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Judy Miller Alert! The New York Times is Lying About Iran's Nuclear Program
It's deja vu all over again. AIPAC is trying to trick America into another catastrophic war with a Middle Eastern country on behalf of the Likud Party's colonial ambitions, and the New York Times is lying about allegations that said country is developing "weapons of mass destruction."
In an article attributed to Steven Erlanger on January 4 ("Europe Takes Bold Step Toward a Ban on Iranian Oil "), this paragraph appeared:
The threats from Iran, aimed both at the West and at Israel, combined with a recent assessment by the International Atomic Energy Agency that Iran's nuclear program has a military objective, is becoming an important issue in the American presidential campaign. [my emphasis]
The claim that there is "a recent assessment by the International Atomic Energy Agency that Iran's nuclear program has a military objective" is a lie.
As Washington Post Ombudsman Patrick Pexton noted on December 9,
But the IAEA report does not say Iran has a bomb, nor does it say it is building one, only that its multiyear effort pursuing nuclear technology is sophisticated and broad enough that it could be consistent with building a bomb.
Indeed, if you try now to find the offending paragraph on the New York Times website, you can't. They took it down. But there is no note, like there is supposed to be, acknowledging that they changed the article, and that there was something wrong with it before. Sneaky, huh?
But you can still find the original here. Indeed, at this writing, if you go to the New York Times website, and search on the phrase, "military objective," the article pops right up. But if you open the article, the text is gone. But again, there is no explanatory note saying that they changed the text.
This is not an isolated example in the Times' reporting. The very same day - January 4 - the New York Times published another article, attributed to Clifford Krauss ("Oil Price Would Skyrocket if Iran Closed the Strait of Hormuz "), that contained the following paragraph.
Various Iranian officials in recent weeks have said they would blockade the strait, which is only 21 miles wide at its narrowest point, if the United States and Europe imposed a tight oil embargo on their country in an effort to thwart its development of nuclear weapons [my emphasis].
At this writing, that text is still on the New York Times website.
Of course, referring to Iran's "development of nuclear weapons" without qualification implies that it is a known fact that Iran is developing nuclear weapons. But it is not a known fact. It is an allegation. Indeed, when U.S. officials are speaking publicly for the record, they say the opposite. As Washington Post Ombudsman Patrick Pexton noted on December 9,
This is what the U.S. director of national intelligence, James R. Clapper, told the Senate Armed Services Committee in March: "We continue to assess [that] Iran is keeping open the option to develop nuclear weapons in part by developing various nuclear capabilities that better position it to produce such weapons, should it choose to do so. We do not know, however, if Iran will eventually decide to build nuclear weapons.
To demand a correction, you can write to the New York Times here. To write a letter to the editor, you can write to the New York Times here. To complain to the New York Times' Public Editor, you write him here.
Comments
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99 Comments so far
Show AllThank you CD for your coverage of the onslaught of propaganda meant to propel us into yet another disastrous attack based on very questionable data.
Right?!! I think this full tilt boggie toward ending our time on the planet is grounded in the bigotry and ignorance these folks have nursed on for generations now. They envision a world where the rest of us continue to serve them and feed their endless appetite for oppression. The more we buck their crumbling system, the more genocidal and suicidal they become. I advise all of us to take care - a dying giant is a very dangerous creature.
NYT=CIA
Judy Miller lied to get us into the war with Iraq and the zionist owned NYTimes published every lie. Thousands of US troops have been sent to Israel and JPost repo rts today, the UK just sent their most powerful ship to the gulf. These warmongers are drumming up another war for Israel. Israel has lied and distorted information on Iran for years. They are pushing the US governement and in particular the zionized State Dept. under H. Clinton into another unwinnable war. This story has been on international news for weeks and not one corporate owned US media reported on it. All we get 24/7 the repuke clown car show. The media in the US is dispicable, its no wonder the american people are so ignorant and stupid on foreign affairs. The Washington Post is another zionist owned rag, that has distorted facts on Iran. Achie never said, "Iran wanted to wipe Israel off the face of the earth"...that was an out and out lie and you can get his full statement on youtube. The lies by the corporate media in amerikka is the driving force for imperialism, a continuation of perpetual war. TheUS/UK/France/Germany/Italy and Israel are the global terrorists. They have armed the middle east to the teeth to take out Iran. But as George Galloway warned Cameron...if they attack Iran, Iran will have the right to use its missiles which can reach all of europe including London...then the nukes will come out...bye bye in 2012.
spktruth200: Great post. Spot on. Only one caveat: UK, France, Germany and Italy are NATO puppets of America. Hard to believe still, with this American-manufactured and delivered Euro-sovereign debt crisis which we've served up, courtesy of Goldman Sachs and many other predatory pools of money that have relentlessly attacked the bond markets of European countries to try and destroy the euro because it's been bonafide competition to the sick dollar and a threat to its reserved world currency status.
Time for a Real Debate: Is America and Israel the two most dangerous and histerical governments in the world, whose privileged neo-cons will not rest until they've wrecked the entire world?
Pepe Escobar's reporting and writing on world affairs is some of the best out there. Why hasn't CD posted this article? We expect stuff like this from CNN and Fox News, not CD. To view the most dangerous global economic reverberations stemming from Obama's cave-in to Aipac and the Israelis and our own demented Congress with his signing of NDAA last weekend, Escobar's most recent article is must reading.
http://atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/NA07Ak01.html
I'm shocked: AIPAC and the Corporate Media Cartel propagandizing the US into launching another illegal war based on a pack of lies? Again?
Gosh after the blatant propaganda and lies about Vietnam, Grenada, Nicaragua, Somalia, Iraq I and II, Libya... that the credibility of the Corporate Media Cartel would be about zero by now.
The NYT: toilet paper of record - not even good for that. Who in their right mind would pay top dollar for a paper with 0 credibility?
No one in their right mind; however, it's great for warmongers!
Sadly there are many who still think the NYT is a bastion of good journalism, when its just a spiffy fascist, aka fox/wsj, newzzzz !
Who might those fools be?
NYT is the propaganda machine for liberals to support and justify the invasion of Iran. Obama told you during his campaign speeches 3 yrs ago that Iran was the problem. One of the few things he didn't lie about. And all those poor innocent Israelis! They are so meek and mild, wouldn't want to harm a hair of anyone living in the Gaza.
WE LOVE TO BE LIED TO.
Gonna be the title of my new song. Stay tuned
careful what you use to wipe, the nyt and most tp contain bisphenol a
lol
The New York Times: All the news fit for us to print! And believe it or not; they are considered " LIBERAL " by the whore media. That the MSM is liberal, is one of the most egregious and punic myths in America. Judith Miller and her fellow presstitutes work for their madames at the N.Y. Times and the rest of the lying, cheerleaders for war, whore MSM.
What else would we expect from the New Dork Times ? They played a key role in initiating the American war crimes in Iraq.
Yeah, ton of BS there. If Iran really had an advanced nuke weapons program, Israel would have taken care of it by now. The US would have gotten a courtesy call as the strike package was en route.
There would have been token outrage from all sides but behind the scenes everyone would have been relieved that the threat was eliminated.
We won't get a courtesy call if Israel decides to strike. The Obama administration ranks somewhere around Syria on their friends list.
socialist pretty much summed it up in his/her post.
As I recall, for the last 10 or 15 years, I've been hearing that Iran is within 5 years of developing a nuclear weapon.
Yep. I've been hearing that, too. A possibly accurate (though meaningless) statement, but misleading when the media put it into this context.
June 1941 : US Executive Order 8807
July 1945 : Trinity test
So that's four years for the development stage of the Manhattan Project. In other words, anyone with the technology the US,UK and Canada had in the early forties (or greater) is within five years of developing a nuclear bomb.
That the numbers haven't changed over fifteen years suggest that this isn't what the Iranians are doing. (I know that was your point - I just wanted to restate it for the slower members of class).
the leadership of iran, whatever faults they may have, are not insane. of course they are planning nuclear weapons technology - why shouldn't they? the genie was let out the bottle a long time ago.
unless the primary proponent of their deterrence effect renounces this policy and makes a sincere effort at their eradication, complete with u.n. inspectors to verify compliance, there is no reason for iran to forsake a military dimension to their nuclear program.
"... there is no reason for iran(sic) to forsake a military dimension to their nuclear program."
Actually there are, powerful reasons.
1) By not having a nuclear weapons program, any evidence offered to allegedly prove they did, as in the case of Iraq, would have to be fabricated, and thus likely exposed as such.
2) An absurdly costly invasion and destruction of yet another country on false pretenses would do more harm to the US than Iran could actually hope to achieve militarily. It will unequivocally further our demise from within, for thus is the fruit of moral decay.
3) Iran has strategic alliances with other countries that already have nuclear weapons capabilities, and whom have significant invested interests in preventing the US from further extending its military reach.
Israel and the US have hawkish transnational agendas that will likely prevail anyway, but we should bear in mind the sophistication of complex global military strategies, and contemplate this: the US is as the sacrificial Lamb being led to slaughter by Israel. Israel will not hesitate to sacrifice the US for the sake of their own Zionist state.
It would be a miracle if USAns would instead find the Great American Spirit they once held so dearly and proudly for truth, justice and sovereignty of others. Without that, we ourselves become our own enemy.
COSMO said:
"the US is as the sacrificial Lamb being led to slaughter by Israel. Israel will not hesitate to sacrifice the US for the sake of their own Zionist state."
It's the exact other way around!
Since Israel became an entity in l949, the U.S. had a long-standing pattern of imperialism well in advance of that. Care to alter history to make Israel responsible for all that, too?
MANY times it's been explained by the finest minds in these threads that Israel IS A FACTOR in U.S. foreign policy, as both nations thus far share certain geo-political interests. Israel is not the only factor behind the martial foreign policy determinations. Eisehower spoke with warning about the growing power of the MIC, and then the NSA became its own covert force in the late l940's.
Further, the emphasis on oil and control of the world's energy reserves is of significant interest to many of the political big whigs in the U.S. and elsewhere.
When persons who SHOULD know better, make Israel the 100% culpable fall guy, they are paving the way for a restoration of anti-semitism. It's a dangerous path.
I believe that we all possess soul memory, and these imprints influence unconscious belief structures. Because there are FAR more Christians (and Muslims) than Jews, it is quite easy for either of these sects to turn against Jews. The imprint borne from campaigns designed to blame Jews for historical problems is a very old one.
Just as I would not wish to see ALL Amerikans punished for our nation's overt policies of naked aggression, I would not wish to see all Jews punished for right wing policies of an increasingly off-balance apartheid nation.
There's a LOT of blood on the hands of the United Kingdom, and it, too, backs current M.E. policies (or has, up until this point). Israel has come to immitate its US & UK masters in the use of aggression. Yet you place all blame on Israel. It may well be the projection of the shadow so popular to those cultures that wish to evade their own responsibility for killing and other amoral behaviors, that you're in thrall to. It's always far easier to make it about someone else.
Ultimately, it's important to get the board away from your own eyes before you cast the accusatory finger at other. In this case, BOTH nations are guilty of aggression... but to conveniently eliminate all those entities who SHARE both motive and opportunity, and make it only about Israel, is narrow-minded and highly prejudiced.
Siouxrose,
When it comes to the United States' Mideast policy, I disagree with you that Israel "IS A FACTOR." I would not say it is "a factor' but a key/huge/big (perhaps even decisive) factor--that would be more accurate.
Wow, Sioux. You need to do more homework on Zionism, the USS Liberty, AIPAC, Israeli connections to 9/11, etc. Talk about not seeing the forest for the trees...
http://www.intifada-palestine.com/2012/01/candid-interview-about-911-by-dr-alan-sabrosky/
Anti-semitism be damned. That is your psyop distraction right there (that you're always carrying on about), all wrapped up and politically packaged pretty as please.
The new US govt. is a puppet government and there is plenty to find and read. You're carrying on about someone who SHOULD KNOW BETTER? C'mon. And while you're at it, research the history of banking and the multinational banking interests. Who do you think many of those multinational financial interests are anyway?
Get your head out of your sweet arse, and recognize that Israel is a political state and not a religion. I have Jewish friends (actually a couple relatives) that would heartedly debate this with you. But you must understand, they are jews by religious faith, not of political interest.
You need to decide whether the US government is a rogue government or is it actually working for and representing you after all?
Yes, Eisenhower warned us "about the acquisition of undue influence... and disastrous rise of misplaced power." So did JFK. But neither were specific as to the precise sources, causes or mechanisms by which we might lose our security and liberty, which were the cause and purpose for their warnings.
But go ahead, open my closed eyes, and please explain to me why we should favor Israel, so as to not see what is plainly right in front of us? And why you believe Israel is doing our bidding (especially with Palestine?) rather than the other way around.
Yours, my friend, is the dangerous path... of blissful naiveté.
Knowing that the U.S. is a rogue government hardly qualifies as cause to blame all those Jews. I mean they're all bankers, right?
Sorry, Cosmo. YOU are the one who is diverting data to your favored cause. Anyone can distort an argument to find at least one or two examples that appear to prove it. That's what Southern Baptist ministers do with the Bible. They twist it into a document in FAVOR of racism, sexism, and all the other divisive ism divisions that Christ incarnated to help heal.
IF you were fair about this, that is, willing to recognize Israel's influence in alignment with OTHER equally powerful (and I will say, Dark) forces, then I would be in agreement with you. It is those who wish to isolate Israel (and by extension, "The Jews") and make it solely about this sect that is TERRIFYING.
And I recognize your use of the Ron Paul "with us, or against us" narrowly framed use of logic. Sure, I know about the U.S.S. Liberty; but I'd say the pass that situation got from the U.S. is more in line with the ethos of "Honor among thieves." I mean how many vessels that belong to other lands has the U.S. MIC sunk? It'sa pact among warriors. "I won't tell on you, or hold you to account for your acts of aggression, if you likewise, extend to me that favor."
I tire of stating this. I am not apologizing for, or agreeing with Israel's self-destructive foreign policy decisions. I abhor militarism in any nation's hands or practices. The issue I take with you is one of proportion. You want ONE single scapegoat, and you seem inured to responsibility on the part of U.S. leadership, military and civilian. Instead, you project ALL blame onto Israel. And that IS scary, not to mention both academically lacking and unbalanced.
Do your homework Sioux. I am not the one clouded by a favored cause or distorting things out of proportion. And I never suggested there is but one culprit or scapegoat. That's you "diverting data." Read me again. I said the agenda belonged to both the US and Israel, but that Israel would not hesitate to sacrifice the US for its cause.
You are the one using scary TERRIFYING emotionally driven terms, not me.
And for the record, since you brought it up, I doubt you come close at all to matching me in academic accomplishment and balance. I usually do not put my education out there, but you had the irreverent audacity to assert it - in a purely subjective (as in asserting favored causes) judgment.
BTW, you said: "Eisehower spoke with warning about the growing power of the MIC, and then the NSA became its own covert force in the late l940's" That would be about the same time Israel became a state?
The blame game is yours, not mine. More than just about anyone you will ever meet, I do NOT capsulize the way you are suggesting. I am a deconstructionist. By nature and by training I look for underlying assumptions and inherent relationships. I research, learn and let evidence speak for itself, and of that I am quite happy to debate, and to have my eyes opened. All your emotionally charged SCARY and TERRIFYING rhetoric does not prove any point you are trying to make, and certainly does not prove me wrong. Your anecdotal comparisons to Baptists, racism and sexism speak more to your assumptions than mine, and most certainly do not disprove what I put out there in my original comment.
[When persons who SHOULD know better, make Israel the 100% culpable fall guy, they are paving the way for a restoration of anti-semitism. It's a dangerous path.]
Either or Fallacy; I think the credibility is out the window for Sioux. We have had enough crying-wolf to prevent honest dialogue, Sioux. Sioux, or maybe you think Yew? ...Rose or Rokhs(Roxanna) is Iranian P(F)arsi.
Did I miss something or are you suggesting that another person's perspective is less valid if they are a Jew or an Iranian?
Siouxrose, sometimes it IS "about someone else."
Until very recently, discussion of Zionist influence on U.S. foreign policy was stifled by cries of "antisemitism." That doesn't work any more, Siouxrose. It is now out in the open: the financial (and therefore political) power of Zionists (most of them Jewish) has distorted U.S. foreign policy for more than 60 years.
Even NYTimes columnist Thomas Friedman wrote recently, "I sure hope that Israel’s prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, understands that the standing ovation he got in Congress this year was not for his politics. That ovation was bought and paid for by the Israel lobby." (Friedman was referring to the shameful jumping up and down of our Senators and Representatives in 29 standing ovations during a 50-minute speech by Israeli President Netanyahu to a joint session of Congress.)
That is why the joke: "Why doesn't Israel want to become a U.S. state? Because then it would have only two Senators!" is not really a joke.
This week, General Wesley Clark recounted the Bush administration's adoption of the Zionist PNAC (Project for a New American Century) plan: for the U.S. to attack Iraq, and then Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and Iran:
http://mondoweiss.net/2012/01/clark-there-was-no-national-debate-over-the-policy-coup-by-the-hardnosed.html
Israel has deliberately conflated the illegal colonialist state of Israel with Judaism, in order to be able to cry "antisemitic" at every criticism of Israel's crimes against humanity. Israel claims to be the "Jewish state," acting on behalf of Jews everywhere, despite the fact that such conflation of "Israel" and "Jew" encourages hatred of Jews worldwide. Not everyone understands that Israel is to Judaism as the Ku Klux Klan and the Aryan Nations are to Christianity.
Unfortunately, despite valiant efforts by groups such as Jewish Voice for Peace, most U.S. Jews support Israel's crimes against the Palestinians. It seems to me that since we have come to expect Muslim Americans and their mosques to speak out against hate crimes committed by Muslims, it is not unfair to expect Jewish Americans and their synagogues to speak out against the ethnic cleansing, apartheid, land theft, and other crimes against humanity committed daily by Israel, especially since Israel claims to be acting in the name of all Jews.
The U.S. continues to enable Israel's slow-motion holocaust against the Palestinians every single day, and the silence of the Jewish American community is deafening.
Nice points; One historical clarification with permission... Aryan is not a 'bad' word. It is the ancestral name of a culture; branches of Aryan, specifically in today's Iran, are responsible for lot's of things we appreciate today: Abolition of slavery, feminism&environmentalism (look at the practices and principles of Zoroastrians), Federalism (taxation/representation), tolerance of religions (claimed in the OT, although I'm skeptical it wasn't more than a well known characteristic of Persians-actually supported in factual history too), haloz-+'s-angels-judgement-soul...and much-much-more if we were allowed to study it with better accessibility and empathy...the causes, of which, many CD-ers are attune to.
There's no modesty in personal-attackers, just probably delusions about themselves. Hitler and Nazi's were to Germany as Bush W. and war-hawk Zionists are to the U.S. ...Puppet straw-men that don't represent a majority of sensible people perhaps?
For anyone claiming racist posting: try arguing the literal points as they are posted, please, without creating your own arguments to contend with. You might be accused of manipulation, or treason against Americans and Our values. -In the court of Public Opinion, it's a pretty serious reprimand.
Peace.
Siouxrose,
thank you for your post. although i consider myself an anti-zionist and i believe israel is influencing american policy - i agree with you.
"MANY times it's been explained by the finest minds in these threads that Israel IS A FACTOR in U.S. foreign policy, as both nations thus far share certain geo-political interests. Israel is not the only factor behind the martial foreign policy determinations. Eisehower spoke with warning about the growing power of the MIC, and then the NSA became its own covert force in the late l940's.
Further, the emphasis on oil and control of the world's energy reserves is of significant interest to many of the political big whigs in the U.S. and elsewhere."
there are many factors at play, the primary factor is the maintenance of US hegemony in the region and around the globe (centcom). it's interesting that you referenced the british empire, i agree w/ you US empire is merely an extension of earlier empires (1000's of years) that provided a template for current global power structures.
"There's a LOT of blood on the hands of the United Kingdom, and it, too, backs current M.E. policies (or has, up until this point). Israel has come to immitate its US & UK masters in the use of aggression."
professor ismael hossein-zadah - 'the political economy of us militarism' - tries to measure the influence of different special interests on US foreign policy. like andrew bacivich and others, he addresses US militarism from the perspective of analyzing the MICC. i hope you glance at the table of contents (for the book) at the link below. the book is instructive on many levels.
http://www.politicaleconomics.info/books/books.htm
http://books.google.com/books/about/The_Political_Economy_of_U_S_Militarism.html?id=E8cI7wQ7QOAC
from the table of contents...
{3. the rise of US militarism
- designing a benign empire: how the US imperial power supplanted
british imperialism
- the theory and praxis of benign imperialism
- decline of benign imperialism and the rise of military imperialism:
domestic- foreign relations
4. inventing threats to our national interests
6. behind the invasion of iraq
A. minor or secondary factors behind the war
- the role of domestic policies
- the role of the cabal of neoconservatives
- the role of oil
B. major of primary factors behind the war
- the role of the military industrial complex
- the role of militant zionism
- the demise of the soviet union, the convergence of interest on war, and the
unholy alliance.
- world war IV
- defining the president's message.}
i believe all 7 or 8 of the reasons cited, by hossien-zadah, for the war in iraq are applicable to the buildup to the war w/ iran. if israel strikes iran, its perceived intent will be to promote israeli interests (justifiable paranoia?). and likewise, if americans strike iran - the action will be promoted as justifying american interests. israeli and american interests represent the same interests, the interests of the western powers.
the western empire is overreaching. obama is proud of his poker playing skills. it's fitting that the cia chose a poker player to represent them as they throw the gauntlet down for the russians, chinese, pakistanis and any country that would dare criticize (or indeed overthrow a brutal western puppet like the shah) american, saudi or israeli hegemony in the region.
...peace...
Hi Iowablackbird, appreciate the non-scary even-keeled perspective. I have not read the book you referenced, but I have read a couple reviews, and articles by the author. I wholeheartedly believe the book provides a great deal of context for why we should not be too content to look only at the usual culprits, and to consider a much larger submerged picture.
The following is from Centre for Research on Globalization "The Siege against Gaza: America's Ongoing Support of Israeli Military and Intelligence Operations" by Michel Chossudovsky (but there are actually numerous other sources we could cite)
"There are longstanding and ongoing military and intelligence relations between the US and Israel including close working ties between various agencies of government: Pentagon, National Intelligence Council, State Department, Homeland Security and their respective Israeli counterparts."
"These various agencies of government are involved in routine liaison and consultations, usually directly as well as through the US Embassy in Israel, involving frequent shuttles of officials between Washington and Tel Aviv as well as exchange of personnel. Moreover, the US as well as Canada have public security cooperation agreements with Israel pertaining to the policing of international borders, including maritime borders. (See Israel-USA Homeland Security Cooperation, See also Michel Chossudovsky, The Canada-Israel "Public Security" Agreement, Global Research, 2 April 2008)"
ALSO, from the same article:
"While born in the US, Rahm Emmanuel also holds Israeli citizenship and has served in the Israeli military during the First Gulf War (1991)."
"Rahm is also known for his connections to the pro-Israeli lobby in the US. The Israeli newspaper Maariv calls him "Our Man in the White House" (quoted in Irish Times, March 13, 2010). Rahm Emmanuel gave his support to Obama in the November 2008 presidential elections following Obama`s address to the pro-Israeli lobby AIPAC."
"At the time of Rahm Emmanuel's confirmation as White House chief of staff, there were reports in the Middle East media of Rahm Emanuel's connections to Israeli intelligence.
The exact nature of Rahm Emmanuel's ties to the Israeli military and intelligence apparatus, however, is not the main issue. What we are dealing with is a broad process of bilateral coordination and decision-making between the two governments in the areas of foreign policy, intelligence and military planning, which has been ongoing for more than 50 years."
Following from this, we should take note of many other dual US-Israeli citizens with influential positions in US government. And not take too lightly Israeli influence on OUR government's policies and aggressions, nor as well on the larger submerged picture of global political economy and US Militarism.
Aloha (ie. affection, peace, compassion and mercy)
Rahm Emanuel is a vile person, and he does not hold Israeli citizenship.
He also did not "serve in the Israeli army." Only citizens can (and must) serve in the Israeli army. Emanuel served as a civilian volunteer in Israel in 1991 during the Gulf War.
Why is it such a popular meme to repeat "dual citizen"? It is false.
Again, Emanuel is a vile person. The facts about him and his career are plain. He has been bad for the USA. Why repeat things that are not true?
You are the one making dubious claims. And why is "dual citizen" a false meme?
The Supreme Court has struck down laws preventing dual citizenship. And from the TravelState.gov (US Dept. of State) regarding Israeli-Americans:
"The Government of Israel considers U.S. citizens who also hold Israeli citizenship or have a claim to dual nationality to be Israeli citizens for immigration and other legal purposes. For example, an American citizen child of an Israeli parent will be considered an Israeli citizen by Israeli immigration officials, even if the child was born outside of Israel, and Israeli law will apply to the child's travel to, and departure from, Israel."
Emanual's father was born in Jerusalem... His "volunteer" service was for the IDF, and I have not seen any assertions that his service to Israel was anything other than "volunteer".
Why claim things to be false that you cannot and do not prove as such? What's that about. At best, you don't know.
"Dual citizen" is loosely and falsely applied to all Jews in US government. It is a false meme because it is false. Please show me documentation of "dual citizenship" for anyone in US government, including Rahm Emanuel. i will be happy to acknowledge any documentation you can provide.
Your State Department citation is not such documentation. Israel considers Emanuel to have "a claim to dual nationality" because his father was born in Israel, and so Israel consider Emanuel to be a citizen "for immigration and other legal purposes." If Emanuel MOVES TO ISRAEL, he will receive Israeli citizenship.
Unless he moves there, and until actual citizenship is conferred, he is not a citizen of Israel. He cannot vote in Israeli elections. He cannot run for a seat in the Knesset. He cannot serve (and is not required as a citizen to serve) in the Israeli army.
No one can ever "prove" a negative. i cannot "prove" God does not exist, i cannot "prove" that lizard-human hybrids are not running the government, and i cannot "prove" Rahm Emanuel is not a "dual citizen." The burden of proof is on those making the claims.
Why claim things to be true that you cannot and do not prove as such? What's that about?
Your first sentence is the only valid point you make.
Your take on the State Department citation is incomplete. Since "an American citizen child of an Israeli parent will be considered an Israeli citizen by Israeli immigration officials, even if the child was born outside of Israel, ... Israeli law will apply to the child's travel to, and departure from, Israel" ... and since ... "U.S. citizens who are also citizens of Israel must enter and depart Israel using their current Israeli passport" then there must exist a number of "dual citizens" with Israeli passports. Which makes this thing easy enough for someone with access to prove either way.
Either Israeli-US dual citizenship legally exists or it doesn't. It does, and not subject to your personalized interpretation of how you think it works.
Your entire posture here is pathetic. You are responding to a claim published by a global research group, not a statement I personally made. On the other hand, you are making assertions here as if you specifically are the expert, only that you aren't - you are expressing your opinion and nothing more.
Just because Chossudovsky repeats the falsehood does not make it true. Thank you for providing zero documentation to support the meme of "dual citizen." Chossudovsky also provides no documentation.
There are no "dual citizens" in US government, including Rahm Emanuel. Yours is the "personalized interpretation," and you have not refuted a single fact i've stated, you just repeat yourself.
Feel free at any time to provide a documented citation of anyone in the US government who simultaneously holds citizenship in another country.
You have offered zilch, nada, that dual citizenship is illegal, prohibited, or otherwise not valid.
Your stance is based entirely on the notion that dual citizens cannot participate in government. But the requirement for most government positions only necessitates US citizenship, and does not preclude dual citizens. This is easily verified online on US government websites, as well as elsewhere. I have already offered you proof. If you choose to dismiss it out of hand, that is not my problem.
See http://www.justice.gov/olc/dualcitizen.htm
You can however happily prove the negative, by providing proof that dual citizenship is illegal or otherwise prohibited. If it is not prohibited by law or regulation, then only a genuine ignoramus would believe it couldn't or wouldn't happen.
As for your inane request to provide documentation regarding any specific person - feel free to contact the U.S. Department of State (DOS) for information on dual citizenship. I'm sure you won't have any trouble at all getting copies of citizenship disclosures for whomever you like.
You can make up whatever you pretend i'm saying, and then win your argument with yourself. i'm not saying any of the stuff you go on at great length to claim that i am saying.
My stance is based on the FACT that all the liars such as yourself who repeat and repeat and repeat "dual citizen" about Jews in the US government have not a single such actual "dual citizen" to show. Plain and simple. That's my stance. Show me one or STFU.
How sweet and enlightened you are.
You have proven no lies nor me a liar.
My stance is you have proven well your capacity for belligerence, and incapacity to think critically and be reasonable. Plain and simple. That's my stance. Prove me a liar or MYOB.
You are very funny Cosmo Boy. Now run and go play with your "dual citizens." Oh i guess you are all alone then. Have fun!
Not funny - correct. Logic 101
My logical claim:
A. Dual citizenship is lawfully permitted.
B. Person X is citizen of Country A by applicable law.
C. Person X is citizen of Country B by applicable law.
Ergo Person X is a dual citizen.
Your illogical claim:
A. There is no proof Person X is a dual citizen.
Ergo Person X is not a dual citizen.
Logical fallacy: The absence of proof is not proof of absence. That is, something is not proven false just because there is a lack of evidence. Logic 101.
Your persistent lack of reasonableness (ie. logical reasoning) ) is belligerent, and your mockery is for children.
But you are wrong not because of your behavior, but because you use stinkin' thinkin' to falsely elevate your subjective opinions.
You being haughty and derisive just makes conversation with you a poor choice.
Aloha (affection, peace, compassion and mercy)
Read your own citation. A decision by the state of Israel to treat certain non-citizens "as citizens" for certain purposes does NOT make those people "citizens of Israel" nor "dual citizens."
Just as the decision by the state of Israel to grant citizenship to any Jew who moves to Israel does not make all Jews into "dual citizens." i do have to commend you for not making THAT claim, which is the typical basis of those who spout the "dual citizen" meme.
But feel free to continue your haughty and childish elevation of your subjective opinion. Oh, i mean, "Peace, bro."
And thanks also for openly acknowledging in your post that you have provided "absence of evidence."
moved up...
Edward Betancourt, a supervisory attorney in the State Department’s Bureau of Consular Affairs: “We don’t put an asterisk next to their name if they have a dual nationality,’’ he said. “If a person is a United States citizen, that’s the end of the discussion for us.’’
Thanks Billy,
Again, nothing. i looked up the quote, Betancourt is not talking about anyone in the US government. He is referring to people from other countries, who move to the USA and become naturalized US citizens, who are able to retain citizenship in their country of birth. Genuine dual citizens! Yes, there are people on Earth and in the USA who hold citizenship in two countries. Of course i've never said that there are not.
What i've said is, people including you repeat and repeat and repeat the "dual citizen" meme about Jews in the US government, with NO EVIDENCE. Emanuel was not born in Israel and is not a naturalized US citizen, nor are any of the other Jews in US government who get called "dual citizens" by people including you, so the Betancourt quote is purely meaningless here.
You again provide absolute zero evidence that Emanuel or any other Jew who serves in any US government position (nor anyone at all who serves in the US government) is a "dual citizen."
You might want to ask yourself: Why is is so important to you to repeat, and endlessly defend despite the absolute emptiness of any evidence, the meme "dual citizen" about Emanuel?
jiminy cricket webwalk, why is this so important to you that you are in such profound denial?
The quote I provided makes perfectly clear dual citizenship exists and is permitted in government but as a rule is not documented - not even an asterisk.
The only time it would be documented is for a security clearance, or when a dual citizen obtains a passport from the other country. In either case, you and I would not have access to that documentation. But not having access does not prove it doesn't exist.
TO THE CONTRARY, absent a specific renunciation of citizenship from a particular country, then the laws are clear - a person legally defined as a citizen in a country is a citizen of that country. SO THE BURDEN IS ON YOU to prove those entitled by law to "dual citizenship" have renounced their citizenship of one or the other country. Otherwise, they are by lawful definition dual citizens and no further documentation is required.
I have more than proven the legitimacy and rational for the "meme" but that is not what you are demanding - you are demanding specific documentation regarding specific persons. If you could prove the meme to be falsely grounded (as in dual citizenship is prohibited in government), which you cannot, than you're position would be valid, but it is not - not logically, not lawfully, not even by plain old common sense.
You are hilariously funny Cosmo Boy. What a hoot! It must be fun living in your dream world. You're like GWB, looking for those WMDs under his Oval Office desk. They've got to be here somewhere! No one can prove they don't exist!
Rave on, my friend, repeating and repeating and repeating yourself. Whatever gives you your jollies. Your "logic" doesn't become valid with repetition, it just gets funnier! Thanks for the entertainment.
Dear Sioux Rose,
I have been reading your input here for quite a while, and it seems to me that you always put your finger right on the pulse of the issue. I can't say that I always agree with you, but what you have to say always resonates with me in some way.
This openning especially,
"the US is as the sacrificial Lamb being led to slaughter by Israel. Israel will not hesitate to sacrifice the US for the sake of their own Zionist state."
It's the exact other way around! "
is exactly right. I thought that the idea was best expressed by Israeli writer Amos Oz, who wrote in the Guardian that Israel had become "America's attack dog" in the Middle East. I knew that what he said was true. That is what Israel has become, and as a Jew, a son of holocaust survivors, born in a German refugee camp after WWII, it does not make me feel proud of Israel.
"Israel has come to immitate its US & UK masters in the use of aggression. Yet you place all blame on Israel. It may well be the projection of the shadow so popular to those cultures that wish to evade their own responsibility for killing and other amoral behaviors, that you're in thrall to. It's always far easier to make it about someone else."
Thank you for this. I wish everyone would look again at the machinations of the British Empire in the region prior to the establishment of Israel and also at that entity's role in the founding of Israel. It is my belief that both countries, the US and Israel, are still under orders from The Board... and presidents of each, being 'hired' to service the continuing operations and programs of the original share holders.
Note that in a recent book, Broker, Trader, Lawyer, Spy: The Secret World of Corporate Espionage, the author claims that London is the hub of secret service operations. In all my travels, we have seen British agents operating worldwide... and in no cases did the American services seem to have ultimate authority... just directed executive responsibilities.
Furthermore, I was told that the principle office involved in Black Market Arms dealing in the Middle East (and throughout Central Asia) was located in London. Recall that during the seventies and eighties, this area was the focus of the 'CIA's' (MI6) largest operation to train and arm insurgents.
Blaming Israel for the enormous focus on fracturing and genociding the regions people's over the course of these last decades is absurd. But, the 'alternative' press has been co-opted and its main purpose is off-footing progressives... and keeping hidden the actual power structure and its essential modus operandi.
Except that Sioux's point about someone placing all the blame on Israel is a completely misleading and false conclusion of what was actually said. A few have responded to Sioux's false conclusion by taking my original statement out of context and considering only a fragment of it. So here is the sum total of what I said about Israel in my original comment:
"Israel and the US have hawkish transnational agendas that will likely prevail anyway, but we should bear in mind the sophistication of complex global military strategies, and contemplate this: the US is as the sacrificial Lamb being led to slaughter by Israel. Israel will not hesitate to sacrifice the US for the sake of their own Zionist state."
Note, no specific blame on anybody, and the point was clearly and simply to contemplate the complexity of "global military strategies", and I quite specifically used the word 'is as' in my phrase, not to indicate a foregone conclusion but to be considered as if.
iowablackbird referenced a book, The Political Economy of US Militarism, which seeks to explore a larger submerged picture. You are almost certainly right about London having a key role, and personally, I believe the US may well be subservient to London. But the global interests we are talking here are multinational interests, and the source of global financial and corporate control, heavily invested in the political economy of militarism, and are not national interests.
The irony is how readily some folks accept that the US government has indeed been compromised, but how blissfully blind those same folks are to the source, nature, extent, means and actions of those compromising influences.
Siouxrose is the only person in this thread to claim that anybody has made Israel out to be the single one 100% culpable fall guy. I have not. Nor did I make any anti-semite remarks. But I find it very interesting how some here have so quickly jumped on this false and misleading interpretation of what was actually stated.
It is small wonder we peons are so easily led by the PTB, when we cannot even realize the truth of the power structure in the first place.