Obama Advisers: No Charges Likely Versus Interrogators
WASHINGTON - Barack Obama's incoming administration is unlikely to bring criminal charges against government officials who authorized or engaged in harsh interrogations of suspected terrorists during the George W. Bush presidency. Obama, who has criticized the use of torture, is being urged by some constitutional scholars and human rights groups to investigate possible war crimes by the Bush administration.
Two Obama advisers said there's little - if any -
chance that the incoming president's Justice Department will go after
anyone involved in authorizing or carrying out interrogations that
provoked worldwide outrage.
The advisers spoke on condition of anonymity because the plans are still tentative. A spokesman for Obama's transition team did not respond to requests for comment Monday.
Additionally, the question of whether to prosecute may never become an issue if Bush issues pre-emptive pardons to protect those involved.
Obama has committed to reviewing interrogations on al-Qaida and other terror suspects. After he takes office in January, Obama is expected to create a panel modeled after the 9/11 Commission to study interrogations, including those using waterboarding and other tactics that critics call torture. The panel's findings would be used to ensure that future interrogations are undisputedly legal.
"I have said repeatedly that America doesn't torture, and I'm going to make sure that we don't torture," Obama said Sunday on CBS' "60 Minutes." "Those are part and parcel of an effort to regain America's moral stature in the world."
Obama's most ardent supporters are split on whether he should prosecute Bush officials.
Asked this weekend during a Vermont Public Radio interview if Bush administration officials would face war crimes, Senate Judiciary Chairman Patrick Leahy flatly said, "In the United States, no."
"These things are not going to happen," said Leahy, D-Vt.
Robert Litt, a former top Clinton administration Justice Department prosecutor, said Obama should focus on moving forward with anti-torture policy instead of looking back.
"Both for policy and political reasons, it would not be beneficial to spend a lot of time hauling people up before Congress or before grand juries and going over what went on," Litt said at a Brookings Institution discussion about Obama's legal policy. "To as great of an extent we can say, the last eight years are over, now we can move forward - that would be beneficial both to the country and the president, politically."
But Michael Ratner, a professor at Columbia Law School and president of the Center for Constitutional Rights, said prosecuting Bush officials is necessary to set future anti-torture policy.
"The only way to prevent this from happening again is to make sure that those who were responsible for the torture program pay the price for it," Ratner said. "I don't see how we regain our moral stature by allowing those who were intimately involved in the torture programs to simply walk off the stage and lead lives where they are not held accountable."
In the years after the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks, the White House authorized U.S. interrogators to use harsh tactics on captured al-Qaida and Taliban suspects. Bush officials relied on a 2002 Justice Department legal memo to assert that its interrogations did not amount to torture - and therefore did not violate U.S. or international laws. That memo has since been rescinded.
At least three top al-Qaida operatives - including 9/11 mastermind Khalid Sheik Mohammed - were waterboarded in 2002 and 2003 because of intelligence officials' belief that more attacks were imminent. Waterboarding creates the sensation of drowning, and has been traced back hundreds of years and is condemned by nations worldwide.
Bush could take the issue of criminal charges off the table with one stroke of his pardons pen.
Whether Bush will protect his top aides and interrogators with a pre-emptive pardon - before they are ever charged - has become a hot topic of discussion in legal and political circles in the administration's waning days. White House deputy press secretary Tony Fratto declined to comment on the issue.
Under the Constitution, the president's power to issue pardons is absolute and cannot be overruled.
Pre-emptive pardons would be highly controversial, but former White House counsel Arthur B. Culvahouse Jr. said it would protect those who were following orders or otherwise trying to protect the nation.
"I know of no one who acted in reckless disregard of U.S. law or international law," said Culvahouse, who served under President Ronald Reagan. "It's just not good for the intelligence community and the defense community to have people in the field, under exigent circumstances, being told these are the rules, to be exposed months and years after the fact to criminal prosecution."
The Federalist Papers discourage presidents from pardoning themselves. It took former President Gerald Ford to clear former President Richard Nixon of wrongdoing in the 1972 Watergate break-in.
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36 Comments so far
Show AllThe American people should know that George W. Bush is not only a war criminal: he is also a hate-crime criminal.
George W. Bush had better stop committing hate crimes.
“What did you think of that NAACP anti-Bush race-baiting ad in 2000? You know, the one that practically said Bush was responsible for the dragging-to-death-behind-a-truck murder of a black man just because he didn’t sign a hate crimes bill several years after the man’s death” (Posted by Aaron. Retrieved December 11, 2008, from metafilter.com).
ON THE TOPIC OF HATE CRIME(S):
“Sean Penn accuses Bush of ‘criminal negligence’” (Retrieved December 11, 2008, from deadlykatrina.com). Thus, Sean Penn believes that George W. Bush was at fault, criminally, relative to his response to Hurricane Katrina.
“Had the residents of New Orleans been white Republicans in a state that mattered politically, instead of poor blacks in city that didn’t, Bush’s response surely would have been different. Compare what happened when hurricanes Charley and Frances hit Florida in 2004. Though the damage from those storms was negligible in relation to Katrina’s, the reaction from the White House was instinctive, rapid, and generous to the point of profligacy. Bush visited hurricane victims four times in six weeks and delivered relief checks personally. Michael Brown of FEMA, now widely regarded as an incompetent political hack, was so responsive that local officials praised the agency’s performance.”
Jacob Weisberg. (2005, September 7). An Imperfect Storm . . . How race shaped Bush’s response to Katrina. Slate. Retrieved December 7, 2008, from slate.com
Assuming that George W. Bush had in fact been criminally negligent relative to his response to Hurricane Katrina, would Bush be responsible for hate crime?
“One of those very least were George Bush’s personal complicity in the death (murder to be precise) of my friend Margie Schoedinger[,] [an African-American woman,] in September of 2003. Determining the exact whereabouts and contacts of [then] president-elect George Bush on September 21 thru 22, 2003, should be entirely lacking in difficulty” (Leola McConnell (Nevada Progressive Democratic candidate for U.S. Senate in 2010). Retrieved November 29, 2008, from leolaforussenate.blogspot.com).
Does George W. Bush’s murder of Margie Schoedinger constitute a hate crime?
“A woman in Texas who filed a lawsuit against the president for rape and torture[,] [Margie Schoedinger,] was found shot to death. It was ruled a suicide. No one is investigating. Bush reportedly dated the woman in high school and speculation is that he was using the woman as his sex slave because he is above the law” (John Kaminski (author of “America’s Autopsy Report,” a collection of his Internet essays published on hundreds of websites around the world). (No date listed). Why We Need Martial Law . . . Criminal government is destroying America; military must step in to restore Constitution. serendipity.li. Retrieved December 10, 2008, from serendipity.li).
Do George W. Bush’s rape and torture of Margie Schoedinger constitute hate crimes?
“I believe that George W. Bush hates black people. Through secret government machinations, he caused Hurricane Katrina to form and aimed it at New Orleans on purpose, just so he could wipe out lots of poor blacks. I also believe that before the hurricane hit, he snuck into New Orleans and stole the keys to every school bus in the city to make evacuation of poor people impossible” (Janet M. Stroble. (2006, April 12). Now I Believe. military.com. Retrieved November 26, 2008, from military.com).
If George W. Bush intentionally did what Janet M. Stroble indicated, would Bush have committed hate crimes against countless black people?
“I believe that George W. Bush hates Moslems. All that garbage about freedom, democracy, and the right to vote is a pollution of their culture. I believe that George W. Bush hates immigrants. There were a lot of immigrants working in the World Trade Center and George W. Bush didn’t warn them ahead of time” (Janet M. Stroble. (2006, April 12). Now I Believe. military.com. Retrieved November 26, 2008, from military.com).
In that George W. Bush hates immigrants and deliberately failed to warn them ahead of time as indicated by Janet M. Stroble: would Bush accordingly be responsible for hate crimes relative to racial minorities who were harmed?
“Did Kanye West[’]s [comment], [‘]George Bush Hates Black People[’][,] get his mother killed?” (Retrieved October 18, 2008, from abovetopsecret.com).
There is a discussion at abovetopsecret.com relating to whether President George W. Bush murdered Kanye West’s mother—Ms. Donda West.
Did President George W. Bush, who hates black people, murder Kanye West’s mother in the heat of raging racism? Somebody indicated that although the president of the United States is monitored by the Secret Service, he certainly can meet with one or more persons where his conversations are not intercepted and secretly “order a hit” on someone or order the murder of someone.
If George W. Bush did murder Kanye West’s mother, would it constitute a hate crime?
GEORGE W. BUSH MURDERED A JEW!
“George W. Bush murdered the Jewish former Senator—Paul Wellstone” (Retrieved December 10, 2008, from andrewyu-jenwang.blogspot.com). This Internet site has a lot of information indicating that George W. Bush murdered Wellstone.
“Bush’s visit to Israel is under the guise of Middle East peace. You gotta be kidding me! Bush is THE MASTER ARCHITECT of Middle East war, not peace. . . . Bush didn’t go to Israel because he likes Israelis or like Jews, nope, he went there because he hates them. He went there to spread his message of doom, war, pain and death” (Storm Bear. (2008, January 10). PROOF: George W Bush Is An Anti-Semite! bitsofnews.com. Retrieved November 23, 2008, from bitsofnews.com).
Assuming that George W. Bush did in fact murder the Jewish former Senator—Paul Wellstone, would Bush have committed a hate crime? Bush would have “purposefully” (criminal-law terminology) murdered Wellstone. Wellstone’s Jewish wife and Jewish daughter also died in the plane crash. Bush would have “knowingly” (criminal-law terminology) murdered Wellstone’s wife and daughter. However, would Bush’s murders of Wellstone’s Jewish wife and Jewish daughter also have constituted hate crimes?
Retrieved December 12, 2008, from http://andrewyu-jenwang.blogspot.com/2008/12/what-did-you-think-of-that-naacp-anti.html
Submitted by Andrew Yu-Jen Wang
B.S., Summa Cum Laude, 1996
Messiah College, Grantham, PA
Lower Merion High School, Ardmore, PA, 1993
Monday, November 10, 2008
Andrew Yu-Jen Wang for months had strongly rooted for Barack Obama over John McCain. However, in the end, Andrew Yu-Jen Wang voted for Ralph Nader only as a symbolic gesture because Andrew Yu-Jen Wang expects to be immensely disappointed by Barack Obama who Andrew Yu-Jen Wang assumes will not rigorously make arrangements or seek to have George W. Bush prosecuted—the most horrifying omission of action imaginable.
However, Andrew Yu-Jen Wang acknowledges that it is a hell of a lot better to have Barack Obama as President of the United States than John McCain.
Submitted by Andrew Yu-Jen Wang
B.S., Summa Cum Laude, 1996
Messiah College, Grantham, PA
Lower Merion High School, Ardmore, PA, 1993
Posted by Andrew Yu-Jen Wang at 6:56 PM 0 comments Links to this post
Retrieved November 29, 2008, from http://andrewyu-jenwang.blogspot.com/2008/11/andrew-yu-jen-wang-for-months-had.html
And so Andrew Yu-Jen Wang did not vote for Barack Obama where Wang strongly suspected that Obama would not really go all out to cause George W. Bush to be incarcerated for his heinous crimes. This omission of action of Obama would be shocking to the conscience. It would be the saddest thing. It would demoralize the American people. It would break the heart of the American people. And so Wang just did not want to make a fool of himself by investing himself in Obama through casting a vote for Obama only then to be mortified and let down by Obama not embarking on a mission to incarcerate the absolutely evil career criminal—George W. Bush.
After George W. Bush leaves office, one of the most important things is for his incarceration to be sought by the American people. If Obama were not prepared to fight diligently for such a thing, then Obama would, in a way, have wasted his time as the President of the United States. Moreover, Obama must be aware of George W. Bush’s various onslaughts against black people. Please read all about it in the blog of Wang (http://andrewyu-jenwang.blogspot.com/). Thus, if Obama does not have the indignation and rage to seek Bush’s incarceration, one must conclude only that Obama lacks the courage to do it. In failing to seek Bush’s incarceration, Obama—a black person—inevitably shames and humiliates and embarrasses himself.
Obama—a black person (a racial minority himself)—should be profoundly sensitive to the racial prejudice and widespread suffering Bush has inflicted against black people.
Submitted by Andrew Yu-Jen Wang
B.S., Summa Cum Laude, 1996
Messiah College, Grantham, PA
Lower Merion High School, Ardmore, PA, 1993
Retrieved November 30, 2008, from http://andrewyu-jenwang.blogspot.com/2008/11/electing-barack-obama-president-was.html
Important note. Hezbollah and the current government Syrian and Muqtada al-Sadr's Shiite oppose the security agreement in order to violate Iraq's security plans to undermine security in drug smuggling which is the source of financing terrorism because it does not place them in societies and civilizations which are protected by the Constitution
A government without morals and the President of without dignity this is the specifications of the Syrian regime, and I am sorry for any foreign diplomat in Syria either is anonymous or the goal of illegal does not rise by His position
and against the interest of the Syrian people Is the system of sectarian gives the privileges and legal violations to the sons of the sect, which govern only
What?
must be convinced England that he could not be the reform of the Syrian regime through political bargains because sectarian from inside ?
does he think the Syrian regime that he ,
could cross and continue to the logic of global openness through its Rules of the current _ I think it's an illusion
British Foreign Secretary says Syria basis in the stability of the region this is not praise ", but it means that they are behind the imbalance for the security of the region. Smart Syrian Walid Moallem, Minister for Foreign Affairs. cheating in as saying that the goal of a tour of the British minister in the Middle East to establish a partnership between London and Damascus. Is illusion and is miserable This system. Is based on the basis of terrorism and deceit in order to undermine the stability of Iraq as a system of constitutional parliamentary I am in my opinion he go the Minister to his country. He forgets that he came also is to the Middle East, in particular, "Syria and Palestine. don't did reiterate once again
Why I don't support Obama, plain and simple
- "I have said repeatedly that America doesn't torture, and I'm going to make sure that we don't torture,"
http://www.ryanhartman.wordpress.com
Turkey declared that it could mediate between Iran and America, I mean, the sponsor of the regional first and controlling the drug trade in the world. Necessary you play is background herself as the best. A solution of whoever
interference in the affairs of other................lol
Turkey declared that it could mediate between Iran and America, I mean, the sponsor of the regional first and controlling the drug trade in the world. Necessary you play is background herself as the best. A solution of whoever
interference in the affairs of other................lol
We as a nation cannot return to civilized norms without holding our leadership accountable for crimes of historic proportions including premeditated mass murder and crimes against humanity. We must live by agreed upon international laws if we are going to apply them to other countries with any semblance of credibility. Even if an Obama administration refuses to initiate charges, unless they grant blanket pardons, criminal charges must and will be brought.
The Jaded Prole
I am more curious as to what the world is going to do once the administration has changed hands. If Mr. Obama's hands are tied by GWB's presidential pardons, we can rant and rave all we want, it won't do us a bit of good. But there are so many people around the world who are offended and upset about what has happened, there is a good chance that this might be taken up in the world's court.
Another Neuremburg trial?
In this lame duck time, we can speculate all we want, we can hope for things, but only time will truly tell. Myself, I would be keeping closed mouth about what my intentions are, see what they are going to do, and act accordingly. I would think that they are going to point the way to what we should be looking at if we bide our time and watch what they are hurrying to cover up and get themselves out from under at the last minute.
I BEGGED everybody to listen to me. Obama's change of mind can be traced back to his private luncheon with George Bush.
Just like Nancy Pelosi's private luncheon with George right after her election as speaker of the house. Then, after beginning her official duties, all of a sudden Pelosi declared impeachment to be "off the table.
And now, after a private lunch with George, Obama is already starting to waffle on war crime prosecutions for George and his friends. I am telling you, a private lunch with the president is the kiss of death for a politician. Must be something in the food.
Democratic lawmakers, as a whole, supported the Bush administration's many crimes, including assenting to give Bush carte blanche to attack Iraq, tolerating torture and suspending domestic civil liberties.
We've had a lawless Bush regime, abetted by Congress. People hunger for justice, not the least the people abroad who are still subject bombings or military occupations by U.S. troops.
The attack on Iraq was a war crime (under Geneva Conventions, Nuremberg principles).
The practice of torture conflicts with a law Congress signed and is condemned worldwide.
The U.S. Constitution specifies "inalienable rights." The Patriot Act and FISA bill (both of which Obama signed, even though they violate Constitutional rights) must by nullified.
If Obama decides not to punish the Bush administration's crimes, he will set a lawless precedent for the future.
I've heard the argument, time and again, that Obama had to be elected in order to be pushed. This issue - Bush war crimes - is a big one. It's a real reason to push.
Are you pushing, loyal Dems, to make Obama change his mind on this issue? How much do you hate the Bush war crimes? Will you get involved to see that justice is served? What is your plan now that you hear Obama intends to sweep the Bush crimes under the rug? Is this the change you voted for?
-TIA
jimm
I am considerably disappointed in the prospect that Mr. Obama and his advisors will sweep the abuses of human rights perpetrated by our government under a rug of complicity, all in the name of "moving forward". We can't move forward by pretending these terrible crimes weren't committed in our name.
While it is important to punish those who commit crimes, especially those who order others to commit them despite long-standing legal proscriptions against them, what is much more important is that these crimes be acknowledged and confessed, and forgiveness sought, by their perpetrators. If we let the perpetrators pretend they did no wrong, how does that move us on?
Since it appears that no prosecutions will take place, (clearly the wrong answer), then at least we need a "national reconciliation commission" along the lines done in South Africa after apartheid. Since it appears we have no national leaders up to the task, I suggest we ask Dr. Desmond Tutu to come here and chair one. I certainly don't want another 9/11 commission. I can only imagine that Mr. Obama might ask Henry Kissinger to chair it.
NOT SO GOOD.
Obama isn't sweeping anything "under a rug of complicity". Talk about hyperbole!
In fact, he is doing the exact opposite:
OBAMA:
"What I would want to do is to have my Justice Department and my Attorney General immediately review the information that's already there and to find out are there inquiries that need to be pursued. I can't prejudge that because we don't have access to all the material right now. I think that you are right, if crimes have been committed, they should be investigated. You're also right that I would not want my first term consumed by what was perceived on the part of Republicans as a partisan witch hunt because I think we've got too many problems we've got to solve.
So this is an area where I would want to exercise judgment -- I would want to find out directly from my Attorney General -- having pursued, having looked at what's out there right now -- are there possibilities of genuine crimes as opposed to really bad policies. And I think it's important-- one of the things we've got to figure out in our political culture generally is distinguishing between really dumb policies and policies that rise to the level of criminal activity. You know, I often get questions about impeachment at town hall meetings and I've said that is not something I think would be fruitful to pursue because I think that impeachment is something that should be reserved for exceptional circumstances. Now, if I found out that there were high officials who knowingly, consciously broke existing laws, engaged in cover-ups of those crimes with knowledge forefront, then I think a basic principle of our Constitution is nobody above the law -- and I think that's roughly how I would look at it."
It's just that he also realizes that:
OBAMA: "I think you reserve impeachment for grave, grave breaches, and intentional breaches of the president's authority,"
"I believe if we began impeachment proceedings we will be engulfed in more of the politics that has made Washington dysfunction," he added. "We would once again, rather than attending to the people's business, be engaged in a tit-for-tat, back-and-forth, non-stop circus."
Either Obama is stealthy beyond one's wildest imagination, or will continue to abet and cover for the criminal class. I am on pins and needles with anticipation.
Obama realizes how important it is to choose your fights carefully and that sometimes you must retreat in order to live to fight another day. This is not the time to drudge up old battles that can never be fully resolved. The past is a black hole. We need to move forward, to inspire people, to frame our agenda in a pro-active way. Obama will end torture. That is what is important. Focusing on punishment and assigning blame will only open old wounds and wind up demonizing soldiers or intelligence officers who were only following orders. We don't need another generation of veterans being insulted for their service. During Vietnam they called Vets "baby-killers", the only difference is now they are calling them "torturers". Bush is the problem, not our troops.
If OBAMA starts off like a hurricane to Right all the Wrongs and go for TRUTH, whether Wall Street, and the Banks that control it/us, the War Criminals of the GWBUSH administration, and they are, and also admonishes the Zionist government of Israel for genociding the Palestinians, as they are now doing as we write our messages here, he will not last long. Our newest President will be looking down the barrel of a gun, so to speak.
===================================
"I have, therefore, chosen this time and this place to discuss a topic on which ignorance too often abounds and the truth is too rarely perceived — yet it is the most important topic on earth: world peace. What kind of peace do I mean? What kind of peace do we seek? Not a Pax Americana enforced on the world by American weapons of war. Not the peace of the grave or the security of the slave. I am talking about genuine peace, the kind of peace that makes life on earth worth living, the kind that enables men and nations to grow and to hope and to build a better life for their children — not merely peace for Americans but peace for all men and women — not merely peace in our time but peace for all time. Address at The American University, Washington D.C. (10 June 1963)"
Dangerous speech, and he paid for it just five months later.
==========================
70 per cent of our country's assets are controlled by less than 1 per cent of our population, and if you think the majority of these people of the 1 per cent care a fig for justice, truth, humanitarian aims, world peace or anything like that, you are wrong. They live in their own world, and their interests are to amass more wealth, and to maintain and grow their power. And of course this does not leave out the other folks in other nations in their top 1 per cent of wealth-and-power holdings.
And that's real. If it weren't real, with all of their money and their power coupled with a desire for a peaceful, secure, prosperous humanity, this would be a much finer and more peaceful world for everyone than it is now and ever has been, and as JFK envisioned 48 years ago.
I go back and forth about Obama, but I do not think he gave up an offered, lucrative position with one of the most prestigious law firms in the nation when he graduated from Harvard to become a community organizer to help the disempowered and the poor because he is crazy, stupid or has a martyr complex.
I do not think he will diss what his late mother and his recently deceased grandmother instilled in him. If his salt-of-the-earth grandmother and grandfather are heroes to him, it just doesn't make sense.
Let's give him a chance. What he is up against, what we all are up against, are smarmy, sneaky, ruthless, phony-baloney, inhumane, callous individual and power-bloc people who do not care a fig for you or for me, who could not identify with our lives, our persons, our to-them small dreams. After-all, we are just the people. They are the wheeler-and-dealer KINGS [a few QUEENS] of the STREET, of their NATIONS, and of the WORLD if they can harness and control it all, even if they destroy people and the planet in the process. They can't see that far. They only know their own world, and it is not in them to have a heart or deep spiritual understandings.
These are the most dangerous times of our history as human-beings. And yours, and anybody's guess, at this moment, of how it will all turn out, is as good as mine.
But let's give Obama a chance.
It is interesting that Obama actually repeated the Bush& company line -"The U.S. doesn't torture". What the heck does that even mean? The fact is that it does. He said nothing here.
And to not go after the criminals gives a very clear message that there is no rule of law to worry about, so it is all meaningless. Jane Mayer "Journey to the Dark Side" said that when she interviewed CIA agents, there were those who said they didn't do certain things because they envisioned actual jail time for these kinds of actions. She said that without repercussions there would be no reason for these guys to hold back.
Leahy definitely left the option of extradition on the table from his comment "In the United States, no." Once Obama is inaugurated, perhaps some other governments will call for war crimes trials.
On the upside I saw that Cheney and Gonzalez are now under indictment in texas. http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/tx/6119696.html
Woo and Gonzales should be at least stripped of their rights to practice law, as they clearly have no understanding of the subject.
Rumsfeld, however, should be dropped off in Baghdad to be boot-fucked to death by the surviving citizens
"The only means of strengthening one's intellect is to make up one's mind about nothing, to let the mind be a thoroughfare for all thoughts." - John Keats
"IN the United States..no"
If Prez Junior Fucknuts pardons everyone, can they be "extraordinarily renditioned to another country to be charged elsewhere, in some country that actually RESPECTS international law?
"The only means of strengthening one's intellect is to make up one's mind about nothing, to let the mind be a thoroughfare for all thoughts." - John Keats
EJmurphy414,
How can you be joyful and disappointed at the same time over Mr. Obama's actions?
You are an example of the typical fool citizen. You don't know what you think or feel. You are confused.
Yet you vote, causing the rest much anguish. Please don't vote again, because you are an idiot.
Don't waste your time. Some people think that Obama can't do anything right.
He ends the war in Iraq - they're angry because he wants to win the war in Afghanistan. He frees the prisoners at Guantanamo - they're angry he didn't immediately end the policy of extraordinary rendition. He invests in green technologies - they hate him because he wants to fund research for clean coal. He wants to make the rich pay their fair share of taxes - they hate him for not starting a Marxist revolution. And on and on, etc... etc... He's in a no-win situation with them.
When it comes to Obama, these so-called "progressives" are acting more like Republicans PR assassins. Maybe CD needs to better educate it's readers by running more articles highlighting Obama's achievements and less articles attacking him.
CD has run numerous "puff pieces" on Obama. It's just that the criticism so far is the result of Obama's "achievements" to date NOT being an indication of reversing the crimes of the power structure. But then, Obama has been forced to run as a stealth candidate for "progressives". I suppose we all will have to wait for "the first 100 days for a better indication of what an Obama achievement might look like. NOT WAITING. NO TO THE NEW WORLD ORDER!!
And this amidst talk of Eric Holder being Attorney General to bring independence from political pressure to the Justice Department. What a joke. If Obama hadn't made his deal with the Devil he never would have been allowed to get this far. Leahy's quote only confirms there is no rule of law in America. And lets see whether W's forthcoming pre-emptive self-pardons stick or not. There's always Paraguay.
Pat Murphy
Despite my joy at Obama's election, I am very disappointed that he opposes possible war crime prosecutions. Even if no sentences were sought, the world (and many Americans) would welcome a full expose of what happened and why, and judgments on those guilty of violations of the law.
"Befel ist Befel." (orders are orders) These are the words the Nazi operatives used at Nuremberg to defend their murdering of millions of innocent people. The question before every American -- from Obama on down -- is whether he or she will choose to be complicit in the same kind of crimes.
To do nothing to bring justice to criminals when it is your job to do so, is to be complicit to those acts. What's wrong with a trial - is it because they know they're all damned guilty beyond a resonable doubt? If those involved are innocent, let them be so judged. If nothing is to be done and Obama only sits as an apathetic accomplice to heinous crimes, then in the name of equality open the prisons and fire the police.
Obama: renewing the old statement that the more things change, the more they stay the same. Fine, he's black. So is Cynthia McKinney, who's also a woman and a decent, honest individual that owns her own soul and decisions. Think of the milestone that our country would have crossed had we electer her!
Let's stop being dupes falling for the Cult of Personality. Look what we've done: it's another Bush/Clinton/Bush presidency. Keep the CFR out of office if you want a humane country. Keep the CFR out of office if you want to prosecute rogue politicians, instead of being ruled by them.
We need to work now for inclusion of real candidate options in public presidential debates for the 2012 election. We need to get a representative of the people, not the corporations, banks, and military conglomerates.
Aloha, salud, lechiem,
- Tobias
http://www.youtube.com/user/tobiasaurusrex
If Congress and Obama don't revise the patriot act, including restoration of habeas corpus, during his first month in office, you better give up hope on any of the change he promised.
McKinney would've prosecuted.
Why is anyone amazed? The same people who paid the Bush regime to do their bidding paid for Obama's campaign. When Obama won the nomination, the Clinton and Bush handlers - read advisers - and controllers took over.
"modeled after the 9/11 Commission"
If it is we are in trouble!
I don't care about prosecuting for war crimes! It's a waste of time to argue the case legally and have another OJ spiel; just expose the truth in an investigation that is NOT like the 911 commission.
Translation:
NO, Prosecutions for war crimes. No punishment for criminal acts which would put most citizens in jail for life or death.
"Meet the new boss, just like the old boss." Pete Townsend of the Who.
Mr. Obama is giving us the "change we can believe in." Ha, ha, ha.
Well, he is either with humanity or he is with the terrorizers.