Let Cy Bolton count the memos.
In the face of overwhelming evidence, it's astounding that people such as James Kirchick, in "," continue to defend the president against accusations that he intentionally misled and outright lied to the American people in making the case for war with Iraq.
Consider first the implications of the famous Downing Street memo from July 23, 2002. Briefing Tony Blair about his recent talks with Washington, Britain's top intelligence officer stated that U.S. "military action was now seen as inevitable. ... But the intelligence and facts were being fixed around the policy."
A month later, in August 2002, the administration set up the White House Iraq Group, designed solely to sell the public on the imminent threat posed by Saddam Hussein. In essence, it was a marketing campaign to sell the war by escalating the rhetoric and misleading the public. And lying.
And boy, did they. Here are statements from the administration in 2002 as they beat the drums for war. Dick Cheney said: "There is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction. There is no doubt he is amassing them to use ... against us." Condoleezza Rice: "We do know that [Hussein] is actively pursuing a nuclear weapon." Donald Rumsfeld: "[Hussein's] regime has amassed large, clandestine stockpiles of chemical weapons."
These statements were designed to cultivate in Americans fear of Iraq's imminent threat, the keystone of Bush's push to war. They were grossly and intentionally misleading, suggesting that the administration possessed incontrovertible facts on which were drawn these definitive conclusions. In reality, the facts were known to be ambiguous at best. Absolutely no intelligence existed at the time that would allow anyone to reach such concrete conclusions.
And Bush advisors aren't the only ones. His assertion on Oct. 7, 2002, that Iraq posed an imminent threat was beaten into the nation's psyche: "Facing clear evidence of peril, we cannot wait for the final proof." Yet the president possessed directly opposing information from the top-secret National Intelligence Estimate, released days earlier. Prepared by the CIA with input from 16 U.S. intelligence agencies: "Baghdad for now appears to be drawing a line short of conducting terrorist attacks with conventional CBW [chemical and biological weapons] against the United States."
The declassified summary of the NIE -- released by the administration for public and media review shortly after the full report -- was another lie in that it was grotesquely altered. The above point was not included. Also missing were several forceful statements from other intelligence agencies disputing the CIA's horribly overblown and inaccurate assessments. Finally, in at least half a dozen instances, conclusions were altered to make Iraq's threat more compelling. Language was added or omitted that changed CIA opinions to incontrovertible facts
Conclusion: The public document was rigged to support the push for war. The president intentionally misled the public. The intelligence and facts were fixed around the policy.
Another example is the now infamous nuclear reference from Bush's 2003 State of the Union address: "Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa." Not only was this refuted twice in early 2002 -- by former Ambassador Joseph C. Wilson IV and by French intelligence -- but the CIA's National Intelligence Council investigated and told the White House four days before the address that "the Niger [Africa] story is baseless and should be laid to rest." So the administration knew the claim was false, used it anyway and when caught, issued a collective "oops." Although these speeches are vetted by Bush staffers, State, Defense, National Security and the CIA, it just slipped through. Riiiiight.
Two weeks before the war, the president echoed statements made in January's State of the Union: "I've got a good evidence to believe that. [Saddam Hussein] has weapons of mass destruction," and "Iraqi operatives continue to hide biological and chemical agents to avoid detection by inspectors." Ah yes, the mobile labs. And your evidence was from whom, sir? Curveball? The now fully discredited Iraqi chemical engineer who defected in 1999 and claimed to have worked in the labs? In 2002, German intelligence -- who debriefed Curveball -- told the CIA that the guy was "crazy" and "a fabricator."
Yet in his push for war, Bush chose to voice the Iraqi defector's claims over proof offered by U.N. weapons inspectors who, with eyes and ears on the ground, represented the best possible intelligence. From November 2002 to March 2003, they were granted unprecedented freedom and conducted more than 700 no-notice inspections all over Iraq and found nothing. No mobile labs, no underground storage facilities, nothing. This should have been great news, but not for a president looking to go to war. Indeed, U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix flat out accused Bush and Blair of lying when he stated: "The Americans and British created facts where there were no facts at all. ... The Americans needed [to find] weapons of mass destruction to justify war." So Bush was creating facts to justify war.
If there remains any equivocation of Bush's propensity to lie, consider the Jan. 31, 2003, meeting between Bush and Blair. In a summary, Blair foreign policy advisor David Manning wrote that there was tension between the two over finding some justification for the war. In fact, Bush was so concerned about the failure of the weapons inspectors to find WMD that the president floated three possible ways to "provoke a confrontation" with Hussein. So here's your president very publicly using self-defense to sell a war while quite privately discussing how to provoke one -- with an allegedly dangerous foe who poses an imminent threat. Either Bush lied or he put us at grave risk. Or both.
Space constraints don't allow for a refutation of all the lies the president told about Iraq's threat, their weapons and their link to Osama bin Laden. However, consider this final point: Our government spent nearly tens of millions of dollars to try to impeach a president for lying about consensual sex between two adults. Compare that to this abomination: George W. Bush knowingly lied to the American people in selling his case for a war that has directly led to the deaths of more than 4,000 Americans. They are deaths brought about by his lies, deceit and deception. It is an American atrocity of monumental proportion, followed closely by the heinous fact that no one has held him accountable. Where is the outrage?
Cy Bolton is a former news anchor and military affairs reporter. His coverage of defense-related issues and conflicts in the Balkans and the Middle East has appeared on NBC Nightly News, MSNBC, CNN and affiliates across the country.
Copyright 2008 Los Angeles Times
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69 Comments so far
Show AllIn a word, easily.
But... but... War is HOLY (it's endorsed in Dubya's fav'rit book); Sex is E-V-I-L
Thanks for that Mike,
I might take a look sometime, -but preferably not right after breakfast. Images of the WPE (Worst Prez Ever) leave me with a feeling of *mourning sickness* -(sic) !
~ Mourning that an otherwise promising nation could ever be so suckered.
Human beings learn by making mistakes, but to make *that* particular mistake, -twice over, thus allowing the demented rodent into office, well... It kinda beggars belief!
Ho hum.
~ Keep on truckin' Mr Mike.
xx
By the way UCD and Plantman, there is a great old cover picture on the Rolling Stone Magazine of Bush wearing a dunce-cap, sitting in the corner, in the issue that called Bush the worst president ever!
Cy, you actually escaped rather unscathed here. If you want to see how ugly it can get here when CD commentors give an author a bad review, check out this article by Robert Reich and the comments that followed -
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/06/25/9866/
Enjoyed your visit here Cy, come back anytime!
@ plantman13 :::
You feel like a friend of mine!
~Well spoke Sir!
xx
_________
Ps:
And no, --I appreciate your humility, but opine that it is not *you* who ought be wearing the 'Dunce's cap'.
If the cap fits...
...then let our crazed leaders besport the true sign of their status in this world.
~
Thank you, Cy Bolton. Sometimes the truth must be repeated over and over before it begins to sink in. I am one of those lefties who made smug predictions in 2002 that have all come to pass.
But I can take no joy in that fact. As I said at the time, I prayed to be wrong, because to be right was horrific. George Bush has one solution to any given problem...KILL MORE PEOPLE. Whether the problem has been energy, Saddam Hussein, mortgage madness, veterans facilities, enemy incarceration, Iran, etc. etc. etc. the solution ALWAYS includes death. How can we take comfort in being right about this sad state of our nation? I'd rather wear a dunce hat all day long and endure being spat upon by a derisive crowd then be right about this. As for George...a smart guy once said you will know a tree by the fruit it bears. Good trees bear good fruit, bad trees...bad fruit. So far not one piece of good fruit has fallen from George's tree.
@ Cy Bolton: I think I hear where you are coming from, and appreciate that effort.
Our friend Kookookoobirdz opines (at 11:49pm) that, "Articles like this are a waste of electrons..." but I'm afraid I don't agree with that outlook, (but I won't ever attack the author, or his right to express such views!)
The reason I think ALL efforts to reveal the true malignancy of current government(s) is useful, is that our main task (as progressives / radicals / world-changers) could be summed up by saying that our primary task is to help change the *consciousness* of our fellow beings, -- helping very entrenched and wholly brainwashed folk to 'see a little light' if we are able.
If my premise is correct, then articles such as Cy Bolton's do have their place in the world, --and even on C-D? The reason I believe this, is that yes, ~ most of us reading here at C-D are 'old hands' at this game, and knew well before any Bush got elected that it was going to be a disaster...
But then: What about the newbies? What about those who are new to C-D? What about (even!) the spooks who are tasked to trawl C-D to monitor who is fomenting a bit too much 'revolutionary fervour' and needs to be spied upon?
If our motivation to write things is to help bring about changes in consciousness, then just imagine if any government employees / right-wingers reading here were to suddenly have a 'Road to Damascus moment' and suddenly 'see the light' !! :) ~ What a great thing that could be!
-- It's one thing one if we Lefties are saying something 'radical' (-we can easily be dismissed!) but if such 'challenging' ideas are being voiced by a rightwing 'insider' to another of his / her ilk, ,,, well,,, they are likely to have a much greater impact on their audience?
So in this vein, I believe Cy Bolton's efforts were useful, more esp as (-as he states) his piece was originally written for the MSN audience. ~ Now that IS a useful place to air such views!
One trap which some folk too easily fall into, is the negative 'carping' mode, wherein: in place of useful, constructive criticism of ideas they don't agree with, they just vehemently denigrate other authors. What does that achieve? Does it help, or maybe *hinder* our movement?
I feel it's a shame when this occurs, as it doesn't help UNITY amongst us on the Left, and *unity is a very powerful force* in our efforts to revamp the world into becoming a safer, more wholesome place to live…
To paraphrase: "Together we succeed, divided we fall."
So on that basis, I enjoy it when co-workers on the Left strive to have a bit more unity in their ranks, -- and reserve their best invective for the rightwing-nuts in power, -- those who most deserve it!
Whaddayasay? ~ Can anyone here agree with that outlook? Feel free to disagree! :)
xx
From a friendly co-worker,
U-C-D
All Presidents lie some time or other, but Bush wouldn't know how to speak the truth about anything if his life depended upon it. He has the gall to speak to his Americans with continuous lies and expects all to heed his words. Of all Presidents,however, he is the worst liar, and I wonder if he realizes just how much the world believes he is the worst President we have ever elected? Or does he live in his own Wonderland surrounded by right wing nuts who continue to lie for him as well.
The problem with this and all the other articles enumerating the administration's history of lies is that the authors are still playing a game that the Bush crowd moved past a long time ago. It used to be that when you busted someone lying, a switch flipped, and they couldn't lie anymore. They'd hang their head and skulk off.
These guys started something new - they would get busted, everybody knew it, they knew everybody knew it, and yet they just kept going with the same lies. Nobody knew how to deal with that, because it's always been an unspoken rule that you stop once busted. Nobody ever questioned that rule. But this administration did. They realized they just didn't have to stop. People would just scratch their heads and keep trying to prove that a lie had happened. They were totally bewildered as to how these people were able to sthand there and continue to lie. Meanwhile, behind the curtain, they were laughing their heads off at the efficacy of their innovation in the lying arts.
Articles like this are a waste of electrons. The entire world, including the bush squad, knows they have been lying the whole time. The difference is that we keep parroting that fact over and over as though they care that anyone knows they are lying. We keep trying to write better and better "they lied" articles as though if we make one good enough, it will finally nail them and they'll stop and be held accountable and make one of those "mistakes were made" speeches. We might as well write articles proving that water is wet. They'll have just as much effect. It's time to stop pursuing this course. We have to try something else. And we need to adjust the way the press operates going forward so that its oversight is not nullified by the new lying technique.
I also think the press corps should stop phrasing things as questions. I think the Bush team is thrilled to be asked questions - it gives them a new chance each time to put out the stories they have manufactured. I think reporters ought to just start making accusations, with law enforcement right behind them to make arrests. No more benefit of the doubt for people like this who have so clearly been lying, cheating, stealing, maiming, and murdering for so long. Let's dispense with this fiction that they are just advancing a different ideology.
Thank you, Cy Bolton. Of course this should be old news to every American but that is not the case. Some people refuse to read anything negative about the President and some people only read celebrity news. What I find the most disturbing about the last 15 years, is that we no longer have a veneer of propriety. The government no longer needs to be careful or covert, we just take it all in stride--Halliburton's no bid contracts, Exxon Mobil buying off scientists, a multitude of lies about Iraq and Iran. We don't care. Bush got a second term even after all of this evidence was revealed. Incredible.
Stating the obvious is a necessity given our spiral to fascism.
if you are lucky there wont be an american 2012
#
Maplefudge June 27th, 2008 6:02 pm
Wait a minute… What was that about pot heads?
They are mellow yellow and happier than all of those mean & nasty posters in the blog world. The mean people are just nasty.
AND grandpa mcsame is not going to be president, Obama is. Ann Coulter will never host a MSM tv talk show. If you are going to fantasize, pick a hopeful one!!
cyb, I thought the article was very informative. Yes, most people should already have this information, but we know that they don't. Any time we have a chance to enlighten the public we should take advantage of it.
Here is a link to a living interactive archive at Mother Jones Magazine called "Lie by Lie". It's a great resource for anyone who wants to be informed -
http://www.motherjones.com/bush_war_timeline/index.html
I wrote the article above. I did not submit it to commondreams. It was written in response to an editorial that appeared in the LA Times June 16, 2008 by James Kirchick, entitled "Bush never lied to us about Iraq."
http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/opinion/la-oe-kirchick16-2008ju...
After reading his editorial, replete with it's demonstratively illogical, specious and outright fallacious premise and supporting documentation, I was angered; less by the intellectually-challenged Kirchick, more by the Times (the demise of which has been hastened by it's sale to the Tribune Cos.) and their journalistic irresponsibility in printing it.
Having spent a considerable amount of time working in MSM, there's a credo one can't forget: know your audience. My response was for a specific audience and the tact I used was intended only to be a simple, effective way to refute Kirchick's premise by using some well-known speeches and documents to concisely illustrate how Bush did lie. In accomplishing this so easily, my hope was to first prompt Times readers to question the paper's decision to run Kirchick's op/ed. (If you should bother to read some of the email responses to my piece, you will see that I touched this very nerve. In fact, many from the anti-war, anti-Bush camp seem incredulous at the easy accessibility of this most simple, basic proof of the administration's lies and deception.)
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oew-bolton27-2008jun27,0,3186043....
I never even remotely suggested that the material in my response was a "scoop" fanman, and your ad hominem attack is totally unwarranted. I never suggested the material in my response was new, or hard to find. Yes, many of us have long known these facts and have followed the atrocity of the Bush administration in general and the war specifically, as both concurrently unfolded. So, perhaps this story wasn't intended for those of you like adroc, who categorically dismiss it as ho-hum old news then denigrate the writer for trying to educate others (read: consumers of MSM) less willing to seek and see the truth for what it is. And that was the second purpose in writing the response.
Trouble for the left always comes when we exhibit this very kind of smarmy, insulting, know-it-all-itis rather than using any means possible to open people's eyes; to encourage and assist them in seeking the truth (even when it requires some effort on our part and their's); to help tear down preconceived ideas—in this case specifically, of what a president and an administration (cabal) is capable of doing. We never should denigrate, dismiss or insult others if they are speaking or seeking truth. That is a tactic best left to others.
When people on the left engage in these marginalizing measures ("Oh, I knew all this back in '02. Aren't I something special and geez, where have you been, you loser.") they accomplish two things. They first puff themselves up and pat themselves on the back for being soooo flippin' "smart" (always in front of their peers). And they send the target of such comments who, (although not in this case but certainly in others) had finally mustered enough intellectual curiosity to venture outside MSM sources, scurrying back to hide under the covers, safe within the massive pack of sleepwalking, spoon-fed MSM consumers.
I took the time to create links that document everything asserted in the piece specifically so the intellectually-curious neophyte could see how easy it is to find answers to those little niggling, nagging questions that whisper in their ear; to demonstrate how, with just a little effort, you can find something that at least begins to resemble the truth. I ended it as I did with the hope that maybe one or two readers might put themselves in the position of Cindy Sheehan and others; parents, spouses, families who lost someone to a war instigated by the lies, deceit and deception of a president for whom justice will have to be served later because impeachment is not politically expedient for politicians on both sides of the aisle.
If we all agree that truth on any issue is the ultimate quest and we all agree that whatever that truth may be, it's revelation is a good thing, then it is incumbent upon one to help others find it. But to preach only to the choir and to not try to assist others makes one as guilty as those who try to hide the truth in the shadows.
(By the way, the piece was supposed to run 700 words. They gave me 1100 and still botched the edit. For example, I stated that we spent nearly seven years and more than $60 million and we did impeach the President. And my draft included a reference to the more than 100,000 Iraqi dead.)
Progressives have sold themselves CHEAP!! If we were outraged enough to donate $10 to Nader, Obama might even throw us a bone to keep us happy. Right now he takes us for granted. Who else can we vote for? We all KNOW Ralph has no chance, but I don't wish to be part of the Landslide and then the Letdown. Run Ralph RUN
How does President Bush Lie?
WIth Imunity provided by the Democratic Party, and with wedge issues planted consistently by magazines like the Nation to guarantee that an opposition is continuously divided and voiceless.
Without democrats and controlled dissent publications like The Nation, Bush itself would be impossible.
Very good, anwong. You nailed it there. Some of us have been massively outraged, largely because we remember the lies of the Vietnam war era and have seen them played out with transcendent cynicism by Bush-Cheney, largely to a clueless public, happy to know no history and aching for victory, even if it comes perched on a mountain of lies. We anti-war folks are the minority, as both Obama and Hillary proved in the primaries. They can't some across as truly anti-war and expect to be elected. Of course, there's no hypocrisy there either, because they decidedly are NOT anti-war.
Crush this corrupt system or prepare to be crushed by it.
Like a rug - with as much intelligence.
MikeBinSC, you're right. Thank you for your post. It's about time the Democrats stick together like Republicans do. Yes, I would have preferred a true progressive like Mr. Kucinich, or Edwards or Nader, but that's a lost cause. No wasted write-ins for me. I'll vote for Obama. It needs to be a landslide so the criminal GOP can't get away with a rigged election again.
"Where is the outrage?"
There is no outrage about the lies as such since the souring of the American public about the war has been about its failure to produce victory and about the fact that it has gone badly. The American public's opposition to the war has never been based upon a principled response to its fundamental corruption and criminal nature.
Americans don't like to be losers, they like to be winners, and that is what it has been all about. If American forces had succeeded as the administration had intended, Bush and the neocons would have been national heroes even if hundreds of thousands had been killed in blatant unjust war of criminal aggression. Americans would be "winners," and everyone would be happy, flags would wave, and parades of "heroes" for the "homeland" would march down Main Street USA.
If the administration or the next can find a way to leave their crimes in Iraq and convince the American public it was somehow a "victory," no one is going to care. As Adolph Hitler cynically but correctly observed, "The victor will never be asked if he told the truth."
All this has been known for six years, by those of us who didn't count then and still don't. Big news: Bush has been lying from the beginning to get his war. Who'd have ever thunk it? Such endlessly recycled stuff as this wouldn't be necessary if we had a Congress, instead of a bunch of puffed up, coiffed white-haired crime abettors posing as checkers and balancers to this scofflaw regime.
We are forced to keep reading these exact same accounts ad infinitum, it would seem, because we lack ANY power to force this complicit Congress to ACT. Impeachment? Off the table, intones her royal majesty Pelosi, in 2006 just before the elections that delivered a majority of dimwit Dumbocrats who would prove to rubber stamp everything the Bush thugs demand to continue their illegal war as long as their black little hearts desire.
"Where is the outrage?" cries Cy Bolton. Uh, last I looked it's been nonstop on internet blogs for 6 fucking years. Also in the streets in the run-up to the inevitable war, made inevitable by lies the MSM swallowed ravenously, and it still hasn't had its fill. This makes about the thousandth article like this I've read, and there are countless ones I missed, that conclude "Where is the outrage?" If it's not in Congress or on network news, it doesn't officially exist. Common Dreamers and numerous other web bloggers don't constitute any voice in the matter. Neither do millions marching in the streets of DC, New York, dozens of other cities in the US and around the world. MILLIONS, with no voice in the matter.
Finally those millions just gave up, because neither the politicians nor the MSM was listening or giving a flying fuck what they thought or said. There's been and remains outrage aplenty, Cy, just not the kind that moves anything.
Also, Bolton notes at the end how Bush's persistent lies have got over 4,000 US servicemen killed in Iraq, but not a word about the 1.2 million (give or take a hundred thousand or so) Iraqi dead, and the 4.5 million Iraqi refugees. Not to even mention their destroyed country. So again we're left with the impression that those more than 1 million Iraqis would probably have died anyway, even if we weren't there murdering them by the trainload daily. Maybe it's too early to tell if they were really people, just as it's too early to tell if torture is legal or not. Maybe Bush's lies and Cheney's commitment to pure evil are GOOD things in long run. We won't know for at least a hundred years!
While I'll never deny someone's right to moments of "outrage", I'm with adroc and focusing on the opinion that this is a "groundbreaking piece of journalism."
Why? Because this is a wonderful articulation of The People's argument(Voice). It is the product of not just one individual, a keyboard and today's news, but culminates from Harriet Tubman crawling on her belly along the Eastern Seaboard to Freedom, the hand to hand battle for an "8 hour work day" and "the weekend" - this carved out space for human cognition now combines with Internet age technology to bring humanity to the point of being able to confront it's schizoid behavior.
Yes, behavior totally characterizing George W. Bush as his administration spoke of the false desires of Saddam Hussein to attack the U.S. in public, while contemplating methods to provoke such and attack behind closed doors, but behavior characterizing the United States since before the signing of the UN Charter in the 1940's - in public stating "peace and goodwill", while behind closed doors State Department memos said "control the Mideast oil fields...whatever the means".
It is arguments being processed (for the first time in the history of humanity!) such as this presented by Cy Bolton that can fill the abyss separating humanity from a greater dignity, pleasure and prosperity. However, I say not if it is argued with outrage, but if it is presented with composure and compassion and an unswerving diligence honed by outrage.
Why? Because as our Constitution recognizes in detailing impeachment - "all humans are fallible". And for "this argument" to prevail it has to be presented in the home, workplace and government agencies where the bluster of fascist boasting reside.
Cy Bolton presents a wonderful human creation. Even if it doesn't procure impeachment of Bush/Cheney, let's continue to process it, let's continue to unfold the greater glory of human existence and experience; with composure, compassion and diligence.
Bush can get away with it because he's in the company of liars--the US Congress.
"Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa."
I thought a strange look came across the face of the lying idiot king when he said the above, but that would be unusual because he lies incessantly. And his speech writers put in the phrase "uranium from Africa," for a very good reason. Could you imagine him, reading from the teleprompter, and mangling the word "Niger?"
U-C-D, thanks for the link - good article.
Oh... and...
on the subject of just *why* GW Satan and other corrupt leaders lied to us, -(and are still lying to us now) here's a really good article from the UK Guardian newspaper (-maybe CD staff might feature it separately?) :::
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/jun/26/usforeignpolicy.usna...
And, -though it often hurts, - **keep smiling m'dears!** :)
If we let the b*st*rds grind us down into abject misery, we become inoperative and less effective. A wholly dire, cynical, and pessimistic refrain is less attractive than us 'singing songs' of hope and uplift, -that way we keep our *own* spirits up, and we get more done,
...AND... more people will then listen to us, and maybe we'll be more successful in all of the things we are trying to achieve? - like enabling humanity to *live in peace and harmony* on this planet, and not decimate Nature's other kingdoms with our infantile war-mongering and our rapacious greed for often quite superfluous material objects.
(Well, that's my take on things anyway!) ;)
xx
U-C-D
Best reply to the query that starts the title of this essay?
willybilly!!! "How Does Bush Lie" (apologies…I cannot use the President word)…Answer:..When he moves his lips!!
No apologies necessary.
Ubrew12, I also wrote some similar musings back in the day when we saw Bush for the war-mongering psychopath, taking the country to war on a pack of lies, that he has since proved himself to be. I sent it to Air America, a start-up liberal/progressive radio network that I could only listen to on the internet. I also sent it to all my friends and family in my email address book. One day I'll find a copy of it and post it here on CD.
Lillulu, Lobo72, Opeluboy, and others -
Methinks Kem Patrick has gone over the edge! Too bad, so sad. Kem should take a few weeks off from posting comments and do some serious introspection. His support of Hillary over Obama was, shall we say, a bit overly vigorous given the difference between them on the issues.
You know, there were many Obama supporters here on CD, as well as Clinton supporters. Many of those Hillary supporters, like Kem Patrick, are venting their frustration of Clinton's loss on Obama's stand on the FISA bill. But do they think Hillary's stand on the FISA bill would have been different than Obama's had she been the nominee?
I was a Kucinich, then Edwards, then Obama supporter. The time to get a real progressive candidate elected is past. You fight the good fight in the primaries and get the best you can. Trying to get Kucinich the nomination in the Dem Party, is even less realistic than getting Ron Paul the nomination in the Rep Party.
Writing in Kucinich on the Ballot, or voting for Nader, is an exercise in futility without real fifty-state party organization and some kind of media presense. You would be better off writing in "George Carlin" on the ballot, as his candidacy is more viable.
When you are in a fight for your life, as we certainly are now, WINNING IS EVERYTHING! Let's get it done.
Fanman, I too, stopped reading. This article is old, old, old, news. But it takes some people longer to see through BS and propaganda.
This article reminded me of something I wrote in 2003, after the war had started, but I was too timid to publish anywhere:
"The physicist Freeman Dyson once wrote, 'In war, how you fight is eventually more important than why'. The conduct of our military, its patience in battle and the lengths it goes to avoid civilian casualties, all measure up to one of our greatest foreign policy attributes. We can be proud of our soldiers. But there was another war, fought to convince people that the Iraq war was necessary. As the Downing Street memo proves, the Bush administration fought that war without honor. It began with secret meetings to spin the prelude to war so that it would appear regrettably inevitable. In a frontal assault White House lawyers argued that the 1991 Gulf War resolution was still active, so the president could order a new war without congressional approval. This assault was rebuffed, so a flanking action was begun with trumped-up evidence about Iraq's nuke program. In war, timing is everything, so they forced a hasty war resolution out of Congress just before an election. Congressmen who voted against it were called traitors and cowards and turned out of office, including one who'd lost three limbs in Vietnam. They battled European war doubts with 'old Europe' insults. When Canada and Mexico expressed doubts about the war, the response was 'doubts' about government purchases from Canada and Mexico. They moved 200,000 soldiers to the borders of Iraq, and THEN asked the U.N. Security Council whether it thought they should be deployed. Under those conditions, the council vote against war was a vote of independence. The response is named Bolton. This war's greatest casualty was our own intelligence community, which was placed under extreme duress to make the case for war, and then decapitated when that evidence proved faulty. But once we kicked the weapons inspectors out of Iraq, how intelligent did we expect our WMD intelligence to be? And if you have to pause an invasion to search for weapons of mass destruction long enough to let out the WEAPONS INSPECTORS, maybe the invasion itself is unnecessary! Americans seem surprised to find how radically our global image has changed with the Iraq War. But it is not that war that bothers the rest of the world. The Iraq War itself may still turn into a good thing. No, what bothers everyone, what won't let go, is the way that OTHER war was, and is still, being waged against democracy: with bullying, obfuscation, and faked intelligence. It is because our former allies realize that in this broader 'war' this administration has NO intention of fighting with honor, and that dishonors all of us.
Nothing in the story to comment on. This article might be of interest to some dullard readers of the LA Times who get all their information from corporate media hash, but why republish it on Common Dreams? Only the random trolling provocateur or misdirected porn-hunter looking for a "wet dreams" site would find anything new in this story.
How do Bush and his cronies lie? Every which way possible and endlessly - - check our Vincent Bugliosi's book, "The Prosecution Of George W. Bush For Murder"!
- a certain president gets some discouragement about his lying ways here - http://www.rudemacedon.ca/greenisland/ex/gw19.html
KEM, are you one of Hillary's bitter supporters that will vote for McCain? Hillary's no angel and has told a few lies herself, you know.
lobo72 - I feel the same way. The Hillary supporters that cared nothing about decency, fairness, rules or the truth have now become full time Obama-bashers and pseudo Nader supporters.
It's depressing to read the comments here anymore. And it's not that there are people who disapprove of Obama's actions. I do as well. But they offer nothing but negativity, hopelessness and a smarmy, cynical response to whatever is written. They offer nothing constructive, no solutions based in reality. Just teenage-like angst and petulence, all with a self-concscious look-at-me attitude that reveals their shallowness.
Pathetic, sad and useless.
Lets all simply stay active, in whichever way we are capable, and watch the folly crumble the once proud Amurrikan " dream"...(."Dream" as Geo. Carlin said, "because you gotta be asleep to believe it".)
Hey it was good havin' cheap gasoline and cheap automobiles and cheap everything and you didn't haveta work in the fields all day like my mom did in 1919...before we really figured how to let the Amurrikans be the world's chosen few, where even the unemployed (!) could "go to the poorhouse in a Ford", as Will Rogers famously said.
No, its a shame us gringos don't get to keep on keepin on bein' the world"s biggest crybabies, no one to blame but them damn "capitalists' always out to squeeze a few more dollars outa our hides...But you see the real problem is that we left the land, we quit any form of self-sustenance, we don't control our procurement of food or fuel or any guarantees at all now. We are are at the mercy of those corporations we love to hate. And the bureaucracy is just as confused and incompetent as we have allowed ourselves to become. Hey it looked like a good idea at the time...."civilization" that is.
You want a solution to the madness enveloping us all? Get out of the city and learn to farm without hydrocarbons. I did it for 20 years, its no big deal. You'll be carbon neutral, pay the bastards no taxes, be healthy and show the eventual survivors the way.
( Nice post above, Coyotita )
Article reads: "These statements were designed to cultivate in Americans fear of Iraq's imminent threat..." (and etc)
Take heart folks:
There will come a day when 'Joe & Jolene Average-American' will awake from their deep *sleep of ages* ~ and a new and very powerful force will then be released upon the lying, deceiving, cheating devils 'at the top'.
In that hour, the likes of us (the progressive and slightly more awake ones) will be trying hard to refrain from saying "I told you so" as these newly-awakened folk take to the streets, take up the reins of change, and eradicate Satan's playmates once and for all.
There's a lot more of them than there are of us, so their movement won't be lacking numbers.
Well, that's one possible outlook, (- and a less cynical viewpoint for dear fellow readers here!)
:p
I don't think this scenario is an altogether inconceivable outcome, ~ methinks it might very well happen yet :::: How hard do you have to shake people before they finally wake up? They are certainly being shaken at present, and with more shocks to come, by all accounts.
___________________
Our role in all of this is to keep on plugging away, and doing and saying all in our power to counter the daily Murdochian effluent, and to gently educate those who are 'fast asleep at the back of class', - assisting them *to do as each of us once did* !!!
(ie) ::: **To wake from the slumbers of indoctrination, to shake off the state-proffered illusions, and begin to really see the world anew.**
Want an example of such a turnaround?
Well, once upon a time there was a bright (fairly average) American woman who was led to believe that her son was maybe doing the right thing in joining the army. So he went off to fight some supposed 'enemy', but very soon got killed in a phoney, utterly futile and immoral war.
His mom was devastated, - her son's death turned her whole life (and way of thinking ) around. Now she is one of the most impassioned (and awake, aware !) high-profile antiwar activists in the USA. She has now come to realise that our greatest enemies are the many liars, cheats, crooks, bigots and despots in power.
That mother's name is Cindy Sheehan. She writes here occasionally, -- when she's not doing 100 +1 other things to help bring sanity to a wretchedly duped America...
(And as ever, I send her my sincere love and respect.)
xx
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[edit]
-and 'Hi' to sister Siouxrose -I just saw your note as I posted this.
U-C-D x
RICH M: You raise the point I would have... it's amazing the jingoism implicit in stating only one "side" of the big score card!
I'd just be happy to a list of Obama's lies. As far as I can tell he hasn't had any issues with interns, he hasn't lied us into war. He hasn't claimed to be a successful businessman who will run the country like a successful business. But I'm sure he's lied about something. He's not Jesus after all. If he was, his mother would still be a virgin.
Maybe he's a secret Muslim like Steve says...
The many different groups at which we are outraged spin around as if on a wheel of misfortune. Some days its Bush & Co., other days the pointer stops at the MS Media., and this week it is pointing directly at the spineless Congress.
Where's our sense of outrage you ask? Our national outrage, wet with tears for those who have died in war, by those who are homeless because of Katrina, or by the mortgage subloan crisis, who work several jobs just to survive, or who are just crying out for justice over greed and graft and selfishness among our government leaders, is accumulating like mud atop a very high mountain. Already, tremors are being felt in an increasing number of states across this country. Come November, watch out, the members of those groups who chose, (let's say it again: chose) to build their houses on such blatently weak foundations, will be washed up by the landslide in November.
Amen!
"The Bush Public Statements on Iraq"March 2004), "Report on the US Intelligence Community's Prewar Intelligence Assessments on Iraq" (Senate Intelligence Committee (July 2004), The Senate Select Committee report from June, 2008 is all the information needed to impeach Bush, Cheney and a couple dozen others for a war of aggression and aiding and abetting that war. Senator Bond of Missouri tried to offer up 170 amendments to the most recent report that would have made it useless. The report stated that the Bush Administration made statements about Iraq that they knew were not true. many people don't want to acknowledge how involved the neo-con Zionists were in helping created the lies. Paul Wolfowitz and William Luti brought in other like minded acomplices to assist them in the creation of the lies and they were fed directly to Cheney and the White House. Some of the names were Larry Franklin (doing 12 years hard time in the federal pen for giving government secrets to Israel), Douglas Feith, Abram Shulsky,Michael Rubin, Elliot Abrams, Morris Amitay, Michael Ledeen, Kenneth Adelman, David Shenker. The present set of reasons for the proposed attack against Iran is being led by the American Israeli Public Affairs Committer (AIPAC) which is a lobbying and propaganda arm for the Likud party of Israel. We will be charged with being anti-semitic, but remember there are Israelis who call these people rabid Zionists. There is a reason that the Likud party isn't in power. The Israelis don't trust them and their saber rattling.
Wait a minute... What was that about pot heads?
~ SAMSKI ~
The fear that you feel for Mordechai, is nothing but a spark of recognition of what you might see in the mirror when you're totally honest.
I accept the fact that I am killing millions in the "name of freedom", even though it also is disgusting and wicked beyond words, to my own sense of morality -- these deeds are done with implicit "control" of the US COngress, whose supposed to be under popular control, through a Prez elected by popular expression.
If there is much emotional reaction to something, that's a great clue that it has more to do with oneself, than most people of ever aware of.
Namaste
Mordechai is right.
I wonder when Ann Coulter will officially be named host on "Meet the Press." I'd imagine it will be the 3rd year of Obama's presidency, just as the Mighty Wurlitzer goes into high gear with the idea that the coming Depression was caused by Obama & the liberal Democrats. They'll be selling that idea, & the American public will be buying it. Angry Americans will be howling for blood. It won't be pretty.
Jeb Bush will run on the slogan, "Who lost America?" The GOP campaign will be a thing of awesome & dark brilliance, honed to perfection by sorcerers of public relations, in conference rooms at AEI. Bush will win 49 states.
Kem Patrick and Mordechai:
Your non-stop cynicism runs like on old scratchy LP skipping over and over again. I'm thinking many of us glance and skip your posts by now. I'm beginning to. You're both such downers...
Even in this generally right-minded piece, only "the deaths of more than 4,000 Americans" are cited in the concluding paragraph.
But the article fails to mention the number of Iraqi deaths, and indeed, fails to mention any aspect whatsoever of the complete shattering of Iraqi society brought about by Bush's lying.
Even when it gets brave enough to acknowledge that Bush lied -- which is unusually advanced, relative to most US media -- the American MSM still pays homage to the disgusting nationalist notion that American deaths count, while Iraqi deaths don't.
gnerallee sez:
Fanman, I stopped reading after the first paragraph
*******************
What concentration you have--I stopped reading after the headline.
Mordechai frightens me.
Our "born again" Christian(?) prez used religion & fear to manipulate the masses. Too bad no one really paid attention to Christ's words in The Sermon On The Mount. OH! Wait a moment!!!! Those words do not count in today's world....like for instance... when we needed to invade a country to "kick butt!!!" Bush lied, America knew it and didn't care. It was (according to millions of evangelical Christians) the right thing to do and on some levels they made it a religious war. At first this administration blamed the lies on "mistakes" or "mis-information"...."it was the speech writers fault". However, after this administration figured out most Americans wouldn't make a fuss about the lies.....there were no more excuses given. Now, we are waiting for Bush (the puppet)& Cheney (the puppet master)to leave office. Make a fuss about the lies? I don't see it happening, nor does this administration!
"How Does President Bush Lie?" -- Effortlessly.
Kem Patrick, who in your world is not a liar?
Fanman, I stopped reading after the first paragraph.
George Wanker Bush is once again making noise about his brother, Jeb Rancid Bush, becoming president. In the year 2012 the American public is going to be as angry as the Old Testament God in a steroid rage because the United States will probably be in even worse condition than it is now. If McCain is president he will be nearly 76 years old and probably call it quits, figuring that another 4 years of low popularity numbers and the never-ending criticism of him that easily gets under his microscopically thin skin aren't worth it (even if his multi millionaire trophy wife wants to go on and on being the reincarnation of Nancy Reagan). If Obama is the president and the nation is as it is now, or even worse, his act will have completely worn out. So much for change you can believe in. In steps The Great White Hope, Jeb Rancid Bush, touted by the Republican party and the MSM as the next savior of the USA. Anne Coulter will have him on every week at Meet The Press. You say to yourself now that no one, not even the most half-assed of the half-assed American people, will ever again vote for a Wanker or a Rancid. You are so wrong. Bush 2012. And that's no lie.
Let me count the ways.
Poor old George is such a terrible liar.
Both in quantity and quality.
How does bush lie? All day, every day. If he's speaking, it's not true. Follow that rule, you won't be deceived.
Where is the outrage?
It's been sublimated into consumerism.
You will find it at the mall.
Thank you Mr. Cy Bolton for this groundbreaking piece of journalism.
Its not lying, its misinformation.
Potheads aren't known for a tendency toward direct action. They don't feel the outrage, after all. You want the masses to rise up, first you have to take away their opiates.
There is no outrage because the media is not outraged. Americans always follow the agenda of their media. American journalists feed the media their pablum and Americans suck it up like pussy cats. When outrage is needed we'll be told by the media.
Bush's lies won't be dealt with by our Congress as they are all part of the same political game when it comes to holding onto their seats in the Uncle Buck Party. George Carlin said Americans were owned by the corporations, and that included our politicians.
Hoa binh
WOW!
Mr Bolton, you have courageously rewritten the rewrites of rewrites of the rewrites. Very impressive regurgitation indeed.
Does this fool think he has a SCOOP here?
If you only read www.wsws.org in 2002 you would have known nearly everything he breathlessly scoops here SIX years later. WTF
He lies the same way Obama does, only Obama lies a lot better, he's intelligent.
Incidentally, to answer the articles question, "How Does Bush Lie" (apologies...I cannot use the President word)...Answer:..When he moves his lips!!
I think the fault lies in thinking Bush really had much to do with any of this. He's the playboy/cowboy set up to be the frontman. Clinton's impeachment was part of the neocon plan. They knew impeachable offensives were going to be committed by Bush after he was elected. So they in effect took impeachment out of the equation by impeaching Clinton.
And once you do that, anything goes. Subpeonas, investigations, contempt charges, who cares. They just don't show up. Combine that with the Bible and the Flag, and they have an almost unbeatable plan. We'll know in November if it's truly unbeatable.
The only time I would ever believe G.W. would be if he told me he was lying.
Let us hope that Bugliosi remains intact and can being his case to court..As he has said, there is no statute of limitation on murder. The shrub and his cohorts lied us into two illegal wars. They all must be tried and prosecuted for the murder of over 4000 American troopS and MILLIONS of Iraqi and Afghan men, women, children and infants. AND in the process, may the TRUTH OF 9/11 BE REVEALED!