West Bank Faces Toxic Waste Crisis

The West Bank has become a dumping site for hazardous waste - which is making residents sick, say Israeli and Palestinian environmental groups.

Several weeks ago, villagers from Jima’in in the Nablus district complained that Israeli trucks were again dumping waste on Palestinian land.

Ayman Abu Thaher, the deputy director-general of the Palestinian Authority’s Environmental Awareness Directorate said such dumping has been going on for years.

“The Israelis are using the West Bank as a cheap and easy alternative for dumping their waste at the expense of the health of Palestinians,” he said.

According to Friends of the Earth Middle East (FoEME), a joint Israeli, Palestinian and Jordanian environmental group, improper dumping of contaminants and waste has over time become a threat to the region’s drinking water.

Toxic percolation

A Palestinian walks through sewage drain
under Israel’s security wall [GALLO/GETTY]

In 2006, FoEME published a report, “A Seeping Time Bomb, Pollution of the Mountain Aquifer by Solid Waste,” which found that the unsustainable disposal of solid waste has resulted in the percolation of toxic substances including chloride, arsenic and heavy metals such as cadmium, mercury and lead into the groundwater.Since the 2006 report was released, the German government has built a new solid waste disposal project near Ramallah and the World Bank and the EU have also completed another solid waste landfill facility near Jenin.

But Mira Epstein, a spokeswoman for FoEME, said that despite the improvements, the threat to drinking water and the environment persist today.

Over three million people reside in the recharge area of the aquifer, which falls under both the West Bank and parts of Israel. The population includes 2.3 million Palestinians, 235,000 Israeli settlers and 500,000 Israelis living within Israel’s internationally recognized borders.

Bassem Abu Mahdi, the director of primary health services in Salfit, which is located near a dump site in the northern West Bank, said an “increasing number of people have been diagnosed with cancer, amoebic dysentery, diarrhea and other related diseases”.

He cited the dumping of hazardous waste as a cause of the increase.

Accusing Israel

Abu Thaher, told Al Jazeera that some Israeli companies were dumping waste in the Palestinian territories rather than resorting to the official hazardous waste treatment site, Ramot Havav, in southern Israel.

In 1985, Israeli pesticide company Geshuri closed operations in Kfar Sava and relocated to Tulkarem in the northern West Bank after Israeli residents petitioned for and obtained a court order for the company to move.

They had accused the company of being responsible for an increase in pollution-related health issues.

“A number of Israeli companies have relocated to the West Bank to avoid the strict environmental laws governing the disposal of waste, particularly hazardous waste in Israel,” Abu Thaher told Al Jazeera.

Palestinians burning garbage

One environmental problem is the burning
of waste by Palestinians [GALLO/GETTY]

But Tzali Greenberg, a spokesman for Israel’s Environment Ministry, told Al Jazeera that the country’s strict environmental laws are also enforced on Israeli companies operating in the Palestinian territories.”There is no difference to us between Israeli and Palestinian waste,” Greenberg said.

“It all gets treated the same and we follow perpetrators who break the law equally and we think people who are serious about this should contact us with the necessary evidence.”

“We will be happy to follow up and take legal action.”

Zecharya Tagar, from the Israeli division of FoEME, said most of the waste produced in the West Bank came from Palestinians, who comprise the majority of the population in the area.

He added that the biggest threat to both the environment and health in the region was the continual burning of waste by Palestinians.

“This is causing the air to be filled with carcinogenic particles which Palestinians are breathing in on a daily basis,” Tagar said.

“Furthermore, Israel does not have a policy of dumping in the West Bank and to the best of our knowledge, this is complied with by the public sector.”

Security trumps

But the Applied Research Institute of Jerusalem (ARIJ), a NGO dedicated to promoting sustainable development in the occupied Palestinian territories, says waste from illegal Israeli settlements is the major problem.

“Wastewater from the settlements is not restricted to domestic effluent but includes pesticides, asbestos, batteries, cement and aluminum which contain carcinogenic and hazardous compounds,” ARIJ recently reported.

It also accused Israeli authorities of being lenient on settlers who broke the law.

The faltering peace process has also contributed to the problem. The joint Israeli-Palestinian Environmental Experts Committee, established under the Oslo Accords, has not met since 1999, forcing coordination on the issue of solid waste to be done in an ad hoc manner.

The dumping of untreated medical waste, including used syringes randomly discarded in garbage dumps, continues largely because of restrictions on movement that the Israeli army argues is necessary for security reasons.

The extensive closures and roadblocks have also made it hard for wastewater tankers to reach the many Palestinian communities that are not connected to main sewage systems and are dependent on cesspits and these tankers for disposal of waste.

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21 Comments so far

truthmonger March 27th, 2008 11:56 am

We are not too far away from Water War I.
Can’t you just hear bush now - “We can’t let ______ (fill in country) develop clean drinking water.”

ladybug March 27th, 2008 2:00 pm

“improper dumping of contaminants and waste has over time become a threat to the region’s drinking water”
Just another strategy for the “Palestinian Final Solution”

gde March 27th, 2008 2:18 pm

This is not news, it came out years ago. ladybug is correct.

Mike Corbeil March 27th, 2008 2:31 pm

gde,

One article every x number of years doesn’t make this AlJazeera article non-news-reporting. I’ve read enough articles about pollution in Palestine and due to the US-Israel hell reined against Palestinians, but this is the first article I’ve read with the details it provides.

Atrocious, disgusting news, but excellent and important article too!

Hetware’s post in the following page is strongly enough fitting to consider alongside this AlJazeera article. It’s the first post in the page.

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/03/26/7911/

kendpotter March 27th, 2008 3:10 pm

ladybug

“Palestinian Final Solution”

You make me want to puke.

The Israelis are perfectly capable of exterminating the Palestinians in the occupied territories. They lack the “want”. On the other hand, destruction of the Jewish State is enshrined in any number of Arab manifestos. They have the “want” in spades. Fortunately, they lack the capability.

braithwa842 March 27th, 2008 4:33 pm

Or at the very least :-

They have been herded and concentrated into small areas, poisoned, assassinated, homes bulldozed, checkpointed, shot, had land stolen, incarcerated, tortured, had vital infrastructure such as power destroyed, had schools bulldozed, pregnant women aborted at checkpoints. They have been the victims of enough hate, enough dirty deeds, enough one sided propaganda so that one can only imagine that they SHOULD have the want by now.

gde March 27th, 2008 5:05 pm

kendpotter

The Israelis know they can’t kill them all and survive in the court of public opinion, although a minority think that way. But, they do want to maintain a majority of ethnic Jews in the combined Israel Palestine region. And if increased infant and child mortality is one of the mechanisms, that does not bother those in control.

Destruction of a non-Jewish Palestinian state has been a major part of Israeli policy for over 40 years. Israel has carried this policy out, denying the rights of non-Jewish Palestinians to have access to a national government in which they are represented. A fair solution to this issue would require the Palestinians to control both Palestinian and Israeli territory for over 40 years, and the Jews to have no voice during that time. Then a 1 or 2 state solution could be implemented. It won’t happen, of course, but it would be fair.

The Arabs would be happy if the Jews went back to their place of origin (for most of them) and form a country there, or take the state they were given in the 1930s.

kendpotter March 27th, 2008 6:25 pm

braithwa842,

You make very valid points. The Palestinians have serious and real greivances against the State of Israel. The Warsaw ghetto was genocide. The Gaza Strip is not. To say it is is simply assisting the Arab States who have pissed all over their Palestinian brothers and enabled the Israeli’s oppression.

gde

“The Arabs would be happy if the Jews went back to their place of origin…”

In which case the largest number would be going back to Arab States - Which threw them out in the first place in the years following WWII. Look it up. The number of Jews fleeing pogroms in Arab States following the 1948 war far exceeds the number of Jews in Palestine at the start of the war.

eileenfleming March 27th, 2008 8:10 pm

The children of Sderot are not served when the children of Gaza are forced to drink polluted water, but current reality is that hundreds of commodities needed for the maintaining of a normal daily life are not being allowed into the Gaza Strip, by order of the Government of Israel.

Even the entry of water filters - vital for purifying the water drawn from Gazan wells, which are heavily polluted by brine, oil and sewage have been prevented from reaching Gaza for more than half a year because of the sanctions imposed upon the innocent for daring to democratically elect a party deemed as a “terrorist organization” for rising up against the occupation of their land.

Gaza has become the largest ghetto in the world, a regional disaster and also puts innocent Israelis in danger because of the violent retaliatory and provocative actions of their government-which is aided and abetted by USA blind allegiance to the secular state and Ethnocracy we call Israel, which is only a democracy if you are a Jew.

“However bad the suffering is of the inhabitants of Sderot, Ashkelon and the Kibbutzim and Moshavim in the area under the barrage of Qassam missiles, mortar shells and sniper bullets, it is in no way a justification for a cruel siege which severely damages a million and half civilians - men, women and children. The siege is an immoral act and a violation of International Law - and from the practical point of view, increasing the bitterness and suffering in Gaza leads to an intensification of attacks towards the Israeli side, not to their end.”
http://gush-shalom.org.toibillboard.info/ConvJan08.htm

Eileen Fleming,
Reporter and Editor WAWA:
http://www.wearewideawake.org/
Author “Keep Hope Alive” and “Memoirs of a Nice Irish American ‘Girl’s’ Life in Occupied Territory”
Producer “30 Minutes With Vanunu” and “13 Minutes with Vanunu”

SSW March 28th, 2008 2:49 am

Isn’t a large population area or religious extremists (aka muslims )getting sick and dying a good thing ?
This is an environmental problem though that should be taken care of, but that money to the government could be better spent on military endevours.

greatbear215 March 28th, 2008 7:31 am

Gaza is the worlds largest concentration camp. Owned and operated by the nation state of Israel.
Israel simply refuses to answer to any number of complaints filed by the international community. Their conduct goes beyond shameful. It is inhumane.
Israel is another country that needs to be grabbed by the scruff of its neck and taken to the Hague to stand trial.
No one is above the law-and Israel needs to learn this lesson-along with a few other countries.

barely human March 28th, 2008 9:21 am

You make me want to puke.

Go for it! Barfing is underrated!

kendpotter March 28th, 2008 10:24 am

greatbear215

“Gaza is the worlds largest concentration camp. Owned and operated by the nation state of Israel.”

Last time I checked the Israelis had left. Yes, I am pretty sure I remember - They pulled out and then there was an orgy of looting and destruction. All the greehouses where Israelis previously grew food were apparently too kosher for the Palestinians because they promptly destroyed them. About the only thing of value not destroyed were the sea-front villas taken over by Palestinian leadership. Now that is nation building for you.

Let’s say there are two houses sitting side-by-side. You live in one and claim you own both. I live in one and claim to own both. You renounce your claim to mine and the first thing I do is set fire to the curtains, shit all over the rug, and start throwing rocks at your house. I bet you would be impressed.

Of course Israel also borders Gaza on all five sides. What? They don’t? Gaze shares a border with Egypt? Why aren’t the Egyptians stepping in and helping there Arab bretheren. Oh I remember now. They are still keeping Palestinians locked up in refugee camps from the Six Day War, 40 years gone. Wonder what it is like to grow old and die in a camp run by your Arab “brothers”.

Do the Palestinians have real and substantial grievances against the Israelis? Of course they do. Some of which they have brought upon themselves. Some which their Arab bretheren never want resolved because it would ruin their cause celebre and they would have no further reason to blame all their self-induced problems (autocracy/theocracy will do that for you) on the Jews, the West, the Crusaders, the humidity, tight shoes, Brangelina, etc., etc., ad-infinitum, ad-nauseum.

sphne March 28th, 2008 11:30 am

..and yet, they are going ahead with plans for 750 more homes in the occupied areas. You can whine all you want about how unfairly Israel is seen in the eyes of the world, the fact remains–it is a land and water grab.

piazzapulita March 28th, 2008 11:30 am

Kendpotter…
you are a kosher asshole. Why not start by brushing up on the bogus “creation” of the State of Israel, a plot hatched by the British and Zionists with US help, after the fall of the Ottoman Empire, to take over a land inhabited for centuries by arabs - of course, with no arab input or approval - and with the sole objective of systematic ethnic cleansing. Israel cannot pursue its barbaric oppression with impunity indefinitely. After learning what Israel has done to Bethlehem, I marvel that the world’s Christians can maintain their stunning silence. US “friendship” with Israel is a figment sustained by the power of AIPAC which has just about every politician in its pocket. When will Americans learn they are Israeli pawns, nothing more?
What could possibly justify the time, money and access of our latest technology?
Take a look at today’s Times, which describes the barring of Palestinians from a road (Highway 443) built on their private land, with the approval of the Supreme Court, unequivocally legalizing apartheid. Wake up Israel, before it’s too late.

MukiMaine March 28th, 2008 11:30 am

You suggest the Jews should go back where they came from to make the Arabs happy. Does that include the hundreds of thousands of Jews who were thrown out of Morocco, Tunisia, Iran, and other Arab countries in the late 1940s? Israel embraced them and built them the best housing they could (and boy, was it substandard; Israel had no resources). Those citizens are among the most prosperous and powerful Israelis now because Israel wanted to be a home, not a place of poster-child refugees. They should go back to their previous places of residence? Perhaps they could teach their Arab neighbors how to build a strong and prosperous nation!

kendpotter March 28th, 2008 11:54 am

sphne

“..and yet, they are going ahead with plans for 750 more homes in the occupied areas.”

I said that the Palestinians had real and substantial grievances. Israeli expansion outside the internationally regognized boundaries of their state would certainly be a pretty good example of that. I think there should be pressure on Israel, by the US for them to evacuate all of their illegal settlements on the West Bank. It undermines their moral standing and makes them into occupiers.

kendpotter March 28th, 2008 12:01 pm

piazzapulita,

“Kendpotter…
you are a kosher asshole. Why not start by brushing up on the bogus “creation” of the State of Israel….”

I don’t typically waste my time responding to people that have little to offer but insults. But I will in your case. You are (apparently) one of those who wants to turn back the clock.

Before we explore that, I want to ask you a question. Whatever nationality you are, are your people completely static? Where they there from time immemorial, on the same land, never encroaching or being encroaced on by their neighbors? If so, I would like to know who they are (being an anomaly not known in human history).

You aren’t happy with the UN sanctioned boundaries of the State of Israel. Fine, where do they go? What do you intend to have happen to all the current residents of the country?

minitru March 28th, 2008 12:24 pm

greatbear215 -

your arrogant remarks show that you are ignorant of Middle Eastern history but to hide this fact you repeat all the lies and racist clichés about Arabs in general and Palestinians in particular.

The Israelis destroyed most of their infrastructure before they “left” Gaza, not the Palestinians - for obvious reasons (so that it would not fall into the hands of the “enemy”..) The greenhouses couldn´t have been too “kosher” for the Palestinian people because they had done the daily work (for Israeli exporters).

That some Palestinians vented their anger and frustration (caused by 40 years of blatant injustice and daily humiliation) through demolishing of what was left from the Israeli “settlers” is not surprising and understandable. If you bother to take a look at the historical facts (I recommend Robert Fisk) you will surely see that they are the victims of political intrigue (with underlying racism) that started in colonial times (with the British Mandate / Balfour Declaration) and is still going on under the Orwellian slogan of bringing “the peace process” back on track…..

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1259454859593416473

Your sarcasm about the lack of Egyptian (and other Arab countries`) solidarity with their brothers may sound appropriate at first sight but at closer inspection it is not justified: were it not for the CORRUPT and DOMINATING INFLUENCE of the US (replacing Britain and France, who started the whole mess) the whole Middle East would be a different region today. YOUR governments (assuming that you are a US citizen)have installed / backed the worst dictatorships in the region:
Egypt: autocratic regime (with a charade of “democratic elections”) is a big recipient of US “aid” to suppress Islamist groups, any democratic movements and to look the other way when Israel is committing crimes…
Saudi Arabia: a sick, imprisoned society with huge shopping malls but Human and Political Rights from the stone age, home of OBL, most of the 9/11 hijackers and the worst kind of Islamic fundamentalism.. yet Prez Bush is kissing the cheeks of Saudi Royal family….
Iran: as a consequence of the autocratic and cruel rule of the Shah and his secret police (SAVAK), who were installed after a US/UK engineered coup to prevent nationalisation of the oil industry, the country turned to religious extremism and the mullahs took over…
Iraq: was removed from the list of “rogue” states by Ronald Reagan.. (to qualify for US “military aid”) …Saddam shook hands with Don Rumsfeld and was conveniently fighting a war against Iran in the 1980ies, …”important US ally” until he fell from grace and became “the Hitler” of the Middle East…(N.B. torturing and killing is ok, as long as it serves the “interests of the US”….)

I suggest you read Noam Chomskies “Hegemony or Survival” or any other of his books to get the picture (the historical facts are undeniable…)

You should think twice before ridiculing apparent lack of Arab solidarity: the thousands of fighters and even suicide bombers who have infiltrated Iraq to fight US occupation are proof that this solidarity does exist and if Israel and the (other?) “rogue” states did not have the backing of the almighty US war machine what do you think would happen? Arabs are not cowards, they have a lot more courage than the present US goverment:(former ones were not really different) these “chicken-hawks” prefer to attack countries which are practically defenseless and than pose in front of TV cameras as great warriors although the have evaded all personal combat experience…

Perhaps the people in the Middle East would stand a chance to build their own democracies if the United States of Arrogance (I am referring to the ruling elite, not the American people)would turn into a real democracy, not a hegemonic military machine with a formal state attached to it, and LET WEAKER STATES, EVEN WITH STRATEGICALLY IMPORTANT RESOURCES, DECIDE THEIR OWN AFFAIRS FOR ONCE!!!
THIS WOULD ALSO HELP ENORMOUSLY IN THE “WAR ON TERROR”!

kendpotter March 28th, 2008 12:44 pm

minitru,

You are slapping at greatbear for no reason. You are so eager to exhort your tired same-old, same-old, you can’t even be bothered to know the author.

I agree with 95% of what you say. I also believe that Israel is not just going to go away - Do you honestly think they are going to link arms, and march into the sea for your convenience?

I am perfectly aware of history. I know that the CIA sponsored the coup that toppled Mossadegh and installed the Shah, etc., etc. I think the current leadership of the US is the worst pack of scoundrels that have ever run a major country (and with some of the Tsars the Russians had, that is saying something). I also believe a great deal of the Arab’s current problems are self-inflicted. You can only blame so much on others.

All of the jump-on-the-bandwagon-love-the-Palestinians-hate-the-facist-Jews-Western-liberal-morons make me want to puke. To fail to recognize that both sides have legitemate concerns is less than intelligent and will not further a solution to the problems vexing the region.

kendpotter March 28th, 2008 12:52 pm

minitru,

I forgot to talk about an important issue you raise. You talk about Arab solidarity as shown by suicide bombers. This is part of the 5% where I think you are an idiot. None of the Arab militant leaders ever goes through with dying for their cause - They surrender when caught. Dying is for the poor, ignorant fools, they have conned. Suicide bombing never won a war, created a country, or furthered national ends. It is merely an expression of rage.

You want to create a military force that can actually influence events, fight effectively for a cause? Create a society with an educated middle class. Forget about autocracy/theocracy - When a society is used to top-down rule, there is no history of the initiative that is vital to the creation of a group of leaders (your sargeants and lower/middle ranked officers) that can win.

truthmonger March 27th, 2008 11:56 am

We are not too far away from Water War I.
Can’t you just hear bush now - “We can’t let ______ (fill in country) develop clean drinking water.”
ladybug March 27th, 2008 2:00 pm

“improper dumping of contaminants and waste has over time become a threat to the region’s drinking water”
Just another strategy for the “Palestinian Final Solution”
gde March 27th, 2008 2:18 pm

This is not news, it came out years ago. ladybug is correct.
Mike Corbeil March 27th, 2008 2:31 pm

gde,

One article every x number of years doesn’t make this AlJazeera article non-news-reporting. I’ve read enough articles about pollution in Palestine and due to the US-Israel hell reined against Palestinians, but this is the first article I’ve read with the details it provides.

Atrocious, disgusting news, but excellent and important article too!

Hetware’s post in the following page is strongly enough fitting to consider alongside this AlJazeera article. It’s the first post in the page.

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/03/26/7911/
kendpotter March 27th, 2008 3:10 pm

ladybug

“Palestinian Final Solution”

You make me want to puke.

The Israelis are perfectly capable of exterminating the Palestinians in the occupied territories. They lack the “want”. On the other hand, destruction of the Jewish State is enshrined in any number of Arab manifestos. They have the “want” in spades. Fortunately, they lack the capability.
braithwa842 March 27th, 2008 4:33 pm

Or at the very least :-

They have been herded and concentrated into small areas, poisoned, assassinated, homes bulldozed, checkpointed, shot, had land stolen, incarcerated, tortured, had vital infrastructure such as power destroyed, had schools bulldozed, pregnant women aborted at checkpoints. They have been the victims of enough hate, enough dirty deeds, enough one sided propaganda so that one can only imagine that they SHOULD have the want by now.
gde March 27th, 2008 5:05 pm

kendpotter

The Israelis know they can’t kill them all and survive in the court of public opinion, although a minority think that way. But, they do want to maintain a majority of ethnic Jews in the combined Israel Palestine region. And if increased infant and child mortality is one of the mechanisms, that does not bother those in control.

Destruction of a non-Jewish Palestinian state has been a major part of Israeli policy for over 40 years. Israel has carried this policy out, denying the rights of non-Jewish Palestinians to have access to a national government in which they are represented. A fair solution to this issue would require the Palestinians to control both Palestinian and Israeli territory for over 40 years, and the Jews to have no voice during that time. Then a 1 or 2 state solution could be implemented. It won’t happen, of course, but it would be fair.

The Arabs would be happy if the Jews went back to their place of origin (for most of them) and form a country there, or take the state they were given in the 1930s.
kendpotter March 27th, 2008 6:25 pm

braithwa842,

You make very valid points. The Palestinians have serious and real greivances against the State of Israel. The Warsaw ghetto was genocide. The Gaza Strip is not. To say it is is simply assisting the Arab States who have pissed all over their Palestinian brothers and enabled the Israeli’s oppression.

gde

“The Arabs would be happy if the Jews went back to their place of origin…”

In which case the largest number would be going back to Arab States - Which threw them out in the first place in the years following WWII. Look it up. The number of Jews fleeing pogroms in Arab States following the 1948 war far exceeds the number of Jews in Palestine at the start of the war.
eileenfleming March 27th, 2008 8:10 pm

The children of Sderot are not served when the children of Gaza are forced to drink polluted water, but current reality is that hundreds of commodities needed for the maintaining of a normal daily life are not being allowed into the Gaza Strip, by order of the Government of Israel.

Even the entry of water filters - vital for purifying the water drawn from Gazan wells, which are heavily polluted by brine, oil and sewage have been prevented from reaching Gaza for more than half a year because of the sanctions imposed upon the innocent for daring to democratically elect a party deemed as a “terrorist organization” for rising up against the occupation of their land.

Gaza has become the largest ghetto in the world, a regional disaster and also puts innocent Israelis in danger because of the violent retaliatory and provocative actions of their government-which is aided and abetted by USA blind allegiance to the secular state and Ethnocracy we call Israel, which is only a democracy if you are a Jew.

“However bad the suffering is of the inhabitants of Sderot, Ashkelon and the Kibbutzim and Moshavim in the area under the barrage of Qassam missiles, mortar shells and sniper bullets, it is in no way a justification for a cruel siege which severely damages a million and half civilians - men, women and children. The siege is an immoral act and a violation of International Law - and from the practical point of view, increasing the bitterness and suffering in Gaza leads to an intensification of attacks towards the Israeli side, not to their end.”
http://gush-shalom.org.toibillboard.info/ConvJan08.htm

Eileen Fleming,
Reporter and Editor WAWA:
http://www.wearewideawake.org/
Author “Keep Hope Alive” and “Memoirs of a Nice Irish American ‘Girl’s’ Life in Occupied Territory”
Producer “30 Minutes With Vanunu” and “13 Minutes with Vanunu”
SSW March 28th, 2008 2:49 am

Isn’t a large population area or religious extremists (aka muslims )getting sick and dying a good thing ?
This is an environmental problem though that should be taken care of, but that money to the government could be better spent on military endevours.
greatbear215 March 28th, 2008 7:31 am

Gaza is the worlds largest concentration camp. Owned and operated by the nation state of Israel.
Israel simply refuses to answer to any number of complaints filed by the international community. Their conduct goes beyond shameful. It is inhumane.
Israel is another country that needs to be grabbed by the scruff of its neck and taken to the Hague to stand trial.
No one is above the law-and Israel needs to learn this lesson-along with a few other countries.
barely human March 28th, 2008 9:21 am

You make me want to puke.

Go for it! Barfing is underrated!
kendpotter March 28th, 2008 10:24 am

greatbear215

“Gaza is the worlds largest concentration camp. Owned and operated by the nation state of Israel.”

Last time I checked the Israelis had left. Yes, I am pretty sure I remember - They pulled out and then there was an orgy of looting and destruction. All the greehouses where Israelis previously grew food were apparently too kosher for the Palestinians because they promptly destroyed them. About the only thing of value not destroyed were the sea-front villas taken over by Palestinian leadership. Now that is nation building for you.

Let’s say there are two houses sitting side-by-side. You live in one and claim you own both. I live in one and claim to own both. You renounce your claim to mine and the first thing I do is set fire to the curtains, shit all over the rug, and start throwing rocks at your house. I bet you would be impressed.

Of course Israel also borders Gaza on all five sides. What? They don’t? Gaze shares a border with Egypt? Why aren’t the Egyptians stepping in and helping there Arab bretheren. Oh I remember now. They are still keeping Palestinians locked up in refugee camps from the Six Day War, 40 years gone. Wonder what it is like to grow old and die in a camp run by your Arab “brothers”.

Do the Palestinians have real and substantial grievances against the Israelis? Of course they do. Some of which they have brought upon themselves. Some which their Arab bretheren never want resolved because it would ruin their cause celebre and they would have no further reason to blame all their self-induced problems (autocracy/theocracy will do that for you) on the Jews, the West, the Crusaders, the humidity, tight shoes, Brangelina, etc., etc., ad-infinitum, ad-nauseum.
sphne March 28th, 2008 11:30 am

..and yet, they are going ahead with plans for 750 more homes in the occupied areas. You can whine all you want about how unfairly Israel is seen in the eyes of the world, the fact remains–it is a land and water grab.
piazzapulita March 28th, 2008 11:30 am

Kendpotter…
you are a kosher asshole. Why not start by brushing up on the bogus “creation” of the State of Israel, a plot hatched by the British and Zionists with US help, after the fall of the Ottoman Empire, to take over a land inhabited for centuries by arabs - of course, with no arab input or approval - and with the sole objective of systematic ethnic cleansing. Israel cannot pursue its barbaric oppression with impunity indefinitely. After learning what Israel has done to Bethlehem, I marvel that the world’s Christians can maintain their stunning silence. US “friendship” with Israel is a figment sustained by the power of AIPAC which has just about every politician in its pocket. When will Americans learn they are Israeli pawns, nothing more?
What could possibly justify the time, money and access of our latest technology?
Take a look at today’s Times, which describes the barring of Palestinians from a road (Highway 443) built on their private land, with the approval of the Supreme Court, unequivocally legalizing apartheid. Wake up Israel, before it’s too late.
MukiMaine March 28th, 2008 11:30 am

You suggest the Jews should go back where they came from to make the Arabs happy. Does that include the hundreds of thousands of Jews who were thrown out of Morocco, Tunisia, Iran, and other Arab countries in the late 1940s? Israel embraced them and built them the best housing they could (and boy, was it substandard; Israel had no resources). Those citizens are among the most prosperous and powerful Israelis now because Israel wanted to be a home, not a place of poster-child refugees. They should go back to their previous places of residence? Perhaps they could teach their Arab neighbors how to build a strong and prosperous nation!
kendpotter March 28th, 2008 11:54 am

sphne

“..and yet, they are going ahead with plans for 750 more homes in the occupied areas.”

I said that the Palestinians had real and substantial grievances. Israeli expansion outside the internationally regognized boundaries of their state would certainly be a pretty good example of that. I think there should be pressure on Israel, by the US for them to evacuate all of their illegal settlements on the West Bank. It undermines their moral standing and makes them into occupiers.
kendpotter March 28th, 2008 12:01 pm

piazzapulita,

“Kendpotter…
you are a kosher asshole. Why not start by brushing up on the bogus “creation” of the State of Israel….”

I don’t typically waste my time responding to people that have little to offer but insults. But I will in your case. You are (apparently) one of those who wants to turn back the clock.

Before we explore that, I want to ask you a question. Whatever nationality you are, are your people completely static? Where they there from time immemorial, on the same land, never encroaching or being encroaced on by their neighbors? If so, I would like to know who they are (being an anomaly not known in human history).

You aren’t happy with the UN sanctioned boundaries of the State of Israel. Fine, where do they go? What do you intend to have happen to all the current residents of the country?
minitru March 28th, 2008 12:24 pm

greatbear215 -

your arrogant remarks show that you are ignorant of Middle Eastern history but to hide this fact you repeat all the lies and racist clichés about Arabs in general and Palestinians in particular.

The Israelis destroyed most of their infrastructure before they “left” Gaza, not the Palestinians - for obvious reasons (so that it would not fall into the hands of the “enemy”..) The greenhouses couldn´t have been too “kosher” for the Palestinian people because they had done the daily work (for Israeli exporters).

That some Palestinians vented their anger and frustration (caused by 40 years of blatant injustice and daily humiliation) through demolishing of what was left from the Israeli “settlers” is not surprising and understandable. If you bother to take a look at the historical facts (I recommend Robert Fisk) you will surely see that they are the victims of political intrigue (with underlying racism) that started in colonial times (with the British Mandate / Balfour Declaration) and is still going on under the Orwellian slogan of bringing “the peace process” back on track…..

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1259454859593416473

Your sarcasm about the lack of Egyptian (and other Arab countries`) solidarity with their brothers may sound appropriate at first sight but at closer inspection it is not justified: were it not for the CORRUPT and DOMINATING INFLUENCE of the US (replacing Britain and France, who started the whole mess) the whole Middle East would be a different region today. YOUR governments (assuming that you are a US citizen)have installed / backed the worst dictatorships in the region:
Egypt: autocratic regime (with a charade of “democratic elections”) is a big recipient of US “aid” to suppress Islamist groups, any democratic movements and to look the other way when Israel is committing crimes…
Saudi Arabia: a sick, imprisoned society with huge shopping malls but Human and Political Rights from the stone age, home of OBL, most of the 9/11 hijackers and the worst kind of Islamic fundamentalism.. yet Prez Bush is kissing the cheeks of Saudi Royal family….
Iran: as a consequence of the autocratic and cruel rule of the Shah and his secret police (SAVAK), who were installed after a US/UK engineered coup to prevent nationalisation of the oil industry, the country turned to religious extremism and the mullahs took over…
Iraq: was removed from the list of “rogue” states by Ronald Reagan.. (to qualify for US “military aid”) …Saddam shook hands with Don Rumsfeld and was conveniently fighting a war against Iran in the 1980ies, …”important US ally” until he fell from grace and became “the Hitler” of the Middle East…(N.B. torturing and killing is ok, as long as it serves the “interests of the US”….)

I suggest you read Noam Chomskies “Hegemony or Survival” or any other of his books to get the picture (the historical facts are undeniable…)

You should think twice before ridiculing apparent lack of Arab solidarity: the thousands of fighters and even suicide bombers who have infiltrated Iraq to fight US occupation are proof that this solidarity does exist and if Israel and the (other?) “rogue” states did not have the backing of the almighty US war machine what do you think would happen? Arabs are not cowards, they have a lot more courage than the present US goverment:(former ones were not really different) these “chicken-hawks” prefer to attack countries which are practically defenseless and than pose in front of TV cameras as great warriors although the have evaded all personal combat experience…

Perhaps the people in the Middle East would stand a chance to build their own democracies if the United States of Arrogance (I am referring to the ruling elite, not the American people)would turn into a real democracy, not a hegemonic military machine with a formal state attached to it, and LET WEAKER STATES, EVEN WITH STRATEGICALLY IMPORTANT RESOURCES, DECIDE THEIR OWN AFFAIRS FOR ONCE!!!
THIS WOULD ALSO HELP ENORMOUSLY IN THE “WAR ON TERROR”!
kendpotter March 28th, 2008 12:44 pm

minitru,

You are slapping at greatbear for no reason. You are so eager to exhort your tired same-old, same-old, you can’t even be bothered to know the author.

I agree with 95% of what you say. I also believe that Israel is not just going to go away - Do you honestly think they are going to link arms, and march into the sea for your convenience?

I am perfectly aware of history. I know that the CIA sponsored the coup that toppled Mossadegh and installed the Shah, etc., etc. I think the current leadership of the US is the worst pack of scoundrels that have ever run a major country (and with some of the Tsars the Russians had, that is saying something). I also believe a great deal of the Arab’s current problems are self-inflicted. You can only blame so much on others.

All of the jump-on-the-bandwagon-love-the-Palestinians-hate-the-facist-Jews-Western-liberal-morons make me want to puke. To fail to recognize that both sides have legitemate concerns is less than intelligent and will not further a solution to the problems vexing the region.
kendpotter March 28th, 2008 12:52 pm

minitru,

I forgot to talk about an important issue you raise. You talk about Arab solidarity as shown by suicide bombers. This is part of the 5% where I think you are an idiot. None of the Arab militant leaders ever goes through with dying for their cause - They surrender when caught. Dying is for the poor, ignorant fools, they have conned. Suicide bombing never won a war, created a country, or furthered national ends. It is merely an expression of rage.

You want to create a military force that can actually influence events, fight effectively for a cause? Create a society with an educated middle class. Forget about autocracy/theocracy - When a society is used to top-down rule, there is no history of the initiative that is vital to the creation of a group of leaders (your sargeants and lower/middle ranked officers) that can win.

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