Mohan Munasinghe, co-winner of the 2007 Nobel Peace Prize as vice-chairman of the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC). (Credit:Sabina Zaccaro)
Oct 23, 2008
ROME - While there is clear
evidence of growing global warming, "the political will to address it
is still lacking," says Mohan Munasinghe, co-winner of the 2007 Nobel
Peace Prize as vice-chairman of the United Nations Intergovernmental
Panel on Climate Change (IPCC).
Munasinghe, also chairman of
the Sri Lanka-based Munasinghe Institute for Development (MIND), which
has contributed to the work of the IPCC, is among the keynote speakers
at the Oct. 23 high-level seminar at The Hague organised by the Inter
Press Service (IPS), the rights and development organisation Oxfam
Novib, and the Netherlands' National Committee for International
Cooperation and Sustainable Development (NCDO).
The meeting focuses on the support base for sustainable
development and international cooperation, and seek ways to deepen the
roles and responsibilities of both mainstream and alternative media in
this.
Media will be urged to look at the connections between issues.
Development, poverty and climate change are all related problems,
Munasinghe said. "In order to make development more sustainable in the
next 10-15 years, these problems must be addressed all together."
Excerpts from the interview:
IPS: What is the danger in isolating these issues?
Mohan Munasinghe: There are several risks related to
isolation. The most important is conflict. When you look for a solution
to one problem, it may make the other problem worse.
The second problem is that you may have duplications, and this happens
when people who work for solving one problem are sometimes doing the
same thing that other people are doing already. In that case, they are
wasting resources; economic resources but also political will.
The third and most important issue is lack of cooperation. In
order to face all these multiple crises, we have to get everybody
together, we have to create that sense of consensus, a spirit of global
consciousness. If everybody is working on their own problem, it is like
going back to the old selfish solutions.
IPS: How can such a consensus be built, and can the media help?
MM: Building a consensus means starting with the
transition, this means to make development more sustainable. This is
where I think the media have a key role. Consensus can be built looking
for what we call the win-win solutions. We have to create the feeling
that all are working together.
Of course there are some difficulties...the modern capitalist system
works exactly the opposite, it is built on competition; and that is not
going to help us to solve these global problems and develop a global
consciousness.
Ideologically, isolationism is based on the capitalist market
system, and seems to encourage this idea that if everybody thinks only
of themselves, then social or collective good will emerge. But this is
manifestly untrue. If there are no safeguards, not only legal, but
moral and ethical safeguards, we are going to have what is called a
race to the bottom, that is, the people with the worst behaviour will
win.
IPS: Would a scientific rather than ideological approach work better?
MM: In science we have seen the success of reductionism. Everything you
study in greater and greater detail, even a very obscure, detailed
topic, makes you an expert in that. But you know almost nothing about
many other areas...
What we need here is trans-disciplinarity, breaking the boundaries of
discipline but also breaking the boundaries of stakeholders. We are all
stakeholders together, so let us now forget the competition and look
more at cooperation.
If you look at the way ancient societies have been built --
take the Egyptian civilisation that lasted thousands of years -- they
were built on cooperation. We have forgotten that cooperative side.
Many communities, particularly poor rural communities, have survived
because of the community spirit.
IPS: But cooperation is also opposed by economic factors...
MM: Absolutely. In fact, the erosion of traditional values
which we are seeing in many parts of the developing world is leading to
a breakdown of social capital. Sustainable development has an economic,
a social dimension, and an environmental dimension. The economic
dimension is clearer, we want to produce more, increase GNP (gross
national product) etc. The environmental dimension of development is
also becoming clear, in the sense that we all want clean air, clean
water and so on.
The social dimension is more complicated, because it is the glue that
binds society together. This ultra-competitive mode, without ethical
and moral values, is instead leading to violence, and will lead to
fighting over resources.
There are some economic forces that are in a way taking the
neo-conservative line...We have to rethink that, and come back to this
concept of social capital. Increasingly, in a globalising world social
capital is not only good for the community and the village and the city
and the country, but for the entire planet.
IPS: After the unequivocal IPCC (Intergovernmental Panel on Climate
Change) report, are environment and climate now on top of the political
agenda?
MM: There are some politicians who are like the ostrich,
either because they are ignorant or because they represent lobbies and
communities who are profiting from the present unsustainable system.
But there are many others who are very responsible, who are trying to
move in a new direction. We have to identify the good actors and
support them.
As a civil society person, with my institution (MIND), I am entirely
devoted to that, particularly with young people. We make them feel that
as individuals they can make the difference, and also show them the
sense of respect that does not dismiss anybody, even a corrupt
politician; the message is 'maybe your job is to change them, to go out
and do something'.
And I have the same attitude towards business; we have to work
with all of these people, we need all of them. Some of them are very
difficult to live with, I agree, but that is the job of the social
activists.
IPS: Can you refer explicitly to politicians and countries performing well?
MM: Well, there are a number of environmental performance
indexes that have been developed by private think tanks. But these
lists are not perfect, and we shouldn't be complacent. I mean, 'top
countries' also need to improve, because if you are at the top of the
list but you still allow other countries to be at the very bottom, then
you're not doing enough, it is not good enough to be at the top of the
list. That is the consensus building; the success is pulling other
people.
IPS: What could information do?
MM: I think media have a tremendous role to play. I am
referring to the responsible media, because there is a spirit of
competition among media as well. Everybody wants to win the Pulitzer
Prize, sell products, make money and so on. So, we need responsible
journalism. And I think that increasingly people are looking for
responsible articles.
The problem I have is that I'm in a generation that reads newspapers,
but my children are much more TV oriented, and if I look at my
grandchildren, for them information comes just through You Tube, short
messages and so on. I have no way of reaching those people through what
I write, or even this interview...but you media know the tools. How do
we get to those people, I think this is the challenge.
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ROME - While there is clear
evidence of growing global warming, "the political will to address it
is still lacking," says Mohan Munasinghe, co-winner of the 2007 Nobel
Peace Prize as vice-chairman of the United Nations Intergovernmental
Panel on Climate Change (IPCC).
Munasinghe, also chairman of
the Sri Lanka-based Munasinghe Institute for Development (MIND), which
has contributed to the work of the IPCC, is among the keynote speakers
at the Oct. 23 high-level seminar at The Hague organised by the Inter
Press Service (IPS), the rights and development organisation Oxfam
Novib, and the Netherlands' National Committee for International
Cooperation and Sustainable Development (NCDO).
The meeting focuses on the support base for sustainable
development and international cooperation, and seek ways to deepen the
roles and responsibilities of both mainstream and alternative media in
this.
Media will be urged to look at the connections between issues.
Development, poverty and climate change are all related problems,
Munasinghe said. "In order to make development more sustainable in the
next 10-15 years, these problems must be addressed all together."
Excerpts from the interview:
IPS: What is the danger in isolating these issues?
Mohan Munasinghe: There are several risks related to
isolation. The most important is conflict. When you look for a solution
to one problem, it may make the other problem worse.
The second problem is that you may have duplications, and this happens
when people who work for solving one problem are sometimes doing the
same thing that other people are doing already. In that case, they are
wasting resources; economic resources but also political will.
The third and most important issue is lack of cooperation. In
order to face all these multiple crises, we have to get everybody
together, we have to create that sense of consensus, a spirit of global
consciousness. If everybody is working on their own problem, it is like
going back to the old selfish solutions.
IPS: How can such a consensus be built, and can the media help?
MM: Building a consensus means starting with the
transition, this means to make development more sustainable. This is
where I think the media have a key role. Consensus can be built looking
for what we call the win-win solutions. We have to create the feeling
that all are working together.
Of course there are some difficulties...the modern capitalist system
works exactly the opposite, it is built on competition; and that is not
going to help us to solve these global problems and develop a global
consciousness.
Ideologically, isolationism is based on the capitalist market
system, and seems to encourage this idea that if everybody thinks only
of themselves, then social or collective good will emerge. But this is
manifestly untrue. If there are no safeguards, not only legal, but
moral and ethical safeguards, we are going to have what is called a
race to the bottom, that is, the people with the worst behaviour will
win.
IPS: Would a scientific rather than ideological approach work better?
MM: In science we have seen the success of reductionism. Everything you
study in greater and greater detail, even a very obscure, detailed
topic, makes you an expert in that. But you know almost nothing about
many other areas...
What we need here is trans-disciplinarity, breaking the boundaries of
discipline but also breaking the boundaries of stakeholders. We are all
stakeholders together, so let us now forget the competition and look
more at cooperation.
If you look at the way ancient societies have been built --
take the Egyptian civilisation that lasted thousands of years -- they
were built on cooperation. We have forgotten that cooperative side.
Many communities, particularly poor rural communities, have survived
because of the community spirit.
IPS: But cooperation is also opposed by economic factors...
MM: Absolutely. In fact, the erosion of traditional values
which we are seeing in many parts of the developing world is leading to
a breakdown of social capital. Sustainable development has an economic,
a social dimension, and an environmental dimension. The economic
dimension is clearer, we want to produce more, increase GNP (gross
national product) etc. The environmental dimension of development is
also becoming clear, in the sense that we all want clean air, clean
water and so on.
The social dimension is more complicated, because it is the glue that
binds society together. This ultra-competitive mode, without ethical
and moral values, is instead leading to violence, and will lead to
fighting over resources.
There are some economic forces that are in a way taking the
neo-conservative line...We have to rethink that, and come back to this
concept of social capital. Increasingly, in a globalising world social
capital is not only good for the community and the village and the city
and the country, but for the entire planet.
IPS: After the unequivocal IPCC (Intergovernmental Panel on Climate
Change) report, are environment and climate now on top of the political
agenda?
MM: There are some politicians who are like the ostrich,
either because they are ignorant or because they represent lobbies and
communities who are profiting from the present unsustainable system.
But there are many others who are very responsible, who are trying to
move in a new direction. We have to identify the good actors and
support them.
As a civil society person, with my institution (MIND), I am entirely
devoted to that, particularly with young people. We make them feel that
as individuals they can make the difference, and also show them the
sense of respect that does not dismiss anybody, even a corrupt
politician; the message is 'maybe your job is to change them, to go out
and do something'.
And I have the same attitude towards business; we have to work
with all of these people, we need all of them. Some of them are very
difficult to live with, I agree, but that is the job of the social
activists.
IPS: Can you refer explicitly to politicians and countries performing well?
MM: Well, there are a number of environmental performance
indexes that have been developed by private think tanks. But these
lists are not perfect, and we shouldn't be complacent. I mean, 'top
countries' also need to improve, because if you are at the top of the
list but you still allow other countries to be at the very bottom, then
you're not doing enough, it is not good enough to be at the top of the
list. That is the consensus building; the success is pulling other
people.
IPS: What could information do?
MM: I think media have a tremendous role to play. I am
referring to the responsible media, because there is a spirit of
competition among media as well. Everybody wants to win the Pulitzer
Prize, sell products, make money and so on. So, we need responsible
journalism. And I think that increasingly people are looking for
responsible articles.
The problem I have is that I'm in a generation that reads newspapers,
but my children are much more TV oriented, and if I look at my
grandchildren, for them information comes just through You Tube, short
messages and so on. I have no way of reaching those people through what
I write, or even this interview...but you media know the tools. How do
we get to those people, I think this is the challenge.
ROME - While there is clear
evidence of growing global warming, "the political will to address it
is still lacking," says Mohan Munasinghe, co-winner of the 2007 Nobel
Peace Prize as vice-chairman of the United Nations Intergovernmental
Panel on Climate Change (IPCC).
Munasinghe, also chairman of
the Sri Lanka-based Munasinghe Institute for Development (MIND), which
has contributed to the work of the IPCC, is among the keynote speakers
at the Oct. 23 high-level seminar at The Hague organised by the Inter
Press Service (IPS), the rights and development organisation Oxfam
Novib, and the Netherlands' National Committee for International
Cooperation and Sustainable Development (NCDO).
The meeting focuses on the support base for sustainable
development and international cooperation, and seek ways to deepen the
roles and responsibilities of both mainstream and alternative media in
this.
Media will be urged to look at the connections between issues.
Development, poverty and climate change are all related problems,
Munasinghe said. "In order to make development more sustainable in the
next 10-15 years, these problems must be addressed all together."
Excerpts from the interview:
IPS: What is the danger in isolating these issues?
Mohan Munasinghe: There are several risks related to
isolation. The most important is conflict. When you look for a solution
to one problem, it may make the other problem worse.
The second problem is that you may have duplications, and this happens
when people who work for solving one problem are sometimes doing the
same thing that other people are doing already. In that case, they are
wasting resources; economic resources but also political will.
The third and most important issue is lack of cooperation. In
order to face all these multiple crises, we have to get everybody
together, we have to create that sense of consensus, a spirit of global
consciousness. If everybody is working on their own problem, it is like
going back to the old selfish solutions.
IPS: How can such a consensus be built, and can the media help?
MM: Building a consensus means starting with the
transition, this means to make development more sustainable. This is
where I think the media have a key role. Consensus can be built looking
for what we call the win-win solutions. We have to create the feeling
that all are working together.
Of course there are some difficulties...the modern capitalist system
works exactly the opposite, it is built on competition; and that is not
going to help us to solve these global problems and develop a global
consciousness.
Ideologically, isolationism is based on the capitalist market
system, and seems to encourage this idea that if everybody thinks only
of themselves, then social or collective good will emerge. But this is
manifestly untrue. If there are no safeguards, not only legal, but
moral and ethical safeguards, we are going to have what is called a
race to the bottom, that is, the people with the worst behaviour will
win.
IPS: Would a scientific rather than ideological approach work better?
MM: In science we have seen the success of reductionism. Everything you
study in greater and greater detail, even a very obscure, detailed
topic, makes you an expert in that. But you know almost nothing about
many other areas...
What we need here is trans-disciplinarity, breaking the boundaries of
discipline but also breaking the boundaries of stakeholders. We are all
stakeholders together, so let us now forget the competition and look
more at cooperation.
If you look at the way ancient societies have been built --
take the Egyptian civilisation that lasted thousands of years -- they
were built on cooperation. We have forgotten that cooperative side.
Many communities, particularly poor rural communities, have survived
because of the community spirit.
IPS: But cooperation is also opposed by economic factors...
MM: Absolutely. In fact, the erosion of traditional values
which we are seeing in many parts of the developing world is leading to
a breakdown of social capital. Sustainable development has an economic,
a social dimension, and an environmental dimension. The economic
dimension is clearer, we want to produce more, increase GNP (gross
national product) etc. The environmental dimension of development is
also becoming clear, in the sense that we all want clean air, clean
water and so on.
The social dimension is more complicated, because it is the glue that
binds society together. This ultra-competitive mode, without ethical
and moral values, is instead leading to violence, and will lead to
fighting over resources.
There are some economic forces that are in a way taking the
neo-conservative line...We have to rethink that, and come back to this
concept of social capital. Increasingly, in a globalising world social
capital is not only good for the community and the village and the city
and the country, but for the entire planet.
IPS: After the unequivocal IPCC (Intergovernmental Panel on Climate
Change) report, are environment and climate now on top of the political
agenda?
MM: There are some politicians who are like the ostrich,
either because they are ignorant or because they represent lobbies and
communities who are profiting from the present unsustainable system.
But there are many others who are very responsible, who are trying to
move in a new direction. We have to identify the good actors and
support them.
As a civil society person, with my institution (MIND), I am entirely
devoted to that, particularly with young people. We make them feel that
as individuals they can make the difference, and also show them the
sense of respect that does not dismiss anybody, even a corrupt
politician; the message is 'maybe your job is to change them, to go out
and do something'.
And I have the same attitude towards business; we have to work
with all of these people, we need all of them. Some of them are very
difficult to live with, I agree, but that is the job of the social
activists.
IPS: Can you refer explicitly to politicians and countries performing well?
MM: Well, there are a number of environmental performance
indexes that have been developed by private think tanks. But these
lists are not perfect, and we shouldn't be complacent. I mean, 'top
countries' also need to improve, because if you are at the top of the
list but you still allow other countries to be at the very bottom, then
you're not doing enough, it is not good enough to be at the top of the
list. That is the consensus building; the success is pulling other
people.
IPS: What could information do?
MM: I think media have a tremendous role to play. I am
referring to the responsible media, because there is a spirit of
competition among media as well. Everybody wants to win the Pulitzer
Prize, sell products, make money and so on. So, we need responsible
journalism. And I think that increasingly people are looking for
responsible articles.
The problem I have is that I'm in a generation that reads newspapers,
but my children are much more TV oriented, and if I look at my
grandchildren, for them information comes just through You Tube, short
messages and so on. I have no way of reaching those people through what
I write, or even this interview...but you media know the tools. How do
we get to those people, I think this is the challenge.
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