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TechnoratiIsraeli fighter jets flew 1,500 kms across the Mediterranean this month, in a dry run for an attack on Iran's nuclear facilities. Tehran has threatened to treat such a raid as a declaration of war. As the Middle East braces itself for a stand-off of epic proportions, how close is the region to that nightmare scenario?
The meeting at the home of Israel's Prime Minister Ehud Olmert was not supposed to be public. The man invited into Olmert's official residence in Jerusalem was Aviam Sela, architect of Operation Opera in 1981, when Israel launched a long-range strike against Iraq's Osirak nuclear reactor. Regarded as a brilliant aviation tactician, in particular in the field of in-flight refuelling, Olmert's office tried to play down the meeting. But the rumours in Israel's defence establishment were already flying.
Sela, according to sources close to the meeting, had been called in so that Olmert could ask his opinion on the likely effectiveness of a similar raid to Opera on the nuclear installations of Iran.
Peace in the Middle East depends on Sela's and Israel's answer. Yesterday, responding to the Israel's increasingly bellicose language, Iran's top Revolutionary Guards Commander, General Mohammad Ali Jafari, warned that it would respond to any attack by hitting Israel with missiles and threatened to control the oil shipping passage through the Straits of Hormuz.
If Israel were to attack it would have to overcome considerable practical problems. There is no one who believes that an attack on Iran's nuclear facilities would be anything like Opera, when eight F-16s and a similar number of F-15s crept into Iraq. For one thing, in pursuing its nuclear ambitions, Iran took note of the Osirak lessons. Its facilities, including a light water reactor at Bushehr and the controversial uranium enrichment process at Natanz, are dispersed and, in the case of Natanz, protected by up to 23 metres of hardened concrete.
To destroy the uranium centrifuge halls at Natanz alone, analysts have argued, might require up to 80 5,000lb penetrating bombs dropped in almost simultaneous pairs to allow the second bomb to burrow through the crater of the first. Opera required just a handful of bombs.
To strike even the bare minimum of so-called target sets associated with Natanz and Bushehr without the assistance of US cruise missiles fired from their ships in the Persian Gulf would require a massive military effort and, according to the Israeli air force's own assessments, might risk the loss of large numbers of its aircraft for a temporary impact.
But the rumours keep circulating and the hushed briefings are multiplying. In the Israeli Prime Minister's traditional round of interviews on the eve of Passover earlier this year, Olmert vowed that Iran 'will not be nuclear'.
Since then, a series of senior Israeli officials have added their own warnings of the threat of an Israeli strike. Most strident has been Deputy Prime Minister Shaul Mofaz who said earlier this month that Israel would have no choice but to attack Iran.
Other officials, too, such as Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni and Israeli ambassador to the US Sallai Meridor, have made less inflammatory remarks but in a similar vein.
If the rhetoric, coming in the midst of an effort by the so-called G5+1 to persuade Iran to accept incentives to suspend uranium enrichment, is alarming, then so too are Israel's ostentatious preparations for war.
Earlier this month, the Israeli Air Force conducted one of the largest aerial exercises in its history, flying 100 F-15 and F-16 fighter jets, supported by midair fuel tankers and rescue helicopters, 1,500kms west over the Mediterranean. That precisely matches the distance from Israel to Iran's nuclear facilities.
And while some of the messages amount to signalling, to warn Iran as well as the EU and the US that Israel does not intend its nuclear monopoly in the Middle East to be challenged, it is clear that Israel has launched an aggressive information campaign apparently designed to soften up public opinion for the case for war, reminiscent of the run-up to the war against Iraq. Indeed, some of the same cast are back on stage, not least the former US ambassador to the UN, John Bolton, who has loudly been making the case for an Israeli strike.
Academics and journalists who have recently visited Israel have come back from meetings convinced the country is getting ready for war. The campaign has been assisted by the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (Aipac) in the US and the Britain-Israel Communications and Research Centre in the UK, two influential Jewish lobby groups who have brought over experts to brief the media.
Last week, Bicom invited journalists to meet Shmuel Bar, a former military intelligence officer and civil servant in the Prime Minister's Office. Now an academic, Bar writes on Iranian defence doctrine. On Monday the same organisation will be hosting a member of Israel's security cabinet, Isaac 'Bouji' Herzog, who once again will answer questions, among other issues, on the threat posed by Iran.
And at the centre of the present flurry of activity is the question of exactly what threat is posed. The National Intelligence Estimate, the official view of the US intelligence community is that Iran ceased work on its secret weapons programme in 2003 (a view disowned by George Bush). Israel's assessment is that Tehran is two years from a bomb.
The mutual suspicion between Israel and Iran is at historic levels. Israel cites the existential danger posed by an Iranian regime that has suggested that the Jewish state would 'vanish from the page of time'.
Iran points to statements such as the one made last week by the Israeli Infrastructure Minister Benjamin Ben-Eliezer, a former defence chief. In an interview published in the Russian press, Ben-Eliezer said that Iran would be annihilated if it tried to attack Israel. In truth, Israel's concerns are as much concerned with regional strategic issues as they are with the threat posed by Tehran, and in particular maintaining the status of sole nuclear power in the region. A repeat of the 2006 attack on Tehran's ally Hizbollah in Lebanon would be more difficult to contemplate with a nuclear Iran. By the same argument, a nuclear Iran might embolden not only Hizbollah but Hamas in Gaza, too.
What is clear is that the push inside the Israeli establishment for a strike is not being driven by the timetable of Iran's mastery of the technical aspects alone, but by geopolitical considerations. That point was reinforced by Bar last week when he identified a window of opportunity for a strike on Iran - ahead of the November presidential election in the United States which could see Barack Obama take power, and possibly engage with Syria and Iran. An Obama presidency would close that window for Israel, says Bar.
'The support is almost unanimous for this in Israel. One hundred percent. I don't think there is anybody within Israel who sees Iran's threats as rhetoric. So the question is, when do we reach that bridge?' he said, adding that the West is naive to believe that any kind of negotiation will work. 'The only thing that can stop Israel's intent [to bomb] would be extremely robust steps on the part of the West - a blockade of Iranian refined oil, something that would indicate that steps were meant to force regime change. Since that is not on the cards, only bombing Iran will work.
'If it's an Israeli attack they will put pressure on Iran's Arab neighbours to respond to the problem also. It will be counter-productive for Iran to launch a major attack on Israel.
'So they will launch a few rockets at us; that is not devastating for Israel,' he said with a shrug. Israel's case, as put by Bar, is that 'most of the Arab Middle East will side with the hope that Israel does the job and not the US. And make no mistake that they all want the job done. They will condemn it in public of course and then get on with their lives,' he said.
Har added that there would probably be another war with Lebanon - 'a month or two months, that is as long as the Middle East has wars for. We can easily cope with that. That's the nature of life in this region. We will set the Iranian programme back and yes, then we will need to come and take it out of existence again after that timeline. There will be no total conclusion, I hesitate to call it the "final solution", but there are no such solutions.'
But despite Israel's insistence that it has the will to go it alone, it is aware that it must secure at the very least the agreement of the US to turn a blind eye. And there are signs that the Bush White House is deeply split on the issue of any possible Israeli military strike against Iran.
Bush, vice-president Dick Cheney and the remnants of the neoconservative lobby in Washington are believed to be sympathetic to the idea. However, there are also those in strong positions, such as Defence Secretary Robert Gates and some senior military chiefs, who are thought to be privately opposed to such a move. 'If it were up to Bush and Cheney they would want to see this thing done,' said Larry Johnson, a former top CIA analyst. 'But they are now up against a lot of fundamental military realities that make it hard. The military has been pushing back against this.'
Right-wing think-tanks, however, such as the American Enterprise Institute and the Washington Institute for Near East Policy, have been vocal in their advocation of confronting Iran. Indeed, the institute recently produced a report on a theoretical military attack on Iran authored by Patrick Clawson and Michael Eisenstadt, entitled 'The Last Resort: Consquences of Preventive Military Action Against Iran'.
The study fell short of recommending such an attack but it did provide an exhaustive argument on why and how such an attack would work. That led critics to dub it a blueprint for war with Iran. It suggested that the possible best line of attack would in fact not be against Tehran's nuclear programme but against its oil industry, thus cutting off the source of Iran's current wealth. 'The political shock of losing the oil income would cause Iran to rethink its stance,' the report suggested.
It comes at a time when a resolution has been put forward in Congress calling for a naval blockade of Iran led by US warships. The proposal calls for the United States to lead an international effort to cut off the country by sea, something that would almost certainly by seen as an act of war by Iran. The resolution has got huge support from Israeli politicians and the country's highly effective lobbying industry in Washington, led perhaps inevitably by Aipac, which has made the issue its legislative priority. 'The war drums are beating. There is no doubt about that,' said Johnson.
A recent flurry of bilateral meetings between senior US and Israeli military officials in recent weeks has contributed to a sense that planning for a strike may be far advanced. Admiral Michael Mullen, the chairman of the US joint chiefs of staff, travelled to Israel last week for the second time in seven months, cutting short a tour of Europe to meet with Lieutenant General Gabi Ashkenazi, Israel's military chief.
Also last week, a senior Israeli foreign ministry official reportedly travelled to Vienna for a rare meeting with the International Atomic Energy Agency to encourage them to work more quickly on strategies to block Iran's nuclear programme. Although an American government spokesman in Washington said the meeting had been scheduled several months in advance, he added: 'Obviously, when Chairman Mullen goes to Israel and speaks with the Israelis, they will no doubt discuss the threat posed by Iran.'
Paradoxically, Israel has adopted a much less confrontational approach elsewhere in the region: there is the admittedly tenuous Gaza ceasefire and a prisoner swap with the Lebanese militant group Hizbollah is close. There are indirect talks under way with the Syrians and Israel has called for a direct dialogue with Lebanon. Talks with the Palestinians, however frail, none the less continue.
And amid the talk of windows of opportunity and the dry runs for missile strikes, more moderate voices are managing to make themselves heard. Ephraim Halevy, a former head of the intelligence agency Mossad, told a meeting of the Jewish Agency in Jerusalem on Tuesday that Iran's nuclear ambitions did not represent an existential threat to Israel.
'I am convinced that Israel cannot be destroyed,' Halevy said. 'We should not sink into the doldrums of "Israel is on the verge of extinction".' Ultimately, he said, the United States would talk to Iran, and Israel needed to be part of that dialogue.
Martin Van Creveld, Israel's leading military historian, said there were some in the Israeli government who were indeed serious about a military option. But he said the Iranian president, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, would probably not be affected by Israel flexing its military muscles. 'I would be very surprised if the Iranians cave in. I think they are going to follow the same road as every nuclear country has followed since the 1960s [including Israel]; namely they are going to build nuclear weapons without admitting it,' he said. 'And I don't see this made the world into a worse place. I am convinced the outcome is going to be a balance of power and I personally think that a nuclear Iran may not be such a bad thing for the world... Iran is a third-world country. I don't see why people are so afraid of it.'
Prime Minister Olmert, and the hawks around him, may take some convincing of that.
guardian.co.uk © Guardian News and Media Limited 2008
56 Comments so far
Show AllH U _ J I N T A O,
Thank you for your perceptive global information.
I also agree with _ L I S A _ about encouraging your continued postings
Namaste « Presence »
« We must be the change we wish to see in the world » — Gandhi
« There is a sufficiency in the world for man's need but not for man's greed » — Gandhi
« We adopt the means of nonviolence because our end is a community at peace with itself » — ML King
Hu Jintao; please post prolifically.
Do you foresee an alliance between Russia and China? Political Economic or even Military.
Chess is solo, multiple players on this board.
America's rapaciousness forces other's hands...
post more!
Why does Israel assume that *building* a nuclear bomb is the only way Iran can get one ?
China already made a deal for 50 years of Iranian oil and natural gas. China plays for keeps. They will not rely on American and British 'commodity markets' - that's a losers game. We quietly gave Iran plutonium for 10 nuclear weapons which is why Iran is so confident. The U.S. is not the only SuperPower anymore. No one will *touch* China, and it can destroy the US financially now. It has been biding its time; it is the Chinese custom.
Israel is clearly overconfident. They think 200 nuclear weapons and a SuperPower friend make them untouchable. History is full of such destroyed countries.
Iran *wants* to teach the world a powerful lesson about why International Laws should be obeyed. They are playing chess, Cheney and Olmert are playing drunken, rushed checkers.
Everything can change in an hour.
Who needs nukes- just use X-ray machines...
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1214726166105&pagename=JPost%...
Light water reactors do not much plutonium make, which is why the internationals who set up the Iranian plants had no problem installing them. Do the Iranians have a bunch of secret breeder reactors somewheres? Or are they just going to make one antique uranium bomb and be a big threat?
The "shadow" of War is all Israel has left.
They are not stupid or suicidal..... We Jews have learned somethin after all these years.
Fear always sells.... and I quit buyin It.
I'll bet my life on it because if I'm wrong life is gone.
Why gamble with a safe bet?
"Does AIPAC bribe the entire U.S. Congress? There should be investigations into why the Zionists/AIPAC have such a stranglehold on the U.S. government."
Actually they intimidate our entire congress, if the candidates running for office do not sign a letter of support for israel before they are elected AIPAC flood their opponents (that do sign the letter) with masses of campaign cash, thereby assuring that everyone that is elected has firmly signed on to the support of this zionist bully.
Great politics isn't it? For sure if you follow the money you will find AIPAC and or it's tentacles reach into every campaign coffer. Why do you think all politicians blindly affirm undying loyalty to them? Ariel Sharon stated in a public speech about the US government that they had them under their control and they would do what Israel told them to do. What a bunch of lame brain asses we are. Welcome to the new world order. 1% of our population control 100% of our political policies. Without the support of the US Israel would fold like a bad poker hand. But hey it won't matter in a few more years anyway.
An attack could trigger a global financial meltdown. Where o where would the Zionists get their money then (as the Us gives them so much of it).
Here's my favorite part...The U.S. President, regardless of party affiliation, will be compelled to support this attack in word, action and with guns if need be. And I mean ANY President, even that moderate Republican, Barack Obama...who supports the Death Penalty, doesn't want Muslims to be seen or heard as part of his campaign, and who believes that the U.S. should and WILL have an ongoing military presence in the Middle East.
Har Davids - most of the sabre rattling is coming from Israel and the US, and it's very unlikely that any Israelis will be "vaporised" as Iran do not have a nuclear weapon, and keep telling the World that they do not seek one.
Neither the current US or Israeli administrations will engage in talks with Iran, and the US constantly refers to Iran as "evil". The current "negotiations" over Iran's nuclear programme are a misnomer, because the US are not offering anything, and as has been said before Iran has broken no rules, whilst the US and Israel have. If there was a level playing field, to engage in some form of detente, then that would be fine, but the US and Israel expect Iran to give up what is rightfully theirs to pursue. There is no prospect of any bargaining at the moment, because the US and Israel are putting nothing on the table.
I wonder how many people in the Middle East have a death-wish, the way everybody's rattling the sables until war is 'inevitable'? I never lived through a war, so I'm no expert, but only a lunatic or a weapons-merchant can rejoice in it. So, how many Israeli's or Iranian's would really like to be vaporized by a nuclear device and how many would like the problems to be resolved in a less messy manner? Are there any statistics on this matter?
AndyUK and McD, If it were really a matter of nuclear proliferation, it would not be a problem to find a solution with Iran. No, the problem is as someone else said above, the US cannot allow another player of "power" in the region, and after all the US still believes that they "own" Iran and their oil, and that the Ayatollahs are a temporary blip which has to be overcome by "regime change".
Israel is an outpost fortress irritant in the ME project for imperialist hegemony to do their part of the thrust and parry, while the US does the heavy lifting, but together they reap the "spoils of war" and support compliant tyrannies, such as Egypt and Saudi Arabia.
Now what I cannot fathom is why the US government continues to be allowed by the their citizenry to break the spirit if not the letter of US law and certainly international law, in providing aid, and especially military aid, to a country with a clandestine nuclear program, known nuclear arms, known proliferators (originally to apartheid S. Africa), and not a member of the NPT. And so Israel is maintained above the law, the special exception by its powerful lobbies and no civil nor criminal suit is pressed and every year, 3 to 4 billion dollars of US tax payers money goes to support the Zionist terrorists.
Also Mike Corbeil June 29th, 2008 7:15 pm… You write : "Bunker-buster bombs, cruise missiles, … are "glorified fire-works"? Sorry, perhaps I was not clear enough; Glorified fire works are Qassam rockets, fired from Gaza, allegedly by Fatah's, Al Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades, or the Palistinian Islamic Jihad, which are responded to by Israel with 500 lb. bombs on civilians and targeted assassinations, as well as collective punishment on Gaza's Palestinians amounting to war crimes.
I was trying to point out that the Zionists and Americans must have an enemy, even if it means creating one to keep the aggression rolling. Imperialism demands aggression and the enemy provides justification. Nuclear fiction is just another excuse to perpetuate the myths.
Do not reckon yourselves as among the nations, but apart, and separate, and special to me the lord your fucking god. This is not the voice of a god of any kind. It is the voice of MEN. Fanatic, life-hating men who will destroy everything they can't control (and so inevitably themselves, for that is the last thing they can control---witness forcing your entire female population to be invisible, so that you aren't "seduced").....It is the voice of priests, of human beings----how can it possibly be that this world holds itself as beholden to such a crapulous, destructive, infantile view of life? How can it be that the modern world operates according to the non-values of a desert tribe of the Middle East 2000 years ago? Only one answer---every empire has invoked it, i.e., found it the best instrument for creating and policing empires within and without....We must get this poison out of our collective spirit somehow....
DuncanIdaho - it would seem that the mindset of the US and Israel, is very much like a visit to the headmaster's office in the old days. You were supposed to take your punishment without complaint or retaliation, maybe even thanking the Principal for the experience.
It should be obvious that the US and Israel have put themselves beyond the law, and at this moment, consider themselves to be wielding the "big stick". Modern politics in the US and Israel has nothing to do with diplomacy, tact and guile, but is about threatening rhetoric and mindless terror, to be inflicted on nations who stand up to the bully boys.
TonyR - everything you say is true, and I have maintained, that living in Iran at the moment must be close to living in a state of terror, with the constant suggestion, that either Israel or the US (or both) will attack it in the near future.
The situation where Israel has been shielded by the US in particular, is out of control. The bombing of Lebanon went on under the full gaze of the international community, with both the UK and US reluctant to try to intervene.
What is so disturbing, is that Russia and China have gone along with the recent sanctions against Iran - what is happening to the World?
Notice no mention in the article about the illegality of the proposed attack. Does Iran have the right to now act pre-emptively against the Israeli threats?
Note no discussion in the MSM about the nuclear weapons of Israel. Does'nt this massive reporting oversight not tell you something about the media propaganda we are all exposed to?
How could any state have the right to exist as a rogue like Israel permanently above all international law and decent norms?
Israel should be permently disarmed and subject to sanction.
dc McD - You are quite correct in what you say, that the damage has been done and mistakes have been made, but the roots of the problem are the US unconditional support of Israel, and in turn, the actions of the US/UK in corrupting the UN.
The stage for nations to air their grievances, and to be brought to book for any offences, should be the UN, but it is not even handed. Even if we get rid of the UN and set up another World ruling/arbitration body, the situation would exist, where the more powerful members use it as a tool to achieve political and strategic aims.
It does not take a genius to figure out, that all of the sanctions and UN resolutions placed on Iran are illegal, and based on supposition and lies. Israel on the other hand, have had UN resolutions placed on them, but have never suffered any hardship for ignoring all of them.
Nothing has happened to Israel, Pakistan or India for failing to sign the NPT. Until the most powerful nations in the World have the courage to enforce the law fairly, then we will edge closer to catastrophe.
great idea MCD..........who's gonna promote it????????
The 1947 UN Mandate which ultimately led to the recreation of Israel in 1948 in Arab settled Palestine - after a geographic abscence of tens of centuries - was a mistake. Pres. Harry Truman, for one, saw the mistake in prospect, and only gave direct U.S. assent to the 1948 proclamation with the greatest reluctance and at the last mimute. Truman was never anti-Jewish, but he was not a Zionist. His sometimes anguished diary entries on the subject more than once used reasoning not unlike that of Iran's current president, Ahmadinejad. Truman: 'The people of Palestine weren't responsible for what the Germans did to the Jews in Europe, so how can we force them to cede 8,000 square miles of their land? This just promises more trouble for the beleagured Jewish people.'
But the mistake was made, understandably or not, justifiably or not.
What is now clear now, is that after six decades of fierce, tragic, but also successful struggle to survive, the world community has no intention of ordering Israel's wholescale uncreation as an independent state. The best that can happen in the short-term, is for the region's governments to be de-weaponized of nuclear armaments by a concerned world using its united power to compel exactly that. Iran and other regional Israel antagonists must be compelled to fully open all of their nuclear facilities to continuous international inspection, in exchange for the total deconstruction of Israel's already-proven nuclear arsensal, plus identical, ongoing inspections of Israels facilities.
With inspired leadership by any one major global power or group powers, this approach would be realistic and it goals could be achievable. It would probably solve nothing of the region's tensions for the long term -- that can only come by deeper processes over time. What it would do, however, is provide time for those deeper processes to occur. In short, it would allow for a long term characterized by something other than nuclear militarization and the chronic threat of horrific regional war.
Iran's top Revolutionary Guards Commander, General Mohammad Ali Jafari doesn't sport a full beard, I notice. A little propaganda myth flicked away, I feel, and a whole swathe of others surely compromised. No?
and will they go after the u.a.e. as well? they've just signed a deal with france for nuclear power stations. who's to say they won't make 'secret' bombs? gimme a break...................why don't they just move israel to a large uninhabited desert somewhere in the u.s.? (and put a big wall around them)..............
People deranged by religion cannot be expected to make rational decisions. The religious crazies that run Israel are in cahoots with the religious crazies that run America.
The prognosis? Endless war and a dead planet.
P.S. Of Mice And Men was a prophetic story. Check my blog for details.
www.dangerouscreation.com
Yep,I just heard it said Bush and Cheney don't want Iran sitting there with nukes after they leave office,messing up their deals with the oil companies.So they're going to either start a war or make certain some other way they don't have weapons.I guess that means Isreal.
....oh Israel, what an utter shame it is to see you operating in the oh so utterly futile and tragic manner you are with your intentions to attack Iran. How ironic that if you look at yourself in the mirror, you pretty much have become the modern day Nazi German State (minus the holocaust part, of course)...the victim now becomes the oppressive aggressor, eh?!....funny how lessons still go unlearned even when you, yourself have tasted the most utterly horrific transgressions man could ever experience and here you are, shortly afterwards enacting your own destructive doom....all in the name of protectionism....so what you are essentially saying with this madness you are contemplating is this....'we good, them (Iran) bad'...we are the righteous ones while they are the evil ones....we must do everything in our power to destroy them...to rid the world of the evil Iranians'....hmmmm...sounds kinda like what Hitler trumpeted to his people.....Israel, knock this madness off!!!....come on now...do you really....do you REALLY think that conducting in a quick-strike mission within Iran is really going to get you what you ultimately want...in the LONG term??!!....THINK ISRAEL!!!!....you are most certainly about to seal your fate (and perhaps drag the rest of the world down into your drama)...re-think this insane idea to attack Iran, Israel, for you are about to spark one of the most unholiest of fires the modern world has seen since the U.S. dropped it's atomic bomb on Japan...by the way....whose brilliant idea was it to have the Jews return to probably the most controvercial place on the globe one could think of to return a people to....oh, that would be none other than the warped scheme thought up to yours truly, the U.S. and Britain....great idea!!...ya, so we will return the Jews to the heart of the Islamic lands and create a state of perpetual chaos and war to the eventual point where they (Jews and Muslims) will be so battle weary and broken that we can make our eventual claim and stake on Jerusalem....to have the CATHOLIC CHURCH move on in and lay claim to run the "sanctuary" of Jerusalem....because obviously, the Israeli es were/are unfit to manage such a holy place....what a grand-scheme, eh?!!...but brilliant in its long-term design....hate to say it, but I think it's working...Israel is the puppet on Imperialist Britain's and the Babylonia U.S.'s strings....WAKE UP AND SEE THE STRINGS, ISRAEL...time is almost running out on you....yet again!!.....
Any US/Isreal attack on iran to stop their 'supposed' nuke weapons research will do the opposite. Forcing Iran, and other ME countries to speed up nuke weapon research and construction to counter-balance Isreal. It would also deep six the IAEA and make both countries (US, and Isreal) global pariahs. And set up new regional powerblocks to keep both country's in check.
As I said in the other thread 40% of this country has no problem remaining in Iraq for 4 or more years. The masses in America are frightened, paranoid, afraid, demoralized, dejected, and timid towards their own government. In something of Irony, they still continue to do and believe exactly as they are told, like a pack of mangey dogs. You commondreamers typically compare them to sheep... I think you're wrong. They're much more comparable to mangey muts because a neglected and exploited dog begs for scraps, and that's all this population does. (It's why they elect leaders based on getting a 250 dollar "tax cut" even though they can't see that their money is borrowed over future interest).
These mangey mongrel dogs deserve to be ripped off and exploited. They want to be decieved, they crave it. As disturbing as it sounds, my only hope is I can be there to fleece them too, just to laugh at them and how pathetic they are.
" pbdenison June 29th, 2008 10:17 pm
Israel could start a world wide nuclear war."
NO; the US and Israel could. Israel's not going to strike Iran alone, while the US possibly might risk doing so alone. The US govt and its ruling elites, and psychopath military members, that is.
Correction: Wherein I ended with, "This hopefully will end up having only been a very frightening crime on Pelosi's part, instead of actually used for war on Iran; but Pelosi and her gang are not fit for lynching", that should be "are NOW fit for lynching". 'Not' was certainly an unfitting typo. error on my part.
" truthmonger June 29th, 2008 8:29 pm
...
The world should vow that israel should not be nuclear and demand they dismantle their bombs, when they ever admit to having them. Maybe weapons inspectors should go into israel…"
The world can vow that all it wants; Israel is nuclear-armed, very, and knows it's protected by superpower military USA and its ruling elites, leaving that Israel therefore feels safe against what the rest of the world wants.
I believe it's PM Olmert who acknowledged that Israel indeed is nuclear-armed during one of his episodes of speaking threats against Iran and either last year or the one before. I forget which article this was quoted in, but he and/or another top Israeli official did.
As for the IAEA going in; IT CANNOT, not until Israel chooses to conduct itself legally, and that day is not within foreseeable future, yet. And the U.S. govt and its ruling elites will maintain their protection of Israel in this regard, also. They strategically want Israel to be nuclear-armed and I doubt that they have any fears about Israel potentially attacking the USA or any of their interests without their say-so, for they know that if Israel did, then it could be very promptly efaced from the map of the Earth, which they, in turn, know the psychopath Israeli leadership doesn't want to be subjected to.
For the ruling elites of the West and who are after conquering and dominating the world economy in terms of profitable natural resources, Israel being nuclear-armed is a strategically instrumental partner in the Middle East; although Israel is involved with the West's "works" elsewhere, too.
The world has been represented with the many UNSC resolutions drafted with the purpose of demanding that Israel stop it's unending and extreme crimes, and the U.S. govt strategically applies vetoes which are criminal, but still permitted by the UNSC. If the world can't do better than this, then the world of us can demand whatever we want of good changes of or from the Israeli govt, it's not going to do any good.
Anyway, if Iran is attacked, then President Chavez said he'd send his forces to try to help Iran, and if missiles are fired at Iran, then the Russian govt has warned that this might cause it's technologically outdated missle defence system to treat the missiles as if launched at Russia and then replying with immediate launches of Russian nukes and guess where to?!
Unfortunately, Nancy Pelosi and her partners saw to it that the Bush-Cheney cabal can launch war on Iran without any need to inform Congress and obtain its authorization, I very recently learned. This hopefully will end up having only been a very frightening crime on Pelosi's part, instead of actually used for war on Iran; but Pelosi and her gang are not fit for lynching.
Israel could start a world wide nuclear war. How will Pakistan react? Could Islamists take over and nuke Israel? Then what will happen? This is the most dangerous idea in a long time, and think tanks like American Enterprise, etc., are out of their minds, insane. Aristotle was wrong: man is not a rational animal.
Strange or bad things can , and do happen when too much power is in the hands of bullying criminals, specifically big brother and little brother (US and Israel).
All US Intel. Agencies, and, the IAEA have reported on Iran's nuclear program. But there are terrorists out there screaming about Iran's threat. What with that? Out of all the countries in the world, why on earth is Iran a threat to only Israel and the USA? And whenever they mention Iran's nuclear program, they always say NUCLEAR WEAPONS PROGRAM. Let's not forget the nuclear and bio//chem. Iraq was manufacturing.
War with Iran? I'm not worried.
.... After all, Indiana Jones will save us....
Tailcap, very nice biker piece.
Olmert vowed that Iran 'will not be nuclear'.
The world should vow that israel should not be nuclear and demand they dismantle their bombs, when they ever admit to having them. Maybe weapons inspectors should go into israel...
Sorry, almost forgot there for a moment that israel and the US can do no wrong.
"simo June 29th, 2008 4:51 pm
Houston may be hit this summer!! False flag operation may already be planned!!
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/06/13/9596 "
I AM GLAD to have come across that post and it's good to see that CD finally posts a reasonable article in terms of ... like Dr Peter Dale Scott is quoted in the opening of the article simo linked:
"In short, we are living in an on-going state of emergency whose exact limits are unknown, on the basis of a controversial deep event — 9/11 — that is still largely a mystery.
- UC Professor Emeritus Peter Dale Scott"
There was a Global Research News Hour interview between Stephen Lendman and Dr Scott on June 23rd and the MP3 is archived. If interested in listening to the nearly one hour discussion, one I found and find to be certainly recommendable and interesting, then there's a link in the June 30th News Hour notice article, and tomorrow will be with Michael Ratner and Dahr Jamail for guests.
The link to use for these audios is the one for the Republic Broadcasting Network (RBN) website, where the actual link for listening to live broadcasts is available, as well as a link for the archive.
"Michael Ratner and Dahr Jamail on the Global Research News Hour on RBN
Program details for June 30"
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=9462
Stephen and Peter spent some time on the topic Peter refers to as 'deep state' or 'deep state events', or both and possibly other variations of the phrasing; and this involved the topic of the 9-11 attacks, on which Peter has no definite position, just saying that it's definitely a 'mystery', the case needs to be thoroughly and honestly investigated, which is a view NO ONE of any real intelligence can doubt.
I'll quote on the Houston matter in the article simo linked. And WOW; it's amazing that CD has finally grown out of the fear-of-reality state and begun to post something fitting about very dark, very 'deep', 'deeply dark', ... reality of state, war, etcetera, and 'false flag' too. GREAT!
QUOTE:
...
On April 29 of this year, CIA veteran Roland V. Carnaby was shot dead by police officers after a high speed chase through the streets of Houston. Carnaby, who had been the CIA's Chief of Station for the Southeast Region headquartered in Houston, was involved in conducting security surveys of the Port of Houston and had discovered that the Department of Homeland Security was tolerating gaping holes in port security. Carnaby and Houston intelligence and law enforcement personnel were also investigating the presence of "Middle Easterners" who were conducting surveillance of the Port of Houston. The "Middle Eastern" designator is the term used by the FBI for Israelis (typically Mossad agents) in order to avoid "political" problems with superiors.
Former National Security Agency analyst and naval intelligence officer Wayne Madsen has been in Houston investigating the Carnaby case at great personal risk. Madsen believes Carnaby was involved both in heading off a potential war with Iran (by leaking Mossad plans to assassinate Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah just days before Carnaby himself was killed) and in trying to forestall a potential terrorist attack on the port.
According to Madsen, "federal agents in Houston fear that 'another 9/11-type part false flag' attack is imminent, perhaps as early as July 4." Such an attack along the twenty-five-mile Houston Ship Channel, site of more explosive materials, toxic gases, and deadly petrochemicals than anywhere else in the country, could create an environmental and economic catastrophe that would dwarf 9/11.
How will the struggle within this administration be brought to an end? Will courageous military men like Adm. Fallon speak out before the next national tragedy befalls us? ...
END QUOTE.
WHY were they in a high-speed chase after Roland V. Carnaby? He surely wasn't speeding at [high] speed for pleasure.
He "was involved in conducting security surveys of the Port of Houston and had discovered that the Department of Homeland Security was tolerating gaping holes in port security", but working with who, under the mandate of which party, the port security authority, or ...?
Answer: "Carnaby and Houston intelligence and law enforcement personnel were also investigating ...". So he was obviously working with legal authorities, instead of alone, under his own mandate, as a 'Lone Ranger', ....
So what's the high-speed chase for? Did the police chasing him receive their orders from the DHS, or some other federal or state authorities, instead of from Houston authorities? After all, something real caused Carnaby to flee or try to flee at high speed; it surely wasn't just some imaginary matter, fictional beast, whatever, that caused this.
Perhaps Wayne Madsen will determine the answers to such questions, and/or others. It's good to see that he's investigating this, and that he's risking his life in doing so seems to be obvious after what happened to Roland V. Carnaby.
That, "Carnaby and Houston intelligence and law enforcement personnel were also investigating the presence of "Middle Easterners" who were conducting surveillance of the Port of Houston. The "Middle Eastern" designator is the term used by the FBI for Israelis (typically Mossad agents) in order to avoid "political" problems with superiors", IS NOT SURPRISING.
Such or similar Israelis were caught spying in the U.S. since 9-11, and some or many of them had enrolled as students in U.S. universities and or colleges for cover. There was also a group caught on corporate msm "news" media (FOX, CNN, CBS, or another, but a big one in the U.S.) the morning of 9-11, as the attacks were happening on the WTC Towers; and they were cheering away while watching those towers get struck and explode. I read an online article not long ago that said that the FBI did finally find the members of that cheerleading group of Israelis, but had to release them; and I don't recall the precise reason for that, but believe it's surely due to orders from HIGH up.
I do NOT believe Israel and the Israeli lobby [control] the U.S. govt, including with respect to U.S. policies in the Middle East, and no one will ever get me to believe this; not without a lot of concrete proof, which no one has presented even a grain of, so far. All we get is speculation based on misinterpreted appearances. HOWEVER, Israel's been involved with all of these U.S. international crimes and all along, throughout; definitely. There's NO way to doubt the latter; not if we are reasonably informed, and it doesn't take a lot of information to be able to realise that Israelis have definitely been involved all along.
But I prefer to think that Bush et al, and the Israeli govt, really are not intending to attack Iran; I HOPE. And a false flag attack in the U.S. could be used to launch an attack on Iran, but NO sane American can believe that Iran would be guilty; and the false flag could alternatively be used to establish martial law in order to ensure that elections in November are canceled or seriously postponed, for Bush-Cheney to continue into 2009, onward, until they're satisfied. A false flag could be for either reason or both.
Americans, however, MUST realise that there is absolutely NO WAY that Iran is going to be the aggressor; it'll retaliate, at most. Any attacks in the U.S. must be considered as being orchestrated and commanded from HIGH up in the U.S., by [enemies from within]!
This also applies to the USN ships in the Persian Gulf, and also Israel; putting aside the little firecracker rockets some Palestinians occasionally lob over into Israel, and which is nothing unusual (and, while not a good idea, still nothing that's undeserved).
"Lucitanian June 29th, 2008 12:47 pm
...
Israel and most Israelis want peace. The Zionists in America and Israel need an enemy, even if it is only shooting glorified fire-works."
Bunker-buster bombs, cruise missiles, ... are "glorified fire-works"? They are the idols of these hellish fiends ("people"), these "leaders"; they evidently "glorify" these instruments of apocalyptic destruction, or the possession of them and the ability to use them. But these are not "fire-works".
As for "Israel and most Israelis want peace", I agree that a majority of Israelis want peace, [and] justice, for all Palestinians, and more; but Israel wanting peace is a poorly stated description of reality, for the govt is also of or in Israel and does not represent the population, any of it. It does not, for it instead is the country's worst enemy; and the population there also has the govts of the U.S. and other fiend ally govts for additional enemies. In the USA, it's the U.S. govt that is the population's [enemy]. In Canada, the govt, and that of the USA, are the enemies of the people here. Etcetera.
Our govts do NOT represent our populations and hold the reins of our military and law enforcement forces, which too regularly and pervertedly lean to serving the rich elites, not The People.
And when we say Canada, U.S.A., Israel, etcetera, we do mean both the populations as well as the govts; even if the ruling elites would prefer to not think of us when thinking of our countries.
So, and again, I don't think it's appropriate to say that Israel wants peace.
Israel can only be destroyed if it goes to war.
Remember wayyyy back, when the Twin Towers disintegrated into rubble? And the Iranian people joined the world in tears and lamentations in highly visible displays of sympathy and concern? Only a momentary gasp in the long breath of history, and now all that goodwill & compassion has similarly turned to smoke. How is it our nation states haven't yet moved beyond rudimentary blood feuds that belong in Old Testament contexts?
A propane tanker Simo, caught on film would look apocolypic, wouldn't do too much real damage, but would suffice for Fascist Directive-51; The Fhuerer has wisely anticipated our needs and taken all necessary precautions to maintain order.
Houston may be hit this summer!! False flag operation may already be planned!!
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/06/13/9596/
"That point was reinforced by Bar last week when he identified a window of opportunity for a strike on Iran - ahead of the November presidential election in the United States which could see Barack Obama take power, and possibly engage with Syria and Iran. An Obama presidency would close that window for Israel, says Bar."
This quote strikes me as deliberately misstating the real intention. Obama wouldn't take power until January 2009, so November does not define Israel's window of opportunity. It IS, however the window of opportunity to interfere with the US election outcome, which purportedly would lean towards McCain if such an attack took place. Then again, with the help of the complicit corporate media, it probably would give Bush a pretext to implement NSD-51, cancel the elections altogether, and appoint himself as Führer und Reichskanzler.
SELF HATING JEWS....THE END OF THE WORLD IS GOING TO BE THE RESULT OF A CULTURE WIDE, DEEP SEATED SELF LOATHING....GRREEEAAT!..JUST GREAT!
THEY SEEM TO WANT TO ...DESTROY THE WORLD FOR SOME REASON...WHY? I AM ASKING ALL THE OTHER JEWS OUT THERE...WHY? WHY DO THIS? DO YOU NOT SEE THAT YOU ARE THE ONES MAKING ALL THE THREATS/...UHHHH..I THAT NOT WHAT IS HAPPENING? WHY? WHY DO THIS? WHY KILL YOURSLEVES TO MAKE A POINT..FOR SURELY...BEING..WHAT..1000 MILES AWAY FROM GROUND ZERO..IF THAT? SURELY YOU SEE THAT THE RADIO-ACTIVE FALL-OUT WILL KILL ALL OF YOU..DO YOU SOMEHOW NOT SEE THIS BASIC FACT? IS THAT REALLY POSSIBLE?
IF YOUR RADIOACTIVE..THEY WON'T LET YOU INTO MIAMI INTL. AIRPORT...YOU'LL SET OFF THE BUZZERS..OY G'VALT...THOSE MESHUGGANA AIRPORT DETECTORS...
RALAX...HAVE A BAGEL..THINK THIS OVER...THERE'S PLENTY OF TIME TO FUCK EVERYTHING UP FOR EVERYONE...MAYBE THIS ISN'T SUCH A GREAT IDEA...
Back when G.H.W.Bush was President, and what got me back into politics after dropping out when Kennedy was assassinated, was hearing him say basically, "I want this war, and I don't give a damn what Congress does, I'll have it!"
What I'm hearing Israel and G.W. Bush saying is the same. They are going to take out Iran, and they don't give a damn what anyone else in the world wants. In my book, it's just a matter of how soon it's going to happen.
And tragically, this is all about boosting the GOP's chances in the fall election. They want to corner the Dems and Obama, make them agree that we have to be "tough on Iran," so that they can minimize any differences that remain between the two parties, and try to regain the "national security" advantage, as absurd a claim as that would be for the party that has done so much to damage our security and our standing in the world.
"...But despite Israel's insistence that it has the will to go it alone, it is aware that it must secure at the very least the agreement of the US to turn a blind eye. And there are signs that the Bush White House is deeply split on the issue of any possible Israeli military strike against Iran..."
This TREACHEROUS insinuation that US and Israel plan on playing 'Good Cop/Bad Cop' is pure ANTI-SEMITISM! The Jews are Converting to Christianity in droves, as FORETOLD in Scripture. They will therefore GO IT ALONE so that GOD can say with a clear conscience, "They Alone fomented the historic conversion of the Muslims Fascists!"
All this talk about strategy and tactics, and none about Iran's rights under the Nuclear Non- Proliferation Treaty. No talk about respecting a Iran,s sovereignty.And once again- Ahmadinejad never mentioned wiping the state of Israel off the map. He was talking about the REGIME in Israel. Iran has said it would support a two state solution in Israel. Also, Ahmadinejad is NOT in control of Iran's military. He's third in line. But Israel and the US need a cover story in their quest for mid-east hegemony, and the media plays along, casting aggressors as victims.Democrats in the US congress who are about to let this happen- tell me again why I should vote for you when you refuse to walk on your hind-legs.
Israel has to get permission from the U.S. to fly over air space, to bomb Iran, that the U.S. controls. The U.S. needs to be held as co-conspirator and complicit in the war crimes of Israel.
Does AIPAC bribe the entire U.S. Congress? There should be investigations into why the Zionists/AIPAC have such a stranglehold on the U.S. government.
Bombs away - August 15th.
Here's a 10-minute video that may answer the "why do they hate us" question. Israel is our enemy, aways has and will always be. Enjoy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9q5B293FbxM
A gang of scruff, bearded and tattooed bikers are sitting around drinking beers, carousing, having a good time in a hole-in-the-wall little joint.
The biker leader, Uncle Sam, brags that he owns over 1,000 Harley Davidson choppers. Each in turn proudly states how many assorted motorcycles and choppers they own. Another, Zion, boasts he has almost 100 choppers and is building more.
Then out of nowhere, the sound of a lone chopper can be heard revving in the distance. "Oh hell no!" they scream in unison, grabbing their knives, sawed-off shotguns, chains and pistols they scramble to their bikes and race after the lone biker, Rann.
Moral: Only gangs that have choppers should be allowed to have them. If you do not have one, forget about it. Gangs don't like competition. It's about domination and turf.
If Israel attacks Iran unprovoked, I hope Isreal gets its ass kicked.
As much as I admire the Jews as a race and a religion, Israel has turned into a nasty little shit-stain on the planet.
Given the current $4/gal cost of jet fuel, the Israeli treasury sure took a hit with their so-called rehearsal. Olmert's government, indeed olmert himself, is on the cusp of being replaced, and in Olmert's case, jailed.
There's much more to critique in this item: Hezbollah and Hamas are defensive in essence, so the idea that either could wage offensive war agaisnt Israel is absurd. The idea floated to hit Iran's oil industry is just as absurd; oil price would spike to $200-300/bbl and stay there, dooming Western economies. Not mentioned are the 30 odd Iranian VLCCs loaded and waiting in the vicinity of Kharg Island, which after much thought, IMO, they will be the mechanism to close the Straits of Hormuz; so, you cna kiss all hydrocarbon exports from the Persian Gulf goodbye for a long time.
When the muscle is between the ears, it means the person is intellectually incapacitated.
Continual expansion is a common requirement of both capitalism and imperialism. In fact, there is really very little to distinguish between the two. Whatever stands in the way of either must, of course, be made to submit or be 'obliterated'.
It's interesting how little threatened people in almost all countries of that part of the world are about Iran's purported nuclear weapons program. This list includes only countries that aren't paranoid 24/7 over "existential threats" to themselves and, uniquely among all states in the world, don't demand a "right to exist" for themselves in their current supremacist configuration. In Iran's two largest neighbors, and regional rivals, Pakistan and Turkey a majority sees no problem with Iran getting it's own nukes, and given the centuries of peaceful coexistence they've enjoyed with Iran, even consider that if Iran were to ever acquire such weapons it'll only be for defensive purposes.
What would the Israelis give to be assured of a nuclear free Iran, and for that matter a nuclear free middle east?
Would they give up their 200 to 400 nuclear weapons and sign a special undertaking for spot inspections with the IAEA?
Well, I think 60% of Israelis would probably think that might be a reasonable trade. I seriously doubt the Zionist and State terrorists who are in favour of making this "story" of a nuclear threat, have actually any interest in disarming the unarmed Iran as much as continuing lethal conflict in order to avoid political settlement, with anybody.
Israel and most Israelis want peace. The Zionists in America and Israel need an enemy, even if it is only shooting glorified fire-works.
The whole thing is endless smoke and mirrors to keep up the delusion of power in Israel and in America. The delusion is that military might and all the billions invested in it can change anything, especially when you are in the wrong. Who has the balls to admit that?
What can one say, other than to hope that Martin Van Creveld, "Israel's leading military historian", is right -- in all respects. I certainly do have an enormous amount of admiration for him -- both for his ability to draw the conclusions he draws and for the courage to express them.