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TechnoratiItaly Convicts Former CIA Agents in Renditions Trial
The Americans were all tried in absentia after the United States refused to extradite them. But the verdict, the first of its kind, was welcomed by rights campaigners who have long complained the renditions policy violated basic human rights.
![[Egyptian cleric Abu Omar attends a trial over the CIA's "rendition" programme at a Milan courthouse in 2007. Abu Omar was snatched by CIA agents from a Milan street in 2003. An Italian judge has convicted 23 US and two Italian secret agents for the kidnapping. (AFP/File/Giuseppe Cacace)]](http://www.commondreams.org/files/article_images/italiancourt_rendition.jpg "italiancourt_rendition.jpg")
Judge Oscar Magi dropped the case against three Americans, including a former CIA Rome station chief, for the abduction of Egyptian-born cleric Hassan Mustafa Osama Nasr, who was snatched off a Milan street in 2003 and flown to Egypt for interrogation.
He also acquitted the former head of Italy's Sismi military intelligence service, Nicolo Pollari, and his former deputy, ruling that evidence against them violated state secrecy rules.
Magi sentenced the former head of the CIA's Milan station, Robert Seldon Lady, to eight years in prison and the other 22 former CIA agents to five years each.
He ruled that those convicted should paid 1 million euros in damages to Nasr, better known as Abu Omar, and 500,000 euros to his wife.
Abu Omar was secretly flown from Aviano airbase in northeast Italy via Ramstein base in Germany to Egypt, where he says he was tortured and held until 2007 without charge.
It is the first case of its kind to contest the practice of "extraordinary rendition" under the administration of former U.S. President George W. Bush, in which terrorism suspects were captured in one country and taken for questioning in another, where interrogation techniques were tougher.
(Reporting by Emilio Parodi and Daniel Flynn; writing by Daniel Flynn)
55 Comments so far
Show AllThe sad part is that they didn't get the ring leaders of the gang. Bush and Cheney. If Obama would do the right thing, bring Bush and his whole gang to trial, his rating with the decent people of this Country would be a full 100%.
Though I am not particularly fond of Italy (after all, they elected Berlusconi, who is a rotten scoundrel himself),
I still say, "Good for them!"
These C.I.A. guys who do "rendition" are among the worst of the worst.
I am an American, but if other Americans do something this horrid, then they deserve to spend years in prison.
I hear you but, the USA 'elected" Bush Jr. Twice. And now Obama is prety close to Bush Jr.s third term. Berlusconi is one of the riches men in the world and controls most TV stations in Italy. Italy has a PR voting system with a coalition govt., so they don't really elect their PM directly.
Maybe, someone else mentioned this already, but if not, Amy Goodman, this morning, interviewed the Italian prosecutor and Scott Horton (Harper's Magazine, No Comment) as well.
www.democracynow.org
A couple items of note: the Italian co-defendants were given a pass by the court, the Berlusconi government and the Italian judiciary have been a state of virtual war for years (and this is another battle ground).
Justice at last!! Better late than never.
However, the accompanying photo is not of Imam abu Omar as the caption claims but rather of his attorney Montasir Al-Zayyat. An error I thought AFP would be the last to commit!
Now the CIA will have a far more difficult time operating throughout the world, and now many more resources will be dedicated to tracking and documenting the CIA's moves. The people of the world will rally in the streets demanding their governments put even more resources into keeping tabs on the CIA, so the people can sleep more securely.
HOPEFULLY.
THE CIA across the world is like cockroaches that hide in the dark and cracks everywhere...
what's needed is for countries to EXPOSe them - Surround them - and show them UP for the citizens of those countries and DISPLAY THEM for what they are...
if even a dozen countries did that -- what's the USA going to do? invade them all at once. try to undermine their governments? how is it going to finance and man all that? while incurring more consequences unto itself ? it's going to impose "economic sanctions?"
Cuba Survived that and does pretty well , inspite of, by dealing with OTHER countries.
what's the USA going to do about that if even a FEW countries did that and show they're NOT intimidated and simply thumb their noses at the us Government?
they can do as well TRADING with EACH OTHER if the US tries to impose sanctions - and it's the USA that LOSES markets , considering that it is so nervous already for having lost markets to china or other countries beacuse of its own "IMPERIAL" efforts bleeding its own economy and its own people's industriousness.
if anything - EVERY STATE DEPARTMENT of the USA in other countries ought to be investigated - and their claims of "sovereign territory" be SUBJECTED to local laws of accountability TO the local governments and their people - and who the State department people are - EXACTLY what they are doing there. etc. etc. etc.
even if theywere NOT CIA - that ought to make the USA pay attention to the fact that it's NOT going to be allowed forever to do what it wishes to do with impunity IN other countries..and taht americans - if they even so much as have any connection with US government policies - are going to be WATCHED..jst as the CIA does to other people.
the USA likes to SPY on other countries?
its own SPIES ought to be WATCHED OPENLY and if citizens of other countries are made more aware by their own media and leaders that THAT is what's going to have to happen - it becomes a CONSCIOUS TOPIC of national discussion.
MAKE IT AN ISSUE.
and THAT"S how you expose COCKROACHES.
Well, bravo, Italy! We have a start.
An obvious next move for Italy would be to withdraw from whatever extradition treaties the US just violated.
Anyone have the details?
It's a shame our president won't send them to Italy for their punishment. Had these CIA agents truly loved their country they wouldn't have carried out the crimes they should know are against the law.
While we want our country kept safe, I don't believe the CIA is the organization to do it. They were too chummy with corporations and did too much of their bidding in the past and not protecting our country as they should have.
Those 23 belong in the Italian prisons.
Never Give Up.
The U.S. could alternatively imprison these former CIA agents and station head. If the U.S. was to let Italy do this, then I'm not sure, but it might not be the right place; maybe an or the international prison, if there is one, as opposed to just a detention facility, would be the right place if the U.S. wasn't going to imprison these criminals. And if the U.S. let Italy do this, then which country would pay the costs, the U.S., or Italy, or maybe through the U.N.? I don't know how the imprisonment is supposed to work, but the U.S. can certainly imprison these and other U.S. criminals even when their crimes are international. Otoh, that would make it easy for the U.S. to claim it has imprisoned its criminals, while really not doing so; perhaps giving them new names, some plastic surgery, and re-assignment. It'd take occasional inspectors by independent people or maybe a U.N. office, to make sure the U.S. really abided by the imprisonment of its convicted criminals. The U.S. might likely refuse to allow such inspections. It doesn't allow inspections of its nuclear arms facilities.
Hegemony rules even if the U.S. empire is on the downfall.
this is not so much what happens to THESe american CIAs that are BACK in the USA.
it is a question of what the indictment - challenging the "might of the Modern Rome - USA" has done:
and that is -
SHOULD - in teh futre, ANY CIA or imperial USA operative BE caught by other countries that have FEWER compunctions about proceeding with THEIR laws aginst any US displeasure -
and those CIA's are NOT in the USA -the USA will be STARING at
the reality of having AMERICANS being "detained" - Tried, convicted and jailed according to the laws of countries whose laws the USA has regularly trampled on or ignored or insulted.
and americans will SEE - what their own country has done ...removing "safety" and "immunity" from americans in other countries.
and then they wilL REALLY know what is FEAR when they go abroad.
and they will know the FEAR of the citizens of OTHER countries have long experienced UNDER the boots of american imperialism.
and then they will see how IMPOTENT their own politicians and Magnificent Army is in trying to "SAVE and PROTECT" americans ....!
Does Italy have military forces in the GWoT wars, complicit in these supreme international crimes with the U.S. and NATO?
If yes, then I don't see much for the challenging of U.S. empire that you mention. There's some, but in dark comedy fashion, for Italy would be convicting these former CIA agents and station head while being complict in a greater crime than they committed. Their crime is serious, but not as bad as wars of aggression.
why should it not?
you have missed one factor:
the USA's COURTS and MILITARY system have behaved like ONE UNIT in these affairs. promoting and enhancing and defending the USA's criminality.
the ITALIAN COURT - on the other hand DEFIED the Italian EXECUTIVE government's connivance with the USA in the "GWoT".
do you see the difference? .
in other words -- where Berlusconi went along with Bush - then Prodi "caught" the leftover of what Berlusconi's GOVERNMENT did : cooperation in the USA"s SO-called "GWot" but in reality wars of criminality - the Italian Court maintained its independence....
which is DIFFERENT from what the US Supreme court and US circuit courts have done - which is to keep "defending" or at best obfuscating through legal mumbo-jumbo the CRIMINALITY of the USA.
THAT"s a huge difference.
Small victory but a step in the right direction for sure. Let's hope that two things come out of this: (1) more countries follow suit; and (2) they go after the true perpetrators, Bush and Dickie and they don't stop till they're both hanging from the gallows.
Thnk about it:
SINCE THE USA has the most "spies" and operatives around the globe -- CIA< NSA, under "STATE DEPARTMENT" - etc....
this opens the door for indictments of AMERICANS doing the CORRUPT business of US EMPIRE abroad.
imagine a dozen countries DARING the USA to "save" CIA operatives that countries CATCH - for any reason - and for their own motives - try them, hold them incommunicado, convict them, jail them ..
the USA is going to SEND ARMIES to a dozen countries?
what IF RUSSIA does that --
what if CHINA does that - can you imagine the USA trheatening china if china does that ...mobilizing the USA seventh Fleet in the pacific - and china unleashes its at MINIMUM
300 MILLION INTERNET SAVVY "netizens" against America's Technological and computer infrastructure?
that ALONE would bring the United States and its ENTIRE military empire near china IMPOTENT!
what if N Korea does that finding "american spies in korean waters"..
what if Algeria, and many others that the USA has crossed do that...the USA is going to INVADE? bomb them?
this is getting more and more laughable..if it wasn't so frightening and tragic how the USA has placed itself and the world in a living HELL...
and it IS the UNITED states that has done that.
the USA needs to STOP PROVOKING the rest of the world with its Imperial ambitions.
bravo! this is just a good start. likely to move these
renditions other countries not in europe.
What's with all these previews?
Good for Italy is what I say!
AD
Good for Italy is what I say!
AD
I know for a fact from news and from italians who have lived and were born there or who have families in italy - that the GREAT MAJORITY of Italians DO NOT WANT American Military presence in their country.
Who really does? Other than Israhell, can you name one?
Tom Edgar.
One thing overlooked. Now that they are convicted they can be arrested and extradited from ANY European Union country.
This SHOULD be a real megaton blast of reality for Gringolandia: Italy, where a flatulently fascist pedophile reins supreme has found the Gringos' SweetiePie boys guilty of what amounts in anyone's lexicon to crimes against humanity.
But of course the gringos will keep right on beating their chests and claiming that they are the spiritual and ethical guides on the planet.
A pile of steaming horsehit.
Or maybe, they'll call on Congress to pass a resolution unanimously voting down the veredict.
Bravissimo!!
I had an aquaintance in the FAA who flew with Air America in Viet Nam. He had the rank of a marine colonel and he told me a truth that anyone who ever worked for the CIA knows. There is no such thing as a FORMER CIA agent. The pay might stop but the instructions and control never do. And yes, lots of people in the military are CIA.
"There is no such thing as a FORMER CIA agent."
Usama bin Laden.
Lee H. Oswald.
Don't forget William F. Buckley.
Honorable mention might go to Dan Rather as well (see JFK bites the dust- Dan Rather becomes media darling).
Time and Newsweek might as well be official CIA/Wall Street /Mossad funded publications (Zionists-R-US). The puff piece on Lieberman, the PR piece on the upside of depression, and the Orwellian piece on why it's really, really logical and okay that Wall Street is going up while you don't have a job and other bullshit PR never stops from these shills.
This is good news. As an expat living in Italy, a country of contradictions, I'd say the Italian judiciary is quite independent of the other branches of government, unlike the US (see CD articles of Greenwald and Goodman today). (Btw, it was the center-left government of Romano Prodi which originally approved the US plan to expand the base in Vicenza.) Also, IMHO, Italians are influenced by their value of the quality of compassion for human suffering, perhaps one good thing which has come out of the historical dominance of the Catholic Church here. How appropriate that this news from Italy appears today next to the articles about the betrayal of human rights of the Canadian Syrian by officials of both law enforcement and the courts in the name of the National Security State. I see the American legacy of puritanism (along with its xenophobia, perhaps resulting in part from its insular geography) contributing to such heartless behavior (to say nothing of the Protestant Ethic and the Spirit of Capitalism). I can't help remembering the kidnapping of Manifesto journalist Giuliana Sgrena in Iraq and the negotiation of her release. I can't stand Berlusconi, but I'm sure he was instrumental in getting the ransom together for her captors. (Until recently, kidnapping was big business here.) Then after this horrible ordeal, on the way to the airport, her car gets shot at by American soldiers, but she is saved by Nicolo Calipari, top agent for the Italian secret service, shielding her from the bullets and sacrificing his own life. We Americans, of course, "don't negotiate with terrorists." And if we did, can you imagine some top CIA guy taking the lead for, say, Amy Goodman? On another note, sorry to say that from what I can see here, plenty of Italians and other Europeans have bought a lot of the hype about Obama.
I had the great privilege of having sat down and conversed for a number of times - over a few months - with a very , very old Italian gentleman ....he was amazingly sprightly, lithe, clear-eyed (didn't even wear glasses) , a spectacularly sharp mind and memory , extremely well-read and traveled, and in his working life was a Nautical Engineer. he regularly read world news - in five different languages -
i recall his words - although I paraphrase:
"what is happening in the world and the USA today - i have seen before with my own brothers when we were growing up...
we played as teenagers in the town squares in italy when the Fascists marched through ..when they put up the banners of fascism...and we were all already sure of what was to come...this is now happening in the United States....IT has become today's Imperial Rome...I SHOULD KNOW...because I have always been studying History -- and I KNOW what an Empire becomes....because I am ROMAN...
we in the WEST have much to be sorry for what WE have done in the world...we wanted the resources of other countries to ENRICH ourselves...and we went to their lands - but LEFT their people denied of their own wealth while WE plundered them...and THEN we are surprised that THEY come to our shores, in ITaly, the USA< Europe. but that is because of what WE have done to them...more than their faults - it is WE in th WEST who have the greatest corruptions and our leaders of corruption..we went abroad to plunder rather than help them and so when they come -- in any manner - those are the consequences of what we have done".
that gentleman , when i sat and talked with him, was already 103 years old. who had seen BOTH world wars..
I mostly agree. However, the current situation here in the USA is that 95% are worried about paying bills. All those jingoistic propaganda manifest destiny PR games are becoming a memory for 95% of the population. The top 5% are still drinking their own kool-aid.
See an article by John Stanton at Counterpunch (Social Decay in America). It covers the last 30 years quite well.
Extradition only works one way with the US, especially CIA members. The Berlusconi govt. will likely do nothing about this.
Symbolically, this is good. As other comments point out, they will not be able to travel to many European counties. (However I am sure the British authorities will turn a blind eye) At least one of the provinces of the Empire is sybolically challenging its authority.
I'm sorry but I don't think it is a question of blind eyes under the new EU rules, a fugitive in UK is the same as a fugitive in Rome. The arrest warrents are pan European and the police are OBLIGED to act when they are made aware of a fugitive. No politics in it!
As an aside, it's a shame that America cannot apply justice with the same division between state and judiciary given "US Court Denies Maher Arar's Appeal" (http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2009/11/02-6)
on just the same question of being kidnapped to be tortured in another country..... American courts say they cannot dare to second guess the crimes of their executive. That is why the USA is now a fascist state, no longer founded in law.
No politics in it? In theory you are totatlly correct, see:
http://ec.europa.eu/justice_home/fsj/criminal/extradition/fsj_criminal_extradition_en.htm
However in practice...
For example, a UK Judge issued an arrest warrant for an Israeli war criminal in 2005, but before he arrived, he was tipped off in advance by someone in Tony Blairs govt. and went back to Israel. This is how politics always can find a way in.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2005/sep/12/israelandthepalestinians.warcrimes
I agree.
I wish this would kick start the rousting out of CIA assets in foreign news media and governments. If one outfit needs to be personae non grata in the world, it's the corporate mafia's enforcement arm, the CIA.
EXACTLY - as AGG and others say:
it is an OPENING. it is the CIA's and USA"s "imperial SS" forces having their own measure of come-uppance..that they can no longer "move" around with impunity without having to look behind their back - not because of their secrecies - but because
COUNTRIES CAN and WILL begin to ASSERT themselves against US dictates...and - at the least - BIND the hands of the US imperial "arm".
furthermore - it makes clear to OTHER countries -- the "USA IS NO LONGER EXEMPTED" and no longer can rely completely on "tacit, abject, obedience" EVEN by governments that are intimidated by the USA.
it's like anything else --
the "mob rule" can also work in this case.
for example:
if even ONE major country makes a concerted effort to have a "RUN ON THE DOLLAR" you can watch countries, investors, follow suit -- looking for the exit. because it is like yelling "FIRE" in a crowded theatre.
this can also apply to this instance of CIA being brought to trial OPENLY and no longer subject to "backroom deals and armtwisting" by the USA institutions, politicians, and state department.
it really does only take a PEBBLE at times to begin an avalanche....
it only takes a small hole to destroy even the strongest "WALL" to keep the sea from coming in .
all people have to remember is the courage .
all people have to remember is the classic story of the BOY that put his finger in the hole to keep the ocean from flooding the Netherlands...remove that finger - and .........
in this case -- the "WALL" holding against indicting CIA and other USA imperial operatives - is the "power of the USA"...
an italian judge was all it took to say :
"GUILTY".
and that Italian Judge - following in the magnificent and great tradition of TRUTHFUL application of justice as the Ancient Romans developed - despite their many flaws :
as for example:
"HABEAS CORPUS" -- "give us the body" - "the evidence" ..and BY THAT make the judgement....
he has UPHELD the Grandest and greatest tradition given to the world by the Romans....which, even if THEY also failed in ways to follow it- nevertheless provided a foundation for many of the world's greatest social laws.
JUSTICE found through Seeking TRUTH.
and in that sense -- this Italian Judge - is a ROMAN in the BEST sense of the word.
his people should be PROUD of him .
Yeah, and Berlusconi fits right in with the mafia types, no stereotype intended, but if the shoe fits...
Hey, this is proof that empires can convert into law abiding nations. What was once Rome is now Italy. They tortured and killed Jesus and now they convict those who torture. There is hope for the US.
Let's hope it doesn't take the US as long as Rome did to become a law-abiding nation.
Or that they don't have to torture and kill Jesus...all over again. Oh, actually, they may have already done that.
EXACTLY.
we have to remember that the complicated rules of "giving justice" ALSO to the INDICTED or accused - in THIS case - the CIA operatives -
required the judge had access to and be completely persuaded by the fullness of the cases - therefore having to acquit some, while convicting some.
that is the way justice should be, EVEN for the accused,,, or ESPECIALLY for the accused.
but when the judge DID find the cases persuasive - to convict - he showed his COURAGE
and RESPECT for the ROMAN LAW - the magnificent body of social "proof" against an accused "HABEAS CORPUS" - "show us the body"...
in other words, "hearsay, whispers, opinion, gossip, reputation of the accused" are NOT enough - SHOW US THE BODY - SHOW US THE EVIDENCE of teh specific crime...
is what the Judge upheld - as a TRUE ROMAN in the best sense.
and the BEST of the ROMANS of ancient rome would be PROUD that they - despite the horrific brutalities their empire brought to many - DID birth some magnificent heritage to the world.
and HE is a living example of it.
and the greater for applying what a truthfully honest or JUST ROMAN of his times or of ancient times might have done:
that EVEN against the IMPERIAL ROME - and TODYA against the IMPERIAL USA -
TRUTH MUST BE UPHELD above all.
and if the CIA is GUILTY - IT IS guilty ..ANCIENT ROME or
"USA MODERN ROME".
Yep. No matter how corrupt and murderous a government is, there are always good people within fighting for justice. However, the following scenarios seem to dominate our countries.
Rome went from Republic to Empire to Cosa Nostra.
The USA went from Republic to Empire to Cosa Nostra to KOSHER NOSTRA.
There are some interesting side affects to this. These convicts and now fugitives from law will now have their mugshots permenantly plastered all through Europe in Interpol connected law enforcement agencies. These CIA cronies will not be able to freely travel and are practically useless to the CIA in Europe now.
Good news!
Note the unsurprising pattern: the "tops" get let off, while the foot soldiers are nailed. Still, even that would be an improvement over business-as-usual, *if* they actually were apprehended.
Don't hold your breath. I'm sure our Pretendgressives and War Liberals in the "Democratic" Party will have nothing to say about this, considering that their photogenic phoney in the White House still endorses rendition.
---------------------------------
I would rather vote for what I want and not get it, than vote for what I don't want and get that. -- Eugene V. Debs
I was in Italy this summer, and was surprised to find a HUGE US Navy base in Naples.
Maybe Italy should tell the US to hand over the CIA convicts, or get their fascist base off their property.
"The only means of strengthening one's intellect is to make up one's mind about nothing, to let the mind be a thoroughfare for all thoughts." - John Keats
There is 60% (not a typo, sixty percent) unemployment in Naples. The Italian government does not want the US military to leave. There are hookers entwined around every lamp post, and pickpockets on every bus. We must think of their jobs and opportunities and their economic well being.
Cheese puppies,
i'm not a fan of Kent Shaw but what idiot flagged this comment?
Flag the spam, not the people.
Add the air force bases at Aviano and Vicenza. They are currently expanding the Vicenza base amid hostile locals protesting. Berlusconi is all for it, of course. So instead of kicking out the imperialists, the Berlusconi govt. approved more expansion. Berlusconi is up for trial though, his immunity has been overtuned by an Italian court and no appeals, looks like he is going to trial after all.
So the sons of Kissinger will not be able to travel as far and as wide as they once did--good!
Poet
And how many of these CIA criminals will actually serve time in an Italian prison?
Last I had heard, the US is willing to use military force against any country that tries to hold a US soldier or operative in prison after trial.
I guess I am saying: "Bomb, bomb, bomb. Bomb, bomb Milan." (No apologies to McCain)
I believe all of them were tried in absentia. So it is unlikely they will serve time in Italy. However, we do have an extradition treaty with Italy.
The US spinmeisters have a hard choice. If they make a big aggressive fuss about the conviction in Italy, it looks really bad to the rest of the world. (I am not sure how much our image really matters anymore). The US may choose to ignore the cases, try to cast doubt on the verdict, or simply say they have no knowledge of the convictees or their whereabouts.
Or they can cite national security concerns. That works to dismiss any sort of attempt at justice.
Joe
Joe sez:
"Or they can cite national security concerns. That works to dismiss any sort of attempt at justice."
*****************
In that case wouldn't it be totally cool if someone managed to extrordinarily render some or all of these convicted felons to Italy. What's the US gonna say when others follow its example and turn the tables? What's the US gonna do? Commit acts of violence, issue vitriolic diatribes, or break relations--in other words behave like a terrorist? Italy is a part of both NATO and the EU so it's a little tricky to do any such things.
Poet
Yes, it would be great if the agents could be involuntarily extracted from the USA.
However, I don't think it will happen for the following reasons:
1) The CIA is a criminal organisation. They kill people. Anyone who is going to "do a number" on the CIA is taking on a lot.
2) The CIA is expert at hiding things and people. Here in the USA, they can change your entire history all the way back to the birth certificate with no questions asked. Departments of motor vehicles, Social Security employment reccords, medical records, legal records, school history, year books, address paper trails can all be changed WITHOUT the knowledge of state and local employees. They can get into any file in a computer or physical file cabinet in any building in the USA and you will never know it. That's one their main areas of expertise. Forgery and counterfeiting laws are for us, not them. They ignore inconvenient laws.
3) The DUH factor. Everybody knows the CIA spies, bribes, blackmails, extorts, buys and kills. Their employees lie as a matter of routine. What can you add to that?
The CIA is destroying the USA.
It must be pointed out that the CIA was the creation of Wall Street advertising execs coming in from serving as OSI heads, the Dulles brothers and Prescott Bush, the grandfather of George W. Bush.
So this is institutional, generational evil that goes deep into the power structures of the Corporations, Wall Street banking and the Washington elite.
"It must be pointed out that the CIA was the creation of Wall Street advertising execs coming in from serving as OSI heads, the Dulles brothers and Prescott Bush, the grandfather of George W. Bush."
Wow Galenwainwright, I didn't know Prescott Bush was OSI/CIA involved. Thanks for the info. Explains why his son George H.W.Bush was placed as Director of CIA. The unconstitutional ability of CEO's to wiretap everybody (especially small business) under the guise of "necessary for national security" is nothing short of racketeering IMHO. These guys think they are kings and have destroyed the USA.
TJ
"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent." - Thomas Jefferson