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TechnoratiCould The US Election Be Stolen?
TOLEDO, Ohio - With John McCain and Barack Obama already swapping accusations of widespread voter fraud, experts warn that a bitter and protracted fight could ensue if the race to the White House is decided by a narrow margin.
![[US voters lining up to register in January 2008. With John McCain and Barack Obama already swapping accusations of widespread voter fraud, experts warn that a bitter and protracted fight could ensue if the race to the White House is decided by a narrow margin. (AFP/File/Ryan Hanson)]](http://www.commondreams.org/files/article_images/stolenvote1020.jpg "stolenvote1020.jpg")
The legal battle over election rules has already made it all the way to the Supreme Court
as Republicans fight to block potentially false registrations from
being validated and Democrats struggle to prevent voter
disenfranchisement.
Compounding the problem is the decentralized US electoral system, which hands often partisan local officials the power to make rules and maintain the voter registration rolls.
"I'm hoping it's not close," said Richard L. Hasen, a professor who specializes in election law at Loyola Law School in Los Angeles.
"I am certain there will be problems on election day."
An estimated nine million new voters have registered for the hotly contested November 4 election, and the Obama campaign says Democratic registrations are outpacing Republican ones by four to one.
The McCain campaign contends that an untold number of those registration forms are false and warns that illegally cast ballots could alter the results of the election and undermine the public's faith in democracy.
Republicans have launched a slew of lawsuits aimed at preventing false ballots from being cast, the most high-profile an attempt to challenge as many as 200,000 of more than 600,000 new registrations submitted in the battleground state of Ohio that was blocked by a Supreme Court ruling Friday.
They point to investigations into whether liberal-leaning community organization ACORN deliberately submitted false voter registrations as proof of "rampant" and widespread fraud which McCain said could be "destroying the fabric of democracy."
But the Obama campaign said this was just a "smokescreen" to divert attention from Republican "plotting" to suppress legitimate votes and to "sow confusion and harass voters and complicate the process for millions of Americans."
Voters whose registrations have been challenged or those who find their names have been removed from the rolls are often required to cast provisional ballots, which are not immediately counted in some jurisdictions and are often rejected due to technicalities.
Meanwhile, a 2007 study by the New York University School of Law concluded that "it is more likely that an individual will be struck by lightning than that he will impersonate another voter at the polls."
"For these problems to be really decisive they have to be within the margin of litigation, which is typically a few thousand votes," Hasen said in a recent interview.
The 2000 election took weeks to resolve as Democrat Al Gore fought Republican George W. Bush all the way to the Supreme Court after Bush won the state of Florida, and thus the election, with a margin of a few hundred votes.
Four years later, Democrat John Kerry conceded defeat despite allegations of widespread voter suppression in Ohio, which handed Bush his second term with a margin of nearly 119,000 votes.
In the meantime, electoral litigation has become part of the standard play book.
The number of lawsuits filed over elections has more than doubled from an average of 94 in the four years prior to the 2000 election to an average of 230 in the six years following, Hasen found in a study published in the Stanford Law Review.
Misinformation has also been used to discourage voters from showing up on election day.
Students in Virginia, Colorado and South Carolina were wrongfully told by voting officials that they could lose their scholarships and their parents would no longer be able to claim them on their income taxes if they registered to vote in their college towns.
The Michigan Department of Civil Rights launched an advertising campaign this week to combat misleading rumors - some started by local officials in mailings to voters - that people would be denied the right to vote if they lost their home to foreclosure, have a criminal record or do not have photo identification.
Such tactics are not new, said Laughlin McDonald, the director of the American Civil Liberties Union's voting rights project.
Despite strict constitutional and legal protections for the right to vote, "the history of the country has been one of flagrant vote denial," McDonald told AFP.
Many of tactics once used to keep blacks from voting in the south - poll taxes, literacy tests, violence and intimidation - have been eliminated.
But some have been adapted, including the practice of purging voting rolls of people likely to vote for the other party by challenging them en masse.
"There's more (attempts at voter suppression) that's been going on in the lead-up to this election than any I can remember," McDonald told AFP.
"The fact remains the people who have the power to make the rules are all too often willing to do so in ways that serve their partisan interests."
109 Comments so far
Show AllThere's a wonderful irony in the Republican party, whose tactics in 2000 included undermining the integrity of the Supreme Court, is concerned with Americans losing faith in democracy.
We haven't lost faith in democracy, in Jefferson's vision and mission statement in the second paragraph of the Declaration of Independence. We have lost faith in YOU who have violate oaths of office and even the law to subvert the system to meet the petty wants of the few.
Democracy is fragile and easily given away--empire and democracy have never been able to co-exist. Those who see America as the new Rome have renounced the Constitution and are on the way to creating a new nation, not under 'God' but under Power--thus 'government of the people, for the people, and by the people' may no longer be convenient on this part of the face of the earth.
Bob Sauerbrey
Indiana
The third and last U.S. Presidential Debate took place in Hempstead, New York on October 14, 2008. Senator Barack Obama of Illinois took off running with an eight-point lead, according to an average of national polls as collected by CNN. Sen. John McCain of Arizona took advantage of Obama’s unruffled carriage and laid the younger candidate’s policies, judgment and qualities of character out on the table. McCain quickly pointed out that he was “not President Bush” as soon as Obama responded with a more critical stance regarding the economic policies of the past eight years. McCain stated that he would enact an “across the board spending freeze,” chop off some programs and get rid of the remaining once the dust settled. On the other hand, Obama presented a more conservative stance about the issue. He would “go through the federal budget page by page, line by line” in order to close programs that aren’t working as they should be. Both candidates declare to bring a resolution to America and its decreasing economy. However, will it leave consumers with the ability to choose where or when to have access to payday loans? That remains unclear. Just because it is said that Americans are living in “the land of the free” doesn’t mean that interest groups (i.e. banks and credit unions) are of the same mind to have the freedom to choose.
Post Courtesy of Personal Money Store
Professional Blogging Team
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If you're voting on a touchscreen and you experience difficulty, you may want to make a cell phone video of your ordeal.
There should be a wealth of videos for YouTube and the Justice Department with those rigged touchscreens!
Who cares? It's not as if a 3rd party candidate will make it to the White House so of course, the election is stolen once again for one evil or the other !
First they stole the elections from the Democrats, but I was not a Democrat, so I said nothing....
Joe
Perfect reference.
Voted in person yesterday in early balloting at the elections office. Easy as pie and no wait.
I don't like the idea of invalid voter registrations much, but it can't be that much of a problem really. Anyway is Napoleon or Micky Mouse registers, it isn't like a worker at a polling place is going to welcome them to vote is it?
ACORN hired people to do the registration and a few or even many of them cheated on some registrations. They all have to get verified anyway right? How many bad ones slip through? I bet very few.
All a Republican smoke screen!
If the Repubs steal the election again, then I think that will be the beginning of the 2nd American civil war. Seriously. I'm ready.
No your not. You are a progressive, and progressives like gun control. So, the Republicans now have almost all the guns.
Obama will have to secure way more than 52% in the polls before we can look for a win for him. Doesn't take much in the way of Republican dirty tricks on Nov 4 to deep-six that puny lead.
Oregon has paper ballots (a mail-in vote).
If Oregon voers vote Obama in with a HUGE landslide victory, it could be a red flag to call into question the votes in other states where McCain "wins"?
Not sure if there are any other vote-by-mail states.
Where I am..Florida....called absentee voting here, but anyone may participate.
Yeah, I mailed in my ballot here in Tampa last week :-)
Election Fraud and Military Intervention
Concerns about deployment of military on U.S. soil growing -- while mainstream media buries its head in the sand: Naomi Wolf
Excerpt: “The following is the spin of military spokespeople in response to questions about the deployment of the First Brigade on US soil for the first time in over 200 years.
The Army Times initially reported that the First Brigade would handle domestic crowd control and subduing 'unruly individuals' and that they had 'lethal and nonlethal technologies' to do so. Then it issued a correction declaring that the 'nonlethal' package was not for domestic crowd control. Then after a hue and cry was raised by many citizens, Northern Command (NorthCom) offered a wholesale revision of their mission – and the mainstream media is eating it up. Here is an excerpt from the articled linked to in the previous sentence:
Despite conspiracy theories that this could be a first step toward martial law in the U.S., there won't be tanks on Main Street or active-duty troops putting down demonstrations. That is barred by federal law banning the military from being used on U.S. soil for domestic law enforcement.
Instead, the soldiers of the 1st Brigade, 3rd Infantry Division at Fort Stewart, Ga., have been training to back up civilian authorities in providing medical care and dealing with chemical, biological, high explosive or nuclear attack.
Not only does this entirely contradict the first Army Times reports, it also egregiously misrepresents to readers the status of US law in regards to this deployment. Yes, there are laws against military policing on US streets -- they are part of both the 1807 Insurrection Act and 1879's Posse Comitatus Act -- but the Defense Authorization Act of 2007 gutted them.
Congress restored some limitations on the President's ability to deploy troops to engage in military policing in 2008 -- but President Bush issued a signing statement declaring he did not feel bound by those limitations. He also can direct these troops -- and the National Guard, and Blackwater -- to engage in military policing of civilian populations simply by verbally and unilaterally declaring a national emergency of whatever kind he wishes.
Unfortunately, the US Army spokespeople are parsing their words and misleading us. And, whatever the stated mission is today, the fact remains that military up the chain of command report to the Commander in Chief -- not to Congress or to you and me, and not to the Governors as most of the National Guard do.
Why do I insist on raising an alarm about this deployment in spite of a great deal of opposition and criticism? (Though I am grateful, too, for a great deal of support.) I insist on raising an alarm because I am aware of world events and not just blinded by American recent history.
In Zimbabwe, a nominal democracy, President Mugabe sent troops to harass, arrest and even kill voters during a closely contested election. Mugabe's challenger called off his own supporters, telling them they should not risk being killed just in order to vote.
In Sierra Leone, a nation I visited shortly after elections, during a fragile democratic voting process troops and militias were both deployed by the contesting political parties to intimidate, beat and arrest voters. In Azerbaijan, troops were sent to intimidate the opposition during the elections -- and now there is no meaningful opposition. Don't trust me -- ask Human Rights Watch or Amnesty International. Troops are sent by leaders in power, even in weakening democracies, to intimidate voters, arrest and harass opposition leaders in tightly fought elections, all over the damn world.
And nothing, nothing, nothing prevents the First Brigade from being positioned around poll locations, intimidating or silencing or threatening or worse those who challenge their voting outcome or their having been purged from the rolls. This at a time when Prof. Mark Crispin Miller of NYU and Robert Kennedy and many others are documenting MILLIONS of voters being systematically purged from rolls -- overwhelmingly by Republican actions -- and early voting is already showing machines flipping selections from Democrat to Republican, and voters becoming upset.”
"Could the election be stolen again?"
"YOU BETCHA!"
(lol)
Peace
There is one sure way of immediately stopping voter/vote count fraud. Immediate trial and if found guilty, within 24 hours execution before a firing squad, all broadcast on live TV.
Yes, let's show the world we mean business when we promote democracy.
I wonder how many bullets it would take to make a Diebold machine implode.
Hmmm.
Someone below said the masses are too dumb to understand elections can be stolen by the machines. Oh those dumb masses. Seriously, there are three parts to this.
1. Do "the masses" understand that there is room for cheating using those electronic voting machines? The answer is often Yes. If not, they could be exposed to studies like those done by Feldman et al of Princeton, so education is key:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJOyz7_sk8I
2. Do "the masses" know what to do about it? No. And frequently neither do graduate students or PhDs.
3. Does anyone have the organized power to force paper trail and other safety mechanisms. Sometimes. Informed voter pressure has caused some states to reject Diebold
Joe
Private corporations are the election officials, kindly counting the votes for the counties and partisan election officials around the US.
Who counts the votes, chooses the leaders.
Our elections do not meet the standards of international democratic elections used by the Carter center when they go into a country to observe elections.
Remember the Strategy:
look at your own weak spots and attack your opponent on those things even if you have to make stuff up:
Why doesn't this automatically clue us in on where to look for the dirt???
"Ayers" means there is someone they are worried about in their own associations who is unamerican or a terrorist or worse.
"wright" means they have some worse problems in the religious area (witchdoctor?)
"voter fraud" means they are dumping votes or voters or even flipping votes.
"giving away our money" the Bush Admin and wall street have already looted the treasury.
"Communist/socialist" means they are asking the Russians for campaign money, and their party has just nationalized the banks, but not the medical system ("gov't is so incompetent we will give all our banking to them")
Palin won't interview? Accuse the other side of being gaffe-prone. She is a graduate of Newt Gingrich's training for NeoConMen/Women, GOPAC
this is a much longer list than I thought it would be.
people have an infinite capacity for self deception
mira oberman states that "...bush won the state of florida, and thus the election..." really? lady, what planet do you reside on? oh, that "...ones by four to one." line was great too.
in addition to all the comments here and in the article re: voter fraud, throw this in: here in the rural southwest, where rednecks, racists, and illiteracy seem to reign, the e-vote machines are a brilliant way to confuse the computer illiterate. just spin the dial until it gives you the result you're looking for. right.
if the american people aren't completely pissed off about these machines by now - and willing to make or take a stand - then there is no chance for this country's salvation.
Check out HuffingtonPost.com and MichaelMoore.com both have reports of voting machines flipping votes to McCain after the voter pushed Obama. It will be stolen from under our noses -- it's not the voting, it's the counting.
That's what Stalin said:It doesn't matter who votes, it matters who counts the votes. But voter suppression can cost a lot of potential Democratic votes,too (viz 2000 and 2004).
"Could The US Election Be Stolen?"
How tragically naive. have "we the sheeple" DEMMANDED they go back to paper trail ballot machines?
Did "we the sheeple" SCREAM BLOODY MURDER and slam some bastards in prison for TREASON?
Since AIPAC commanded all on both sides of the isle to appear before them in '95 to let them know they would be running both RNC and DNC it doesn't make much difference WHICH Zionist toady wins....THEY'LL decide and let our "leaders" know when they feel like it or by George they'll REFUSE anymore billions and DEFINATELY no more letting "our b(g)oys fight and die in their wars!!
ISRAEL HAS SPOKEN......THEREFORE IT IS LAW, GOYIM!!
I am beginning to have trouble telling the difference between "progressive" sites like this one and Neo-NAZI sites like Stormfront.
Ah, I know the difference. The Stormfront people use less profanity...
That's o.k. Discernment is not a qualification for voting.
Your brain is FUCKED alright. Otherwise, you'd have realized that the so-called "conservatives" are no different from the Neo Nazis. The "conservatives" ain't makin' you any richer as you keep dreaming your delusions up and at 'em but I can see why you'd much rather blame Hugo Chavez rather than admit that it's your gas guzzler that's empowering him. You're one pathetic LOSER in the bunch dude.
Oh shutup.
Good comeback! Not...
I am disgusted with all the fucking Israel-bashing on this site. Don't any of you realize that the conservatives' diehard support of Israel comes from their religious belief that if Jews inhabit all of the holy land, Armageddon will come, the world will be destroyed, those Christian nutjobs think they'll go to heaven? I am Jewish, and I am totally sick of Israel's occupation and the Israeli government's seeming lack of desire for real peace, but I am also totally sick of people here blaming everything on Israel.
I'm not sure what you mean about all the "Israel-bashing" on this site. Some may be strident or paint with too broad a brush at times, but the twisted relationship between the criminal element in the Israeli govt. and the criminal element in the U.S. govt. is definitely a valid topic and should be discussed much more than it is. The influence and workings of AIPAC and associated groups in the U.S. should be spotlighted. Dual-citizen Neocons in high levels of our government should be spotlighted. Israeli companies in charge of sensitive government communications is an issue. Professors getting fired for criticizing Israel, harassment in general for criticizing. Even Mossad assassins for those perceived to be a serious threat to Israeli policies. This is really serious stuff and should be thoroughly hashed out, but maybe on another thread. But then, maybe this would be the time and place because it is pertinent to what is going in our politics.
It is hard to tell how much Israel bashing is based on thoughtful critique of Israeli policy toward the Palestinians and Israel's role in the Middle East, how much the criticism is inflated by hatred or an exaggerated view of Israeli power in the world, or how much is put on the site by provocateurs who want to alienate people like you, Zach, or anyone who rejects anti-semitism or anti-human views of all kinds. Sometimes a discussion is hijacked by turning it into a rote back and forth about Zionists or Jews.
The elites ALREADY stole the elections when they denied third parties participation in the debates.
The GOP doesnt like mcCain enough to steal it for him!
Seriously, I know he seems like a total neo-con (and he is). But the REAL neo-cons dont think he is neo-con ENOUGH.
Already stolen. Nader and the other third parties were excluded from the debates. The sudden September/October "crisis" has totally dominated the media, and utterly lowered expectations of the next administration.
Rather than discussing real working/middle-class advances like single-payer, socialized higher education, a shortened work week, paid maternal/paternal leave, etc. the Rethugs have created a great do-nothing theater for the Dims.
They'll spend the next 4 years to reverse this economic "crisis" that apparently just came out of nowhere (obviously instigated by Wall Street, with bipartisan support) rather than actually bring us forward in any class conscious way.
Forget the cancellations of elections, the accusations of stolen elections, etc. Unless Americans see through this bullshit and vote third party next month, it's already lost.
Rethugs: Two steps backward.
Dims: Two steps backward, one step forward in rhetoric.
.
Bush played '' GOTCHA" again...
What say you America ?????
VOTE NADER/GONZALEZ 2008… You’ll be glad you did and so will I…
http://www.votenader.org/index.html
.
Bush played "GOTCHA" again...
What say you America ?????
Are you gonna make Bush smile and
VOTE NADER/GONZALEZ 2008? McCain & UnAble will be glad you did…
Give her a break already man. She's from Arkansas and just like my state of South Carolina, there's nothing to lose by voting Nader instead of Obama who won't win either one of these states already ! And what state are you from?
As of 10/18/08...
According to CNN, Obama is leading in the polls by at least a margin of 10 points* in enough states to give him 266 of the 270 electoral votes needed to win – only 4 votes shy. If you include Washington state (11), Obama will win. So, even if Obama doesn't win any of the swing states (very unlikely), he would still be elected President. He is currently leading in 5 out of 8 swing states.
Eight Swing States for 2008 Election:
(polls as of 10/18/08)
Florida (27) - Obama 49, McCain 45 (Obama +4)
Ohio (20) - Obama 46, McCain 48 (McCain +2)
North Carolina (15) - Obama 49, McCain 49 (0)
Missouri (11) - Obama 48, McCain 49 (McCain +1)
Washington (11) - Obama 50, McCain 44 (Obama +6)
Colorado (9) - Obama 51, McCain 47 (Obama +4)
Nevada (5) - Obama 47, McCain 45 (Obama +2)
New Mexico (5) - Obama 45, McCain 40 (Obama +5)
Source: http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008
*The exception is West Virginia where he leads by 8 points. See http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/map/polling.
I wanna see em fuckin try it.
Coffeelover,,,,,
mujeriego,
"How many people are planning on showing up at the polls in a Mickey Mouse suit?"
Hehe..you given me an idea.
15 days left to Impeach Bush and Cheney.
The most hysterical and desperate efforts at dividing this country into two waring factions is all about money.
Hysterical because the Republicans have brainwashed the American public for years to believe they are the party that supports lower taxes, in fact they are the party that engineered NAFTA,GAT, and removing regulations that help their fat cat buddy's on Wall street and Corporate America remove benefits and keep wages low while steeling money from Americans. Then they had us bail out their buddy's.
Do we really need Employee leasing company's? And with the age of electronic direct deposit why do we have to wait 2 weeks to get paid?
Isn't it obvious, the misdirection of lower taxes has not helped the middle class, trickle down economics is bullshit.
And now the Republicans are crying that when the American public donates what little money they have left to put a man in office that they believe will improve their lives and America has a whole, they act like desperate shysters in the dark night.
Will someone please tell them to shut up, deal with it , its our turn now, and it may take us thirty years to clean up the mess these greedy good ol boys created.
And when I say us , I mean " WE The People". Remember us, the people who live and work here in America.
BornFreeMen
Yeah, the Republicans believe, against all evidence, that voting for Republicans gets them lower taxes and a balanced budget.
But Democrats believe, against all evidence, that voting for Democrats will bring them peace.
ever notice that the election is only rigged to one side of the coin?
OF COURSE. It's probably already engineered. Read Greg Palast, read Robert Kennedy Jr., and then stand up like the adults we are and refuse to accept any more of this Karl Rovian bullshit. What will it take to open America's eyes? Let us, for Christ's sake, get with the program.
Gail, perhaps some nuclear bombs exploding on Iran might wake America up. Perhaps.
Depends what sport is on television.
Cheers.
www.dangerouscreation.com
Could the US Prez election be stolen [again]?
In a Palin-winked word: Yewbetsha.
As Nov 4 2008 approaches, many national prez polls polls are showing - just as they did in 2004 -- the gap between GOP and Dem narrowing to within the so called statistical margin of error.
Tetti_Tatti (above), and others elsewhere, who rightly see no sufficient difference between McCain and Obama, ask: Who on earth should care about vote fraud within a duopoly?
The answer is: unless you've given up all hope of better [3rd party] candidates' running in the future, and their votes getting legitimately counted in that possible future, you have to care about and fix fradulent vote counting in the present.
Not caring about it, now, will only deepen it, and let it become increasingly normalized -- our insouciance/disgust equaling an abandonment of hope for, and investment in, non-violent change.
Not caring about it, now, obviously also renders useless any ballot advocating for Nader or McKinney in the present.
TT-type cynacism is justified -- I have no doubt.
But until enough of us figure out how to overthow the oligarcy in a way that won't likely worsen our lives beyond how we mis-live and are misgoverned now, I say: we must still care about ballot-counting fraud.
You make me repeat what I wrote on the ACORN thread: Voting has never, ever, changed the corruption in Washington, the bailouts, the wars, the spying. Stop wasting your time registering, voting. When did an election ever produce an American leader who wasn't involved in some type of corruption, or genocide or wars, or spying on citizens, or squandering of the treasury?
There are only two ways to get the government to do what you want, and they don't involve violence: take all your money from the banks and stop paying your taxes. The rest is masturbation.
"Tetti_Tatti (above), and others elsewhere, who rightly see no sufficient difference between McCain and Obama, ask: Who on earth should care about vote fraud within a duopoly?"
That's a good point...for those of you who think they're both the same, why do you give a crap that the elections are being stolen for Republicans? According to you, it wouldn't make a difference...yet they're going to enormous lengths to pull it off.
It was the Greens and the Libertarians who challenged the vote in Ohio in 2004, not the Democrats. You revisionists are disgusting.
Gore won in 2000. The Republicans stole the election. You know that, and yet you still blame Nader.
Kerry won in 2004. He gave up before the votes are even counted. The Greens challenged the vote. You claim that 3rd parties care less about the vote than Democrats, who sat on a treasure chest of millions of dollars, while the Greens scrounged to get the money to pay for the recount.
The Greens call for paper ballots and instant runoff voting. We care more about election integrity than your Democrats, who voted for HAVA, and let the elections be stolen in 2000, 2004 and 2006.
I'm voting Green. Every decent progressive who lives in a hands-down red state has a duty to vote third party if we are serious about taking back this country. Don't waste your vote on Obama! We need to scare the bejeebies out of the Dems while they whip McCain's ass. I am a registered Green in a red state, so this is a no brainer for me.
Meanwhile, I agree with everyone here who says there is no way that this band of neocon thugs is going to let Obama take power -- not unless he has already drunk the kool-aid.
I fully expect the election to be stolen by the Republicans. Today's CNN reports that McCain trails Obama by 5 points in polls. This is ridiculous based on the reported double digit lead at the end of last week, and no good news for McCain over the weekend. Who are they trying to kid? By telling the voters that the gap is narrowing; then, by early November it will be neck and neck; then, when McCain wins by a surprising narrow margin, we'll be expected to swallow it whole. And, likely, the US populace will -- swallow, that is. There are already reports of squirelly electronic voting machines that change votes spontaneously to Republican. I doubt the error ever goes the other way -- like supermarket scanners charging you too little.
That is bullshit. They are just using a wider margin of error , or something to keep you watching. What the f*ck else do they have to cover right now?
Oh, that fricking war!! The way we were all robbed by Wall St? The plan to help the states out that the GOP and Blue Dogs are currently trying to vote down?
Everything on the planet is NOT about this election. But this thread is.Ohio was stolen in 2004, this I now. Ohio has made alot of improvements and Brunner /Strickland are fighting back hard. it is all they can do..
But I thought that America was a SuperPower, THE SuperPower! I thought it was the Greatest Nation in the History of the World. And now I read about vote-rigging and faulty voting machines, etc.
It sounds more like a banana republic to me. Has anyone told the Americans?
P.S. I often do. On my blog. See 'What Would Jesus Do?'
www.dangerouscreation.com
Greg Palast sent this to the radio station that I dj at today
Block the Vote
By ROBERT F. KENNEDY JR. & GREG PALAST
"I don't think the Democrats get it. All these new rules and games … could flip the vote to the GOP in half a dozen states."
Rolling Stone Magazine is making this important investigative story available on the net in its entirety, free of charge.
Read this excerpt, then read it all on-line at RollingStone.com Or download it all, with the Kennedy-Palast voter guide, Steal Back Your Vote, at StealBackYourVote.org.
“The new registrations thrown out, the existing registrations scrubbed, the spoiled ballots, the provisional ballots that were never counted - and what you have is millions of voters, more than enough to swing the presidential election, quietly being detached from the electorate by subterfuge.
"Jim Crow was laid to rest, but his cousins were not," says Donna Brazile. "We got rid of poll taxes and literacy tests but now have a second generation of schemes to deny our citizens their franchise." Come November, the most crucial demographic may prove to be Americans who have been denied the right to vote. If Democrats are to win the 2008 election, they must not simply beat John McCain at the polls - they must beat him by a margin that exceeds the level of GOP vote tampering.
- From the current Rolling Stone
These days, the old west rail hub of Las Vegas , New Mexico , is little more than a dusty economic dead zone amid a boneyard of bare mesas. In national elections, the town overwhelmingly votes Democratic: More than 80 percent of all residents are Hispanic, and one in four lives below the poverty line. On February 5th, the day of the Super Tuesday caucus, a school-bus driver named Paul Maez arrived at his local polling station to cast his ballot. To his surprise, Maez found that his name had vanished from the list of registered voters, thanks to a statewide effort to deter fraudulent voting. For Maez, the shock was especially acute: He is the supervisor of elections in Las Vegas .
Maez was not alone in being denied his right to vote. On Super Tuesday, one in nine Democrats who tried to cast ballots in New Mexico found their names missing from the registration lists. The numbers were even higher in precincts like Las Vegas , where nearly 20 percent of the county's voters were absent from the rolls. With their status in limbo, the voters were forced to cast "provisional" ballots, which can be reviewed and discarded by election officials without explanation. On Super Tuesday, more than half of all provisional ballots cast were thrown out statewide.
This November, what happened to Maez will happen to hundreds of thousands of voters across the country. In state after state, Republican operatives - the party's elite commandos of bare-knuckle politics - are wielding new federal legislation to systematically disenfranchise Democrats. If this year's race is as close as the past two elections, the GOP's nationwide campaign could be large enough to determine the presidency in November. "I don't think the Democrats get it," says John Boyd, a voting-rights attorney in Albuquerque who has taken on the Republican Party for impeding access to the ballot. "All these new rules and games are turning voting into an obstacle course that could flip the vote to the GOP in half a dozen states."
Download the rest – and get the Kennedy-Palast comic book/voter guide – at StealBackYourVote.org.
Or, read it on-line, and watch the video, at Rollingstone.com/issue1064
Sigh! Are the American presidential elections finally too serious a thing to be entrusted to Americans? Never has it been clearer that a globalising world would require globalising institutions and a an increasingly global vote... but, of course, I was forgetting: we are still in the depths of the planetary Dark Ages, and we aliens don't have any say in the most probably once again manipulated election of the next compulsively self-destructive robber baron! The way onwards to hope must be towards a more multilateral, multipolar world... will the intercontinental fallout from the subprime bubble force Obama (or whoever) to gradually slouch back in that direction? Just imagine! Bush and Cheney in the stocks! A new (better) San Francisco 1945!
Now that would be change - and not just preaching!
Yes. We need international observers!
International Observers?
What the hell would they do when the rigging and hacking is done *****ELECTRONICALLY***** which means its out-of-sight of any observers, no matter who the observers are.
We need a fair, honest and legitimate voting system: Using paper ballots and INK PEN with all ballots counted in public view.
I think we do normally have them, because I remember a news story stating that Bush banned them in 2004.
Rewritten history: "Democrat Al Gore fought Republican George W. Bush all the way to the Supreme Court after Bush won the state of Florida"
NOT SO. The recount process was initiated automatically by Florida law since it was so close. Who started the "fighting"? GW Bush sued Florida to STOP the recount, arguing it hurt him to have his victory delayed. Al Gore was NOT the first to go to court. Gore wanted to play by the rules, not remake them. If Florida law had been allowed to be followed, the recount would have continued and Gore would have been found the winner (as was verified about 11 months later by an independent count). Instead, a 5-4 Supreme Court vote with two majority votes cast by people appointed by the plaintiff's father, overturned FL law, without providing a principle or a precedent in doing so.
Even "progressives" buy the media's rewriting of history. Sigh.
Thank you , sir or madam.
Can you also help me to clear up the idea that Kerry "fought with 15,000 lawyers in 2004"?
On a sidebar---when Gore showed up to "transfer the Congress to Cheney", (it was on C-SPAN, which I watched, tearfully--I think that that is what they called it), and the Congrsesional Black Caucus stood up and objected. (By that , I meant Tubbs Jones, Lee, Jackson Lee and others). Gore pounded the desk and said, "Oh, cmon , guys. Lets try to get along".
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How many people are planning on showing up at the polls in a Mickey Mouse suit?
Besides, everyone knows that Mickey Mouse is a GOP stalwart, because he is a BIG RAT, and is fucking Goofy.
"The only means of strengthening one's intellect is to make up one's mind about nothing, to let the mind be a thoroughfare for all thoughts." - John Keats
I dont know--I was going to kindve save what I might wear for Halloween (cant go anywhere this year--no money--kids that come here wil probably just get razor blades) and wear it, so that memebers of the duopoly fan club wouldnt recognize me and attempt to kick my ass.
I am concerned about that "wrongfully told" stuff (in this case, college students told they'd lose their loans,etc). I do not think the Congressional Bill was passed making "putting out deliberate misinformation" illegal, was it? Of course, proving it's deliberate would be difficult. Any ideas on how to stop voter suppression by bad "info"?
The Obama campaign and other Democratic groups are staffing call centers for people who have trouble voting, and are sending lawyers to nearly every precinct to try to handle vote challenging. I'm a Democratic precinct chairman and to be honest, I'm tempted to risk arrest by kicking the shit out of any Rep lawyers that try to deny the students on my campus their constitutional rights.
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http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/press.aspx?id=3771
July 10, 2008
Attorney General Corbett announces charges in legislative bonus investigation - 12 suspects charged in 1st phase of the investigation
.................
In Pensylvania, Democrats, during the 2004 election ,pulled illegal dirty tricks to keep Ralph Nader from getting votes.
Finally justice prevails and their tactics are EXPOSED.
.
In 2004, in this poor-ass part of the Rust Belt--they put out flyers that said that the VOTE HAD BEEN RE-SCHEDULED!! I shit you not! I coudlnt make this stuff up.
Or the Likud will attack Iran, Bush will join in and cancel the elections.
They are not going to cancel the elections. They need to keep up the facade of democracy for the 50% of Americans who still think that their vote matters.
Bush has land in Paraguay where he can cut trees to his heart's content. He doesn't want to be the puppet-in-chief anymore.
I wonder why Monkeyboy wants to leave the U.S. to go live in Paraguay? Isn't the U.S. the greatest country on earth?? Why would he make such a move?
Speaking of the "greatest country on earth," being anti-rigged election is NOT "anti-American," neither is anti-fascism and unnecessary wars "anti-American." Did you hear that, Rethuglicans?
I see the Rethuglicans are busy stealing the election again. Voters have already complained that when they choose Obama, their vote switches to McCain on the touch-screen voting machines. Why haven't the Democrats done anything about this chronic problem in eight years? Rethuglicans own and operate the voting machines........what a fkng banana republic this is.
Let's hope Obama's margin of victory is sufficient to negate the criminal election fraud attempts. If the rethugs manage to steal it this time, there should be more than mere "protests". There should be massive civil unrest, rioting in the streets. Bring 'em on! Heckuvajob!
Sadly, you may be more right than you realize, no matter who wins. the Republicans have been stoking the fires of violence for weeks now, with the likes of Palin, Bachmann,and Pfotenhauer out there spreading their filth about Obama and Democrats as anti-American and terrorist. On the other side the level of anger is rising as well as the fear not of terrorism, but of a stolen election rises. Obama has tried to quell some of the fear by talking honestly about issues and not allowing ourselves to be taken in by small politics, but McCain/Palin have been doing just the opposite. Please remember that if widespread social disruptions occur after 11/4/08, from either side of the aisle, it will be all Bush needs to declare martial law, and then it will not matter who wins, nothing will change at all, except we will have a full-blown dictatorship. I am not advocating sitting back and taking it, but rather if you must take to the streets, remember the peaceful non-violence of Martin Luther King and Ghandi, not the street gangs of South Central LA or Watts. Be ready to defend yourself by all means, but do not provoke and when you need to, defend yourself with great vigor and courage, because it will be all we have left - our willingness to defend our nation from its enemies from within - Bush, Cheney, and the rest of that pack of thugs!
It is a shame that most "progressives" far too moral to have served in the military. If they had, they would realize that martial law, which is unconstitional, would require the military, which means that the Generals would have to give the orders, and the soldiers would have to obey them. Having personally (As a National Guardsman) seen the order to confiscate firearms in New Orleans during Katrina widely refused. (Direct quote: "That is an illegal order, I dare you to court-martial me, sir."), trust me that the generals are not going to give the orders, and if given, the troops are not going to obey.
Wow. I am really glad to hear that. And, thank you.
It is true that Black water was down there doing whatever they wanted , right? Were they firing on "looters" (stealing bread and pop to LIVE)
Most of the firing on looters was local police. Blackwater was there, but primarily as security guards. We (the Guard) were involved in busting into houses looking for dead people, and in "looter suppression" which, for us at least, seemed to involve marching around at 3AM up and down streets on the theory that our presence would deter looters.
A fair number of locals stayed, and we occasionally found bodies who had been shot; I am assuming that they tried to loot the wrong house and paid the price for it.
The reason the NRA found out about the gun confiscation is that half the National Guard (and a good part of the regular Army too) are NRA members and called them. As a result of that, the NRA raised hell and congress passed a law forbidding gun confiscations during emergencies.
The real question is: 'Will Obama get enough of a landslide to overcome the vote-fixing?'
Overcome vote-fixing in a presidential "election?"
With Diebold it doesn't matter how the people vote or how many people vote. The results (how the people supposedly voted and the number of people who supposedly voted) will be what they tell us. We will never know the true numbers.
Diebold can turn day into night.
Yes and no. The way I understood it, the 2006 election produced a democratic victory because the machines were programmed to fix the predicted spread, but polls changed so dramatically at the end due to Republican corruption scandals that it overcame the fix in some places. No doubt that little problem has been fixed by now.
Yes.
But the polls and projection maps most widely desseminated in the Media show clear leads for Obama and very little real chance for McCain. They are trying to make it seem like it is closer than it is, but this is a fairly transparent attempt at keeping people watching with the excuse of "fairness".
The official narrative is of a repudiation of the Bush years and a resurgence of the Dems.
People would be quite suprised to see this narrative not play out.
Any rigging toward McCain in this election would far outstrip the previous Bush riggings in number of States and number of votes to steal.
There is no benefit to such an action for the Corporatist and the Oligarchs as Obama is very much on their team and the Dems will allow a "calming" of the riled up masses other than the fringes that will become radicalized further right.
The mistake is in believing that the '04 and '00 Elections were stolen for, and by the Republicans. they were merely the recipients of the prize that the rigging awards. This year it is the Democrats who will reciev this prize -in exchange for services rendered.
Thank you both. It always amazes me when people who know that the machines are rigged believe that we can "overcome" the rigging somehow, by a bunch of people voting.
You are absolutely right. They can announce a vote total and a vote result which are no where near reality and we have NO WAY of knowing.
And, yes, this year it's Obama's turn to be selected President. The ruling class has lined up for him.
The "suspense" of the close polls is simply to keep us distracted and entertained.
Who on earth CARES?
The election process in the US has always been stolen. For starters, it has always been a farce designed to lure citizens into believing they have a choice. They never did.
And don't you love Democrats? Until Saturday they were calling Collin Powell a war criminal, which is what he is, but now that he has endorsed another war criminal in the making, he deserves their sympathy for, get this, his "redemption". Hilarious.
I posted this same opinion on another site, and , boy oh boy, am I catchimg hell!
How in hell can you "be about change", if you going to "re-invite" the Bush crowd???
Yeah, the Dem kool-aid drinkers have been stooping to all levels to make excuses and apologies and justifications for Powell's endorsement of Walk on Water Obama, the pathetic people that they are.
I will not forgive the American people if they allow the election to be stolen for a third time. They fooled you once, and they fooled you a second time, and if they fool you again and you do nothing--you ain't got no guts!
The American people are so uninterested in what a thirld world apologizer-for-Islamis-terrorists thinks that it would truly amaze you...
Not only they are uninterested, I bet they don't even have the slightest notion where their own interest lies. That's not only amazing but pathetic.
The snag is that most of the "American people" don't acknowledge that any elections have been stolen to begin with. Most people think they have all been legit. The "American people" will say "I'm whatever, get over it." That's what I was told to my face when I protested the 2000 stolen election.
And what do you think the "American people" will do to protest? NOTHING. They will sit on their ass. They are too obese to protest. Most people would have trouble walking one city block.
What is anyone here doing besides bitchin' and name-calling? We should all be joining up with that lawyer mentioned above that's going after the repugs that are doing the voter suppression.
When Powell snubbed the repugs to endorse Obama, it vindicated him a little in my eyes for his part in starting the Iraq takeover. Hopefully, he'll continue to be the person he was before becoming bush's pimp, and continue to work to pay his debt.
"Bush won the state of Florida"--NOT TRUE.
A number of newsworthy points can now be made regarding this issue:
1. The structural inefficiencies, oligopolistic ownership and ideological bias of the media meant the story went uncovered in the USA when it mattered - during the dodgy Florida recount in late 2000.
2. Those who say Bush won because Nader ran in 2000 are wrong. Bush won because of massive electoral fraud.
3. As a result of the outrage (muted, as it was) caused by the US Civil Rights Commission it looks like they [the Bush Junta] might not be able to pull it off again for this coming November; see ‘Florida Scraps Felon Vote List: http://www.sptimes.com/2004/07/11/State/Florida_scraps_felon_.shtml.
You can read all the details of the current news story - Appearing In Front Of The US Civil Rights Commission Today - and the background and details of how the fraud was committed, at the following weblinks:
Palast to testify at US Civil Rights Commission Thursday July 15th:
http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=347&row=0
Florida's flawed "voter-cleansing" program - Salon.com's politics story of the year:
http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=55&row=2
A Blacklist Burning For Bush (The London Observer, Sunday, December 10, 2000)
http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=4&row=2
FLORIDA'S 'DISAPPEARED VOTERS': DISFRANCHISED BY THE GOP, (The Nation):
http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=27&row=2
"THEFT OF THE PRESIDENCY"; BBC-TV Newsnight; Thursday Feb 15, 2001; This is the transcript of Gregory Palast's appearance on BBC News' Newsnight on February 16, 2001:
http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=29&row=2
I can see it now. Obama wins by a narrow margin. mccain and the repug machine take it to the supreme court. Guess who takes over in January?
Don't make me laugh and cry at the same time, please.
For the moment it appears that they'll be leaving, anyway. They all look haggard and worn out, and bankrupt.
Cause to be worried anyway as what came in illegitimately, is as likely to leave in a similar fashion.
"Guess who takes over in January?"
Bush and Cheney. I don't think they have any plans of going anywhere in January and there's no one to make them leave. (Directive 51?...did they just cook that up for the hell of it or do they intend to use it?) The Bush-accomplice Dems would certainly warmly welcome them staying on---I can see Pelosi now all smiles and arm-in-arm with Bush---so they can help them complete their dictatorial agenda, as they have been doing since 2000.
What is directive 51? I haven't heard of it before.
Directive 51 is actually the National Security Presidential Directive #51, signed by Bush in May 2007. It is designed to clearly stated when Bush can declare martial law. It lays out what a catastrophic emergency would be necessary for such an action as determined by the President. It would have to be disruptive to the lives of citizens, and could include man-made or natural disasters, environmental disasters, war, or economic disasters. In short, any event that the president declares a catastrophic emergency would allow him to declare martial law, take over all military control of the National Guards, and turn the recently re-assigned active duty Army units just returned from Iraq on the American citizens, as well as any private contractor security forces as necessary to restore and maintain order.
Consider that this was in place before the start of the primary season, and that it was in place at the beginning of bursting housing bubble in anticipation of an economic crisis (just see what is happening). If the anger of the American people had erupted over the bailout, Bush could have under this directive declared martial law. If things get worse, or there is civil unrest after the election (as I am sure the Republicans are hoping to promote with their current voter fraud charges), I am certain you will see this Directive put into force. Consider the threats against ACORN personnel and the break-ins and vandalism of some of their offices, and you begin to see the rise of the fascist state led by Bush and McCain. We live in scary times.
Then maybe it's a good thing our military forces are so fucked after being in the ME forever.
This is the thing I'm really thinking. Even if there is an election, and someone wins it, they've still got over 2 months to activate Directive 51.
Although I have read that every president has created a similar directive with regard to the ability of the President to assume dictatorial powers in the case of catastrophic circumstance.
Still doesn't make me any less frightened, though.
"Could The US Election Be Stolen?"
DUH!
It already is being stolen. Just one example:
More W.Va. voters say machines are switching votes
In six cases, Democratic votes flipped to GOP
http://wvgazette.com/News/200810180251
To me, it's long been a given that the thing was/is going to be stolen. Why wouldn't it be? 2000 and 2004 were both stolen. Nothing has changed with the voting system since. These corrupt easily-hackable machines are all over the nation now. Those in Denial like to pretend it's going to be fair and legitimate and live with their dreamy wishful-thinking and then they are somehow surprised by the final results. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm.
People don't understand the ease with which code can be altered to cause electronic machines to flip votes. I agree with you completely, but unfortunately the masses are too dumb about these things. If everyone was taught a little programming, they'd realize just how easy it is to do something like this.
Oh those dumb masses.
Joe
Of course they (the Republicans) will try to steal the election again.
It has worked twice for them, why not a third time? Hopefully the margin
will be enough to overcome the crooked machines and the crooked people,
but don't count on it.
Dafoe
Of course ther will be voter fraud by the repugnants in those states where they control the state administration. The Federal Government should devlare they will look after voting in federal elections, but that will never happen and so we have the slippery slope of doing nothing to the sacred god blessed american way of doing politics. One gets disgusted with the layers of sleaze and corruption but everything is for sale in this country, everything with no exceptions.
Enthusiasm is now the key to getting out our vote. We need to make sure that our enthusiasm for Obama and change is infectious. An enthusiasm that lasts all the way to his inauguration
Remy Germain October 20th, 2008 2:44 pm wrote:
We need to make sure that our enthusiasm for Obama and change is infectious.
Enthusiasm for Obama is NOT enthusiasm for change. It is enthusiasm for more of the same.
Remy Germain October 20th, 2008 2:44 pm wrore:
An enthusiasm that lasts all the way to his inauguration
For me the inauguration of Obama will be a very sad day. It will be a day in which I cannot watch TV or read a newspaper out of disgust for their constant repetition of the false claim that we are about to enter a new age of change. Well of course, some change will occur. The color of the skin of the president will change for the first time in history. But that will not make me happy. Such a superficial change has absolutely nothing to do with America's real problems, which are deep and profound. I'm afraid America upcoming superficial age of change is nothing more than a continuation of it's current age of dillusion. The madness will continue.
Man, have I had it with the repetitious "Obama and McCain are no different" comments.
Look, we all know that we're living in a corporate oligarchy, where our tax monies are confiscated and turned over to the MIC, and that true progressive change will only come from viable third parties. We get that.
But you must understand that Obama and McCain are not the same! Obama is waaaay more progressive than McCain. McCain has turned into a far-right hardliner, and his VP choice is a theocratic nutjob. Surely you wouldn't prefer those two over Obama! Give the man some credit for inspiring millions of people and waking them up to the fact that we need fundamental change, whether or not he can actually provide all the change that you desire.
If the inauguration of Obama will be a very sad day for you, the inauguration of McCain will be very, very much sadder!
And what YOU must understand is that your position represents the substantial majority.
Did you not read the article? Of the nine million new registrations this year the Dems have grown by FOUR TIMES the amount the GOP has.
Obama is going to win by a large margin.
There is almost NO possibility of a "close" election, relative to '04 and '08.
I've seen electoral college projections with five categories : Strongly Obama, Leaning Obama, Tossup, Leaning McCain, and Strongly McCain. In these, McCain could somehow do the near-impossible and create such a turnaround in these last TWO WEEKS that he wins 100% of 4 out of the 5 categories, from Strongly McCain to Leaning Obama, and Obama STILL WINS.
I have seen popular vote polls where even with the supposed "loss" to Obama of an historically strong -3%- Nader vote, Obama STILL BEATS McCain by 12%! TWELVE PERCENT.
The Dems also seem likely to pick up dozens of seats in the House and up to 8 or 9 seats in the Senate.
EVERYTHING is pointing to "big win" for Obama and the Dems, yet still we see all this B.S. fear of McCain.
Here's to November FIFTH!
OF COURSE the Rethuglicans will try to steal another election next month! It's in their blood. They believe they're entitled to rule over us slaves. They're dying to cut even more taxes for the rich, wages, Medicare, health care, Social Security, retirement, you name it.
The crypt keeper McCain made a cryptic remark about Colin Powell endorsing Obama. The weasel said he wasn't surprised, the implication being that since Obama and Powell share the same racial stock, that's the only reason Powell is backing Obama.
I'm getting off topic here, but did you see Cindy McCain, the old Barbie doll complete with facelift, campaigning for her husband? It's like "See me, I'm white, blonde, blue-eyed, and young (from my facelift). I'll be your perfect Barbie doll first lady!" She looks as young as her daughter.......LOL
I think Michelle Obama will be a great first lady. She's statuesque and classy.
The Rovemeister is resting assured that John McClone and Sarah Barracuda will win. He knows that even if all of his crusaders' manipulation fails to keep targeted voters from voting, there is always PLAN D.
D stands for Diebold, the fascist manufacturer and maintainer of voting machines.
"The people who cast the votes don't decide an election, the people who count the votes do.” Joseph Stalin
The election was stolen, in 2004, here in Ohio, by teh GOP. If you were at the polls, there would simply be no question in your mind.
Now, there does appear to be some problems (especially at the "top") of ACORN's efforts. It is just a few thousand, and, these "fake" people wil not be allowed to vote. With so many disenfranchised in 2004--it is very difficult to be upset about it.
Ohio has banned voter "challengers" from out of state (most were form Texas), voter "caging", and the poll tax of a picture iD. (They confirm it with other devices). Unfortunately , Gov Taft (indicted for defrauding our Workmans Comp out of $3 millin by investing it in "rare coins"--he paid $3000 and "apologized"), bought al new Diebolds, before he left. J. Kenneth Blackwell, who was the head of Bush[s campaign in 2004, intentionally placed fewer machines in opoorer areas and allowed challenging at historicaly Af. Am. colleges. We cannot afford new machines, but, there is now a paper trail.
Th racism that has cropped up in Ohio, anew, (I knew it was there--I am just surprised at the terror implicit in some peoples' attacks on Obama--no one I know personally)is humiliating. It has made me want to reconsider not voting for Obama. But, he just cannot seem to stop making decisons that piss me off! Not even for a week!
Ohio is trending Obama. This will change nothing in my life, nor most of the "working class on a good day" people I live near. I am rather torn sa to what to do. "My" candidates are so far off from winning as to make mine, perhaps , a vote among "tens"!