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NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden and journalist Glenn Greenwald made a joint appearance on Saturday in which they discussed how the "products of surveillance" include the accumulation of metadata as well as drone strikes.
The two were speaking via separate video streams at a session of Amnesty International USA's annual human rights conference taking place at a hotel in downtown Chicago.
\u201cAdvice from #Greenwald #Snowden to 900 here: use encryption, power of individuals, stand in solidarity #Amnesty2014\u201d— Amnesty Utah (@Amnesty Utah) 1396730166
According to Reuters' reporting on the event, Snowden and Greenwald
cautioned that government monitoring of "metadata" is more intrusive than directly listening to phone calls or reading emails and stressed the importance of a free press willing to scrutinize government activity. [..]
"Metadata is what allows an actual enumerated understanding, a precise record of all the private activities in all of our lives. It shows our associations, our political affiliations and our actual activities," said Snowden [...]
"My hope and my belief is that as we do more of that reporting and as people see the scope of the abuse as opposed to just the scope of the surveillance they will start to care more," [Greenwald] said.
YouTube user Dori Kenyon captured some of the event, which can be seen below. In the video, the Intercept journalist describes his response to a supporter who wanted him to move away from covering NSA stories and get back to issues like drones, Guantanamo and indefinite detention. Greenwald explains how they are not separate issues, but inextricably linked.
"The premise that underlies the system of mass surveillance," Greenwald said, "is really the same principle and part of the same system -- the idea that the government can do whatever it wants without even notifying its own citizens in any meaningful way that it's doing it, and can completely disregard the rights of its own citizens but even more so the rights of anybody who's not a citizen in order to exert dominion and control."
"One way it does that is through invasions. Another way is through torture. Another way is indefinite detention or drones. Another way is through mass surveillance," Greenwald said.
Snowden added, "When you think about drones, how does NSA, how does the U.S. military, how does the CIA [not clear] its targets? They're not targeting humans. Humans don't have GPS... It's the cell phones we're carrying around."
Snowden said the people in Guantanamo might have been captured over some call they made, and asked how the CIA knows where a specific target for a drone strike might be. "These are all products of surveillance."
"What we are seeing today is a renegotiation" of what the public is allowed to know and what the government is deciding for us behind closed doors," Snowden said.
Glenn Greenwald and Edward SnowdenAmnesty AGM 2014 Conversation on Surveillance I wish the video of Mr. Greenwald and Mr. Snowden was better. They were ...
Some at the conference took to Twitter to share the event as well:
\u201c.@ggreenwald on defeatism: Snowden shows the power of any individual to change the world, to literally change the world #Amnesty2014\u201d— Naureen Shah (@Naureen Shah) 1396730001
"It takes solidarity." Snowden delivering real talk at #Amnesty2014. We MUST stand in solidarity.
-- Jessica Wehby (@JessWehby) April 5, 2014
MIT Students Show the Enormously Intrusive Nature of Metadata
You've probably heard politicians or pundits say that "metadata doesn't matter." They argue that police and intelligence agencies shouldn't need probable cause warrants to collect information about our communications. Metadata isn't all that revealing, they say, it's just numbers.
But the digital metadata trails you leave behind every day say more about you than you can imagine. Now, thanks to two MIT students, you don't have to imagine--at least with respect to your email.
Deepak Jagdish and Daniel Smilkov's Immersion program maps your life, using your email account. After you give the researchers access to your email metadata--not the content, just the time and date stamps, and "To" and "Cc" fields--they'll return to you a series of maps and graphs that will blow your mind. The program will remind you of former loves, illustrate the changing dynamics of your professional and personal networks over time, mark deaths and transitions in your life, and more. You'll probably learn something new about yourself, if you study it closely enough. (The students say they delete your data on your command.)
Whether or not you grant the program access to your data, watch the video embedded below to see Jagdish and Smilkov show illustrations from Immersion and talk about what they discerned about themselves from looking at their own metadata maps. While you're watching, remember that while the NSA and FBI are collecting our phone records in bulk, and using advanced computer algorithms to make meaning from them, state and local government officials can often also get this information without a warrant.
The Power of Metadata: Deepak Jagdish and Daniel Smilkov at TEDxCambridge 2013MIT Media Lab graduate students Deepak Jagdish and Daniel Smilkov share some surprising insights from Immersion, a tool they ...
When President Obama said that the phone surveillance program "isn't about" "listening to your telephone calls," he was deflecting attention from the terrifying fact that there's nothing currently stopping the government from amassing and data-mining every scrap of metadata in the world about us. He made it sound like metadata spying isn't a big deal, when it's pretty much the golden ticket.
Metadata surveillance is extremely powerful, and we are all subject to it, constantly. If you want to see something resembling what the NSA sees when it looks at your data, give Jagdish and Smilkov's program a try. Then tell the government: get a warrant.
In the 1950s and 60s, the NSA spied on all telegrams entering and exiting the country. The egregious actions were only uncovered after Congress set up an independent investgation called the Church Committee in the 1970s after Watergate. When the American public learned about NSA's actions, they demanded change. And the Church Committee delivered it by providing more information about the programs and by curtailing the spying.
Just like the American public in the 1970s, Americans in the 2010s know that when the government amasses dossiers on citizens, it's neither good for security nor for privacy. And a wide range of polls this week show widespread concern among the American people over the new revelations about NSA domestic spying.
Yesterday, the Guardian released a comprehensive poll showing widespread concern about NSA spying. Two-thirds of Americans think the NSA's role should be reviewed. The poll also showed Americans demanding accountability and more information from public officials--two key points of our recently launched stopwatching.us campaign.
But there's more. So far, Gallup has one of the better-worded questions, finding that 53% of Americans disapprove of the NSA spying. A CBS poll also showed that a majority--at 58%--of Americans disapprove of the government "collecting phone records of ordinary Americans." And Rasmussen--though sometimes known for push polling--also recently conducted a poll showing that 59% of Americans are opposed to the current NSA spying.
The only poll showing less than a majority on the side of government overreach was Pew Research Center, which asked Americans whether it was acceptable that the NSA obtained "secret court orders to track the calls of millions of Americans to investigate terrorism." Pew reported that 56% of Americans said it was "acceptable." But the question is poorly worded. It doesn't mention the widespread, dragnet nature of the spying. It also neglects to describe the "information" being given--metadata, which is far more sensitive and can provide far more information than just the ability to "track the calls" of Americans. And it was conducted early on in the scandal before it was revealed that the NSA doesn't even have to obtain court orders to search already collected information.
Despite the aggregate numbers, many of the polls took place at the same time Americans were finding out new facts about the program. More questions must be asked. And if history is any indication, the American people will be finding out much more. Indeed, just today the Guardian reported that its working on a whole new series with even more NSA revelations about spying.
One thing is definitely clear: the American public is demanding answers and needs more information. That's why Congress must create a special investigatory committee to reveal the full extent of the programs. Democracy demands it.