ELIZABETHTOWN, Pa. - The date Aug. 4, 1964 still haunts Daniel Ellsberg, despite the passage of more than 40 years.
He was a 33-year-old on his first day at the Pentagon as special assistant to Assistant Secretary of Defense John McNaughton. It also was the day the North Vietnamese navy allegedly fired 21 torpedoes at U.S. naval vessels in the Gulf of Tonkin.
Ellsberg was one of 100 people who saw top secret transmissions later in the day saying the attack never happened, yet President Lyndon Johnson used the alleged incident to drive the U.S. into full-scale war in Vietnam.
"I knew Congress was being deceived into a declaration of war and that the public was being totally deceived into a landslide victory for a man who was about to plunge them into a big war," Ellsberg told a crowd of more than 200 people Thursday evening at the inaugural Ware Seminar on Global Citizenship at Elizabethtown College's Center for Global Citizenship.
The 76-year-old activist gained notoriety during the Vietnam War when he released the Pentagon Papers to the New York Times and other newspapers, detailing internal U.S. policy decisions regarding the war and its escalation.
Ellsberg said in the last few weeks he has begun to think a coup has occurred in the presidency of George Bush, which he characterized as a "rogue administration."
He said that if a new 9/11 terrorist attack happens in the United States, the president would not hesitate to suspend and dismantle the Constitution and that hundreds of thousands of Middle Easterners and dissidents could end up in detention camps. "I think we're in danger - we're in a crisis," he said.
Ellsberg pointed to actions taken by Bush that he said violate the law, including endorsing warrantless surveillance and lying to Congress about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. At the same time, he was quick to chastise the Democrats in Congress, saying that by going along with Bush's war they've failed their duty to uphold the Constitution.
He said the Senate resolution passed Wednesday declaring Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps as a terrorist organization is an invitation for Bush to declare war on Iran.
Ellsberg compared Wednesday's resolution to the Gulf of Tonkin resolution, passed Aug. 7, 1964, that gave Johnson a virtually blank check for combat in North Vietnam. He laid out a scenario of $200 a barrel for oil, the possibility of retaliatory attacks against the U.S. and the president keeping open the "nuclear option" to attack Iran. He said he is asking people in government who have information that could stop such a war before it happens to not do what he did by releasing the Pentagon Papers after the war started. He said they should do what he didn't do - release the information before a disaster happens. "Don't wait till the war has started," Ellsberg told the audience. "Don't wait till the bombs are falling or thousands more have died."
Ellsberg said he has been called a traitor numerous times for breaking a "vow of secrecy" when he released the Pentagon Papers. But Ellsberg said he took an oath of office to uphold the Constitution - the same oath all military and public servants are required to take.
"It is not an oath to the president," Ellsberg said. "And it's not an oath to keep secrets. And it's not an oath to the commander in chief, or the Fuhrer or Caesar or to the flag. "It is an oath to support and defend the Constitution of the United States, so help me God, against all enemies, foreign and domestic."
© 2004-2007 Lancaster Newspapers
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91 Comments so far
Show AllI hope the Rapture comes soon and I hope it also takes the Israeli lobby up with Cheney and Bush. Perhaps then we will not have to worry about nuclear bombing Iran. Also thanks to all the peacemakers and the congressmen and Senators who did not vote to fund this war.
Duncan Hunter is a sick joke. He's on the list as one of the most corrupt 22 politicians in Congress.
GlobalFriend, the way we found out how the rest of the world views us: we went abroad, and discovered that the last honest president this country had was Abraham Lincoln. This was discussed in a leading spiritual journal of India: "Bhavan's Journal".
WHY is Dennis Kucinich ignored so much??
Have you seen Tom Tomorrow's latest cartoons about Alan Greenspan? If not, we'll send you a copy.
geoff29: I tried to go to the site you gave above regarding the two nukes--couldn't get through. I went to their main page which has a message that says they have been hacked.
holymoly: Right on! I also heard the second interview with Professor Hudson on 'Guns and Butter' about Greenspan.
When I vote on my paper ballot next year, I will write in the name, Dennis Kucinich, as well. And Dennis baby, select Mike Gravel as your running mate.
Wake up America!
I just went to the latest installment of Guns and Butter after I posted my last. It was weird that Michael Hudson, Kucinich's economic advisor, was interviewed again, and he brought up the Year of Jubliee!! I swear I had not heard that interview before posting the above--weird coincidence! But his interview is spot on, talking about Allen Greenspan and how he is responsible for the mortgage bubble, the dot com bubbble, the passing off of the the income tax from the wealthy to the bottom 90% by calling Social Security a "user fee" and taxing the workers for SS only to give the money to the ultra wealthy as tax breaks. Then saying, uh oh, no money for Social Security. Yet there was a trillion for a war and a trillion for tax cuts. People are you tired of the lies yet? Now Greenspan is trying to pretend he is not the granddaddy of it all. It won't work Allen. He should not be able to go out and hawk his book without people hounding him and shouting lynch him! lynch him! One foot in the grave and another on a banana peeling and he is still lying through his teeth!
I remember back in '98 when Citifinancial and Travellers wanted to merge and they bought out our Congressmen to repeal the Glass-Steagall Act--they called it deregulation. Oh, I remember it well when our democratic turned republican senator went along with all of that with Clinton's blessings--and you think I would vote for his old lady??? Not in a million years. As Hudson points out in his interview, Clinton was supported by the Democratic Leadership Committee which, he says, is the Republican Wing of the Democratic Party--it is the Wall street Bankers. No wonder Hillary was so quick to give Citifi and other big banks whatever they want.
I've voting for Kucinich, if we are still able to vote come election time. The Clintons have screwed us over quite enough, thank you.
People all of our screw overs come through and by the bankers through our congressmen. We have to educate ourselves on finance as much as possible. I remember that NPR had some programs on about the Glass-Steagall repeal, but all the politicians were crooning about deregulation (may Reagan rot in hell!!) and the free market bullshit so they could rape and plunder. Anyway, this is how they've screwed us over--this is how we have to take it all back! If you support Hillary Clinton, you deserve just what you get. A vote for Hillary is a vote for Big Banking. If that is the life you want, choose it!!!!
As an 18-year old with Aspergers, I don't know what to say.
I had so much hope for next year: going to a good collage, living on my own, and getting a degree in library sciences. It looks like domestic events could squander my chances. I really feel like I can't do much as a teen still living at home. Could anyone give me some tips on how to live a good life?
geoff29: my survival rate is 65%
I got the chance to meet Mr. Ellsberg when he visited my daughter's college class right as we were getting ready to attack Iraq. Mr. Ellsberg shamed us by saying he had read The Birmingham News and found not one anti-war letter in the letters to the editor. As a matter of fact, I ended up writing two and they were published. One man who responded to my letter with a letter of his own challenging The News to refute or deny my allegations against the Bush administration, only received death threats for his trouble. The News did not bother to do a factual analysis. I suppose they did not want a mob to burn down their building.
When I was traveling to Florida before the attack on Iraq, I had a bumper sticker on my old clunker of a car--the bumpersticker I believe I got from CD--anway, it said ATTACK IRAQ? NO! a nice pick-up truck passed me and the young couple looked at me in astonishment like I was a total fool. I could see it in their faces: "How can someone not want to get even for 9-11?" When the truck sped on by, it had a U.S. Airforce sticker on its bumper. I wonder what that young couple thinks now--all these years later?
All of us anti-war folks have taken a lot of flack everytime we stand up for what is right, but at least I go to bed at night with a clear conscience, and I know many of you do.
As for the coming monetary collapse, I would recommend the interviews with Tarpley and Hudson at the Guns and Butter past shows sites--all of the interviews in these archives are interesting and informative: http://www.kpfa.org/archives/index.php?show=13
Hudson points out that in NY there was a law that when bad loan were made on purpose to trick people and take advantage of them, the law declared the loan null and void. That may be a solution to the mortgage crisis. Just let the homeowners keep them. That will transfer a great deal of wealth quickly to the working classes. Also, money is something Congress can generate at any time. We can print new money, pay people with that money to build new bridges, hospitals, etc. Withdrawing already existing funds would be useless--it is only paper with no backup of any kind. If you drew out all the money in the world, the Federal Reserve would just print more--but they really don't have to as it is all digital anyway--with an ATM card transferring "money" when you make your purchases. The old Jimmy Stuart "Bailey Savings & Loan" has long since been replaced with a system that loans money on credit paper held--not reserves on deposit.
However, we are a country with a vast amount of resources, we have a people who can achieve a lot of good--so what if the useless bankers useless dollars fall? As my dad used to say: them that's got it can lose it, and them that ain't can't. Maybe it is time to have a Year of Jublilee, like the Bible says. I mean, if we are going to follow God's Ten Commandments and post them on every henhouse, outhouse, schoolroom, courtroom, etc., why can't we take a part of God's economic plan--you know the one, that says you should start the Monopoly game over once in a while. Give all the players new money to start again before it all ends up in the hands of the few again. The year of the Jublilee was to find all debts forgiven, land restored to the original families, all indentured servants freed. What we need folks, is a Year of the Jubliee. With a country as vast as our, with resources as vast as ours, there is no need to anyone to go hungry. We can have a basic guaranteed income--which will keep abject poverty away from all, and yet people will then be free to pursue natural talents and employment they enjoy--and we might actually have real work in this country again--instead of made up work that just harms and further enslaves people.
"On your way to a fascist takeover"? No. You're right in the middle of it, and it's happening.
ricco, said: "Have facists ever been voted out?
Democracy wasn't designed to deal with fascists."
No. That's right. Democracy is not designed to deal with Fascists. Last time the Fascists took power, the World went to war to get them out. Remember that. And make sure you tell every neighbor you've got, and remember the slaughtered cities of Dresden, Moscow, Stalingrad, Hiroshima, Nagasaki, London, Warsaw, and others as you drive through Chicago, Los Angeles, New York and the shameful ruin of New Orleans. And don't forget the camps of Auschwitz, Buchenwald, Treblinka, you've got 800 new ones built by Halliburton with your money just for you.
This time, in the Third World War that America is precipitating, the only 'winner' is going to be the Earth, which may as a result of the Third World War started by the United States of America, be able to slowly regenerate and return to normal after the population of the planet is massively adjusted by the ensuing conflagration. That should solve some human impact problems. But I personally, don't see any signs anywhere of anything but a headlong rush into fascist totalitarianism in America. Quite frankly, I'm beginning to think the World may welcome this state of affairs for America, as I think it is rather sick and tired of American arrogance, American economic and military bullying (overt and covert), and American 'democratic' (imperial) pretensions. That a lot of innocent people are going to suffer (and are suffering) is terrible, but I don't see too many Americans exercising or demonstrating the kind of character that made America one of the most admired nations, once upon a time.
The Repugnants and the Democraps, and in fact the two-party system itself is demonstrated to be utterly useless.
What I find more disturbing is the fact that the Grand Experiment has been exposed as weak, had its flaws exploited by the very nation that so espoused democracy as to build a mythology that has so convinced its populace of their invincibility that even as they lose their freedom they continue to wave their flag in utter ignorance. I'm disturbed because if this so-called bastion of democracy can fail, then the rest will soon follow plunging the world into corporate run despotism and tyranny that's just not worth living in. That Bush and the Badministration backed by the corporatocracy exploited the flaws of democracy rather than fixed them surely declares them as enemies of freedom, enemies of the people. So if there is an ounce of gumption left in America, any balls at all, then get cracking. Yeah, you might die...tell that to the Minutemen who shed their blood so you wouldn't have to do what they did to gain you the freedoms you're letting slip through your fingers. If the corporates can take America, they can take any country in the world and enslave every man, woman and child from that point on out. You think you've seen 1984 now? No, you're just getting a little taste of what these fascist fucks can do, and they're winning, while you're talking.
So much for the vaunted American heroes (American heroic mythology--nothing more than fairy tail (sic.)), none of you are apparently capable of defending your freedom, the Pledge of Allegiance and the Oath of Allegiance many take as employees of states and universities doesn't mean a damn thing to you. Example: http://www.ucop.edu/ucophome/policies/bfb/upay585.pdf
When do your words begin to mean something to you?
I really think that's America's biggest problem. Your words don't mean anything like what they pretend to mean. "The Land of the Free" (for the rich who get to pass on all costs to the people who work for a living) "WMD in the desert" (Cheyney, Powell(!), and that Jerk in the Whitehouse), "Read my lips...No more taxes" (Bushdaddy)"One vote" (Florida 2001 Erection (sic) of a Dictator) "government of the people by the people for the people" (if ever) "I never had sex with that woman" (The great charmer) "Torture? The USA? Never" (Lies-are-Rice) "Rule of law" (Rule of Rich/OJ/Gitmo/Pulled out of International Justice Court) "Human rights" (Gitmo and much more we don't know about) "Death before dishonor" (Abu Graibh) "Protect and serve." (Rodney King and many more) "Mission accomplished" (The Wank in the Whitehouse) "American Dream" (mortgage bubble/credit debt/34 Million Poor). "Women's rights" (that you never ratify) "Equal employment" (same) "Disarmament" (SALT abandonment; and a new expanded nuclear program) "No child left behind" (arts cuts to the point that musicians and others have to privatize that part of education/and every student saddled with debt at the start of their lives!) "We're a peaceful country" (with a multibillion dollar 'defense' budget greater than all other nations put together, and more war notches in your belt than any other nation in the world!) "We're a god-fearing nation" (yeah, but not the Christian god you pretend to be, the God of War - Mars! - "Fear US!") "Uncle Sam, wants you!" (On your knees begging for your life) "health care and good food for everybody" (W.H.O. sugar cartel and RDA scandal, and obesity/Supersize me!) "Our economy is strong" (shored up by $49 Trillion from China, Saudi Arabia, et al).
PFFT!
"Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."
Yeah, right. "Death, slavery and the pursuit of misery" that's what America is really all about, isn't it. (See also: Garment workers on US Saipan -- where your own government flouted the labor laws to favor garment corporations Video on Google).
Lies, lies and more damned lies. And the above is just a partial list. You guys love your lies, your empty words. It's the American Way of Life today. And this is the truth. I didn't make this up. You guys did.
Ellsberg at least is being a REAL American. Standing up, risking his own life, and character assassination, to tell it like it is. That's true heroism. And there are a few others: Robert Fisk. Olbermann. Danny Schecter (Weapons of Mass Deception/In Debt We Trust). Cindy Sheehan. Al Gore on climate change who couldn't get democracy to work to address the issue because American democracy is owned by those who create the climate change! Michael Moore, who warned you all of that Wank in the Whitehouse and who was pilloried because of it, and who is now proven right. But then since when could an American recognize truth? Even Reality tv is scripted! So the very diet you guys are fed by your art & entertainment industry is intended to get you to buy into illusion, and you do. Over, and over and over again. Polarized and paralyzed.
I've written the above to jar you into reality. To knock you out of this do-less complacency that I fear will end up as I have described as above. Where is your outrage at this situation? Turn up the heat, it's the only thing that's going to restore what you profess in these pages and comments to love. Make your words mean something by ceasing to talk and get organized and start doing before it is too late.
Give the courageous people mentioned herein your money because they are putting it on the line for freedom, humanity and all that is decent, and that includes Common Dreams and the NRDC.
Stop filling the coffers of the IRD so that the war economy is brought to its knees. If you love peace, stop fueling war with your earnings.
PrestonDigitator --
Note I posted the TACTIC above . . . .
QUOTE: PrestonDigitator September 28th, 2007 4:47 pm
The sense of urgency is visibly growing along with the level of frustration. Of all the tactics that are available to 'we the people', I found one this morning that has restored real enthusiasm to my life in the face of this long abysmal past 7 years. I discovered the idea here at Common Dreams, on a blog by this same honorable and esteemed author, Mr. Ellsberg, entitles "This Coup and the Next One". His blog is prescient, and visceral, as would be expected, but one of the responses really negated my hapless sense of frustration; please go to, and read Mr. Ellsberg's other blog and then on through the responses. Please note a post by
"iyamwutiam September 27th, 2007 1:50 pm" , and consider it carefully, and then please come-on aboard. To me, it is THE weapon that 'we the people' have been looking for, to bring this government to it's senses.UNQUOTE
Basically I think it would be a pretty dumb idea -- from A to Z -- but you should also consider that something like that could trigger FEMA's regulations which could limit what could be taken out of bank accounts.
In fact, it could do widespread and great harm to the public and not impact leadership in the way intended.
File that one under "Bad idea."
Here's the recommendation from the other thread recommended by someone commenting on this article . . .
QUOTE: I have stated this idea many times - and will do so again in the hopes of it being noticed and getting some traction. As we know - any meaningful form of protest is blackedout by the media - the latest example being September 15th- while we hear endlessly about Burma and its 50-100 protestors the fact that hundreds of thousands have been showing up regularly since 2002 to protest the war and all its accoutrements (such as the patriot act etc). In addition - once again we are primed with blatant falsehoods with everything regarding corruption via contractors, insider trading, credit bubbles, and of course more recently Iran.
Despite committed orgainzations such as moveon.org, codepink etc - we find ourselves more under seige and laws are twisted and stretched to nterpret any dissent as an excuse to taser or imprison US citizens whose roots are unquestionable.
I beseech everyone and anyone out there - to do the only protest this country which is being engulfed by callous cannabilistic avarice can understand. The protest would require all americans who wish to regain or at the very least send notice to the government that we are not with out a powerful weapon of dissent that is completely non-violent and completely legal.
That weapon would be the withdrawal of funds from the US banking system. If coordinated properly - this will cause so much distress in the credit and cash machinary of the country - that I am SURE the truth will be not only unveiled but enforced.
What is that truth !! The truth that 70 percent of this economy runs of consumer confidence (that is the general US population going out and giving the government and its corporate accomplices funds to imprison us and have a double standard (one for the corporations and one for the common man)). So what can 'we' do about it- and how meaningful would this be!
In my view - it is an incredibly powerful message and time is NOW - as can be witnessed by the Northern Rock, recent credit crisis, and liquidity crunch - the economy of many so called 'developed' countries is painfully over-extended by using the mortgages, mutual funds, stocks, pensions etc of millions of americans - and then leveraging those to corrupt OUR REPRESENTATIVES. No wonder they don't pay attention to us and feel that they may imprison, silence and most importantly increasing reveal their contempt by not responding to their contstituents genuine concerns.
If it was possible for organizations such as unions, non-profits AND millions of americans to remove from the highly leveraged system our funds - and continue to do so - I doubt it will last longer than a month- we would open the eyes of every single person on the face of the earth to a seminal truth. The government and these corporations are the parasites - it is we - WE- who are the hosts.
Therefore if we can concertedly remove a significant sum of money (say 100,000 people and assocaiated organizations and unins (example teachers unions, nursing, UAW - members of code pink, mveon, etc etc) we can unequivocally paralyze the 'assets' of thise country (since the assets of this country is OOR money).
Once and for all the truth will be revealed - as to who are the parasites and who must be the hosts. This is very similar to Socrates argument of the sheperd and the flock - if not for the flock the sheperd is destitute.
So once again - please someone and anyone spread this around - because I am convinced that we can remove at least 10 billion from the system (which with fractional reserve LENDING - equals close to 1 trillion dollars in assests and then if you add in the hedge funds who borrow against that as well as brokerage - we are talking close to 10 trillion dollars!!!!
This silent, legal corrdinated protest will surely let the politicians and corporations know that we are a financially literate populance in addition to a humane, educated and concerned one.UNQUOTE
Personally, I think it's possible ... but it could also backfire on us with economic stress which could result in tipping us in a direction that could be very negative for many Americans????
What does anyone else think about this????
Just imagine -- only six short years ago, we had a very healthy economy, peace -- AND A SURPLUS!!!!
Personally . . . . I think bankrupting the Treasury is a treasonable offense -- impeachable offense.
Nor do I think this is by accident -- it's a speedway to overturning democracy. In fact, Tom Hartmann the other day on Air America opined that another Great Depression may be on their agenda.
lillulu --
Unfortunately PNAC is highly interested in space and militarizing the skies --
From these highest hills we can threaten others, even if we have quite "conquered" and claimed the moon --
Voting for a DLC Dem is obviously not the way to go --
We still have a year or more to select our own candidates and even run them in the Democratic Party --
How about Bobby Kennedy and Jane Harmon?
Or Feingold? There's a guy who understands what's going on and doesn't understand why Democrats are doing nothing!!!
From today's NYT
September 30, 2007
New Group Boasts Big War Chest and Rising Voice
By DON VAN NATTA Jr.
Freedom's Watch, a deep-pocketed conservative group led by two former senior White House officials, made an audacious debut in late August when it began a $15 million advertising campaign designed to maintain Congressional support for President Bush's troop increase in Iraq.
Founded this summer by a dozen wealthy conservatives, the nonprofit group is set apart from most advocacy groups by the immense wealth of its core group of benefactors, its intention to far outspend its rivals and its ambition to pursue a wide-ranging agenda. Its next target: Iran policy.
Next month, Freedom's Watch will sponsor a private forum of 20 experts on radical Islam that is expected to make the case that Iran poses a direct threat to the security of the United States, according to several benefactors of the group.
Although the group declined to identify the experts, several were invited from the American Enterprise Institute, a Washington research group with close ties to the White House. Some institute scholars have advocated a more confrontational policy to prevent Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons, including keeping military action as an option.
..... for the rest:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/30/us/politics/30watch.html?ex=1348804800...
Letter Sent to the New York Times
From: John Walsh
Date: September 16, 2007 9:49:05 AM EDT
To: letters@nytimes.com
Subject: Frank Rich's column
To the editor:
In an otherwise excellent column today (9/16/2007) Frank Rich perpetuates the myth that the Democrats do not have the power to end the war because of an inevitable veto from Bush.
Nothing could be farther from the truth. The war demands funding, and a new supplemental funding will soon appear before Congress. That can be filibustered in the Senate, with only the 41 votes or abstentions required to sustain a filibuster. At that moment the legislation is dead. There is nothing to veto so Bush must come back with an acceptable bill. At the same time the Democrats could submit legislation to bring the occupying troops home quickly and safely. Let Bush veto that if he dares. There is already a national petition drive for this at FilibusterForPeace.org and every Senator has received a copy of it.
In the House one person Nancy Pelosi can accomplish the same thing. She can simply refuse to bring Bush's supplemental requests to the floor. In this she has veto power as surely as the president does.
So let us not hear from the Democrats that they do not have the power to end the war. Clearly they do. One must conclude that the Democrats support it. They pay for it and so they own it.
Sincerely,
John V. Walsh, MD
Professor of Physiology
University of Massachusetts Medical School
john.walsh@umassmed.edu
Hi Saila,
I think we are in a revolution now and if we realize that it is beneficial to keep it as peaceful as possible.
I must say however that my idea that the Army may join us had better be more than "lets go hit the streets and maybe the Army will join in the fun"... We are a long way from that day but that day may come like JFK said something like "If we make peaceful revolution impossible, we make violent revolution inevitable"
But please ...Just because you are not ready to follow provocateurs disguised as "Revolutionaries" does not mean that you are not a real Revolutionary...and I think there are a few on this site who can give you facts about how many millions of folks that can be put in modern concentration camps in the USA today...they just call them detention facilities with or without showers.
Maybe the Word is mightier than the Sword after all.
Love and Peace, jim
ALOHA !!
The USSR collapsed under a debt and currency crisis. The USSA will collapse the same way ... add in a stock market crisis that is derivative driven. We are starting to see the beginnings now. Banks that once bragged ... TOO BIG TO FAIL ... will be the same ones lementing ... TOO BIG TO BAIL OUT!
Once that occurs there will be no need to take to the streets as the police and the US military will, like Russia, be reduced to Border Patol not World Police Patrol. Like Rome, Britain and Russia an over extended military will crush the US Empire. The size of the government payroll will drop substantially as there will be no funds to pay for a BIG GOVERNMENT ... a US Dollar would be worthless like a Russian Ruble was. Police and soldiers have family also. They will not stay at their posts while their families starve. Recall what happened in Russia when the Communist regime fell ... the military quit taking orders and went home. Why should the end game of our socialist regime be any different? Rome shrank from a global Empire to a city state. Who knows Mexico might buy back California. France might buy back Lousisiana ... For sure foreigners will buy us out for cents on the dollar. New Jersey and other states have already sold foreigners their roads. Thats just the start ...
People here assume that the US government will go on forever while all else around it collapses. You have to remember that the US government would not exist without tax revenues. They need us more than we need them. Sadly the politicians and the voters have yet to realize that. That realization is coming ... it has started already. As the US economy flounders so do State and Federal tax roles and revenues. Remember some 70mil baby-boomers will be too old to work soon. Then they will be a debt burden to the US government and produce no real tax revenues. Look at all the housing defaults. Remember that if a person abandons their mortgage the State and County get no further property tax revenues. Selling stocks for a loss will not produce more tax revenues either. Throwing people into DEBTORS PRISON will not resolve anything other than to add further debt burden to government. Without tax revenue this government will fail. A double whammy credit and monetary crisis is heading our way that will pave the way for the fall of the US government and its military due to tax defaults.
Jim Glover:
Jim, reading your thread tells me that you're not yet ready for revolution, neither am I. Real revolutionaries do not give a damn about all the barriers you mentioned. When the shit hits the fan, and they've had it up to their necks, they won't give a damn about the police or the army. Somebody earlier suggested 5%, that is 15,000,000 people. Do they have enough prison space for that many people? If people pack the streets, men, women, and children, who would dare to give the order to shoot them? Chances are that the police and the army may even join the people. As far as martial law and curfew is concerned, if every community ignores it, it will not succeed. It has been done before.
You're not ready for revolution yet, but when you're ready nothing can stop you!
What??? No war and thus deprive the arms' industry of all those juice profits? Instead of money for war, how about money for PEACE!
Hi Folks,
I have had revolution on my mind for over 50 years now and i just want to say "takin it to the streets and Just give us a time and we will be there", is nice and romantic impulse but in our modern day world with surveillance on every word we type or plan on any street action is monitored by the police state and whoever says they are goin to lead you in the street revolution will wake up and find that they have lead the people into a trap.....Street action, unless organized like crazy to be non violent makes us look like a mob, not leaders who can fix any problems .... street action at this point is suicidal ...the police state will know everything about your plans and block you and beat you at every corner because they will know every corner you plan to go to before you even think of going there.
Sure you can block traffic and prevent your fellow citizens from getting to work and boy will they cheer when they see the cops beating us and clearing the road so they can get a check to feed the kids and pay the mortgage..... we have seen what the street action has gotten for us...so far and it ain't worth braggin about unless I just want credit for doin something.
There may come a time for violent revolution but that is not now...we have dissapated much of our energy already in so many sreet demonsrations that they are taken for granted and basically ignored by most folks and the media.
This site is about free speech but if you think you can use this site to organize a revolution that may be a good idea but if the idea is to confront the Army in the street you are asking for what they want you to do so they can use all their training to beat and torture you just to get you out of the street and put away. You will be goin out in the street because some groups and web sites who have promised victory many times before tells you "this is the big one that will turn it all around".... Street action will only be effective in our new world order when the military is on our side and shows us that they are willing to go after and protect we the people from the domestic robbers and shredders of our constitution (Bush/Cheney) and the Congress enablers instead of the real people like us.
So keep bangin away at the keyboard folks ..at least the Aliens will see this as proof that we are speaking out but before we are lead down another dead end street and end up in another free speech zone surrounded with guns and tazers, Let's ask ourselves if what we are asked to do will help or hurt our common dreams...
And please can someone else who cares about real change tell our brave Dennis Kucinich that if he is goin to bring up impeachment in the House to not forget to mention the name of the President...I think he still plans on getting everyone to go along with the notion that if we force Bush appoint a new VP we will have solved this crises..... this is all a pathetic joke folks.
I think that Iran is confidant that there will not be a big war with them and I think that Bush told the top Dems that he will negotiate and all this war talk is to make them look like they are "tough on terrorism", forcing the enemies of Bush to negotiate and all the top Dems are into that and will keep all of the fascist changes that have occurred under their watch.
Wait and see if I am correct on this and hope that I am because we are all dead if I am wrong.
ForUs, Jim
what are your chances of surviving a zombie apocalypse?????
http://www.justsayhi.com/bb/zombie
O! for a Muse of fire, that would ascend
The brightest heaven of invention;
A kingdom for a stage, princes to act
And monarchs to behold the swelling scene.
720 billion, 100s of thousands dead and no end in sight. Your great grand children will be paying for this mess, with both tresure and freedoms. thats a given! The only real question is, will our grand children have a Constitution? Answer, not if we the people don't defend it. Your not going to fix the problem setting behind your computer. Organize people, start the million patriot march and take back what belongs to you and future generations.
don't know if everybody read this, but here's an informative article about those nuclear weapons that were "accidentally" flown to Louisiana a few weeks ago and their relation to the current situation with Iran. which is more riffing on the "use it or lose it" theme - you know like the kinks, only able to play three chords in apeman.
http://www.atlanticfreepress.com/content/view/2518/81/
ALOHA !!
Goverments always have money ... Look to the Weimar Republic of Germany in the 1920s. They had plenty of money but were broke!!! Look at the USSR ... We're next ...
THAT IS THE PROBLEM ... When governments have too much money that means government is too BIG! When BIG CENTRALIZED GOVERNMENT is allowed to exist, like Rome, like the USSR then the few elite and their egos and their flights to power arise ... its not long before "We The People" no longer exist and we become the "subjects" of a Caesar ... a King! Our "constitutional money" was sacraficed way back in 1913 and then confiscated in 1933. The following were the exact words President FDR said in 1933. You will recognize that our rights as a free people are always stripped from us as a result of some sort of "crisis". Now in 2007 it is a crisis of "terror" and geopolitics. In 1933 it was the financial crisis of the Great Depression and later WW2.
Read the words of FDR. Does this sound like an elected President serving "We The People" or a King? He actually uses the word "subjects" and he says in essence "hoarding gold and silver"(constitutional money) was unpatriotic. So in his mind seizing the "subjects" property is not only patriotic but for our own good as a Nation. Then he goes further to say that the IRS will oversea this confiscation. So the IRS is FDRs Gestapo ... For such an offense during the 1780s our Founding Fathers would have branded FDR a traitor and executed him. The anti-constitutional acts commited against "We The People" today do have a historical precedence. Aside from FDR, Hitler was the only other modern leader that ever confiscated gold from "subjects". The US Constitution calls gold and silver "real money".
March 9 1933--Executive Order Of The President Of The United States--
"By virtue of the authority vested in me by---The Act of March 9 1933--In which Congress declared a serious emergency exists,I as President do declare that the national emergency still exists;that the continued private hoarding of gold and silver by subjects of the United States poses a grave threat to peace,equal justice,and the well being of the United States;and that appropriate measures must be taken immediately to protect the interests of our people--
All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been sealed,pending action in the due course of law.All sales or purchases of such gold and silver within the borders of the United States and its territories and all foreign exchange transactions or movements of such metals across the border are hereby prohibited--
Your possession of these proscribed metals and/or your maintanence of a safe deposit box to store them is known by the government from bank and insurance records.Therefore be advised that your vault box must remain sealed,and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the "Internal Revenue Service".END
Now consider what the founder of the Rothschild banking empire said over 230 years ago before our US Constitution even existed ...
"Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes it's laws."
- Mayer Amschel Bauer Rothschild
Who owns the US Federal Reserve Bank? Not "We The People", but a group of private banks both foreign and domestic. The US government and the US Treasury handed over our constitutional money to the Rothschild banks in 1913.
I believe the Founding Fathers failed when they stopped short of "seperations". While we do have a seperation of Church and State. We now need a seperation of "Bank and State". The federal Reserve bank needs to be dismantled and the US Treasury installed as the only issuer of money, like it was prior to 1913.
Its that simple ... a fiat monetary system corrupts our money and our leadership and our values. Look no further than the average American's propensity to spend more and demand more than he earns. When the US government moves to buy votes with false promises in order to build its size and therefore its powers we no longer have a USA but a USSA socialist republic! Without a fiat monetary system the Vietnam War and War On Terror could not have gotten as far as it has and the likes of the Bushes and Clintons would have no desire to seek office. Fiat money corrupts absolutely!
Do not vote the usual two party aristocracy, the Dems and Reps, back into power again in 2008. The US Congress has shown how gutless it is against the Rep President Bush and his "executive orders". This is the same gutless Congress that existed ever since 1913 and 1933.
I plan to vote for RON PAUL in 2008. The only candidate who wants to reinstate "congressional money" and the only politician in Washington DC that has stood up against the US Federal Reserve Bank and its capos Greenspan and Bernanke. Without a purging of the fiat money system no real and meaningful political or geopolitical changes can ever occur.
So you see ... in essence our government has been without "real money" ever since 1913! In othe words a "government without money" does exist. What Americans think they have in their wallets is not money, but an IOU. Foreigners, especially our largest trading partners, have figured this out ... Let the games begin!
GOVERNMENT IS ONLY AS HONEST AS ITS MONEY ...
Ellsberg is so important.
Join http://peacesource.net
take up office space on this list with PAND Peoples and Nations for Nuclear Disarmament.
Send me lobbying lists from each country. Bombing Iran must be prevented.
Gravel does well on WMD and Iran issues. Look at the following tool.
Based on your personal and private viewpoints, and leaving aside (if possible) your pre-conceived loyalties, who is the best candidate for you? The best blind-test might be here:
http://www.vajoe.com/candidate_calculator.html
Answer as to your beliefs alone, not how your favourite candidate might think/vote.
KEM PATRICK
as a good californian friend of mine used to say 'i'd rather be f....d than screwed'...........
i was serious about roundabout. he's mia...........
So many CommonDreams comments seem to doubt or ignore the reality and power of non-violence civil disobedience, or seem to doubt there will be sufficient numbers of citizens willing to take to the streets to prevent this pending war with Iran. It only takes 5% of the American people to force a change in the political winds. Only 5%!!!!!!!!!! Do not doubt that 5 out of every 100 Americans aren't willing to go to the streets to prevent this insane war with Iran, if they are sufficiently informed of time, date and place.
I plead, go to work national PEACE group leaders, get together AND GIVE US A DATE !!!!!!!!!!!!
Saila - "I don't believe there's going to be any war with Iran."
All of us join with you in the hope and prayer that there will be no war with Iran.
Ellsberg, like Paul Craig Roberts, have been directing our attention to the obvious for a long while. The war with Iran is already happening, as Galen points out, the fleet is already there, all that remains is the pulling of trigger.
I'm sure most of us have realized from when we were small children that some kind of overwhelming event would occur in our lifetimes following this script. No generation escapes a defining moment, that's not a natural expectation. History, no matter it's interpretation, reads otherwise.
When the mechanism is in place, it will be used at some point in time. That's the perverse nature of human beings.
The only way you would not use a weapon is if you do not have one in your house. If you do have one, however, the odds increase exponentially that you will use it and at some point on a time line stretching out toward infinity, that weapon will cause harm. Any mathematician will verify the odds of this.
Further, the people have been utterly marginalized, that's why we speak out on commondreams, because we have no significance to the group that runs this show. Those folks have multiple contingency plans for saving their own ass.
We worry that we may suffer consequences, but no one in this government is worried about that at all. On a daily basis, as a matter of fact, they have made decisions that reveal the utter lack of any real concern for us except for our cash. They say otherwise, but it's all a sham.
There are far too many complex problems right now, and everyone knows it. Scarce and vanishing resources, parts of the globe suffering severe consequences of a damaged environment, populations that are on the very edge of going totally out of control in circumstances that are a millimeter away.
What would you do if you ruled the world? Ok, maybe you'd be an idealist, but these people are not, they represent, and have represented, the very worst of us, most of the time.
What we are doing on commondreams, and numerous else wheres, is showing where our allegiances lie - which is a faith in the goodness of human beings outside of this irrationality. As it has throughout history, we will at some other decisive moment, which remains somewhat obscured, overcome even this.
The readiness, so to speak, is all. I believe shakespeare also provided the antithesis to this, which I can't at the moment recall.
HOW HONEST IS A GOVERNMENT THAT DOESN'T HAVE ANY MONEY ?
I'm making bows and arrows. Mad Max is upon us.
The most heavily armed civilians on the planet are too afraid to have a revolution. Interesting. What brought us to this point? Probably people like Britney Spears who said we should just trust pResident Bush in all that he says and does...........haha
ALOHA !!
GOVERNMENT IS ONLY AS HONEST AS ITS MONEY ...
I'll repeat it. ~~ WE WILL HAVE A DEPRESSION. ~~
Everything elses of importance, except the global warming issue, will be moot.
Be ready, buy a road kill recipe book and put out a sardine or two for stray cats. Yum-Yum.
JJ. I won't harm your warm pussy __ cat.
Hey all,
If you want to read a hilarious parody on the Ahmadinejad forum at Columbia University, log on to CounterPunch and read "An Academic Hotshot Introduces a Petty Tyrant" Hell, Columbia. It is great! (and ties in with this article)
[Ellsberg] said they should do what he didn't do - release the information before a disaster happens. "Don't wait till the war has started," Ellsberg told the audience. "Don't wait till the bombs are falling or thousands more have died."
Here's where: http://www.wikileaks.org
Warning, Warning: A Perfect Storm has emerged from the collision of four Class 5 Hurricanes: Housing Bubble Collapses, Consumer Debt Bubble Collapses, Treasury goes Pop, the Dauphine nukes Iran. Put those in any sequence you like. As a result,
The Dollar TANKS. Bankrupt Federal Government. Can't even afford to pay their Stasi agents, let alone those folks they have on payroll from the NYTs & CBS.
Very quietly (3am Sunday Morning stuff), with no MSM attention whatever, the States begin to appropriate the Federal Arsenals including WMD's (side bar, How many of the former Confederacy of Slave States have Nuclear, Chemical, or Biological arsenals? Oh yeah, we're makin whoopie now).
The only Q at that point will be, "What can the individual States get in return for handing over the individual members of the Bush Crime Family to the ICC." Oh, yeah, and can we throw in Hillary & Bill Clinton?
I mean the mass murderers of at least 500,000 dead Iraqi babies should be worth at least a tanker of crude, right? As bonus we can give them an authentic replica of the Blue Dress complete with fake sperm stain and arificial DNA. After all Americans made it, so it's fake. But it's a geniune fake. We really intended to make a good relica.
Death will be a merciful release.
Face it folks, we have painted ourselves into a corner and what's gonna happen is gonna happen. Sorry. Like Kosh in Babylon5 said to a couple of fundamentalists who came to complain to him, "The avalanche has begun. Too late for the pebbles to vote."
He was not diplomatic. He did not candy coat his statement. He did them the honor of being candid. How many policians in your world could be described as candid? Will anyone describe the final Dem candidate for Imperial Wizard as "candid"? I don't think so either.
They all grow a woody when they think about our Unitary Presidency (above the Law). That is why none have challenged IT and that is also why this is a perfect storm. At the very moment we are least prepared we shall be hit the hardest, from within, by the richfilth so they can own Everything. Remember that Class War everybody talked about a few years back. Iraq is as much a part of that Class War (the xfer of all wealth to the top) as shipping all the middle class jobs to slave pits on the Pacific Rim.
Perfect Storm. To late for the pebbles to vote. And oh yeah, we are also the most heavily armed civilian population on the planet and we didn't forget the bullets. Like they said in one of the Harry Potter's franchise films, "Clench yure buttocks, it's going to be a bumpy ride."
Peace.
karlof1 September 28th, 2007 6:46 pm , thanks for response. The real 'kicker' in the plan is the fact that right now the US economy is teetering, plus the gobment has hammered in mega-inflation(dollar devalued to 30 year low) against mega-recession (credit market crisis), therefore, the evil triad of government-wall street-corporations has never been more vulnerable. The fact is, every dollar you have in the bank, gives the bank (establishment) 7 dollars of leverage to do the establishment's deals. Certainly, leave enough in to do check transactions, but start pulling out what ever you feel you can safely protect on your own. I'm telling you, this WOULD/WILL work....it is THE answer to we people reminding THEM, that it is THEY who are the PARASITES, and we ARE their host. It will re-establish OUR rightful control!
Well while WE all sit around in front of our computers saying scary things the NeoCons are doing something . . . which is way more than I can say for the majority of Americans. Sure chasing the paycheck is necessary . . . No doubt about it . . .
But I also think that active . . . and I mean ACTIVE participation in ANYTHING that will bring about a change is much more necessary.
But I am just one person sitting in front of my computer. Excuse me for now, I have to go out and stand in the street . . . Alone of course . . . Now that will certainly help a lot.
SOS-TEHRAN:
Please re-read/dis-tribute/act/perform/sing/... Ellsberg's plea to stop the war-machine's appetite for disaster directly linked to lavish life styles, consumption, briefly coined as "cancerous luxury: disgusting."
It boils down to greed and lack of love for nature and humanity. How can be stop the madness gone worst, as if each turn is bound for worst. WHY! development in disguise posing as progress. ENOUGH!
Royal Countess, sounds like you listen to Rush LimbHawHaw -- the Fascist regime is already in place, and if Hillary inherits the mess, we see there will be someone to blame her for it and call her the Fascist that Bush is.
US Involvement in Vietnam started when Eisenhower agreed to put military advisors there in 1954... it began as a covert Cold War, just like Nicaragua, and as an extension of the anti-China Korean War, covering China (an chronic obsession of the Republicans, who get tons of money from the old Kuomintang) from both east and south. The Vietnam mess was then dumped in Kennedy's lap when he became President, after which the war extended to neighboring Laos.
Then, with two Kennedys wiped out by the Republicans' CIA, then came Johnson, a Dixiecrat Demo-Republican hybrid whose home-state Texas is still one of the biggest financial beneficiaries of war due to a big Weapons Industry presence there along with our favorite OIL (another long-time war beneficiary).
Logical that Bush will try to escalate war (maybe along with some hollow diplomatic gestures) beyond undoing, for the very same reasons, making it hard to de-escalate by the time he leaves the Office he stole Twice.
Then Repubs and crypto-Repubs will be screaming at any Demo President which will take office in 2009, and blame them for all the problems dumped in their laps, which is standard Republican policy.
Before we talk Third Parties, we need to make sure they can win, and make sure they will not simply take votes away from Dems and give them to Repubs, as was the case with Wallace, Nader, and every other 'Third Party' candidate the Republicans backed in order to split Democratic voters and then win.
What a delight Ellsworth is and how terrible it is that after more than 40 years he must try to warn us again about the deranged Texans we place in office. Its too late to save us from Lyndon or little Bush but perhaps we should consider a constitutional amendment to ban any future Texans from the presidency or vice presidency. And considering the quality of the Texans sent to the congress, the same admendment should disestablish Texas as a state, give it commonwealth status with one non- voting member of congress....or better still give it back to Mexico.
The Constitution was nice while we had it. Most people deep down know that they have lost something. They don't feel it yet. Fear and fake patriotism are losing their appeal. Whatever takes it's place may even be worse.
When the cell phones and cable tv are lost maybe there will be some attention. OOPS gotta go pro wrestling is on!
PrestonDigitator--Unfortunately, there is a large flaw in the plan to paralyze the USA through what amounts to a run on the banks: the negative savings rate in the USA--the commonfolks have little or no money to withdraw from said banks. However, the initial thrust of the idea has merit and suggests two courses of action: The first, withholding taxes from the federal government, I've already suggested numerous times, while the second would be the refusal to pay debt, which would have a similar effect to that as a run on the banks. Such a "default" crisis would make the engineered, so-called sub-prime crisis pale in comparison. I would warn folks not to stop payment on something truely necessary, like their home or automobile or health insurance. But a year-long, longer if needed, creditcard payment moratorium would have some profound affects, but participants would need to be disciplined and not use the withheld monies to purchase more stuff.
KP - stay away from my kitty cat, aka, couch snake!
She's not food, she's warmth! :)
The problem is much more severe today. As opposed to the Vietnam era, today our Congress is complicit rather than being deceived.
SAILA, I do hope you are correct. It don't look like you are right now. ___ We'll see. If we have a war with Iran, we are screwed, if we have a depression, we are screwed.
So, ____ we're screwed. One way or the other.
When the depression hits, we won't be sitting here typing smart, intelligent and stupid stuff. So if you aren't ready for it, ya better get ready, for time is running out. JJPETER is correct, no one will need cat food for cats, because the cats will be food. This isn't 1929, the stores will be empty in two days and the best shots with the most ammo will rule. That is a sad thing to say, and a damn shame, but it is how it will be.
Kristina, the people you are talking about represent a minute sampling of the American people. Most Americans want us out of Iraq and know that Bush is doing a terrible job. (Also, if the people you talked about are spending all their time in a bar, many of them are probably alcoholics.)
Think of this, too. I think it's like 40% of (voter eligible) Americans vote anymore. In 2000 our Supreme Court appointed-Bush probably did win about 1/2 the votes. Now that is 50% of 40%..which comes to 20%. So 20% of Americans voted for him the first time. There is powerful evidence that the votes were tampered with, with the electronic voting machines, in 2004.
Now, you may say, why didn't more Americans vote? Is it because they are apathetic morons? I don't think so. I did vote in that election and in the last one. Before that I hadn't voted in a presidential election since Nixon ran against McGovern..the lesser of two evils.
There's no one to vote for! Let's face it folks there is - n o - o n e - to vote for, and there hasn't been for a very long time. I believe many here know that by now. We, as a nation have given up. We're beaten and defeated. Our government and our way of life has been stolen from us.
I still think, that in all likelihood, the only way out of this mess is an all-out revolution. Take our country back. Get our constitution back. Down with all the neo-cons, those that admit it, and those that pretend to give a shit, but would sell us down the river in a heart beat. What are we waiting for? Start planning for the revolution and for what kind of government we want.
I personally want the kind of government we had when the Jeffersonians were running the show.
Stinger_28 "Wow. I hope the genuine apathy and lack of outrage here is because all of the people with a spine have left their computers and marched out to lynch their congressman."
LOL literally
jj and checks, I can see both your points but what angers me is the people that just don't give a damn about what is going on. If I between damn near a full time job, taking care of various stray animals, a husband an elderly uncle and house, bills, laundry, cleaning etc. can find the time to educate myself on these things why can't others? The answer? Because they just don't give a damn. I'll use my customers for an example, most have plenty of time to sit in a bar but if I mention the name of Kucinich they get a blank stare and say who? They can regurgitate every talking head point from Fox noise though and they voted for "Dubya" in the last two elections and they'll be voting for Fred Thompson or Rudy boy in this one. Probably not "that Romney guy" though cuz he's one of them mormons and of course the inbreds here are all Baptist, bible thumping droolers...They won't be voting for Obama cuz he's one of them sand niggers and Hillary? Perish the thought of letting any of the "wimenfolk" have any power (not that I would want anyone to vote for her but it's the mindset).
jjpeter, well why didn't you just say that to begin with? It sounds a lot more compassionate, and includes yourself. Before it sounded like you were pointing the finger at everyone else..at least, all other Americans.
"the powers that be will have us just where they want us." Couldn't agree more and we're mighty close to that right now. If we don't do something now it may be soon too late, or even harder.
"Blow up your TV, throw away your newspaper, move to the country, build you a home, plant a little garden, eat a lot of peaches, and try to find Jesus on your own." John Prine
LOL Galen, sometimes my attempts at humor are quite dry, was being snarky...
checksandbalances -
My comment was the truth, and I first hand observe and experience that reality on a daily basis. Chasing a pay check is where I, you, and everyone that isn't sitting at home waiting for the dividend checks to come in the mail - sink our time.
"If you want the take the revolution out of a revolutionary, give him a mortgate."
My point is; when the bottom falls out of this canoe, when oil goes to $200 a barrel, when all credit is dried up, we'll all be fighting over cat food at the local super market - the dumb and dumber ones, the dot connectors, the newly realized poor.
Then, we'll see just how thin of a "civil" veneer there is over this civilization, and the powers that be will have us just where they want us.
Celebrity: I think Mr. Kucinich had better start wearing a kevlar undershirt. And not accept any invitations to go hunting...
It's too bad, the liberels and the comunist were the people to stand up against Hitler Facist policy.Today the Jews are playing right into the Facist state again. When the war comes to Iran do you realy believe Israel will escape unharmed. What fools they are,this time I wont feel sorry for them and my father is not here to save them. Don"t worry be happy!
I don't believe there's going to be any war with Iran because the consequences will be prohibitive and the outcome uncertain. That's, of course assuming everyone else in the U.S. is as demented as Bush and would allow him to do what Cheney and ziocons want. A regime change would be impossible because anyone installed to replace it would not even last a day. You cannot fight a revolution.
Given the U.S. can destroy Iran with conventional weapons, what then? The U.S. cannot occupy Iran like it did Iraq because U.S. casualties would soar if it tried to hold land. The U.S then may have to resort to nukes for which it will pay a very steep price. For one thing, it will forever lose its mantra and claim of democracy, freedom, and human rights. IT will also bring worldwide condemnation and shame to America and Americans for nuking a country which didn't have nuclear weapons.
On top of that, there are quite a few nasty things the Iranian can do to retaliate such as attacking the U.S. interests all over the Middle East. It's really unthinkable what other things may happen once the war starts. Even the Bush regime may change (by the people).
The sense of urgency is visibly growing along with the level of frustration. Of all the tactics that are available to 'we the people', I found one this morning that has restored real enthusiasm to my life in the face of this long abysmal past 7 years. I discovered the idea here at Common Dreams, on a blog by this same honorable and esteemed author, Mr. Ellsberg, entitles "This Coup and the Next One". His blog is prescient, and visceral, as would be expected, but one of the responses really negated my hapless sense of frustration; please go to, and read Mr. Ellsberg's other blog and then on through the responses. Please note a post by
"iyamwutiam September 27th, 2007 1:50 pm" , and consider it carefully, and then please come-on aboard. To me, it is THE weapon that 'we the people' have been looking for, to bring this government to it's senses.
Darryl: Bush was 'elected' in much the same way a brick fles thru the air under it's own power.
PLEASE click on the following and listen to the voice of reason. AVOICE WE NEED IN THE WHITE HOUSE!!!
http://rawstory.com//news/2007/Kucinich_seriously_thinking_about_forcing...
jjpeter said, 'And American's - stupid on booze, weed, sports, TV, hip hop, church, chasing the next paycheck, spinning in their private little self absorbed worlds - ignorantly think things are going to "stay the same." '
If anyone is ignorant here and talking out of his/her ass it's you jjpeter. Americans are no dumber or more self absorbed than anyone else. We're all like that, us people.
And, "chasing the next paycheck" ? That's called survival. Not everyone can just sit around all day and type stuff on internet boards..here being mainly harsh criticisms of, and blasting the American people, while supposedly curing the ills of the world. I'm lucky enough to be able to earn a few bucks from home. Most can't do that.
jjpeter said, 'And American's - stupid on booze, weed, sports, TV, hip hop, church, chasing the next paycheck, spinning in their private little self absorbed worlds - ignorantly think things are going to "stay the same." '
If anyone is ignorant here and talking out of his/her ass it's you jjpeter. Americans are no dumber or more self absorped than anyone else. We're all like that, us people.
And, "chasing the next paycheck" ? That's called survival. Not everyone can just sit around all day and type stuff on internet boards..here being mainly harsh criticisms of, and blasting the American people, while supposedly curing the ills of the world. I'm lucky enough to be able to earn a few bucks from home. Most can't do that.
I first logged onto this website after 9/11 to try and understand why it happened. From what I have read here and what I have gleamed from history, some citizens of these countries believe that USA has interfered in their domestic policies to the detriment of its citizens and decided to do something about it. It saddens me to see the result of their actions causing your once great, free, country to fall rapidly into self destruction.
When I look at the resume of George Bush - a not very bright failed businessman bailed out by his connections with his father, born again Christian - I can only assume that he is the wrong leader for this time for your country and yet he was elected through a democratic process.
I just hope our politicians in Australia are smart enough not to be dragged down into the same financial, and political quagmire that your country seems to be heading.
Galen--Thanks so much for your ringing endorsement.
For those with greater motivation who want to heed Ellsberg's call to action, http://www.freevermont.net/ is the website of those already putting in motion what I've suggested. And here's a link to an interview with one of the movement's leaders, http://carolynbaker.net/site/content/view/143/
Usually, the worthwhile things in life do NOT fall off a tree into one's lap; they need to be pursued with effort and conviction. Rolling back Empire and its globalization are the most important goals because they must take place before ANY meaningful progress can be made on the many other problems besetting humanity on our small planet. To throw up one's hands and make statements like Galen's is to be Defeatist.
Stinger: Oh. You took the red pill too, huh?
The GOP are a domestic enemy to the US constitution, and the democrats are their hapless "useful idiots"
I think the most surreal thing is that a news organization like Reuters can publish the Senate Finance Commitee Chairman saying 'the treasury will default' by October 1st (3 days) and there has been not a ripple anywhere that this is even newsworthy.
THE ENTIRE BALANCE OF THE FEDERAL TREASURY OF THE US OF FUCKING A IS GONE AND NOBODY'S THE LEAST BIT AWARE THAT THIS MEANS ANYTHING AT ALL!!!
I'm in pink marshmallow land where all of the 6 winged paisleybirds whistle yellow submarine while the green triangular suns do immelmans across the mustard yellow sky.
LA LA LA *sproing* oh, look! There went my brain onto the sidewalk to have a chat with the mice.
Speaking of the moon, besides giving a few people on the space ships the thrill of their lives, planting the U.S. flag on it, and costing taxpayers hundreds of billions or trillions of dollars, what good is space travel doing? (Pssst, U.S. leaders, space can't be dominated or conquered.) Leaders of the USA can think of more ways to waste our money than anyone.
Congress is not merely useless, they're dangerous. They give the sociopaths Bush and Cheney a blank check every time. The U.S. is now broke. We are just about $10 TRILLION in debt. But the Party of War, the GOP and their complicit partners the Democrats, want even more war! I say dump them all in 2008. Vote for Kucinich, Gravel, Nader --- anyone but the military-industrial complex war criminals, big corporation and AIPAC shills.
KEM: Axe? Check. Shovel? Check. Hoe? Check. Three tine cultivator? Check. Hand woodworking tools? Check. Seeds? Check. Cat(meow)? Check. Lady, her kid, Freind and her kids, all other freinds? Check. Books I'll need? Check.
Well, I'm ready to go...
Just make sure you ask to be paid in Euros. :P