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WikiLeaks: US Targets EU Over GM Crops
US embassy cable recommends drawing up list of countries for 'retaliation' over opposition to genetic modification
The US embassy in Paris advised Washington to start a military-style trade war against any European Union country which opposed genetically modified (GM) crops, newly released WikiLeaks cables show.
In response to moves by France to ban a Monsanto GM corn variety in late 2007, the ambassador, Craig Stapleton, a friend and business partner of former US president George Bush, asked Washington to penalise the EU and particularly countries which did not support the use of GM crops.
"Country team Paris recommends that we calibrate a target retaliation list that causes some pain across the EU since this is a collective responsibility, but that also focuses in part on the worst culprits.
"The list should be measured rather than vicious and must be sustainable over the long term, since we should not expect an early victory. Moving to retaliation will make clear that the current path has real costs to EU interests and could help strengthen European pro-biotech voices," said Stapleton, who with Bush co-owned the St Louis-based Texas Rangers baseball team in the 1990s.
In other newly released cables, US diplomats around the world are found to have pushed GM crops as a strategic government and commercial imperative.
Because many Catholic bishops in developing countries have been vehemently opposed to the controversial crops, the US applied particular pressure to the pope's advisers.
Cables from the US embassy in the Vatican show that the US believes the pope is broadly supportive of the crops after sustained lobbying of senior Holy See advisers, but regrets that he has not yet stated his support. The US state department special adviser on biotechnology as well as government biotech advisers based in Kenya lobbied Vatican insiders to persuade the pope to declare his backing. "… met with [US monsignor] Fr Michael Osborn of the Pontifical Council Cor Unum, offering a chance to push the Vatican on biotech issues, and an opportunity for post to analyse the current state of play on biotech in the Vatican generally," says one cable in 2008.
"Opportunities exist to press the issue with the Vatican, and in turn to influence a wide segment of the population in Europe and the developing world," says another.
But in a setback, the US embassy found that its closest ally on GM, Cardinal Renato Martino, head of the powerful Pontifical Council for Justice and Peace and the man who mostly represents the pope at the United Nations, had withdrawn his support for the US.
"A Martino deputy told us recently that the cardinal had co-operated with embassy Vatican on biotech over the past two years in part to compensate for his vocal disapproval of the Iraq war and its aftermath – to keep relations with the USG [US government] smooth. According to our source, Martino no longer feels the need to take this approach," says the cable.
In addition, the cables show US diplomats working directly for GM companies such as Monsanto. "In response to recent urgent requests by [Spanish rural affairs ministry] state secretary Josep Puxeu and Monsanto, post requests renewed US government support of Spain's science-based agricultural biotechnology position through high-level US government intervention."
It also emerges that Spain and the US have worked closely together to persuade the EU not to strengthen biotechnology laws. In one cable, the embassy in Madrid writes: "If Spain falls, the rest of Europe will follow."
The cables show that not only did the Spanish government ask the US to keep pressure on Brussels but that the US knew in advance how Spain would vote, even before the Spanish biotech commission had reported.
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Show AllSo far I have not seen any Wikileaks releases that said anything that I did not already "know". I say "know" because after years of watching the actions of our government to further the Empire I have come to realize that if there is ever a choice among the following options, the US will certainly come down on the side of immediate profit at the expense of everything else. The options: Environmental benefit; Humanity; Long range economic stability; Peace; International Justice, Immediate Profit. In the last 30 years I have seen no action by the Pentagon or State Dept. that has been for any other reason than shortsighted profit by some business. So why should anyone be surprised to learn what Progressives have always "known"? I hope that someone can disprove the truth of what I have said.
Hunches based on circumstantial evidence are useful, but are going to be dismissed as conspiracy-theorizing without hard evidence. The cables provide that hard direct evidence.
Even after the hard evidence is presented it will continue to be branded as conspiracy theory by a majority of Americans who are unwilling to believe anything beyond what is contained in their respective political party's talking points (Democratic and Republican Partys specifically).
True, by in this case their argument has no merit. Without the leaked cables, their argument has merit. Having, versus not having, the leaked cables to back up your claim is the same as the difference between a scientific claim and one based on religion.
I agree SaboCat direct evidence is important.
"So far I have not seen any Wikileaks releases that said anything that I did not already know."
That's not the point. The point is the criminalization of news and those journalists who reveal truth.
Yes, that's another important point Ghandighost.
While there are those who will support "Team USA" regardless how blatantly the U.S. government disregards the Constitution and violates the rights of journalists, the criminalization of news reporting that includes "revelations" of rather banal U.S. government efforts to pressure the Vatican and EU states to support the interests of the same multinational corporations which continue to exploit American consumers while ignoring the plight of Americans suffering from the criminal misdeeds of Wall Street further demonstrates just whose side "our" representatives and the U.S. government is on. Further evidence, for those that need further evidence, that the criminalization of Wikileaks and the news isn't about protecting "national security".
There are a lot of angry Americans out there.
We all need to figure out how to communicate better with each other, including those of us inclined to miss the destructive and exploitative role of corporations, and organize an effective defense against these predations.
Dear ppeters:
All people enter the world at different points of time, and some too develop ears at later stages. I'm glad that you knew this before, but I didn't. Repetition does get into and stay in the long term memory neural pathways; look at the success of the tea party. That of course is a negative example party, but repetition does work, but people have to hear it first.
It seems that Wikileaks had been around for a while, but it is new to me. Ever since Enron, the world seems to be stuck in one big "Ground Hog Day" loop. I know that historically there were loops before that, but maybe Y2K was meant to tell the world 'You 2 are Finis " It really does seem that way because I guess that there really was a Y2k worm and it turned on all of us.
The American Empire does not tolerate dissidence especially from its client states and contrary to what most liberals believe the United States is not just a foolish giant making mistakes but is in fact the real Evil Empire that they project on to everyone else.
Deja vu news. Everybody who has been fighting GMOs knows the standing of the US in relationship to getting Monsantos accepted in every country around the world. Each and every item brought forth in this article has been printed in other reports within the past 12 months. OH, I see now, WIKILEAKS says something, so now it is NEW news, not just rehashed news. I guess all the other environmental and/or natural news sources have been guessing at the truth these past months, but now WIKILEAKS has weighed in...
State Department cables are not something Wikileaks "says." They are the official communications of the United States government. Wikileaks is just reporting what they said.
nobodyknown...
The real beauty of Wikileaks is that they can no longer claim that something printed in "left wing" publications is just conspiracy theory BS. Now they have to spin it some other way.
Yes and the two ways the Beast Double Doble speaks is:
1) For left consumption ------ Nothing new , no victory , do not pay attention
2) For right consumption ------ Blood on their hands, great damage , terrorists
If these Wikileaks releases bring this matter to the attention of more people, I couldn't care less how old the story really is. Just send the this article and/or any links to all and sundry.
I suppose you're right. Better late than never. I'm just getting a bit tired of 'Wikileaks' being proped up as Gospel, especially for information that has been on the street for a decade. Corporations such as Monsanto have only ONE motivation, and it does not matter how many people die for them to achieve their goal.
I was shocked to learn, and I admit I was late in doing so, that when a genetically modified organism, such as a variety of corn that is resistant to Roundup is released into the environment it can cross breed with any other strain of corn out there.
I always assumed that someone was minding the store and that genetically modified seed would only be permitted with precautions in place to prevent the modified genes from becoming part of the natural environment.
Sadly that is not the case. Irresponsibility of an absurd dimension has allowed Monsanto and others to distribute seed to farmers around the world that produces plants with fertile pollen and seed which allows the modified genes from Monsanto to become part of the general genetic makeup of the type of food crops modified in Monsanto labs. After a short period of years, all the corn grown, even on organic farms, comes to contain the modified genes because pollination insects, such as bees, or the wind, carries the fertile pollen containing the modified genes into the general environment, cross pollinating the seeds of corn that does not have the genetically modified material. Over time, no corn exists that does not have the Monsanto genes.
No one knows the impact that eventually may have on human health. No long term studies of the type necessary to determine the safety of the synthetic genes have or could been done. There hasn't been enough time, even if Monsanto was responsible enough to have tried.
Our entire food supply and the entire human population have been turned into a massive experiment in which we all are participating as guinea pigs.
We are in a situation now where several of the most important food crops on the planet including corn, soybeans and rice are contaminated with synthetically modified genes. Research exists which links those genes to allergies and many other human illnesses. If genetically modified corn proves to lead to a serious disease that only manifests itself after long term exposure we will have lost corn as a food plant. That is because even on farms where no Monsanto modified corn has been planted the pollen from the modified seed cross pollinates, contaminating even the corn from organic farms. Monsanto has forced its modified corn seed even into the areas of southern Mexico and Central America. These are the areas where corn evolved and all corn plants around the world trace their origins.
Because Monsanto has forced its way in, displacing indigenous farmers, even the ancestor gene pool of original corn has been contaminated.
There is more truth to the statement that if Monsanto can get GM corn into Spain the rest of Europe will follow than it appears to have on its surface. Are there still uncontaminated strains of corn in Europe because the ocean is wide enough so their corn has not been contaminated? Maybe. And that may prove to be more important than just an economic matter for Monsanto. It may prove to be the only source for safe corn if the preliminary research which is showing many disease and allergy causing characteristics in modified corn proves to be true.
No genetically modified seed of any kind that can move out and contaminate the environment generally should be permitted. Period. Ever. But, believe it or not, regulatory agencies in the U.S. and under the U.S. domination have allowed just that for more than a decade, resulting in the irreversible contamination of many of the world's most important food crops.
Another issue is the so called "terminator" gene technology. Monsanto and Sygenta and others are working on developing plants that cannot produce fertile seed more than once so farmers are obligated to always buy seed from the multinational chemical companies and will no longer be able to use their own seed to plant the next year's crop. Life on Earth is put at serious risk if no responsible oversight is put in place to prevent the widespread release of terminator technology.
'seeds of deception' by jeffrey m. smith told us all about this in 2003.
Excellent post, Heavyrunner.
Ah, but the pollen, pollinates the neighbors crop of corn and Monsanto can tell that it's no "natural" DNA; it's PATENTED!
To prove it; the owner of the patent, has sued poor farmers, whose crops have been contaminated by MONSANTO.
Folks, Mark Abram has been previously called out on this site as an industry troll. He's shilling for Monsanto. And figuring out how folks who want healthy organic food will argue their point.
How much does Monsanto, or the US government, or both, pay you?
That's exactly what the manufacturer said!
Doctors recommend Lucky Strikes over all other brands!
Sir:
You are too funny. Spouting robotic corporate doublethink is not exactly going to be convincing to the inmates of the Common Dreams asylum. Your natural audience would seem to me to be the Glenn Beck crowd. What? Glenn isn't willing to share his $38 million in profits for disinforming the public with you? Poor baby.
Mark Abram, you may well be a well-spoken, articulate shill. But you are still a shill.
Get a life. And please consider that your posts might just be regarded by the preponderance of participants here as nothing more than punditry pollution. Or, the eczema of the airways, the psoriasis of the public commons or the stuff squirting out of the south end of horse heading north.
Mark,
Or the Monty Python guy who walked into the cheese shop only to find out after considerable effort that they didn't have any cheese!
Thanks for the "cheese", and for provoking a discussion of GMO foods. :)
Any thoughts about KrazyKatz’s (Januray 4th, 2011 12:52 am) GMO "Round-up Ready" comments?
Mark,
ARGUMENT: Should Monsanto be euthanized for its role in mass murder in the Viet Nam War?
Background: http://tinyurl.com/34rmtfr
Corporations were feared and distrusted by the Founding Fathers of the U.S.A. Charters for early corporations specified that they were to provide some beneficial service to society. Sadly, modern Americans have completely lost the script and occasionally, as with your PR/psyop-based dissembling and chicanery we are forced to endure complete crap being presented as well articulated "argument". Sadly, your idea of debate is not about right vs. wrong. I detect a strong interest on your behalf to engage in that most despicable of behaviors, lawyering on behalf of a sinister and criminal force without any recognition of the essentially criminal nature of your sophistry. Throw out ethics. Throw out truth. Throw out decency, because Mark Abram has the usual tool of the scoundrel, he has cleverness and a willfulness to cheat humanity for his own benefit.
You apologia for the criminals at Monsanto is quite insane, Mark. Perhaps you are too befuddled to understand this.
The argument we should be having is whether or not Monsanto should be killed off because of its odious record of abuse, murder, economic bullying, insatiable greed and dangerous and arrogant disregard for the predictable consequences of its insanely foolish mass planet-wide experimentation with the future of life itself.
Mark, the formula is simple. You continue to argue on behalf of criminals, we'll continue to attempt to disabuse you that you are smart, decent, clever or wanted.
Utter nonsense.
Nature, and natural evolution of genetic material through natural selection, AND human breeding of plants through horticultural selection, do NOT purposely redesign major human agricultural crops to withstand life in a toxic death zone, and then spread that toxic death zone so that only that plant survives. That is EXACTLY what "Roundup Ready" plants are. Designed by and for the corporation, to extract maximum dollars from the human agricultural economy.
Nature, and natural evolution of genetic material through natural selection, AND human breeding of plants through horticultural selection, do NOT purposely redesign major human agricultural crops to achieve "patented" status and require a licensing fee to plant, thus disrupting the fundamental human agricultural practice of seed-saving and preventing further horticultural selection. This is PRECISELY what GMOs are DESIGNED to do, to force human farmers into sharecropping for corporations. Not only designed to "maximize revenue streams" in the medium-term, but to Jesus H Fucking Christ CONTROL AGRICULTURE in the long-term. Just some minor thing, what human with any sense of history should be concerned about a corporate plot to own the "rights" to all seeds?
"Vague anti-technology prejudice" and "food purity fetish" my ASS. These are fast becoming clear through repetition as INDUSTRY SHILL TALKING POINTS.
Fuck you and the stream of corporate spew you rode in on. You clearly have no shame, but many here can smell your stench.
If GMO's are so harmless why is Industry (You) so fiercely opposed to labeling their Frankenfoods?
"Mark Abrams"
What do you and your corporate partners not understand about truthful and fair negotiations?
"The US embassy in Paris advised Washington to start a military-style trade war against any European Union country which opposed genetically modified (GM) crops"
If your GM crops are SO wonderful, why not let "the market" decide? Hmmmmmmm?
I heard that GM corn is a suspect in the disappearing of monarch butterflies.
Also heard that "patented" seeds do not reproduce and new ones need to be purchased from Monsanto every year.
NO THANKS for your police state control.
That's right, and all such tales of collapsing populations of insect and animal life is just more scare tactics and fairy tales.
Gosh i heard bees were vanishing, is that a fairy tale too?
Certainly none of the disruption and suddenly accelerating simplification of life on Earth could be scientifically proven to be credibly tied to any actions of any global chemical corporations. Those corporations should be subject to less public knowledge! That's what's safer for all of us!
Hey i'm the friend of the little guy, but you know, sometimes the trillion-dollar chemical corporation turns out to be your best friend? If you know what i mean?
"So-called "GMO" crops are generically harmless."
I think you mean genetically harmless.
Calling all of those against the use of GMO crops Luddites may be a good rhetorical tool, but it does not answer the question about choice. For example, I feel no need to be "connected" to everyone on the planet at all times, so I use a 10 year-old cell phone that works quite well, when I turn it on, which is only when I want to make a call.
I can make the decision to use this outmoded technology but I cannot make any decision about the use of GMO foods because the government will not require Monsanto or anyone else to label foods properly. A food industry executive was quoted recently as saying that if they were required to label their products honestly, they might as well put a skull and crossbones on the package.
It may be true that GMO foods are no more harmfull than non-GMO foods, but that is not the point. If a label on a food package is to mean something, it should tell me what I want to know.
I can choose between different brands, but I cannot choose between GMO and non-GMO products. Why not?
Absolutely perfect analogy. Yes, we are anti-GMO racists. How could anyone argue with your equivalence here? Hmm, let me see... Nope, your logic is perfect.
What a simplistic fool.
Again, yes, the analogy of wanting to be informed of the corporate-developed genetic construction of patented foods, is equivalent to racist hatred. You are brilliant. Thank you.
This puts a face on the "who-where-why-what-&-when" of U.S. diplomats, working for corporations.
I guess the bigger picture would be the whole government is working for the corporations.
The big competitors don't depend on the "free market" competition; they depend on powerful positions in our government to further their sales. Nothing New!
It's just that Wikileaks put a face on it!
What was once news is now becoming a crime. Defend the 1st Amendment.
4/24/07
Fascist America, In 10 Easy Steps:
From Hitler to Pinochet and beyond, history shows there are certain steps that any would-be dictator must take to destroy constitutional freedoms. And, argues Naomi Wolf, George Bush and his administration seem to be taking them all.
by Naomi Wolf
Italy in the 1920s, Germany in the 30s, East Germany in the 50s, Czechoslovakia in the 60s, the Latin American dictatorships in the 70s, China in the 80s and 90s - all dictatorships and would-be dictators target newspapers and journalists. They threaten and harass them in more open societies that they are seeking to close, and they arrest them and worse in societies that have been closed already.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/apr/24/usa.comment
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjALf12PAWc
√ 1. Invoke a terrifying internal and external enemy
√ 2. Create a gulag
√ 3. Develop a thug caste
√ 4. Set up an internal surveillance system
√ 5. Harass citizens' groups
√ 6. Engage in arbitrary detention and release
√ 7. Target key individuals
√ 8. Control the press
• 9. Dissent equals treason
• 10. Suspend the rule of law
Dear U.S Government:
O.K. I am officially ashamed to be an American citizen. Yes, I realize that this happened a while back in Bushie land , but this "craig Stapleton" is the kind of person who should be put into GITMO, along with bush-cheney et al. What is wrong, government, that you can't see the terrorists of the world standing in plain sight?
Oh, so the U.S. Ambassador functions as the mafia for corporate America. How charming; no wonder people don't like many of our ambassadors.
Really, this stapleton person was trying to strong arm countries for the benefit of his corp buddies. FRANCE, he was offering "material support" to those who have no right to interfere in your affairs. Please take this stapleton worm, and place him in stocks on the site of what's left of the Bastille and force feed him GMO crops...oh GMO-boarding; we should be good at that too.
It's weird, but surprisingly nice, that the Catholic church won't support this GMO debacle. I suppose that they are against "playing God " with the food of the world, or perhaps GMO seeds are really the pedophiles of Nature.
And Spain, well it's bad enough that the English and windy seas of NATURE beat you and the Armada, but where is your sense of self ? It would appear that you are yet another vassal of the BULLY nation. Tell the U.S. and any other remaining Bushie clones to back off and respect your sovereignty.
*****************
Oh yes, and poster Mark Abram ,YOUR remarks typify the comments surrounding CORPORATE nonsense. It's not only the harm that these corporations do to the planet, but the fact that the GMO people are suing farmers whose land becomes infected with these genetic modification, because corporates produced the GMO aliens seeds and now say they own it . "Wind" now leaves the realm of Act of God, and becomes Act of Greed. Like much of the FDA products, KILLER CRAP is finally pulled from the market AFTER the damages to humans have been done. Talk to the starving people in India about the damming effect of being forced to buy genetic seeds too. Maybe you haven't noticed those news stories, but people in India are offing themselves because they see no future in a corporately owned and heating up drought- plagued planet.
Don't mess with Mother Nature, because in case you haven't noticed, she is really starting to mess with us. Here it is Jan. 3rd, and the first 2 days brought us floods in Australia and a 7.1 quake in Chile, and oh yeah, the GULF and Haiti and the floods in Pakistan plus the environmental devastation in the Middle East haven't been repaired yet either! ( New Orleans, any good news there yet?) The farmers in Haiti don't want the GMO seeds being foisted upon them either!
You have a very sad brain, Mr. Abram, so crawl back into your big fat portfolio , although sadly, unless you are one of the UBER - rich, you are soon to be crushed by the corporate jaws too.
"Don't mess with Mother Nature, because in case you haven't noticed, she is really starting to mess with us. Here it is Jan. 3rd, and the first 2 days brought us floods in Australia and a 7.1 quake in Chile, and oh yeah, the GULF and Haiti and the floods in Pakistan plus the environmental devastation in the Middle East haven't been repaired yet either! ( New Orleans, any good news there yet?) The farmers in Haiti don't want the GMO seeds being foisted upon them either!"--stardust
~
got this goodie from today's "democracy now!" broadcast. the new chair of the subcommittee on environment and economy, john shimkus of illinois, assures us darlings of the cosmos not to worry and here's all the proof we need.--hummingbird
~
"So I want to start with Genesis 8, verse 21 and 22. "Never again will I curse the ground because of man, even though every inclination of his heart is evil from childhood. And never again will I destroy all living creatures, as I have done. As long as the earth endures, seedtime and harvest, cold and heat, summer and winter, day and night will never cease." I believe that’s the infallible word of God, and that’s the way it’s going to be for His creation.
The second verse comes from Matthew 24. "And He will send His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other." The earth will end only when God declares its time to be over. Man will not destroy this earth. This earth will not be destroyed by a flood. And I appreciate having panelists here who are men of faith, and we can get into the theological discourse of that position, but I do believe God’s word is infallible, unchanging, perfect.
Today we have about 388 parts per million in the atmosphere. I think in the age of the dinosaurs, where we had most flora and fauna, we were probably at 4,000 parts per million. There is a theological debate that this is a carbon-starved planet—not too much carbon."--john shimkus
~
these people need intervention. how do you reason with such insanity?
you don't.
Dear hummingbird:
I think Rachel Carson is infallible; the " book "guy, not so much. The CREATION Museum has humans walking around with dinosaurs, although no one can explain why they weren't on the ark. How do I know that they weren't on the ark...well, probably because if they were, there wouldn't have been much ark left with those reptilian appetites.
John Shimkus needs to take a FIELD TRIP to Chersky, in East Siberia. While there, he might notice the melting tundra, along with the methane bubbles in the remaining but melting ice. The buildings there are imploding into a sinking land which has become a methane badlands of sorts. How would Mr. Shimkus explain this "devilish" procedure? Oh yes, the fine print in the "book" .." As long as the earth endures..." there's a loophole for you!
Dear Mark Abram:
I'm sorry but I read your argument as "there is no science" re: GMO, but it's all over the place with Food and Water Watch, Friends of the Earth, Sierra Club, Union of Concerned Scientists, and even with a lot of articles on CD.
I do apologize because your argument of "no proof' sounds so Fox news, so I was truly trying to communicate with you on a Glen- Beckian level! By the way, don't buy any of that gold that he's hawking!
Bunch of LIBTARD organizations, what do you expect them to say? Science is religion. Facts are false.
Dear licketyglick:
I think you have had a lickety-SPLIT in a synapse somewhere. A LIBTARD? Is that something like a LEOTARD, where corporate persons, pretending to benefit the public, do a Dance of Death upon the planet? It was a funny word though, and it did make me laugh!
Let's see. LIB= informal liberation as on social reform, i.e. liberal OR it could be an abbreviatuin for BOOK,LIBRARY, or LiBRARIAN.
TARDIGRADE= slow moving or a creature that lives in moss. I like that one, so perhaps a LIBTARD is a slow moving , but bookish, microscopic creature that sees much more damage to the enviroment than PR firms do.
I like the LIBTARDS and they are very GREEN!
"As far as I can tell" - 'nuff said.
Mark Abram wrote: "Good old Ma Nature herself is busy modifying genes all the time..."
yes, and "ma nature" also kills millions of people every year of "natural causes." and floods cities. and blows them away with hurricanes. and scorches landscapes in molten lava. does that mean it's okay for monsanto to lend a hand with those job, too?
i'm really getting tired of people -- usually people with some financial stake in a given policy or technology -- making moronic, illogical statements in a haughty derisive tone that belittles thoughtful, compassionate, rationally concerned, not-profit-motivated people.
and for those who deride wikileaks or diminish the importance of their leaks because many of the elements of this story may have been public before. please, pray tell, what recent contributions (that may cost you your liberty or possibly, your life) have you made to the public discourse.
when deeply immoral or criminal acts are being committed i think it's okay to mention them twice.
yes, of course they/we are often wrong. but interestingly, so often when we are wrong the stakes are so much lower than when those who want to plow ahead with corporate-backed, inadequately tested technologies are wrong.
this is a perfect example of that phenomenon, notwithstanding the arguments ("proved" with academic studies backed by...Monsanto! and since disproved by studies unbiased by funding sources) that GMO growing improves yields relative to non-GMO growing and thus will reduce starvation.
so, to recap: if you are wrong about the dangers of GMO growing and it continues unabated, flora and fauna could be irreparably mutated/damaged and people and animals sickened; and even if you're right -- and nothing grows an extra eye, gets sick, or dies -- it's been shown that crop yields will go down over the long term while crop prices go up and the proceeds flow, under patent, to the already wealthy.
if i'm wrong -- and, if in some miraculous way i were able to slow or roll back the use of GMO growing -- well... those phenomena that will occur if you're wrong, won't occur.
mark, that's a very weak rebuttal to the point i made. in fact, i'm going to act as judge and jury here and say it's not a rebuttal at all as it doesn't address the point i made.
to address the points that you just raised: to suggest that there's not a "shred" of "scientific or otherwise verifiable evidence" that GMO crops have huge negative ramifications is to spit in the face of independent, traditional farmers all over the world whose lives have been destroyed, and in some cases ended, by industrial -- and specifically GMO -- agriculture.
your persistent protests that you are some kind of maligned rational progressive thinker seem to be falling a little flat in this forum; i don't disagree that progressives fall prey to knee-jerk impulses as much as others, but i would maintain that their knees tend to jerk in the direction of decency, prudence, and compassion for the world around them and away from anything that makes the planet and the vast majority of its denizens more beholden to large corporations and the small, privileged class that controls them.
My concern is with the way that the politicization of this homeland security nonsense distracts from real issues and wastes the energies and undermines the credibility of the Right.
Perhaps someday when "terrorism" is equated with environmental damage the same as it is with blowing things up, the "precautionary principle" will be applied fairly.
"The precautionary principle states that if an action or policy has a suspected risk of causing harm to the public or to the environment, in the absence of scientific consensus that the action or policy is harmful, the burden of proof that it is not harmful falls on those taking the action.
This principle allows policy makers to make discretionary decisions in situations where there is the possibility of harm from taking a particular course or making a certain decision when extensive scientific knowledge on the matter is lacking. The principle implies that there is a social responsibility to protect the public from exposure to harm, when scientific investigation has found a plausible risk. These protections can be relaxed only if further scientific findings emerge that provide sound evidence that no harm will result."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precautionary_principle
What about allergens that are not universally known or accepted as allergens, but are allergens for a certain percentage of the population nonetheless?
What about the unknown possible impacts that GMOs can have on the entire chain of life?
Do we only apply the precautionary principle to those activities that we know absolutely without doubt to be potentially harmful?
Again, brilliant analogy my friend! Yes, GMOs are merely as humdrum as walking out your front door!
No need to address the fact that chemical corporations are actively carrying out long-term strategic plans to control the living stuff of human agricultural systems.
With these trillion-dollar behemoths astride the genesis of life, why would anyone think anything like precaution is necessary? Nothing but the best possible outcomes could be in store for everyone! It's like the warm sun on your face when you step out into the fresh air.
No interventions in living systems by these benevolent corporations have ever had any negative consequences, or upset the balance of overall living systems, or anything of the kind. These trusted chemical corporations have nothing but a long track record of leaving healthy thriving complex diverse living landscapes everywhere they ply their trade. Well at least since WWII when these chemical corporations were hip deep in profiting from the worst horrors of the war. But they've done an admirable job since then of creating profitable new markets for their poisons.
Now shoo away little boys and girls. No talk here of collapsing populations of birds or such trifling things as insects. Bees? Who ever dreamed of such nasty little stinging creatures! The world is better off without these tiny terrors.
Spread more glysophate! Terminator seeds! Neonicotinoids! Estrogen mimickers! Hormone disruptors! Neurodisruptors! Who could fear these corporations or their wise profitable investments in life? Nothing serious can go wrong. It's as safe as walking out your front door. Only paranoids would stoop to expressing fear of such developments, or of the people and institutions that carry them out.
Only the criminally insane would imagine that so hateful and dangerous a thing as labeling such foods might be considered. Let's keep the discussion within the boundaries of reasonableness, now now!
This is the rational, reasonable way forward for the grand experiment of human civilization. Losers, infants and fools submit to irrational fears regarding mix-n-match genetic revolutions led by the drive for corporate profits. Rational thinking will determine the future development of life. The fittest food crops will survive based on which produces more corporate profits.
Precautionary principle my ass! We need strong and bold leaders who brush aside such infantile fears!
"politicization of this anti-scientific nonsense"
FYI http://www.progress.org/gene10.htm
Now what do you think, or can you comprehend the science?
The human body makes antibodies to foreign proteins (antigens) and the
GMO crops contain virus, get it? It is called allergy. Do you understand
immune complexes or complement? A little research before making such
rash statements might help you be relevant. You, sir, have no credibility.
Warm regards regardless...
What do you care most about, btw, other than defending corporate greed? What makes you "progressive," as you infer yourself to be?
Just curious…