Anti-War Activists Attack Democrats over Iraq Bill
WASHINGTON — For anti-war activists, turning against House Majority Leader Steny H. Hoyer was only the beginning.
The liberal group MoveOn.org ran radio ads this week chastising the Southern Maryland Democrat for voting against a measure that would have forced a withdrawal from Iraq within 180 days.
But that attack ad was nothing compared with the vitriol unleashed yesterday, as war opponents lit into the rest of the Democratic leadership for agreeing to drop a withdrawal timeline from the Iraq spending bill.
“An abandonment of our troops and a silence of the will of the American people,” said Win Without War Director Tom Andrews.
“It is remarkable that they can’t stand up to President Bush,” said Susan Shaer, director of Women’s Action for New Directions.
Six months ago, MoveOn cheered the Democratic takeover of Congress. Leaders of the group, which claims 3.2 million members, expressed cautious support for the new majority’s plan to start forcing an end to the war by attaching conditions to spending.
But after learning about the latest version of the bill, after Bush vetoed one that had timelines, the group began threatening to recruit challengers to Democrats who support it.
“Voters elected Democrats in November to lead the way out of the mess in Iraq,” said Eli Pariser, MoveOn’s political action director.
He said his members want the group “to consider all options” for Democrats “who ran on ending the war but vote for more chaos and more troops.”
The reaction, swift and angry, makes clear the pressure confronting congressional Democrats, who find themselves caught between anti-war activists and an unyielding commander in chief.
Bush has vowed another veto if Congress ties funding to deadlines for withdrawal. Democrats lack the votes to override that action, and party leaders fear the political consequences of voting to cut off funds altogether.
Democratic leaders have tried to cast the deal negotiated with the White House as a step toward ending the war. For the first time, they say, Congress would establish benchmarks for Iraq’s government and require Bush to report on progress.
“We have put an end to blank checks for war and an end to the president’s policy of more troops, more money, more time and more of the same,” said Rep. Rahm Emanuel, chairman of the House Democratic Caucus. “We have begun the process of implementing new policies, of bringing accountability to this war, and of forging a new direction in Iraq.”
Zach Messitte, director of the Center for the Study of Democracy at St. Mary’s College of Maryland, said Democrats might not have much to fear from angry liberals, at least for now.
“It’s a year-plus until primary time, which is a long time away,” he said. “People understand the nuances enough to know that there are certain political compromises that need and have to be made in order to gather together the broadest consensus.”
But divisions over the issue are deep, and widening, even among Democratic leaders. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has indicated that she will vote against funding without timelines. Wisconsin Sen. Russ Feingold said he could not support a bill “that contains nothing more than toothless benchmarks.”
With other Democrats likely to follow suit, party vote-counters were left to rely on Republican support to help pass the funding.
Anti-war groups are urging Congress to reject the bill, which the House is to take up today.
“This is a key test vote on whether your representative is serious about ending the war,” MoveOn activist Nita Chaudhary wrote.
Such language is a departure for MoveOn, which had shown moderation in its willingness to work with Democrats on drawing down U.S. involvement. Other groups have taken a harder line, pushing against any further war spending beyond what would be necessary to bring troops home.
MoveOn leaders had said they were looking forward to supporting Hoyer as he worked toward ending U.S. involvement in Iraq.
“He’s shown he can be a great anti-war leader for the Democrats,” Tom Matzzie, Washington director for the group, said in February. “The next six months is going to be a real trial for Democrats. Hoyer’s skills inside the House will be a big asset.”
Barely halfway into those six months, MoveOn began beaming its anti-Hoyer message into his district, blasting his vote against starting a pullout.
“We were so proud when he was made majority leader of the House of Representatives,” an announcer intones. “But that pride has turned to disappointment. Because last week, Steny Hoyer was one of just a few Democrats to vote against the McGovern bill - a real plan for withdrawing from Iraq.”
Hoyer’s office says he understands “the passion” that many feel about the war.
In a statement, Hoyer said he was “deeply disappointed that the president continues to defy the will of the American people on Iraq, but … I do believe that Democrats this week imposed a level of accountability where formerly there was none, and we will continue our efforts.”
Copyright © 2007, The Baltimore Sun
With all due respect to the efforts of MoveOn, we’ve been fighting neocon/hawk Democrats for 40 years now. They exist as a party because a substantial percentage of the public expects a different policy out of them, the few progressives in their ranks, at this point, only legitimize the same ‘ol from the remainder by casting a shed of hope (which is not forthcoming) on them.
There appears to be no substantive difference in foreign policy between the two corporate parties, no interest in IRV, cleaning up the ballots, etc. Are we going to bang our heads for another 40 years?
The votes were not there.
If you want to change things, work your tail off the next couple of years to elect better leaders. We have the power to do this. The internet is a new tool we are learning to use in these efforts.
Monopoly media gives us monopoly leaders, but things are changing.
“The votes were not there.”
So then bring up the bill EVERY DAY and filibuster EVERY DAY until the votes ARE THERE. You have to fight for what you want not run away with your tail between your legs.
This proves that although we like to think that there is a difference between democrats and republicans, they both are still politicians. I now have no sympathy for the democrats in Congress.
It is time to begin recalling politicians from office. Negotiations are over! Start the recall process, now!
I disagree with Zach Messitte. I think that we have been more than patient with our leaders, and that our patience is beginning to wear thin.
I called both of my senators and my representative today, encouraging them to vote no on the latest funding bill. I don’t expect them to listen to me…but I will be monitoring their votes and I will not forget.
We need candidates who listen to their constituents. If the parties are so powerful that they think they can ignore their base, then it is time for a third party.
Too bad there is no federal recall. It would be nice if we could bust the president, wouldn’t it? Welcome to the Undemocracy.
Alas, so the Democrats have joined the child killing baby butchers. I’ll never vote for a Democrat again. Of course I’ll never vote for a Republican either or speak to my Republican neighbors.
Oh it’s Impeachment that’s off the table said Vlad as he sharpened his stakes . . .
The cowardice of the Democratic party is disgraceful. Do they really think the American public is stupid enough to think cutting off funds will leave soldiers defenseless? No, it simply means they’ll *have* to come home. So, go ahead and don’t approve a spending bill, and we’ll get what we want–an end to this embarrassing, deadly war.
At the very very least, do not approve *more* funds than Bush requested (which is what the current bill does). How stupid is that?!
As a more general issue, I’m sick of Democrats being so afraid of Republicans that they refuse to confront them on anything. The Republicans don’t share that fear, so they’ve been winning (until the country got so screwed up that we’d vote for anyone else). It’s time for Democrats to grow a spine.
Whats surprising is moveon.org is taking a stand to end the war !
I thought they moved on from such trivialities !!
The Dem majority are poised to make themselves permenantly irrelevent. If they cave on this issue then they are the Republican’s bitches forever.
They dont even need to put a bill forward. This is a supplimental for EXTRA money. JUST SAY NO TO WARMONGERING
Can’t vote for the War party, even if it means not voting against the other war party.
While we mere citizens are all caught up with Iraq funding, recent developments seem to indicate that Iran is back on the front burner. An attack by Iran is Bush’s get out of jail card–his entre into a “legitimate” war, one we could “win” by bombing the f..k out of these recalcitrant Muslims.
jon
Connecting the dots: from human behaviors to ecosystem decline
http://StudentsForTheEarth.org
Cheney knew.
“Monopoly media gives us monopoly leaders, but things are changing.”
Yes. They’re getting worse. I hate to say it, but Nader told us so.
Democrats dont want to appear to lose the war like little kids fighting on the playground–but if they keep it going and it ends under a democratic administration–then they will be blamed anyway.
Its much better for them to have it end now-before Bush leaves office–so they can blame Bush for the whole thing during his presidency.
The war will stick to Bush anyway–because he is a walking talking f*ck up. You would have to be a real moron to have thought this guy looked presidential.
Bush Watch.org had him pegged even before the 2000 election.
wsws.org
Impeachment is the only real option. Every day that Bush is in office he does more damage. With his veto and his “signing statements” legislation is moot. If we make enough noise and support the legislators who refuse to be intimidated, we might be able to put impeachment back on the table.
Here’s the rude comment I sent to Reid, Pelosi, my senators and congressman today (and I’m being polite):
Unbelievable! We sent you people to Washington to fight that little psychopath in the White House and end this disgusting war. And what do you do? Turn into spineless, gutless, worthless little turds. You won’t even stand up for the people out here in your own party. You just bend over and let Bush screw you and us and the country. To hell with you, to hell with the Democrats! You bunch of pissants.
Tell us what you really feel. IMPEACH, IMPEACH, IMPEACH.
Eventually progressives are going to have to begin the long and arduous task of building the alternative to the Tweedledee and Tweedledum if there is ever going to be a real change. It has been put off with the same excusses for 40 years and we are still at square one. Common USA the rest of the world is depending on you to put a stop to these bullies.
Look, moveon.org is not the voice of the peace movement. If they were, they would have been calling for Impeachment long ago. They would be giving organizations like Iraq Veterans Against the war, and Gold Star families for peace a national platform for their message. At the very least, they would be asking their members to spend money on grassroot relief of katrina survivors, Since the Government on both sides have failed America, groups like Moveon.org and it’s millions of members should stop talking about what’s best for the country and start doing something productive like volunteering on the Gulf Coast or giving $1. each to www.ivaw.org www.ivawdeployed.org www.gsfp.org to help them get the real message out.
There simply has to be more to this than meets the eye.
If not, the Dems just sold out what was left of We the People.
The DLC Democrats who are trying to say that this cave-in to Bush is some kind of “bringing accountability” (Rahm) are seriously thinking they can pull another Rovian “tell the big lie” propaganda charade.
The question is whether there are enough real Democrats ready to accept this dribble.
From my perspective on the West Coast, they’re not. At least, no one I know is. We’re mad. And we’re calling. And we’re waiting to see how our representatives vote. Because, this one IS the litmus test to tell if they will be supported in the future. And, I don’t WANT TO HEAR any weasly justifications.
Incumbent Democrats worry about re-election. All the time. And it doesn’t seem to matter even for those in the “safe” districts. So, WORRY!! One comment I heard yesterday is that Democratic leaders won’t wake up to the grassroots until there is a massive defection and news conference with Ralph Nader!!!
Democrats took the majority NOT through the dwindling number of Democratic votes last time around. They won because of the INDEPENDENTS who were abandoning the Republicans in droves. Now what will they do? Certainly, they will recall that the Democrats did not stand up to Bush and STOP THE WAR. And this is what the independents had hired them to do.
###
The Demicrans and Republicrats sold out long before this day arrived. By failing to actively pursue impeachment, this one party system has allowed the Bush administration to continue business as usual without any repercussions or criminal prosecution. Accountability begins with ourselves. The time for lesser evils is over. There can be no compromise of human rights, justice and the integrity of life support systems. Demanding anything less is our demise.
Wish I could say I was surprised…but I am most assuredly not. I ask each of you to have a sincere-with-thyself moment and ask, “Did I really think the Democrats would do anything regarding ‘the war’ beyond serving their plutocratic corporate task masters?”
If you’re realistic, semi-observant and honest with yourself then I think you know the answer. If not, then let me suggest an appropriately analogous exercise that may assist with your contextual incomprehension.
Hold out both of your hands, palms up. Pile your hopes in the first and shit in the second. Which one actually filled up first? Any more questions? *L*
Wake up!!
I guess that I am naive but I thought that the democrats would stop Bush. Now we see that Nader was right.
Absolutely disgusting. Working with the Democrats is like being asked to dig a trench with your hands tied behind your back. We desperately need to regroup and either clean out the Democratic party from top to bottom or, better, establish a well-organized third party coalition that will bust up this one-party monopoly once and for all.
I’ve been a registered Democrat all my life. No more. The Republicans are worthless, and the Democrats are worthlesser, if you know what I mean. The next election, we need to vote all of the bastards out. Whatever happened to “Balance of Powers?”
Democrats in the House and Senate simply are not an anti-war party. They talk in terms of troop withdrawal, benchmarks, phased redeployment of troops, and training Iraqi troops, but not about returning our troops home. The huge US Embassy in Baghdad will not be dismantled. The Dems, including almost everyone but Gravel and Kucinich, want the troops to remain in the Middle East to use against Iran or someone else when the opportunity arises. As David Rieff puts it, they are not against the next war (NYT Magazine, March 25, 2007).
Dennis Kucinich,
Please stop wasting your time trying to get the Democratic party inline. It won’t happen. Really relate to the “40 years” battle. Let’s stop busting our heads against a cement wall. Dennis, please form a new party - the Progressive Democratic Party.
Look at the big picture - we have %5 of the population and we are spending approximately %50 of total world military outlays. We have a tenuous foothold in Iraq, which may prove to have more oil reserves than Saudi Arabia. Peak oil (production decline) is coming soon (next 20 - 30 years) or is now here depending on who you talk to. Global warming is about to severely stress global civilization. The military-industrial complex runs the whole show (a Canadian friend recently referred to the US Government as a “front for business”. Our military adventures lately are the moral equivalent of Germany attacking Czechoslovakia (Hitler called that country a “dagger aimed right at the heart of Germany” .. some things never change). WE are the evil empire. So .. do you think this morally bankrupt, downright evil military-industrial complex is going to give up power voluntarily? No, they are going to lie, manipulate the media, fix elections, declare national emergencies, or create national emergencies (as is well documented in the past). If we ordinary citizens want to take control back, it is going to take rigourous activism, feet on the street, work stopages, national strikes, tying up whole cities in protest, “fill the jails”, just like we had during the civil rights movement. Remember the TV coverage? It was shocking and brought real change. That, at a minimum, is what its going to take.
I support Moveon’s threat to oppose re-election of leading Democrats who give in to Bush on this. The public wants firm action, and it has disavowed Bush’s incompetent “stay the course” nonsense. The “war” (actually the ‘occupation’) was lost years ago, and the public knows it. Bush is throwing away the lives of young Americans, and now Democrats will be complicit. Let’s show cowardly Democrats that they serve at the will of the people, not at the will of George Bush!
Today’s Associated Press coverage of the war spending bill, copied by CNN, devoted about half of the article to the “miffed” Republican response to the Democrats’ domestic spending attachments, amounting to around 1% to 2% of the war funding.
65% of the American people oppose the war according to CNN’s most recent poll. But nowhere in the article did the AP mention public dissent. Nowhere in the article are the American people referred to at all. The article was difficult to find - it wasn’t in the headlines at Google. I had to search for it.
The mainstream media seems to be doing its part to marginalize the public while the warmongers allocate public resources against the public will. I suppose the public can learn how to marginalize the mainstream media, and learn how to allocate public resources against the warmongers’ will.
To preznit_bouche…
Your observations, and solutions, are probably right.
The groundswell is beginning.
It seems to me that, “We the people”, each of us, are not taking responsibility. We are quick to point fingers and make others to blame, Democrats, Republican, Bush, Cheney, the right, the left, the media, but what did you do today to make a difference? Notice I used the word “We”, I include myself, I turned my back on my country of birth and decided to live in Europe, way back when this really all started, Reagan was elected president. I thought by not identifying with it and not directly supporting it, I was not part of it, which was then maybe partly true. But this is no longer true for me as I see and feel the ripples permeated through all of life, perpetrated by and in my land of birth. We are the problem, “We the people”, for not making a difference, complaining will get us no where. It is each and everyone’s responsibility to become Responsible to life and for ones own actions, do we give the corporations our money, then like it or not we are a part of that collective. Each of us will find, as we take more conscious responsibility for our own actions, all of them, we can make a difference! It is like America is very sick and we want to attack the symptoms, (Democrats, Republicans, Bush, Cheney, the right, the left, the media, corporate America, etc.), rather than the cause, we are the sickness. We can make a difference but we should begin in our daily lives and take responsibility there with the little things before we point our finger and make others responsible. Our problems did not begin with Bush and will not end with Bush and his gang of thugs, it will end when “We the people” take responsibility for our own actions. Peace be with you all!
“fear the political consequences of voting to cut off funds altogether.”
The message is so painfully clear, its politics over an end to the monumental suffering and death wrought on the American Military, their families, the Iraqi people and their families.
It is amasing to me how the politicians can look at themselves never mind their Constituents.
How do they explain their actions to the Military Personnel, the wounded, their families and the families of those who have died and the families of the people they pulled out of the Euphrates River yesterday and the Iraqi people?
I agree with almost all the sentiments expressed above. I think that the Democrats have left us in the lurch again. Problem is, there are rustlings that Cheney will get his war with Iran and we will get a dictatorship akin to “Big Brother.” The indications are all there. I believe that is the truth.
It pleases me that so many see through this charade, and all we can do is promote a legal way to put an end to the existing traitors, Bush and Cheney. But who is going to lead us???? Obviously not the Democrats.
THe only Democrat who IS standing up to President Bush and his crew is John Edwards.He has demanded that Congress send back a bill for withdrawal again and that Congress should not back down from this administration.
Listen to the tremendous speech he gave at the Convention: www.cadem.org and go to his website to look at what he is doing in relation to the war in Iraq,healthcare,poverty,morality of this country….
John Edwards’ website www.johnedwards.com
He also has a seperate website for supporting the troops on that same site.
We need to, all of us, call and write to let them know how amazingly pissed we all are.
They are so terrified to do anything that might make them lose the WH in 08 so htye caved since they didnt want to be balmed for deserting the troop. He vetoed the first bill, w is the one who abandoned them. The Dems are appearing so spineless.
I like the way they are doing it quickly too. Like they do not want to give voters a chance to call and try to stop them.
This could lose the the WH. They are splintering their own party. It is ridiculous.
How disgusting, we sent them their to stand up to that bully and they got their asses handed to them. Pathetic!
BTW ricg- loved the letter. I really needed a good chuckle today.
Oh, try and catch the bird putting his two cents in on w’s leeve this am in the rose garden. Im still giggling.
skst’s observation is right on the money (see above):
CUTTING OFF FUNDS TO THE U.S. ARMED FORCES OCCUPYING IRAQ IS NOTHING OTHER THAN BRINGING THEM BACK HOME.
That is the cash value of such a motion.
All other interpretations of that motion are mere sentiment or intimidation maneuvers on the part of bloodthirsty politicians who nearly all have never participated in combat.
A regrettable statistical truth: the less a politician has taken part in actual warfare, the more bloodthirsty that politician is likely to be, for that individual is over-compensating for what one can only call constitutive cowardice (people who delegate the performance of warfare to others, without wanting to risk their own life in combat, are cowards).
The Democrats are lite Republicans, a sickening crew of traitors to their own electorate.
Whereas the Republicans are undoing their grand old party through their countless acts of corrupt behavior, the Democrats need to be destroyed by the people.
We will continue to be left with the same choice unless we take action. Between the Democrats and the Republicans…. we don’t get to choose the best option, we get to choose the lessor of two evils.
The two are the same, big money, big politics. When will this nation wake up?
Gutless “F” ing bastards, every chicken $hit one of those entitled pandering elitists in congress!
If anyone thought they actually had representation in congress, think again!
Isn’t it time to start a war here at home?
Don - watch it - big brother reads every post and takes names. He knows who you are, where you live, how much you make, anything he wants to know. And you live on a one way street - you don’t know squat about him. Calls for a “war here at home” could make you disappear.
EveningLand said:
“A regrettable statistical truth: the less a politician has taken part in actual warfare, the more bloodthirsty that politician is likely to be, for that individual is over-compensating for what one can only call constitutive cowardice.”
John Mcain disproves that.
MoveOn is just an echo chamber for Nancy Pelosi and her allies in Congress. They don’t try to pressure her into anything, they wait for her to tell them what she wants, then they tell their “members” to repeat the message.
The attacks on Steny Hoyer are not a sign of a sudden burst of unexpected leadership from within MoveOn. Hoyer is a rival of Pelosi. She wanted Murtha in his position but failed to shoehorn him in, remember. So, now Pelosi has cooked up an obvious sham by which she and other Democrats in safely anti-war districts can vote against the war without really upsetting the Republicans, Bush, or their mutual corporate masters and war profiteers because she has already guaranteed that the blank check she wrote herself (and is now acting as if she opposes) will be signed by The Commander Guy.
It is a complete sell out and a complete farce! MoveOn and Pelosi are like Tweedle-Dee and Tweedle-Dum . . . in more ways than one.
George Bush’s ‘Mission Accomplish’ is successful.
They have been able to stop Iraq from pumping oil and look at the obscene profits made by the Texas Oil Gangsters. Now it is time for them to carve up the black gold and they will. We are not leaving Iraq and the ‘insiders’ in both parties want it exactly that way.
Either Kucinich or Paul could stop this but the insiders will never allow them to be nominated.
We have been betrayed by the demo-rats.
This was all just grand political theater meant to amuse and confuse the poor befuddled voter. We are just rubes to these elitest bastards.
ALL politicians serve the same Master - BIG OIL & BIG MILITARY- Exxon pays the bills while the troops pay in blood and the taxpayer is bled dry.
NEVER VOTE DEMOCRATE OR REPUBLICAN AGAIN..WE NEED A THIRD CHOICE
‘Contract on America’ by David Scheim explains much of how the Democratic Party has been sabotaged since the 1960s by conservative money bolstering and pressuring Democratic Party politicians particularly in the South and the Midwest. Read it to understand a big part of the problem. The Republicans are slick and are skilled at dividing and diffusing Democratic policy… they have the money, the advertisers, and the lack of scruples.
It’s easy to get disgusted with the Democratic Party when the politically-naive conservative element undermines it and pushes it over to Republican policies. But dividing Democratic votes will only hand the elections to the Republicans, who love to create and back 3rd parties to steal Democratic votes.
The way to win is to finally educate southerners and midwesterners to political reality, and that is a tall order, which means undoing deeply-ingrained anti-union and anti-social-democratic attitudes which are continually rammed down their throats by the very conservative media which has prevailed there for a long time.
Iused to have faith in the democrats, but now realize they are as usless as tits on a boar.
Yes, iolellity, I am aware of the fact that there are politicians to whom my description does not apply: that is why I spoke of a statistical truth, and of likelihood, and did not speak simply of all politicians and of a universal truth (i.e., one that would hold of all politicians).
Some politicians have been soldiers in their youth, yet they keep on lusting after blood in their older days, as if their thirst for blood had not been quenched by the acts of war and destruction that they carried out. Some people, in other words, are vampires — they were reared and tutored into the condition of vampire.
They just voted the legislation.
From DCCC:
“Breaking News: Because of your help, the House just passed legislation that will go to the White House that includes critical issues Democrats have been fighting for including: canceling the President’s blank check in Iraq, raising the minimum wage, and increased funding for military health care and veterans’ benefits, and help for victims of Hurricane Katrina. ”
How is this legislation cancelling the President’s blank check in Iraq?
I just unsubscribed from DCCC.
A couple of “I told you so…”
“…Democrats will not do anything different in the long run than the Repubs they displaced because the power and money that put them there has not changed, just the recipients”
“…the Repubs WANTED the Dems to be in this position strategically, it is why they took the “hit” of losing in 2006. The Dems now look exactly as the Repubs want them to: weak and unable to lead, so a strong Repub [an oxymoron] can be brought forth to unmake the “mess” the Dems have made of their majority in Congress. It is classic Machiavellian/Rove tactics, with a large dose of Sun-Tse thrown in.”
So, in conclusion: look to your history books, read up on chess, think further than the next news cycle. Who was it that said something like “he that lives and runs away lives to fight another day - Karl Rove”
This all sucks, I’m going back into my cave.
The Democrats have been doing this for decades. The Democratic Leadership Council, formed by the conservative, Rockefeller backed Clintons and their allies was built in the eighties to undermine the legacy of the New Deal and make the Democrats look more like the Republicans. This is particularly true with the big free trade deals. But we are stuck with a two party system. The only choice we have is to reject DLC Democrats like Emmanuel, Hoyer, Hillary, and the “Blue Dogs” and support the Kuciniches and maybe Edwards, if he’s for real. The conservative Democrats can respond to this by trying to appear progressive, as Obama does, but he is a big supporter of imperialism. There are good Democrats, including some of the new labor oriented Democrats like Tester and Webb, just elected in 2006. We need to elect more Democrats like them and throw out the corporate (DLC) Democrats. The party had lots of progressives and passed a great deal of good legislation between the New Deal and the Great Society eras, and they eventually cut the funding for Vietnam. The Democrats are inadequate today because of the DLC worms in the woodwork. But we need to stick with them and support the progressives: Kucinich, Waxman, Conyers, etc. There are many of them. The DLC took lots of time and money to bring about their coup of the Democratic Pary. It will take time to get them out, but it is possible. Third parties simply don’t work in the United States. I voted for Nader twice, but I will not do it again. The Greens will never get anywhere here, not without proportional representation and a cabinet parliamentary system with coalition governments. But we don’t have those things, and barring miracles, we never will.
This reminds me why I voted for Nader in 2000 and 2004.
The World Socialist Web Site has good commentary on the surrender of the Democrats to Bush here:
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2007/may2007/dems-m24.shtml
“The Republican Party, no matter how unpopular and discredited among the people, prevails because it represents most directly the interests of the most determined and ruthless sections of the ruling elite. The Democrats, on the other hand, serve a very specific function within the political establishment. They defend the basic interests of the ruling class, while promoting the fiction that their party is something it is not now and never was — a party of average working people. This is what imparts to the Democratic Party its inveterate duplicity, half-heartedness and cowardice.”
In response to “The votes were not there”, what about Mike Gravel’s strategy outlined in this Mother Jones interview?
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/22/1371/
“He proposes a law commanding the president to bring the troops home. In 60 days. ‘The Democrats have the votes in the House to pass it. In the Senate, they will filibuster it. Fine. The Majority Leader starts a cloture vote the first day. Fails to get cloture. Fine. The next day—another vote on cloture. And the next day, and the next day, Saturdays and Sundays, no vacation—vote every single day. The dynamic is that now you give people enough time to weigh in and put pressure on those voting against cloture…. I would guess in 15 to 20 days you would have cloture and the bill would pass and go to the president. He would veto it. Wonderful. It comes back to the House and Senate. Normal thing is to try to override and fail. No guts. No leadership. So in the House and Senate every day at noon, you have a vote to override the veto. The Democrats are the leaders—they control the calendar. It only takes half an hour to have these votes. The media will jump on it, you know, “This guy changed his vote,” etc. But then peace groups can go out into the hustings and get these guys where they live, at home, and I would say that in 30 to 45 days they will override the veto. But it’s got to be on a clean, simple issue, none of this “go out and manage the war, deal with the funds” stuff. We never cut off the funds in Vietnam. I was there. I tried it. I failed. What you have to do is go to their immediate survival. By Labor Day this could be all solved, and the troops be home by Christmas.’”
We need total up and down reformation of our political system.
- Popular vote vs. electoral college
- Strict campaign finance reform, elections entirely publicly financed (reducing dependence upon corporate influence)
- Free press coverage (read Obama’s passage in his book about how expensive our press makes it to advertise for politicians)
- NO 30-second ads allowed. They are nothing but disinformation clothed as information. AKA propaganda.
- No political appointees allowed to the civil service other than cabinet-heads. If that slows things down a bit, then that’s surely a good thing, since fast-paced agendas are most certainly ideologically-based.
- No campaigning from office, for both executives and legislative branch.
- Barred for life from leaving office as a politician to work for lobbyists, and barred for life from leaving SES (Senior Executive Service) civil service positions to work for lobbyists.
So they cave in to him again! AAAAAUUUUUUGGGGGGHHHHHH! When the hell will we get leaders with backbones? So keep sending the bill with troop withdrawal over and over. And let the funding be cut off. Maybe then he’ll pull his head out of his a– and realize we are serious. And inundate the media with talking heads making it clear who is responsible for the cut-off. Let’s see… who has more credibility?… hundreds of Congressmen and Senators elected to represent the people or one rogue and irrational “President” elected by an incredibly slim margin. I think I’d go with Congress. I guess we know the “cowboy” is still in charge. Congratulations Congress on your abysmal failure.
“Blessed are the merciful, for tehy shall receive mercy”
(sermon on the mount)
weep to day O good folk, for the cry of the innocent, little, angelic girl in Iraq, bloodied and dying in her weeping mother’s arms, for neither your church bells nor your king weeps for her today.
may you recive mercy
I propose anytime says the word Democrat to you, you say in response you mean the Caveinacrats, I have heard they are finished, no one believes in them anymore.
From Pat Buchanan:
“With such volatility in this crucial region of the world, with such uncertainty, it is easy to see why Democrats prefer to be the “dummy” at the bridge table and let Bush play the hand.
The congressional Democrats are cynical, but they are not stupid. If the surge works and U.S. troops are being withdrawn by fall 2008, they do not want it said of them that they “cut and ran” when the going got tough, that they played Chamberlain to Bush’s Churchill.
And if the war is going badly in 2008, they know that the American people, in repudiating the party of Bush and Cheney, have no other choice than the party of Hillary and Pelosi and Harry Reid.
That is why congressional Democrats are surely saying privately of the angry antiwar left what has often been said by the Beltway Republican elite of the right: “Don’t worry about them. They have nowhere else to go.”
And that is why the antiwar left was thrown under the bus.”
Buchanan is an ass but an ass who gets it right almost all the time about democ-rats.
Its just too bad that we the people are naive enough to believe we live in a democratic society !
Common sense will tell you that the Demo Congressional members know EXACTLY what’s going on and they know EXACTLY what’s needed. But 98% of them are dirty, one way or another. If Bush knows what WE had for breakfast, what do you think he knows about Congresspersons? He has every one of them pegged, how much they take from Lockheed Martin, Boeing, Caterpillar, etc., not to mention who they’re sleeping with. THEY AREN’T STUPID OR SPINELESS, THEY’RE BEING BLACKMAILED, folks. Dennis Kucinich said it today. All they have to do is stop making any laws. The war is already funded for the next six or eight months. All this talk about funding the troops is bullshit. The Demos aren’t EVER going to stop the war.
There’s only one thing that can stop it and that’s a genuine people’s revolt of some kind but that takes more than a few outraged people like us. It takes millions. And the Gestapo is watching.
This is why people need to break free from the damned Democrat Party and go to Green or other parties. Would change the face of American Politics forever.
This should be a real lesson to those who insist there is no difference between the 2 parties. There most certainly is. And that difference is that republicans stand up for their principles (however repulsive) and fight for their constituents (however corrupt) while the democrats…well, the democrats…WTF, I am amazed at the depth and passion of the anger I feel toward these spineless, shameless, craven cowards.
Partly, I know, because I donated to them in ‘06. What was I thinking? Bramscher is right, (see above) they’ve been screwing us for 40 years. As far as “nowhere else to go” I have a couple of possibilities. I could go to my polling place and vote Green or Socialist or Libertarian, or Populist or anything else to break up the duopoly or I could just go fishing, with the same end in mind.
Enough is Enough is Enough is Enough, etc
It is time for a revolution and have heads roling. The french knew very well how to deal with no representation at the goverment level. Enough is enough, get out in the street and scream your anger at this bogus political system. No representation of the will of the public. Lets not vote at all at the next election. Lets chalenge the system, the police, the goverment. Lets get down in the street and protest. Next thing will be an underground political system where subversive group will organized. I am so f. mad.
Aldo,
Good idea on the revolution. We have no real representation anymore. EVERYONE in Government is sold out to corporations and their own greed to stay in power!
Mcdee,
I agree there is really no where to go now that the dems sold us out. I’ll be fishing too.
And I actually gave to Murtha’s campaign. NEVER AGAIN!!!!
Dems have really messed up now as they have lost our vote… Actually they just helped the Republicans.
I am hopping Fing Mad!!!
Just when it looked like the democrats were REALLY going to do something, they in time slowly yield to the wishes of King George and begin to prove that they can’t even do what they were voted in to do. Even the ‘Gas Gouging’ bill got edited to mean absolutely nothing. Can you spell B E T R A Y E D?
Standing back and looking at the situation it would seem simple.
What more proof do you need that the people are irrelevant?
A majority want out of Iraq. Our government does the opposite.
A majority want universal health care. Our government keeps that for themselves as they tell us that would be “socialism” if we had it.
A majority want conservation and to increase MPG gas ratios to over 50MPG and conservation. Instead we get $4 a gallon gas.
Since the 2000 election debacle we still don’t have a uniformed, verifiable voting system. You think this is by accident?
Government employees get yearly raises as the same time they have refused to raise an unlivable minimum wage for the working poor.
Our schools, roads, bridges and infrastructures are falling apart as violent crime rises and more than half the money we make goes back to a government that keeps taking and taking as it gives nothing in return but a thumb in the eye.
If we don’t pick the kind of change we want the changes we get will pick us apart. We can’t go on like this. It’s physically, mentally and economically impossible.
indict all war supporters in congress for complicity in war crimes and crimes against humanity.
congress should be debating why they allowed the administration to bully the country into an oil war for empire, and how to transform America’s military occupation of iraq into acts of solidarity, humanitarian assistance, and restorative justice. instead, most people in congress are hard wired to violence and addicted to wealth and dominance.
dissolve congress.
I have already taken my Democratic Senator to task in a scathing E Mail letting him know how I feel about the Democratic party caving in to Bush! This mess keeps getting worse every day. All the ones did who chose to vote for funds was condemn some of our soldiers to death.
Now we see that the presidential election in 2008 is just a horse and pony show. Let the people play make believe like they have a voice. Those that rule by power should and will be overthrown by that same power. That’s a law of nature.
A fighting democrat, a fighting democrat… my kingdom for a fighting democrat…
If you want to turn the tide, it’s your purchases that will make the most difference in marketing to you.
I believe Europe said it best; if you fall into the blame game you will never get anywhere.
Europe May 24th, 2007 6:38 pm ^
MSM joins the administration/Fox News drumbeat constantly. Watching CNN’s coverage of the war appropriations bill just now, the “reporters” talked about how Hilary and Obama voted. They continually said that both have in the past voted “to support the troops” and not voting “to support the troops” might involve politics, and what would they do the next time a vote “to support the troops” came up. Not once did they call the measure what it was, a supplemental appropriation to continue the war. Our neighbors are looking to see who is going “to support the troops”, not who is supporting the war, thanks to the entire media using Fox News propaganda.
Our country is gone, folks. Reagan started the slow bleed and the Bush boys trampled the remains - Clinton didn’t break even, being part of the bleeding. Corporate vultures have turned hunter, not even waiting to scavenge a prostrate carcass but separating democracy from the herd and chasing it down, killing it with their dollars. Our government is owned by corporate millions, and no reform or even revolution will change it. Kiss our asses goodbye.
“We need total up and down reformation of our political system.
- Popular vote vs. electoral college
- Strict campaign finance reform, elections entirely publicly financed (reducing dependence upon corporate influence)
- Free press coverage (read Obama’s passage in his book about how expensive our press makes it to advertise for politicians)
- NO 30-second ads allowed. They are nothing but disinformation clothed as information. AKA propaganda.
- No political appointees allowed to the civil service other than cabinet-heads. If that slows things down a bit, then that’s surely a good thing, since fast-paced agendas are most certainly ideologically-based.
- No campaigning from office, for both executives and legislative branch.
- Barred for life from leaving office as a politician to work for lobbyists, and barred for life from leaving SES (Senior Executive Service) civil service positions to work for lobbyists.”
Baby, like 99.9% of Americans you’re missing the point.
Politics it’s not only Washington. It’s your workplace were
you toil to enrich the bastards who corrupt the system.
I know it’s more difficult to grasp, but without this grasping, everything else is ridiculous.
You’re all totally brainwashed to see politics only in voting, representatives, etc., etc.
Beyond comical.
All this discussion is great, but here we have a web site available to hundreds of millions of internet connections around the world, but, at most, a couple hundred of participants in this forum, with about a dozen participants doing 90 percent of the discussion. Talk about Andy Warhol’s prediction!
Meanwhile, a large majority of USans cannot name their representative in the house, or even their state’s senators, and don’t know even the basic functions the Congress, executive of judicial branches, nor, do they care.
What the cynical Dems believe (including many progressives who just don’t want to believe the truth — that this has always been a bi-partisan war and the Dems as a party will continue to support it while trying to appear as if they don’t) is that in the end, let the anti-war wing scream, yell and whine because elections are a choice between 2 people in the two-party system, and none of us is going to vote Republican at election time. As the Dems have no integrity, decency, honesty or patriotism, they’re perfectly willing to vote funding that causes the children of primarily working class and poor Americans to be killed and maimed so that they win in 2008 (even though they won’t) and call it supporting the troops.
The Dems successfully projected a sense of the “inevitability” of their having to vote to fund the needless killing and maiming of more troops and Iraqis over the objections of 70% of the electorate. That “inevitablility” was repeated right from the beginning by the leadership, so all of us were supposed to feel that even though we’re angry, deep down we understand it wasn’t the Democratic controlled House and Senate’s fault that they had to vote through the “kill and maim our troops so we can get elected” bill and betray those who gave them control of both Houses to end the war. People as intelligent as Tom Hartmann from Air America keeps implying he disagrees with, but understands, the betrayal of the troops by the leadership Democrats — as do the pundits (with the exception of Keith Obermann) who got all this wrong in the first place.
What we have to do as progressives is come up with a way to stop it. Don’t get mad get even. I think if all of us put away our differences, stopped trying to impeach Alberto Gonzales (just another Bushbot), and united and demanded that Pelosi put Conyers in charge of actually moving impeachment and removal of Bush and Cheney, we would have a mechanism to end the war and the high crimes and misdemeanors this Bush group is doing within about 4 months.
We should not take “no” for an answer. As a result of the cynicism and hostility to the troops demonstrated by the Democratic majority, this war will go on unabated. Even Murtha voted to kill and maim more troops in the interests of the party. The leadership Dems have anticipated we may go there and have given many lame excuses why we shouldn’t go the impeachment and removal route — trying to portray it as a nutso idea that would inevitably fail.
And we shouldn’t wait until September. We should start now. If the leadership Dems have a better way to stop the war and get the troops out within 3-4 months, to stop the daily criminal actions of this Administration, then they should put it forward and better succeed in carrying it out. Otherwise impeachment and removal are the only tools we have to end Bush/Cheney’s reign in the near future. If the leadership Dems won’t do it, then we should fight them in all primaries at all levels and let them know we cannot be taken for granted. We should make the Demorcatic Party look like Iraq, without the killing, maimings and torture.
Nancy Pelosi for the first woman US President in 2007, whether she wants it or not.
If wishes were a-holes we’d all have one, but alas they aren’t. We can keep wishing that the scum doesn’t ride to the top in our “elected” officials, but most seem to prove us wrong every time.
I absolutely agree that we vote with our money. Nothing else, even the voting booth trumps cold hard cash. Lobbyist vote that way and they seem to be doing a bang up job. We just need to find a way to money vote in unison.
I’ve been trying to find SOMETHING POSITIVE out of this total betrayal. Guess it’s that we KNOW which of our incumbent Democrats really HAVE TO BE CHALLENGED in the primary next time around.
Case in point is Congresswoman Jane Harman. After going along with President Bush’s warrantless wiretapping as minority leader of the House Intelligence Committee, she found herself in a primary fight against anti-war activist and PDLA president Marcy Winograd. Although Winograd came into the race quite late and with a fraction of the financial resources that Harman had, she mobilized an army of volunteers and ended up with about 40% of the vote!!! Had she had either more money or more time to get the message out, Harman would have been history. But all was not lost on Harman, who has now VOTED AGAINST the supplemental.
The moral of the story is that Congressman Howard Berman, another of the pro-war reps from LA, needs a strong primary challenge to wake him up or replace him. In office FOREVER, he thinks he’s no longer accountable to the people in his district (that he moved into to run). All he does is raise tons of money from corporate lobbyists and vote for war, over and over and over…until this time…when he CHOSE TO NOT VOTE!!! Well, we DO UNDERSTAND what a NO VOTE means too.
Anyone within range is invited to the PICKET BERMAN demonstration tomorrow, 5/26. Meet at the Rite Aid parking lot at Riverside/Whitsett in Valley Village (this is the East San Fernando Valley just north of 101 and west of Laurel Canyon). Or please pass this along to anyone you know in the area who can make it.
###
Ten Key Values of the Green Party
Originally ratified at the Green Party Convention in Denver, CO, June 2000.
TKV Flyer w/Spanish translation (PDF)
Democracy is Coming (to the USA) Brochure (PDF)
Platform
Links
1. GRASSROOTS DEMOCRACY
Every human being deserves a say in the decisions that affect their lives and not be subject to the will of another. Therefore, we will work to increase public participation at every level of government and to ensure that our public representatives are fully accountable to the people who elect them. We will also work to create new types of political organizations which expand the process of participatory democracy by directly including citizens in the decision-making process.
2. SOCIAL JUSTICE AND EQUAL OPPORTUNITY
All persons should have the rights and opportunity to benefit equally from the resources afforded us by society and the environment. We must consciously confront in ourselves, our organizations, and society at large, barriers such as racism and class oppression, sexism and homophobia, ageism and disability, which act to deny fair treatment and equal justice under the law.
3. ECOLOGICAL WISDOM
Human societies must operate with the understanding that we are part of nature, not separate from nature. We must maintain an ecological balance and live within the ecological and resource limits of our communities and our planet. We support a sustainable society which utilizes resources in such a way that future generations will benefit and not suffer from the practices of our generation. To this end we must practice agriculture which replenishes the soil; move to an energy efficient economy; and live in ways that respect the integrity of natural systems.
4. NON-VIOLENCE
It is essential that we develop effective alternatives to society’s current patterns of violence. We will work to demilitarize, and eliminate weapons of mass destruction, without being naive about the intentions of other governments. We recognize the need for self-defense and the defense of others who are in helpless situations. We promote non-violent methods to oppose practices and policies with which we disagree, and will guide our actions toward lasting personal, community and global peace.
5. DECENTRALIZATION
Centralization of wealth and power contributes to social and economic injustice, environmental destruction, and militarization. Therefore, we support a restructuring of social, political and economic institutions away from a system which is controlled by and mostly benefits the powerful few, to a democratic, less bureaucratic system. Decision-making should, as much as possible, remain at the individual and local level, while assuring that civil rights are protected for all citizens.
6. COMMUNITY-BASED ECONOMICS AND ECONOMIC JUSTICE
We recognize it is essential to create a vibrant and sustainable economic system, one that can create jobs and provide a decent standard of living for all people while maintaining a healthy ecological balance. A successful economic system will offer meaningful work with dignity, while paying a “living wage” which reflects the real value of a person’s work.
Local communities must look to economic development that assures protection of the environment and workers’ rights; broad citizen participation in planning; and enhancement of our “quality of life.” We support independently owned and operated companies which are socially responsible, as well as co-operatives and public enterprises that distribute resources and control to more people through democratic participation.
7. FEMINISM AND GENDER EQUITY
We have inherited a social system based on male domination of politics and economics. We call for the replacement of the cultural ethics of domination and control with more cooperative ways of interacting that respect differences of opinion and gender. Human values such as equity between the sexes, interpersonal responsibility, and honesty must be developed with moral conscience. We should remember that the process that determines our decisions and actions is just as important as achieving the outcome we want.
8. RESPECT FOR DIVERSITY
We believe it is important to value cultural, ethnic, racial, sexual, religious and spiritual diversity, and to promote the development of respectful relationships across these lines.
We believe that the many diverse elements of society should be reflected in our organizations and decision-making bodies, and we support the leadership of people who have been traditionally closed out of leadership roles. We acknowledge and encourage respect for other life forms than our own and the preservation of biodiversity.
9. PERSONAL AND GLOBAL RESPONSIBILITY
We encourage individuals to act to improve their personal well-being and, at the same time, to enhance ecological balance and social harmony. We seek to join with people and organizations around the world to foster peace, economic justice, and the health of the planet.
10. FUTURE FOCUS AND SUSTAINABILITY
Our actions and policies should be motivated by long-term goals. We seek to protect valuable natural resources, safely disposing of or “unmaking” all waste we create, while developing a sustainable economics that does not depend on continual expansion for survival. We must counterbalance the drive for short-term profits by assuring that economic development, new technologies, and fiscal policies are responsible to future generations who will inherit the results of our actions.
Ten Key Values from other state and local Greens.
There is no authoritative version of the Ten Key Values of the Greens. The Ten Key Values are guiding principles that are adapted and defined to fit each state and local chapter.
WHY DO THEY HATE US SO MUCH?? (the all-time most audacious question asked by supremacist xenophobic Yanks and their Fascist allies)
——————————————————————————–
Read that question w/ some whining noise added to it for fun!!!
This is a response from a world citizen to the all-time most naive question I have heard/read so much from the so-called analysts, writers, politicians, and hands of IMPERIALISM in your dishonest media.
In your undying, never-ending hatred for Iran and drowned in an ocean of narcissism, you simply have forgotten, or yet better, chosen to forget, the crimes, inhumane policies, arrogant attitudes, and pain inflicted by you “patriotic” psychos on many a nation, including Persians.
Well, the Northern Christian hypocrisy and self-love on one side; its harsh animosity and blood thirst for Iran is something else. It was evident in your clownish, arrogant President’s speeches and now it’s epitomized by the most blatantly hateful, Nazi pieces of propaganda which Goebbels himself would love you for ), there it comes, suck it and swallow it w/ AMERICAN (w/ a thick R the way you like it) pride and xenophobia.
By what I have read from the likes of you in your very “OBJECTIVE” media (no shortage in the ” objective, informed, and bright” nation of yours), you completely epitomize what the monstrous Northern Christian imperialism means to billions of impoverished, victimized, oppressed masses of the world and what it has done for the past several centuries only in order to secure its own filthy interests derived from your selfish, self-indulged, self-centered, egotistic, materialist, and Calvinist lifestyles and worldviews. If and only if you were interested in the truth and facts, you could easily find the answer by reviewing your friends’ list and also crimes’ list for decades or centuries (for those Euro liberals!!). It doesn’t take a genius, does it?
YOU are the epitome of unfairness, injustice, governmental terrorism and bigotry. These are some of the crimes against humanity committed by your patriotic asses all over the planet (the list would be only too long but I mention a few here):
U.S. sponsored coup against democracy in Guatemala in 1954 which resulted in the deaths of over 120,000 Guatemalan peasants by U.S. installed dictatorships over the course of four decades.
U.S. overthrew the governments of the Dominican Republic in 1965 and helped to murder 3,000 people.
1973, the U.S. sponsored a coup in Chile against he democratic government of Salvador Allende and helped to murder another 30,000 people.
1965 the U.S. sponsored a coup in Indonesia that resulted in the murder of over 800,000 people, and the subsequent slaughter in 1975 of over 250,000 innocent people in East Timor by the Indonesian regime with the direct complicity of President Ford and Secretary of State Henry Kissinger
U.S. sponsored terrorist contra war (the World Court declared the U.S. government a war criminal in 1984 for the mining of the harbours) against Nicaragua in the 1980s which resulted in the deaths of over 30,000 innocent people (or as the U.S. government used to call them before the term “collateral damage” was invented–”soft targets”).
U.S. war against the people of El Salvador in the 1980s, which
resulted in the brutal deaths of over 80,000 people, or “soft targets”.
U.S. sponsored terror war against the peoples of southern Africa (especially Angola) that began in the 1970’s and resulted in the deaths and mutilations of over 1,000,000.
U.S. invaded Panama over the Christmas season of 1989 and killed over 5,000 in an attempt to capture George H. Bush’s CIA partner, now turned enemy, Manual Noriega.
U.S. sponsored a brutal coup that resulted in the deaths of over 70,000 Iranians from 1952-1978.
This doesn’t even mention the crimes in Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia, Grenada, Bay of Pigs and before that the support for and direct involvement w/ Batista’s regime in Cuba, the 8-year war against Iran -including chemical weapons usage- by (the former friend!!) Saddam, death squads in Central America, the 5 decades of Israeli crimes in Palestine and Lebanon (the veto policy), the “missing” in Argentina, and of course the “silent coup” in Algeria in 91 (w/ deceitful cooperation from the French bastards) that stopped the FIS from winning the elections thus plunging the country into a civil war for years…………….
We can never forget your crimes or undying sense of self-love and ego that make the Yankees and their NATO/G7 lovers the most detested nations on this planet, perhaps galaxy.
Now kill as many innocent people as you want. LAUNCH, LAUNCH as a bastard called JAMES WOODS declared on JAY LENO. Brag about Hiroshima, Nagasaki, and Beirut bombings. Brag about killing of the innocent family members of Kaddafi, all the countries’ leaders and revolutionaries who had the guts to say no to your Fascist Empire.
It matters not. The U.S. (and the British disgusting colonialism) will go where the Romans, German Nazis, Mongols, and the rest of the arrogant sorry excuses for humanity went. Now celebrate killing Moslems, Nationalists, and Leftists (not to mention nuns and priests), etc. in your never-ending fire of hatred, supremacy and ego.
Unlike many other foreigners, I am not simplistic enough to think you are just the minority and the “rest” are simply decent, nice, culture-loving individuals. The fact is it’s filth like you that votes for the criminals you call leaders (Reagan and Bushes, Blair, Merkel, Harper and Howard come to mind immediately). Also I don’t think, despite the popular belief, you are ignorant or just stupid; I think you know enough and simply choose to ignore because you are the most selfish, inhumane, robotic bastards this planet has seen for a long time. Your sense of “SELECTIVE MEMORY and JUDGMENT” is proof enough.
I think legendary Orwell got it right in this passage from Nineteen Eighty-Four, an account of the ultimate supremacist empire:
“And in the general hardening of outlook that set in . . . practices which had been long abandoned - imprisonment without trial, the use of war prisoners as slaves, public executions, torture to extract confessions . . . and the deportation of whole populations - not only became common again, but were tolerated and even defended by people who considered themselves enlightened and progressive.”
As a reaction to your actions, our (the South) hatred for you could only be compared to the feelings we have against Serbs, Nazis, Genghis Khan and Alexander the Criminal.
THE NEW ROME WILL FALL…… AND ITS FOLLOWERS, FRIENDS, ALLIES AND APOLOGISTS….. WE’LL MAKE SURE OF THAT. DEATH TO THE U.S. and EU!!!
They, being the DEMS, better have some grand scheme to end this war and soon. Three more months of war and horror is unexcusable. The DEMs are taking the anti war group for granted, much like the GOP and the religious conservatives. The DEMS would not even be in control of the house and senate if it weren’t for voices like PA REP John Murtha who got the whole movement going, and what’s his reward from Pelosi - obscurity, which is just wrong. Murtha went out on a limb, walking point and took the heat when all the other spineless DEMs were too busy “looking patriotic”, i.e. clueless. Should’ve known something was up, when Pelosi chose Hoyer over Murtha and stated “impeachment” off the table. So the DEMS are just as guilty as the REPs, using our troops as political fodder. These spineless DEMS now have just as much blood on their hands as the GOPs. I (we) want the troops out before the end of the year….or I’m jumping ship, going independent or Green. At least the GOP rubber stampers “stay in line and in goose lock step discipline.” No more funds, no more troops in Iraq.
My name is Lowell Manning and I live in New Zealand. I’m sorry to come in at the tail end of this discussion.
For a time, in 1989/1990 I led the electoral reform movement in New Zealand. I resigned from that position once both the major political parties here had both committed to a binding referendum on the electoral system.
Despite major subsequent efforts to sabotage the process, New Zealand became one of the very few countries in the world (in 1993) to democratically choose proportional representation.
Since then there has been, in New Zealand considerable limitation on the power of parties in our unicameral (one house) Parliament.
In the US you face an unprecedented challenge to democracy primarily because the US Constitution, for all its brilliance did not take account of four major (I do not say they are the only) factors:
- campaign finance laws practically ensure the rich will always win
- professional lobbying ensures Congress and Senate do not step out of line
- advertising is largely unrestricted and all but guarantees success for those who have the clout to manage the media
- mainstream US media has been “bought” (go for example to Greg Palast’s website to find out what just about everyone in the world except Americans know about how Bush won in 2004 - involving criminal actions by very senior Bush appointees)]
Yes, the American system has failed badly, and the only way I can see is for the US public to initiate a massive “bottom up” campaign to change the electoral system and/or change the balance of power created by the effective usurping of the US Constitution, as indicated above.
Among the potential contenders I am aware of for President in 2008 there are two who might turn the tide. One is Denis Kucinich (who unfortunately hasn’t a hope in hell of winning nomination). The other is Al Gore, who just might, if there were a truly massive public grassroots movement to support him. But he will, in my view, need intense protection if he is to again succeed in being nominated, should he choose to stand, as there are plenty of powerful interests out there who would not want to see Al Gore President of the US.
Cheers fo now
Lowell Manning
If MoveOn and the anti-war organizations would encourage their members to join the Green Party, they would get action from the Democrats in a hurry.
In our two-party system, GPs are effectively “independent” voters,who, in large numbers, united under the anti-war umbrella, could easily control the 2008 election.
It’s pretty obvious that we haven’t been able to move the Democrats from within the party; they feel confident that we won’t vote Republican in 2008; but what if we had a third option?
WHY DO THEY HATE US SO MUCH?
Because we are feared; not respected!
Because we ignored the atrocities and were easily duped into believing these countries were ready to invade the United States.
I don’t take this criticism personally; but as a nation, I know we are guilty.
Guilty of believing Guatemala, Panama, El Salvador, Iraq and every other country we have invaded (by proxy included) was a threat to our way of life. We believed they had an army capable of invading the US!
Why did we believe such rubbish? Because people like us failed to be heard. Because people financially well off didn’t want to rock the boat and believed the official lie.
So here we are, nothing has changed has it? Environmental collapse effects us all.
There is only one Peace candidate.
“Peace is a powerful message,” said Paul, speaking to Maher, along with fellow guests Ben Afflect and P.J. O’Rourke. “Especially after the war has been going on and the people wake up and realize how many people die and how much it costs. And that’s why i think people are really ready for a message that says we don’t have to be in this mess. Logic tells us that we can make a better world in a much easier way than causing wars.”
Think about it.
Hey Latraki
There is more than one peace candidate running for president. I think Dennis Kucinich has earned that label.
first, its great to see the level of possibly awakening disgust.
secondly, heres hoping that that disgust is a catalyst for each pissed off voter.
thirdly, i sincerely propose a comical but worthwhile idea to those who are pissed and writing here or speaking out or doing whatever you can… IDEA Send a blank postcard expressing your gratitude to president Bush for igniting one of the largest reawakenings of the nonasshole crowd to political involvement. Bush’s presidency has seriously reawakened the left and all non republicans. say what you will about effectiveness but SHRUB has reawakened those who care about wrong and wasteful wars and other human things.
PEACEFULLY RESIST USING YOUR HEART AND COMIC SENSE. overpass sign hangings, anything and everything nonviolent (we really need more creative tagging) rock the boat!
p.s. thank you ms sheehan, i hope you will return someday if you choose.