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Today's Top News
Unmanned Plane Patrolling Stretch of Canada-U.S. Border
A warning to Canadians smuggling batches of "B.C. bud" or other contraband into the United States: Beware the eyes in the sky.
An unmanned plane the U.S. government has been using to patrol North Dakota's northern border since 2009 is now flying along a greater section of America's northern frontier, stretching from Spokane, Washington, to the Lake of the Woods region in Minnesota.
Officials with U.S. Customs and Border Protection say the aircraft can transmit live, streaming video and radar images from above the huge swaths of rugged — and remote — terrain that are a haven for criminals sneaking marijuana and ecstasy into the U.S. and cocaine into Canada.
"We're trying to work the border smarter, not harder," said John Priddy, director of National Air Security Operations Center-Grand Forks in North Dakota, where the aircraft is based. "There's new technology being deployed, which will make it more difficult to conduct illicit activities."
Resembling a giant mechanical wasp, the remote-controlled Predator B — which has a length of 12 metres and a wingspan of 20 metres — can stay in the air for 20 hours at a time and typically flies at about 6,000 metres.
It is equipped with infrared sensors and ground-movement detectors and can produce radar images showing tire tracks, shoe impressions and anything else that looks out of place.
Priddy said officials are not deploying the plane each day with an expectation that they will catch a criminal in the act. Instead, they send the Predator B to specific areas of the border, which have been flagged by authorities, and conduct surveillance missions — sometimes over a period of days.
Priddy said the aircraft has contributed to arrests, though he declined to elaborate because investigations are ongoing.
Similar aircraft have been deployed in Iraq and Afghanistan and along parts of the U.S.- Mexico border. The long-term goal is to have them flying along the entire length of the Canada-U.S. border.
Supt. Warren Coons, director of the RCMP Integrated Border Enforcement Team, said Wednesday he has not received information about the surveillance program's effectiveness and declined to offer a personal opinion.
Coons said there are no plans to adopt such technology in Canada, but he wouldn't discount it, either. He noted Canadian authorities use other forms of visible and covert technology — he declined to say what — at points of entry and in remote sections along the border. Improved communication between U.S. and Canadian authorities has helped to identify vulnerable areas, he said.
Some Canadian residents who live along the border wonder whether the Predator B is anything more than a fancy toy.
In the two years the Predator B has been patrolling the North Dakota-Manitoba border, southern Manitoba legislature representative Clifford Graydon said he's never heard of any arrests linked to the aircraft.
He said his counterparts across the border have told him the machine has had mechanical issues and doesn't perform well in bad weather.
"I'm not certain how effective it's been," he said.
Graydon did acknowledge, however, that the smuggling of drugs and guns is a problem and that the mere publicity of the Predator B could serve as a deterrent.
Thomas Butler, mayor of the Alberta border village of Coutts, said he hopes the plane's cameras are focused on catching criminals and not prying into people's windows.
"I have no problem personally as long as all they're doing is monitoring activity at the border," he said.
U.S. authorities said they have no interest in people's private affairs.
They said the Predator B has been a reliable performer, though federal aviation restrictions prevent them from flying in bad weather.
The extension of the Predator B's flight path comes at a time when criminal activity along America's northern border is getting the attention of that country's highest officials. This month, U.S. President Barack Obama signed into law legislation that requires the U.S. Office of National Drug Control Policy to develop within six months a plan to better co-ordinate anti-drug efforts between federal, state and local law enforcement agencies along the border.
Authorities say smugglers have used all forms of transportation to cross the 49th parallel, including all-terrain vehicles and snowmobiles.
A report released late last year by the U.S. Government Accountability Office noted the Spokane sector, which includes parts of Washington and Montana, has seen a lot of smuggling using low-flying aircraft.
RCMP officials acknowledge the use of small planes and helicopters to smuggle drugs is a "vulnerability" that has been identified in yearly threat assessments.
In 2009, a high-profile joint U.S.-Canada investigation dubbed Operation Blade Runner saw authorities intercept two helicopter shipments of marijuana from B.C. to Washington and Idaho. It led to the arrests of eight Canadians and one American.
Drug smugglers have also been caught snowshoeing across the border. In B.C., they've even smuggled drugs using an underground tunnel.
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84 Comments so far
Show AllCRAP! I am sure I have seen these guys flying over the Venture County area. You cannot believe how low some of these dudes fly over populated areas.
Then there are the wanabe World War Two fighter Pilots. One of these days………..KABOOM!
Do they think that no one looks up? Why just the other day a C130 flew over and I could swear the pilot was waving at me.
You know what they say……….dododododo…..”Watch the skies!”
There getting closer folks. What's next?
Well the B model has hard mounts for wepons, bombs and such, maybe start with flares, then well sky the limit.
I see the one in the pic has no de-icing boots but thats an easy fix, with modern digital and IR camera technology they should have no trouble working in snow an other foul weather.
The question is how many of them Shifty Kanucks can we keep from sneakin into the USofA :)
>^^<
"The question is how many of them Shifty Kanucks can we keep from sneakin into the USofA :)"
If any of them are dumb enough to want to. I think we will be getting more surveillance as they keep tightening the screws on people trying to leave this US vale of tears.
If anyone remembers the movie "Casablanca," people were killing, prostituting themselves, doing anything to get one of the rare "exit visas." We keep getting closer to that sort of life, here.
I got news for you, they've been over us for quite sometime now. In fact, when Napolitano made her famous announcement that they would be bringing them to the border with Mexico, they had already been populating the US skies for a while. Here you go, my friend:
Pentagon the largest holder of FAA authorizations for drone use in US
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/01/faa-270-active-drone-authorizations/
http://articles.cnn.com/2010-03-12/us/border.drones_1_border-patrol-predator-unmanned-aircraft?_s=PM:US
http://www.aolnews.com/2010/06/14/push-for-more-border-drones-faces-regulatory-flak/
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/01/22/AR2011012204111.html
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2011/01/24/privacy_issues_loom_as_police_use_of_drones_begins_to_rise/
This was a "Mexican" drone (wink, wink) that crashed in El Paso
http://tinyurl.com/4c9l4cz
Here's the alternative media version of the same event:
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/12/radar-mexican-drone-crashes-el-paso/
Obama: Never Mind Afghanistan, It’s All About The Drones
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/12/never-mind-afghanistan-its-all-about-the-drones/
Defending Against Drones
How our new favorite weapon in the war on terror could soon be turned against us.
http://www.newsweek.com/2010/02/25/defending-against-drones.html
‘We can see everything’: USAF launches ‘airborne surveillance system’
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/01/we-everything-usaf-launches-airborne-surveillance-system/
Yes this is a troubling development. And how much does this cost? for what benefit?
Is it fun for the border patrol to have federal dollars and wartools at their disposal?
I'm calling my congressman.
The Government ordered hundereds last year plenty to go around. I have no idea what the cost-per-hour is to operate one. I'm sure it's classified!
Ok 41.5 million for 5 for DHS so 8.3 million each, plus two operators. plus gas ??? that's all I can find on the inter webs.
>^^<
"The woods are lovely, dark and deep,
But I have promises to keep,
And miles to go before I sleep,
And miles to go before I ---excuse me Sir. Please put your hands on your head and turn around.
What? Who's that? Is that a gun?
Hands on your head asshole!
I was just hiking in the moonli-BLAM! BLAM!
What we are becoming, Maplefudge.
Joe
¡ʎuunɟ noʎ
I saved that,, hope you don't mind... soon as the tears leave my eyes that is ROFLOL
Too good!
>^^<
This is the funniest comment I've ever seen.
this should give one a third-trimester pregnant pause...
This is, of course, a way to protect our domestic pot growers from unfair foreign competition. It is the last refuge of the family farm, and more lucrative than many crops grown here. If only we would start growing opium poppies, we might leave Afghanistan sooner.
"U.S. authorities said they have no interest in people's private affairs."
phew... had me worried there for a minute! you never know what to believe until you hear it directly from "u.s. authorities."
My thoughts exactly. I can only hope they don't mistake my weedy backyard for some heinous drug growing operation and send the stormtroopers in to arrest me for growing...native shrubs?
But then not to worry; the TSA doesn't keep those pictures from the naked body scanner either.
Remember what Obummer said last year, "Preditor, you'll never hear it coming" I'm/he's serious!
>^^<
"In 2009, a high-profile joint U.S.-Canada investigation dubbed Operation Blade Runner saw authorities intercept two helicopter shipments of marijuana from B.C. to Washington and Idaho. It led to the arrests of eight Canadians and one American."
wow. it must now be nearly impossible to find marijuana in washington and idaho. keep up the good work.
a joint investigation? good one...
This is your government. This is your government on drugs.
We have all these drones to sell, so we have to find "uses" for them. You know, like keeping tabs on the hordes of Canadians and other terrorists who hike through hundreds of miles of desolate open prairie to cross over the North Dakota border every year, perhaps to blow up the concrete buffalo in Jamestown.
Meanwhile, so many states and cities are going bankrupt while we pay big $$ to diddle around with our weapons systems in the wilderness.
Joe
At 8.5 million a copy maybe if we catch one we can ransom it back lol. The best part nobody gets hurt!
>^^<
Now-now, that would take money from the para-military law enforcement complex and put it in the hands of I don't know, education, health care, infrastructure. all those guys with guns have to get honest work! They are government workers you know, with unsustainable pensions and perks!
All those investigators with time to burn, might start looking at Wall St scams, Election Finance, White Collor crime in general. If they can't look for ilegal drugs, because they were no longer illegal.
That could mess the whole SYSTEM! what are you a commie :)
>^^<
This is part and parcel of the continuing slide into a total police state. The "War On Drugs" has been a vast failure in all regards except one - it has allowed the authoritarian state to continue to take away rights and increase surveillance of the populace to protect us from the evil drugs!
"Thomas Butler, mayor of the Alberta border village of Coutts, said he hopes the plane's cameras are focused on catching criminals and not prying into people's window"... All of these technologies and intrusions are promoted as a good thing for security and stemming criminal activities and are eventually turned inward and used against the populace.
First they came for the... fill in the blank and too many still cheer on the attention to their safety little knowing that they will eventually come for them. Only torture terrorists? What about Manning and Padilla? No military operations on American soil? Posse comiatus gone with 9/11. Freedom from unreasonable searches? Gone to protect us from terrorists and criminals. And on it goes. Anyone paying attention knows how this ends and it's not good for the common person or "freedom and democracy" TM.
Pretty soon were gonna have the drug wars between the street pushers and the ones in the white coats....
Sounds like Mexico?
>^^<
Marijuana, coke, and heroin together make up only a small fraction of the drug abuse in the US. Prescription drugs make up the bulk, while, of course, alcohol causes far more deaths and ruined far more families. Oh, but I forgot, alcohol is legal, and big pharma just keeps pumping out anti depressants and pain killers.
So, if a drone spots a human in the wilderness, is he or she automatically a drug smuggler?
Silver Fox, your children and most everyone else already have their brains altered by heavy doses of mind-softening mass media TV pap and government sanctioned propaganda.
You have to ask though: did prohibition work? If there is demand and that demand is illegal then crime will supply it. End of story.
You might want to read Philipoko's script including his humorous last line. I'd have to disagree on one point though. In most cases Marijuana use is not drug abuse, not that I have any use for it or other drugs myself, but unless it is affecting safety in some way, it is harmless.
The "war on drugs" is phony -and just how much Coke do the politicians in Washington get through?
Really? Highly trained? Do they speak Canadian?
No we don't want anyones mind altered unless of course we can program them to buy crap they don't need and don't really want. Also program them to be terrified of everything and everybody. It would be interesting to legalize marijuana for one year and see what that does for consumption of all the crap we are told we must buy or we are not patriots.
Drug use in Places like Portugal and the Netherlands went DOWN since they decriminalized possession and acknowledged that if people want drugs, no amount of laws will stop them from getting them.
Heroin amd Marijiuana was legal in the USA prior to the 1920's.
The DEA and the "war on drugs" serves NO PUPOSE.
Decriminalize and shift the monies saved to treatment programs and the US will be billions and billions ahead.
The US has 2 point some odd Million in jail with millions and millions ,more having Criminal records for crimes like "posession of Marijuana". These criminal records make it harder for parents to get jobs which in turn harms children in the family unit.
Consider that in the Netherlands Marijuana possession and use NOT a crime yet they have less usage of the same then in the USA.
It might be wise for any wedding parties either side of the border to move further back from said border.
Oh! Right! No problem, the Predator is not armed -yet.
Really, try reading the unPatriot Act, and the enabling laws for DEA drug interdiction, and come back with that trash-talk about a free country! Where you can't carry a gun within 500ft of a congress critter.
>^^<
Siver Fox, you appear to have no sense of humour or comprehension of satire.
Silver Fox: "Over 95% say they began their drug habit with marijuana"
That's a non-sequitur. The idea that using Marijuana leads to other drugs is BS. They wanted to mess around with drugs due to peer pressure, boredom or whatever. Using marijuana didn't cause or lead to an addiction to other drugs -you might as well say you can correlate drinking milk with drug abuse. Marijuana is the easiest thing to get -and you can smoke it just like cigarettes.
Do cigarettes lead to drug addiction? Well yes, in reality nicotine is the most addictive drug out there, but you'd have a hard time persuading anyone that smoking leads to the kind of drug abuse you are talking about.
Terrorists carry backpacks, therefore all people carrying backpacks are terrorists, right?
Contortionists are indeed some coo-raaazy-cats!
"Indeed alcahol ABUSE is a seriou issue. So is the use of mind altering drugs. Does anyone honstly believe that becasue alcahol abuse is a serious problem that use of mind altering drugs by teens and pre teens is then alright?"
Let's invert that argument shall we?
So you would just let the teens and pre teens live in a world where alcohol is cheap and easily accessible in any number of homes? Huh?
Just where is your concern for them?
Shouldn't we make them criminals for possession of alcohol to protect them? To protect society? I mean, alcohol abuse is much much more prevalent, and much more likely to be a factor in violent crime than marijuana could ever be.
I mean, shouldn't we revisit prohibition, so DHS can hand out some more contracts to drone manufacturers to run down those moonshiners that would suddenly appear?
See how difficult it is for your argument to stay rational?
They also drank milk. Let's make milk illegal
Where drugs have been decriminalized, drug use has decreased along with the crime rate. More people have died the past year in Mexico as a direct consequence of our draconian drug laws than both sides of both wars we are engaged in. "Do you think marijuana use by teens is OK?" I suggest parents whos teen agers are abusing drugs, alcohol, FOOD, etc..., take a hard look in the mirror. Abuse does not occur in a vacuum.
You are alluding to the problems associated with the opium trade of that era, up until the Communist Revolution.
Nice try.
Smoke some cannabis sativa, then clean your house, or do some reading, or create some art, then come down.
Smoke some opium, sit comatose, then come up.
Now tell us all how they are equal, as per your insinuation.
Note, some prefer the sleepy benefits of a nice Indica, or Indica dominant hybrid, for pain management, etc, before bedtime, but it STILL does not compare to opium.
The discussion has been about whether it best to keep criminal, or decriminalize the use of cannabis.
Since that has been the thread in our discussion, and your discussion on this thread with others, then it would be reasonable for me to assume, that your comment about what happened in China, was intended to relate to that ongoing debate.
You wrote…
"And the coutry is full of dopers. Look what happened in China from the mid 1800s till 1945."
Since you have referred to cannabis users as "dopers" time and time again in your posts on this thread, then of course I would assume that you were insinuating that what happened in China would have happened if that trade were cannabis, and thus equating the two.
You wrote…
"No, pot does not compare to opium and opium does not compare to crack, lSD, meth, heroin, etc and most kids who get on those drugs almost all began by using marijuana."
Since you seem to acknowledge that cannabis is of less harm, then you are apparently leaning heavily on the gateway drug fictitious argument.
Alcohol is THE biggest so-called gateway drug. So, in keeping with your principles, should we revisit prohibition?
See the question mark? I'm asking, not putting words in your mouth.
The Netherlands has less drug usage then the USA.
They have 1/8th teen pregnancies. They have a fraction of the violent crime. They have far fewer people in Jail. They are not a country full of "dopers" . More people drink alchohol in the Netherlands then take marijuana.
You are wrong on this issue.
http://www.drugwarfacts.org/cms/node/67
Cannabis use amongst people from 15 to 64 in the Netherlands is 5.4 percent 2005 19 percent lifetime. In the US it is 10 percent in 2005 41 percent lifetime.
Other drugs like LSD, Cocaine, Heroin have less usage in the Netherlands.
What the Netherlands has done with Cannabis is seperate the supply of it from the Hard drug market. Since coffee shops are allowed to grow and sell the stuff legally AS LONG AS they do not sell to people under 18 it in the best interests of the shops to ensure the person they sell to is an adult. They also refrain from dealing in harder drugs.
Since the sale seperate from Hard drugs usage is isolated from the same. There no evidence at all it a gateway to other drugs.
When the US had prohibition on Alchohol they had more people dying from drinking alchohol and the usage amongst children went UP. Prior to Prohibition on the US there was in fact LESS consumption of the same amongst children.
People started brewing the stuff in their own homes which carried with it more risks. With people making it in their homes children were exposed to it.
The crime rate went up as well along with corruption amongst Police officers and Public officials.
When people buy drugs like Cannabis illegally they have to deal with the criminal element to do so. This criminal element not only sells harder drugs, but are involved in things like loan sharking, prostitution strong arming and the rest.
Just like prisons serve as a training ground for people who would not normally involve themselves in major crimes and come out of jail worse then when they went in due to that exposure to the hard core criminal element, the drug war in the US does much the same with entire neighborhoods and its families and children continually exposed to that Criminal element.
The Netherlands is a mmeber of the EU and peolple enter and leave the country much more freely then in the United States. There little in the way of Border controls.
All neighboring States have a more liberal attititude towards drugs then does the USA. Further due to the EU and things like hi-speed rail more people enetering and leaving the country are from non bordering States.
Portugal recently decriminalized a wide swathe of drugs and see usage and drug related crimes go down.
Silver Fox,
I appreciate your passion on behalf of youth.
Would like to point out that if drugs such as marijuana were legalized, there would be prohibition for their use by youth such as we have in place for cigarettes and alcohol with ID's required to purchase.
I agree with you that I don't like to see teens using these, even caffeine!
Don't you think that decriminalizing might lessen violent crime? Prohibition is making drug cartels and drug pushing lucrative. We are all victims of drug crimes and their associated costs.
Also, I do not believe you can find a conclusive study that says 95% of marijuana users go on to heavier drugs.
Not arguing with you from the standpoint of someone who uses drugs-- I never have-- just from what I observe first hand.
Don't you think that decades of failure of the "War on Drugs" ought to lead to a new national dialogue?
I hope we can create a more peaceful society where people can be high on life.
"(mariuuana)","marijuan","marijuansa"
I typically don't highlight someone's misspelling, or typos, but that many on the same word? If you want to be taken seriously, take a moment to get the spelling right while taking advantage of the preview comments window, to edit before publishing.
You finally got it right, with "marijuana" in your last question, that rhetorically makes an absurd insinuation, that those against criminalization of use of marijuana, would therefore think "marijuana use by teens is Okay". I don't think many rational adult cannabis users gleefully hand teenagers baggies of pot, however most rational people must conclude at this point, that cannabis isn't going away even after over 30 years of intense interdiction efforts, and thus it is likely, legal or not, that teens are going to get it, if they want it.
As for your rather bold assertion as fact that "95% of teens who had suffered a drug overdose and had to be treated by doctors in a hospital emergency room and said they "started" their drug habit with (mariuuana)"
Huh? Where did you find that fiction printed. Please post the link.
Alcohol surely is the largest so-called "gateway drug", and I don't see you calling for revisiting prohibition on that.
As to the "45% of college freshemn [sic]" who "use" cannabis, according to you. First, I don't think it is true that 45% of college freshmen regularly use cannabis. Send the link to that bit of fiction please. But IF indeed it is true that 45% of college freshmen use cannabis (with the implication being on a regular basis), then I say that's a mighty good commercial FOR cannabis use, after all they didn't sit on their asses after high school did they?
One thing that just blows my mind, are people like you, who purport to be all about the interest of children, but you completely ignore, the broader harm to children, and young adults that demonstrably result from the criminalization of cannabis, and even the harder drugs.
In your world, it is better for the teen to get busted for possession, because somehow in that twisted logic world, that teen will end up with a better life having a felony on their record with some prison or county jail experience with hardened criminals, than it would be for that teen to experience some enhanced colors or psychedelic effects while listening to some Pink Floyd.
I have had many conversations with teens dissuading them from using mind altering drugs of any kind, including alcohol and "cannibus [sic]".
So take your insult "Nope we don't hand marijuana or cannibus out to kids, but people like you insure them that marijua use is (alright)", and shove it.
The fact is, that YOU would rather teens and young adults get locked up for possession of "cannibus [sic]", and somehow you think that is a lesser harm to society.
I went to your news blog http://www.schizophrenia.com/prevention/streetdrugs.html, and was shocked, just shocked at all of the scary, scary, information.
After meandering through many of the links, I've determined that your news blog http://www.schizophrenia.com/prevention/streetdrugs.html, should itself be considered a risk factor in developing schizopophrenia.
For those who might take heed, and not visit your news blog, for fear of developing a higher risk factor for onset of schizophrenia, here is an example of some of the links you will find, there. No, I'm not kidding…
>Lower Level of Stress for Child while growing up May Significantly Lower Schizophrenia Risk
>Social Stress associated with immigration may Increase Risk of schizophrenia
>Social Adversity during childhood linked to Increased Schizophrenia Risk
>Social isolation during childhood, teen, and early adult years is linked to increased Schizophrenia Risk
>Childhood Exposure to Cats with the the T. Gondi parasite may increase schizophrenia risk.
>Country living (vs. City living) between ages 0 and 15 years, is linked to lower schizophrenia risk
and my favorite one of all…
>Nicotine Use by Younger Adults May Reduce Schizophrenia Risk later in life
So Silver Fox, "people like you" want our precious children to develop lung cancer later in life, so they'll have a lower risk of developing schizophrenia? Just what kind of a monster are you?
I used cannabis as a teenager, and don't recommend it for teens especially, but if the choice was hypothetical, and between recommending alcohol or cannabis, then cannabis would be the clear winner.
The most ironic part, about your campaign against cannabis use, is recommending that news blog, that is just chuck full of studies by the professionals of psychiatry.
The same professionals, that prescribe the full bevy of SSRIs to teenagers, and adolescents. The same professionals, who know full well, the risk of psychosis or even suicide from taking those drugs. Those same professionals, also know, that prescribed SSRIs like Zoloft, Prozac, etc., make it out of the hands of the young patients, and into the black market at junior highs, high schools, and colleges. Obviously we need some drones flying around the vaunted halls of psychiatry, and the buildings of Big Pharma, to keep our kids safe.
Google Ritalin and schizophrenia. I'll expect you shall add that to your next rant.
Finally, and I mean.....finally, geesh why the hell have I taken this much time out of my day? Must be some latent psychosis from that great Super Silver Haze I smoked a few days ago.
Anywho…
I submit, the greater danger to society is from that nexus of psychiatry and Big Pharma, who have at an ever more alarming rate, prescribed dangerous drugs to adolescents, teenagers, and adults. This is at high risk to these human beings, and for big profits.
Here is a tidbit from a little article I found, relative to those dangers posed by the nexus of psychiatry and Big Pharma.
Where is your campaign against them?
--------
The Aftermath Of Prozac, Zoloft, Luvox, Fen-Phen, & Many Other Serotonergic Drugs
By Dr. Ann Blake Tracy - Executive Director,
International Coalition For Drug Awareness
www.drugawareness.org
Dr. Ann Blake Tracy, a PhD in Psychology and Health Sciences, has specialized for 10 years in adverse reactions to serotonergic medications. She is the executive director of the International Coalition for Drug Awareness (www.drugawareness.org) and author of the book PROZAC: PANACEA OR PANDORA? (800-280-0730)
WARNING: IT SHOULD BE NOTED THAT A GRADUAL TAPERING OFF OF MEDICATIONS IS SAFEST WITHDRAWAL METHOD TO AVOID SERIOUS WITHDRAWAL EFFECTS (Often there is the terrible withdrawal associated with the SSRIs. Unless patients are warned to come very slowly off these drugs by shaving minuscule amounts off their pills each day, as opposed to cutting them in half or taking a pill every other day, they can go into terrible withdrawal which is generally delayed several months. This withdrawal includes bouts of overwhelming depression, terrible insomnia and fatigue, and can include life-threatening physical effects, psychosis, or violent outbursts.)
If you don't wish to see anyone put in jail for using marijuana, then why the hell are you against legalization of possession?
Incredible.
I'm not posting words in your mouth, but I'm out of a measure of deference assuming that you at least have the capacity for rational thought, and can follow the trajectory of a debate.
You have made the case, according to your beliefs/worldview, that we as a society ought not legalize cannabis consumption for various reasons.
I have countered, that legalization doesn't work, and that continuing the criminalization of cannabis – which includes in many many states, a felony charge for possession of even small amounts – is a larger harm to society.
As to the link http://www.schizophrenia.com/prevention/streetdrugs.html
You posted that, as a reply to my post (hue_sir_name January 27th, 2011 7:22 pm) where I specifically challenged you on the following assertions.
Now take careful note of the quotes which are copied and pasted from your post I was replying to…
I wrote…
As for your rather bold assertion as fact that "95% of teens who had suffered a drug overdose and had to be treated by doctors in a hospital emergency room and said they "started" their drug habit with (mariuuana)"
Huh? Where did you find that fiction printed. Please post the link.
and also in that same post, I wrote (stuff inside quotes is your writing remember)…
As to the "45% of college freshemn [sic]" who "use" cannabis, according to you. First, I don't think it is true that 45% of college freshmen regularly use cannabis. Send the link to that bit of fiction please.
------
So I go to that link
http://www.schizophrenia.com/prevention/streetdrugs.html
Which is a huge document, with tons of links. So I search for keywords according to your quotes. Nothing.
I look and look and look, and cannot find that specific reference.
Could you please help me out here. Find the page where you read that, copy and paste it the text, and then look up at the url, and post that exact link.
Since in your previous posts, you cite schizophrenia as a concern, in it being linked to cannabis use, I thought I would put that in perspective by citing the other links that are on that site.
Take any link text that I quoted as coming from that site, and put it in your search engine, and you will find yourself on a page from the news blog www.schizophrenia.com
Again, here are some of the titles of articles on that news blog www.schizophrenia.com
>Lower Level of Stress for Child while growing up May Significantly Lower Schizophrenia Risk
>Social Stress associated with immigration may Increase Risk of schizophrenia
>Social Adversity during childhood linked to Increased Schizophrenia Risk
>Social isolation during childhood, teen, and early adult years is linked to increased Schizophrenia Risk
>Childhood Exposure to Cats with the the T. Gondi parasite may increase schizophrenia risk.
>Country living (vs. City living) between ages 0 and 15 years, is linked to lower schizophrenia risk
and my favorite one of all…
>Nicotine Use by Younger Adults May Reduce Schizophrenia Risk later in life
I'm not dishonest. You possibly are not dishonest, in that you might just not be ABLE to follow a discussion.
Silver Fox, correlation isn't proof. Your assertion that using marijuana generally leads to other dangerous drugs and is therefore dangerous and consequently should be illegal and banned is a logical fallacy.
Those that want to mess around with drugs will do so. What they start with is irrelevant, it is likely to be whatever is most easily obtained. So they start with alcohol and nicotine, then marijuana and then whatever else the school hopheads are selling.
Millions of people drink alcohol and smoke cigarettes and most don't fit into a drug abuse category. Millions use marijuana and don't fit into a drug abuse category either. Using marijuana doesn't lead in most cases to abuse.
So this is the "White House Office of National Drug Control Policy (ONDCP")?
The ones that have spent billions on anti-marijuana advertising? I'd have to say that it isn't working and I'd also have to question how unbiased they might be.
The single most effective course would be to decriminalise drug use and treat it at its worst as a social and medical problem.
Having a war on anything doesn't seem to solve anything.
Obama's speech in Berlin, just prior to being elected as President of the USA... Apart from other things that 'MUST BE TORN DOWN' was *borders, between nations*
And here he is, patrolling his borders!
¬sc