Blackwater ‘Arms Smuggling Probe’
Federal prosecutors are investigating whether staff from controversial US security company Blackwater smuggled weapons to Iraq, according to reports.
Some employees are alleged to have sent over unlicensed weapons and equipment, that could have been used by a group labeled as terrorist by the US.
The North Carolina-based firm said it was not aware of such an investigation.
But it confirmed two members of staff were sacked in August 2005 for stealing company property in the US.
Blackwater was blamed for a Baghdad gunfight in which 11 civilians died last Sunday.
The contractor had its license to operate in Iraq withdrawn by the Iraqi authorities following the shootout, but resumed limited operations on Friday.
The News and Observer in North Carolina quoted two sources as saying officials were investigating whether any Blackwater staff had shipped weapons, night-vision scopes, armor, gun kits and other equipment to Iraq, without the required permits.
The newspaper said that, in January, two former members of staff with the firm had pleaded guilty in Greenville, North Carolina, to weapons charges and the pair were now co-operating with federal investigators.
The allegations of weapons smuggling in Iraq by a North Carolina firm came to light earlier this week in a written statement from the state department’s inspector general, Howard Krongard.
In July, Turkey complained to the US that they had seized American weapons from the outlawed Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), designated a terrorist organization by Washington.
Investigators are reportedly attempting to determine if any Blackwater weapons could have been sold on the black market and ended up in the hands of the PKK.
Meanwhile, the Iraqi government was also investigating if Blackwater had been involved in six other violent incidents in Iraq that left at least 10 people dead, according to the Washington Post’s Saturday’s edition.
‘Hazy situation’
An Iraqi interior ministry investigation found Blackwater to be “100% guilty” of last weekend’s incident in which 11 Iraqi civilians were killed.
Blackwater insists its guards acted in self-defence.
A spokeswoman for the company said on Saturday that they had called in investigators from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms after finding two Blackwater employees stealing company property in August 2005.
The members of staff were dismissed and then criminally prosecuted in connection with offences in the US, said the spokeswoman.
Responding to allegations that Blackwater employees were the subject of an Iraq arms smuggling probe, the spokeswoman told the BBC News website: “We are aware of that report and we have yet to see definitive proof that the firm in question is Blackwater.
“I’m not saying it’s not, as sometimes these things can happen, but it’s a hazy situation.”
Regarding Saturday’s Washington Post report, Blackwater said it was based on one-sided information from the Iraqi Ministry of the Interior.
© 2007 BBC
Disgusting and despicable!!!!!!!!!!
Blackwater needs to be probed all right…with a fireplace poker right up its corporate ass.
And once again: The people who work for this corporation and all other corporations that profit from war ARE AS GUILTY as the CEOs of said corporations. Without them, these corporations could not exist.
The workers should not be left off the hook.
Do I detect a glimmer of hope here, or is it just a reflection of light caused by the haze?
Federal prosecuters are investigating? Guess they’re tired of their jobs. ____ Well maybe not, Gonzales is gone now.
Am I getting my hopes up for naught?
That it’s alleged some of its employees are engaged in gun running doesn’t surprise me in the least. Organisations like Blackwater/ Black & Tans have no business even to exist - PERIOD!
Well, well, you couldn’t make it up. Whilst the US and their little helper,the UK government, blame Iran, ‘insurgents’, ‘Al Qaeda’ etc., the US Army ‘loses’ 190,000 arms (and that’s only the ones we know about) and Blackwater, might, allegedly, be flogging others off to make a bit of pocket money over their mega buck salaries.
There are also a number of allegations re mercenary companies involved in prostitution, trafficking and drugs. They are only allegations, but please don’t fall over in shock folks.
What I also enjoy about all the mercenaries is that they are there (apart from their curricular and non - allegedly - curricular duties) to escort US top military brass around, surrounding them, in their dozens, armed to the teeth, to keep the poor babes safe. Now here was I thinking top brass were top gun, the bravest of the brave. They’d earned their laurels, defeated Atilla the Hun single handed etc. But apparently they have no courage at all, delicate little souls in arms. The 19 year old Private goes out on foot patrol, facing the wrath and loathing of an occupied population and the big boys get mega escorts.
What am I missing here??
Best, J.
THE EIGHT STAGES OF GENOCIDE
By Dr. Gregory H. Stanton, President, Genocide Watch….
1. CLASSIFICATION: All cultures have categories to distinguish people into “us and them” by ethnicity, race, religion, or nationality: German and Jew, Hutu and Tutsi. [BUSH SAID “YOU ARE EITHER WITH US OR WITH THE TERRORISTS”]. Bipolar societies that lack mixed categories, such as Rwanda and Burundi, are the most likely to have genocide [JENA HAS BEEN A PART AMERICAN PSYCHE SINCE INCEPTION]. The main preventive measure at this early stage is to develop universalistic institutions that transcend ethnic or racial divisions, that actively promote tolerance and understanding, and that promote classifications that transcend the divisions. The Catholic church could have played this role in Rwanda, had it not been riven by the same ethnic cleavages as Rwandan society. Promotion of a common language in countries like Tanzania or Cote d’Ivoire has also promoted transcendent national identity. This search for common ground is vital to early prevention of genocide.
2. SYMBOLIZATION: We give names or other symbols to the classifications. We name people “Jews” or “Gypsies”, or distinguish them by colors or dress; and apply them to members of groups. Classification and symbolization are universally human and do not necessarily result in genocide unless they lead to the next stage, dehumanization. When combined with hatred, symbols may be forced upon unwilling members of pariah groups: the yellow star for Jews under Nazi rule, the blue scarf for people from the Eastern Zone in Khmer Rouge Cambodia. To combat symbolization, hate symbols can be legally forbidden (swastikas) as can hate speech. Group marking like gang clothing or tribal scarring can be outlawed, as well. The problem is that legal limitations will fail if unsupported by popular cultural enforcement. Though Hutu and Tutsi were forbidden words in Burundi until the 1980’s, code-words replaced them. If widely supported, however, denial of symbolization can be powerful, as it was in Denmark, when many Danes chose to wear the yellow star, depriving it of its significance as a Nazi symbol for Jews.
3. DEHUMANIZATION: One group denies the humanity of the other group. Members of it are equated with animals, vermin, insects or diseases. Dehumanization overcomes the normal human revulsion against murder. At this stage, hate propaganda in print and on hate radios is used to vilify the victim group. In combating this dehumanization, incitement to genocide should not be confused with protected speech. Genocidal societies lack constitutional protection for countervailing speech, and should be treated differently than in democracies. Hate radio stations should be shut down, and hate propaganda banned. Hate crimes and atrocities should be promptly punished.
4. ORGANIZATION: Genocide is always organized, usually by the state, though sometimes informally (Hindu mobs led by local RSS militants) or by terrorist groups. Special army units or militias are often trained and armed. Plans are made for genocidal killings. To combat this stage, membership in these militias should be outlawed. Their leaders should be denied visas for foreign travel. The U.N. should impose arms embargoes on governments and citizens of countries involved in genocidal massacres, and create commissions to investigate violations.
5. POLARIZATION: Extremists drive the groups apart. Hate groups broadcast polarizing propaganda. Laws may forbid intermarriage or social interaction. Extremist terrorism targets moderates, intimidating and silencing the center. Prevention may mean security protection for moderate leaders or assistance to human rights groups. Assets of extremists may be seized, and visas denied to them. Coups d’etat by extremists should be opposed by international sanctions.
6. IDENTIFICATION: Victims are identified and separated out because of their ethnic or religious identity. Death lists are drawn up. Members of victim groups are forced to wear identifying symbols. They are often segregated into ghettoes, forced into concentration camps, or confined to a famine-struck region and starved. At this stage, a Genocide Alert must be called. If the political will of the U.S. Government, NATO, and the U.N. Security Council can be mobilized, armed international intervention should be prepared, or heavy assistance to the victim group in preparing for its self-defense. Otherwise, at least humanitarian assistance should be organized by the U.N. and private relief groups for the inevitable tide of refugees.
7. EXTERMINATION begins, and quickly becomes the mass killing legally called “genocide.” It is “extermination” to the killers because they do not believe their victims to be fully human. When it is sponsored by the state, the armed forces often work with militias to do the killing. Sometimes the genocide results in revenge killings by groups against each other, creating the downward whirlpool-like cycle of bilateral genocide (as in Burundi). At this stage, only rapid and overwhelming armed intervention can stop genocide. Real safe areas or refugee escape corridors should be established with heavily armed international protection. The U.N. Standing High Readiness Brigade — 5500 heavy infantry — should be mobilized by the U.N. Security Council if the genocide is small. For larger interventions, a multilateral force authorized by the U.N., should intervene. It is time for nations to recognize that the international law of humanitarian intervention transcends the narrow interests of individual nation states. If NATO will not intervene directly, it should provide the airlift, equipment, and financial means necessary for regional states to intervene with U.N. authorization.
8. DENIAL is the eighth stage that always follows a genocide. It is among the surest indicators of further genocidal massacres. The perpetrators of genocide dig up the mass graves, burn the bodies, try to cover up the evidence and intimidate the witnesses. They deny that they committed any crimes, and often blame what happened on the victims. They block investigations of the crimes, and continue to govern until driven from power by force, when they flee into exile. There they remain with impunity, like Pol Pot or Idi Amin, unless they are captured and a tribunal is established to try them. The response to denial is punishment by an international tribunal or national courts. There the evidence is heard, and the perpetrators punished. Tribunals like the Yugoslav or Rwanda Tribunals, a tribunal to try the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia, or the International Criminal Court may not deter the worst killers. But with the political will to arrest and prosecute them, some may be brought to justice. And such courts may deter future potential genocide-ists who can never again share Hitler’s expectation of impunity when he sneered,”Who, after all, remembers the Armenians?”
THAT WAS OF COURSE APPLICABLE UNTIL BU$HCO DECIDED TO INSTIGATE OIL WARS IN THE MIDDLE EAST ACTING IN DEFIANCE AGAINST INTERNATIONAL LAW AND THE CONSTITUTION OF AMERICA
THEN CORPORATISE A MERCENARY ARMY BLACKWATER, REPLETE WITH CRIMINAL ACTS WORTHY OF NURUMBERG STYLE TRIALS
EXAMPLE OF:
8. DENIAL is the eighth stage that always follows a genocide. It is among the surest indicators of further genocidal massacres. The perpetrators of genocide dig up the mass graves, burn the bodies, try to cover up the evidence and intimidate the witnesses. They deny that they committed any crimes, and often blame what happened on the victims. They block investigations of the crimes…..
Fallujah - The Hidden Massacre
Veteran admits: Bodies melted away before us.
Shocking revelation RAI News 24.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article10907.htm
WARNING
This video contains images that depict the reality and horror of war. It should only be viewed by a mature audience
What exactly did the 2 former Blackwater employees plead guilty to?
“weapons charges” ?
Stealing from the company?
Oooh, now that would be serious.
Welcome to the world predicted by Orwell and Bill Gibson (look it up).
Blackwater = Black Shirts.
Neo-cons = Neo-nazis.
Corporate Elite = Fascists.
Am I getting through to you?
Galen: you have it nailed.
When our government is investigating one of their own corporate buddies, I expect that the whole thing will be just another Bushco whitewash and nobody, with the exception of possibly a few grunts, will be charged with anything.
Given the degree of screcy and deceit that has accompanyed the handling of this war, anything is possible. A thourough investigatin into this should matter must be implemented immediately. Any persons who have contributed to arming the enemy should be charged with treason.
Journalist and author Jeremy Scahill wrote the book “Blackwater: The Rise of the Worlds´s Most Powerful Army”. Blackwater USA was founded in 1996 by former Navy SEAL and millionaire Erik Prince with close ties to the Christian Right. Some quotations from Scahill`s book:”..a shadowy mercenary company….largely off the congressional radar…having remarkable power and protection within the US war apparatus” with no accountability or oversight on the ground in Iraq. Scahill calls Blackwater the “Bush Administration`s Praetorian Guard”. No surprise that Condi hastens to cover up for them
simonhhh –
DEHUMANIZATION: One group denies the humanity of the other group. Members of it are equated with animals, vermin, insects or diseases.
This tactic is also used in general to divide the citizens of any government system, and pit them against each other. This includes people of various political camps..conservative vs progressive, Republican vs Democrat, classical liberal (libertarian) vs modern liberal.
“Hate radio stations should be shut down, and hate propaganda banned. Hate crimes and atrocities should be promptly punished.”
Do I hear more than a smatter of 1984 here? In 1984 - thought crime was severely punished. ‘Hate crime’ is thought crime. It involves motives and motives involve mind police and prosecution for what one is thinking. A crime is a crime in and of itself. The reason for doing it does not require an additional punishment and, is in and of itself, criminal.
“incitement to genocide should not be confused with protected speech. Genocidal societies lack constitutional protection for countervailing speech, and should be treated differently than in democracies.”
If you’re referring to the US here, which I believe you are, how is it that you and I are able to carry on this conversation? I guess we’re not a genocidal society. Then again, how is it that so many here keep ignoring the fact that Iran is constantly on the war path with everyone and their cousin who is not Islamic, and threatening to blow them off the face of the earth?
On the other hand, yes, Blackwater is despicable, and the fact that it’s a US security company makes me sick.
My major concern is that Blackwater is Dick Cheney’s Praetorian Guard that will eventually be turned on demonstrators in the U.S., a replica of Hitler’s brownshirts.
thomas j hussey, That sounds like a distinct and terrifying possibility.
Does anyone think that when these operative were given “legal” immunity that these act would not happen? These men have been given absolute power over the people in Iraq and without any real oversight, of course it will corrupt them (the ones that were not corrupted already).
zhongman, the ones who finance wars never gave a damn who they were arming or who they were backing. Trust me, they are already corrupt.
Wild Rose:
You write: ‘ I guess we’re not a genocidal society. On the other hand how is it that so many here keep ignoring the fact that Iran is constantly on the war path with everyone and their cousin who is not Islamic? ‘
In seven years we have been warned of the ‘Butcher of Belgrade’ - and the (US led) West butchered the Balkans. There has been the ‘Butcher of Baghdad’ and the (US led) West has butchered Iraq. Now the most dangerous man on earth lives in Tehran and threatens our very existence (inspite of clearance by the International Atomic Energy Agency.) I await the ‘Tyrant of Tehran’ creeping into bulletins. (Oh, that someone would write of the ‘W …..rs’ of Washington and Whitehall.)
However, a current political furore to further demonise Iran, are recent hangings of ‘political opponents.’ Hanging, putting to death in any way, is beyond barbaric and has no place anywhere on earth. The state becomes equal to the most chilling mass murder.
However, to hear Washington condemn as barbaric, Iran, for their actions, when they are in the process of hanging (read lynching) the entire legitimate government of Iraq, would be laughable, were it not so shameful, illegal and appalling. As an occupying force, the US and UK are responsible for everything their puppet ‘government’ does. This this is being done in their - thus our - name. Of course the US has a pretty impressive putting to death record.
Let us hear no more of human rights violations of other governments, from the US and UK., until they halt theirs. Leave the protests to those who genuinely believe in human rights, not to those who illegally ignore and abuse all that fine Treaties and Conventions have ever stood for.
Meanwhile, UK Prime Minister Gordon Brown (who wrote the UK cheques for the Iraq disaster, a country destroyed, four million fleeing and displaced and the genocide of one and a quarter million deaths, since the 2003 invasion, according to a recent, highly respected pollster, ORB) refuses to meet Robert Mugabe at the European-African summit in December. Reason? ‘Abuse, torture and mass intimidation of political opponents’. Indeed, but people in glass houses …..
Dear jassim..
Fair enough. Sort of.
To be honest with you I detest all of the governments that you have mentioned, except maybe the current one of Iraq. My heart goes out to the Iraqis who have been used and abused by all of these masters of war.
Screw all of them. Government is evil. Down with government.
And, jassim, I was making a point about freedom of speech and hate crime, more than anything else.
“Regarding Saturday’s Washington Post report, Blackwater said it was based on one-sided information from the Iraqi Ministry of the Interior.”
The whole imperialist enterprise is based on one-sided information, e.g. Saddam’s WMDs and ties to Al Qaeda. The difference is “us” versus “them”, ain’t it? As you can see from the photo there must be a white anglo-saxon protestant male in clear view to legitimize the operation. Fortunately the world keeps turning despite their most frantic efforts.
Moyock, NC, United States of America. It’s funny how the US has always driven their trucks into some remote mountain nest or isolated swampland, poured concrete, drilled, blasted and bunkerized like some squirrel putting away nuts for wintertime. A near instinctual behavior conjoined with the rank and file of the human pack, obedience to alpha authority, quashing of higher ordered thoughts, drone like allegiance to some vague ideal, or the Queen of the colony. How can these ants be stopped when they are doing what they do best?
Video of mass murder on Tuesday - “investigation” of smuggling on Saturday. How about holding the higher ups, i.e., Erik Prince responsible for the murders on Tuesday?
Investigation will mean something when Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and Prince are sitting next to each other in handcuffs at the Hague.
For now it’s just another phony smokescreen.
And, speaking of investigation, maybe someone should look into the fact that now that the C.I.A. controls Afghanistan heroin is half price and twice as strong and it all seems to be coming from Afghanistan . . .
Does anyone else remember “Air America” and the heroin from SE Asia that damaged so many lives a generation ago?
Blackwater is a disease.
Guys, this is deliberate. Blackwater does not survive if there is no war. They are not fighting for peace. They are fighting for chaos. There is no money for peace. This should not surprise anyone. So next time you see a ‘terrorist attack, thank your president for arming those same ‘terrorist’ via bloackwater and gang.
BLACKWATER WHAT YOU SEE IS WHAT YOU GET:
Look at the photo up there. What do you see?
Three or four civilians, armed to the teeth, basically hired muscle, carrying out…what? security? protection?
(what is security? protecting whom? under what law?)
What you see are civilians, from the US, visitors on foreign soil, armed to teeth, using weapons, force without any kind of recognizable rank, authorization, legal identity, legitimacy.
Why they are there:
They are there because they are well paid by US taxpayers to be there. That is their goal, to get US taxpayers money.
If they kill in the course of their duties it is not to uphold law order, it is in order to get paid by those who might uphold law and order. Thus they are killing on contract, when they kill. They are not members of the US forces, are not trained by the US government, do not take the same oaths if there are any, do not have any special designation or duty or code that is recognizable by civilians in Iraq.
They work for hire. But they carry out duties that are closely intertwined with military justice and laws governing military conduct and military codes, and also civilian justice.
This authority has to be granted by the people, the justices etc. of the US, and it must be directly overseen, governed, administered, trained etc. by the US government.
But, here, you have independent gunslingers at work.
Now, let’s assume just for arguments sake that their work is effectively carried out. What then? Does it make things any better in Iraq?
What does the local population perceive?
Well, the local population sees just what you and I see in the photo: Civilians with guns motivated by personal financial gain, representing their own fanancial gain, using force in an essentially illegitimate, lawless fashion.
They fear them, and then loathe them. This is primarily because these mercenaries, or civilians packing weapons, do not represent any kind of reliable legal status or authority, as would be the case with US soldiers or personnel (as bad as the situation is already).
Their very presence of course tends to increase instability because it increases fear and loathing in the populace, due to the appearance of greater and more irresponsible use of lawless force. Their very existence and activities would instantaneously increase fear and loathing in the populace and lead to the acquisition of more guns per household in the occupied populace, and in vigilantiism in the occupied populace.
Just look at the photo, and imagine yourself as an Iraqi.
If these people were actually government workers in military uniform, they’d be much less disconcerting.
How can a country that makes its postal workers wear uniforms, put armed mercenaries on the streets of Baghdad, who are essentially out of uniform, and without clear legal identity or mandate?
This is an administrative, military and financial catastrophe from the start. It’s an administrative fiasco, a nightmare brought on by Rumsfeld and Cheney’s failed concept of outsourcing and privatising all military functions. It can’t work. It’s intrinsically flawed thinking.
Why look any further.
Bush is all about making things fail from the very first move.
Conclusion:
Resign Bush now, and the war is much closer to being resolved with a conclusion that would be favorable to US people and business.
Keep Bush in, and America will be pushing itself farther and farther away from succeeding, and even from maintaining its financial, military, political, and cultural edge in the Iraq, in the Middle East and around the world.
Bush is taking America off course and downhill. America cannot afford Bush.
It’s time to stop the bleeding, physically and fininancially.
If Bush leaves and the army is allowed to function on without his interference, things will dramatically improve in Iraq. I guarantee it. And America would be able to either stabilize the situation legally and/or pull out in an orderly and honorable fashion.
There is no reason to wait 14 months to do it. Push Bush out now, and put some reasonable replacement in his place to clean up this mess.
Blackwater employees are the epitome of “unlawful combatants.”
Incidentally, I am for immediate withdrawal of US troops.
I have always been against this invasion and war.
The above argument is purely logical.
Imagine if your local police were frequently in civilian clothing, and armed, and working as private contractors on their own recognizance, in small groups or bands.
What would you think? How could you tell them from criminals?
It is about the logic of using civilian contractors to carry out military as well as quasi policing functions in Iraq.
It is impossible because to use authority such as this you must be uniformed, bear clear insignia, and be absolutely and recognizably trained and governed by government administration.
$4 billion of the two hundred billion Bush is asking Congress for, is for Harley Davidson bikes for the Halliburton gang. H/D needs the business.
The US death spiral in Iraq, interpreting the news:
Flow chart:
1. Somewhere in Iraq, iraqis are killed by suicide attacks.
2. Somewhere in Iraq American soldiers and contractors are killed by roadside bombs etc.
3. Somewhere in Iraq a contractor or soldier kills an innocent iraqi
4. Iraqi neighborhood sees bands of Blackwater contractors.
5. Iraqi’s read, witness and hear about these events.
6. Iraqi’s in said neighborhood feel no protection for themselves or their wives or children by law.
7. Many of these Iraqi’s begin to acquire rifles and guns for self defense because they see no other way to protect their lives.
8. Soldiers begin going through neighborhoods busting down doors to search for weapons.
9. Soldiers frequently find weapons, arrest and or kill occupants, and damage property.
10. This is reported as the arresting of insurgents, but in fact what are being arrested are Iraqi’s who keep guns just like Americans for self defense.
11. Next time, Iraqis being to fight back. These are now termed insurgents, and killed or arrested, and tortured and or killed in prisons.
12. Now, the entire neighborhood sees no other alternative but arm itself and start to shoot at soldiers and contractors in a desperate attempt to keep them away from the neighborhood.
13. This is now a fullscale resistance war, created to a large extent by the occupiers.
14. The press reports every incident as “counter insurgency”, or “terrorism” when it is really just people holing up in their neighborhoods trying to keep poorly managed armed US personell out of their neighborhoods.
One last thing.
50% of the American voting public has voted Republican.
The entire administration of Republican policy since the opening of Guantanamo, much of the war in Afghanistan and the entire Iraq aggression has been unlawful, based on falsified reports, and filled with war crimes, including murders, slanders and calumnies, bribery, graft, fraud, tortures and perverted acts….
The republican party really needs to get Bush out immediately in order remove itself from this legal affiliation.
It is his administration of the mandates that has led to the legal abuses.
Nixon resigned for less than this.
Bush’s resignation would clear things up a lot for both parties, and for the American people.
Each Iraqi household is allowed to have one AK-47 for home defense. If the troops or police, etc find two, Oh-oh, ____ terrorists. I guess no decent terrorist would only have one AK-47.
well einstein:
have to disagree on the uniform thing..only locally..
i saw the police put on uniforms in 1955 in the town i
grew up in and they got mean and the force grew..
i saw the police in the town i live in now put on uniforms
in 1984 and they got mean and the force grew..
‘n since at least ‘81 i have been expecting the jackboots
to come stomping down the driveway..
‘n i wonder if i created this
ken
As I’ve said before, if the shoe were on the other foot and some foreign power had invaded us and threw out the sewer rats that are infesting our government, we might feel grateful, if they would turn the country back over to us.
However, if they stayed on, until they felt we were capable of “governing ourselves,” and wanted to provide a government based on what they considered proper government, we would fight back and try to throw the occupiers out of the country.
The occupiers would call us insurgents and terrorists, they would bomb and strafe us, pick us up and torture us, hold our families hostage. Every time they hit some small town, the dead would all be insurgents or “collateral damage” (don’t count the women and children)
We would welcome the help from Canadian and Mexican friends who could supply us with either arms, or fighters, who would become “outside agitators or terrorists” in the lexicon of the occupiers.
We would use every dirty trick we could think of to kill off the occupiers, who would probably have us out-gunned, and the quislings who went along with the occupation.
Read your history, the WW-II Nazi occupations and the resistance groups that fought them, despite the horrifying reprisals, the random gunning down of civilians, etc.
Unless they managed to kill us all, eventually we would win. We would have the land on our side, the motivation, and the fact that, to lose would be to lose our identity, to become nothing more than slaves or servants of the rulers.
That is what is going on in Iraq right now. We can call this thing off now, or wait another few years and another few thousand dead Americans, and a few hundred thousand more dead Iraqis, then call it off.
The object lesson is Vietnam, where the same scenario played itself out after about 58,000 dead Americans and over a million dead Vietnamese. We could have left Vietnam when it became obvious what was going on, with minor casualties.
The predicted domino theory never happened, there was not an invasion of sampans on California beaches. There was a lot of death in Vietnam and there are a lot of birth defects, etc., from Agent Orange and other horrors we dumped on the country, just like the DU we have infected the Middle East and other places on the planet with. But eventually, Vietnam stabilized on its own and is now a trading partner with the US.
We have just got to get out, now, and let things shake themselves out. Sooner or later, it is going to occur to the Iraqis that perhaps Blackwater or the CIA blew up a few mosques and market places to get a civil war going so we could stay in and take their oil. They might begin to question that all sides and factions are getting arms from us. Someday they will figure out who their real enemy is, then look out!
kengarjagalouski September 22nd, 2007 6:44 pm
Thanks. Most Americans are in one way or another afflicted by police brutality some time in their lives. I’ve experienced it, too. Just in situations where, for no reason at all I’ve been hassled by police.
And it’s gotten worse and worse in recent years.
My comments were not a pandering apologia for police, though I’ve got to admit that in some ways my argument was colored slightly by the current totally rightwing discourse that dominates American life.
I just meant to show that Bush and his enablers have contradicted themselves in the implementation of their own policy. I wanted to show that the concept of introducing plainclothes mercenaries to police Iraq was guaranteed to fail in its purported mission.
I wanted to point out that logically speaking, whether you support the Iraq war or not, whether you are a firebreathing interventionist and imperialist warmonger or not, Bush is an incompetent military leader and administrator.
Leaving aside the question of peace, we are now engaged in a war. Before there is peace, there is a war, which will have to be ended.
Bush’s policies and actions are self defeating, disasterous, suicidal. And though I loathe Republicans and all war supporting democratic policitians and their supporters, I believe that can all agree on one thing.
Bush needs to be replaced immediately with someone who can handle the situation with some small amount of professionalism, intelligence, leadership ability and fiscal probity.
The Bush administration and the NRA will resolve this problem by outlawing the tracing of weapon serial numbers and making it a crime to suggest or report of war profiting by any and all our wonderful loyal war contractors.
Blackwater is a mercenary force greater in numbers than the US military in Iraq. I say, let them take over the mission. They can cover our GI’s back while they exit from Bush’s War. Then the Blacwater mercenary force, which is more truly Bush’s army than is the US army, can take over fighting Bush’s War for oil. It is fitting.
It isn’t only Blackwater that ought to be going home for killing innocents and smuggling weapons, but the Bush administration has protected from the consequences of their actions. Here are some new pictures of torture at Abu Ghraib published last year:
http://www.antiwar.com/news/?articleid=2444
Amnesty Internation issued its 2006 annual report that includes the following information about the other contractors, too:
They’re a murderous bunch of mercenaries…
denissail, I believe you said it all!
JH___Good idea you have, bring the troops home ASAP and let Bush`s Blackwater killers stay and clean up Bush`s war. Best idea I have seen yet. They have better equipment than the regular army does so it should be simple.
Apparently the mob would offer “protection” against accidents — for instance you just happen to get your kneecaps busted when you’re walking to your car one evening after work. They worked the insurance and accident “industry” at the same time, if you take my meaning.
Regional stability and peace would be a disaster to the m.i.c. and Blackwater’s contracts. It would be the mother of all ironies if it turned out that they were arming sides against one another to keep the fire of violence stoked and, thus, their contracts renewed and expanded…
Simonhhh
This “anti-genocide” campaigner Dr Gregory H. Stanton contributed a chapter to a book that denies the U.S. actually lost the Vietnam war - “The Real Lessons of the Vietnam War: Reflections Twenty-Five Years After the Fall of Saigon” edited by John Norton Moore and Robert F. Turner.
.
JH September 22nd, 2007 10:26 pm
Not true about leaving Blackwater there. All its doing is building a crime organization that will be dealing in weapons, drugs, prostitution and labor trafficking. That’s how Al Quaeda got into gear. That was Bush’s and the neocon’s earlier “Blackwater.” It was a private army started by the neocon objectives in Afghanistan during the cold war.
In fact, some thinking leads me to surmise that these contractors are being picked off like flies by the local militias in Iraq, and getting some very raw treatment also, in order to discourage these mercenaries from going to Iraq for profit.
This probably accounts for the recent Mai Lai style retaliation on the part of the Blackwater mercenaries, firing indiscriminately into the crowd.
I don’t believe that Blackwater publishes its casualty figures. That is the problem. If I am wrong, perhaps someone could find the figures somewhere.
Anyway, the Iraqi militias will make mince meat of these mercenaries. Bush is more interested in protecting them than he is in protecting soldiers, since these mercenaries seem to be more expensive and less expendable than enlisted soldiers.
Leaving them in there is a fiasco in every way, especially for the US treasury.
They are totally unable to control the situation there.
All they can do is engage in black market activity and crime, and get killed, costing the US government ever greater sums of money.
This kind of activity is destroying the economy.
Blackwater.
Bush’s ‘Einsatsgruppe’. (look it up - they worked on the Russian front in WWII)
wild rose September 22nd, 2007 3:11 pm
“incitement to genocide should not be confused with protected speech. Genocidal societies lack constitutional protection for countervailing speech, and should be treated differently than in democracies.”
“If you’re referring to the US here, which I believe you are, how is it that you and I are able to carry on this conversation? I guess we’re not a genocidal society.”
I understand your intention, however the extent of free speech in a with ’so called’ constitutional protections is relative. Countervailing voices were not heard in Germany circa 1930’s against the Nazi Party for the same reason Common Dreams progressive opinions in 2007 America. Progressive views are distinctly in the minority. The Bu$hCo Kleptocracy and the Military Industrial OIL & MEDIA complex couldn’t give a SHIT how we parrot on, at CDs, Anti-War, Chris Floyd etc We would represent an audience of less than 1%….correct me if I am wrong please….
IF HOWEVER, these views found their way on MSM the aforesaid Military Industrial OIL & MEDIA complex would be wiretapping, singling out, mysterious disappearances, assignations, secret renditions etc Look what happened to Joseph Wilson, Padilla the list endless going back to creation by Congress in the National Security Act of 1947,
Minority dissent is fine in America 2007 just don’t go Main Stream… Notice how the TRUTH was LOST or MANGLED on MSM about ABUGRAIB or FALLUJA etc
Galen September 23rd, 2007 5:23 am
Blackwater.
Bush’s ‘Einsatsgruppe’….CORRECT
thomas j hussey September 22nd, 2007 3:18 pm
“My major concern is that Blackwater is Dick Cheney’s Praetorian Guard that will eventually be turned on demonstrators in the U.S., a replica of Hitler’s brownshirts.”
And it will be citizens’ tax dollars paying for the creation of this police state. Maybe congress will consider hiring security from China instead of paying Blackwater such extravagant and outrageous fees.
we need to realize that the US gov’t WANTS two failed states in afghanistan and iraq, one for oil, one for heroin production (that’s right: there’s token poppy eradication, but there’s billions to be made off the books selling smack to europe & the US and elsewhere; where would the $$ go? for the off the books operations, of course, to avoid any accountability at all). the failed states also necessitate perpetual intervention, distract and destabilize neighboring countries (iran of course, but turkey, jordan, syria, etc.), and strengthen israel. THE GOAL IS A FAILED STATE.
btw, in one way the US did not really “lose” in vietnam. the whole world watched the genocidal decimation of another country, and they got the point.
The full text of the story printed elsewhere mentions the fact that trigger for investigation ocurred when Turkey demanded to know why PKK infilitrators and other criminals were armed with very late model US weapons. They turned over the serial numbers which began the investigation.
Just another big joke.
These men were simply obeying orders. Yeah right.
John Wayne is alive and well.
on another note, some of you might enjoy this. http://www.lucasgray.com/video/p…peacetrain.html music by cat stevens
I read a couple of articles not long ago that hinted that some of the “friendly fire” incidents might have been in response to GIs not going along with some buddies who were profiting from the drug trade.
Remember, “If you’re not with us, you’re against us.” is not Bush’s invention. The mob has used it for years and there is lots of money to be made, just by turning a blind eye, or being a conduit in Afghanistan.
If you don’t like it, or it is thought there is a chance you might blow the whistle, you might just get offed in “self defense.”
When one hires prostitutes to do what they do, one should not be surprised when they do the same work for another customer!
You wonder if the arms, which the Pentagon/White House is accusing Iran of giving to Iraqi insurgents, aren’t actually coming from Blackwater.
Blackwater=Whitewash.
WmC -
Think Mosque bombing in Samarra that triggered the Sunni-Shia violence.
Remember the Brits in Iraqi civilian dress who got arrested with makings of roadside bombs, Iraqi issue weapons and other bomb making devices several years ago? Yeah, the ones who the Brith Army busted out literally by knocking down the jail and spiriting them away.
Just wondering - same type ops - naw, we wouldn’t do that -HAH!
Blackwater prez on bombing Iran: http://www.blackwaterusa.com/btw2006/archive/112006btw.html