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Who’s Bashing Teachers and Public Schools and What Can We Do About It?
The short answer to this question is that far too many people are bashing teachers and public schools, and we need to give them more homework, because very few of them know what they’re talking about. And a few need some serious detention.
(Illustration: David McLimans)
But the longer answer is that the bashing is coming from different places for different reasons. And to respond effectively to the very real attacks that our schools, our profession, and our communities face, it’s important to pay attention to these differences.
The parent who’s angry at the public school system because it’s not successfully educating his/her children is not the same as the billionaire with no education experience who couldn’t survive in a classroom for two days, but who has made privatizing education policy a hobby, and who has the resources to do so because the country’s financial and tax systems are broken.
The educators who start a community-based charter school so they can create a collaborative school culture are not the same as the hedge fund managers who invest in charter schools because they see an opportunity to turn a profit or because they want to privatize one of the last public institutions we have left.
The well-meaning college grad who joins a Teach for America program out of an altruistic impulse is not the same as the corporate managers who want to use market reforms to create a less expensive, less secure, and less experienced teaching force.
And the hard-pressed taxpayer who directs frustration at teachers struggling to hang on to their health insurance or pensions—which far too few people have at all—is not coming from the same place as those responsible for the obscene economic inequality that is squeezing both.
In my home state of New Jersey, there’s a man named David Tepper who manages the Appaloosa Hedge Fund. Last year, Tepper made $4 billion as a hedge fund manager. This was equal to the salaries of 60 percent of the state’s teachers, who educate 850,000 students. But Gov. Christie rolled back a millionaire’s tax and cut $1 billion out of the state school budget, so people like Tepper would have lower taxes. It’s not only impossible to sustain a successful public school system with such policies, it’s also impossible to sustain anything resembling a democracy for very long.
What’s at Stake
I’ve spent a large part of my adult life criticizing the flawed institutions and policies of public education as a teacher, an education activist, and a policy advocate. But these days I find myself spending a lot of time defending the very idea of public education against those who say, sometimes literally, it should be blown up. Because the increasingly polarized national debate around education policy is not just about whether teachers feel the sting of public criticism or whether school budgets suffer another round of budget cuts in a society that has its priorities seriously upside down.
It’s really not even about the hot-button reform issues like merit pay or charter schools. What’s ultimately at stake is more basic. It’s whether the right to a free public education for all children is going to survive as a fundamental democratic promise in our society, and whether the schools and districts needed to provide it are going to survive as public institutions, collectively owned and democratically managed—however imperfectly—by all of us as citizens. Or will they be privatized and commercialized by the corporate interests that increasingly dominate all aspects of our society?
The corporate reformers’ larger goal, to borrow a phrase from the Democrats for Education Reform (DFER), a political lobby financed by hedge fund millionaires that is a chief architect of the current campaign, is to “burst the dam” that has historically protected public education and its $600 billion annual expenditures from unchecked commercial exploitation and privatization.
This is not some secret conspiracy. It’s a multisided political campaign funded by wealthy financial interests like hedge fund superstar Whitney Tilson and rich private foundations like Gates, Broad, and Walton. And it’s important to keep this big picture in mind, even as we talk about specifics like merit pay and charters, because these issues are the dynamite charges being put in place to burst the dam.
What is really new and alarming are the large strides that those promoting business models and market reforms have made in attaching their agenda to the urgent need of poor communities who have, in too many cases, been badly served by the current system.
The narrative of public education as a systematic failure has been fed in recent years by the shifting of federal policy away from its historic role as a promoter of access and equity in public education through support for things like school integration, extra funding for high-poverty schools, and services for students with special needs, to a much less equitable set of federal mandates around testing, closing schools, firing school staff, and distributing federal funds through competitive grants to “winners” at the expense of “losers.” Taken together these policies, embodied first in NCLB and now in a “Race Over the Cliff,” have helped create an impression of public education as a failure that is steadily eroding the common ground it needs to survive.
Democrats have been playing tag team with Republicans to build on the test-and-punish approach. Just how much this bipartisan consensus has solidified came home to me when I picked up my local paper one morning and saw Gov. Christie, the most anti-public education governor New Jersey has ever had, quoted as saying, “This is an incredibly special moment in American history, where you have Republicans in New Jersey agreeing with a Democratic president on how to get reform.”
Under NCLB this bipartisan consensus used test scores to move decisions about teaching and learning away from classrooms, schools, and districts to state and federal bureaucracies. Test score gaps have been used to label schools as failures without providing the resources and strategies needed to eliminate the gaps.
Today a deepening corporate/foundation/political alliance is using this same test-based accountability to drill down further into the fabric of public education to close schools, transform the teaching profession, and increase the authority of mayors and managers while decreasing the power of educators.
What we’re facing is a policy environment where bad ideas nurtured for years in conservative think tanks and private foundations have taken root in Congress, the White House, and the federal education department, and are now aligned with powerful national and state campaigns fueled with unprecedented amounts of public and private dollars.
Unless we change direction, the combined impact of these proposals will do for public schooling what market reform has done for housing, health care, and the economy: produce fabulous profits for a few and unequal access and outcomes for the many.
The corporate/foundation crowd has successfully captured the media label as “education reformers.” If you support charters, merit pay, and control of school policy by corporate managers you’re a reformer. If you support increased school funding, collective bargaining, and control of school policy by educators, you’re a defender of the status quo. This is hardly a surprise in a media culture that allows FOX News to call itself “fair and balanced,” but it does make intelligent debate about education policy more difficult.
Confronting Poverty
This is particularly true when it comes to the way the issue of poverty is being framed.
One lesson I’ve learned over the years is that school power comes in many pieces. And these pieces, large or small, can be used to promote social justice. Not only on big issues like funding equity or federal and state policy, but also daily inside our classrooms in the choices we make in our teaching, assessment, and curriculum practices; in the relations between our schools and the communities they serve; and in the way our unions advocate for the needs and rights of our students and families along with our own interests as teachers.
Serving schools with high numbers of students in poverty is no excuse for bad teaching, poor curriculum, massive dropout rates, or year after year of lousy school outcomes. We need accountability systems that put pressure on schools to respond effectively to the communities they serve. In my experience, parents are the key to creating that pressure, and teachers are the key to implementing the changes needed to address it. Finding ways to promote a kind of collaborative tension and partnership between these groups is one of the keys to school improvement.
But the idea that schools alone can make up for the inequality and poverty that exist all around them has increasingly become part of the “no excuses” drumbeat used to impose reforms that have no record of success as school improvement strategies. In fact, many are not educational strategies at all, but political strategies designed to bring market reform to public education. We used to hear that the “single most important school-based factor” in student achievement was the quality of the teacher. Now even the school-based qualification is being left out. Instead we’re hearing absurd claims about how super-teachers can eliminate achievement gaps in two or three years with scripted curricula handed down from above, and how the real problem in schools is not the country’s shameful 23 percent child poverty rate or underfunded schools. Instead, it’s bad teachers.
Now it’s absolutely true that effective teachers and good schools can make an enormous difference in the life chances of children. And it’s also true that struggling teachers who don’t improve after they’ve been given support and opportunities to do so need to go manage hedge funds or do some other less important work.
But when it comes to student achievement—and especially the narrow kind of culturally slanted pseudo-achievement captured by standardized test scores—there is no evidence that the test score gaps you read about constantly in the papers can be traced to bad teaching, and there is overwhelming evidence that they closely reflect the inequalities of race, class, and opportunity that follow students to school.
Teachers count a lot. But reality counts, too, and “reformers” who discount the impact of poverty are actually the ones making excuses for their failure to make poverty reduction and adequate and equitable school funding a central part of school improvement efforts. The federal government has put more effort into pressing states to tie individual teacher compensation to test scores and eliminate caps on charter schools than encouraging them to distribute more fairly the $600 billion they spend annually on K-12 education.
Instead, at a time when corporate profits and economic inequality are at their highest levels in the history of the country, the U.S. secretary of education says that schools must get used to the “new normal” and do more with less. For Arne Duncan and Bill Gates, cutting education budgets is not a problem, it’s an opportunity. They are now traveling the country proposing that schools save money by increasing class sizes, ending pay for teachers’ experience and advanced degrees, closing schools, and replacing real classrooms with virtual ones.
At the same time they want to spend hundreds of millions of dollars to create more tests based on the new common core standards and use those tests to implement merit pay plans.
No Value in ‘Value Added’
At this point spending more money on standardized tests to track academic achievement gaps is like passing out thermometers in a malaria epidemic. People need better health care, more hospitals, and better-trained doctors. They don’t need more thermometers.
There is no research that shows that paying teachers to raise test scores improves student achievement, raises graduation rates, increases college participation, narrows academic gaps, or produces any of the positive school outcomes that policy makers say they seek.
Test-based teacher evaluation systems have the potential to seriously damage the teaching profession. The National Academy of Sciences found 20 to 30 percent error rates in “value-added” ratings systems based on their own dubious premises. Teachers in the bottom group one year were often in the top group the next and vice versa. The same teachers measured by two different standardized tests produced completely inconsistent results. The basic assumptions of these testing systems are at odds with the way real schools actually work. Bending school practices to accommodate them could negatively affect everything from the way students are assigned to classes to the willingness of teachers to serve high-needs populations and the collaborative professional culture that good schools depend on for success. They would also require yet another massive increase in standardized testing to deal with the fact that less than 25 percent of teachers in most school systems teach math and language arts, which is what most states currently test.
When you add the practice now under way in cities like Los Angeles and New York of publishing these psychometric astrology ratings in the paper next to the names of individual teachers, you have a recipe for community chaos and educational tragedy.
These plans are not about helping schools develop better systems to support teacher effectiveness; they are obstacles to it. For example, in Maryland, the Montgomery County Education Association negotiated a professional growth system that included test scores as one part of an evaluation process that looks at student outcomes, classroom performance, professional responsibilities, advanced degrees, and other factors. The process requires all new teachers and teachers who’ve been identified as struggling to work with well-trained teacher coaches over a two-year period to improve their practice and results. The system has resulted in a significant increase in teacher quality, including decisions, jointly supported by the union and administration, to remove several hundred teachers from the classroom over a period of years. But last year Maryland won a Race to the Top grant that, under federal pressure, requires 50 percent of teacher evaluations to be based strictly on test scores. The grant threatens to destroy a successful system developed by collective bargaining that actually works to improve results for teachers and students.
The Changing Character of the Charter Movement
The last issue I want to discuss is charter schools. As you know if you’ve seen Waiting for “Superman,” charter schools are being hailed as a kind of new magic reform bullet.
Charter schools have an interesting history that has often been overlooked in the current debate. The first charter schools were initiated by Albert Shanker and the American Federation of Teachers in New York City in the late ’80s and ’90s. They were originally designed as teacher-run schools that would serve students who were struggling inside the regular system and would operate outside the reach of the administrative bureaucracy and the highly politicized school board. These first charters also drew on early rounds of small high school experiments initiated by teachers or community activists as alternatives to large comprehensive high schools. But, after a few years, Shanker became concerned that the charters and small schools were fragmenting the district, creating unequal tiers of schools serving different populations of students with unequal access, and also weakening the collective power of the teachers’ union to negotiate with the administration about districtwide concerns. So he pulled back at a time when there were still very few charters. Instead, he and other union leaders focused on the standards movement, which for them became the primary engine for reform.
But charters continued to grow slowly. Individual states, beginning with Minnesota, began to pass laws to promote the formation of charters, partly as a model of reform and partly as the construction of a parallel system outside the reach of both teachers’ unions and, in some cases, the federal and state requirements to serve and accept all students. And this charter movement gradually began to attract the interest of political and financial interests who saw the public school system as a socialist monopoly ripe for market reform.
In the past 10 years, the character of the charter school movement has changed dramatically from community-based, educator-initiated local efforts to create alternatives for a small number of students to nationally funded efforts by foundations, investors, and educational management companies to create a parallel, more privatized system.
Today there are about 5,000 charter schools in the United States that enroll about 4 percent of all students. Although charter laws are different in each state, in general charter schools are publicly funded but privately run. Few justify the hype they receive in Waiting for “Superman,” and those that do, like the schools featured in the film, are highly selective, privately subsidized schools that have very limited relevance for the public system. It’s like looking for models of public housing by studying luxury condo developments.
The most complete study of charter school performance, by Stanford University, found that only 17 percent of charter schools had better test scores than comparable public schools and more than twice as many did worse. And, unlike charter schools, traditional public schools accept all children, including much larger numbers of high-needs students and students without the heroic, supportive parents seen in the film. In most states charters do not face the same public accountability and transparency requirements that public schools do, which has led to serious problems of mismanagement, corruption, and profiteering.
Charter school teachers are, on average, younger, nonunionized, and less likely to hold state certification than teachers in traditional public schools. In other words: less expensive.
As many as one in four charter school teachers leaves every year, about double the turnover rate in traditional public schools. The odds of a teacher leaving the profession altogether are 130 percent higher at charters than traditional public schools, and much of this teacher attrition is related to dissatisfaction with working conditions.
Charter schools typically pay less and require longer hours. But charter school administrators often earn more than their school district counterparts. Geoffrey Canada of the Harlem Children’s Zone and Eva Moskowitz of the Harlem Success Academy, two schools featured in the film, are each paid close to half a million dollars.
This is not to deny the reform impulse that is a real part of the charter movement. Many times during my 30 years of teaching at my large dysfunctional high school in Paterson, I wanted to start my own school. And many of the issues that public school advocates like myself criticize in charters—like the tracking, creaming, and unequal resources—exist within the public system too. But public schools have federal, state, and district obligations that can be brought to bear. There are school boards, public budgets, public policies, and public officials to pressure and hold accountable in ways that privatized charters don’t allow. In post-Katrina New Orleans, where more than 60 percent of all students now attend unequal tiers of charter schools, there are students and parents who cannot find any schools to take them.
In too many places, charters function more like deregulated “enterprise zones” than models of reform, providing subsidized spaces for a few at the expense of the many. They drain resources, staff, and energy for innovation away from other district schools, often while creaming better prepared students and more committed parents. This is especially a problem in big city public systems that urgently need renewal and resources but are increasingly being left behind with the biggest challenges. Nowhere have charters produced a template for effective districtwide reform or equity.
No one questions the desire of parents to find the best options they can for their children. But at the level of state and federal education policy, charters can provide a reform cover for dismantling the public school system and an investment opportunity for those who see education as a business rather than a fundamental institution of democratic civic life. This doesn’t mean charter school teachers or parents are our enemies. On the contrary, we should be allies in fighting some of the counterproductive assessment, curriculum, and instructional practices raining down on all of us from above. We should find more and better ways to integrate charters into common systems of accountability and support. Where practices like greater autonomy over curriculum or freedom from bureaucratic regulations are valid, they should be extended to all schools.
But any strategy that promotes charter expansion at the expense of systemwide improvement and equity for all schools is a plan for privatization, not reform.
What Are We Fighting For?
It took well over a hundred years to create a public school system that, for all its flaws, provides a free education for all children as a legal right. It took campaigns against child labor, crusades for public taxation, struggles against fear and discrimination directed at immigrants, historic movements for civil rights against legally sanctioned separate and unequal schooling, movements for equal rights and educational access for women, and in more recent decades sustained drives for the rights of special education students, gay and lesbian students, bilingual students, and Native American students. These campaigns are all unfinished and the gains they’ve made are uneven and fragile. But they have made public schools one of the last places where an increasingly diverse and divided population still comes together for a common civic purpose.
But the system’s Achilles’ heel continues to be acute racial and class inequality, which in fact is the Achilles’ heel of the whole society.
Those who believe that business models and market reforms hold the key to solving educational problems have, as noted, made strides in attaching their agenda to the urgent need of communities that have been poorly served by the current system. But their agenda does not represent the real interests or the real desires of these communities:
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It does not include all children and all families.
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It does not include adequate, equitable, and sustainable funding.
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It does not include transparent public accountability.
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It does not include the supports and reforms that educators need to do their jobs well.
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It does not address the legacy or the current realities of race and class inequality that surround our schools every day.
Where we go from here, as advocates and activists for social justice, depends in part on our ability to reinvent and articulate this missing equity agenda and to build a reform movement that can provide effective, credible alternatives to the strategies that are currently being imposed from above.
Because, in the final analysis, what we need to reclaim is not just our schools, but our political process, our public policy-making machinery, and control over our economic and social future. In short, we don’t only need to fix our schools, we also need to fix our democracy.
- Posted in
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71 Comments so far
Show All"And it’s also true that struggling teachers who don’t improve after they’ve been given support and opportunities to do so need to go manage hedge funds or do some other less important work."
So true. And it is the administrators who choose not to address the issues of the struggling teachers, and those teachers themselves, who should shoulder the blame for the few "inadequate" teachers that still have jobs.
OYE
"...it does make intelligent debate about education policy more difficult."
The critical problem with this article is its premise (quoted above) that the fundamental problem of selling a social right for profit (in this case public education) is due to a lack of "intelligent debate about education policy."
That's not the fundamental problem.
Nevertheless, this article goes into a comprehensive and superbly detailed analysis as if it were.
The fundamental problem is power. Those who stand to profit from selling a social right have it, and those like the guy who wrote this, don''t.
If the author of this piece were truly trying to "fight" for a social right, then he would address this fundamental problem of power.
One of the manifestaions of that problem comes in the form of today's unions--such as the WEAC--that serve to suppress, undermine and misdirect the "fight" for public education before the fight even gets started.
Instead, this author, like most on the fake left, seems to prefer to avoid confronting such uncomfortabel realities.
Continued good-luck with that.
Stan Karp wrote:
"The corporate/foundation crowd has successfully captured the media label as “education reformers.” If you support charters, merit pay, and control of school policy by corporate managers you’re a reformer. If you support increased school funding, collective bargaining, and control of school policy by educators, you’re a defender of the status quo. This is hardly a surprise in a media culture that allows FOX News to call itself “fair and balanced,” but it does make intelligent debate about education policy more difficult."
* * * * *
gregsdiary wrote"
"'...it does make intelligent debate about education policy more difficult.'
The critical problem with this article is its premise (quoted above) that the fundamental problem of selling a social right for profit (in this case public education) is due to a lack of "intelligent debate about education policy."
That's not the fundamental problem.
Nevertheless, this article goes into a comprehensive and superbly detailed analysis as if it were.
The fundamental problem is power."
* * * * *
My Reply:
Actually, if the statements immediately preceeding the text you have excerpted from Stan Karp's article are included in the quote, and particular attention is paid to the first sentence, then I suspect that most of us would conclude that you have provided us with just one of many examples from the article where Karp talks about the fundament problem of power.
After all, it must have taken considerable power for the "corporate/foundation crowd [to have] successfully captured the media label as “education reformers.” The fact that this power is power that the corporate/foundation crowd have had for a long time does not change this fact.
Controlling the conversation or debate may not seem all that important. Conversation and debate are after all such polite words. But Stan Karp without explicitly saying so (Is that really necessary?) shows who has been framed to appear as the "good guys" and who has been framed to appear as the "bad guys".
Personally, I do not care whether Stan Karp is part of the "fake left" as you suggest, or part of the "real left" as you might wish, or not part of the left at all; so long as Stan Karp is actually doing something about and has something reasonably insightful to say about the attack upon teachers and upon public education in this country.
"Personally, I do not care whether Stan Karp is part of the "fake left" as you suggest, or part of the "real left" as you might wish, or not part of the left at all; so long as Stan Karp is actually doing something about and has something reasonably insightful to say about the attack upon teachers and upon public education in this country."
Yes, today's progressives and liberals like to stay "informed" and like "getting things done." And they've been doing it now for the last 40 years.
Like I said, continued good-luck with that.
Conspiracy of Delusion.
Yeah. Well, some of us working class folks have kids in school now. Maybe you do too. Lots of us with kids in school who live anywhere near Madison, Wisconsin were in the streets for days. Your own critique of Stan Karp's article suggests that your grasp of the power problem isn't all that good. So,let's hope that your version of the "real left" is more than just a one trick pony.
"Lots of us with kids in school who live anywhere near Madison, Wisconsin were in the streets for days."
And what was the outcome?
More important, what do you think of the role the unions like WEAC played in the determination of that outcome?
gregsdiary wrote:
"Yes, today's progressives and liberals like to stay "informed" and like "getting things done." And they've been doing it now for the last 40 years.
Like I said, continued good-luck with that."
* * * * *
My Second Reply:
You have a problem with and "staying informed" and "getting things done?"
That's . . . .
Well, that's incredible!
But, surely you must know that pointless infighting has been a serious problem for the left in the United States since at least the early part of the last century.
[Please do the math.]
Like you said, continued good-luck with that!
"Instead we’re hearing absurd claims about how super-teachers can eliminate achievement gaps in two or three years with scripted curricula handed down from above, and how the real problem in schools is not the country’s shameful 23 percent child poverty rate or underfunded schools. Instead, it’s bad teachers."
As some narrow the focus of the problem to "bad teachers," others narrow the focus of the problem to a lack of "intelligent debate about education policy."
Meanwhile, just as in healthcare, privatization becomes more entrenched.
gregsdiary wrote (quoting Stan Karp):
"Instead we’re hearing absurd claims about how super-teachers can eliminate achievement gaps in two or three years with scripted curricula handed down from above, and how the real problem in schools is not the country’s shameful 23 percent child poverty rate or underfunded schools. Instead, it’s bad teachers."
As some narrow the focus of the problem to "bad teachers," others narrow the focus of the problem to a lack of "intelligent debate about education policy."
Meanwhile, just as in healthcare, privatization becomes more entrenched.
* * * * *
My Reply To GREGSDIARY:
Sheesh!
Even your own excerpts quoted from Stan Karp's article argue against your point.
Just about anyone who read the article knows that what you claim simply isn't true.
But why shouldn't I just let Stan Karp make the argument rather than me?
* * * * *
Stan Karp wrote:
"What Are We Fighting For?
It took well over a hundred years to create a public school system that, for all its flaws, provides a free education for all children as a legal right. It took campaigns against child labor, crusades for public taxation, struggles against fear and discrimination directed at immigrants, historic movements for civil rights against legally sanctioned separate and unequal schooling, movements for equal rights and educational access for women, and in more recent decades sustained drives for the rights of special education students, gay and lesbian students, bilingual students, and Native American students. These campaigns are all unfinished and the gains they’ve made are uneven and fragile. But they have made public schools one of the last places where an increasingly diverse and divided population still comes together for a common civic purpose.
But the system’s Achilles’ heel continues to be acute racial and class inequality, which in fact is the Achilles’ heel of the whole society.
Those who believe that business models and market reforms hold the key to solving educational problems have, as noted, made strides in attaching their agenda to the urgent need of communities that have been poorly served by the current system. But their agenda does not represent the real interests or the real desires of these communities:
•It does not include all children and all families.
•It does not include adequate, equitable, and sustainable funding.
•It does not include transparent public accountability.
•It does not include the supports and reforms that educators need to do their jobs well.
•It does not address the legacy or the current realities of race and class inequality that surround our schools every day.
Where we go from here, as advocates and activists for social justice, depends in part on our ability to reinvent and articulate this missing equity agenda and to build a reform movement that can provide effective, credible alternatives to the strategies that are currently being imposed from above.
Because, in the final analysis, what we need to reclaim is not just our schools, but our political process, our public policy-making machinery, and control over our economic and social future. In short, we don’t only need to fix our schools, we also need to fix our democracy."
* * * * *
My Questions For GREGSDIARY:
Do you gregsdiary by any chance see a criticism of privatization or the unequal distribution of power in society anywhere in Stan Karp's words?
Or are you simply so blinded by your own need to make sure everyone knows they must speak in the language of what you consider to be the "real left" that you can't even understand what you are reading?
Given Stan Karp's 30 year profession as a teacher, the title of his article, and your apparent inability to "get it", there are at least two major ironies here in your criticism of Karp!
I'll add a pun.
Just stop the carping!
You don't know what you are talking about!
Reply To GREGSDIARY:
And please read more of the other comments written by others both about this article and the problems of unions and with the solidarity among teachers etc that have already been posted here.
"And please read more of the other comments written by others both about this article and the problems of unions and with the solidarity among teachers etc that have already been posted here."
Gee, I don't think Stan mentioned any problem with the unions representing the ruling elite instead of the workers.
Maybe that's because the author doesn't represent the interests of workers anymore than the unions and the Democrats do.
Instead, after what the unions just did in Wisconsin, Stan and the rest of the fake left are busy pointing blame at "Bashers" and the need to elevate civil discourse etc.
This kind of argument appeals to a progressive/liberal sense of "moral" superiority and persecution because of their "purity."
Meanwhile, privatization becomes more entrenched.
Funny how that works.
Even after 40 years.
gregsdiary also wrote:
"One of the manifestaions of that problem comes in the form of today's unions--such as the WEAC--that serve to suppress, undermine and misdirect the "fight" for public education before the fight even gets started."
* * * * *
My Comment:
Well, the only complaints that you have made against Stan Karp's article that possibly have any crediabilty as far as I can tell is that Karp has not condemned teacher's unions or the leadership of teachers' unions for as you put it "representing the ruling elite."
While Stan Karp seemed to me to imply some criticism of teacher union leadership when he described the shift in focus by Albert Shanker of the American Federation of Teachers from charter schools to standards, no other real criticism of teachers unions was offered by Karp.
This does not change the fact that your repeated claims that Karp had not addressed any aspects of the problem of power were contradicted not only by text from Karp's article that you yourself chose to quote, but by much of what Karp said in his article which you chose to ignore.
Your repeated claims that Karp had not addressed any aspects of the problem of power remain as inaccurate as ever.
I was not in Madison, Wisconsin during the protests and have never lived in the state. What I heard about the role of unions, at least in the protests, was largely positive.
Teachers and their union, the Wisconsin Education Association Council, were of course said to have made concessions on pay and benefits but would not relinguish their collective bargaining rights.
Perhaps, then your complaint is with WEAC President Mary Bell and the Wisconsin Education Association Council in particular and / or teachers' unions in general.
While it will not change my view of Stan Karp's article, of your critique of Stan Karp's article, or of your intolerance toward other people's points of view, I am nevertheless interested in hearing your perspective on what happened in Wisconsin and your perspective on teachers' unions in general. Perhaps, others might be interested too.
"While Stan Karp seemed to me to imply some criticism of teacher union leadership when he described the shift in focus by Albert Shanker of the American Federation of Teachers from charter schools to standards, no other real criticism of teachers unions was offered by Karp."
Why do you suppose that is?
One way to find out the answer is to accept the premise of this article and take its arguments to their logical conclusions. And as I mentioned in my first post on this thread, the premise of this article is that the fundamental problem of selling a social right for profit (in this case public education) is due to a lack of "intelligent debate about education policy."
Ok, so let's just suppose that somehow, someway, through elevated civil discousre and discussion "bashers" and others suddenly "got it" and understanding regarding our social rights reigned supreme throughout the land.
Yahoo!!
What would change?
As far the continued privatization of social rights goes, nothing would change.
That's becuause those who seek to sell a social right for profit do so becuase they CAN. They have the power to make such profit and so they do.
It's as simple as that.
And all the elevated discussion and proselytizing in the world is not going to change that simple fact.
What would effect such a change?
The active engagement of the working class to challenge power.
When it comes to fighting for social rights, the working class challenge to power is where that fight happens. It's where the rubber hits the road so to speak.
So it is significant that Stan doesn't even mention Wisconson--never mind the betrayal of workers by union officials.
It is my contention that Stan, along with the rest of the fake left, avoids mentioning such betrayals because when it comes to workers rights versus the ruling elite, they are not on the workers' side in the first place.
gregsdiary wrote:
“When it comes to fighting for social rights, the working class challenge to power is where that fight happens. It's where the rubber hits the road so to speak.
So it is significant that Stan doesn't even mention Wisconson--never mind the betrayal of workers by union officials.
It is my contention that Stan, along with the rest of the fake left, avoids mentioning such betrayals because when it comes to workers rights versus the ruling elite, they are not on the workers' side in the first place.”
* * * * *
My Reply:
So, in the final analysis it appears that you are basing your entire argument, that Stan Karp did not at all address the fundament problem of power in his article, on whether or not the members of the Wisconsin Education Association Council vote Mary Bell out of office as the president of the WEAC when the next opportunity arises.
You may know better than I whether or not that will happen, because I certainly don’t know.
It is incredible how much hatred some left wing working class people have for other working class people in this country.
"So, in the final analysis it appears that you are basing your entire argument, that Stan Karp did not at all address the fundament problem of power in his article, on whether or not the members of the Wisconsin Education Association Council vote Mary Bell out of office as the president of the WEAC when the next opportunity arises."
Just as the rest of the Right narrows the focus of an issue by singling out teachers, this is another good example of how in a like-wise fashion, the fake left narrows the focus of an issue down to personal feelings (as in, don't be a hater) and the singling out of one particular official.
In both instances, the goal is to misdirect attention from any real challenge to the ruling elite.
40 years of this nonsense is enough.
gregsdiary wrote:
“Just as the rest of the Right narrows the focus of an issue by singling out teachers, this is another good example of how in a like-wise fashion, the fake left narrows the focus of an issue down to personal feelings (as in, don't be a hater) and the singling out of one particular official.
In both instances, the goal is to misdirect attention from any real challenge to the ruling elite.”
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My Reply:
Stan Karp did not narrow the focus of concern about the problem of power and the dismantling of public education. You did. You narrowed the focus of concern about the problem of power by singling out unions, and attempted to narrow the focus of Stan Karp’s article by erroneously claiming that the basic premise of the article was that the problem was simply a lack of "intelligent debate about education policy."
What’s more, you have repeatedly narrowed the problem of mounting a real challenge to the ruling class to what you perceive to be the betrayal of the working class by the so-called fake left; ignoring the fact that the animosity you feel and seek to engender in others toward other working class people who do not share your narrow perspective divides the left in ways that have repeatedly undermined efforts to effectively challenge the ruling class in the past.
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Brief Recapitulation:
gregsdiary wrote:
“The fundamental problem is power. Those who stand to profit from selling a social right have it, and those like the guy who wrote this, don''t.
If the author of this piece were truly trying to "fight" for a social right, then he would address this fundamental problem of power.”
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My Reply:
As the article thoroughly demonstrates the author Stan Karp does addressed the fundamental problem of power in his article in a myriad of ways.
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gregsdiary wrote:
” the premise of this article is that the fundamental problem of selling a social right for profit (in this case public education) is due to a lack of "intelligent debate about education policy."
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My Reply:
You were never able to demonstrate that this claim was true, because the content of the article refutes it.
* * * * *
gregsdiary wrote:
“When it comes to fighting for social rights, the working class challenge to power is where that fight happens. It's where the rubber hits the road so to speak.
So it is significant that Stan doesn't even mention Wisconson--never mind the betrayal of workers by union officials.
It is my contention that Stan, along with the rest of the fake left, avoids mentioning such betrayals because when it comes to workers rights versus the ruling elite, they are not on the workers' side in the first place.”
- - - - -
My Reply:
You are right Stan Karp did not mention Wisconsin nor crticize unions.
Teachers are, of course, part of the working class, if Wisconsin teachers feel betrayed by their union; Mary Bell the president of WEAC will lose her job. Right?
Perhaps your contention that Stan Karp is not on the side of teachers is simply false.
That seems likely. There is nothing in the article that supports this contention. Rather you base your contention solely on Karp’s failure to mention Wisconsin and criticize the unions. This just sounds like another ad hominem attack.
* * * * *
gregsdiary wrote:
“One of the manifestaions of that problem comes in the form of today's unions--such as the WEAC--that serve to suppress, undermine and misdirect the "fight" for public education before the fight even gets started.
Instead, this author, like most on the fake left, seems to prefer to avoid confronting such uncomfortabel realities. “
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You are right Stan Karp did not criticize the unions in his article. If members of
WEAC believe that their union has served to suppress, undermine and misdirect the fight for public education before it even got started, surely we can expect that they will remove Mary Bell as president of the WEAC.
Once again you directed an ad hominem attack at Stan Karp.
But you have never commented on whether or not you thought Mary Bell would lose her job as president of the WEAC, and if not why not. Is it possible that most of the teachers do not feel betrayed by Mary Bell? Is that possibly an uncomfortable reality that you are avoiding?
I have asked you to tell us what more you know about the WEAC, if anything. But no details have been forthcoming.
Public education like anything gone awry - it needs to get back to its "basic principles". Students, teachers, administrators and parents all need to be on the same page. Redefine the purpose of education. After teaching several years I just couldn't take it anymore. Teachers with the best intentions could not battle all the distractions overcrowding, low student expectations, poor manners, lack of effective disciplanary action by school officials (not always their fault) and poor leadership from far away (NEA) and all for a salary rated just above poverty level (florida). Teachers too busy trying to climb the ladder out of the classroom and into a cushy administrative job kissing butt all day long. So here it is ... not critism but a formular for success. We were successful once you know. Back to basics. Start with the systematic eradication of federal controls over public school education. The responsibility needs to lie solely with the community its leaders, parents and teachers. No large bureacratic agencies loaded with paper pushers and a school board president making six figures while teachers do the important work for peanuts. Perhaps the mayor of each town or city should be head of the "school board" to oversee the quality of education that is being maintained in his or her community. Someone accountable and reachable to answer for the success or failure of its education system and its
outcomes. Put competition back in our community schools, respect for oneanother, discipline, social responsibilty at the community level. Unions have made their mark in public education and the emporer has no clothes, they have failed misreably. The NEA has had its chance and it too must go, failure cannot be rewarded. People if you want your public education to work you must take it back,,,it is doomed in its present hands.
I agree with what have heard others say, that the elite wish to control the school system, thus be dictated to in their fashion, similiar as military schools.
Remember that possessing an education degree does not make you a good teacher any more than possessing a management degree makes you a good manager.
The best professors I ever had in college never had a teaching degree or an education degree. They had real world experience. One of the main problems with educational effectiveness is that the entire system is set up so that people in the real world cant get in; they are all required to have spent time in one particular academic field of study: Education.
Remove the gatekeepers and there will be a much greater opportunity for the kids in schools. Worse than the keepers at the gates are the keepers of the inner sanctum, the unions. New York is presently embroiled in scandal because of the rubber rooms they made to protect bad teachers.
Being a teacher isn't inherently heroic. Just like there are dirty cops there are bad teachers, and they do not deserve such insane levels of protection. Not if the goal of education is to prepare students for the world instead of protect teachers from their own incompetence.
My wife finally retired last year, after 42 years of abuse from school administrators, parents, lawyers and politicians.
She was a truly dedicated Special Education Teacher who loved her students... (at least MOST of them) and received little gratification from the adults she had to deal with.
Here are some facts about the public school where she worked these last ten or fifteen years:
Discipline was not permitted. If a kid misbehaved, she was instructed to send the kid to the "Refocus Room" where the kid was given a hug, asked what was wrong, given a popsickle and then was sent back to the classroom. Eventually EVERYONE wanted to misbehave.
Teachers in her school were instructed not to do anything about holidays... too many religious conflicts.
Special Ed was pretty much dissolved in her school... they "mainstreamed" everyone... thus eliminating any possible progress with the seriously handicapped partly because she now had 20 kids in the classroom instead of the traditional seven or eight "Special" kids... about a third of her students were from homes where NO ENGLISH was spoken... only Russian. Spanish, Portugeuse, Cambodian, Vietnamese or several other assorted languages.
...When you add up the hours in the school days, the number of school days, took out teacher work days, meetings and teacher educatrion, the teachers had the students less than 17% of each year. Tough to make much progress, even if you are just "teaching to the tests".
There was no such thing as "tenure"... they could (and often did) fire teachers for ANY reason. Her best year ever, teaching all school year plus Summer School and tutoring several students after school for pay, she made $62,477. plus about $900 a month in insurance and benefits. (9 months of the year.)
Excerpt from "Lies My Teacher Told Me: Everything Your American History Textbook Got Wrong" by James W. Loewen, The New Press, 1995. p 295. (concluding chapter)
“Feel-good history for affluent white males inevitably amounts to feel-bad history for everyone else. A student of mine, who was practice-teaching in Swanton, Vermont, a town with a considerable Indian population, noticed an Abenaki fifth grader obviously tuning out when he brought up the subject of Thanksgiving. Talking with the child brought forth the following reaction: “My father told me the real truth about that day and not to listen to any white man scum like you.!” Yet Thanksgiving seems reasonably benign compared to, say, Columbus Day.”
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In so far as the struggle in support of teachers and good public schools involves addressing the fundamental problems of power in our society, just how history is taught in our public schools is relevent to the discussion here.
James W. Loewen book "Lies My Teacher Told Me: Everything Your American History Textbook Got Wrong" covers the breadth of United States history and in lesser detail other American history as well, from Columbus and the First Thanksgiving, through "Gone With The WInd" and Big Brother, to the mysterious Disappearance of the Recent Past.
Along the way we learn, if we didn't know it already, about the brutality of Columbus, the epidemics that devastated the indigenous population before and after the arrival of the Pilgrims, the first use in 1623 by the British of "chemical warfare" in the colonies, and that "Indian warfare absorbed 80% of the entire federal budget during George Washington's administration and dogged his successors for a century as a major issue and expense", and skipping ahead somewhat one of my favorites, that Helen Keller was a socialist. For many of us there is simply much too much history to re-learn. "Lies My Teacher Told Me" provides an easy opportunity to get started or just add to the work already in progress.
Depending upon what Texas and a few other states may be doing to manipulate the content of American history books, the quality of the American history taught in public schools ebbs and flows somewhat, while other history resources available to young people such as historical novels seem to have improved steadily over the years since I was a kid.
While the comparison and evaluation of particular textbooks used in the public schools found in "Lies My Teacher Told Me: Everything Your American History Textbook Got Wrong" may be dated, the broader perspective on American history and on the content of American history textbooks as presented by James W. Loewen is still worth the read.
And then of course there is Howard Zinn's "A People's History of the United States."