Subscribe to Common Dreams News Updates
Most Popular This Week
Popular content
Today's Top News
No Deal
I hate to say this, but looking at the plan as leaked, I have to say no deal. Not unless Treasury explains, very clearly, why this is supposed to work, other than through having taxpayers pay premium prices for lousy assets.
As I posted earlier today, it seems all too likely that a “fair price” for mortgage-related assets will still leave much of the financial sector in trouble. And there’s nothing at all in the draft that says what happens next; although I do notice that there’s nothing in the plan requiring Treasury to pay a fair market price. So is the plan to pay premium prices to the most troubled institutions? Or is the hope that restoring liquidity will magically make the problem go away?
Here’s the thing: historically, financial system rescues have involved seizing the troubled institutions and guaranteeing their debts; only after that did the government try to repackage and sell their assets. The feds took over S&Ls first, protecting their depositors, then transferred their bad assets to the RTC. The Swedes took over troubled banks, again protecting their depositors, before transferring their assets to their equivalent institutions.
The Treasury plan, by contrast, looks like an attempt to restore confidence in the financial system — that is, convince creditors of troubled institutions that everything’s OK — simply by buying assets off these institutions. This will only work if the prices Treasury pays are much higher than current market prices; that, in turn, can only be true either if this is mainly a liquidity problem — which seems doubtful — or if Treasury is going to be paying a huge premium, in effect throwing taxpayers’ money at the financial world.
And there’s no quid pro quo here — nothing that gives taxpayers a stake in the upside, nothing that ensures that the money is used to stabilize the system rather than reward the undeserving.
I hope I’m wrong about this. But let me say it again: Treasury needs to explain why this is supposed to work — not try to panic Congress into giving it a blank check. Otherwise, no deal.



69 Comments so far
Show AllThis needs to be looked at much closer before the congress hands over the taxpayers money.. Something is up here.
I get a strong feeling that Paulson is trying to ram this through using the fear of an economic meltdown as the reason. Not that this is not real possibility if do not act.
But I find it hard to believe that they did not know this was coming for a longtime,when their have been people trying to point out that their was a problem for years.
To point out, that we could not continue to rack up this huge amount of debt, without consequences.
Also get the feeling that those on Wallstreet knew in the end that the hand of the Uncle Sam would come to the rescue. In the meanwhile they made huge profits and cashed big bonus checks.
Sometime ago I was reading a financial blog and a woman stated that she had a very good friend who worked on Wallstreet, that told her "that they cannot let us fail, we nothing to worry about".
Maybe we should invade two or three more countries. I'm not exactly sure how, but I think it would help. We're only spending $12 billion a month on Iraq and Afghanistan. Thats not enough.
-- EKATON --
Maybe two or three countries should invade us and give us a fucking regime change.
That would be change we could believe in.
Congress should demand the resignations of Bush, Cheney, and Paulson NOW as a prerequisite for moving forward on this before a new administration takes over.
Dream on. Congress' job is to protect corporations, even when they fail. We'll pick up the tab. No problem. We are the American people! We love being screwed. We protect and cherish our duopoly system. Oh, sure, we complain, but really, for us, nothing is better than a good old fashioned "hopes and dreams" speech to get us all into the proper line. Just like school.
I do believe the timing of this is very much on purpose. I do believe fear tactics are being used to ram this through without enough thought. SLOW DOWN! Read the fine print, and DEMOCRATS, please grow a spine and say NO DEAL!!!!!!
Progressives continue to depict the Democrats as "spineless,"- makes them seem more helpless doesn't it? I say, let's stop using these terms. These people are anything but. They have plenty of spine when it comes to screwing you and me.
I asked my Senator(D), why he doesn't support single-payer health care for all, considering the majority of Americans want it, and a huge majority of Democrats want it. His answer was this, verbatim: "I don't think the American people are ready for single payer health care."
That's spine folks!
Now, maybe we ought to get some spine ourselves ..... If not now, when?
Vote Nader 08!
Why not just take the money back from them that stole it? Then there'd be plenty to "save" the financial system, and they WOULD have something to worry about.
Oh, yeah, I'm dreaming: wrong country, wrong election.
Oregoncharles
If "the taxpayers" knew the numbers, they'd be rioting in the streets.
Every $1 trillion "our" government "spends" to "save" their friends translates to $8000 per taxpayer (rounded up, based on 130 million taxpayers. Ignore the 'per citizen" numbers - non-taxpayers are not relevant.)
So far, just this year, "our" government has promised their friends over $3 trillion of taxpayer money (that we actually know of) in return for, what everyone from the NYT to the WSJ refers to as "toxic assets."
That's $24,000 per taxpayer, whose average income is $32,000/year - leaving the average taxpayer with a net-of-gross of $8000K for 08. Minus taxes at, say, a medium 25% (of $32K=$7000,) and, this year, the average taxpayer will take home an astounding $1000, or about 80 bucks a month. (And a handful of toxic assets!)
How many taxpayers voted to give AIG, Fannie, Fredie, and the rest basically their entire year's earnings as a thank you for robbing us blind?
Of course, add in another $8K for the Pentagon ($1 trillion budget,) another $8K for Iraq/Afghanistan ($1 trillion spent so far,) and another $24K to cover the $3 trillion 08 Fed budget...
And every taxpayer is on the hook - this year only, remember - for at least $64,000 apiece, or twice the average income.
Toss in each taxpayer's share of the National Debt, now approaching $10 trillion, or another $80,000 per tp... for a total of $144,000, or nearly 5 years worth of the average taxpayer's income.
These are the real, raw painful numbers that need to be shouted to every sucker - er, I mean taxpayer - in America RIGHT NOW. Maybe, just maybe, We The People will wake the f**k up and, you know, revolt or something...
Make Way For the Money Ball
Make way for the money ball
it’s a juggernaut of greed
it’s a runaway picking up speed
Make way for the money wrecking ball
selling short on the profit of the fall
the money ball overwhelms us all
The money ball is our treadmill
our treadmill for the man
the corporate puppeteers for Uncle Sam
with more poppy fields blooming in Afghanistan
to maximize the profit
or.......
forget the pain
Make way for the money ball
it’s awesome shock indeed
bomb rebuild and feed
bomb rebuild and feed
The snowballing money ball free fall
is cheered on by the neo liberal republican dons
and media cons who feed on wars
called spreading freedom
Since there is no other way
make way for the money ball
help TINA!.... full spectrum stupidity...
it’s total dominance on the way
Make way for the money ball
it’s a juggernaut of greed
it’s a runaway picking up speed
Don’t jig or jog just ‘duck and cover’
the money ball juggernaut just flattened the clover
and it ain’t going to stop for the ‘cliffs of Dover’
It feeds for nukes and neo con pukes
tumbling trump towers and freedom spooks
as it rolls on yellow ribbons
it’s a runaway....
Make way for the money ball
while it builds another wall
and squeezes those with least
for their ‘duck and cover’ is our bread and butter
Make way for the money ball
as it inflates as if turned on by yeast
don’t spurn the beast with
the ‘least of these’
Parsimony won’t deter the money ball
Us & the marks get inflated with the fall
might as well eat drink and be merry
and build another wall
If you don’t see the glow of dawn
you may miss the money ball
for....
it’s a runaway
Financial Collapse Just in Time for a Humongous Payoff...
The numbers are too big for most of us to comprehend.
Bush/Cheney and their compliant Congress are paying off American mega-banks in the amount of one trillion dollars, and "trillion" is an easy little word to say.
$1,000,000,000,000.00
Try writing that on a check! Seriously, try it! I bet you thought you could squeeze in all those zeros if you started really small. Now try it again! Get a sharper pencil or a finer point pen...
$1,000,000,000,000.00
It cost $650,000,000 to build the Mall of America, and we're giving 1,500 Malls of America to the banks! 30 Malls of America for every state, including Alaska, and when you finish fitting 30 Malls of America into Alaska, some very small towns like Wasilla will have their very own mega-mall.
And it's all happening just in time for the out-going Bush/Cheney administration and their compliant Congress to see it through. What a beautiful coincidence!
Six weeks from now Barack Obama will be elected President of the United States, and he may even be elected by such a large margin that Republicans can't steal the election. Would Barack Obama be as quick to endorse a trillion-dollar pay off for the mega-banks? Nobody knows.
So the time is now, and there's barely enough time left for Bush/Cheney to get the job done.
You can't just haul a trillion dollars out of the Treasury and hand it to the banks, because there isn't a trillion dollars in the United States Treasury, and there isn't even much real money left in the banks.
Before you can pay off the banks, you have to create the money, out of thin air, out of nothing, out of the future. This is fiat currency with a vengeance, and like all other fiat currency it's based on trust in the governmentment that issues it.
It's a trillion dollars of faith-based currency, and who better to create it than a couple of Christian statesmen like George W. Bush and Dick Cheney!
So the bottom has fallen out of financial derivatives just in time for Bush/Cheney to arrange for the biggest pay-off in the history of the world, and if you see anything beyond a coincidence in any of it, you're probably just another conspiracy-theorist in a tin-foil hat.
Jacob Freeze
The actual language of the various proposals is hard to comprehend for non-economists like me, so I'm happy to defer to Paul Krugman's judgement, but...
While I was reading a hand-out from Chuck Schumer's office, I suddenly remembered one of Beavis and Butthead's comments on some lame-o music video:
If you play it backward, it says "This sucks."
Jacob Freeze
Alan MacDonald
Yes, Jacob, you are absolutely right that this 'smash and grab' for cash is precisely timed to be rushed at the end of the Bush gang's regime --- since their 'smash and grab' for oil in the Iraq war plot has not earned what they had hoped.
You are also correct that the un-Constitutional looting authority being given to Paulson had to be carefully planned and will definately be used to buy the HEDGE FUND whores' valueless derivative instruments --- which they have created out of thin air as a modern form of alchemy.
On Sunday morning's talk shows Paulson refused to answer or 'take off the table' the possibility that the Treasury's new (un-Contitutional) authority to 'buy assets' from investment firms would extend to HEDGE FUNDS.
As reported thereafter in the print news wires:
"Paulson also said that the intent of the plan submitted to Congress "RIGHT NOW wouldn't be to buy from hedge funds" -- private investment funds that specialize in aggressive risk-taking." (emphasis added)
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5h-m2tgAY5HFX2q2zO2GFukGjgqxA
Thanks for the link.
As you say, the fact that public planning doesn't include hedge-fund buy-outs doesn't mean that a different provision can't be slipped into bill at the last moment. This is how we got into the mess we're in, when Phil Gramm deregulated banks in a 200 page addendum to a bill that almost nobody even noticed at the time.
Jacob Freeze
Geeze, Krugman is on mark and even more consise than normal. In six very short graphs he punches it home -- this bailout is pork on a scale which even the mililtary must envy...
Frank 1589s point is well taken. However, $8000 per taxpayer is no problem because that is taken out the backdoor -- you just give them $800 tax rebate in the front door and they will quiet down, that is what our masters figure, anyway...
But when there are, umn, unhappy people in the streets, what then? The 700 billion Paulson is suppossed to get is to be used at his discretion, with no questions asked or oversight at all...
______
There's a glory in the morning because the earth turns 'round and a promise in the evening when the sun goes down
Alan MacDonald
Dr. Krugman, a very simple example of the market's perfect 'invisible hand' when provided with accurate 'cost signals' can easily prove that the government will pay too much for these assets, that the public will be the rube in this confidence game 'three card monte' of "following the money", and that this will end badly.
Suppose that we simply substitute the assets of the American car stock of huge, fuel consuming SUV's for the American housing stock of McMansion sized fuel consuming homes.
The invisible hand of the market system, when provided with the accurate 'cost data' on energy, will automatically and continually discount the real value of both SUV's and oversized homes ---- and for precisely the same reason.
Thus the FEDs will never get a higher value for housing mortgage assets than they pay in this bailout --- just as GMAC will never get more for its stock of off-lease SUV hogs that it is stuck with.
Therefore, the costs of carbon based energy over coming years is a clear and unarguable 'cost signal' to the market that America's globally double sized car stock, as well as America's double sized housing stock will not go up (or even stay level in value) after simply being bought by the government.
This "follow the money" three card monte shell game is doomed by the cost signals of energy before the con(fidence) man, enthusiastic shill, and marked rubes even begin to play.
It's simply taxation without representation. Perhaps it's time to spill the tea.
You better believe Wall St. deserves a blank check as much as the Pentagon deserves a blank check. And if you don't, then O'Bama's Brownshirts will make you believe.
&YYY&
What works for the privatised government is what has already worked, and so the rescue packages are designed to do the same thing that the financial crisis has done already. That is, take the publics money and throw it on the inflationary debt heap. This will not save the VS dollar. But it will prevent investment in anything better that the money could have managed, such as local industry and innovation in the economy. Since its the publics money, it is throwing out the good money after the bad into the fire of criminal activity.
The war against the financial meltdown and the war against justice and the war against terrorism and the war against the public. Always fighting the war of wars, the pirate government sails the high seas of bankruptcy, swindling its money from one crisis to the next.
Bush and the cabal of vampires that are sucking this nation dry never miss a trick. This $700 billion bailout is just another example of corporate welfare that leaves the taxpayers to clean up the mess while the criminals who lied and thieved their way to this most recent financial crisis sail off into the sunset with hundreds of millions of dollars. The psychopaths who run our country simply couldn't care less about the devastation they have wrought. I weep for my grandchildren.
Create a crisis, terrorize the population, go to war. Only this time the war is on our wallets. Paulson points out we don't have time to discuss this or include any protections for the taxpayers, we need to just do it now. Sign here. Why does this smell so fishy? I know. It's the same when I get offers too good to be true, and if I don't sign now, they will immediately expire.
Thank you, Paul. As usual, you're right on the money (although I don't agree with you about healthcare - we need HR676).
When the people fear their government there is tyranny,
when the government fears the people there is liberty.
~ Thomas Jefferson
They have applied every trick in the book. They either create disaster or take advantage of it.
It occurs to me tha bush is a horrible MBA. Cheney has been pised off ever since Nixon got (almost ) impeached.
Maybe Cheney (who has houses throughout the world) set about destroying the uS intentionally, adn Bush is just hiss ass puppet.
All this plan tries to do is to attempt to keep the price of Real Estate artificially high. It is only meant to prop up a bubble that never should have existed in the first place upon which these firms and speculators were able to create massive paper wealth.
That all said this MIGHT be an opportunity for Americans. Maybe after all these years of being screwed by the Government in the name of "liberty, Freedom and the free market" more Americans will clue in as to the Criminal nature of the people in charge of running their country.
I am not very hopeful. I go to other boards all of whom claim much the same as the politicians.."yes this all very regretable but it must be done".
This speaks to another fiction and myth, that being that Private Industry is more efficient then Government and the notion that Government should be run like Businesses by Businessmen.
When you create that type of administration, then Government becomes just another Business FOR businessmen.
PK
How come there's been no appreciable discussion in the MSM about alternatives to the present plan for the Gov't to buy the near-worthless liabilities?
For some alternatives see:
http://yglesias.thinkprogress.org/archives/2008/09/mallaby_this_deal_stinks.php#comments
Please, Mr. Paulson, don't let the big boogieman Great Depression get us. With the Iraq war I and most other CDers had time to realize we were being sold a pig in a poke, but now we must decide so quickly and nearly none of us has a clue. I do know that for many years I have trusted Paul Krugman to give us his best opinion and he's never failed me in that trust. I'd follow his advise before any other in the Bush Administration.
Progressives continue to depict the Democrats as "spineless,"- makes them seem more helpless doesn't it? I say, let's stop using these terms. These people are anything but. They have plenty of spine when it comes to screwing you and me.
I asked my Senator(D), why he doesn't support single-payer health care for all, considering the majority of Americans want it, and a huge majority of Democrats want it. His answer was this, verbatim: "I don't think the American people are ready for single payer health care."
That's spine folks!
Now, maybe we ought to get some spine ourselves ..... If not now, when?
Vote Nader 08!
Has anyone seen Obama's "statement" about this. Before we agree to Mr. Paulson's plan we want...all kinds of money for housing bailouts, etc., etc.,
1. There is no money
2. There is no money
3. There is no money
When will somebody say we can have empire or national security. We can't have both. Obama's comments are typical of Dems for 30 years. They give the R's whatever they want as long as they can get some crumbs. And they always cooperate on these financial thefts.
sierra7
Hey, we can print it!!!! Paper's cheeeeeeeeep!!!!
cassandra September 21st, 2008 7:03 pm
"Has anyone seen Obama's "statement" about this. Before we agree to Mr. Paulson's plan we want...all kinds of money for housing bailouts, etc., etc.,
1. There is no money
2. There is no money
3. There is no money"
The government could print it but then you'd need a truck to take enough of it to a store to buy a loaf of bread.
Lobo Gris
STOP THE WAR AND YOU WILL HAVE YOUR MONEY!
And don't forget to rescind those tax cuts for the wealthy and corporate elites. Then you'll have more money there !
One stickey little question--if the FED nationalizes all of the mortgages, who will pay local property taxes on forclosures?
US!
I don't understand finance very well (a trait I am sure I share with the majority of Americans). I am just a scientist, who relies on objective, repeatable data. All these suggestions (from Govt., Wall Street and Independents) about what to do in response to the crisis seem to rely less on an objective approach, and more on the instinct (which is notoriously unreliable).
This does not instill in me a lot of confidence for those making decisions, and that makes me nervous. I guess I'll be holding my lucky charm and security blanket a little tighter over the next several months.
As a scientist, I'm sure you'll appreciate how this "experiment" has reproduced the result of the earlier, more modest, iteration: the savings & loan collapses of the late 80s and early 90s. Here too, it seems, financial products called derivatives (designed by mathematicians who don't know anything about economics. Hey, it's just a formula) played a role. That little financial fiasco, in which John McCain was a player insofar as he tried to pull the regulatory tentacles off of his friend Charles Keating long enough to turn an investigation into an industry-wide collapse, resulted in tens of thousands of people, mostly seniors, losing their life savings. Reforms were put in place, and it only took the de-regulators until 1999 to remove them, along with regulations put in place during the Great Depression. Less than a decade on, I think we have proof in reproducible results that when you remove the regulations, bankers and other wheeler dealers will cheat, lie, and steal and by their short-sighted, self-serving actions, bring about another financial collapse.
Thanks for taking the time to explain this.
Your words speak true, but I also think it safe to say that removing, or loosening, regulations does not always lead to collapse, i.e., financial systems do not obey the laws of gravity. They are complex systems. Having said that, it seems a more pragmatic approach would be to gradually loosen controls and observe the system, being ready to tighten the reigns if necessary. Removing completely all regulations in one pass is foolish, and arguably criminal.
How about this. Government can offer to buy the property of anyone facing foreclosure by using money it creates without debt (out of thin air like the Fed does), like Lincoln did with the Greenbacks (just have to make it legal tender for all domestic payments). The homeowner can then stay in the house, paying rent (say 20% of their income) and the property taxes and insurance.
This eliminates foreclosure, gives the banks back the principal which they created, and prevents people from being thrown out of their homes, and ensures local communities get their property taxes.
Only losers are the Fed and their shareholders in the system who do not get to create this money. The only losses are the interest which does not get paid. But since nobody creates money for the interest, thats no great loss. Of course, the securities based on these mortgages that get sold are devalued somewhat since no interest is being paid, but at least the losses are minimized, and the principal is salvaged.
Makes more sense than what Paulson proposes.
And where does government get its money to buy the property from? Either the taxpayers will be forced to pay up now or whatever country we're borrowing from will force us to do it down the road? Would you mind posting a reference to what you're even talking about because it just doesn't make sense or I have something really new to learn.
the key is... "by using money it creates without debt"
Folks may be used to the idea that money is created by private banks and then loaned to nations as debt, but there is nothing other than duplicitous power brokers and compliant citizenships that need make that so. From time to time, governments (including our own) have issued their own money. It is an interesting topic to research, but beware...
I suggest you start with Ellen Brown, she has some good articles and a book.
http://www.webofdebt.com/articles/dollar-deception.php
The Federal Reserve System creates money out of thin air. From loans. When the government sells them Treasuries, what is that, simply a promise to pay with interest. The Fed buy it with money they create. The commercial banks do the same with mortgages and other loans.
Money is debt. If we can issue Treasuries for the Fed to create money, we can issue our own money, interest free.
This kind of thing gets Presidents killed though.
It gets the money by printing it. Essentially. It's called "fiat money". The value of it comes from reducing the value of all the other dollars - by instant inflation.
http://www.users.bigpond.com/pmurray
http://www.paulmurray.id.au/ageofworms
Creating money in times when there is less than full employment is not inflationary. Much, not all, of todays inflation is caused by speculation in commodity markets and cartel/monoply pricing practices.
Inflation also comes from the interest on debt, because the system does not create money for the interest, so debt expands as does the money supply, which is inflationary. In our current system, debt is money. At a given rate of money supply (debt) growth, if interest rates are low, inflation will also be low. If interest rates increase, watch out.
If government creates money w/o debt in a time when there is less than full employment, no inflation will result.
The republican fascist see the economic crash (caused by their greedy deregulation) coming---they will blame the democratic party for said crash if they don't sign on to the bailout. This puts the democrats in a no-win situation. If they go along they look like capitulating fools. If they don't sign on, it's all their fault.
Or they could try being truly oppositional.
madcow can only see two solutions to any problem, matti. That's why he's such a rabid democrat.
That would be the first option matti---not signing on to the bailout. Alas, I fear they'll capitulate again, so as not to look like they are responsible for letting it all crash.
Let's all blame Obama for the whole mess---he's one of those democrats.
Paulson is trying to run out the clock before the election; giving Bush one final shot at Iran, therefore, rallying the country for McCain who would be elected during the "wag the dog" show war.
What do you think?
Next thing the republicans (Liars, thieves, and whores) will be selling the citizens (zombies with flat screen tvs and a lot of shiny things) some more prozac to go with thier worthless investments in corporate crime.
Heck of a job Paulie!