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Gen. Keane Keen on Attacking Iran
Celebrating a golden anniversary reunion with classmates from Fordham College (class of 1961) on a perfect June day in New York should be a time of pure Gaudeamus Igitur and little or no stress.
I should have known better that to attend a long lecture by Jack Keane, a retired four-star general of Fordham Business School’s class of 1966. Actually, I did know better; but I went anyway. I felt I could risk going to hear Keane’s slant on the world because, prior to my upcoming Mediterranean cruise to Gaza, my cardiologist had pronounced my blood pressure under control. I felt as good, and energized, as 50 years ago.
Keane, now a member of Fordham’s Board of Trustees, has been the go-to general for the neoconservatives in recent years. He indicated that he was about to catch a flight to Europe where he would lobby leaders of the 41 NATO countries who, except for three, have been “unwilling to ask their people to sacrifice” in places like Afghanistan. (It seems never to have crossed his mind that most Europeans have long since concluded that the war in Afghanistan – aka Vietnamistan – is a fool’s errand, and that they are less susceptible to misleading rhetoric about the so-called War on Terror.)
Proceeding from general to specific, Keane mentioned that he had asked top UK military leaders at Sandhurst why even the British seem to be going wobbly on Afghanistan. He said that over cocktails British generals commiserated with Keane, asking him sheepishly, “Have you Americans lost confidence in us?”
“Yes we have,” Keane said he answered. He told us he very much bemoaned increasing U.S. isolation — even from its closest allies — on crucial matters of war and peace, but assured us: “We’re better.” Keane said he was going to Europe to try to transplant some of the U.S. “strength of character” into European backbones.
Europe Unwilling to “Sacrifice” Like We Are
Keane suggested that the two world wars had weakened the moral fiber and resolve of most Europeans. He claimed that the “main ingredient” in the lamentable “unwillingness of European leaders to ask their people to sacrifice” was the prevalence of Social Democracy. At which point a Golden Jubilee classmate of mine threw up his hand in a vain attempt to ask what sacrifices most Americans have been asked to make during almost ten years of war in Afghanistan — especially relatively wealthy white Americans like, sadly, virtually all of us in the audience.
On such a beautiful spring day, only a skunk at the picnic would call attention to the reality that only a select few Americans are being asked to “sacrifice;” that is, are being sent off to kill and be killed.
Hundreds of Fordham alumni perished in WW-I and WW-II. During Korea and Vietnam respects were paid and prayers always offered for those fallen in battle. Not so this year. I found myself wondering if any alumni had died in Iraq or Afghanistan. (I should have asked, even at the risk of eliciting an embarrassed silence.)
I have felt from the outset that eliminating the draft merits a place toward the very top of the long list of President Richard Nixon’s missteps. Would Congress have voted to launch war on Iraq, if “important” people — like Representatives and Senators themselves and their children — would have been at risk to be sent into battle? I don’t think so.
Keane and his well-heeled Establishment colleagues are quite okay asking other Americans to sacrifice. Half of U.S. forces are drawn, via a poverty draft, from the inner cities and small American towns of less than 50,000 – places with few jobs and even fewer educational opportunities. This is, in my view, an important moral issue, however painful it might be to examine it closely. It is avoided like the plague.
Highly Educated but Ill-Informed
I found the situation at Fordham as bad as what I observed during our last class reunion five years ago. Sadly, most of my classmates and many of my closest friends — virtually all avid readers of the New York Times — are malnourished by the thin gruel dished out by the Times and the rest of the Fawning Corporate Media.
Those willing to take the trouble to navigate the Web and look for alternative media for full and accurate information still comprise a distinct minority. Like me, however, they were deeply troubled that our alma mater would lionize Gen. Keane. “Thou shalt not kill” seems to have become as “quaint” and “obsolete” as the Geneva Conventions.
Those in that minority were all too well aware that Keane was a key figure in promoting the so-called “surge” of over 30,000 U.S. troops in 2007 that helped the Shia complete the ethnic cleansing of Baghdad. In short, during the surge, the Iraqi capital of several million was transformed from a predominantly Sunni city into an overwhelmingly Shiite one.
I had expected Keane to echo Establishment encomia regarding the “success” of the surge — and I had thought about what I might ask on that topic during the Q & A — but his hour-long lecture on “Emerging Global Risks and Opportunities” had a more general sweep. If anything held center stage, it was the “threat” from Iran, which he portrayed as part of an “ideological” struggle to create an Islamic Caliphate by defeating America’s moral fiber, with the first step in this assault being the attack on 9/11. See how it all comes together?!
Iran: Main “Strategic Enemy” of the U.S.?
According to Keane, not only is the Iranian “dictatorship” intent on acquiring “regional hegemony,” it is trying to “fundamentally change the world” by acquiring nuclear weapons. The United States is rightly concerned, he said, with internal repression in Iran; he branded Iranian leaders as “thugs and killers.”
The “fundamental concern,” however, is that the Iranians “are acquiring nuclear weapons.” Here we go again, I thought. My hand shot up, but I had to wait until Keane finished his global survey. Finishing with the Far East, he reassured us that America has little to fear from a resurgent China.
When the Q and A began, I prefaced my question by highlighting the things we had in common, noting that I too was a Distinguished Military Graduate of Fordham’s ROTC program and had been offered a career commission in the regular Army.
I chose to take my commission in the Army Reserve and I mentioned that after two years on active duty I had served for the next 27 years as a CIA analyst. I then made a point to thank him for warning us at the outset that he was a direct, open person with strong opinions, and that some of what he would say would be precisely that — his opinion. It seemed appropriate at that point to allude to Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan’s famous dictum that everyone is entitled to his own opinion but not to his own facts.
Could he be unaware, I asked, that in late 2007, the 16 agencies of the U.S. intelligence community had concluded — unanimously, and “with high confidence” — that Iran stopped working on a nuclear weapon in mid-2003? Did he somehow miss the key National Intelligence Estimate of November 2007? Did he also miss the March 2011 testimony of National Intelligence Director James Clapper, who told Congress there was no evidence warranting change in that judgment?
Four-Star Bull
It was like waving a red flag before a four-star bull. “What’s your question?” he barked.
I asked: “Why do you join with those neoconservatives who have such difficulty distinguishing between the strategic needs of Israel on the one hand and those of the U.S. on the other? Why do you keep claiming the Iranians ‘are acquiring nuclear weapons,’ when you know that this is not true. How can you keep a straight face in telling us that Iran is our ‘main strategic enemy?’ That is also not true, and you know it.”
I then added a suggestion that he find time at the airport to pick up Seymour Hersh’s investigative article on Iran and nukes in the current issue of the New Yorker magazine.
Would that Fordham’s seal included the word Veritas, alongside Sapientia et Doctrina. For, somehow, the truth does not seem to hold much priority any more. I might have guessed that Keane’s response would be not only unresponsive but disingenuous.
“There is evidence that was available starting in 2006, even before that National Intelligence Estimate was drafted, that Iran is working on a nuclear weapon.”
That did it for me. I lost it. Convinced that this was not only a whopper, but the kind of whopper that could well end up getting thousands more killed, I blurted out, “That’s a lie.”
Some of my classmates told me later that at a Gala Jubilee Reunion it is very much frowned upon to call a wealthy Trustee of the university — and a four-star general to boot — a liar. Even if he is.
The next questioner, a former classmate of Keane, asked “Why not a nuclear free zone in the Middle East?” He was cut off when he tried to point out that Israel is the only regional country opposed, with full U.S. support, to a nuclear-free zone there. Another questioner asked about the influence of the Israel lobby. Keane’s response, “Sorry, we’re out of time.” (In fairness, we were out of time, but Keane could not disguise his relief that that he could gracefully side-step addressing the key issue the lobby.)
The Setting Aside, Iran Issue Hardly Academic
The possibility of an attack on Iran seems to be on the front burner again, thanks to neoconservatives like Keane. In Washington in the not-too-distant past, we used to call such aficionados of pre-emptive war “the crazies;” many have since become the capital’s opinion leaders.
Yet, even some level-headed Israelis are doing their best to warn their countrymen that Israel’s right-wing government is again, dangerously, beating the drums for an attack on Iran. It has reached the point where former Mossad intelligence chief, Meir Dagan, has stated publicly that Israeli leaders may be on the verge of doing something really dumb and extremely dangerous.
In a recent talk at Hebrew University, Dagan called a military attack on Iran “a stupid idea” that “would mean regional war.” Dagan said, “The regional challenge that Israel would face would be impossible.” But many hard-line Israelis – like their neocon counterparts in the United States – don’t want to hear such warnings. They are convinced – and see ample evidence — that, no matter what, in the end analysis the U.S. will pull Israel’s chestnuts out of the fire
The Israeli newspaper Haaretz has reported:
“Most of the politicians, and amazingly (and absurdly) enough, also a large number of journalists, want [Dagan] to be quiet. They don’t want him to get us upset with his fears or arouse us from our slumber with his warnings. We’ll just leave the fateful decision of whether to attack Iran to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Defense Minister Ehud Barak, and to them alone, and let the storm over the issue subside. As if blind, we will follow them and be led by them straight into the midst of the danger.”
As for Dagan himself, Haaretz commented that if he “thinks it’s a matter of a threat to our existence at our doorstep, it is not only his right to make himself heard, it is his supreme duty. He should attempt to stop it, to act as a gatekeeper. If he acted otherwise, he would have been abusing his role as former Mossad director.”
Keane’s Record
I’ve had a day now to reflect on why I blurted out, “That’s a lie.” I mean, aside from the fact that I am 99 percent certain it was, in fact, a lie. I could have followed Washington rather than Bronx etiquette and said something less caustic, like “I don’t believe you have that right, general.”
I’ve pieced together the reasons for my blunt, visceral reaction. My umbrage derived mostly from the tens of thousands of human beings — Iraqis, Afghans, Pakistanis, Libyans, as well as Americans – who have died because of misleading statements like the one Keane made about Iran “acquiring nuclear weapons.”
And I guess the setting had something to do with it, since I felt rather strongly that Keane should know better. You see, during the Sixties all undergraduates at Fordham were required to take a course in moral theology/ethics. Business School students were not exempt.
Moreover, I regard Keane and his neocon friends as mostly responsible for the death and destruction brought about by the surge of some 30,000 additional U.S. troops into Iraq between February 2007 and July 2008. U.S. troop deaths spiked to over 900 in 2007 alone, making it the deadliest year of the U.S. since 2004. As for Iraqi civilians, the first half-year of 2007 was the most deadly first six months of any year since the invasion of Iraq. In a word, the surge brought industrial scale violence to Iraq on the pretense of quelling it.
The most significant thing that happened during the surge was that the additional U.S. troops, most of whom were sent into Baghdad and its suburbs, enabled the Shiites to disarm the Sunnis. Once the Sunnis were disarmed, Shiite militias poured into Sunni neighborhoods at night and ethnically cleansed those neighborhoods. We could even observe from satellite imagery that the lights in Sunni districts literally went out.
Mixed neighborhoods in Baghdad ended up with virtually no Sunnis. In short, Baghdad went from a predominantly Sunni city to being overwhelmingly Shiite. Again, we’re talking millions.
It is true that the horrific sectarian violence declined once the ethnic cleansing was far advanced, but that was mostly because there were far fewer mixed neighborhoods where Sunnis and Shiites could kill one another, although sectarian butchery remains horrible even to this day.
Moreover, it is a mistake to think that those U.S. troops still in Iraq will be spared. Earlier today five more U.S. soldiers were killed in a rocket attack on an American base in the Baladiyat district of Baghdad. This appears to be a tangible sign that the Sunnis mean to “get even” not only with the Shia but with the U.S. troops who screened the ethnic cleansing of Baghdad in 2007-2008.
As for what the surge did in terms of brutalizing American troops, one need look no farther than the gun-barrel video and chatter from an Apache helicopter on July 12, 2007, in a southeastern neighborhood of Baghdad. WikiLeaks, you will recall, released the video and it can be accessed via collateralmurder.com in 18-minute and 39-minute versions.
An excellent report with short commentary on the video was produced earlier this year by the German TV program Panorama. Panorama was later persuaded to go back, “undub,” and provide a 12-minute video-cum-commentary in English, since the American Fawning Corporate Media have tended to avoid this horrific footage.
Unasked Questions
Before Keane chose to focus on Iran, I had jotted down a line of questioning about the surge, mostly as a way to help those of my classmates who still appear not to know where to look for objective information and analysis.
I was confident that his answers or non-answers would be instructive regarding the widespread misunderstanding of what the surge in Iraq was really all about.
In short, during the fall of 2006, CENCOM commander Gen. John Abizaid and the commander of U.S. troops in Iraq, Gen. George Casey, in formal testimony to the Senate Armed Services Committee, strongly advocated that the U.S. NOT send additional troops to Iraq. They argued that refusing to reinforce would be the only way to ensure that Iraqi politicians would finally get the message that they had to put their own house in order.
Just before the mid-term election in 2006, then-Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld chose to support his commanders. In the view of the neocon hardliners in George W. Bush’s administration, Rumsfeld (of all people) was going wobbly on the Iraq War. Immediately after the election, Rumsfeld was ousted and was replaced by Robert Gates in December 2006.
Also, in December 2006, James Baker, the former Secretary of State and White House Chief of Staff under President George H. W. Bush, announced the results of the highly regarded Iraq Study Group. Rather than advocate sending more U.S. troops to Iraq, the ISG did the opposite, urging a drawdown.
In addition, most, if not all, of the Joint Chiefs of Staff were against the surge. However, with Keane and the neocons ascendant, and Gates and Gen. David Petraeus (an extremely close associate of Gen. Keane) waiting in the wings, Bush cast aside the advice of his field commanders, the Iraq Study Group, and the top brass at the Pentagon. Soon, Abizaid and Casey were gone, too. And Petraeus became, well, Petraeus ex machina.
My tentative plan at Fordham was to ask Gen. Keane how in the world he and his neocon allies succeeded in persuading President Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney to ignore the experts and opt rather for a surge. And how does he reply to those who say it was simply a case of postponing the day of definitive defeat in Iraq until Bush and Cheney could ride west into the sunset?
Gen. Keane, I would ask, How do you justify the deaths of more than 1,000 additional U.S. soldiers and countless thousands more Iraqis in exchange for sparing Bush, Cheney and the neocons the embarrassment of having the catastrophe in Iraq hung firmly around their necks?
Perhaps someone else will get a chance to pose such questions to Gen. Keane sometime soon.
A shorter version of this article appeared originally on Consortiumnews.com.




48 Comments so far
Show AllWhy are businessmen seeking to start more wars? Iran has not threatened our national security or offered a greater threat than North Korea or any of the other countries that have gained nuclear power..We give aid to Pakistan, Israel and India and other nuclear powers Is it because Israel seeks war with Iran? Are there profits to be made? And do they plan on sharing them with those of us that sacrifice our young in their wars?
Or is it that we are to sacrifice our young as human sacrifices at the same time we experience austerity while they no longer pay taxes or sacrifice at all? Iran hasn't done anything to me. In fact I've only seen them demonstrate restraint and openness. They seek nuclear power for the same reasons Saudi Arabia does and it was Saudis on board those planes not Iraqis, Afghans, Libyans, Pakistanis or Iranians.
Good points however, there were Pakistanis on those planes.
"According to Keane, not only is the Iranian “dictatorship” intent on acquiring “regional hegemony,” it is trying to “fundamentally change the world” by acquiring nuclear weapons."
Isn't that exactly what Israel did with Dimona and they and their US friends in collusion kept it a secret for decades.
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/israel/documents/reveal/index.html
"On such a beautiful spring day, only a skunk at the picnic would call attention to the reality that only a select few Americans are being asked to “sacrifice;” that is, are being sent off to kill and be killed."
True, in the sense of someone participating in our corporate imperial military engaged in war crimes.
But we are paying for these corporate energy wars with more public debt and a depressed economy.
Iraq is characterized as an enemy for giving the Shah the boot and nationalizing their hydrocarbon resources.
They are also seen as threat to the schemes of Big Oil (backed by our military) to establish hegemony over Central Asian energy resources via the occupation of Afghanistan.
"On such a beautiful spring day, only a skunk at the picnic would call attention to the reality that only a select few Americans are being asked to “sacrifice;” that is, are being sent off to kill and be killed."
Of course, this is often the argument used in support of reinstituting the draft. However, if we give these madmen more troops, they will only find more wars to fight. There is no real or illusionary problem on the planet that they won't use as an excuse to send in more American soldiers to sacrifice and die for multinational corporations and others who control our government.
The mere fact that these jingoistic bastards are arguing for more wars, when we can't even finance the ones we already have, is sufficient evidence that they don't care one iota whether this nation collapses internally--so long as in our dying gasp we sacrifice all of our sons and daughters to turn the Middle East and adjacent regions over to those who have coveted it for so long.
As a popular song once asked, "War? War? War? What are we fighting for?"
Damn good question!
However, today perhaps the lyrics should read, "War? War? War? WHO are we fighting them for?"
Corroborating signals?
From the article:
The Israeli newspaper Haaretz has reported:
“Most of the politicians, and amazingly (and absurdly) enough, also a large number of journalists, want [Dagan] to be quiet. They don’t want him to get us upset with his fears or arouse us from our slumber with his warnings. We’ll just leave the fateful decision of whether to attack Iran to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Defense Minister Ehud Barak..."
From Asia Times:
Is an attack on Iran in the works? - Asia Times, Victor Kotsev (Jun 6, '11)
"In the past few months, ostensibly in the wake of the Arab Spring, Israeli discussion of a war with Iran has been relegated to the back-burner. If the rhetoric heats up, it could paradoxically mean a delay in any attack. If discussion remains muted, it could be in anticipation of a strike."
Nothing but shit will keep getting done with the likes of the neoconservatives still calling the shots. And how easy it was to cull the 'baddies', those generals not calling for surges, so those 'goodies could institute their surges and now the military is top heavy with the 'goodies' while those we really need running and commanding the military are given desk jobs in Hoboken sorting out mailing lists or some arcane jobs.
Leaves very little to hope for in the future. Just like the corporate criminals who have most control, their 'good buddies' running military ensure that the wars keep a coming.
Thanks again Mr. McGovern for keep us apprised of the situations and who is fucking us the most. I honestly can see anything good happening until what I guess would have to be a military coup in the military to get some sense that does some good 'going'.
My take: Keane knows that AIPAC always wants a few sympathetic goys on their board.
gardennorcal, don't tell us you STILL buy the govt 911 conspiracy B S ..we have no reason to be in iraq or afghanistan......the only terrotists come from the good ole U S of A
Keane is a four-star idiot. An attack on Iran will have both immediate and far-reaching consequences, although what these will be, no one can predict with any accuracy. However, what can be said is that such an attack will accelerate the US's downward slide.
"This is, in my view, an important moral issue, however painful it might be to examine it closely. It is avoided like the plague."
Of course it is. It is at the core a class issue. These things have been addressed and dismissed as Marxist, nothing more need be said. We don't want to start a class war now… do we?
Well, Ray McGovern, I guess you're now one of the new "crazies," and God bless you for it. Thank you for your irreplaceable coverage and bravery.
Israel and the United States are the two biggest terrorist states in the world and they believe in controlling the world through permanent war. Israel can kill civilians with impunity, steal Palestinian land, threaten nuclear blackmail over the entire middle east and have 110 percent support from America while doing so. Creating the state of Israel was a gigantic mistake for which the world has been paying for ever since.
[Keane suggested that the two world wars had weakened the moral fiber and resolve of most Europeans.]
I read that and nearly puked. Does that fool really think that way? When one talks about the evils of humans, isn't war one of the prime evils? An evil from which most, if not all, others flow? I've always held that the higher you get in military rank, the less gifted you are.
The words "less gifted" are too kind. The Army rewards incompetance. The novel Catch 22 was exaggerated, but not by much. Anyone who has been in the service recognizes the officers portrayed in it.
I wanted to cut out what I viewed as my excessive cursing on this board. But that's not worked out too well, for some reason I still swear like I'm still in the goddamn navy.
Really tho, if I did use more accurate words I'd also have gone over the limit on length.
Maybe after two world wars the Europeans have had just about enough of that fucking madness. Too bad the US never had to suffer invasion and mass destruction. It might be a little less enthusiastic about going to war every chance it gets. Better to fight them there than fight them here, right? Maybe if the US attacks Iran, Russia will Nuke NYC, Washington, Chicago, Los Angeles, San Diego and Seattle. Maybe then people in the US would become a bit less bloodthirsty.
[Maybe after two world wars the Europeans have had just about enough of that fucking madness.]
Damn right you are. I know Europeans who moved here after the war and that's their story. Germany and France worked hard to bury the hatchet, and avoid trying to bury said hatchet in each other's heads after the last major war. I hope they won't forget.
[ Too bad the US never had to suffer invasion and mass destruction]
Actually, you have suffered that scale of war before. The US Civil war was the first of the industrial wars. That war saw slaughter on a mass scale. It saw mass destruction too. You might be able to argue that it turned the states off of fighting others, and it did for a while. It was 30 years before you went into another large conflict in the Spanish American War. Of course, the counter argument is that you were busy at the time fighting the 'Indian' wars; which were more massacre than war...
I did get training on how to deal with Nuclear, biological and chemical warfare. The chemicals and bioweapons are horrid, but they can be defended (somewhat) against. For training in dealing with nuclear war; the instructor said "bend over and kiss your ass goodbye." If the nukes fly, we'll all die.
this slight aimed at Europe stuck in my craw as well.
Thank you for your courage and patriotism. Someone might have asked, "What would be the consequences for US gasoline prices if the Persian Gulf were contaminated by radiation from bombed nuclear reactors? Or if the the Straits of Hormuz were closed by mines? Or if the oil terminals of Iran, Iraq, Kuwait, and Saudi Arabia were destroyed by war?"
Thanks for sharing the map link. I found it very informative, especially the blended USA/Israel entity and where it thinks it is.
I had no problems with the image and scroll bar so it may be a browser issue. Have you tried a different browser or the latest version of what you are using? I have FireFox 4.0.1 if that helps.
One can only look forward to the demise of such psychopathic dinosaurs as Jack Keane.
Good for Ray. I'm glad he wasn't mugged and dragged out of the room for Questioning Authority this time around.
I'm surprised that General Keane didn't rant on about Iran introducing foreign substances into the precious bodily fluids of freedom-loving citizens everywhere without the knowledge of the individual.
His depraved and irrational warmongering reads like out-takes from the speeches of General Jack D. Ripper in "Dr. Strangelove".
Sadly, it's no surprise that the rest of the upscale audience listened in rapt and respectful attention.
I appreciate the article and agree about the ethnic cleansing "surge" in Iraq. As well, I concur in regard to the goading influence of the Apartheid Zionist Entity in domestic American politics. Still, Saudi Arabia's' vicious anti-Shia policies (in Iran, Iraq, and throughout the Gulf region) -- policies backed up by America and all the money in the world -- deserved a prominent mention, unless I somehow missed that.
I disagree heartily, however, on the hateful subject of military conscription. A Draft would consume the same impoverished Americans that it does now but would just pay them less and get more of them killed. Thanks to the -- largely in vain -- sacrifices made by those of us who served in Draft-era Vietnam, eighteen-year-old citizens now have the right to vote. If and when they want their government to violate their Thirteenth Amendment freedom from slavery and involuntary servitude, they'll vote accordingly.
I got as far as the draft comment in this piece and could read no further.
My comment below was posted without reading any others.
I'm glad to see there are still others who remember the Constitution.
Thing is tho... The repeal of the draft made it less likely that the non-college kids would protest too much. It's made war more acceptable for the USA, not less. I understand where you're coming from, and to a point I agree with you.
The draft forces more people into thinking about the morality and the necessity of the war. I still think it makes war less likely to happen if the young knew that the idiocy of their elders would lead to their death or maiming. Bring the draft back and the soldiers would be coming home much sooner. Why else would the Caligula party oppose it?
(note, the Caligula party is what I propose as the new name for us to use when discussing the major party in the USA. You know the one with two right wings.)
I've been on the fence on this one for awhile, but I think I've made up my mind. The argument with reviving the draft is that more would oppose the mideast occupations, or at least think about them, for God's sake. But then I thought about the differences between the Vietnam War and our present War on a Noun, and realized that a lot more of our soldiers were getting killed in Vietnam than ours are in the Mideast, and although there was opposition, that war lasted 9 years or so, however you want to count it.
In these conflicts, we don't need that many soldiers. We're not slithering around in jungles; we've got clear terrain and lots of big, big stuff to blow stuff up with, often from great distance. A veteran of Iraq recently told me recruiters are now turning people down. They've got enough, thank you.
So why is the "Caligula party" opposed to the draft? Why do it? It could only serve to arouse a sleepy populous. There's plenty of kids with neither prospects nor any clear understanding of the politics behind the conflicts. Plenty of fodder without the draft.
Yes but the problem with your premise is that while less citizens of the United States of America are getting killed MORE Citizens are being killed and there more such wars being waged.
To "save" those American lives you sacrifice men women and children that have done the United States of America NO HARM.
Were there 50000 sent back to the USA in Body bags from Iraq, the US would not have started bombing Pakistan. they would not have invaded Libya. They would not be looking to make war on Iran.
It is because of those lower deaths that MORE countries and peoples become victim to US agrression. The underlying problem is you still see it as THEM versus us and while it not intentional you imply American lives more valuable.
If You add up the number of dead in Iraq, Pakistan , Libya Afghanistan , Somalia and include with that the 500000 dead to US sanctions in Iraq, you are pushing towards the number of Vietnamese those 50 some odd thousand Dead Americans had a hand in killing.
And it is because of those low US casualties that these wars see no end in sight and that will mean in fact MILLIONS more die at the hands of this all volunteer military.
Had the war against Vietnam only say 10000 US casualties they United States of America would STILL be killing those people or would have slaughtered milliosn more in order to force their will upon them.
It an unfortunate truth that if you do NOT want to see more children blown up in Afghanistan, there will have to be more dead US soldiers. That or the USA must go bankrupt and collapse as a nation state.
A truth. Tony
"I have felt from the outset that eliminating the draft merits a place toward the very top of the long list of President Richard Nixon’s missteps"
what gives here?
this McGovern is supposed to be intelligent.
conscription is against US law.
look it up: involuntary servitude.
"everyone is entitled to his own opinion but not to his own facts."
Let's face it...the rich war profiteers are so greedy raking it in that they don't care about the rest of us.
After all, the less of us there are, the more of the wealth becomes theirs....even though they (the 1 %) control almost 80 % of the net value and income of the U.S.
I cannot figure out, for the life of me, why the wanna-be rich still believe in the system. Maybe its the 'dumbing down' of our education system at all levels since Reagan was elected..when public ed at all levels became a 'privilege' and not a 'right'.
Few Americans receive an education in economics. so they just go along with the "experts" who have been lying and shafting us for decades.
Stop being such an idiot - as in living in your own world. People of the US, by your own definition, have just as much right as anybody else in the Western Hemisphere to call themselves Americans - whether you like it or not. If the Mexicans, Chileans, Argentinians, etc. or anybody else in the Western Hemisphere want to call themselves Americans more power to them. If that and your ignorant blanket condemnation are the best arguments you have against them - that is, Americans - you should perhaps look to your own education and consider that the best thing you can do is to sit down and not speak until spoken to.
Free speech dear....
Most people who live in the Americas would rather call the yanks 'Americans' and not bother to much about the issue. Why do you give a damn about what they call themselves anyhow? Does it really cause you any harm?
Why did you start commenting on this thread anyhow? You've not said anything about the substance of the article. You're just being arrogant enough to think you are entitled to tell people what to say.
Readbetweenthelines.... Hi again.
Another reason why I gave up on the Catholic Church as an institution a while ago.
General Jackie should be given kevlar vest, parachute & some firearms and parachuted into his proposed war zone.
And Clinton and Obama should be dropped in the same area as well.
We _must_ continue to remind our Congressional delegations that ISRAEL IS NOT OUR FRIEND!!
"But all the knowledge in the world is of no use to fools"
Thanks Ray for your peek into the septic tank of degenerates and buffoons who are at the heart of this abomination Pentagon Kill Industries Inc, the epitome of the moral degeneracy that infests this "society".
Long Road Out Of Eden (The Eagles)
Moon shining down through the palms
Shadows moving on the sand
Somebody whispering the twenty-third psalm
Dusty rifle in his trembling hands
Somebody trying just to stay alive
He got promises to keep
Over the ocean in Amerika
Far away and fast asleep
Silent stars blinking in the blackness of an endless sky
Cold silver satellites, ghostly caravans passing by
Galaxies unfolding, new worlds being born
Pilgrims and prodigals creeping toward the dawn
But it's a long road out of Eden
Music blasting from an SUV
On a bright and sunny day
Rolling down the interstate
In the good ol' USA
Having lunch at the petroleum club
Smokin' fine cigars and swappin' lies
He said: "gimme 'nother slice o' that barbecued brisket!"
"gimme 'nother piece o' that pecan pie!"
Freeways flickering, cell phones chiming a tune
We're riding to utopia, road map says we'll be arriving soon
Captains of the old order clinging to the reins
Assuring us these aches inside are only growing pains
But it's a long road out of Eden
Back home I was so certain
The path was very clear
But now I have to wonder: "what are we doing here?"
I'm not counting on tomorrow
And I can't tell wrong from right
But I'd give anything to be there in your arms tonight
Weaving down the Amerikan highway
Through the litter and the wreckage and the cultural junk
Bloated with entitlement, loaded on propaganda
And now we're driving dazed and drunk
Been down the road to Damascus,
The road to Mandalay
Met the ghost of Caesar on the Appian way
He said, "it's hard to stop this binging, once you get a taste."
"but the road to empire is a bloody stupid waste."
Behold the bitten apple - the power of the tools
But all the knowledge in the world is of no use to fools
And it's a long road out of Eden....