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Is David Petraeus a 'Lying Liar' About the Drawdown?
"Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them" was former non-Senator Al Franken's 2003 examination of the lies and distortions of right-wing pundits and politicians.
Such a book, if it were written today, should certainly include a fair and balanced look at some of the lying liars still running our foreign policy: in particular, at Mr. David Petraeus. (Mr. Franken might not be the best candidate for writing such a book today, given that he voted recently against Senator Feingold's amendment requiring the President to establish a timetable for military withdrawal from Afghanistan, even as Democratic leaders like Senator Durbin supported Feingold's amendment.)
Harsh words about Mr. Petraeus? Yes. Justified? Absolutely.
Consider: Mr. Petraeus has been leading a campaign of "domestic information operations" to browbeat Congress and the American people to accept limiting the size of, and possibly even a delay of, the drawdown of US troops from Afghanistan in July 2011that President Obama promised when he acceded to the military's demand for a "surge" of 30,000 troops in Afghanistan last fall.
In a recent interview with NBC's "Meet the Press," Petraeus implied that he might recommend against any withdrawal of US forces next summer, causing the White House to reaffirm its commitment to the July 2012 deadline in response, saying, "The date is not negotiable."
"Certainly, yes," [Petraeus] said when the show's host, David Gregory, asked him if, depending on how the war was proceeding, he might tell the president that a drawdown should be delayed.
These words make David Petraeus a 'lying liar.' Because asking for more time if the "surge" didn't work within 18 months is exactly what David Petraeus promised not to do when the "surge" was decided.
As Newsweek reported, in an excerpt from Jonathan Alter's book "The Promise" (all emphasis mine):
Obama was moving ... toward conclusions and eventually presidential orders. This would not be a five- to seven-year nation-building commitment, much less an open-ended one. The time frame the military was offering for both getting in and getting out must shrink dramatically, he said. There would be no nationwide counterinsurgency strategy; the Pentagon was to present a "targeted" plan for protecting population centers, training Afghan security forces, and beginning a real - not a token - withdrawal within 18 months of the escalation.On Sunday, Nov. 29, having made his decision, the president decided to hold a final Oval Office meeting with the Pentagon brass and commanders in the region who would carry out his orders. He wanted to put it directly to the military: Gates, Mullen, Cartwright, Petraeus, and national-security adviser Jim Jones, without any of the others. Obama asked Biden to come back early from Thanksgiving in Nantucket to join him for the meeting.
As they walked along the portico toward the Oval Office, Biden asked if the new policy of beginning a significant withdrawal in 2011 was a direct presidential order that couldn't be countermanded by the military. Obama said yes.
[...]
Inside the Oval Office, Obama asked Petraeus, "David, tell me now. I want you to be honest with me. You can do this in 18 months?""Sir, I'm confident we can train and hand over to the ANA [Afghan National Army] in that time frame," Petraeus replied. "Good. No problem," the president said. "If you can't do the things you say you can in 18 months, then no one is going to suggest we stay, right?"
"Yes, sir, in agreement," Petraeus said.
"Yes, sir," Mullen said.
[...]
The president then encapsulated the new policy: in quickly, out quickly, focus on Al Qaeda, and build the Afghan Army. "I'm not asking you to change what you believe, but if you don't agree with me that we can execute this, say so now," he said. No one said anything."Tell me now," Obama repeated.
"Fully support, sir," Mullen said.
"Ditto," Petraeus said.
[...]
If conditions didn't stabilize enough to begin an orderly withdrawal of U.S. forces (or if they deteriorated further), that would undermine the Pentagon's belief in the effectiveness of more troops. The commanders couldn't say they didn't have enough time to make the escalation work because they had specifically said, under explicit questioning, that they did.
As far as I am aware, Mr. Petraeus has never disputed Mr. Alter's account of these events.
And as far as I am aware, no reporter has asked Mr. Petraeus during his current media tour about the contradiction between his current advocacy for delaying the withdrawal and his "Yes, sir" under explicit questioning that he would not ask for more time. I look forward to being corrected on this point.
No doubt, some will respond cynically to the blatant contradiction between what Petraeus is saying now and what he said in November. "So, Petraeus is a lying politician - what else is news?" But the point is that while Petraeus acts like a lying politician, he is treated by the mainstream media as if he were beyond politics, above criticism, merely a professional military man giving his neutral, unbiased, impartial professional military advice. That lack of scrutiny makes Petraeus a more dangerous liar than a politician.
A friend claims he has a reliable method for getting kicked off a jury. When the judge asks him if he is more likely to believe the testimony of a policeman over that of any other citizen, my friend will say that he is less likely to believe the testimony of a policeman, explaining that policemen, compared to other citizens, are almost never prosecuted for perjury, so they have less disincentive to lie under oath, and a person evaluating a policeman's testimony compared to other testimony should take that into account.
The same considerations apply to Mr. Petraeus' treatment by the media. Because they subject him to less scrutiny than they do to ordinary politicians, even when he is making political statements - and the decision to withdraw or not to withdraw troops is fundamentally a political decision, not a military one - Petraeus has less disincentive to lie than other politicians.
This week, the number of U.S. deaths in the Afghanistan war since President Obama took office surpassed the number of deaths under President Bush (download a web counter here; spread the news here.)
This should be the occasion for a fundamental rethink of what we are doing in Afghanistan, including a debate on establishing a timetable to complete a military withdrawal. The last thing we need to be doing now is handing over decision-making to an unelected leader named David Petraeus. If his clear statement in November that he would not ask for more time cannot now be trusted, why should we now trust anything else he has to say about questions that are fundamentally political, especially the drawdown?
Meanwhile, Fairness and Accuracy in Reporting is appealing to NBC to have a guest on "Meet the Press" to talk about the war besides Mr. Petraeus and his disciples. You can support FAIR's effort here.


25 Comments so far
Show AllJust as the tiny acorn contains the blueprint for the tree that's yet to unfold, the moment any enterprise begins works like that seed to establish the nature of its future manifestation.
A war begun on false pretenses is by nature, flawed. It is a poisonous seed that can produce nothing other than a barren harvest.
That major politicians and their partners in the MIC global crime complex lie is part of the job description.
There is a saying in the spiritual world that's quite apt: "All of the ill-begotten wealth will have to be given back."
The lust for militarism in raw pursuit of others' assets has brought the homeland security state to its virtual knees. Yet still the merchants of greed, along with their calamitously brutal uniformed brigades, march forward into the (moral, ecological, and financial) abyss.
Although most minds have been trained to disregard the dots (in plain sight) that quiver for recognition, the now evident acceleration of deadly climate events will soon teach those who traffic in absolute power, what their absolute corruption means. And costs.
Watch for falling debris.
"A war begun on false pretenses is by nature, flawed. It is a poisonous seed that can produce nothing other than a barren harvest."
Actually, the war in Afghanistan was not begun on false pretenses. The invasion was intended to capture Osama bin Laden, and destroy his training camp. They bungled the first, but accomplished the second goal (by driving the camps to other places).
Continuing the war after that is the problem.
SHEEP: I don't agree with your assessment. First of all, Osama was nearly handed over but that outcome was not even allowed because unless he remained at large, the necessary poster boy for war would have been lost. Second, your comment presumes that Osama was truly responsible for the attacks on the World Trade Center. I don't buy it, never did... not since I saw the buildings come apart on that fateful day.
Incidentally, the numerology of 9-11-2010 is exactly the same as that of 9-11-2001; and in the I Ching, its sum of 23 references the Kua/Hexagram known as "Splitting Apart." It will be interesting to see what occurs this year. (I do not wish for anything like the previous event.)
It's been reported that Osama bin Laden and some of his top aides were flown out of Afghanistan shortly after we invaded on a jumbo jet containing Pakistani nationals, military officers and intelligence personnel. The Bush White House expressly prevented Americans from checking that flight so that, as well as subsequent events, would suggest that, as you say, the Bushies wanted bin Laden to stay free for his propaganda value to the Bush war effort. If Osama had been captured, Americans might have started wondering why we're still in Afghanistan, and the profit margins of our MIC and private contractors wouldn't abide that.
You don't go to war against an entire country just to capture or kill one person. Unless you're the US, that is. We did it in Iraq, we did it in Afghanistan, we do anywhere we damn well please. They found Saddam and hanged him, but destroyed an entire country to accomplish this one pathetic goal, which could have been achieved far less violently. Of course, to be consistent, if Saddam deserved hanging (and I'm not doubting it), Bush and Cheney deserved it no less, since they did thousands of times more harm to Iraq than Saddam did. And Iraq won't recover for generations, if ever. As for Osama, even the CIA doubts he was centrally instrumental in 9/11. He was just the convenient fall guy for invading Afghanistan, a country he was merely reportedly holed up in, not his native state of Saudi Arabia, easily the most repressive of all Arab states but a friend to US oil interests, so untouchable by our war machine. Dead or alive, Osama merely served as phantom boogyman to satisfy uninformed Americans' lust for an enemy to justify perpetual bombing raids on defenseless people anywhere. It's the national hobby.
Considering that the 9/11 hijackers were Saudis and their only connection to Afghanistan was training camps located there, the invasion had no potential to improve security of Americans or even revenge the deaths of the 9/11 victims.
Get real. If we had actually wanted the late Osama bin Laden, we would have him. You are naive to believe the overt reasons (lies, all) and ignore the covert reasons: Establish and protect pipeline from central Asia (for the corporations), restore poppy cultivation and heroin trade (for the CIA), and access to the next strategic targets, Iran and Pakistan (for the war machine). As for training camps--still there, just more of them and in more countries. Both starting and continuing the war are war crimes.
"Watch for falling debris."
I stay in the house these days as much as I can.
Siouxrose,
I see you had a birthday recently. Best wishes for happiness. And compatriots who are better spellers.
Your reference to 'dots' has piqued my curiosity. I always try to be a careful observer of my environment, and 'dots' are one of my favorite forms to observe. But there are several kinds of dot out there to see.
Are you referring to the ones that long to be united in order to manifest a last ditch salvation of the earth? Or different ones? I hope you don't mind my nosiness.
IOWA: Maybe a shrink would delve deeper, but I merely use "dots" because they function as a useful euphemism. The image evoked prompts people to connect areas of inquiry they don't usually bridge together. If you can come up with a better allusion, as a writer, I'm open ears to it.
Thanks for the birthday wishes.
I point out spelling errors because these generally alert us to those posters who just shoot off (generally uninformed) opionions straight from the hip. A curious corollary can be found in the fact that recent unearthed documents streaming back to the McCarthy days (specifically: similar campaigns intent upon spying on citizens) reveal that the goons of that era also could not spell. Clues, my friend, clues.
Good point, Siouxrose. As the signage at the various Tea Party rallies attest -- "Get a Brain, Morans!" and "Obama's a Muslin!" for example -- the further on the lunatic right you dwell, the worse your spelling becomes. Another hint comes with the ALL CAPS emails and other missives from the neoliths. I still have no idea why they think writing an entire email or posting a comment in ALL CAPS somehow makes their point better than standard u/lc, but that's another mystery for the ages. A psychologist friend says the misspelling of simple words is an indication of a disorganized mind in conflict with itself -- that would seem to be borne out by the crazed contradictions of the righties (i.e.: they want strict adherence to the Constitution, except when it comes to their pet peeve, and denying something they know to be true just to make their argument sound logical).
Of course, all of us slip occasionally in the spelling department -- you typed 'opionions' by accident. ;)
"Is David Petraeus a 'Lying Liar' About the Drawdown?"
___________________________
I assume so, since he's a successful general and Imperial Warlord.
You know what they say about the first casualty of "war". In fact, just CALLING Amerikan orgies of substantially unilateral military ultra-violence in foreign lands "war" is a lie in and of itself.
BTW, the author seems to have carefully chosen to refer to the Über-General as "Mr." instead of "General" in the article. If he wasn't published here so often, I'd suspect that Robert Naiman is from the future, and forgot that presidential candidate "Mr. Petraeus" was once a general.
PS: At least "Petraeus" is spelled correctly here; it rivals the word "lose" for frequency of misspelling on the Internets.
Also: "there" for "their" and "they're".
Also: chose for choose
to for too and two
Nazi's for Nazis
it's for its, and vice versa eternally
then for than
distain for disdain
your for you're
speach for speech
truely for truly
Ghandi for Gandhi
disasterous for disastrous
here for hear
lead for led
about 12 dozen misspellings of Al Qaeda (or al Qaida)
Emmanuel for Emanuel
phase for faze
lightening for lightning
...to list a few
You are right. It was deliberate, since a key theme of the piece was that when Mr. Petraeus functions as a politician, the media should not show him any more deference than they would any other politician or citizen. Hence "Mr."
I knew it was no accident or oversight. Thanks for the clarification!
It's been said Mr. Gen. Petraeus also has political amibitions -- he'd like to be president someday, God forbid. His 'surge' policy in Iraq basically came down to bribing the various hostile factions not to attack us; he's had less success with that in Afghanistan. The emphasis on 'training' the military and law enforcement is a specious dodge -- the Iraqi troops aren't 'trained' anymore than the Afghanis are. The fact the American military and Big Media refuse to admit is that no Iraqi or Afghani wants to die for our grand pacification schemes in the Middle East and the profits of multi-national corporations -- hell, most of our own troops don't want to die for that, either. The great historian Barbara Tuchman had it right 30 years ago in her book "The March of Folly: From Troy to Vietnam." Here she is writing about our futile involvement in Vietnam:
"In its first stage, mental standstill fixes the principles and boundaries governing a political problem. In the second stage, when dissonances and failing function begin to appear, the initial principles rigidify. This is the period when, if wisdom were operative, re-examination and re-thinking and a change of course are possible, but they are rare as rubies in a backyard. Rigidifying leads to increase of investment and the need to protect egos; policy founded upon error multiplies, never retreats. The greater the investment and the more involved in it the sponsor’s ego, the more unacceptable is disengagement." [...]
"…[C]ounterinsurgency in operation did not live up to the high-minded zeal of the theory. All the talk was of ‘winning the allegiance’ of the people to their government, but a government for which allegiance had to be won by outsiders was not a good gamble." [...]
"For the ruler it is easier, once he has entered a policy box, to stay inside. For the lesser official it is better, for the sake of his position, not to make waves, not to press evidence that the chief will find painful to accept. Psychologists call the process of screening out discordant information ‘cognitive dissonance,’ an academic disguise for ‘Don’t confuse me with the facts.’… [Cognitive dissonance means any alternative will be] deselected since even thinking about them entails conflicts."
Does any of this sound familiar to what we're hearing about Afghanistan today? Winning hearts and minds? Rigidity of thinking? ("We must stay in Afghanistan until the Afghan army can stand on its own" is the same thing LBJ and Nixon said about the corrupt South Vietnamese ARVN.) The old axiom is our military always fights the last war -- they are, and it's one we lost.
(Mr. Franken might not be the best candidate for writing such a book today, given that he voted recently against Senator Feingold's amendment requiring the President to establish a timetable for military withdrawal from Afghanistan
It is indeed interesting to see what happens to people once they get some power.
Agreed.
The last Al Franken radio show I listened to, was the morning that he praised the assault on Fallujah. This was after it was known that white phosphorous had been used, and after it was known that US forces had seized the main hospital.
He had his Senate run firmly in mind, and decided that he needed solid war mongering credentials.
Surely his USO tours that year had something to do with that as well.
Franken, really is a Schmuck.
Franken's sell-outs has got to be one of the quickest in recorded history, though!
What else would you expect from a professional war criminal ?
Withdrawal will come when the billions that the elite have poured into that country, same as Iraq, can be protected , and secured,,
we are the global war machine/ investment rebuilding security police of every war thats going to happen in country's we want to develop all over the world.
THE United Stazi of America will keeps its people inline as the war mongering elite use our blood, treasure and future tax dollars to build their wealth while they turn America into a third world country of poor wages.
They will use the patriot act to shut people up or incarcerate them.
They will crush the constitution and all religion in this country.
If Christians allow Mosques not to be built, people who cant stand religions will stop all churches from being built.
And all you right wing religious torture freaks will end up in jail, which you should anyway, just turn your selves in and end gang stalking.
Its secret groups like the stazi, and the people who pay them , that are stopping the American constitution from protecting all of us from a Fascist corporate dictatorship.
Fear , and war on criminals , where ever they are , will ruin this nation.
Terrorism requires global police action, not war
War locks countrys down.They take our money , and our freedoms, and give us false security.
But what do I know, I am just a gang stalking victim of the United Stazi of America three years 24/7 , because I Protest the wars every week, and comment on this web site every day, because the constitution lets me.
But I am paying the horrifying price of being destroyed by cointel pro gang stalking torture freaks.
Welcome to the land of the Stazi , and the home of torture freaks.
How dare you question the integrity of General Petraeus!
I mean, get with the program, there's a reason why his nickname is General 'Betray us' (The 'us' of 'Betray us' can also be read as US, as in United States.)
Of course he's a lying liar!
So many have beaten me to it, but as Mr Rogers might say:
Can you say President Petraeus?
not without gagging.