WASHINGTON - Two months after insisting that they would roll back broad eavesdropping powers won by the Bush administration, Democrats in Congress appear ready to make concessions that could extend some crucial powers given to the National Security Agency.
Administration officials say they are confident they will win approval of the broadened authority that they secured temporarily in August as Congress rushed toward recess. Some Democratic officials concede that they may not come up with enough votes to stop approval.
As the debate over the eavesdropping powers of the National Security Agency begins anew this week, the emerging measures reflect the reality confronting the Democrats.
Although willing to oppose the White House on the Iraq war, they remain nervous that they will be called soft on terrorism if they insist on strict curbs on gathering intelligence.
A Democratic bill to be proposed on Tuesday in the House would maintain for several years the type of broad, blanket authority for N.S.A. eavesdropping that the administration secured in August for six months.
In an acknowledgment of concerns over civil liberties, the bill would require a more active role by the special foreign intelligence court that oversees the interception of foreign-based communications by the security agency.
A competing proposal in the Senate, still being drafted, may be even closer in line with the administration plan, with the possibility of including retroactive immunity for telecommunications utilities that participated in the once-secret program to eavesdrop without court warrants.
No one is willing to predict with certainty how the question will play out. Some Congressional officials and others monitoring the debate said the final result might not be much different from the result in August, despite the Democrats' insistence that they would not let stand the extension of the powers.
"Many members continue to fear that if they don't support whatever the president asks for, they'll be perceived as soft on terrorism," said William Banks, a professor who specializes in terrorism and national security law at Syracuse University and who has written extensively on federal wiretapping laws.
The August bill, known as the Protect America Act, was approved in the final hours before Congress went on its summer recess after heated warnings from the administration that legal loopholes in wiretapping coverage had left the country vulnerable to another terrorist attack. The measure significantly reduced the role of the foreign intelligence court and broadened the security agency's ability to listen to foreign-based communications without court warrants.
"We want the statute made permanent," a spokesman for the Justice Department, Dean Boyd, said Monday. "We view this as a healthy debate. We also view it as an opportunity to inform Congress and the public that we can use these authorities responsibly. We're going to go forward and look at any proposals that come forth. But we'll look at them very carefully to make sure they don't have any consequences that hamper our abilities to protect the country."
House Democrats overwhelmingly opposed the bill in August and said the administration had been forced them into a corner.
As Congress takes up the new bills, a senior Democratic aide said, House leaders are working hard to ensure that the administration does not succeed in pushing through a bill that would make permanent all the powers it secured in August.
"That's what we're trying to avoid," the aide said. "We have that concern too."
The bill to be proposed on Tuesday by the Democratic leaders of the House Intelligence and Judiciary Committees would impose more controls over the powers of security agency, including quarterly audits by the Justice Department inspector general. The measure would also give the foreign intelligence court a role in approving, in advance, "basket" or "umbrella" warrants for bundles of overseas communications, a Congressional official said.
"We are giving the N.S.A. what it legitimately needs for national security but with far more limitations and protections than are in the Protect America Act," said Brendan Daly, a spokesman for Speaker Nancy Pelosi, Democrat of California.
Perhaps most important in the eyes of Democratic supporters, the House bill would not give retroactive immunity to the telecommunications utilities that participated in the eavesdropping. That has been a top priority of the administration. The temporary measure gave the utilities immunity for future acts, but not past deeds.
Private groups are trying to prove in federal court that the utilities violated the law by participating in the program.
A former senior Justice Department lawyer, Jack Goldsmith, seemed to bolster their case last week when he told Congress that the program was a "legal mess" and strongly suggested that it was illegal.
The House bill would also require the administration to disclose details of the program. Democrats say they plan to push the administration to turn over internal documents laying out the legal rationale for the program, something the administration has refused to do.
In the Senate, the chairman of the Intelligence Committee, John D. Rockefeller IV, Democrat of West Virginia, is working with his Republican counterpart, Christopher S. Bond of Missouri, a main proponent of the August plan, to come up with a compromise.
Wendy Morigi, a spokeswoman for Mr. Rockefeller, said that retroactive immunity for the utilities was "under discussion" but that no final proposal had been developed.
The immunity issue may prove to be the crucial sticking point between whatever proposals the House and Senate ultimately pass. Representative Jerrold Nadler, a New York Democrat who was among the harshest critics of the temporary bill, said in an interview he would vigorously oppose any effort to grant retroactive legal protection to telecommunications utilities.
"There is heavy pressure on the immunity, and we should not cave an inch on that," Mr. Nadler said.
Mr. Nadler said that he was worried the Senate would give too much ground to the administration in its proposal, but that he was satisfied with the bill to be proposed on Tuesday in the House.
"It is not perfect, but it is a good bill," he said. "It makes huge improvements in the current law. In some respects it is better than the old FISA law," a reference to the foreign intelligence court.
Civil liberties advocates and others who met House officials on Monday on the proposed bill agreed that it was an improvement over the August plan but were less charitable in their overall assessment.
'This still authorizes the interception of Americans' international communications without a warrant in far too many instances, and without adequate civil liberties protections," said Kate Martin, director of the Center for National Security Studies, who was in the group that met House officials.
Caroline Frederickson, director of the Washington legislative office of the American Civil Liberties Union, said she was troubled by the Democrats' acceptance of broad, blanket warrants for the security agency rather than the individualized warrants traditionally required by the intelligence court.
"The Democratic leadership, philosophically, is with us," Ms. Frederickson said. "But we need to help them realize the political case, which is that Democrats will not be in danger if they don't reauthorize this Protect America Act. They're nervous.
"There's a 'keep the majority' mentality, which is understandable," she said, "But we think they're putting themselves in more danger by not standing on principle."
© 2007 The New York Times
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107 Comments so far
Show AllLOL! GO, Kathy Heckman!!!! I love it, I think I will write the same thing to my....oh, waitaminnit. I live in Oklafuckinghoma and all my representatives ARE republicans.
I just got back from JoAnn's Fabric Store, I absolutely couldn't believe what I witnessed. There was this elderly employee leaving the shift for the day and before she left she had to open her pocketbook to her boss inspect it before she left the store. I was absolutely stunned.
I said, Did I just see what I thought I saw? She said yes, it is company policy, no one trusts nobody.
The site below has the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, adopted by the UN on 10 December 1948.
http://www.un.org/Overview/rights.html
------------------------------
On December 10, 1948 the General Assembly of the United Nations adopted and proclaimed the Universal Declaration of Human Rights the full text of which appears in the following pages. Following this historic act the Assembly called upon all Member countries to publicize the text of the Declaration and "to cause it to be disseminated, displayed, read and expounded principally in schools and other educational institutions, without distinction based on the political status of countries or territories."
PREAMBLE
Whereas recognition of the inherent dignity and of the equal and inalienable rights of all members of the human family is the foundation of freedom, justice and peace in the world,
Whereas disregard and contempt for human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of mankind, and the advent of a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people,
Whereas it is essential, if man is not to be compelled to have recourse, as a last resort, to rebellion against tyranny and oppression, that human rights should be protected by the rule of law,
Whereas it is essential to promote the development of friendly relations between nations,
Whereas the peoples of the United Nations have in the Charter reaffirmed their faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person and in the equal rights of men and women and have determined to promote social progress and better standards of life in larger freedom,
Whereas Member States have pledged themselves to achieve, in co-operation with the United Nations, the promotion of universal respect for and observance of human rights and fundamental freedoms,
Whereas a common understanding of these rights and freedoms is of the greatest importance for the full realization of this pledge,
Now, Therefore THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY proclaims THIS UNIVERSAL DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS as a common standard of achievement for all peoples and all nations, to the end that every individual and every organ of society, keeping this Declaration constantly in mind, shall strive by teaching and education to promote respect for these rights and freedoms and by progressive measures, national and international, to secure their universal and effective recognition and observance, both among the peoples of Member States themselves and among the peoples of territories under their jurisdiction.
Article 1.
All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Article 2.
Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty.
Article 3.
Everyone has the right to life, liberty and security of person.
Article 4.
No one shall be held in slavery or servitude; slavery and the slave trade shall be prohibited in all their forms.
Article 5.
No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.
Article 6.
Everyone has the right to recognition everywhere as a person before the law.
Article 7.
All are equal before the law and are entitled without any discrimination to equal protection of the law. All are entitled to equal protection against any discrimination in violation of this Declaration and against any incitement to such discrimination.
Article 8.
Everyone has the right to an effective remedy by the competent national tribunals for acts violating the fundamental rights granted him by the constitution or by law.
Article 9.
No one shall be subjected to arbitrary arrest, detention or exile.
Article 10.
Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.
Article 11.
(1) Everyone charged with a penal offence has the right to be presumed innocent until proved guilty according to law in a public trial at which he has had all the guarantees necessary for his defence.
(2) No one shall be held guilty of any penal offence on account of any act or omission which did not constitute a penal offence, under national or international law, at the time when it was committed. Nor shall a heavier penalty be imposed than the one that was applicable at the time the penal offence was committed.
Article 12.
No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.
Article 13.
(1) Everyone has the right to freedom of movement and residence within the borders of each state.
(2) Everyone has the right to leave any country, including his own, and to return to his country.
Article 14.
(1) Everyone has the right to seek and to enjoy in other countries asylum from persecution.
(2) This right may not be invoked in the case of prosecutions genuinely arising from non-political crimes or from acts contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.
Article 15.
(1) Everyone has the right to a nationality.
(2) No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of his nationality nor denied the right to change his nationality.
Article 16.
(1) Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution.
(2) Marriage shall be entered into only with the free and full consent of the intending spouses.
(3) The family is the natural and fundamental group unit of society and is entitled to protection by society and the State.
Article 17.
(1) Everyone has the right to own property alone as well as in association with others.
(2) No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of his property.
Article 18.
Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance.
Article 19.
Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers.
Article 20.
(1) Everyone has the right to freedom of peaceful assembly and association.
(2) No one may be compelled to belong to an association.
Article 21.
(1) Everyone has the right to take part in the government of his country, directly or through freely chosen representatives.
(2) Everyone has the right of equal access to public service in his country.
(3) The will of the people shall be the basis of the authority of government; this will shall be expressed in periodic and genuine elections which shall be by universal and equal suffrage and shall be held by secret vote or by equivalent free voting procedures.
Article 22.
Everyone, as a member of society, has the right to social security and is entitled to realization, through national effort and international co-operation and in accordance with the organization and resources of each State, of the economic, social and cultural rights indispensable for his dignity and the free development of his personality.
Article 23.
(1) Everyone has the right to work, to free choice of employment, to just and favourable conditions of work and to protection against unemployment.
(2) Everyone, without any discrimination, has the right to equal pay for equal work.
(3) Everyone who works has the right to just and favourable remuneration ensuring for himself and his family an existence worthy of human dignity, and supplemented, if necessary, by other means of social protection.
(4) Everyone has the right to form and to join trade unions for the protection of his interests.
Article 24.
Everyone has the right to rest and leisure, including reasonable limitation of working hours and periodic holidays with pay.
Article 25.
(1) Everyone has the right to a standard of living adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services, and the right to security in the event of unemployment, sickness, disability, widowhood, old age or other lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond his control.
(2) Motherhood and childhood are entitled to special care and assistance. All children, whether born in or out of wedlock, shall enjoy the same social protection.
Article 26.
(1) Everyone has the right to education. Education shall be free, at least in the elementary and fundamental stages. Elementary education shall be compulsory. Technical and professional education shall be made generally available and higher education shall be equally accessible to all on the basis of merit.
(2) Education shall be directed to the full development of the human personality and to the strengthening of respect for human rights and fundamental freedoms. It shall promote understanding, tolerance and friendship among all nations, racial or religious groups, and shall further the activities of the United Nations for the maintenance of peace.
(3) Parents have a prior right to choose the kind of education that shall be given to their children.
Article 27.
(1) Everyone has the right freely to participate in the cultural life of the community, to enjoy the arts and to share in scientific advancement and its benefits.
(2) Everyone has the right to the protection of the moral and material interests resulting from any scientific, literary or artistic production of which he is the author.
Article 28.
Everyone is entitled to a social and international order in which the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration can be fully realized.
Article 29.
(1) Everyone has duties to the community in which alone the free and full development of his personality is possible.
(2) In the exercise of his rights and freedoms, everyone shall be subject only to such limitations as are determined by law solely for the purpose of securing due recognition and respect for the rights and freedoms of others and of meeting the just requirements of morality, public order and the general welfare in a democratic society.
(3) These rights and freedoms may in no case be exercised contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.
Article 30.
Nothing in this Declaration may be interpreted as implying for any State, group or person any right to engage in any activity or to perform any act aimed at the destruction of any of the rights and freedoms set forth herein.
-------------------------------
I think Jefferson would have approved of the above. God, what hopes for the future we had in 1948! How we have fallen since then.
How can one penetrate the obtuseness of the Democrats in Congress to convince them that virtually all Democrats and most Americans see them as weak because they refuse to fight the greater enemy -- the Bush administration? Giving in to the insane and irresponsible positions of the Bush/Cheney regime further drives the perception of weakness in the Democrats. Fight the Bush/Cheney criminal gang, for they are the great enemy of this country and the people in it. The terrorist bogeymen are weak confused simpletons, and Democrats do themselves no favors in playing Sancho Panza to Bush/Cheney's demented Adolf Quixote.
America under the Great Decider, is providing fodder for every stand-up comic in the world, for countless generations, who says we're not a giving nation?
And now I give you . . . . (fill-in the blanks, if you have enough space)
And everytime I think of Dick Cheney, I start praying for early onset of that disease that makes me forget, I'm not religious. . .
I wish to clarify I was agreeing with Marctileston's post and another got posted in between :)
Russ, very interesting read. Ma, I don't think it neccessarily precludes love or "passion" in that sense. Moreso attachement to worldly goods. I could be wrong but I am doing a little research on Guru Dev and he is quite interesting..
"His desires recede and turn to God, with the result that now his worldly actions are dictated by a sense of duty rather than by passion."---Russ
"Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art." ---Leonardo Da Vinci
I completely read through your post and it is very difficult for me to wrap my head around a life with no passion.In my experience God is passion and basically that is all there is. "Without spirit there is no art".
Just today I was looking out my window and saw a pair of bluebirds. My heart leaps when I see hummingbird. In my mind, these creatures were created out of passion. I don't think these creatures were created for servitude or duty. They love what they do. Life is a gift. When a hummingbird flutters from flower to flower there is no sense of servitude. I get a sense of great joy or passion. I actually learn from that. It takes me away from social injustice of this world and brings me closer to the true ways God. They are not doing harm and they are doing what they have been created to do with passion.
I just know as an artist there is no way I could give up my innate passions. If I did I would die, there would only be a shell of me left.
^^^
what he said..
It is said that in September 1945, when the Second World War was over, newspaper reporters wanted to know the reaction of Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati, Shankaracharya of Jyotirmath (Guru Dev). Allegedly he gave them the following statement, parts of which match other published quotations of Guru Dev:-
'Real victory is that, after which there can never be a reverse. Nobody can call himself a victor forever merely by crushing an external foe, because such foes can spring up again. A real victory is achieved by bringing under control the internal foes. A check over the internal enemies is therefore the only way of conquering the external enemies forever, because we should bear in mind that it is our own internal enemies which create the external enemies.
These inner enemies are ambition, anger, greed, false attachment, vanity and jealousy. It is this hexagon sitting inside us which makes a cat's paw (duping) of anything in the outer world in order to create enemies for us. Therefore if anybody wants to enjoy peace and happiness through victory over all enemies, then he should raid the very source of all physical enemies - the subtle hexagon living in us. Destruction of enemies by root is not possible without breaking up this hexagon (ambition, anger, greed, false attachment, vanity and jealousy). This is axiomatic.
It is a fact established by practical experience that anyone who has conquered these subtle inner enemies, has broken up the central source of all external enemies. Therefore, all enemies are nipped in the bud. Then he has no enemies left to be defeated. It is only such a victor who can be called a real victor. Then the gates of true and lasting peace and happiness are opened for him.
For a nation which desires to be completely free from enemies and to build a world of peace and happiness, it is necessary to have such men at the helm of its affairs who have conquered their inner hexagon. Otherwise they would destroy themselves along with many others. The history of the last several centuries shows that the rulers of powerful nations have given a bloodbath to the world under the influence of their hexagon. This is brutish. T hose who carry the burden of guiding a nation should particularly act with insight. It is no greatness or humanism to be carried away by one's hexagon and spread a wave of suffering over the earth.
After all, how long can we go on destroying the external enemies? As soon as we get rid of one, another one is ready to engage us. In this way we not only remain ourselves perpetually disturbed, but we also keep a cold war going on which threatens the peace and happiness of the whole of mankind all the time. This is certainly neither a sign of any victory nor of the suppression of any enemies. Hence it is most essential that people who rule nations should be those who have conquered their inner hexagon. It is these really victorious leaders who can successfully guide the societies, the nations and the world on to the path of lasting peace and happiness.
It is not too difficult to win over the hexagon. But people take it to be impossible without giving thought. Most of them hold the belief that only a perfect saint who has renounced all worldly concerns can break up the inner hexagon. This belief is based on complete ignorance. A renouncer renounces the very cause of the hexagon, so in his case the question of conquering the hexagon does not arise at all. A victor over the hexagon is one who maintains his worldly attitudes but does not allow himself to be subordinated by them. Let the enemy have an occasion to strike, but let him find that he cannot do so because he finds you too strong for it. Only then can he be treated as defeated. Mere engagement in bona fide worldly activities is no hindrance in keeping the inner hexagon in a state of subjugation.
For liquidisation of the subtle cell of inner enemies, it is not necessary to make warlike preparations over a number of years and then start a slaughter which keeps the world hanging between life and death. The only thing necessary for this is to become unbiased and to act with imagination.
To be unbiased is to look correctly. A person who sees things as they are is called an unbiased person. There is no difference between what a thing is and how he sees it. His outlook is completely balanced. His appreciation of a thing is correct - in other words, he never misunderstands. If the world is unreal, he does not give it any reality. If Brahman is real, he takes it as real. When one is convinced of the unreality of the world and the perpetuity of the Atman, then he becomes unbiased.. Then he sees things in their true shape.
By saying that the world is unreal, we mean that it can exist as it looks only for the time being, and that it would look something different hereafter. Everybody is actually seeing that everything in the world perishes and that we shall have to miss it one day - the smallest and the biggest - all are destined to change. Everyone sees clearly how many go on being born and how many go on dying constantly before our eyes. This is what we call th e transitoriness of the world. We see all this going on but we do not think over it.
One who has set in his heart the concept of the transitoriness of the world through a process of reasoning and deep thought, is the person competent to win over the inner hexagon. Because, one who is convinced of the transitoriness of the entire world complex cannot be susceptible to greed or attachment to anything, for he knows that the object of his greed or attachment today will be something different tomorrow. Conscious of this, disappointment, desires and attachments do not germinate in his mind. Nay, their very seed is destroyed. Then jealousy also is gone. He is no longer vain about his greatness, learning or wealth. When greed, attachment, vanity and jealousy disappear, there is no cause left for anger and anger goes away automatically. His desires recede and turn to God, with the result that now his worldly actions are dictated by a sense of duty rather than by passion. His behaviour automatically becomes proper and he lives in the world without being affected by it, just as a lotus leaf lives in water without getting wet. Such a man has no external enemies left, and his sameness rules over the whole Nature. None is capable of disturbing his kingdom of peace. It is such a person who is "samadarshii" (impartial, dispassionate) and a great victor, who can carry the world towards the goal of lasting peace and happiness.
Therefore, a victory over the inner hexagon is the highest form of victory, and it is to achieving this great victory that man should direct his efforts.'
The real and tangible issues that arise from warrantless wiretapping are numerous. They may include the use of insider information to destroy or takeover companies, or to fix prices, or intercept business strategy. I wouldn't be shocked to discover that patriotism was being evaluated and those who failed to meet the "Party's" criteria would be "dealt" with. I can imagine all sorts of information that could be mined to create an unfair advantage in the realm of politics, finances, business, elections, gambling/point fixing, bribery, extortion, etc. etc. I know that elections are a thing of the past now and votes aren't counted anyway, but these are just a few examples of the mis-use of illegally obtained information that was once private.
What many people fail to consider or understand, especially the wrong-wing conservatives, is the momentum that is accumulating regarding our diminishing rule of law. It's a principle thing.
The principle behind the right to privacy is that each of us is entitled to pursue happiness, without interference from the government or individuals. To decrease or remove those rights due to a security threat sets a precedent that may never end. We cannot predict who will be in positions of power in the coming years or decades, it is irresponsible to put into place, laws that restrict our human rights. Whether there are any indications that politicians may or may not act in our best interest is another argument, but surely we couldn't be sure that they wouldn't use wiretaps in an unethical way.
So my point is, although we may think this is no big deal because we have nothing to hide, does not mean we have nothing to lose. It would seem that the elite are hellbent on continuing their dominance, that was created by writing laws designed to give the already wealthy unfair advantages. As we allow our rights to be dismantled, one at a time, we empower the current ruling class to be more oppressive. Bush said it a long time ago, you're either with him or against him. So, if you find yourself either working or paying taxes, guess what? You're not with him. Therefor, by the associative property, you're against him.
The working class is being attacked. If we allow this surveillance to go un-protested, it's not a stretch to think that one day our communications could be limited in the name of national security. No phone calls on weekdays, no more internet, all letters must be inspected and checked for content, etc. etc... These again, are examples and may never come to fruition. But for the love of George Bush, uhm, strike that, I mean God, can we trust our leaders to preserve our rights? Or to excercise self control or compassion concerning the use of power?
"They that can give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." is an appropriate quote for these times. Maybe it was Ben Franklin, not completely sure. But his point was, that our basic values should not be compromised and the foundation of human rights is the right to individual privacy. Are we really so afraid of terrorists that we will give up our basic human rights?
The next issue is, that the Democrats are Republicans, are elite, corporate backed, wealthy, former slave owners, who intend to accumulate all of the wealth for themselves, at the expense of the working class. Revolt is an option. Another is refusal to give them our money. Buy local, don't pay interest, don't borrow, don't waste, live simply, educate the ignorant, fight for what America pretends to stand for, or once did.
peace
In fact, here is an opinion that is off-topic i suppose, but this conversation is near its end.
Anyway: I propose to diminish the concept of "rightness" unless it is only be used directionally.
So instead of saying: Its my RIGHT - it could be stated: Its my entitlement. That seems a preferable word to me, but this is just my opinion.
I can say this though IAH: there has been way too much righteousness going on when it comes to liberty and liberty has been losing out....
Peace,
Ken Hausle
The idea i was attempting to project is as such: who cares if you are being monitored. If you have no way of knowing, then just go about your business worry-free (unless you have other things you think you must worry about...). As far as someone telling someone else they are doing something wrong just by existing, that sounds like a matter of opinion. We are all entitled to our opinions - aren't we?
If some government wants to be "all-powerful" with the capability of observing your every more, but you don't recognize it (the government or the observing), well then, why worry about it. It is a waste of time and effort. Also, i so agree - the damn government should stay out of People's business in the so-called name of "security", and the damn government must be held accountable. This country has gone "security-crazy" although more than likely that is just the excuse associated with the power grab. I'm sure all the lawyers are thrilled with the many opportunities it presents for financial reward, but if i was a lawyer i doubt i could live with myself. I'd probably be worried all the time. Better to be an engineer in my humble opinion.
Peace,
Ken Hausle
It doesn't matter whether the person being monitored is doing nothing wrong or not. Robbing someone of their personal safety and freedom is evil and fascist pure and simple. They government must be held accountable for their actions.
I got a petition from Democrats.com on repealing the domestic spying and impeachment. They said to offer a comment so I did. Here 'tis.
---------------------------
Every letter I write asking why the Cheney/Bush cabal is allowed to shred our Constitution and Bill of Rights gets ignored. Every call to impeach them gets fluffed off with a form letter.
Now, it would seem that, not only are you prepared to expand their spying on American citizens, but you want to give them immunity for their unconstitutional actions.
Are you doing this so you can inherit a functioning fascist state after the elections (assuming we have them)? So far, you have not been functioning as representatives of We the People, but you sure have made the rich richer, and the powerful more powerful.
Show you can represent We the People. Restore the Constitution and the Bill of Rights to the Halls of Government. Impeach and remove the Cheney/Bush Gang who have robbed us and destroyed our integrity in the eyes of the civilized nations of the world.
Stop being a Reichstag and show some guts!
----------------------------
I imagine this goes into the usual black hole, but we've got to keep trying. Boy, this sure isn't the United States that I was born into seventy years ago. But I do remember us fighting a government just like ours of today, so people would no longer have to live in such a world or under such a government.
What happened?
Ken Hausle, did you ever see "Fatal Attraction? It kind of makes the point I am trying to make. A great deal of people that try to control other people by knowing everything about them by monitering their every move have severe psycholigical problems and they are dangerous. So it doesn't matter if you're not doing something wrong or not this type of behavior can lead to grave danger. In my opinion, that is exactly why the government should NOT have unauthorized access to all personal information and private correspondance of all its citizens. Privacy is an extremely important aspect of personal safety and freedom.
Hell without it, citizens could be killed or imprisoned for dissenting a specific view!!!!!!!!!!!! That is why it was written in the Constitution!
Ken Hausle, I assume you are being facetious with your question? If not, the danger begins when the definition of "doing something wrong" gets changed and suddenly you ARE doing something wrong just by existing...
MA_Matriarch - but if one is not doing anything "wrong" why should one worry? Honestly.
When i die, its time to die. While i live i want to live honorably (or at least try...).
Peace,
Ken Hausle
One hears the comment all the time, if I am not doing anything wrong I don't have anything to worry about.
They don't have a clue how dangerous it is for the government to have unauthorized authority to monitor their every move. They don't have a clue of the danger they are of being controlled by tyranny government.
If we loose this personal freedom, the Constitution and America is indeed dead.
Vote Kucinich but plan to move to another country as a refugee should he not be elected. To stay in the USA with any other candidate would not be a good idea since both parties are of the same colour and creed, or should I say,GREED. This War Of Terror is going to last many years and American workers have to pay for it, the corporate fat cats don't pay taxes they just move their operations offshore.
Might secession be a solution??
Hello mastershake - no sir.
Most people think they are simply going to vote for the first woman President.
That is Billary's only claim to fame save her husband and the excellent post you made which clearly shows how she is factually the corporate candidate. Not only are Democrats going to assist the Republicans in extending government power over its citizens, I'm here to say that after the 2008 elections happen the govt will suspend the Constitution for good. They'll use global warming or the war on terrorism or some such dire warning and fear mongering excuse to do so and most of the American Sheeple will simply bleat and follow along as they always do in the past 30 years. It will take a revolt of the middle class and working class to shut the nation's economy down before the wealthy American Executive Aristocracy stops raping and killing America.
libertas fugit - thanks for that link on the "dragonfly insect spy".
(what follows is a bit of a rambling discourse, so skip it if you are not in the mood.....)
=========================
The weather where i live (Charlotte, NC) has been most unusual this year (some say we are in our worst drought ever, but i think perhaps we are just transitioning into new type of climate). Anyhow, you wouldn't believe all of the odd flying bugs i have seen around my yard - i've lived in NC on and off since 1978 and either i wasn't paying attention, was delusional, or these bugs (especailly the various bees i have seen) are something new. I suppose it could be that the drought has caused many little critters that are normally out of sight to change their behavior and/or perhaps they are attracted to the large compost bin i have in the back yard.
Lately, when one of these bugs buzzes right into my face as many flying bugs are wont to do, i try to catch em - it requires precise timing. So far i have only knocked a few out of the air, but i plan on catching one soon - hopefully i can catch it alive and then i will decide what to do with it. In fact, rather than posting here today, i think i should go out and try to catch some bugs.
I'm sure the "grand" military thinkers in the US of stinking A can't wait to miniaturize the "air force" to the greatest extent that the latest "whiz-bang techno-blubbo-mumbo" will allow. Then you equip the bug with a little "stinger" that will immobilize key targets and carry out other very precise tasks. All that is left to do is send in some mindless blackwater pricks to mop up the unsuspecting. And WALLA -- quick and easy (other than a bit a blood seeping into the ground and getting into the water) control is achieved. What a country. What a stinking country.
What these military folks don't know though is the bugs can just as easy come their way, and with the weather crazy like it has been (and is going to be) who knows what kinds of bugs are going to come out of the woodwork. Who knows.
Well, i'm off to do some bug hunting. Peace fellow common dreamers.
Peace,
Ken Hausle
When will Ralph Nader receive an apology from the fools on the left (I was one at one point, but I apologized) who belittled him for saying that there's not a dime's worth of difference between Democrats and Republicans?
rebel, I was wondering the same thing about company policy>?
I know this thread didn't pertain to that but was in a hurry and knew most of the main posters here would hit this thread. I'm a bartender and you just wouldn't believe the stuff people feel "the need to confess" to me. What's so strange to me is these people believe alot of the same things "we" do but they attribute all the problems to liberal media etc...I tried to explain it's the whole system that is rotten, Congress is complicit and both parties are one in the same. One just has different window dressings...
libertas, just read the Dragonfly article, scary but predictable.
When the founders enacted the "right to bear arms" in the constitution it did so as a safeguard against a suppressive government. That same logic can be carried to the government's wiretaping of it's citizens. Surveilance can and should be a two way street, not just the perogative of the police state. There must be numerous people with the tools and ability to listen in, to video tape and expose the hypocrits? There's always a weak spot somewhere in the system, we just need to get creative and fight back, unintimidated.
This is an interesting story that fits right in. It was in the Washington Post.
Dragonfly or Insect Spy? Scientists at Work on Robobugs.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/10/08/AR200710...
I wouldn't put it past them.
Everybody here seems to recognize a totalitarian state when they see (and live in) one. The important fact that clarifies this incomprehsible mess has to do with the US imperial project. In Burma and lots of places people rise up when they have nothing left to loose. The dictators in such places depend on terrorzing their citizens in order to continue looting and enslaving them.
But the US is an uber hegemon. We loot the wealth and resources of other countries which allows us to have a comfortable middle class, at least until recently. Hard to get people to be uppity when they still have the remote in one hand.
We may have had a middle class, but we haven't had a democracy. A meaningful democracy and imperial projects are mutually exclusive. And since WW II the US has interfered signficantly in the affairs of soverign states about 70 times.
There is absolutely no reason to believe the Democrats want to oppose the Republicans on this. They've been supporting this same agenda all along. Clinton expanded domestic spying and federal anti-terror and death penalty laws. Then the Democrats almost unanimously voted for the Patriot Act. They've voted yes on every extension the Bush admin proposes. The Democrats have made no real effort to roll back or repeal any of this.
There is absolutely no reason to think of the Democrats as anything but supporters in this. The Democrats do not 'give in'. They are partners in this from the beginning.
The only answer is to create a new opposition. The Democrats have been dead and gone for 20 years now. A vote for the Democrats is the same damn thing as voting for the Republicans. You are just choosing which hair style you want to see on TV as this stuff just keeps passing and growing and getting worse.
DO NOT VOTE DEMOCRAT in 2008!
I have practically given up that the Democrats will do anything to stop Bush. They just give him everything he demands. I don't think there is anything they can find out; secret memos, lost e-mails, lies, a "smoking gun" or you name it , that will make them take any action. I think if Bush himself admitted that he ordered torture and knew there were no WMD's in Iraq, I don't think they would do anything. So much for our Checks and Balances system of government.
roger carter, Hi cous. Thanks for the encouraging words, but isn't Britain in a worse surveillance state than even the US right now? No offense meant, it was just what I've gathered.
Please tell me that Dennis Kucinich was NOT one of those Dem's who caved in? We need a whole new Congress as well as a new administration. The comments presented above who said that the dems are no better than the GOP are right - - it is high time for some 1776 Revolutionaries!
Citizen1:"I don't even have to read the article. Dems = Bush enabler"
I agree, and it isn't that I don't have to read it, it is that at this moment, I cannot read it, cannot bear to read it. I scanned it, and then started straight with the comments and from the bottom. Love the Zappa quote whitewatersally.
IM BACK,ONLY BECAUSE I JUST READ BUSH WAS TRYING TO OVER RIDE A TEXAS PRISON.BUSH IS DEMANDING THE RELEASE OF A CONVICTED KILLER.A MEXICAN WHO LIVED IN THE STATES MOST HIS LIFE,HE STRANGLED TWO TEENAGE GIRLS TO DEATH.BUSH IS PULLING STRINGS AND OVERSTEPPING AUTHORITY TO GET THIS PRISONER RELEASED.BUSH MUST NEED A KILLER OF LITTLE GIRLS FOR HIS PRIVATE MERCENARIE ARMY !!if there is a god in heaven,please dont let bush get away with this(see the guardianor watchingamerica)
holymoly,i cant argue with that..yes,the enemy is within,the whole bushclan just needs to go,it is them and their kind messing up the place..population control should begin and end with them.iammyself,i am going to repeat this just for you...frank zappa said"FREEDOM IS JUST AN ILLUSION THAT WILL CONTINUE ONLY AS LONG AS IT IS PROFITABLE.WHEN IT IS NO LONGER PROFITABLE...THEY WILL CLEAR THE STAGE,TAKE DOWN THE SCENERY AND PULL BACK THE CURTAINS..THEN YOU WILL SEE THE BRICK WALL" goodnight,frankzappa..I AM SALLY, THE ZAPPACRAT
Thanks old goat for the link. Thanks for reminding us that "soft on terrorism" won't cut it. Thanks for reminding us that it is Rove who got his butt kicked by the voters when his "terror" fearmongering strategy failed.
EMBRACE YOUR FEAR. FEAR IS A SIGN OF LIFE. THE DEAD DO NOT FEAR.
Now if the dems would just listen to Feingold.
holymoly: Thanks. Took the words right out of my mouth.
whitewatersally: And how do you folks get employers to stop deducting taxes from my check and turning the money over to the federal government?
Ranting is good! It keeps me from imploding.
Whitewatersally says: national security ?eavesdropping is not national security..securing our ports and borders,are…
That would suppose that our enemies actually come from without---that is buying into the lie. Did our enemy outside the borders cause our defense mechanism to stand down on 9/11? The things that happened on 9-11 had to be orchestrated by a sophisticated group--not cave dwellers from Afghanistan.
Our borders are basically as unprotected as always--yet the only terrorists attacks we have had have government fingerprints all over them. Torture is not to get information out of terrorists, it is to frighten us and to let us know they can do whatever they damn well please. If they can frighten enough people, they will continue to surrender their freedoms without a fight.
Of course, we have done so much evil in this world now, that it would not surprise me if someone tries to retaliate. But if something does happen, I'll be looking at that bunch in DC first--chances are, they are up to their old tricks. Muslim patsies with box cutters brought down all those buildings in NY. Right!
this was linked on TomPaine - Salon by Greenwald
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/08/06/rove/index.html
iammyself..you are here ranting,as well.i have done everything within my power not to feed the beast for 40 years.i have written letters,demonstrated,gotten teargassed,beat and gone to jail..etc..etc..over the years i have tried...because i identified the enemywithin,very early in life..all of our cars here in florida should be running on solar power,already..i do not believe the technology does not exist..sunshine is something we got plenty of,here.if bush has his way..the sun wont shine.we all need to go with wind,water and sun energy..while we still have the sun and the wind and the rain,and they remain free.we do not need oil to live,we cant drink it.and yes,you are so correct..hit them where it hurts..DONT EVEN FILE TAXES THIS YEAR !!there is something comforting about ranting..it is our collective voices screaming out that we hate this evil being committed in our names and we hate every thing the bushmasters have done and here at commondreams...is our testimony and our evidence against them !!!!
Nader2000: you may be right, in which case, we have just the government we deserve. But I hardly see how things would be different if we have the "preferrable" candidate--especially if you mean Hillary "he-mislead-me-"Clinton. Who wants someone so stupid that Bush could mislead her for President--but, of course, she was not stupid--she is lying. We've had enough of that out of the current occupant of the White House. No, if the country has to go down the sinkhole, let it be a repug who does it and not with someone who received my vote. I can't help it if Americans vote for a stupid/lying man/woman, With these two choices--Clinton or Bush--lesser of two evils IS nonsense--they are about the same. If they are my only choice, I'll stay home, and blog my blues on Common Dreams.
Eventually, it will be like Jefferson said in the Declaration:
"People are more disposed to suffer while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are long accoustomed."
Eventually the American people will get enough and put a stop to it--of course, it may get really dirty first--as in Germany WWII, dirty. Right now, he is still mainly going after Muslins or people of brown skin, so most of the jerks in this country feel relatively safe.
If I am wrong, well, it was a good experiment in Republican government--and there was nothing we could do about it anyway--especially if our "solution" was to vote for a warmonger like Clinton--because obviously she is part of the same gang who have gotten us into the mess we are in. YOU need to understand that, while we are clarifying things for one another.
Oh, and you use the phrase "moderate dems"--would you like to elaborate??? Are you talking about that "moderate dem" that ran with Al Gore last time???
And you say Congress is doing what the voters want? Is that why they turned out the Repugs last time--so that the Dems could act just like them???? People put the dems in and get the same old crap--that is bullshit about looking soft on terrorism. People voted them IN and the others OUT--BUT IT DID NO GOOD or so little it is hard to see it. SO YOU WANT US TO VOTE IN MORE OF THE SAME! Isn't that the definition of insanity?
Gawd...here we go again.
Isn't this just a bunch of wasted energy and pixelated ranting? I mean, what do you really expect? Who do you think you are? Where do you think you live? What kind of society do you think this is?
If you REALLY look into those questions, you'll see that the Dems have no choice. Think Kucinich will be able to do more if he's prez? He'll be assassinated!
Come...on...people! This is a corporate/fascist state and has been for a long time. The Dems are doing as their masters bid them. There are occasional changes...by chance or simply to keep up the illusion of democracy. It doesn't exist. It never existed. It may never exist unless we really try to see that we've been smoked and have been living a fool's dream.
Want to really change things? Change yourself! Stop feeding the beast. Stop consuming so fucking much! Use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without. Stop paying war taxes, or if you have the nads, all taxes (I'm working on this one).
Take the pill that takes you down the rabbit hole that you'll never come out of. We need to pull the wool off our eyes and see anew!
...or...we can just keep ranting...
and it seems the citezenry are UNWINNLING to extend those powers to the populace.
LONG LIVE THE REVOLUTION!
holymoly..i want to vote for dennis k. i just want to know what the hell he intends to do concerning iran,since bush has gone and f8cked that up royally,too.no offense,but i do think men have not done a very good job due to lack of 'civilization'and 'nuturing'and i do believe,were it not for woman,they still would be living in caves,with a 6-pack and a remote control.do you know where alot of the money to pay off the victims of pedophile catholic priests,is coming from ?from the sale of convents across the nation....and not one..no,not one nun,has ever been accused of a crime,pedophilia or otherwise !!
Kristina40, that's exactly the kind of thing we need, people talking to people, and people like you reporting what you hear. Very cool.
Makes you wonder though, he's a Christian wing nut, thinks the IRS is a sham, supports McVeigh and the overthrow of government, AND works for Blackwater. I wonder if his views are company policy?
Dude they tap your brokers line...You think they are gonna stop?
Its gonna be a long day till the sun shines free again!
Where are the minutemen when we need them? Reagan you BITCH!
Canuck Chuck: "facilitate'? Let's try "participate". "Slide into"? We are already there. Just a few finishing touches on the fascism thing. "Overshot" needs to be added. They forgot about or didn't see the cliff stright ahead! OOPS!! Too late. Momentum wins by a length! CRASH!!!! Game over.
Master Shakes: Why would he need line item veto power? How silly. The Current Occupant already has his illegal signing statements. Unless of course Congress makes the line item veto retroactive so the signing statements are no longer illegal. Hmmmm...Okay, now I get it.
Daniel Shays: White Rose, "Socialism demands participatory government."
Does that include The Union of Soviet Socialist Republics when Stalin was dictator?
Calling a system socialism doesn't make it so. Nazi is short for National Socialism. Both were brutal dictatorships. The only difference was that the "corporations" were owned by Stalin's state, whereas, to start with, the Junkers thought they owned Hitler.
lucas, thanks for the laugh.
whitewatersally: what about a brit for first lady? If I'm allowed to vote, Kucinich seems to be our best bet.
I don't even have to read the article.
Dems = Bush enabler
"...the emerging measures reflect the reality confronting the Democrats.
Although willing to oppose the White House on the Iraq war, they remain nervous that they will be called soft on terrorism if they insist on strict curbs on gathering intelligence."
I just LOVE how you all spin this as the "cowardice" or "spinelessness" or "corporate" or "class" loyalties of "the Democrats," when what it says, in fact, is that some MEMBERS OF CONGRESS who were elected on "Democratic Party" tickets (and incidentally, not all of them) are ready to approve a COMPROMISE on this issue because that's where they perceive THEIR CONSTITUTENTS - the VOTERS to be. That is, they are unwilling to oppose what they perceive to be the WILL OF THE VOTERS (whether that perception is correct or not).
And then you go and argue for splitting the left-of-center vote further by peeling off the left end into a feckless "Green Party." Boy, that'll show 'em, won't it?
No, it won't. All it will do is let you jokers keep on playing out your little play politics fantasy game, exploiting the idealistic but sadly clueless. Oh, and further convince moderate Dems that they may as well ignore the Left.
Folks, you've got to understand this. The problem isn't "the Democrats", it's more the media, and ultimately it's We the People, particularly the voters. Half of us supported George W. Bush, twice. A few percent of us voted for Nader, and no more than this would ever support a split-off Left party.
Half of us will support a "Democratic" nominee, and the only way to move this Congress and our government to the left is to get more progressives nominated as Democrats, and then get them elected - and yes, when we fail to get the most progressive possible nominee for office, to support the PREFERABLE candidate (forget this "lesser evil" nonsense).
That's the way it is, and no amount of rhetoric or wishing or powertrip fantasy is going to change it.
OK, I had a very strange talk with a (of all people) Blackwater Op. He's a customer at my bar and I thought when I first met him there was something off about his story. He originally told me he worked for a "food service" company but had witnessed some things and wanted to blow the whistle but he quit. He and I have had some lengthy political conversations before and we agree on some things but he is a Christian wing nut so we disagree on alot of other things. He is aware of the Fed and it's evil presence, he is also aware the IRS is a complete sham, he is a supporter of McVeigh and claims he was trying to start a revolt against the government. He finally came clean today when I was railing on about Blackwater and told me "I work for Blackwater", I wish I could have picked his brain some more but my shift was over and he's shipping back out tomorrow, I assume to Iraq. He also told me we are being lied to about the death tolls, he said Blackwater alone has had 750 killed. I think he really wants out but he said he has to believe in this country or what is left? I told him you can still believe in your country and try to fix it to be a nation that truly serves justice. He said one of the Blackwater guys that was killed and beheaded was a friend of his and he has real issues with Muslims. I asked him what he thought Americans would do to a people that invaded our country and killed our women and children to the tune of 600,000 people? I doubt I got through to him, but I think I planted a seed...
Best part is ALL THROUGHOUT the republican debate today, they talked about the line item veto...
Unreal. Give MORE SWEEEPING UNPRECEDENTED powers to the executive branch!?!?! A few more years in the sun and this is going to legitimately qualify as a dictatorship led country.
dear roger,we need a leader,would you like the job ? it has come to the point where we need to 'outsource'all our top positions in government and i would rather have a brit for pres. than a candidate from china.we are being held hostage by the most evil wraiths....they are almost thru killing off anything that moves in iraq..they got iran in their sights..and even the american people are on their'to do'list.
You know? A funny thing happened on the way to a democratic majority.
You fill in the rest, please, oh ! i see you already have.
anney, Aaron Russo knew what he was talking about. http://www.freedomtofascism.com/
roger carter,
As you imply, the fascist takeover is borderless. It's centered in the corporatocracy of the US but the multinationals are everywhere. It's not just an American struggle, it's a worldwide one. You, in Britain, are a part of the same struggle to rid the world of warfare states which are puppets to the corporate powers that dominate this planet
One day the worldwide anthem will be "Imagine".
Earth to the Democratic Congress: wake up. The reason that people in this country poll well for "fighting terrorism" as an issue is that the doublethink that your party allowed to take hold in their minds is still there. However - people are *not* stupid, as your frontrunner at present seems to think. All people want is to make sure that the bogeyman doesn't blow them up in their beds, which is not the same as wanting to have civil liberties curtailed in the process of assuaging that (admittedly all but non-existent) problem. Having a spine and standing up to the Repugnicans will poll much better than going all gooey every time the brownshirts tell you to goosestep. Nobody likes a coward, and people are waking up. Are you?
But if you want to keep down your present path, fine. If you don't start running the country, we're going to start running it for you - which means you'll be out of a job. But at least we'll all sleep well at night, knowing that we addressed the problem of the world's biggest abettors of the world's biggest terrorist organization by voting them out of office.
Keep this up, and a hot seat at the Hague is guaranteed to be yours. Enjoy your time in the Hamptons, while it lasts...
"Demo-rats seem ready to facilitate USA's Bush-led slide into Fascism"
Those who held up the "Patriot" Act, got a little dose of white powder in the mail--and voila! the Act went right on through. It was weapons grade--which meant it came from a U.S. Government-sponsored lab--yet, everyone pretends like it didn't happen. FBI guy in charge gets big promotion. Like "hellava job, Brownie" in New Orleans. Everytime the officials fail the country dismally, they get medals and promotions.
on 9-11, 3,000 Americans and guests killed--vaporized--did I say vaporized--I shall always remind people that they were vaporized. Buildings come straight down after volcano-like eruptions. Looks like somebody in our government is playing for keeps and our Congressmen and women have never been known for their bravery. Greatest crimes in our history go uninvestigated or have only a sham investigation--which speaks volumes.
Let me take this opportunity to thank the History Channel for their ridiculous display of government boot-licking. They actually did the 9-11 Truth movement a great favor. Anyone watching that propaganda piece had to get suspicious. I checked out their blog right afterward, and lots of people were spurred into doing their own research by the sheer imbalance of the program. Thanks History Channel, Hearst Publishing (Popular Mechanics) and NBC/Disney owners. You protested way too much, and a lot of folks got it.
Roger Carter: Thanks for the understanding. We all need to know if anybody on the "outside" really understands what the American PEOPLE are up against here in the US. Your observations are spot on. And the uprising HAS to happen! It is the ONLY solution at this late date.
roger carter - excellent question.
What the "new continent" has is a mixture of all Peoples from many places. This makes us unpredictable and vulnerable, but it also makes us strong if we are receptive to our best notions.....
We can be so much better.......we may be, and if we do, there need to be reparations.........
People, let us remember that we all want Peace and Harmony. Don't we????
Peace,
Ken Hausle
Im a brit and am constantly encouraged by the insight and vehemence expressed here as you guys surely are fighting for your freedom - undergoing relentless onslaught by the far right. How the hell can you STOP this short of an uprising is beyond me. You have no resources other than your fine minds and patriotism, no logistics, no cohesive leadership,little if any access to control of the media or communications ...and the awful thing for the rest of the world is simply that if Fascist USA totally arrives there is no hope for the rest of us. Witness a New Labour government ten years on ...not very much socialism left in their creed ...just more of corporatism a la Bush/necons. Sorry, I have no answers.............just more observations.........GOD BLESS AMERICA and us all!
@Grumbler"A third party strategy is a losing strategy."
Isn't America losing already be continually electing the same clowns to Congress and the Presidency that keep on selling us out the highest bidder?
This most important question to ask yourself on election day is not "which candidate won?" but instead, "Did *I* win?"
People who support the Bush-Cheney Crime Syndicate lie and say "Muslims admitted to doing 9/11." What are their names, by the way? Does that mean, according to the war supporters, that it's okay to kill any Muslim? Even unarmed men and women and children? Blackwater just shot and killed two Iraqi women today who were no threat.
$$$$$ War and killing $$$$$ is profitable according to sad, evil people. :(
I first saw this story this morning in the New York Times on-line. The summary under the header said, "Democrats remain nervous that they will be called soft on terrorism if they insist on strict curbs on gathering intelligence."
Was there any reason to read further? I did, but found that my first suspicion was justified. Nothing substantial was added.
The headline and summary carried the meaning complete. And the word "nervous" seemed almost on track. It was overly mild, of course. Any of the following words or phrases would have been more apt: "pathological," "paranoid," "care
too much what dumb people think," "sheeple."
That's what we've got in America right now, administratively speaking. The people who run us, Republican or Democratic, are extremely neurotic, even deranged.
We need a resurgence of the liberal arts, along with well-balanced individuals like Mrs. Miniver of British fictive fame. We don't want to be like the neurotic Republicans in "The Masque of the Red Death" by Edgar Allan Poe.
That story is about nobles in a fortress doing anything in their power to keep the plague/terror out. What's going to happen to them is a foregone conclusion.
The non-neurotic Mrs. Miniver would go about her business. If the person on her left was transformed into a blood patch, she would do
what she could, but, essentially, would continue going about her business.
We need people of sound mental health who are not easily jerked this way and that.
Pass notes.
How to get their panties in a wad.
Is there going to be vote? Tell me again what elections in this country accomplish for the people? What are all those gulags that Haliburton is building across the US for again? And what about the HUGE Blackwater military base being built in San Diego County? Rule of law; does it exist anymore? Bill of Rights? Constitution?
At this point the whole body politic is rotten to the core. No matter what party. It doesn't even matter who is to blame or how we got here. The wave of the American experiment crested a while back. The breaker can no longer be stopped. I'll fight to the end but I know my efforts are in vein. There will not be revolution until every American feels the pain personally. And that pain is coming to a neighborhood near you very soon. All the pieces are in place for an economic collapse. An attack on Iran or a "red flag" event will just hasten it.
The funny thing is that I am no longer depressed about the inevitable. I know that a peoples' true revolution is the only medicine that can precipitate what needs to be done to cure what ails this country. And there will be no revolution until ALL of the people wake up and HAVE to fight together to survive. Of course, those that are looking forward to "The Rapture" probably won't be much help.
The only thing left for us to do now is prepare. Put together the essentials that you and yours will need for several months. Don't forget the seeds for community gardens. Make sure you have a bicycle. Get to know your neighbors. We are all in this sinking boat together and everybody is going to have to help bail.
Peace and Good Luck
Geesh, this is depressing! Less than a year ago, I thought we'd won. A third party strategy is a losing strategy. However, if the neocons do break away, it could then be a four-way race, and we could be in for a tecktonic shift in our country's future.
Congressional Dems are afraid of their own shadow. So much for true patriotism and such trivialities as upholding the US Constitution, Bill Of Rights, The Geneva Convention, and other International laws.
Everywhere I go and everyone I meet - Democrat and Republican - are angry their respective parties don't stop the insanity; refuse to hold the criminals in charge accountable for their crimes.
As far as Democrats . . . Hillary-Dillary has got a hell of a surprize when citizens refuse to vote for her, or anyone who extends spying on common citizens and plans to wage war far into the future. There are a lot of citizens who simply will no longer vote for the lesser of two evils.
While I'm on the subject, how is it being "soft on terror" when Iraqis were and are no threat to the U.S.? No weapons of mass destruction, no plans to attack the U.S. or anyone else, so why do U.S. politicians pretend there is a link between Iraq and terrorism?? That goes for BOTH Republicans and Democrats.
Democrats just want to go along with warmongering, war