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Hell Yes, Secesh! Don’t Let The Door Hit You On The Way Out
It is a measure of the sheer poverty of our national politics that the notion of secession is in the air again. Hey, just like those happy days of slavery and civil war again!
Last summer, no less an official than the governor of Texas and likely presidential aspirant (never mind the irony - this is regressivism we're talking about here, folks), Rick Perry, hinted that if Washington didn't stop leaning so hard on the states, then people down there might just get to feelin' justified to go their own way. Don't mess with Texas, Eastern elite dudes! Meanwhile, though, Perry will of course continue accepting large lump-sum checks from the Feds, if it's all the same to you.
Then knucklehead governor of Virginia, Bob McDonnell, who seems every day more like a model of forward thinking - if only it were still the thirteenth century - has joined the recent stampede to honor those great patriots of the 1860s - who, er, um, tried to wreck the country - by re-instituting Confederate History Month there. No mention of slavery, either. Great idea, Bob! And so original, too. Old, racist, white guys feeling victimized by history. What a novel concept!
Meanwhile tea party savants continue to demonstrate the volatile dangers of amateur alchemy, mixing ample ignorance with toxic rage to produce catastrophic idiocy in scary proportions. (As if twenty minutes of watching Glenn Beck wasn't single-handedly sufficient to make that case by itself.) They hate the oppression of Washington and bemoan the transgressions against states' rights. Then they go cash their Social Security checks, on the way to their Medicare-funded doctor's office visit.
As if that weren't nutty enough, now we learn that a Republican district nominating convention in Minnesota - Minnesota! - missed by just two votes including a resolution in its platform declaring that states have the right to secede from the union. What is in those lakes up there?!?!
These are the ravings of lunatics. The combination of federalism and capitalism makes American government in Washington about the least intrusive of any in the world, apart from those that are just a mess. I guess if you happen to think that the people of Sweden are being crushed as we speak under the oppressive yoke of socialism, you might find the (very low) tax rates in America to be scandalous. I guess if you think our good friends in Britain are enraged that they not only don't have a federal system of vertical power sharing like we do, but they don't even have states with which the national government could share power if it wanted to, then you might get away with thinking that Washington is a cruel taskmaster, lording it over Mississippi and Arizona. Just one thing, though - don't tell the Swedes or the Brits. So far, they have miraculously managed to avoid finding out just how oppressed and unhappy they truly are.
It's also amusing that you rarely hear the nice folks of the unhinged right specifying what it is, exactly, that the fascist feds are taking away from them. Guns?! Well, er, actually, no. Religion?! Gimme a break. The right to be racist?! Still perfectly legal.
Even though logic is to the right in America what a snarling Doberman is to cornered blind cat, I'd like to nevertheless dignify their rants by treating them seriously enough to agree with their expressed desires. If Texas wants to leave the union, I say: Let ‘em. Same with anyone else. I'm not kidding. I mean it.
I say that for three reasons. The first is philosophical. I have never understood how one can claim to believe in democracy, but only if people are limited in what they get to decide via their democratic institutions. It's not enough that you get to pick your representatives, or even set policy directly through an initiative or referendum. Ultimately, the most profoundly undemocratic thing you can do is force people to belong to polities they don't want to be part of, and set that question as off-limits to their democratic decision-making. Americans hate the idea of being dictated to by this or that international institution. Why should they in turn demand that states be dictated to by America? If one happens to care about consistency of principle, this makes no sense.
Except if, as we often do, we reify the present into the eternal. America, we say, must remain intact because it exists today and we therefore cannot imagine any other alternative. Well, guess what? There wasn't always America. There wasn't always France or Britain or Germany or Canada either. In fact, the creation of each of these polities from their respective parts was deeply controversial in its time and often remains so today. Don't be surprised if any day now the Québécois vote in a referendum to leave Canada, or the Scots to ditch the UK and form their own country. It's already come close to happening. And if that's what they want, then that's what they should be allowed to do. Otherwise, let's not fool ourselves. It ain't democracy. It might even be colonialism.
The second reason I don't have a problem with the concept of secession is pragmatic. The fact is that secession attempts are going to happen. Always have, always will. And when they do, there are basically two response options available to those who are the would-be seceded upon: The first is what you might call the Lincoln model, which is to deny anyone the right to leave a union their grandparents voluntarily joined or (more often) were forced into, and to fight a war if necessary to prevail on that question. It's bloody and it is, as I've already pointed out, highly undemocratic. I may be the only guy north of the Mason-Dixon Line to argue this, but I think Lincoln was wrong to force the South to remain in a union they no longer wanted to be in (not to mention the irony of him invoking the American War of Independence, over precisely the same concept, in the Gettysburg Address). The same is true of the ugly war Russia has fought in Chechnya, or the nasty Balkans wars of the 1990s. The principle is exactly the same in each case.
Option two, which I am happy to report the Anglophone Canadians or the English in the UK would surely follow today, is to say a reluctant good-bye. Divide up the household assets, get a divorce, pat the kids on the head, wish them luck, and send them packing. We might call this the Gorbachev model, and thank goodness he employed, rather than Russia going down Lincoln's path and fighting the fourteen other former republics to make them remain in the Soviet Union. Can anybody say the world is substantially worse off today because Belarus or Kazakhstan are independent states now? On the other hand, there are about 650,000 Americans who were consumed in Mr. Lincoln's war, and one heck of a lot more additional misery back then, beyond those direct battle deaths. That's a lot of people whom we can definitely say were seriously worse off. And for what? What great disaster would have ensued had the US split?
That's a serious question, which brings me to reason number three for letting secesh secede. It's not exactly a secret that the folks who want to split from the union today (as before) are the ones with the nastiest, most backward politics in the country, and would therefore hardly represent a loss to the rest of us. Worst of all, though, because they are aggressive and skilled at hard-ball politics, they are also the folks who hold leadership positions in the US government, way out of proportion to their numbers. Which means that their lousy politics get nationalized for all of us to enjoy. Thinking I'm kidding? Do these names mean anything to you?: Bush, Cheney, DeLay, Palin, McCain, Armey, Clinton, McConnell, Gingrich, Lott, Frist, Rove, Atwater, Thurmond, Helms. and so on... For years now, these fine folks have been working to turn the USA into Mississippi, rather than the other way around.
And they've succeeded. So now that they're talking about seceding, I'm wondering exactly what the down-side is. It's not like we in the would-be rump United States will lose revenue or something. In fact, the opposite is true. The folks who bitch the most about the oppressive heavy hand of Washington are always the same ones whose states are net recipients of federal funds. Which makes the rest of us net payers. And, I'm sorry, I don't mind helping out my comrades (even in Texas) who need an assist here and there. But not if they're going to have stupid and regressive policies. And especially not if the price of my assistance is having them insist we all have stupid and regressive policies. And really, totally, especially not if they're going to complain about how tough it is being forced to receive and spend my tax dollars.
I'm dead serious, then, when I say good riddance to the tea party and GOP dominated states and their backward societies. If they want to secede from the union, we should encourage them. We in the progressive states will then be free to actually make thoughtful public policy decisions for once, without all this painful catering to absolutely obstinate regressive politicians. They, meanwhile, can set up their ideal Republic of Jesus. They can toss out science and do supersti... - sorry, I mean religion - instead, as the basis for their education system and other policy decisions. They can spend all their money on the military and eat pork rinds all day long. They can cut their lazy seniors off the Social Security and Medicare dole, and put them to work in coal mines right up until the day they die. It will be good for their character! They can oppress women and minorities and gays just as much as they need to in order to feel better about their sorry selves, and then watch what happens when all those folks split for better places, like where we live. (Watch out, though - we may borrow their repressive immigration policies to keep them out of Intelligent America. We'll treat regressives like they treat poor Mexican immigrants, and wouldn't that alone be worth the price of admission?)
I'd like nothing more, to be honest, than to see those two new polities, side by side, conduct a little living experiment in social science. Let's all come back ten, thirty and fifty years later and compare notes. Let's see who is succeeding and who is just seceding, whose policy ideas work, and whose don't.
But there's one little problem, of course. There wouldn't just be two new polities - there would be more. In some ways, the best thing that happened to the Confederacy was to lose the war, because otherwise, like any good confederal polity, they would have immediately had to struggle with the massive problems of a pathetically weak central government. It's the same built-in disaster that caused the Founders to ditch the Articles of Confederation after about a decade or so of failure under its structure, opting instead for the horrifyingly repressive federalism model of the Constitution instead.
Let's say the South were to secede tomorrow, and establish Richmond as the capital of the new Confederate States of America. Not only would those boneheads immediately realize that none of their problems were solved by ditching Washington, and not only would they see that their problems and standard of living just got worse without us to carry them anymore, but they would also still be dealing with the same old power issues, only with worse outcomes. Richmond would try to give orders to Texas, only to find Texas flipping them a very nice little states' rights birdie in response. It might even get deeper than that. Maybe southern Florida would split from the northern half of the state. Secession on secession. And so on. What an accomplishment, eh?
If it sounds like I'm laughing at these tea party buffoons and their secession rants, it's because I am.
And if it sounds like I'd be more than happy to grant them the wish of their autonomy, it's because I would.
Indeed, I would just as soon that we secede from them ourselves, if they're not going to get there first.
Goodbye, and good riddance.
Oh, and good luck, too. Y'all are gonna need it.




96 Comments so far
Show AllI am from California. There are good reasons to create The 50 Autonomous States. It comes down to authentic local representation. California in particular could have the say over their own redwoods and ocean if locals had the final say about local issues.
From a local resources point of view. If government were smaller and locals were expected to be the guardians of their small areas, the people's will might be known. Right now, Diane Feinstein can sell our Redwoods to Texas investors and there is nothing the local people can do about it!!!
I'm glad you get it. Many others feel the same. The Second Vermont Republic-The Green Mountain Independence Movement is another good one.
There would be a need for so much unimpeded transport of commerce across borders, that I don't really see what the point of each US state being an independent nation-state. Are you suggesting passports and customs station on the borders?
I am a little slow, I wish someone would summarize what he
just said.
I believe it is the Dems calling all their liberal buddies
and media to stir the racism pot so they can keep the
minority vote that they don't deserve.
Mainstream television, WaPo , NY Times, are getting
even more rediculous as elections approach.
BABOON
You sir, are obviously seeing part of the real truth of this article.
And what part would that be? Seems to me he has completely missed the whole point of the article (not to mention the general flow of reality). Or was that sarcasm that I missed?
Sorry. Feeding the trolls again.
This article doesn't have a point as any one can see at a glance. I don't think you are a troll.
"The combination of federalism and capitalism makes American government in Washington about the least intrusive of any in the world ..."
Pardon me while I mop up my spilled coffee.
I'm not sure how that assertion might be viewed internally by each of the "sovereign" United States, but I have a strange feeling that some other parts of the world might regard the capitalist intrusiveness of the "American government in Washington" somewhat differently.
I guess I don't understand your point. Even with a Republic of California, the people would probably still vote for Diane Feinstein for something. And she might still be able to sell the trees to Texas.
I seem to have inserted my comments in the wrong place. They belong a couple comments down.
No problem. It would be nice to have some more flexible self-editing capabilities here, but as a site admin myself, I understand the tendency to be restrictive.
Humor doesn't cover the hatefulness in this piece. There's so much framing going on I feel I've inadvertently wandered into a second-rate art gallery. Presumptions and personal bias abound.
A few examples:
# "secession ... Hey, just like those happy days of slavery and civil war again"
Secession has nothing to do with slavery.
# "this is regressivism we're talking about here, folks"
Regressive like 1776?
# "the recent stampede to honor those great patriots of the 1860s - who, er, um, tried to wreck the country"
He's totally conflating any secession talk with Southerners, the Far Right, Tea-Baggers, etc.
# Tx and MN are not ridiculous for airing their frustration. Granted, any such talk is probably political theater, but it's certainly any state's prerogative to consider its options and voice them.
# Alaska, too, entertained the notion of independence for decades despite similar ridicule.
# What does secession have to do with Confederate History Month?
# "folks who want to split from the union today (as before) are the ones with the nastiest, most backward politics in the country"
I myself can entertain the idea of a "Cascadia" and hardly have 'nasty, backward politics'.
It's not only possible but highly likely that secessionist speech results from very real grievances. How about addressing these injustices, perceived or real, instead of attacking the messengers. This article leaves a bad taste in my mouth. It's not a righteous rant.
Excellent comment.
Those who criticize Green's comments about the effects of secession should do what he suggests, and read about the country as it was run under the Articles of Confederation. Nothing worked, which is why the Constitutional Convention was conveded in 1787, whose delegates (all appointed by state legislatures) decided to create a stronger federal government. Recall the first line of their document: "In order to create a more perfect union..."
I take your point, however, in 1787 there were 2.5 million people living in this country, now there are over 300 million. Things have changed greatly and in order to keep things together the federal government will necessarily have to use more heavy-handed tactics, especially when taking into account the added pressures of peak oil, global warming, immigration, etc.
I don't know the answer to this conundrum. Either states will have to start exerting their sovereignty or we may very well see full-blown centralized tyranny/fascism. Or, there could be some kind of secession. The kind I envision is by bioregion, not states.
Ernest Callenbach's book, Ecotopia, is a look at how secession might work. He also acknowledged that it wouldn't come about peacefully. A dilemma.
I continue to find the other David Green to be self-absorbed, clueless, and irrelevant to vital issues. He's a blowhard, too impressed with his writing and so-called sense of humor. I have no idea why his views regularly are posted by putatively progressive-left websites. I guess because he's a professor.
Well said sir! There IS a David Green that speaks the truth and deserves respect. And I thought there wasn't one.
Nice. Rebutting his arguments, point-by-point is a lot of work, so just make ad-hominem attacks instead. It works every time.
pjd412
I'm sorry, but he had no real points, his article is nothing but a thinly desguised ad hominem attack.
Its simply a condensed version of democratic talking points and a blantant appeal to bigotry.
Great article, Prof. Green. I can remember, back in the day, when Norman Mailer and James Breslin ran a mayoral campaign that would have declared New York a "free city", a seperate governmental identity from the USA. I have come to wonder in the last few years if our nation, and the world, would have been much better off had the slave states been allowed to secede. The awful carnage and the resulting scarring of our national psyche would have been avoided, our worst war. With the coming technological revolution, slavery was doomed as an institution. Furthermore, I can imagine that black people might have been in a better postition to fight for their political rights had they remained in the south where they were a significant portion of the population, if not a majority, as with Mississippi. Perhaps we might have avoided what has come to pass, which seems to have combined all the worst traits of the two sides of the "Union" that Lincoln preserved.
Tony Vodvarka
On the other hand, the Confederacy could have easily evolved into a Nazi or Stalinist -like state and attempted genocide against the black people remaining within its borders, once the advance of technology meant slavery was no longer needed. What would the Union have done then? Probably nothing. I'm still convinced the Confederacy would have inevitably attacked the Union, not just looking for Lebensraum and grabbing the North's industrial base but because it simply would have been the natural course of events for the kind of aggressive and homicidal swine who would have run the Confederacy. Woodrow Wilson, for example.
Suggested, if not required, reading: "Ecotopia" and "Ecotopia Emerging", by Ernest Callenbach.
The latter, incidentally, gets some interesting credit for prophecy: a prolonged oil war in the Middle East.
Funny, I hadn't read your post before posting mine.
Yeah, Ecotopia is a hopeful look at what could happen, though, Callenbach acknowledged that it can't happen without some kind of force...or trickery.
I haven't read Ecotopia Emerging in a long time, so have forgotten its message re oil. I'll have to take another look. Thanks!
David Michael Green disgraces CD with another of his hate articles, filled with hate speech advocating hateful stereotypes appealing to only the worst sort of bigot.
I do not understant CD continuing to publish this type of sladerous dishonesty.
I understand him as he and his democratic cohorts are getting desperate as they begining to see the abyss they have created for themselves with their dishonesty and arrogance.
You are limited by a lack of a sense of humor. This is ironic satire.
I must be losing my mind. I took DMG's article seriously.
Nonsense Kitty Lady. This is tired stereotyping and liberal elitist thinking masquerading as ironic satire.
Kitty Lady
There was nothing satirical about his article. He simply reflects a favored perspective of a bigotted and arrogant small section of our countrymen. The lefts equivelent of redneck militia if you will.
Why would "progressive" states want to keep Washington?
?
Excellent question, donnalou!
For the architecture.
While David Green's proposal to let regressive states split off and rot on their own has its' attractive facets, such as those states being forcefully weaned off the federal tit (those states almost all get more federal $$ than they send to Washington D.C.), there is a significant downside.
Said downside is that those state's rapacious elites would soon drag them down to Third World status, creating a version of what is facing Europe, which has similar neighbors to its' south and east. Said neighbors peoples are desperate to leave and are winding up in the EU.
So it would appear that the other almost as unpleasant option be applied; regressive states are dragged along kicking and screaming, as there is no way to put them anywhere else on the planet.
Its not Mr. Greens designee's that would rot. Its the ones that love their stereotypes and false image of themselves.
Who would get to keep all the nukes?
The Southern states would just auction them off to the highest bidder.
After all, everyone has the right to keep and bear arms.
I suspect that 150 years is not enough to break the connection between Lincoln's defense of the union and the end of slavery. I am not sure the strategy of secession can yet be considered outside of the historical framework. The "them" and "us" structure of the original piece does seem to oversimplify the complexity of the issue in the sometimes too real world we all share.
These are the ravings of (aggressive and homicidal) lunatics.
Yes, they are. But mass secession of a New Confederacy, made up of the Old Confederacy plus new Johnny Rebs like Oklahoma, Kansas and Arizona, would certainly put an end once and for all to the present USA empire. That wouldn't break my heart. The downside would be that the New Confederacy would inevitably attack the remainder of the Union and try to conquer it. Haley Barbour or David Vitter would become the new Jefferson Davis.
Doubtful. You look at the USSR and it was pretty much a bloodless affair. I have maintained that given the current state of affairs, secession will probably be a reality by 2025. Given the recent year under Obama, I am revising that downwards. As competition for resources heats up and government taxes continue the out flow with no return, look for continued grumblings from disparate regions. Look at those areas with poor return on federal tax dollars coupled with good natural resources. Here are some potential break ups:
1. Californication - California, Oregon, possibly Washington.
2. Republic of Tehas - Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, possibly Oklahoma.
3. United Great Lakes - Michigan, Wisconsin, Illinois, Minnesota.
4. Gotham - New York, Pennsylvania, small states north up to and including Maine.
Lefty
2. Republic of Tehas - Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, possibly Oklahoma.
Most assuredly Oklahoma along with Arkansas and Louisana, probably Utah, Kansas, Nebraska, Missiouri, Kentucky and the Virginias plus all the states below the last three. Perhaps Ohio.
Your 3 & 4 are probably correct, but I'm not sure Oregon and Washington would go with California.
Interesting divisions you came up with.
(At least western) OR and WA, norCal if it likes, SW B.C. = Cascadia. We already have a flag.
"It is a measure of the sheer poverty of our national politics that the notion of secession is in the air again." The opening line of this article reminded me of the 'sheer' political fiction of ending capitalism in America. Far right, far left, the difference is that secession was real. Ending capitalism, yeah, sure, that's just a joke.
David Michael Green is blowing smoke when he writes:
"The combination of federalism and capitalism makes American government in Washington about the least intrusive of any in the world."
Tell this to the world's largest population of prisoners - here in the USA. tell it to the people who are tased for talking back to the cops, who have been militarized courtesy of the Federal government.
The USA is a place of rigged elections and nearly complete control by the giant corporations and the military/intelligence complex.
Obama recently announced the right to assassinate Americans.
Now that's intrusive.
Green's perspective is that of a privileged ivory tower, upper middle class elitist.
Like so many liberal intellectuals, he doesn't have a clue regarding the rage felt by the average American. He doesn't even try to understand. Instead he resorts to "humorous" caricatures and tired streotypes.
Attitudes like Prof Green's are why the masses distrust liberals, and why the Tea Party is growing in leaps and bounds.
I agree. Whether intended as satire or not, this is about the worst thing I've ever seen from DMG.
Excellent comments, one and all.
"Green's perspective is that of a privileged ivory tower, upper middle class elitist."
bourgeoisie: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bourgeoisie
Green is bourgeois with all the attitude and perspective of that group.
"Attitudes like Prof Green's are why the masses distrust liberals, and why the Tea Party is growing in leaps and bounds."
And why a socialist-type party ought to be!
Sioux Rose
DREAM JOE: Good points! I would also add the awful federal mandate of "No Child Left Behind" which effectively turns education into conditioning children's minds to accept lives as automatic robots. States are essentially forced to teach the same dead and deadening excuse for curricula. And then there are the drug war's sentencing guidelines which often tie the hands of judges limiting their capacity to make seasoned determinations on the basis of their hopeful experience in wisdom and jurisprudence. Countless other examples exist, such as the power of GM crop producers in making sure that food labels are NOT properly marked. These federal determinations impact states profoundly.
My sister told me that where she lives in Queens, NY there are suddenly all sorts of soldiers in her midst. She thinks they are preparing for something coming down...you know you live in a free land when there are uniformed guards EVERYwhere... The Europeans no doubt envy such exciting displays of liberty.
This was hardly Professor Green's best essay.
Thank you, Rich M., for taking the time to construct a cogent reply. I hope DMG reads it.
How dare you making a reasoned response to a tongue in cheek article?
Seriously, nice response.