US Accused of Using ‘Kangaroo Court’ to Try Men Accused of Role in September 11 Attacks
The United States military announced yesterday that it was bringing death penalty charges against Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and five other men suspected of orchestrating the September 11 attacks, and intended to try them under the Bush administration’s much-criticised military tribunal system, which is subject only to partial oversight by the civilian appeals system.
The decision to use Mohammed and the others as guinea-pigs in a constitutionally dubious legal proceeding is likely to trigger a firestorm of anti-American sentiment in the Islamic world and spark a fractious domestic debate in an already highly charged presidential election year.
Concerns were raised last night of political interference by the White House in the military’s decision to go to trial in the middle of an election campaign in which the Republican frontrunner, John McCain, has made the fight against al-Qa’ida central to his election bid.
“What we are looking at is a series of show trials by the Bush administration that are really devoid of any due process considerations,” said Vincent Warren, the executive director head of Centre for Constitutional Rights, which represents many Guantanamo detainees. “Rather than playing politics the Bush administration should be seeking speedy and fair trials,” he said. “These are trials that are going to be based on torture as confessions as well as secret evidence. There is no way that this can be said to be fair especially as the death penalty could be an outcome.”
While few doubts have been raised, domestically or internationally, about the men’s involvement in the attacks on New York and Washington, just about everything else about their treatment has been bitterly contested and is likely to continue to be contested, inside the courtroom and out. Everything is laden with potential controversy - the decision to try the six men together rather than individually, the proposed venue at Guantanamo Bay, where all six are being held, the threatened use of the death penalty, and perhaps the most controversial question of all: the admissibility of evidence gathered through waterboarding and other coercive techniques generally defined as torture.
Even Brig-Gen Thomas Hartmann, the Pentagon official co-ordinating the case, acknowledged yesterday that it could be several months before a trial begins and months more, if not years, before any death penalty - assuming it is enforced - is carried out.
General Hartmann was careful to say that he wanted the trial proceedings to be “as completely open as possible”, with lawyers and journalists present in the courtroom - barring the possibility of some closed sessions to consider classified information. He stressed that the men would be regarded as innocent until proven guilty, just as they would in a civilian court. And he promised to provide “every piece of evidence, every stitch of evidence, every whiff of evidence” to the defendants’ lawyers so they would be fully able to prepare for trial.
That did little to stop Clive Stafford Smith, the British lawyer who has worked on behalf of “enemy combatants” at Guantanamo, to issue a condemnation of the “kangaroo court”. He said: “Anyone can see the hypocrisy of espousing human rights, then trampling on them. We will infuriate our allies who firmly oppose the death penalty. We will anger the world.”
Aside from Mohammed, alleged to be the mastermind who planned and coordinated the September 11 attacks, the defendants are Mohammed al-Qahtani, labelled by US officials the “20th hijacker” who never made it on board any of the planes that were crashed; Ramzi Bin al-Shibh, an associate of Mohammed Atta’s in Hamburg who is believed to have acted as an intermediary between the hijackers and the al-Qa’ida leadership; Ali Abd al-Aziz Ali, a nephew of Mohammed’s suspected of acting as his chief lieutenant; Waleed bin Attash, believed to have trained the hijackers; and Mustafa Ahmad al-Hawsawi.
But contrary to General Hartmann’s assurances, it is far from clear what rights any of these men will have. The Supreme Court, which struck down an earlier version of the military tribunal system, is expected to rule before July on whether the protections of the US Constitution apply to them.
Several commentators noted yesterday that the Bush administration is taking a risk by trying to press ahead with the trials. Its previous efforts to pursue justice against suspected terrorists have been patchy, if not downright disastrous.
Zacarias Moussaoui, the French national previously labelled the 20th hijacker, escaped the death penalty at his civilian trial and emerged as a deeply disturbed individual scarcely capable of participating in a sophisticated guerrilla operation - much to the embarrassment of the federal prosecutors who tried him in civilian court in Virginia.
Jose Padilla, the US citizen accused of wanting to detonate a radioactive “dirty bomb”, won the argument that he could not be held indefinitely in military custody without trial and went on trial in civilian court. He received a far lighter sentence than his prosecutors were seeking - 17 years instead of 30 to life.
The Bush administration appears to believe that, politically at least, it can win the argument by stirring up the country’s emotions about the worst peacetime attack on its own soil.
Facing execution
* Khalid Sheikh Mohammed
The Pakistani, educated in the US, claims responsibility for 31 attacks and plots including the 9/11 attacks and the beheading of Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl. Accused of being military commander for al-Qa’ida’s foreign operations. Captured in Pakistan in 2003 and taken to Guantanamo Bay from secret CIA prison. During interrogation, was subjected to simulated drowning technique known as waterboarding.
* Ali Adb Al-Aziz Ali
A nephew of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and cousin of jailed 9/11 bomber Ramzi Yousef. Accused of facilitating the attacks by transferring $120,000 to US-based operatives and assisting nine hijackers on their way from Pakistan.
* Ramzi Bin al-shibh
The former room-mate of Mohamed Atta is accused of being a link between al-Qa’ida and the hijackers. The Pentagon says he helped find flight schools for the al-Qa’ida pilots.
* Walid Bin Attash
The Yemeni, who was raised in Saudi Arabia, is accused of running al-Qa’ida camp in Afghanistan where he trained two 9/11 hijackers. Has admitted planning the attack on the USS Cole, and has also claimed involvement in the bombing of the US embassy in Kenya.
* Mustafa Ahmad al-hawsawi
The Saudi national is accused of being a money-man for the 9/11 attackers. The Pentagon says he provided them with cash, Western clothing, credit cards traveller’s cheques.
* Mohammed al-Qahtani
Officials say he was meant to be one of the hijackers but was barred from the US by immigration officials at Orlando Airport. Captured at Tora Bora caves in Afghanistan.
© 2008 The Independent
As someone else has already pointed out, these men were denied their Geneva Convention rights but will now be executed for violating the Geneva Convention.
Either they’re criminals and should be in civilian court or else they’re ’soldiers’ and should be treated like soldiers captured in war. However the War Party wants to politicize it while keeping any relevant information (such as their motive for the attacks) from the U.S. public. A complete sham.
Bush and Cheney should be on trial too for allowing the attack to happen. They received more than 50 warnings including three from heads of state. Why was NORAD was ordered to stand down and what happened to the FAA tapes? They started to write the Patriot Act BEFORE the attack because they knew they could use the attack to grab power. They are as complicit as any of the defendants.
Bush, as usual unconsciously, has already completely prejudiced the cases against the whole GITMO population. “These are vicious killers and they’ll get a fair trial,” he said—speaking Texan to an audience somewhere.
Agreed, bush and cheney and the entire neocon group should be tried in a public court for crimes against humanity and war crimes. The decision to use military to seek the death penalty of six “accused” individuals is a slap in the face to the constitution and rule of law. Where will this stop? Will the Code Pink members or any protest group be tried by a military court down the line. For another view from across the pond:
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/2d34e146-d8d8-11dc-8b22-0000779fd2ac.html?nclick_check=1
This always happens when you try to convict innocent men. These men ‘confessed’ after being tortured for more than 4 years.
Anyone with half a brain knows darn well the 9/11 attack as well as the previous WTC attack was set up by our own government to generate anti-islamic support and garner a new world order.
This is the only way the PNAC can prosecute anyone but themselves for this crime. There’s no evidence that a plane ever hit the pentagon, nor that one crashed in PA, and the evidence of NY is that the buildings fell due to controlled demolition.
The only way for the guilty to convict innocent people, is to use torture induced confessions. Only a military court will allow that. The neo-cons then execute others for crimes that they, the neo-cons, actually committed.
You will never see a fair trial for 9/11 until the people who received the of the missing $2.3 trillion from the Pentagon, which funded the event, are tried for treason and murder.
I’m not saying that the middle eastern fall guys are nice, or rational, nor do I neccessarily agree with any of their beliefs. However, they had nothing to do with what they’re being charged with. Watch “9/11 Mysteries”, “9/11 Revisited”, and “9/11 In Plane Sight”. Then you will see how the people who are responsible for the 9/11 event are the same ones who have been using executive privilidge to destroy the Constitution and our nation.
When those who commited the crime put the innocent on trial, how can it be a fair trial?
Wake up.
P.S. Those who are doing this will not stop. These innocent men will be executed. What’s a few more dead to these people, when they’ve already murdered 3000 civilians in NY, 4000 US servicemen and estimated numbers reaching near a million Iraqis in an illegal war. They do not care about life, freedom, ethics, morals, equality, the planet, our Constitution, or us, only power.
Does anyone else find the timing of these trials interesting? “The Commission” is a new book out, detailing the process behind the 911 commission report. What better way to hide the administrations guilt than to play the 911 terror card. It’s just like when Bush says he wants to get to the bottom of X. We know full well that’s just a diversion to make it seem like he himself doesn’t know who’s guilty when in fact it’s him.
The writer says this will be fiercely debated in the US elections. Has anyone seen any evidence of any kind of debate on the “trials” of these six or the Military Commissions Act itself?
You’d think that after 4 years, if these guys were really guilty, the government would have built the most astonishingly bullet-proof case against them - ever. A case so bullet proof you wouldn’t have to try them in a military tribunal. I mean, if it’s all so crystal clear, why disadvantage them at all? Oh maybe because these guys are just there to take the fall. 9/11 was the false flag event to end all false flag events. This is just a giant, well timed political distraction. I call bullshit.
KaneJeeves
“Does anyone else find the timing of these trials interesting? ”
You’ve got it! This ‘turror threat’ and related assorted trial events gobbledegook, gibberish, mishmash diversions are designed to maximise the confusion of average Americans… Hence, keeping the hope of Mr ‘100 years war’ McCain election chances ontrack…
How pathetic…
John McKan, guroo of the Military Commissions Act of 2006.
Special Comment: Beginning of the end
Oct. 18: Keith Olbermann addresses the signing of the Military Commission Act into law in a special comment.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15321167/
Indeed the TIMING of these “trials” is of very special importance. If they are “debated” in the 2008 election, every effort from the Right will be made to refer to “justice” and paint every Democrat in sight as
a “terrorist coddler.” Obama is up to this debate.
Mrs. Clinton much, much less so. Obama thinks on his feet. Mrs. Clinton stumbles around until somebody else prompts her next insight or emotion.
There will be no justice in the United States if Congress does not initiate steps to Impeach Bush-Cheney and others in their regime, and hold them accountable in a court of law for crimes against The United States of America, its citizens, and humanity in general. They have, by their actions over the last seven years, become a threat to national and international security. It is all very tragic, but so, too, are the deaths of well over a million, mostly innocent, people who only wanted to get through the day.
So maybe 10% of those who watch these trials on their television sets will see them for what they are. So what? The other 90% will quake in fear of terrorism and gladly give up their remaining liberties. They know how foolish it is to doubt what their televisions tell them and are afraid of what people might think of them if they question these trials: Are you a terrorist or what?
DITTO…this is all about the elections and keeping McCain in the running against his democratic counterparts.
Also, this will be a secret ‘military trial’ that the public/media will not be able to witness. KANGAROO. SHAM. NOT JUSTICE BY ANY STRETCH OF THE IMAGINATION.
Put BUSH/CHENEY/RUMSFELD on trial for killing 4,000 Americans and .a few hundred thousand Iraqis needlessly!
First, we are going to give you a fair trial and then we will hang you!
As I have stated in 2 other articles about this topic:
I find the printed news about the upcoming ‘kangar….er, fair trial’ by the military commissions in Gitmo intriguing. I have not seen a story in print with the specific charges that the ‘Gitmo 6′ are being accused (condemned?) of.
Public Radio yesterday announced the specifics and they sounded as if they were duplicates of the war crimws we are and have been committing in Iraq and Afghanistan - charges such as bombing civilian targets in time of war, killing innocent civilians, conspiracy to kill civilians, terrorism…. and so on.
Small wonder the MSM is NOT daring to print the specific charges - even unaware readers would not fail to see through the hypocrisy.
We hanged German and Japanese war criminals for these crimes(including (waterboarding) after WWII.
Talk about the ‘Silence of the Lambs’
Seig Heil !
After January 2009, someone please waterboard Cheney and the whole sorry truth will come out. The real enemies are NOT in Iraq, Iran and Afghanistan. Nor are they at the concentration camp at Guantanamo. The real enemies are in (1) Saudi Arabia from whence al Qaida members have largely come and whose vast financial resources and international money contacts give them free access to money and all it can buy; (2) those States of the USA that gave them access to the training that allowed them to become trained pilots; (3) the CIA and armed forces of the USA which, when al Quaida was their friend in fighting the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, gave them advanced military equipment and training and (4) Pakistan where they have been given protective cover and additional help by the Government. After Cheney confesses under watreboarding, he should be tried in the same way as Sadamm Hussein was and, when found guilty of crimes against humanity, be dropped off alone and on foot in the streets of Baghdad in the Sadr City area.
Hmmm.. “Kangaroo Court”… nice political code word. I like that.
“He (General Hartmann) stressed that the men would be regarded as innocent until proven guilty….”
Okaaaay. And they’ve been held for what, 4 years? 5 years?
And they have been waterboarded, (whether or not that’s torture,) blah, blah, blah…
Either the latter puts the lie to the former, or we should all be very, very frightened, or both.
If Bush’s ‘tax rebates’ are the bread, this must be the circus.
Seems like Bush/Cheney are desperatly trying to let these guys walk…they will botch the trial and have to let them go…I guess to cover up who was REALLY behind the 911 attack
I cant see this dojng any more damage to the USA’s tanished image…the entire world already sees the USA as some kind of throwback 1950’s eastern european dictatorship….exactly what bin laden wanted in the first place
If they are REALLY considered innocent until proven guilty…then where is the bail hearing?
I’m just curious, why haven’t the “terrorist” killed Bush and/or Cheney yet? I’m sure they have all the resources and connections to do it, and I’m sure they would love to after this ridiculous “War On Terror”. I’m very, very skeptical with this whole 9/11 “They hate us for our freedom” shit. It is just very strange that the two most powerful men could have not only survived the largest attack on America soil, but also continue to be breathing after killing a million Iraqis and thousands of Afghanis, not to mention completely destroying multiple nations along the way. If they hate us so much, Mr. Bush, why aren’t you a dead man?
‘Jesus’ cosmetic row in Singapore
And just in time for Summer fun…
The Jesus Brand Waterboard
Kangaroo Court II
This smacks of the Bush Administration’s messy execution of Saddam Hussein. I certainly do not defend or support Saddam or those now facing the US charges, however W seems to think that executions of Arabs and US elections go together like peas and carrots.
Saddam was sentenced on 11/5/06 and election day was 11/7/06. He was lynched on 12/30/06.
I would bet $$$ to donuts that there will be a conviction with a death sentence before November. The execution being held around the “holy days”.
Just like a crappy TV plot that needs no explanation.
And so it goes…
Which one of our candidates running for the “leader of the free world” is willing to refute or deny the use of any of these unconstitutional executive powers granted by congress to the current president? Until this issue into the abuse/use of executive priviled is addressed, the US will remain an ugly, unhappy and awful place to live where any crime can be called treason and fair trials a thing of the past.
Gee - the Independent no less. They usually have such an even handed approach to all things American.
If this was tried in a civilian court, the case would be thrown out the first day. First you torture people for years to extract so-called “confessions”. Then you send in the “nice guys”, the FBI to corroborate what these folks have said under extreme duress. The back story, of course, is that you will cop to whatever you said or we’ll torture you again. This dog and pony show is so corrupt and disgusting that it would never stand up in a REAL court of law. Of course, we don’t have that anymore.
twalsh1
“… why haven’t the “terrorist” killed Bush and/or Cheney yet?”
Why do you think Bush has a whole damned army protecting him; people are made to stay in their homes with shades down; trees are cut along roadways he’ll be traveling along; and all the other things that have been done to protect him when he goes to any foreign country? Probably has a whole squadron of fighters up there when he flies anywhere, keeping a clear circle for miles around Airforce 1 or his helicoptor. And wouldn’t be surprised if there was a mine field around his whole ranch in Crawford.
As a young college student I was made to read Arthur Koestler’s “Darkness at Noon’ to see the horrors of totalitarianism nd its effect on one man. Now we have in this country the Repuglican death squads which emulate the horrors we were supposed to fear. Big Brother was a communist. Right??? How soon we forget that Hitler was a communist-hating conservative with similar interrogation techniques as any French or Danish underground captive could tell - from their graves, of course. When these “trials” are carried out and “justice” meted out, what fair-minded person could say we do not deserve the awful consequences which must inevitably follow? Let us just hope they follow on Washington, DC or Crawford, Texas where they belong and not elsewhere.
Why haven’t the terrorists killed Bush and Cheney? Because they depend on each other. Remember, Bush senior was entertaining the Bin Laden family on 9/11! Why else would the administration let Bin laden escape when the soldiers had him cornered in Tora Bora?
The Air Force was running multiple war games on the morning of 9/11 simulating hijackings over the continental United States that included (at least) one “live-fly” exercise as well as simulations that placed “false blips” on FAA radar screens.
These war games eerily mirrored the real events of 9/11 to the point of the Air Force running drills involving hijacked aircraft as the 9/11 plot actually unfolded.
The war games & terror drills played a critical role in ensuring no Air Force fighter jocks - who had trained their entire lives for this moment - would be able to prevent the attacks from succeeding.
When I was a young man, we used to see the CCCP put on show trials of “enemies of the people.”
Most of these poor bastards had been in the dungeons of the KGB’s Lubyanka Street building, sometimes for years. They confessed to anything that was said to them, no matter how ridiculous. If they confessed, with luck they would be shot. Denial meant going back for more torture.
Many were there for an unorthodox thought, a criticism of party dictates, or just because a neighbor was angry with them and denounced them. The end result was the same. There were no innocent people. After a time, they would do anythng, confess anything, to get a bullet in the back of the head instead of more torture.
We used this to demonstrate how much how much more civilized we were than the Russians. We had the rule of law. The Bill of Rights protected everyone. You were innocent until proven guilty. You had the right to an attorney.
SO now, we are having show trials at Gitmo, with evidence given under torture, no right to hear evidence, and already convicted in the minds of the judges and their keepers, and perhaps in the eyes of an American People, bombarded by endless propaganda and lies.
After six or seven years of torture and humiliation, I imagine that many of the so-called defendants would rather be executed, than go back to still more years of Gitmo.
This just serves to drive another nail in the coffin of our Constitutional Republic.
The US is guilty of war crimes. Kangaroo courts are the recourse of criminals. The US should not be criticized for the way it breaks the law, but for breaking the law. Even a real trial would still be unlawful. This war has been waged under false pretenses and constitutes the most serious of war crimes under Nurenberg and US laws. This is what the US should stand accused of, not how it conducts the trials as this ultimately justifies these trials and only criticizes the fairness of the trial. That is wrong. The US must stand before the world community as a criminal.
” locust February 12th, 2008 11:56 am
As someone else has already pointed out, these men were denied their Geneva Convention rights but will now be executed for violating the Geneva Convention.”
THAT’S REALLY NOTHING NEW. It’s very standard “policy” with hypocritical and hegemonic powers, definitely very “normal” of the USA, or the U.S. govt and its real ruling elites, to act this way. Throughout all of U.S. history there’s little example of [good] kind; it’s mostly analogous to active cancer. The analogy is not thorough though, for cancers are … also unwelcome, … experiences, but they’re innocent.
The U.S. did very much the same with the Bush administration’s bs “justifications” for attacking Iraq, as well as with or for attacking the Taliban; just that the latter understandably is a little less obvious for the witless or less witted among the citizenry to see. The U.S. also did the same in ensuring that Saddam Hussein would not have a fair trial and would definitely be executed; the conclusion was a determined long enough in advance. It’s just that the constantly lying and hellbent Bush administration, et al, needed to stage a show around this to try to hide the fact that Saddam was definitely getting the death penalty.
There was absolutely no legal or moral basis for the execution of Saddam Hussein.
Of course these and other relevant facts do not justify the death penalty for detainees of the the U.S. in its wholly bogus GWoT, though. There’s no way to justify their executions. Legally or morally, it doesn’t matter which of the two considerations we employ; the Bush administration has no justifiability in executing these GWoT detainees, or for processing them via U.S. military court.
Conversely, it all is justification for hanging Bush, Cheney, plenty of others who served in the two terms of this administration, and while the same applies with respect with to the Bill Clinton, GHW Bush, R. Reagan, … administrations. Of course never to be left out are U.S. military command officials (besides the c-in-c and Sec. of Defence, who are already accounted for as guilty officials of these administrations).
They could all be justifiably sentenced to the death penalty, but it’d be better to end d.p. once and for all. It’d also be more fitting for these people to serve out the whole remainders of their lives incarcerated in fittingly filthy, rat-infested, cock-roach infested, … dungeons somewhere. Etc.
YET, most U.S. voters evidently are going to be voting for ever more hell on Earth this coming November, for most evidently are voting for … no valid candidates; no one who’s going to make anything more than fraudulent or false efforts to stop the wars, anyway.
Obama and Clinton have already made it very clear that they’re going to maintain the extreme criminality of the USA, et al; in terms of the wars on Iraq and Afghanistan, the Israel-Palestine conflict and Israel’s hellish criminality, the war-act coup d’etat against Haiti, and so on. There may be some variations from these candidates, and perhaps only to try to again deceive, or else out of “plain” stupidity; but they are all going to continue the present crimes.
The only valid candidates who are running are Cynthia McKinney and Mike Gravel (if still running). There’s Nader, but the last I read of about him says that he’s still exploring whether or not to run again.
U.S. voters hide (try to anyway) their actual pro-criminality natures, and will vote to continue what they falsely pretend to want to stop. They may have themselves fooled, self-deceived, but pretending still is NO good! It is rotten as hell, akin to hypocrisy and self-deception, …; unless the pretense is just an innocent act for the purpose of entertainment, say.
Like their evil rulers, they lust to live out their lives as [pretenders], including when their lies are even obvious. When their lies are obvious, these people still persist in pretending that no one has noticed. Obama, Clintons, etc., etc., etc.
We are unable to do this, but figuratively should take barrels of fresh blood from Big Agri. slaughters of animals and find a way to dump all of this on the Bush administration, for starters anyway. And include all of the administration’s DP and RP supporters in the Congress and the Senate, DoJ, etc., all of whom strongly have supported and continue to support the Bush administration and the GWoT; putting aside excuses these people would pretend to justifiably excuse them for their criminal votes, for such excuses are bs.
After all, they are all of ‘blood cult’ (former Pope John Paul II’s words about Bush Jr during early 2003 or late 2002) psychopathy, and the whole of humanity needs to realise this is true. The blood on their hands is all real and for RACKET, so ‘blood cult’ and the like are fitting references.
Andrew Gumbel writing for the UK’s INDEPENDENT says: “While few doubts have been raised, domestically or internationally, about the men’s involvement in the attacks on New York and Washington,…”
I don’t know what planet Mr. Gumbel is inhabiting, but the doubts about who was ultimately responsible for the planning and execution of the 9/11 event are being dispelled by ever-accumulating evidence, including eye- and “ear”-witness testimony about explosions in the basement and mid-sections of the Twin Towers, with Building 7, seven hours later, conveniently pancaking down in its own “footprint” in less than 12 seconds too, just like the mammoth Twin Tower buildings did. Evidently according to many experts, the fates of the three buildings in the World Trade Center comlex were perfect examples of very sophisticated and knowledgeable controlled demolition efficiency and perfection. According to demolition experts, the preparation of explosives, wiring, master controls to level these buildings so neatly would have taken about two weeks.
There’s evidence and eye-witness testimony about work crews at odd times, and computer systems shut down on the weekends … Funny, no one mentioned or caught a bunch of Arabs sneaking around in the innards of the buildings.
And it seems none of the whole bunch of the hi-jackers or these fellows in the dock of this Kangeroo Court at Guantanamo maybe knew/know how to fly planes very well, especially the big ones that alleged crashed into the upper floors of each respective tower, and interestingly none of the alleged hi-jackers names appear on any flight roster, and at least six of them are alive and well and living outside the U.S.
And wherever is a photograph of that huge Boeing plane or even pieces of it lodged in that small opening [vis-a-vis the size of the alleged plane] at the Pentagon? I searched my news magazines back then, and then the internet news archives. There aren’t any pictures because it wasn’t a plane that made that hole in the Pentagon wall?
In Naomi Klein’s well-researched terminology [in THE SHOCK DOCTRINE, The Rise of Disaster Capitalism], the first SHOCK of the SHOCK DOCTRINE, whether a huge human-planned disaster [assassinations and government overthrow, for example] or natural disaster, such as Hurricane Katrina decimating New Orleans, both kinds of SHOCKS are guaranteed to disorient, confuse, panic, disempower, frighten, demoralize, terrorize a nation or area’s population, rendering it totally malleable and unquestioningly acquiescent to whatever decisions are announced, whatever laws are suddenly changed or fashioned, whatever propaganda is spewed by a strong leadership.
And then, quite simply Anything is Possible. For example, the Pentagon’s September 8, 2001, secret memo that surfaced so briefly on the net a few years ago and disappeared zip-zap, outlined the basic strategies and areas for the attack and bombing of Afghanistan, and then all that war fever to link Sadaam Hussein with al-Qa’ida with the excuse to begin the bombing of Iraq with a lot of SHOCK & AWE to “liberate” the people of Iraq and bring them FREEDOM AND DEMOCRACY. [A plan in the works for about 3 years prior to the actual attack and invasion.]
“Between March 20 and May 2 [2003], the weeks of ‘major combat,’ the U.S. military dropped more than thirty thousand bombs on Iraq, as well as twenty thousand precision-guided cruise missiles — 67 per cent of the total number ever made.” (The Shock Doctrine, Naomi Klein, p.332 with notations of her original references.)
Hey … GOOD FOR THE ECONOMY. Picture our Veep D. Vader Cheney rubbing his dry-bone hands together and on the phone to Haliburton and the folks at the Carlyle Group, with investments predominantly in defense industries, … and lots of others. Gotta’ manufacture some new bombs and crusies already! Zip-Zap.
“Big profits in the ‘defense’ industry right now! Good for the country, good for your state, good for YOU hiss the snake-oil MEGA-CORP lobbyists swarming through the hallowed halls of The People’s Congress and Senate up on the Hill.
When I read an account of the meetings among the military personnel and the leadership deciding so cold-bloodedly on the Technicolor Adventure of SHOCK AND AWE directed at the beautiful city of Baghdad and the innocent Iraqi people, I cried.
I never have cried so much through a book [and I’ve read some real tear-jerkers in my time], and certainly never one that’s essentially about a particular Economic Policy and how it’s imposed,… starting with a terrible SHOCK. The U.S. Greedheads and some allies have been in bed with or supportive of this particular Milton Friedman-and-his-Chicago-Boys economic policy for about 40 years now.
A trail of blood, disappearances, torture and economic chaos. Much blood on too many hands, and NO FEELINGS of remorse or regret or sorrow in too many hearts, e.g., Donald Rumsfeld’s shrug and offhand “Well, stuff happens” in a Q & A moment about casualities and chaos in Iraq, regarding civilians and our U.S. soldiers. And this total uncaringness … just ambitious plans with other people’s children threatened, hurt and on the line … tells me I am living in a country ruled by Psychopaths whose major qualities are NO CONSCIENCE and a total inability TO FEEL empathy, compassion and TO CONNECT at the heart level with fellow humans. I sincerely believe we all are in danger of our very lives because we are being governed by Mad Men with a Mad Woman or two in there too.
Remember the thirsty, hungry, hurt people on a New Orleans highway overpass and how long they were there before they were dumped with thousands of others into the unequipped Super Dome. And Remember 9/11 … and the surviving heroes: Fire Fighters, Police, medical people, and emergency volunteers who have been denied help for their disabling illnesses … tumors, respiratory problems, cancer, etc. Too expensive to cover … don’t ya’ know.
The Saudi men who are now being “tried” in Guantanamo in the essentially secret Kangeroo Court, as someone already said, are likely unsavory people, but as to who is responsible for 9-11? Do your homework. Sift through the evidence. Many sites and books now. Watch the many DVD’s that are available. Use your own judgment. And if your conclusion is that 9/11 was an Inside Job, then pass the word in whatever way you can and encourage others to examine the evidence and come to their own conclusions.
My judgment … from a Disbeliever to a Convinced: 9/11 WAS AN INSIDE JOB AND THIS IS THE GREATEST MORAL ISSUE THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES HAVE TO CONFRONT.
As President George H.W. Bush, used to say so emphatically: THIS CANNOT STAND!
Are we the Home of the Brave or a bunch of cowards or what? Are we The Sheeple we are so often called by some of our own citizens and citizens of other countries … or are we free men and women with brains capable of open-minded, critical thinking? Are we morally and ethically responsible citizens or do we look the other way and play it safe? And, yes, it’s dangerous now to be visible in writing, speaking, showing up … But perhaps it’s much more dangerous to not “Show Up,” in the broadest sense.
There’s both a nation and a world at stake now, and millions of people are being killed or are dying because of Economic & War policies initiated by our own government.
“Stuff happens.” or “Not on my watch.”
We’ll find out soon enough what we are made of.
************************
“We are drunk and at the edge of the roof.” - Rumi
“A [wo]man does what [s]he must - in spite of personal consequences, in spite of obstacles and dangers and pressures - and that is the basis of all human morality.
President John Fitzgerald Kennedy
“We [must] be the checks and balances on this out-of-control, criminal government.”
Cindy Sheehan, mother of Casey, peace activist, Congressional Candidate, Election 2008
To add to the article; I saw a CCR rep on Democracy Now today, and he pointed out that the Pentagon flak announced that the prisoners would have the “right of silence” at their trial, where they aren’t allowed to see the evidence against them. He pointed out that the prisoners didn’t have the “right of silence” while they were being tortured. What a farce, to use the words of the Bill of Rights in such a twisted way!
Also, the junta has announced that even if found innocent, the prisoners will not be released! They will be kept in prison for the rest of their lives if found innocent.
There are anti-terrorists in prison in Miami now, who have been found innocent and not released. This is because they are Cubans and the terrorists they are against are American sponsored terrorists against Cuba.
Mike Corbeil, don’t forget the show trial of Milosevic. I am reading a book called “Travesty”, about that trial. It is unbelievable that the US got away with such a travesty of justice. And most “progressives” know nothing about it. The author is John Laughland.
I agree with Cee Miracles and others that the 9-11 attacks were obviously staged and managed to instill fear into the american public. But Katrina is worse than you think. There were reports that there were explosions in the levees that failed, flooding the city. Remember that it was the floods that caused the most damage, not the hurricane. And the result of the floods and starving of the refugees and the mass deportations, -
a whiter, richer New Orleans - was the plan all along, I think.
I see that a certain member of America’s Highest Court is in favor of torturing the innocent.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080212/ap_on_re_au_an/britain_scalia_torture
See also: http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1202-33.htm
There are all sorts of theories. I disagree with the one about no plane flying into the Pentagon because 1- jet fuel was everywhere and 2- the passengers died. Knowing that it took nearly an hour and a half for NORAD to do their job, I find it edifying that there were 18 additional blips to confuse everybody. But the timing of the exercises was way far beyond curious. And whatever happened to the WTC towers, the building 7 total collapse where, I believe, the emergency communications center was located made no sense whatsoever. Again, the passengers from those planes did die. They didn’t just vanish. The hocus pocus of identifying all those hijackers almost immediately also made no sense. Now we get to these defendants at Gitmo. How did these people admit to guilt? Such admissions under torture are inadmissible in a court of law. That’s because people will say anything when tortured. So, before a world that has, on the whole disavowed executions, we are going to have Gitmo capital military commissions trials. What a mess.
Probably someone else has already noted this but this lets Osama Bin Laden off the hook right? When first asked he said he didn’t do it. Then a video (thought to be fraudulent) shows him saying he did. Now these guys are gonna fry for doing it?
Makes a real mockery out of the present situation in Afghanistan.
I, like Libertus Fugit says above, am old enough to recall these ponderous trials of so-called “Soviet traitors.” These prisoners were so out of it, either from drugs or torture or both, that all they wanted was an opportunity to make their confessions and get shot. These were the famous Communist “Show Trials.” Now, Chairmen Bush and Cheney want their show trials and are stupid enough to think we will all swallow it. We are in real trouble, a lot more than many of us can possibly believe. I don’t think we have a lot of time left to correct this situation. The Russians and Chinese won’t let us win in the Middle East, and, quite frankly, Bush and Cheney don’t want us to win over there.
In respect of the plane crashing into the Pentagon, the “engine” which was shown as “proof” that a large passenger airplane had crashed into the Penagon, made the entire situation laughable. At best, what was shown was a turbine used as necessary to provide extra power for electric use and system failures. It was definitely NOT a propulsion engine. I worked in an aircraft factory that manufactured turbine engines. I think I can tell the difference in what was claimed and what was shown.
Bush and Cheney are criminals of the highest order. They should be stripped, dragged through the streets and hanged with old ropes. That is my own personal opinion.
9/11 was an inside job. This is just throwing another crime on top of those that have already been commited.
THANK YOU, whatfools, for the link to Scalia’s statements.
He really takes the silk glove off the iron fist.
Guess what happens to any appeal? 2 chances - slim & none!
Please - you all should read!!! He IS touted as the next Chief Justice!
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080212/ap_on_re_au_an/britain_scalia_torture
See also:
http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1202-33.htm
Contrary to what any Mussolini on the Supreme Court thinks (and that could include the black one) torture is the easiest world phenomenon to judge that there is.
Torture separates ALL people into two simple groups: victims and goons. As Hannah Arendt told us, it is banal. Bush, Scalia, Mukasey, Gonzalez and all the other American goons are banal.
It is time for Hollywood to start working with the public schools, showing everyplace
“Judgment at Nuremberg” starring Spencer Tracy and Marlene Dietrich.
It is time also for Argentine and Uruguayan lecturers to come to the United States and explain the unintended (or rather “unimagined”) results of torture.
We need to learn, with precision, every repercussion that occurred in those two countries.
In my previous life (before retirement) I had the sad occasion to be at a number of aircraft crashes, several of them airliners. The alleged debris field at the Pentagon and at the fourth crash did not in any way resemble reality. Especially the Pentagon. An imaginative high school kid could have come up with better explanations than the “experts” did.
…and where is the erstwhile “opposition party” while all this takes place? What are the Democratic front runners saying or doing to contest and confront the erosion of civil liberties and the rule of law? That’s what I thought.
“The real enemies are in (1) Saudi Arabia from whence al Qaida members have largely come and whose vast financial resources and international money contacts give them free access to money and all it can buy; (2) those States of the USA that gave them access to the training that allowed them to become trained pilots; (3) the CIA and armed forces of the USA which, when al Quaida was their friend in fighting the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, gave them advanced military equipment and training…”
There is a lot of confusion here. First, Saudi Arabia itself was a fabricated country that could not exist without international corporate/military support. The government of Saudi Arabia is perfectly integrated into the international military cartel and functions for its purposes.
Those purposes (maintaining and extending control) also include continuing genocide in the Middle East (repression and oppression), rape of the environment, usurping of lands, resources, etc.
It is entirely within the COMMON interests of the Saudi royals and other wealthy Saudis such as the Bin Ladens to support police state factioning and false flag terrorist efforts in the region.
Al Qaeda is a joint project (like others in Africa, Pakistan, India. etc.) of several interlocked police state agencies including MI6, CIA and Pakistani Intelligence. (Remember Gladio? same principal! but the focus of Al Qaeda is to credibly present a global threat rather than a purely Western European one.)
So, Al Qaeda was not our ‘friend’ but the creation of US military efforts along with other secret service efforts to debacle the society of Afghanistan and replace it with a fierce ‘Islamicism’ (to which end, American universities such as the U of Mich actually prepared revisionist historical texts)
What is so very hard for Americans to accept is that the society in which they live is not only not democratic, it is quite decidedly totalitarian. Furthemore, the ‘US’ is not a sovereign country. It is a fully integrated part of an international military/corporate system. And, the facts of its operation are secrets carefully guarded by agencies such as the NSA, CIA, MI6, etc.
The key here is “need to know.” in other words, if you do not need to know (‘need’ is of course determined by military strategists), you will not only not be told, you will be disinformed.
So, is Bush guilty? He is guilty of not telling you these facts but, he himself would be terrified to do so! Bush did not plan 9/11. Who is out front to take the heat is simply that, a HUGE distraction!
Think military. Think military think tank. Think DoD! Think interlocked and highly coordinated effort involving ALL the key support structures in industry and you have an idea what is happening in the centers of power where false flag operations are approved.
9/11 was orchestrated for the soul purpose of extending police state controls world wide and also to further genocide efforts around the world.
The comparison of the Bush Outrages to Nuremberg is the pinnacle of delusion. That one has the gall to make such an assertion is breathtaking.
We need to keep focus on Bush War Crimes. . . a focus that such distractions only water down.
The hypocrisy, as we know, includes the American press, assiduous in finding the nearest way at hand to gloss anything of substance, every time.
A CHORUS OF NUMBSKULLS: “simulated drowning, tens of thousands, simulated drowning, tens of thousands, simulated drowning, thousands, hundreds of thousands!”
A CHORUS OF SMARTER PEOPLE: “real drowning, over a million, drowning, over a million, drowning terminated before the person dies, a million, drowning terminated after the person is dead, over a million!”
Why is the second group smarter than the first? Because they are more accurate.
Oh, here’s a newsman, a world journalist who aspires to be an American newspaperman. His name is Scoop Miller and he really wants to know what everyone thinks, even what I think.
And so he has agreed to do an onstage demonstration of simulated drowning, in which he will play the victim, and I will play Antonin Scalia.
“Just listen, Scoop. It’s easy. Put this cotton pad on your face and do as I say.”
“Are you really going to pour water in my nose and mouth?”
“Of course not. I’ll pour a little on your forehead, some on your chin, a bit on the side of your face, then I’ll move ten feet back and tip the pitcher there, just behind your nose and mouth. The audience will never know.”
“Seems kind of phoney.”
“Well, you agreed to simulated drowning. You don’t want real drowning, do you?”
“No.”
“Okay then, send tremors through your body
when I pour, as if you’re having a seizure.
Then stop shaking and die.”
“Got it.”
“You do? You really do? I doubt it.”
Yooper, we didn’t see the same film. “Judgment at Nuremberg” took the subject of torture seriously, something the portion of the American populace that is goons has trouble doing.
I’m not saying you’re a goon. But I think these people need to be mocked, in whatever way people can do it. And brought to account.
i don’t believe any of these guys are guilty of anything. If they were, they could be charged and tried by a jury of their peers.
our gulag is smaller than stalin’s, but in every other respect just as bad, and sometimes worse. why this is so impossible to accept is it’s being done by the old beacon of democracy and freedom. the situation is really desperate now, because we have only a shadow of a judiciary left. can we repeal the military commissions act? technically it should still be possible, but where are the sincere congresspeople to stand up and do it? why did it ever pass in the first place? that thing just tore our constitution to shreds.
Seems to be near unanimity in the opinions expressed above. Anyone read Free Republic? What does it look like there? I won’t go there but I expect there is near total agreement to extremely opposite views to those here.
Watch out folks. Anyone of us could be next for speaking disapprovingly of this government. As usual, I see little to be hopeful about in the future.
I was recently asked why the US had to “save” or fix every country around the world.
My reply ” Because it makes American Corporations
Very, Very Rich”. Is that overly simplistic?
Bush, Cheney, and others, including our Congress, should be charged for war crimes. War crime is what has happened (is happening) in Iraq.
But our American herd of sheep is proud to vote for candidates from both parties, parties who are party to this war crime. Long live American sheep.
My reply ” Because it makes American Corporations
Very, Very Rich”. Is that overly simplistic?
No.
Whoever said the timing of these trials is the key is right. This is an obvious ploy to focus the American voter on terrorists in order to keep their fear level up so they’ll end up voting for whichever candidate wants to keep the war going on for as long as possible. This candidate is, of course, John McCain, a Republican, and this is the only possible way the Republicans can stay in power.
“The Saudi men who are now being “tried” in Guantanamo in the essentially secret Kangeroo Court, as someone already said, are likely unsavory people, but as to who is responsible for 9-11?”
I have to say, the comment of Cee Miracles is quite excellent, except for the one phrase “…are likely unsavory people…”
Generally, when there is chaos such as was created in Viet Nam and Chile (following the assassination of Allende), those rounded up and/or tortured and/or executed are the best the society has produced. In Chile, progressives were seized, held in the stadium, tortured, butchered, etc.
In another case, after Banisadr was ousted by the extreme right wing elements, a friend of mine was executed. In fact, I was the one who had convinced him to leave his medical studies at UCLA to assist others trying to implement a saner government for the people who had suffered so much under the CIA’s torture regime in Iran.
In Iraq, the first people executed were the intellectuals, the doctors, teachers, etc. It is the same all over the world. The people held captive are every society’s hope for a better tomorrow. That is why those who wish to maintain elite domination, target these social resources of a population first.
Remember how many monks were tortured in Viet Nam? It is always the intellectuals, the progressives, those who are hard to corrupt… it is their names that are always called first when torture programs are implemented. This is key to genocide, first remove the leaders. Once the leaders are gone, the others will be easy to fool, frighten, manipulate, etc.
In our own country we can see this clearly in the assassination of Black leaders especially those who were creating independent schools, small businesses, etc. Such people constitute a constant concern for the powers that be and that concern means that surveillance is not about finding terrorists but rather identifying future leaders.
I have known those who were tortured. They are not in the least unsavory… only altruistic, dedicated, intelligent and competent. And so they were targeted. And so they are now gone.
You don’t need a doctorate in nuclear physics to grasp: ‘al Qaeda’ is a loose network of ragtag militants cultured by western intel for their own national interests. With the cold war over and peak oil on the horizon, this nation was forced to “develop -and simultaneously control- a widely perceived direct external threat”…911… the defense industry, big oil, and big government had their needs met.
Any slack jawed troglodite should be able to understand that al Qaeda frontmen are sock puppets for the cable news story hour…any person with two ii’s should be able to see that those skyskrapers were obviously blown into a trillion pieces. Again, this is not nuclear physics.
…and The Scum in DC know that all we’ll do about it is stand around (or sit at our keyboards) and bitch, or “vote”, hoping that this year Lucy won’t pull the football away again. Result is The Scum will continue to rape the world unimpeded.
There is a time for intellectual discourse of various sorts and working within the “system”; then there comes a time for drastic physical action. The question is: what will it take to get American’s their spine back? Or will we die like frogs in a slowly boiling pot?
al Qaeda is a black ops set-up that has been run by U.S. intelligence since its inception in Afghanistan. It was specifically designed to establish a Reichstag fire situation where the American public would be panicked into doing practically anything. Now the president is proposing the largest military expenditures for the next fiscal year ever. And guess what? He’ll get it.
50 bucks says you won’t find me- someone who knows enough to know- stomping the streets against intel teams that make the STAZI look like incompetent mongoloids. Forget it. I value my backyard a hell of a lot more than letting it all ride on the backs of 100 million people who don’t believe in evolution. Let them have their kangaroo courts and sham war on terror. Let the public drool away with Britney and Fox news. Call me jaded.
tlescpk: “…Call me jaded.”
No, I’d call you self -absorbed and/or cowardly. Yours is the kind of thinking that perpetuates the kangaroo courts and sham war on terror.
I think that we can all see the monkeys, but where the heck is the organ grinder?
The men and women and children at guatanamo and elsewhere are innocents.
The terrorists, if you really care to find them, are in Washington D.C.
Or are you not aware that America is a safe haven for terrorists?
seditious-
Where’s your resume, and results? (crickets…)
The masses of the 60s, and 70s brought social change, that’s it. For all practical purposes our political/federal system has devolved by orders of magnitude (see: quasi police state/fake war on terror). Vietnam- a bloodbath, but 911 was truly sick.
All those 60s protesters aren’t dead today; they went mute because they’re fat and happy. “Active” grass roots political change is impossible when a satiated lazy uneducated populace runs up against a trillion dollar arms/banking industry that cornerstone’s the power base. Until the people are starving, I’ll gladly balance my courage with realism. Sometimes the best work happens on the edges anyway. So if you really want to make a difference, vote Republican to destabilize the economy. That’ll prime the pump eventually. (i.e. see: OBAMA)
If the last 8 years hadn’t been so horrible, do you really think we’d have a shot at this:
“This is the new American majority,” Obama told supporters in Madison, Wisconsin, where the next showdown occurs in a week. “This is what change looks like when it happens from the bottom up.”
-Reuters
tlescpk -
Don’t count your crickets before they’re hatched. My “resume, and results”? You might be surprised, but I damned sure won’t be posting them here in a public forum.
I’m not interested in regurgitating the 60′-70’s. It is the same beast we are up against today, but requires different methods. What this country needs now is true and brave patriots - not Vichy-style panderers or bromidic intellectualism.
First the CIA destoyed video evidence of torture/crimes against humanity/war crimes at the hands of US in-terror-gators …
now the CIA and Military will destroy the physical evedence, GITMO detainees with a speedy one size fits all trail and exicution. How conveiniant. This will make the Nixon-Watergate 18 1/2-Minute Gap seem like a day at Disney.
I’m sure Bushco is getting a bit nervous about possible war crimes trials with Obama looking more like the next president.
We are al al-Qaeda now, especially if the new National Defense Authorization Act, passes — which it probably will.
seditious-
Um, okay what would a “brave” patriot actally do to alter the realty of our now deeply engrained Soviet-style show trials? Letter to the editor? Yell to a senator? Or something too secret for public forums, like your resume? Why the reticence? Go ahead and be secretly brave. See how long it takes the feds to pick that up.
I’d say Nouveau Pichy would have to be congress- our steely reps who just voted to let the telecoms off the hook for running “big brother” splitter machines straight to the NSA. Oh yeah, that reticence of yours? Makes sense. I doubt the vacuum was built for peeps at Martha Stewart.com.
Let us get something very clear the 9/11 attack was a false flag, there is no way it could have been anything else. All these Muslims being paraded as participants in that scam were either duped or played no part. Why is there no due process because the ” evidence” would not stand even the most casual scrutiny, why was there no investigation into 9/11 for the same reason.
Of course Americans will never admit they were duped too, it’s not in an American persons make up being the biggest bluffers on this planet. Why else would religion have such a strong hold in the USA if they could face reality.
The USA is now being run by a military Junta and has been for the last 8-9 years in the best traditions of North Korea, Burma and Argentina.
The world had better wake up and get grip before the maniacs in Washington and New York really flip their lid.
It was interesting to note the change of attitude of Putin during the past 8 years from being a visitor to Texas to threatening Ukraine with dire consequences if they join NATO.
tlescpk: “…Call me jaded.”
” No, I’d call you self -absorbed and/or cowardly. Yours is the kind of thinking that perpetuates the kangaroo courts and sham war on terror.”
No it’s the religious nutcases who are the problem in the USA, anybody who thinks that some bearded bloke in the sky made anything in a few days should be carted off to a nice cosy padded cell.
What perpetuates military Juntas is brainless people, none thinkers, flag waving idiots.
seditious-
Postscript to “self-absorbed and/or cowardly”: I’ll gladly open eyes on the edges (educate) and live for tomorrow, while you can get down with your weatherunderground daydreams and see how far that gets you. We know how that Always ends. I’d say the best way forward is for each of us in the know to act as glasses for the masses- a lens to our friends. The complete absurdity of the 911 myth is easy to convey if you know what you’re talking about. A million “me’s” are easy to envision, as are the 10 million friends we convert.
You?- How many do you really think want to initiate change via radical (i.e terrorist) methods? Do you even understand what the war on terror is about? It set up a broadbased societal system to stop YOU. So if you think the best way is to swim UP Niagra falls, good luck. I’ll watch you from the top after I walk around.
On Friday, September 15, 2006, George W.Bush was quoted as saying, “Khalid Sheikh Mohammed has provided valuable information. He told us the operatives had been instructed to ensure that explosives went off at a point that was high enough to prevent people trapped above from escaping.”
I kept a copy of that statement because I had always wondered about the use of the word “explosives”. That statement by Bush was either made after he had seen the CIA video tapes or had been told about the successes of the “Torture Program”.
The University of Mc Gill Experiments, in Canada, for the CIA in the 50´s were attempts at stripping a person of their knowledge and creating a new personality with different knowledge. The CIA imported and redocumented, in the 50´s, 1600 Nazi Scientists. The operation was called “Operation Paperclip” and many worked for the CIA and Military Intelligence.
The CIA has always worked beyond the control and supervision of the U.S. Congresses and “Operation Cyclone”, the joint CIA and Pakistani ISI operation to recruit 100,000 Islamic Militants from 43 Islamic Nations, is still bearing fruits for the Military Industrial Complex.
Go back and read your history. Read about the Haymarket Square Riots and how 4 Union Leaders were hung even though they had nothing to do with an explosion that killed 7 policemen. The hanging was symbolic of the emerging “Expansionists”, probably known today as Neo-Conservatives. That hanging postponed the growth of the “Labor Movement” and was followed by exploding the U.S.S. Maine to start the Spanish American War.
No, if anything should be done it should be an “Independent Investigation” of the planned demolition of World Trade Center #7. The motive is obvious. One event can prove that the rest of the events of 9/11 were more than 19 terrorists acting for a group that was created by the CIA, Al Qaeda.
Having men tortured until they admit to what an interrogator is demanding they admit to is not evidence of guilt.
Do I trust the FBI ? Since J.Edgar Hoover, the Director of the FBI, hated John F. Kennedy and did everything in his power to cover up CIA and FBI roles before and after the assassination.
Do I trust the CIA? You would have to read, “La CIA y 11 de Septiembre” by Andreas Von Bulow, to understand how much the CIA has been involved with the Islamic Jihad. The Taliban were put in power in Afghanistan by the CIA and when the Taliban decided to give the “Oil Pipeline” Contract to Bridas Oil of Argentina, the U.S. decided the Taliban had to go.
Watch out Venezuela, you don´t mess with Mobil Exxon. With over 330 billion dollars of revenue a year and over 33 billion dollars of profit, the U.S. Military is ready to go.
This explains a lot of things! The republican party put Captain Kangaroo in the White House.
This is just more of Bush’s ’smoke and mirror’s’ terrorism fighting! I realize there are probably 30% of American’s who are ignorant enough to buy into it. We all know it’s like our rebate checks. It is designed to make the Republican party look better in the election year. It’s all a ploy on Bush’s part. To get a few votes from ignorant American’s who aren’t any smarter than to believe him. They are going to try and shaft the American people again with their abilities to keep us safe from terrorist’s! While ignoring the fact, they were the ones who were asleep at the switch in 2001 when 9/11 happened! They have done precious little to keep another terrorist attack from happening. The list of what they haven’t done is to long to go into. Any intelligent person knows Osama doesn’t have to hit us again. All he has to do is set in his tent in the desert and wait for George W Bush and the Republican’s to destroy us for him. They are well on their way to doing exactly that. The sad part about it there are probably going to be 6 dead Arab’s in the process. Who may or may not be guilty of what they are being charged with. Because they are more than likely being used as scapegoats for this out of control President who has to play his political games.
Munch1, you are right, and it’s always been thus.
An ER nurse told me that she had a “theory”. It was that nature used to kill off stupid people, but now we keep them alive, so humans are getting stupider, so we should let them die.
I told her that 1) that wasn’t a new theory. It was called eugenics and it had been done to death. 2). Smart people had always been killed by stupider ones, for the crime of heresy, or sedition, or whatever trouble their intelligence had gotten them into with the ruling class of the time.
You are right that the ruling class will go after the intelligent, aware, outraged and active members of society, leaving the brain washed mouth breathers who believe and do what they’re told, to live.
It’s everyone’s personal decision whether to continue to fight and be killed, or to go along with the program and stay alive for a while longer. But even a lot of the “Good Germans” ended up dead eventually.
I don’t think that even a military court will convict these men.
Military judges are not without morals like Bush/Cheney.
Even McCain is against torture.
This may well become a trial of the military against the torture of Bush.
According to the Prophecy
tailcap: “…and where is the erstwhile “opposition party” while all this takes place?”
Passing lifetime immunity for the Fuehrer and his surveillance operatives in the “Telecom” industry. And, very soon, passing the Anti-Homegrown Revolutionary Thought Act.
In other words, representing YOU.
tlescpk -
Perhaps you should stop your speculation and assuming. I’m not advocating “terrorism”, at least not the covert kind, (BTW - if you think I’m worried about Uncle Sam + Verizon, et al’s ‘PROMIS’ net, don’t worry - I’ve got that covered).
In simplistic terms, I’m talking about real people getting in the streets and taking back what’s theirs - overtly and for all the world to see. THAT’S what is needed, and it won’t be pretty. Many people would get hurt and killed, but it will have to come to that before anything significantly changes in the US. I am 100% convinced of it.
Most everything short of grass-roots revolt has been done already, ad infinitum. We’ve seen how well non-violent resistance/civil disobedience has gone under the Neo Cons and Vichy-Dems - even decades before the current crop came to power. (JFK, MLK, RFK, Wellstone, etc.) Obviously, they aren’t listening because they know they don’t have to. They learned the lesson well from the Vietnam era: own the MSM propaganda machine, and you’re more than half way there. It’s also clear that the WU and similar methods didn’t work then, and won’t work now.
I am not inclined to believe that “the internet will save us” either, as so many have wrongly hung their hats on.
Am I proposing “radicalism”? Not unless you consider the Federalist Papers, Constitution, and Bill of Rights radical. It is our right and duty as citizens to overthrow the government should it become anything near what it is today. Impeachment is “off the table”. Elections/voting is a fraud. Peaceful protests mean nothing. Petitioning and dialogue with the “elected” representatives is paid lip service then generally ignored. The Supreme Court is stacked. The only 2 alternatives left are: continue the fascist status quo into oblivion, or take the (temporarily) difficult path.
Perhaps you’re right: it may require facing starvation before the average Merkin gets the balls to act as a real citizen.
there is a video “A FORCE MORE POWERFUL” easily found at libraries and online. it tell how nonviolent civil disobedience has changed the modern world. IT GIVES DETAILED INSTRUCTIONS ON HOW TO GET YOUR COUNTRY BACK. it shows real examples of people taking back their country. if you study and practice with others, you could start taking back the us by April or May.
complaining on COMMONDREAMS is worse than nothing because it gives you the false impression you are changing things. GET THAT VID.
YOUR VOTE HAS NOT COUNTED IN 8+ YEARS WHY DO YOU THINK IT WILL COUNT THIS YEAR! obama hillery mccain are not going to change the system but you can. get that vid.
get that vid.
Seditious
you may be right! but if you read my comment above and take the time to see the video it may change your mind. the real problem is the apathy and ignorance of the mass of people. it is they that must change NOT bush/cheney. can’t get the stink out of skunk. sacrifice and hardship is not american and the people dont have a clue about survival. the gi’s would open fire and blackwater and whoever else
see www.infragard.net
but, you may be right and it must happen!
just watch the video, “A FORCE MORE POWERFUL”
papercut -
I have no more faith in N-V civil disobedience to change the root, underlying disaster politics the way it has been for the past century, since at least 1913 and Wilson’s forming of the Federal Reserve. Not even FDR can be held up, since he confiscated the People’s gold in 1933 in order to propagate the fiat money system that benefits the bankers. Learn your REAL history.
What we need is a modern day Andrew Jackson.
Passive resistance is simply a pollyanna/peacenik excuse not to fight. I am fully convinced that nothing short of violent revolution/civil war again will actually force a structural overhaul, instead of mere cosmetic or feel-good, band-aid approaches. The system the way it exists now has been entrenched for too long and too deeply for half-measures to have lasting and meaningful results.
There’s no doubt that should the population rise up against the system, the military and mercenaries would be called out to oppose it. But they’re just an extention of the corrupt gov’t that we would be attempting to clear out, so that should be expected. With any luck, many of those in the military could be persuaded not to support the fascist regime.
“Apathy and ignorance of the mass of people” indeed, and I would add - their outright cowardice.