Obama Not Looking Back on Torture
Barack Obama suggested he's not likely to actively pursue criminal charges against national security officials who were directly involved in unlawful interrogations or wire-tapping, and said it would be difficult to quickly close down Guantanamo Bay.
On Guantanamo — which he repeatedly promised to shutter during the
campaign — Obama, in an interview on Sunday with George Stephanopolous
on ABC's "This Week," reiterated his intent to do just that but also
sounded a pragmatic note.
"That's a challenge," the president-elect said about the prospect of
closing down to the detainee facility within the first 100 days of
taking office. "I think it's going to take some time and our legal
teams are working in consultation with our national security apparatus
as we speak to help design exactly what we need to do.
On the question of prosecuting crimes that may have been committed
during the Bush presidency in the course of the war on terror, Obama
continued the theme of "looking forward as opposed to backwards" he
took on the campaign trail and reaffirmed since winning the presidency
last November.
While aimed at attracting consensus from a broader electorate, the
position is not exactly what many in the liberal base of his party
would prefer.
As Stephanopolous noted, the most asked question on Obama's own
transition website relates to investigating the "crimes" of the Bush
administration.
Asked if he would appoint a special prosecutor to investigate such
matters as warrant-less wire-tapping and torture, Obama demurred.
"We're still evaluating how we're going to approach the whole issue of
interrogations, detentions, and so forth," he said. "And obviously
we're going to be looking at past practices and I don't believe that
anybody is above the law.
"On the other hand I also have a belief that we need to look forward as
opposed to looking backwards. And part of my job is to make sure that
for example at the CIA, you've got extraordinarily talented people who
are working very hard to keep Americans safe. I don't want them to
suddenly feel like they've got to spend all their time looking over
their shoulders and lawyering."
Pressed, Obama said twice more that he wanted to get "things right in
the future, as opposed looking at what we got wrong in the past."
Asked specifically about the idea of a "9/11 commission with
Independence subpoena power" to look at torture and warrantless
wiretapping during the Bush years, Obama said that "We have not made
final decisions, but my instinct is for us to focus on how do we make
sure that moving forward we are doing the right thing. That doesn't
mean that if somebody has blatantly broken the law, that they are above
the law. But my orientation's going to be to move forward."
Obama also reiterated his desire for a "new approach" to Iran —
something he frequently mentioned during the Democratic primary—but was
quick to add a stick to go with the carrot.
Asked if U.S. relations with Tehran would include a "new emphasis on
respect," Obama replied: "Well, I think a new emphasis on respect and a
new emphasis on being willing to talk, but also a clarity about what
our bottom lines are."
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99 Comments so far
Show AllNot Possible.
The Torturers, Cheney, Bush, The CIA, Adddington-An ex-President, the complicit Congress- an ex vice President and the intel community.....Friends, this is most of "the system," it is as powerful as America itself and as an integrated whole would defend itself to the death, how could Obama successfully go after 1/3 of Congress, the CIA, Cheney and Bush?
Revenge is deserved. Exponentially. But short of a revolution where we drag dick and george off their ranches and shoot them, it ain't gonna happen, is IMPOSSIBLE, if looked at realistically.
Respectfully, azjoe.
Based on a lie I had over 4,000 American men and women killed,a couple hundered thousand Iraqi civilians,1,600 New Orleans residents and shredded the Constitution as a byproduct.But what the Hell, that's in the past,let's move on.
We need a new Simon Weisenthal.
Joe
The Senate and House Dems watched the crimes being committed before BO arrived and said nothing so all of the Senate and House members are guilty by association and of not reporting the crimes to the proper authorities . Lets face it , for some years we have had a very corrrupt government and the whole government would be in turmoil if BO would stand alone against the rest . Nancy knew of the crimes before she became speaker and said nothing . So when she became speaker she could not do anything .
" Get things right in the future as opposed to looking at what we got wrong in the past ". Looks to me like Obama has sold out to Bush and Cheney. They are guilty of treason, murder of 1000's of innocent people; torture, war crimes; stealing, and just about any other crime you can name and I ask you: How in the hell can you not look back and get that right, before you can begin to think about getting things right in the future! If you do not get indictments against Bush and Cheney: NOTHING WILL BE RIGHT IN THE FUTURE!
I borrowed some money to build a house ten years ago, but that is in the past. Think maybe that reasoning will work with Citibank if I stop paying my mortgage?
Sure, I think Obamatron is setting a legal precedent here for folks like you and me to follow.
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1963 & 1968- Dallas and Los Angeles Coup d'État by the US Military Industrial Junta completed, according to modern examination of old evidence
"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.", Albert Einstein. (Ed note: WHITE PHOSPHOROUS, DENSE METAL SUPER WEAPONS, NUCLEAR STICK UP, MISSILE DEFENSE, AND PROPAGANDA!!!!!)
I think the big boys, the top 1% in net worth have been talking to the president elect. Don't forget who elected you Mr. President
Can't we just get past this and move on?
Move along, nothing to see here..
Clinton redux basically-Bill pulled the same crap regarding the Iraq invasion & occupation when he was buddying around with Pappy Bush and on the discredited side of the divide.
White trash Bill just wanted the country club set to like him. Obama wants their acceptance too--he is just another houseboy to the master, but it may prove to be a harder landing for Mr Obama--the folks have just about had enough if he plays nice with the discredited Right when here is a moment to make a stand in opposition.
There will be no resolution unless these crimes are addressed otherwise that door is still open.
You're right. He obviously wants to be in with the in-crowd, as evidenced by his jolly luncheon with the ex-presidents last week. I didn't expect much from Obama, but I thought he had a little more self-respect.
.
FINAL Bush Press Conference:
Bush displays his advanced state of narcissistic reasoning until the very end, openly blaming the divided nation on everyone but himself.
Here is to the world-wide wish that the next time we see you is at your trail at the International Criminal Court in The Hague - for Crimes Against Humanity!!!
.
It sounds like he's choosing his words very carefully. We'll see where this goes in the next 6 months to a year, at least I will before making an evaluation.
______________________________________________
"Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it, misdiagnosing it and then misapplying the wrong remedies. " Groucho Marx
"Nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people."
H. L. Mencken
Fast to End Torture and Create Peace
Nonviolent Resistance
By Cindy Sheehan
01-12-09
(CommonDreams stopped printing Cindy's articles, so I assumed the responsibility)
On July 4th, 2006, I embarked on the "Troops Home Fast" with many fellow activists all over the country. We began the fast in front of the White House and we were planning on ending it in front of the White House on September 21st (World Peace Day), but few of us made it that far.
At the end of July, Iraqi Prime Minster, Nouri al-Maliki said he would meet with Medea Benjamin (CODEPINK) and I, when he was visiting DC, if we would end the fast. Maliki, for some reason, left the Iraqi embassy without meeting with us, so the fast continued. However, some Iraqi parliamentarians were shocked and ashamed of Maliki's rude treatment of us, so we were invited to meet with the parliamentarians in Amman, Jordan, and that's when most of the fasters ended their fasts.
I lasted through Jordan and a few days back in the states when I became very ill and had to have two blood transfusions and two emergency surgeries in Waco, Texas in August of '06…during a Camp Casey protest. So, my fast lasted 37 days when I had to end it under doctor's orders.
Now, we are going into the 7th year of occupation in Iraq and are in the 8th year in Afghanistan. Although the violence is thankfully lower in Iraq, it came with a horrible price of US genocide and ethnic cleansing. (Plus the over 4000 Americans who are dead for nothing and the tens of thousands who are emotionally, mentally and physically maimed). The Obama regime hasn't even been sworn in yet, but is promising to increase violence in Afghanistan.
Today, (January 11) is the sick-sick 7th anniversary of the opening of the US torture camp in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. The stain of this facility just about 90 miles off of our shore will live in infamy forever. The regime-elect has promised to shut it down and we can never give up until the last illegally incarcerated detainee is given due process and fair trials, or released and given restitution.
I met a Sheikh in Jordan on that first trip when I was still on the "Troops Home Fast." He described indescribable horrors after he was beaten and dragged out of his home by US troops and thrown in Abu Ghraib prison. The pictures from that facility shocked us all, but meeting a man who was brutally tortured and has to live in constant pain and takes dozens of pills a day to survive the pain and debilitation the torture caused was very heartbreaking. It made me ashamed to the core of my government that is still trying to claim some kind of moral high ground.
In Cuba and elsewhere around the world, I have met a few detainees that were rounded up and sold to the US military by the Northern Alliance for bounty and sent to Guantanamo. My friends, Asif and Rhuhel's stories are told in the Mat Whitecross movie, Road to Guantanamo, but the stories they tell in person of being sodomized with broom handles or put in stress positions while being subjected to heat/cold and loud blasting music also make me so ashamed. What is even worse is that the British Government knew that Asif, Rhuhel and their friends weren't even in Afghanistan at the time they were being accused of consorting with Osama bin Laden, but they had to stay at the prison for over 3 years!
I have been at the barbed-wire barrier that separates the bucolic town of Guantanamo Cuba from the horror-site of the US torture facility with a mother of someone who was being unlawfully detained there, Omar DeGhayes. Omar has thankfully been released, but hundreds remain.
The stain of torture has affected every American---not just the torturers or our selected officials who sanctioned, planned and authorized the obscene policies. How can we as individuals claim to take any moral high ground when our silence gives consent?
Starting today and until the inauguration on the 20th, there is a Fast for Justice in front of the White House to kick off the 100 Days Campaign to close Guantanamo. I couldn't be in DC, so I will be fasting in solidarity with those people in DC and those people in Guantanamo.
Some of the prisoners at Guantanamo are still being forced fed and some have been there for seven years.
Some people have health/other considerations that would make fasting for nine days difficult. You don't have to fast for the entire nine days, you can join us for a day, or two, or nine, but there are also other ways of fasting.
I think I can fast for nine days. What can you do?
Fast from TV.
Fast from booze.
Fast from cigarettes.
Fast from coffee.
Fast from one meal a day and give the money you save to a homeless shelter.
Fast from gasoline.
Fast from credit cards.
Send money to organizations that are working for peace.
The only way that we will not be held complicit as the "Good Germans" of the Bush error, is to boldly speak out against the crimes and to do whatever we can to make sure President Obama follows through with his promise to close Guantanamo.
I will be blogging daily about the fast, and would appreciate your comments or fasting stories:
Cindy@CindySheehansSoapbox.com
.Thanks to Cindy for her work, may it bear fruit. Thanks to Cygnus for taking up the torch that , for some unknown reason, CD has tried to extinguish.
.
We see things, not as they are, but as we are.
Anais Nin
Cygnus-X1-isaHole,
Thank you for that. Keep posting.
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1963 & 1968- Dallas and Los Angeles Coup d'État by the US Military Industrial Junta completed according to modern examination of old evidence
"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.", Albert Einstein. (Ed note: WHITE PHOSPHOROUS, DENSE METAL SUPER WEAPONS, NUCLEAR STICK UP, MISSILE DEFENSE, AND PROPAGANDA!!!!!)
Pan
Bush and company created a need for a Great Hope and dreams, ahh the dreams I had for this mortal.
But! then again >>>.. he`s no Joe Lieberman either.
B.O. says: "And part of my job is to make sure that for example at the CIA, you've got extraordinarily talented people who are working very hard to keep Americans safe." What an incredibly stupid comment! Keeping us safe?! Are we supposed to fall for the belief that the CIA is anything but a gang of wiseguys? Yes, they are "extraordinarily talented people" at screwing up third world countries and its indigenous people. We should be working to impeach B.O. - before Jan. 20.
Eighteenth century American revolutionaries have devolved into our current breed of citizens: American delusionaries. It actually makes perfect sense. Now that we're the American Empire, we must live in a constant state of denial about what our government really does. Otherwise, we'd either go crazy (if we had a conscience) or we'd feel the need to do something about it. It's much easier (and safer) to pretend that our government is not thoroughly corrupt - even when there's overwhelming, contrary evidence staring us directly in the face.
Nixon made his deal, too. If he was impeached, he couldn't be pardoned (It is in the Constitution, read it) and all of his administration's lies and thefts would have come out into the open, so he agreed to resign and take a pardon.
Many of us protested to our alleged representatives, et al.
The Ford Administration and the Congress said, "We can't live in the past, we must move on!" Another answer was that "Impeaching Nixon would denigrate the presidency!"
Nothing denigrates the office like allowing crooks to use the office to rape and pillage, then walk with their ill-gotten gains, untried and unpunished.
At the time, I wrote an article about the botched impeachment of Warren Hastings. That was received with much derision, as was my prediction that Nixon would resurface as a respected Senior Statesman on Far-Eastern affairs. And so it came to pass.
The only way we can "learn from our mistakes" is to look at them, exposed to the light of day, and correct them. We cannot learn by sweeping them under the rug, then going out and closing the door behind us. That's how we keep on doing the same damned thing over and over, while listening to the apologists.
In fairness to Obama, I have to think he understands the consequences of really trying to change anything at this point. If he just manages to slow the train as it rushes toward the abyss, thats all you can hope for.
Of course, this means we are doomed as the U.S. Constitution is pointless.
This is so predictable. This is what I have been saying about this consummate opportunist sellout ad nauseam for a year until I got banned. I don't why they let me back on. What do I say to those that believed Obama's campaign lies? TOLD YA!
The utter cowardice and complicity of the Democrats knows no bounds. These scoundrels are timid and walking on egg shells even after having won in a landslide and gaining control of both houses. Who they are is best illustrated by who they chose as their leaders: Nancy "impeachment is off he table" Pelosi and "Dirty" Harry Reid. Even in victory they are weak, impotent and cowering.
Sheer, unmitigated, undeniable cowardice. As Edmund Burke once said, "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for enough good men to do nothing." And nothing is exactly what Obama will do, and exactly what he did during the Gaza crisis, golfing while Gaza burned. Intelligent and charismatic Obama may be, but courageous he certainly is not.
Alex
I saw this interview. It was very discouraging.
Obama is going to do MORE good for America than any president since FDR. Trying to incarcerate a few creeps (who need to be tortured to death) would create a tremendous fight as these primarily Republican scum fought to save their necks.
It would turn into a Democrats against Republicans street fight on Pennsylvania Avenue. The Republicans would respond by successfully blocking every bit of legislation they could, everything good Obama tried to do, not to mention the investigations themselves.
So this political decision is what is best for Americans. Witch-hunts are fun, but they entrench an enemy and validate his perspective.
Obama, you come a long way from playing soccer in Jakarta alleys.
Joe, you smelly anus. Torture is not OK! No matter how you feel about whomever, it's not OK to torture anyone! Don't you get it man?! Maybe if you'd served your country, maybe, perhaps, built some cages, shot off a few rounds, rounded some people up, then came home to realize that this country doesn't "support the troops", and hey, now you're on your own, doc, here's some shiny medals, attached to pretty colorful ribbons, along with a case of PTSD, you'd freakin' realize that we're all being lied to...you might know better. But...well...I guess it's really no use. Pull your head out, Joe. Maybe you should visit an alleyway in Jakarta. You might learn something.
Awww, were you lied to? Did you "serve" your country, put some people in cages and no one appreciates your twauma? Awe you got was wibbons?
Yeah, a lot of smart people don't give a #&*@ about people who volunteer to go murder people in foreign countries for money.
My families blood is all over Omaha Beach, my family flew in the RAF in WW! and fought Hitler. We fought him twice. And won. And got no PDTS or whatever people get who can't take it.
Cry Me a River.....are you all on your own???? no gun and now you scared?
Thanks for the laugh. You got no idea who you are talking to, but I'll tell you this, I don't need no stinking medals, I got no fear and no trauma. And girl, I can hit a golf ball at 60 meters EVERY time. I've dropped, cleaned and eaten two 90 lb pigs with an air-rifle, temple shots. bye now.
If it gets so bad you can't feed yourself I'll send you some meat FedEx. Cook it quick.
OK buddy. Your family did this, your family did that. You play golf and shoot pigs in the head. You're so freakin' tough! WOO!!
Good Morning EBlair. Let's start over. I loathe, despise the torturers, from Bush and Cheney down. The fact that I don't think we can get to them, an ex President and vice President and the CIA, does not mean I don't wish we could. Badly. I would like to see them all strung up from lamp posts on Pennsylvania Avenue. However I believe they are too powerful, numerous and insulated.
Have a great day, azjoe.
PostScript-I would never play golf!
Good Morning to you, azjoe. I can agree with all that.
Hope you have a great day also.
Thanks EBlair.
perfection is impossible
Obama is facing the largest mess ever. He must prioritize and I agree that the most important thing to do at the moment is to fix the economy. This is important because it effects the whole world not just the USA. The prosecution of crimes that the Bush administration have committed would take a great deal of time and money and distract the congress. I am disappointed in all the negative comments. Certainly we all know that the country has been run by criminals the last eight years. Revenge is possibly a luxury right now. The world understands that the American public understand that we are responsible for a great deal of evil. The world also understands that we have chosen not to continue down that path.
So, if someone murdered your child, committed fraud, and robbed you blind, you'd just not deal with it because you were too busy?
No, thanks.
You are incorrect. These people wil never be prosecuted, because , a good 1/3 of "these people " are Democrats!
Pelosi, Harmen, all of them knew about everyting.Obama is exercising professional courtesy at our expense.
How an educated person can think that the US can "move on" from torture and war crimes is beyond me...
It damages a countries's "psyche" and the soul cries out for justice.
SteveC, Hello. I agree, the Democrats are in it up to their necks. So he would be attacking both sides of the aisle. But worse, most actors in the torture debacle were CIA. There is no way he can go after them. After sanctioning from Bush down, the torturers and there managers cannot be pursued. There would be a revolt.
Obama must pick his fights. He will only have so much "political capital," if he chooses a protracted fight he can't win, it would be foolish. There were, as you pointed out, many actors. There were too many, too powerful.
And SteveC, I would personally spend the rest of my life waterboarding every single one if I could. Cheney, Addington, Bush, Kristol-Sadly no can get to them. Not even the New President.
He is focusing on the economy. Not a Bad Idea. Peace.
If the Bush Crime Family is to be prosecuted, then it won't come from within the government, it will come from the citizens that demand it.
Does the ACLU or other Constitutional law group have standing to bring war-crimes charges against individuals in the Bush administration? If the US does not prosecute them, then other countries have the authority to do so. Either way would be okay with me, as long as it gets done.
I wish I felt some sense of satisfaction in seeing Obama beginning to act as I and others had suspected he would. Thus far he is more disappointing than I imagined he'd be, but it's not an "I told you so" victory in the least. The only consolation I have is that I never got my hopes up about him and therefore don't feel let down.
Circumstances will force him to deal with unprecedented problems and it remains to be seen what he's really made of. Will he emerge as a true leader and restore constitutional rights, bring sanity to foreign relations, and be a man of his word? Or will he sell his soul to Mephistopheles Inc. out of fear and insecurity. Unfortunately it looks more and more like he's deciding to sit down at the Faustian bargaining table.
Ha,ha,ha, the House Negro is now your overseer.
You were told over and over again that Mr. Obama is a corporate shill working for the benefit of the ruling elite.
Now everyone is going to pay dearly with continued loss of legal rights, a two tiered political system, and economic system.
As Bob Dylan wrote and sang: "How does it feel?" Suckers.
.The politics of Barack Obama has absolutely nothing whatever to dovwith the amount of melanin in his skin. You do not help with garbage like this.
.
We see things, not as they are, but as we are.
Anais Nin
hoytdouglas Does your house "have," a Negro? Do you depend on racist terminology (Negro is not palatable to Black Americans) to express yourself off line or just here?
We have to go with Obama, he is the only show in town.
Some other things first. 1. Correct the spelling, it is not right it is reich wing, after all reich means rich so nobody can argue with that. 2. change all swear words to bush (i.e. bushing mother busher). Can you think of anything more obscene than Bush. Let George become a legend in his own time.
ROFL! Love that ~ change all swear words to bush. You are right, it is the most obscene, disgusting moniker currently available!
That is really funny! I love some good wordsmithing. Unfortunately the reich wing does too, but real creativity comes from the bottom up! Bush the bastards.
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1963 & 1968- Dallas and Los Angeles Coup d'État by the US Military Industrial Junta completed
"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.", Albert Einstein. (Ed note: WHITE PHOSPHOROUS, DENSE METAL SUPER WEAPONS, NUCLEAR STICK UP, MISSILE DEFENSE, AND PROPAGANDA!!!!!)
We the hopeful have been had--F*^# Obama! I'm not waiting any longer to judge him--he's just a "name-brand" change--that's how he won--talking change but until there is true justice there will never be any real honest change. It's 2006 all over again except now we have both Pelosi and Obama as Bush clones. Justice is off the table. Disgusted
If politicians can ignore and absolve high placed murderers and thieves, we can all commit these crimes without fear of prosecution.
I am needless to say angry that President elect Obama isn't going to proceed with the prosecution of Rumsfeld and the gang. Am I surprised, No, not really. Angry, yes. I just have to wonder how many other "promises" will come to pass by the Oval office door ways into oblivion.
Does anyone know where I can run away too, how about Sweden? I am seeking AMNESTY!I am scared to live here anymore!
What you seem to be saying Glover is prop up the status quo with our tax dollars while trying to survive the beating by the bankers. If I'm lax in memory, please forgive me, but shouldn't the bankers be in jail for fraud and their enablers forced to return the money they stole from us?
Obama who I supported and saw twice in person, I now view as a disgusting pig meant to trick us into accepting the NWO product in new packaging. Because he looks progressive because of his color people cant criticize him much like you are not allowed to criticize Israel. Clinton and Gore were supposed to prosecute Iran/Contra crimes such as cocaine dealing but refused citing that, just like in this case, we should look forward and not back. And guess what happened...we got all the same players and actors back in Cabinet position, Ass. Secretary posts etc. Negraponte, Abrahms, Poindexter etc blah blah blah. This is BS. So is some citizen commits murder then he should be allowed to walk with his legal defense being that we should all just move on and not dwell on the past. If you dont correct the past then the future will be more of the same. Obama is a LIAR.
Unless we expose the charade that sent our subsidized industrial base to China
we are doomed. Building roads and bridges was ok for the WPA and the CCC.
They worked at minimum wages.
We are being enslaved by the workings of the Bush and Clinton Families.
A few more months of this depression and it will be to late to wake up.
Afraid to get caught in the quagmire they build for us, we are being told to
move forward. That is the same Patois Politicians use when they get caught with
there fingers in the cookie jar. Let's have full disclosure of the Bush and
Clinton Machine and how we have been taken to the cleaners. Both Bush and Clinton
are Multi-Millionaires now. Why are Foreign governments donating tens of millions
of Dollars to Bill Clinton? Do they owe him? What a double cross. Unless we
hold these people responsible for this scam, they will repeat it all over again,
like the Bailout. Who will tell us?
Why is everybody so obsessed with Bush and his gang? Or Clinton, for that matter?
Does nobody realize that these guys are nothing but straw men, go-fers, second and third tier capos for the real Godfathers?
Going after Bush and company may satisfy our sense of outrage and our need for justice, but the problem will never be solved until the Godfathers and Godmothers are exposed and permanently separated from their money.
We are not a country ruled by law, we are a country ruled by lawyers. International law means nothing, or rather, it means what it is convenient for it to mean. The humans race has not advanced, it has slid backwards. The pinnacle of human social development was the tribe. We need to have a process by which people can rule who know what it is to be desperately poor, powerless, and victimized. That's not ever likely to happen. Obama would have to have a hose down his throat before he would know about water-boarding. The fault, I'm afraid, is not with individuals, it's with the human race. Sentience was developed by a few species, but an aggressive ape was not one to succeed for long. Too bad we will ruin it for the dolphins and whales.
Normally, it would be a great achievement for the US to elect as president a person of color. However, I am not sure it is so wonderful when the color is yellow, as in yellow coward.
Obama--he wont rock the boat! A triangulator, a man without backbone, always ready to give in...
Dr Wu, the last of the big-time thinkers
Well! Who's yer Daddy now?
Is it time to bend over yet?
One of the comments below said, "Obama said that he and his team have not made final decisions yet..." Huh? You mean, he hasn't decided to prosecute known violators of U.S. Constitution, international law, human rights, and committers of war crimes? More of the same folks. More of the same. When will they ever learn. When will they ever learn?
Obama will be in no position to say Bush is guilty or even plan to prosecute Bush people before he is president...then it will take time to gather the documents and decide. It will be up to us to push him for peace and justice for years to come... we are the government and the politicians our public servants...Empower ourselves and unite and we will see more change coming.
I want to see him recognize the World Court first thing before goin after the Republicans.
That would be the best first forward step for justice.
He could hire Vincent Bugliosi to expedite the process at home. And yes, we should have some formal connection with international law.
Joe
.Stop attempting to propagandize the position of those seeking justice. Noone is asking for a verdict from Obama, only an assurance that he will pursue justice. We cannot seem to get even that.
.
We see things, not as they are, but as we are.
Anais Nin
Your problem is you are seeing things as you are.
and
You are seeing things that are not.
.Your problem seems to be a rather large lack of maturity and ability to defend your position without revealing the fact that you have the mentality of a twelve year old.
This last effort, as well as the previous three responses to me, remain empty of substance, off target and reveal much about you and nothing whatever about the topic. If you intend to turn into a stalker because I dared disagree with your position and dared criticize your hero you reveal much about you and nothing whatever of import.
I expected much better of you, Jim, sorry you have disappointed us all.
.
We see things, not as they are, but as we are.
Anais Nin
No matter who runs, the same side always wins.
He can't look back, because America is ruled by a US Military Industrial Junta dictatorship, since 1963. Obama has only been elected as the Media Representative Figure Head of said Junta. Expect nothing more.
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1963 & 1968- Dallas and Los Angeles Coup d'État by the US Military Industrial Junta completed, according to modern examination of old evidence
"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.", Albert Einstein. (Ed note: WHITE PHOSPHOROUS, DENSE METAL SUPER WEAPONS, NUCLEAR STICK UP, MISSILE DEFENSE, AND PROPAGANDA!!!!!)
When the ruling elite in Amerika commit heinous crimes, it's all about "looking forward," but if the it's the guy who lives in a run-down section of Amerika, then it's "let's build more prisons."
With each new day Obama shows himself for the reactionary corporate lackey that he is.
I hate what this nation has become.
If, as appears likely from his public statements, Obama fails to pursue justice in the matter of the crimes committed by Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Gonzales, Wolfowitz, Powell, Rice, etc., etc., etc., ... then he's a fraud and there's no chance that we will ever recover our once proud reputation for being a country ruled by laws and not men!
Shame on you Mr. Obama; you have revealed yourself as a lying political hack!
I FEEL TOTALLY BETRAYED!
"So let us regard this as settled: what is morally wrong can never be advantageous, even when it enables you to make some gain that you believe to be to your advantage. The mere act of believing that some wrongful course of action constitutes an advantage is pernicious." - Marcus Tullius Cicero (106-43 B.C.)
Bob Regl
Wow, some of the folks here need to get a grip, seriously....
Jonathan Martin also needs to write a title and a first paragraph to his piece that reflects what was said. The piece starts off like a Fox news report.
That title started all of this, shame on you Martin.
If you read past the first paragraph, you find what Obama said,
"We have not made final decisions, but my instinct is for us to focus on how do we make sure that moving forward we are doing the right thing. That doesn't mean that if somebody has blatantly broken the law, that they are above the law. But my orientation's going to be to move forward."
Obama said that he and his team have not made final decisions yet, yet Martin would like to have us think otherwise.
Given the complete mess left by George W., I think that it is reasonable to begin by stopping any further damage.
If you have been reading this web site, you know that many organizations have pursued legal action against Bush and Company. Hasn't worked out very well. Obama may need the time to make sure that the Justice Dept and the rest of the US legal system is cleared of all stink from all of the Bush appointees before actively pursuing anything.
George W. and the rest will be around for awhile. They may be forced to leave the US in order to avoid prosecution - It took years but Kissinger cannot travel to certain countries because he will be arrested. I would be more than happy to see Bush, Cheney and the rest in this situation. Revenge is best served cold.
I myself would like to have my rights returned to me and to have the US govt acknowledge the existence of the Geneva Convention and the International Criminal Court Tribunal. This is what I think Obama means by moving forward.
.Your post made me reread that article and especially the quotes attributed to the President-Elect. Once again I deduced from them that Obama is not going to appoint a special prosecutor, not going to order Justice and the GAO to investigate the war profiteering, not going to demand prosecution for lying this nation into war, not going to look further into the firings of Justice lawyers based upon political litmus tests, and certainly not going to restore the dignity of this nation.
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We see things, not as they are, but as we are.
Anais Nin
Hope springs eternal, eh Pollyanna?
---USAn---
What President since Washington has wanted to limit Presidential power? If Obama admits that Bush took powers that he shouldn't have, then those are powers that Obama will not have. That is why impeachment is so important. After the 20th it will take a groundswell or a revolution to get us(US)back to where we should be.
So, waterboarding and thumbscrews are O.K. with this Israeli sock puppet, or what?
Jeevee
Unutterably sad, but predicted. Are most voters too frenetic to have checked Obama's voting record before voting for him?
So now his name is going to be Mr. "Nancy Pelosi" Obama.
Think of what such attitudes toward justice and accountability for wrongdoing convey to the world, and to the US's own citizens?
Imagine if a common gang member or violent estranged spouse on trial for first degree murder basing their defense on the prosecution dwelling on the past and a "need to go forward"? The judge would laugh out loud at such an argument!
BUT, if you are sufficiently powerful and wealthy, you can use such a defense - or worse yet you own would be prosecutors will use such a defense for you.
And so high moral principle for both individuals and states, that Obama is invoking here is simple. Might Makes Right - rule of law is for the weak; impunity is for the powerful.
For individuals, this means get a firearm (preferably fully automatic), and a scheme to threaten others with it and not get caught. For nation-states, it is a stockpile of nuclear bombs, a means to deliver them, and scheme to build them without getting caught. This is the morality Obama is espousing here.
Got Power?
---USAn---
C'mon Obama,
Don't cave in this soon in the game!!!
This is your chance for "real" change. By prosecuting the criminals that got us into this mess, you will be "moving forward!!"
Appoint another 911 commission, this time, one that seeks the truth and is willing to uncover what really happened on that fateful day, and continues to be the cause belli for our foreign policy as well as the terrorist tactics our current leaders have used on their own innocent countrymen.
Why are you being so shallow so soon? Forward vs Backward is just another manipulative way of using words so as to not confront what's really important to our country, which is to hold leaders accountable and seek the truth.
Don't be a "Black Bush!"
Writing our history accurately is more important than continuing to create the legacy Bush et al have passed onto you.
Get smart man!
Every criminal now has a new defense: We should look forward, not back.
Joe
jclientelle:Joe, I hope it isn't so, but I say Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeek! if it is an abrogation of the rule of law. (wow, where'd I get that?) I can hear Marjorie Cohn now www.marjoriecohn.com There'll be lots of folks going Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeek and more.
Not for nothing was Hawaii "without power" when Mr. Obama was vacationing there. The symbolism was lost on no one.
And this surprises who? Voters who believe in campaign promises? Certainly not anyone who is AWAKE!
"...On Guantanamo — which he repeatedly promised to shutter during the campaign — Obama...reiterated his intent to do just that but also sounded a pragmatic note..."
- In other words, prepare for the news that Gitmo won't be closed after all.
"...On the question of prosecuting crimes that may have been committed during the Bush presidency in the course of the war on terror, Obama continued the theme of 'looking forward as opposed to backwards' he took on the campaign trail and reaffirmed since winning the presidency last November..."
- In other words, no prosecutions.
"...While aimed at attracting consensus from a broader electorate, the position is not exactly what many in the liberal base of his party would prefer..."
- Rather an understatement, considering that there's not a single antiwar voice in the entire new Cabinet, nor a single opponent of the outrageous bankster bailout, nor a single critic of unconditional support for Israeli aggression.
During the campaign, Dem Party Apologists repeatedly insisted that a Democratic president (especially a "constitutional law professor"!!) would act to reverse the lawlessness of the Bush years. Yet with every passing day, we see that this former law professor is functioning merely as more polished & articulate front man representing the same basic policies.
See the big difference between the parties? The evil Republicans supported the War on Terror, the Wall St bailout, torture, & immunity for themselves for all their crimes. The "lesser evil" Democrats, by contrast, support all the same things.
Here's a bit from a comment I posted elsewhere on April 12, 2008-- when Obama and Hillary were still vying for the nomination-- concerning the prospects of a new Democratic administration investigating and prosecuting the broad range of criminal and illicit acts and policies perpetrated by President Unitard and his criminal gang:
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... I've elaborated elsewhere, but I find it all too likely that Clinton will justify a de facto amnesty on the brittle technocratic grounds of facilitating a "healing" and "restorative" bipartisan process to optimize the flow of the very remedial legislation that We the People mandated!
Obama, I expect, would pitch it in Lincolnesque terms: best to let bygones be bygones, rise above being mired in the degrading and tumultuous conflicts of the past, and seek healing and reconciliation in accordance with the better angels of our nature.
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And another bit from a more recent comment:
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I've always been skeptical of Happy Horseshit talk of reconciliation, cooperation, bipartisanship, etc.
Not because all of those things aren't desirable and wonderful, but because when politicians and the corporate media commentariat talk about such attractive ideals, you may be sure that it's in the service of blowing off the politically unpopular and risky actions needed to achieve social justice.
I spit when I hear a politician glibly pledge to work for "reconciliation", because I know that the grand notion of reconciliation will be used as a magnificent carpet under which to quietly sweep a multitude of sins. And then we tapdance on the carpet.
The sins, like cockroaches and untreated syphilis, invariably fester and return to bite We the People in our pendulous buttocks.
My fear is... that Obama's self-conscious identification with Lincoln will lead naturally to a Lincolnesque proclamation of Letting Bygones Be Bygones, etc.
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And so it shall come to pass! The euphemism "moving forward" sets the stage for Bonnie Prince Barack to flush the outgoing maladministration's multifarious high crimes & misdemeanors down the Memory Hole. He's a distinguished constitutional scholar with the ethics of a dutiful janitor.
· Yr Obd't Servant
."It is more honorable to repair a wrong than to persist in it." Thomas Jefferson
"I wish I could love my country and Justice too." Albert Camus
"Institutions are, in a moral sense, impotent unless they are supported by the sense of responsibility of living individuals." Albert Einstein
"I do not believe in a fate that falls on men however they act. But I do believe in a fate that falls on men unless they act." GKChesterton
"Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes the lawbreaker, it breeds contempt for laws; it invites every man to becomea law unto himself." Justice Brandeis
Where men build on false ground, the more they build the greater is the ruin." Hobbes, Leviathon
Whatever President Obama hopes to accomplish, whatever his vision for this nation should be, he will fail miserably if he allows us to move on from the crimes of the Bush administration without seeking justice. ( I said that)
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We see things, not as they are, but as we are.
Anais Nin
And by the way, Mr. President Elect, if you are monitoring our conversation: I am a moderate - not a person who tends extremely left on most issues. If you think you will stabilize your vote margin for the upcoming elections by ignoring people in the middle who devoutly believe in the rule of law and the constitution you are - and will be mistaken. The moral fabric of this country - and I DO NOT mean that in purely religious terms - is diminishing. It is diminishing because our system of government of broken and few believe that moral or ethical conduct will pay them capitalistic dividends. The bankers can do what they want - the system bails them out. The government can run up huge deficits - nobody cares. US corporations pay abysmally low income tax (or none at all), yet the propaganda machine puts out we have the second highest corporate tax rate in the world - but they forget to include the 1,001 loopholes made to conveniently bypass responsibility.
No, Mr. Obama, we don't trust you just because you are now THERE. And if you continue to cater to the corporate structure, you will lose in 2012 - there is a rising in this country, and those who listened to Kucinich and others will be more forceful, more vocal and more electoral than you can ever imagine. You cave to the right wing - they sneer at your weakness. You call it bipartisanship - they call it cowardice. We are not a center - right country Sir - the vote proved that. Now, yes now, you have to prove what you really are! Stand up - or simply stand aside.
Obama is nothing but status quo and the dingbat knows it. No wonder the Democrats were eager to fight against allowing Nader on the ballot even in 2008. If he had been on the ballot out here in TX, I would have been able to vote for him and not be stuck with Obama. And don't get me started about Barr.
I voted for Obama because I felt I had no choice - Palin and the Neocons hired by McCain left no choice - but I am growing increasingly happy about the fact that I did not spend lots of time campaigning for Obama on the basis of his promises. Many in Chicago feel he is little more than a political opportunist - I will give him the benefit of the doubt for a few more months - but if he doesn't implement rule of law, to include prosecuting war criminals - I will fervently campaign against him and all other Democrats till hell freezes over. His political expediency, his willingness to cater to the Right Wingers, should be a growing concern to every person who supported his candidacy.
"I voted for Obama because I felt I had no choice."
Isn't this exactly what is at the heart of the so-called two-party system which, let's face it, is really a ONE-party system? No alternative candidates or viewpoints are allowed to be heard, thus ensuring only those already beholden to the corporatocracy will be the viable possibilities. This in turn ensures the corporate agenda will continue unabated.
"The technique of infamy is to invent two lies and to get the people arguing heatedly over which one is true." - Ezra Pound
I feel exactly the same way. Exactly. I have a rapidly sinking feeling about Obama and I'm not in the least surprised that I have a rapidly sinking feeling about him.
Is anyone really surprised that Obama is backing down on his campaign promises? Will that's what you get for voting another dem. into office. I can only hope that the lesson has been learned this time.
He's not backing down. He just said that closing Guantanamo will be a "challenge". Of course, it will be a challenge. What's wrong with saying that?
Everyone wants Obama to be perfect. But he's only human. He's not Jesus.
I'm sure it was also a challenge to shut down the Japanese internment camps after WWII. But it still happened didn't it?
Can anyone deny that Obama is still vastly better than McCain?
Anyone who says that Obama is breaking his promises is nothing more than a filthy liar!
.You are a childish little fellow, and the lies are coming from Obama.
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We see things, not as they are, but as we are.
Anais Nin
ardee, there you go again with the insults.