-bashing'." However, Falk points out, "U.S. leverage is probably greater than it has been because Obama is President and Washington has indicated its intention to rejoin the Human Rights Council."
Palestinian organisations say that banning these side-events is a significant disappointment in pursuing Israel's legal responsibility towards its actions in Palestine. Dr. Falk echoes this sentiment. "I believe that the strong evidence of Israeli racism during the recent Gaza attacks makes it strange to refuse NGOs organising side-events to address the issue," he tells IPS. "Also, the collective punishment aspects of the occupation seem to qualify the Israeli policy as a form of racism, combined with the rise of the extreme right, with (Avigdor) Lieberman as (Israeli) foreign minister."
Jarradat-Gassner says that within the framework of the Durban Review Conference, the issue of Palestine and Israel should be prominent. "There is an obvious link between colonisation and apartheid (in Palestine-Israel). If you have a settler-colonial regime that comes here to stay, and codifies into law its relationship of domination over the indigenous population, you are entering the field of apartheid...We are talking about what Israel has been practising over the last 60 years in Palestine."
Meanwhile, anticipating a limited platform for debate and discussion on Israel's actions in Palestine, BADIL helped structure a separate symposium along with international Palestinian human rights and justice organisations and sponsored by the Palestinian Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions National Committee.
Entitled the Israel Review Conference: United Against Apartheid, Colonialism and Occupation: Dignity & Justice for the Palestinian People, these Palestine- focused NGOs will have a platform to address international civil society two days before the Durban Review conference commences. Jaradat-Gassner tells IPS she hopes that the Israel Review Conference "succeeds to make mainstream the analysis of Israel as a regime of colonial apartheid that also uses military occupation. It's not easy to dismiss this sort of analysis."
Additionally, U.S. President Barack Obama's administration appears to have decided not to attend the Durban Review conference. In 2001, the United States representatives walked out of the first Durban conference when Zionism was defined as racism against Palestinians.
In the United States, progressive African-American organisations have expressed their disappointment and frustration that Obama has avoided the Durban Review conference. Ajamu Baraka, executive director of the U.S. Human Rights Network in Atlanta, Georgia, tells IPS that his organisation "takes the position that the Obama administration should participate and be willing to discuss all of the issues that will be addressed during the review process...A strong stand on this issue by the first African-American President of the United States would have a revolutionary impact on the global discourse on race."
- Posted in
36 Comments so far
Show AllOh, boo-hoo. The mean United States is ruining our fun.
The apparaent "dead skunk" ( in TheMiddleRoad ) smell you emote, is overpoweringly nauseating.
Please attempt to clean up your act.
Namaste
How can Israel be a racist society when they don't consider Palestinians as humans? The revered Israeli General Moshe Dayan advised Israel's leadership that it should 'make it clear to refugees that "we have no solution, you shall continue to live like dogs, and whoever wishes may leave"'.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2002/may/11/usa.comment
Sir Winston Churchill, a staunch defender of the Zionist project, was equally forthright when testifying before a Parliamentary Commission on Palestine:
I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place.
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Churchill
The truth of history cannot be erased.
Justice will come some day.
This stupidity is likely posted by the same shill that is TheMiddleRoad. The idea is to piss on this article and this site in order to discredit vocal opposition to Israeli crimes.
The Global Elite/
The House of Rothschild/
International Jewish
Terrorist Network
"We need to take away the foundation for terrorism,
and establish barriers to its activites and its spread"
-Javier Solano-EU High Commissioner
POINTS:
1. Anti-Christ will be Jew
2. House of Rothschild/ Head of Snake/Ardent Zionist
3. Terrorism in Israel/War on TERROR- USA/EU/Israel
4. Using FEAR to procure billions into US/EU military-industrial-intelligence National Security State complex to protect International Jewish Corporate Empire from the Masses of the peoples on the planet
5. US/British/Israeli Axis of Evil
The Rothschild Empire is today the richest, most powerful, most influential temporal force on the planet.
Based primarily in London, UK, it has amassed untold TRILLIONS in wealth over the past 3 centuries to become the prime mover and shaker in international political and financial affairs.
The House of Rothschild is ardently jewish and staunchly pro-zionist in its religious disposition and affairs. As of the year 2000, they have decided to engage and promulgate "international terrorism" to catalyze and 'fast track' their ultimate quest and goal for a One World Government based in the European Union.
Rothschild interests not only control the United States of America directly through the US Federal Reserve, they also control (and weild) the most lethal military fighting force in the world today: the US military. This International Jewish Terrorist Empire fights by proxy, that is, they get others to fight, kill and die for them, in this case, deluded and deceived Americans.
There exists a US/British/Israeli Axis of Evil that is reeking absolute havoc upon our world today, committing acts of military, economic and environmental terrorism, exploitation and destruction on an unprecedented scale all over the world, leaving only death, ruin, chaos and vengence in its wake.
The Rothschilds operate out of the financial district in the heart of London, England; known as 'the City'. All major British banks have their main offices there, along with branch offices for nearly 400 foreign banks, including at least 70 from the United States. Within 'the City' exists the Bank of England, the London Stock Exchange, Lloyd's of London, Fleet Street (home of international publishing and media/newspaper interests), the London Commodity Exchange and the London Metal Exchange. It is literally the financial hub of the world...
Covering an area of 677 acres or one square mile (known as the wealthiest square mile on Earth), the City is ruled by a Lord Mayor who is personally apppointed by the Rothschilds. 'The City' is, in its own right, a sovereign state existing within the confines of the larger city of London per se', much like the Vatican is within the city of Rome.
The United Kingdom (as well as the entire European Union), is controlled, directed and governed by the powers that be within 'the City'. The British throne (the Crown), the prime minister and the UK Parliament are all fronts for the Rothschild Empire, as will the European Commission, Council and Parliament be when the EU assumes its role as global headquarters for One World Government in the not to distant future.
The fact that the richest, most powerful dynasty in the world is Jewish should explain why the current international terrorist network operates out of the US/British/Israeli triad; the very heart of International Jewry. However, the Rothschild Empire has no love for jews in general, as they were the principal financier of Hitler's Germany and the prime cause for the Nazi Holocaust. International geo-strategic and geo-political 'one world' interests come first, from their perspective.
Al-Qaida and the US/EU/Israeli so-called 'War on Terror' are all funded and directed by this International Zionist Cabal of Jewish Financiers based in London. At issue here is the use of raw force to dictate 'one world' strategem for economic and political consolidation, as well as to control and defend the empire against the masses of hungry, desperate and angry peoples of the world, whose ranks are growing rapidly.
That the Rothschilds control, influence and direct international intelligence agencies such as the CIA, NSA, GCHQ, Mossad and M16 etc...is practically a given. In fact, such a worldwide intelligence network has been the very secret, or key, to its phenomenal rise to global power this past half century.
There are only 5 nations in the world left without a Rothschild controlled central bank: Iran, North Korea, Sudan, Cuba and Libya. Enter the so-called 'war on terror' and the real international jewish terrorist modus operendi that is about to strike Iran as they did Iraq, who was previously on that short list, but is no more.
Today, the USA is currently being set up for the fall. Targets: anti-'One World' US patriots, American freedom and independence, the US Bill of Rights, The US dollar and New York City- London's chief financial rival for world economic control, dominance and authority. NYC will most likely be "nuked" by this International Jewish Terrorist Network (under the guise of CIA/M16/Mossad sponsored Al Qaida) once America has run its course for the Jew World Order.
The very nature of securing and maintaining international power, from their perspective, is to employ every kind of diabolical, insidious, wicked and evil means of deceit, deception and terror (the motto for Israel's Mossad is 'by way of deception') in order to effectively procure their rule and reign on Earth- and this they do without remorse.
The state of Israel, though, is the crown jewel of international jewish world plans to assume the throne of global dictate. Ceasar, Fuhrer, King, Prince... whatever name or title one confers, it is a near certainty that he who will rule from Jerusalem will emerge from the House of Rothschild- the very root of international jewish terrorism.
The Anti-Christ will be Jew, sure to be a Man of fierce countenance, when he proclaims himself 'god' of this world at the end of history.
Selah,
Jonas the Prophet
Planet Earth
http://jonahtheprophet.tk
They make padded rooms for people like this....
We are so sorry that your accomodations
have not been satisfactory
--------- the Management
You should be.
I will attempt to "manage" some compassion for the guilty,
as placing all of that effort on the victims is just so demanding
Now you're just making stuff up.
By the way, i doubt you even bothered to read what 'Jonas the Prophet' wrote..check out the website link.
Jonas would like to, among other things, dismantle the Dome of the Rock and Al-Aqsa Mosque and build some peace center in an elementary school in Nederland, Colorado. He would of course be the 'Messenger of the Covenant' to the world.
It's all in his website.
Maybe you could be his 'manager'
"Now you're just making stuff up."
What ever I must do to keep you comfortable ( i.e. controlled ),
as the other patients do so often complain.
So i gather you don't think very highly of the medical field of psychiatry?
Has psychiatry been misused. Of course, but then again nearly all of medicine has been abused.
I do have a request, i see how much you love to ignore the actual points of a comment and just engage in ad hominem attacks but i really am curious now...do you actually believe Jonas?
I never said that I did, or even implied that -- as it might fan your flames.
What I do believe is that the intricate levels of manipulation, disinformation, misinformation, misdirection, outright lies, and PSYOPS propaganda have long been twisting these highly emotional issues to the boiling point and liken to Gordian Knot.
That said, there are various elements of truth, which are interrupted and abused by and with incontrovertible lies.
The truth is a relative issue, and more often than not is useful as a continual sets of questions and answers, each getting a little closer to what is real. Of course the path taken, is blocked by certain pre-conditions and positions, so that for many -- the pursuit of truth would literally mean the elimination of their personality and belief system.
Did many many Jews die in Stalin's pogroms, of course.
Did the pathocrats in Stalin's wicked machine of terror make use of the 'Protocols of Zion' to further their purposes to kill off and blame Jews, of course.
What is more interesting to me, is that Zionists themselves use these very protocols for their own demented purposes, which for many the "end justifies the means", but never for me.
What I mean is that Zionists will make and have been proved to have made sacrifices of Jews, like in '47 King David Hotel bombing, in order to forward their long established pursuits of power, control, and creation and continuation of the state of Israel.
In other discussions here on CD, I've been informed that there are many levels and degrees of radical action and thought, within the larger Zionist community and history -- as is true of all human activities.
The the reflective banter of anti-Semitism is well used as a shield to block thorough investigation and distillation of the underlying truths. This is similar to the flawed logic trick of "point source" as if the many faceted expression of millions could ever me ascribed or distilled to just a few points of view, much less to a single "point".
So I'll ask you, "How often do you think that the Zionists cause and members, justify their own use of anti-Semitism in pursuit of the bigger picture payoff of stabilizing Israel's position in the world ?
The evidence is blatant and clear that many Zionists did in fact -- block the 1930s attempts at exodus of large numbers of Jews from Germany ( boats loaded with potential refugees, were turned around in NYC, and sent back to Germany ).
¿ Why do you think that "they" did that ?
¿ Is it even possible to discuss that reality, w/o being castigated as A.S. ?
¿ Do you really believe that the AIPAC ( presumed innocent possible ) traitors caught recently passing classified national state secrets to Israel, are being hounded by A.S. terrorists intent on violating the free speech rights of some Jews to send what they see as non-privileged ( w/o any strings attached ) info back to Israeli INtelligence ?
Go ahead read and reply about this investigation of same, and earlier case of POLARD :
Adding Insult to Injury - Powerful Jewish Groups Demand Case Against Accused Spies Be Dropped
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/182141-Adding-Insult-to-Injury-Powerful-Jewish-
Groups-Demand-Case-Against-Accused-Spies-Be-Dropped
You Zionist have a lot of "explaining to do " … … …
Namaste
HMMM, forgive me but i interpret your quick remark at me being a defacto support for Mr. Jonas. I call him crazy, he does seem to be delusional, and you retort with sarcasm...if you think he is crazy then why remark?
What flames? If i were flaming i would have made a long drawn out comment, kinda like you did, but rather i made a quick euphemism.
What is a good example of paranoia? Would it be imagining that a small group of Jews use their money to control and instigate every 'evil' thing that has occurred in the world for the past couple hundred years....
"The truth is a relative issue" -What? The truth isn't relative, that's why it's called the truth. It's this 'relative' issue that's causing those Gordian Knots you lament about...Real truth is concrete.
"there are various elements of truth" -There's another name for this...A LIE! or Deception!
While not excusing the King David Hotel bombing, I personally don't agree with blowing up buildings for the purpose of a statement, it was been widely acknowledged that Irgun went to great lengths to avoid any casualties. They told everybody what they were doing...The London News Bureau ran a headline about the bombing some 15 minutes before it even happened...3 phone calls warning about the bomb we're made by the bombers...the bombers also warned the Arab kitchen works to flee-they were the only ones who heeded the warning.
The Patria Disaster is regarded as an accident-a good intention that turned tragic.
FDR sent the St. Louis, aka the voyage of the damned, back to Britain and France but even that occurred before France had fallen to the Nazis. No ship was sent back to Germany but rather sent back to Europe and this occurred before the fall of Europe. It was once said by the Guardian i believe that the world was divided into two places-were Jews could live and were Jews couldn't go. The world thought Hitler was just going to oppress the Jews and for that they just shrugged their shoulders but once nations realized that Hitler was extermination the Jews a paradigm shift occurred.
I don't see how this is an example of Jews sacrificing other Jews.
Not to say that doesn't happen. I've read Mila 18, it's based on historical events where some Jews were glad to help the Nazis for a couple bucks. But this happens in every culture. Look at the Muslims who sell other Muslims out to the US! The US offers cash rewards for terrorist and some Muslims are handing over innocent Muslims for a couple of bucks. Likewise how is it any different when a black man sells crack cocaine to a black kid? Some people will sell out their own mother for a buck.
I didn't call Jonas anti-semitic i called him loony.
The calling A.S. is made far too frequently but that doesn't mean it doesn't occur at all.
I don't know how Jews doing wrong to other Jews is anti-semitic. Switzerland isn't an anti-semitic nation but they did wrong the Jews b/c they saw an opportunity to make a buck. It isn't anti-semitic to wrong a person who happens to be Jewish. Antisemitism is wronging a Jew b/c they are a Jew. So during WWII there were some Jews who made a good deal of money selling out other Jews. Some people will do anything for a buck.
Pollard is where he belongs. It doesn't matter what nation he spied for he spied. Truth be told i think the fact that is was for Israel is what made his punishment the max. We are Israel's staunchest friend and they still spied on us...we we're pissed and we made Pollard into our punching bag. Had he done it for say Canada or Mexico, lesser allies, he wouldn't have gotten life.
AIPAC, like all lobbyist groups, is too powerful-although i don't agree that 'they control the government. I have no doubt that Israel is just like every other nation in the world. Everybody spies on everybody else. Britain spies on us, France definitely does, i don't understand the big deal. When caught they all go to jail.
I'll ask you this, why does your desire to argue with me led you to side indefensible nut jobs like Jonas?
Why do you have this animosity towards Zionist? I'm not calling you Antisemitic but i don't thing your unbiased either. Nobody is denying that Israel has committed crimes, well maybe some are but they are like Jonas, but to have an almost reflexive blame Israel mentality simply isn't productive nor right. Why was there no news on this site about the Palestinian children orchestra being shut down b/c they played for Holocaust survivors? If this site cares so much about Palestine why didn't i see a headline talking about the Hamas executions of supposed Israeli collaborators who all happened to be Fatah members? Reading this site leads you to believe that nothing good comes out of Israel. It doesn't matter what the political spectrum is, a biased news site is useless.
PART _____ 2 of 2 _____
You obviously have lead a sheltered life, for you to believe that " The truth isn't relative, that's why it's called the truth. " It is the questions not the answers that real wisdom is found, but I guess that's p[art of your problem -- thinking that the answers are enough and that "concrete" shall set you free.
Why cannot Zionists just come out and directly repudiate Menachem Bagin and the Irgun, as mass murdering terrorists that they obviously are ? In courts of law, war crimes, and in the hearts of the victims -- do you really think anyone gives a shit that "it was been widely acknowledged that Irgun went to great lengths to avoid any casualties … London News Bureau … 3 phone calls warning " ?
Nonetheless, there it is pure and simple -- terrorism -- with no repudiation, just BS excuses that in most courts would hardly loosen the noose in the least. And then for Zionists to elect such scum to high office is the ultimate nose thumbing insult to past, current, and future victims of unrelenting Israeli greed and violence, toward further land theft and torture of it's unacknowledged indigenous population of Palestinians.
Yeah, I know "[you] don't see how this is an example of Jews sacrificing other Jews, " that in a nutshell is the problem -- more unfounded denial. And of course traitors exist in all cultures, but most do not elevate those organizations to the status of such high regard and esteem shown to the Zionists.
You ignore a major element of the truth of Pollard's evil impact, when you state "Truth be told i think the fact that is was for Israel is what made his punishment the max." What about Israel taking these 1,000,000 pages of stolen top national defense secrets, and selling them to our absolute worse enemy Russia -- for profit and deals to release more Russian Jews ?
I it were true that "I have no doubt that Israel is just like every other nation in the world," please do provide references for equivalent PACs ( like AIPAC ) for all other immigrants' Countries -- in proportion to their numbers ? Explain how such disproportional foreign influence is "good" for America, any examples ?
You're wrong on both counts, when yu say that "Reading this site leads you to believe that nothing good comes out of Israel. It doesn't matter what the political spectrum is, a biased news site is useless."
Perhaps the news is exactly as it seems, that almost nothing good is coming out of Israel -- although it is humorous that Jews now lie about the source of their fruit, to escape embargoes. I will grant you that the fruits themselves are intrinsically good, and do come out of Israel -- but often just rot away, because of the rest of the big picture world coming in with judgements.
As far as news is concerned, the actual availability of unbiased news is nearly impossible, so people interested in the truth cannot rely on any one or two sources -- and must distill the pieces across the tide of false and purposely misdirecting news. What truly is worse than "useless" is people committed to disreputable acts to propagate lies and distortions to their petty pathetic cause's advantage, regardless if being paid or not.
Namaste
I'm sheltered because i believe truth is finite? What you seem to believe truth to be is some elastic opinion of facts. It believing in absolutes is being sheltered then the whole world would be better off being sheltered.
The Bush administration tortured prisoners b/c they share your position of 'the truth.'
There are some absolutes in this world. Truth is one of them.
Actually a court of law does differentiate between the two-at least in the Western Judicial System.
We have a tiered system, 1st, 2ch, 3rd, degree murder, manslaughter, and involuntary manslaughter-that would be what the Irgun should have been charged with by the way.
The victims aren't allowed to sit on the jury for a reason you know.
Bagin should never have been elected to office but neither should practically any of the Palestinian leaders as well. Once again you hold the Israelis to a higher standard than the Palestinians.
Sadly those traitors as you call them usually do get elevated to high positions. Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Arafat, Bush, Pol Pot, the list goes on and on!!!!
I said AIPAC is to influential but that is more so b/c the Sup Court decided to treat money as a form of speech.
AARP is also too powerful...are you going to condemn all the elderly people in the US too?
You don't seem to know much about political culture. Only Allied nations would have PACs in the US. Britain does and they use it to influence government military contracts. Nations that aren't allied with us know that having a PAC on k street would be a waste of time and money. Do realize though that the Palestinians have a couple of PACs just like Israel does but they just don't have the influence. Seeing how the nation of Israel is so favored in the country it is only logical that the Israel PACs are among the most influential.
You know all those Green ideas being offered around today, the movement to save the world be eliminating the carbon footprint...they pretty much all came from Israel. Over 90% of Israel homes use solar panels for example...but you are right nothing good comes from Israel.
NO, whats worse than useless is people that are so blinded by their hatred that they can no longer see objectively. Those people, you for instance, are useless.
Many Progressives believe that ( about everything ):
The only thing _ A B S O L U T E _
is that it's all _ R E L A T I V E _
While fundamentalist "thinkers" like yourself, are committed to singular, everlasting SOLID truths, just like concrete boots now drawing you to oceans deep.
Flexible or non-existant morality ( and commitments to create World Terror ) lead $hrubi$h & Co. to unrelenting torture, death, and suffering of millions. There is virtue in seeking for truth, but that was never intended nor a result of any torture.
The wisdom of the ages hardly condones unmitigated violence nor torture -- and instead suggests the primary source of absolute information and knowledge is within each of us -- not "out there".
You assert that the "court of law does differentiate between the two," while you were discussing truth, which is somehow disconcerting from what you claim to believe.
¿ What do you think there is two of ?
You pathetically assert Irgun would be charged with as little as "involuntary manslaughter", which has no legal precedent -- while in fact all actions committed during the commission of a felony are interpreted as being from the most venal of motives ( not the least, because they really really tried to call ).
You're completely busted on that one !
If you still want to argue, just look into "special circumstances" being applied when 2 or more are killed, especially with complete premeditation. And then consider several dozen dead that were essentially an act of war, when there was no war.
No repudiation of Zionist fiends and a minor whine 'it should have been' hardly is proportional nor appropriate.
You comment "AIPAC is to[o] influential but that is more so b/c the Sup Court decided to treat money as a form of speech", which proves govt/corporate fascism being institutionalized -- which neither condones nor absolves AIPAC of treasonist activities. They've just been able to skirt the law ( and real consequences ) b/c of corruption, payoffs and political expediency of neoCONer's matching ageneda.
You rant about "AARP is also too powerful...are you going to condemn all the elderly people in the US too?", but fail completely to demonstrate any AARP-instigated wars costing trillion$ and millions of lives upset or dead.
Yes perhaps I am under-informed about PAC-rat "accomplishments", but nothing close to war against Iraq & Afghanistan has ever been influenced from our "Allies". Influencing military contracts is just piece meal corruption and greed, and is way under the league of warmongering conflict initiators. Having political assassination squads successfully eliminating many COngressmen & women just doesn't happen with Palestinian PACs, so proportionality bites you once again.
You really placed yourself out on a limb with erroneous unprovable assertion that "the nation of Israel is so favored in the country", when in fact surveys and polls consistently show the opposite in actual opinions of the people. The manufactured consensus is just belt-way hogwash, that the media propagates as if it were true ( when it isn't ). Israeli rope ( good faith ) is just about stretched long enough by now, to support a good hanging. It should have been cut off with USS Liberty.
You are obviously psychotic to assert that I'm "blinded by their hatred that they can no longer see objectively. Those people, you for instance, are useless.", when in fact it is you is so full of hate and fear -- and cannot win even a few minor points of a real discussion
Namaste
Are you familiar with the legal theory of mens rea?
The bomber of the building would gulty of involuntary manslaughter with willful disregard for human life-as well as destruction of private property and terrorism.
The principal difference between this and murder is the act lacked malice. One can only be charged with murder if there was an intent to kill. The British Government has admitted that the Igrum had no intention of taking a life during the act.
So when i asserted that a "court of law does differentiate between the two" i was referring to the multi-tiered nature of criminal prosecution.
"The only thing _ A B S O L U T E _is that it's all _ R E L A T I V E _"
....Yeah, so if there are no absolute laws then...
~Slavery can be okay under certain circumstances?
~Depending on the situation raping a women is permitted?
"Flexible or non-existent morality ( and commitments to create World Terror ) lead $hrubi$h & Co. to unrelenting torture, death, and suffering of millions. There is virtue in seeking for truth, but that was never intended nor a result of any torture."
-I find it odd that you mention morality when in a world without absolutes there can be no morality!!!
Also, that torture you're complaining about is also permitted in a world of relativity.
Here's the classic problem for those who believe in moral relativity-If nothing is absolute then the Holocaust, Apartheid, Genocide, and slave trade aren't wrong. Again, in fact in a relative world there are no morals but rather just cultural and social norms. Further for you to force your cultural and social norms on other people would be ethnocentric.
I say that slave trading is self evidently wrong (and immoral but you don't believe in morals so never mind) but a self evident position can only exist when speaking of absolutes. If you claim that there are no absolutes in the world then you are arguing that for some people slave trading is perfectly fine.
I know, logic can be so stubborn sometimes...
"You really placed yourself out on a limb with erroneous unprovable assertion that "the nation of Israel is so favored in the country", when in fact surveys and polls consistently show the opposite in actual opinions of the people."
-Every Gallup poll since 1967 has favored Israel over the Palestinians.
The current gallup poll, and the only one done under Obama, is Israel 59% and Palestine 18%.
Yeah when i say the US overwhelmingly supports Israel it is an empirical fact.
www.gallup.com/poll/116308/Americans-Support-Israel-Unchanged-Gaza-Conflict.aspx
"[You] cannot win even a few minor points of a real discussion," what the hell are you talking about? You were categorically wrong with regards to the criminal charges and you obviously never bothered to actual check the polling data b/c you were once again completely wrong. Yes, you are blind.
PART _____ 1 of 2 _____
"What flames? "
you ask, might I be trying to quench, after your flushing all of Jonas' free speech rights down the toilet of ad hominem attack that he should be locked away in the insane asylum. You certainly exhibit a very level low self-awareness and inability to recall your previous statements. Perhaps that is an indication of their being scripted knee-jerk reactions to those you must oppose, which leads to little personal investment in the thoughts, and even less authenticity ?
Your pre-defensive position for the assault on Jonas' right to speak, is "i would have made a long drawn out comment, kinda like you did, but rather i made a quick euphemism." I really suspect most people would rather be told "shut the fuck up", than much shorter misguided genteelism "you're insane" -- but that is the manner of PSYOPS to inflict disproportional pain, with savage rapier thrusts -- is it not ?
Your exaggerated absurdity is apparent with "small group of Jews use their money to control and instigate every 'evil' thing that has occurred in the world for the past couple hundred years....", which in no way deflects the real truth of the Rothchilds empire of interconnected families and global influence, especially in the most wicked aspects of the bankster industry -- whose primary focus is profiting from both sides of those at war, and starting warmongering assaults on weaker countries to attempt to assuage their uncontrolled greed and pursuit of ever greater power and control.
I don't believe that some group of Jews is responsible for starting all wars, but it is likely that a disproportionate number of Jews are profiting from most of those wars, that they are not involved in other than as "investments". The very idea of a military and hate-based economy deadicated to artificially creating continual crises and upheavals for greater profits, is despicably evil and inhumane. The fact that some Jews are part of this circle of death is not in question, nor is there any doubt that every culture has its own share of psychopathic individuals willing to do whatever … for money and power.
Anyone who doubts this should attempt to consider that there is no time for the serfs and farmers of adjacent countries to plan invasions, flim-flam banksterism, and imperialistic pursuits. No, that is the role of the privileged leisure class -- who have something to gain by acts of war and conquest.
The insidious web of connections that you criticize as "a good example of paranoia", is well documented and is simply expedient and good business practice ( e.g. interlocking Bds of directors ), regardless of its immorality and shameless other practices of grinding human lives into numbers on quarterly statements.
The heartless capitalistic monster is a pervasive sickness that goes well beyond solely Jewish ownership. I doubt that you really up to denying the existence and influence of the Trilateral, CRC, Blidenberg, neoCONers, PNAC, etc … , is that correct ?
It seems you need to take Free Speech 101 for you just don't understand. It is under the principal of free speech that i criticize Jonas.
" I really suspect most people would rather be told "shut the fuck up", than much shorter misguided genteelism "you're insane"
1) It's a bit presumptuous of you to assume you know what people want to be told.
2) I don't tell people to shut up; i respect the right of free speech but i will call out a person who makes wild accusations.
The Rothschilds were once rulers of the Global banking system but they've pretty much withered away. Remember the Nazi's stole all the Austrian families wealth and the French nationalized the French families bank. Today they do most M & A and aren't even the biggest. They do make a very good bottle of wine though.
It's comical how you accuse anyone who doesn't agree with you of being 'Israeli PSYOPS.'
jonahprophet "Anti-Christ will be Jew"
Come to think of it, Christ was also a Jew.
Which makes me wonder how ironic is the fact that a Jew hater as you, jonahprophet, worship a Jew (Jesus).
Peace for Israel is to have the entire world submit to their rule by iron rod.
That's in the Bible - Deuteronomy I think.
Now there is a surprise, the UN siding with America.
When America began the latest illegal war of aggression in Iraq it was under the cover of the UN Resolution 1441. While at the same time the US Gov is in direct violation of its own treaties, over 300 to be close in number, with the Native Tribes who had occupied the geographic territory. These were treaties the Americans brought to the Native People, not the other way around.
The Israeli occupation of Palestine was illegal from the begining, and has not gained credibility since then.
The 'irony' that history will study will most likely be that; an essentially illegal nation, the Unites States of America, would support another illegal nation, Israel, and the rest of the world allowed it. They both continue to conduct themselves in an illegal manner, with very serious consequences for what is a vast majority of innocent human beings. The other "great nation" Britain (and they are not 'great') has just as much innocent blood on its 'flag' as its major supporters.
Individually they are helpless without all of the material wealth they have stolen from so many. If human kind can survive these challenges, there may be hope. At least they will have the negative examples established with these representatives of "human kind" ---It makes most of the Native Americans I know 'almost' ashamed to be a "human being"---( well I did say 'almost').
No one reading this now will be alive to see it, but the USA and Israel and all of their allies will fail, most likely from within, and/or take each other with them into oblivion.
The one thing to hope for is that the future members of 'human kind' will learn from the terrible example set by these nations---of human beings.
Good Luck World, you really need it.
Figure it out. It's all the white trash nations that are boycotting the conference.
The sooner the Anglo-Saxon genetic stain is removed from the human strain, the sooner humanity can dwell in peace.
UN, US -- one gets confused.
Nations not on the Security Council could use another organization.
One of the definition of anti-semitism is: Put one set of rules for Jews, and a different one for everyone else.
(I hope all the progressive people in CD would agree that putting different rules only against one ethnic group is wrong)
Now examin what UN Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights did in 2001:
In Durban they declaired that the Jewish state is racists, while all other countries on the planet aren’t. (According to Durban, all other 191 UN members, some of which are the worse Human right abusers, were not mentioned as racists.)
Durben and Durben II which were suppose to fight racism, end up promoting racism.
Now I’ll wait for all the hard core anti-Israeli and anti-semite commenters in this forum to say that it’s all right to single out only Israel (A country which on many Human Right issues is the most progressive in the middle east), while ignoring other much worse cases. Defending their racist agenda with arguments such as:
- It’s OK to critisize only Israel, it’s a good cause.
- Israel is the only racist (or the most racist) country on the planet, therefore there is nothing wrong with single out only Israel.
- Racism against Jews is not anti-semitism.
- Etc…
I’m waiting…
There is a real challenge for the mental wizards out there---you must be the president of that "club"
So here goes "ace"..........
Name one nation on the face of the planet that is organized around one "race"---i.e.
The Jews are considered a race, and Israel, both historically and currently were established for the "Jewish" people. Prior to the Roman era, the "Jews;" laid claim to Israel "because God gave it to them"----
Then they lost it, for the same reason they are loosing it now, and then mental wizards (much like yourself) RE-established the modern state of "Israel"--1948--for the "Jewish People".........................and they are now committing the very same crimes against others that were committed against them---for the very same motivations-----------RACE.
One of the reasons the USA and the world at large is in so much trouble presently is that people like you have the "vote"----or other power, even though you are so very ignorant.
Good Luck, you really need it.
Yes, here is another one that can be added to the list of reasons why single out only Israel is "legit":
NativeSon: "The Jews are considered a race" (Therefore the Jewish state, as the only country in the world who is consist of people of one race, should be exterminated.)
---
The last one who claimed that Jews are a race was Hitler.
How can a black Ethiopian Jew be of the same race as a white European Jew or a Middle Eastern Jew?
B.T.W - The Jews (And the Israelites before them) always saw themselves as a nation and not as a race. (Both in modern history and in old Biblical scripts)
I am sure that you can provide "citations" to these assertions.
The Jews are considered a 'race' even by themselves--you need to expand your knowledge base.
Before you provide those "citations" you wish to study them a bit more closely.
You most likely would wish to read my posting with a little more clarity.
I never advocate the 'extermination' of the Jews, I recommend that they be
"dispersed", as the Romans saw fit to do, since they do not "play well with others", and this can be recorded---with great accuracy, for the past 60 years, and then "way back there in them Roman days"----when they did not "play well with others--even then practicing the shedding of innocent blood on a mass scale". The concept that they are the 'chosen ones' by one God or Goddess is a very old concept that has never held up under close examination. It never fails to create a sense of superiority in the believer---and that is where the problems begin.
Good luck in your study----"ignorance is a terrible burden, that can only be relieved with knowledge". Try it.
NativeSon: “The Jews are considered a 'race' even by themselves--you need to expand your knowledge base.”
I’m a Jew and I don’t consider myself a race. More than that, I don’t know any Jew who considers himself a race. Moreover, I never heard anyone excluding the Nazis, and you, who refer to Jews as a race.
Show me a link to a non-white-supremacist site who claims that Jews are a race.
http://images.google.ca/images?
hl=en&q=Ethiopian%20jews&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi
http://images.google.ca/images?hl=en&um=1&sa=1&q=Ashkenazi+jews&aq=f&oq=
NativeSon: “You most likely would wish to read my posting with a little more clarity. I never advocate the 'extermination' of the Jews, I recommend that they be "dispersed", as the Romans saw fit to do”
You most likely would wish to read my posting with a little more clarity, I never said you want to exterminate the Jews, I said you want to exterminate the Jewish state (Israel), which is what you clearly admitted you want to see happens.
B.T.W, when the Roman "dispersed" the Jews, they also did a little extermination on the side. Thank you for clarifying that you "only" wish to exterminate 2 million Jews and "dispersed" the rest. Perhaps you are slightly less anti-Semite than the Nazis.
http://en.wikipedia.orkg/wiki/First_Jewish-Roman_War
Casualties and losses Estimated at 1,200,000
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bar_Kokhba's_revolt
580,000 Jews (mass civilian casualties), 50 fortified towns and 985 villages razed.
Good luck in your study----"ignorance is a terrible burden, that can only be relieved with knowledge". Try it.
You still did not answer any of your own points from your original posting----and what a master of the old word twist............
But, like more than your share of either arrogant or ignorant members try this one on for size.
As a "Jew" your DNA is as distinctive as an African, or Native American or Asian or Anglo European-------------whether YOU, or any other Jews you know consider themselves a "Race" is irrelevant---your DNA could be distinguished from mine as a Native American---that makes you a "Race" by modern scientific standards. Just one more point in the argument---the Black Ethiopian Jews are still Jews, they are just "Africanized" Jews---and they won their recognition through the DNA results.
your argument on the Roman respect is typical of so many other Jews---you could not keep your treaties/promises to Rome, the one who defeated you more than once---so you suffered the consequences---disbursement-----according to Flavius (one of your own), the killing at Masada was the last, and YOU killed yourselves there in mass suicide-------after that the Romans just kicked you all out of Jerusalem---for 500 years. And since you seem to be up to the same old behavior, I think it is still a very good idea. (Once the USA falls apart, most likely sooner than you think, do you really think the other members of the "community there in the mid east" will tolerate you/Israel/the "Chosen Ones"-----are you making any bets---if so on who?)
You keep exposing your ignorance---so you either are not a Jew----or one of those that should not "reproduce", since stupidity most likely can be an inherited condition-------------(see GW Bush for a citation on that one)-------
Actually all of you, Jews, Christians, Muslims should be allowed to go ahead and kill yourselves off---then the survivors can be kept in mind for future generations to use as a horrible example -------
P.S. The Native American people as a whole can show antiquity that exceeds the Hebrews by several thousand years----we have been around a very long time.
You brag about surviving the Nazi, 6 mill dead Jews. We survived the Christians and then the Americans after only 50 to 100 million dead-----we will still be around long after you all are gone-------------most likely at your own hands.
Good Luck, you really need it.
I don't want to get into a debate with you, NativeSon, regarding the so called racial purity of Jews, or historical debate of Roman timeline. You seemed to be an expert on the subject, in addition to being smart and knowledgeable.
What the Native American / the First Nations suffered in the hand of the European colonists is horrible, on a scale bigger than the holocaust. 95% of your people were exterminated, while in the Holocaust less than one half of us, Jews were.
I feel sorry that you want to exterminate me and half my people and ethnically cleanse the other half, especially when we were not the ones who committed the genocide against your people nor did we stole your land nor do I want anything to happen to you and your people today. I'm sorry that you chose hatred and racism over coexistence and tolerance. And I'm sorry that you are calling me names (stupid and ignorant)
Although I want you to fail in your extermination and ethnic cleansing aspirations, (and I'm sure you will,) I wish you well in everything else.
Peace and respect.
I do not want to exterminate anyone, in fact I do not even advocate the use of "exterminators" for insects or rodents.
You brought up several points that were simply false and my attempt to dispel those falsehoods found no audience.
I should learn to be as patient with the adults I encounter as I am the children.
I am grateful to you for your hand at teaching me.
Thank you, and Good Luck
N A T I V E _ S O N ,
This dude is likely psychotic and insidiously clever PSYOPS agent, whose major joys in life are obviously in ƒ ⊃ © k i n g up people's minds.
He states HYPOCRITICALLY to the MAX that
"I'm sorry that you chose hatred and racism over coexistence and tolerance. And I'm sorry that you are calling me names (stupid and ignorant)"
He's not sorry in the least, and never apologetic -- just backstabbing hateful -- whilst criticizing you for exactly what he does all year long ( racist hate, intolerance, and denial of existence ).
If you step back a bit, perhaps you can find the room for a big laugh out loud -- and possibly even some compassion for what prolonged and unmitigated hate and fear does to a person's heart and soul.
Blessings
Namaste