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What Would Have Happened if the "Bomb Iran" Contingent had its Way?
I'm going to leave the debate about whether Iran's election was "stolen" and the domestic implications within Iran to people who actually know what they're talking about (which is a very small subset of the class purporting to possess such knowledge). But there is one point I want to make about the vocal and dramatic expressions of solidarity with Iranians issuing from some quarters in the U.S.
Much of the same faction now claiming such concern for the welfare of The Iranian People are the same people who have long been advocating a military attack on Iran and the dropping of large numbers of bombs on their country -- actions which would result in the slaughter of many of those very same Iranian People. During the presidential campaign, John McCain infamously sang about Bomb, Bomb, Bomb-ing Iran. The Wall St. Journal published a war screed from Commentary's Norman Podhoretz entitled "The Case for Bombing Iran," and following that, Podhoretz said in an interview that he "hopes and prays" that the U.S. "bombs the Iranians." John Bolton and Joe Lieberman advocated the same bombing campaign, while Bill Kristol -- with typical prescience -- hopefully suggested that Bush might bomb Iran if Obama were elected. Rudy Giuliani actually said he would be open to a first-strike nuclear attack on Iran in order to stop their nuclear program.
Imagine how many of the people protesting this week would be dead if any of these bombing advocates had their way -- just as those who paraded around (and still parade around) under the banner of Liberating the Iraqi People caused the deaths of hundreds of thousands of them, at least. Hopefully, one of the principal benefits of the turmoil in Iran is that it humanizes whoever the latest Enemy is. Advocating a so-called "attack on Iran" or "bombing Iran" in fact means slaughtering huge numbers of the very same people who are on the streets of Tehran inspiring so many -- obliterating their homes and workplaces, destroying their communities, shattering the infrastructure of their society and their lives. The same is true every time we start mulling the prospect of attacking and bombing another country as though it's some abstract decision in a video game.
After The Wall St. Journal published the Podhoretz war dance demanding that Iran be bombed, and after Podhoretz casually called for England to "bomb the Iranians into smithereens" if their sailors weren't immediately returned, I wrote:
In this week's Newsweek, Michael Hirsh has a worthwhile article reporting on his observations during his visit to Iran. While listing the internally repressive measures taken by the Iranian government, Hirsh describes Tehran as "bustling," as "traffic crowds the streets and boulevards," filled with the "chic" Iranian women and the "meterosexual" Iranian males who seek greater economic security and prosperity. That is what Norm Podhoretz and his friends hungrily want to annihilate.
Matt Yglesias, in a recent post about the administration's "debate" over whether to bomb Iran, wisely included a random photograph of an Iranian street with civilians walking on it. These are the people Norm Podhoretz and his comrades want to slaughter:
Our ability to render invisible the people we kill when cheering on our wars is one of the primary mechanisms which make it so easy to embrace that option.
Perhaps the scenes unfolding in Iran, our Enemy De Jour, will make those dehumanization efforts -- the linchpin of our militarism and state of perpetual war -- more difficult in the future.
- Posted in





44 Comments so far
Show AllI'm ashamed and embarrassed to be the same species as Bolton, Lieberman and Giuliani.
Actually I don't think you are Sir. These folks are not a member of our species, they are members of a small group known as Pond Scum.
I wish they were a small group, but if you look around you including election results, the group is not small at all. It includes vast majorities of certain groups.
You have a point, but I'd still say, considering the vast number of decent people, they are in comparison, a small group. But larger than I was thinking now that you bring it up.
And most of that group bemoan the lack of decent people.
boys - i tend to think of them as evil shape shifting reptillian aliens
one thing they have in common, to a man, is that they are what is called chickenhaks
too scared to serve one day themsleves but they don't mind, as glen points out, lots of other folks getting killed
Got them in one....Chicken Hawks indeed.
Cygnus-X1-isaHole,
Banish the thought,
you are not.
Quoting Henry Miller from "Air-Conditioned Nightmare", "America, you'll be the death of the world".
Tony Vodvarka
Always merry & bright!
Thanks a million, Glenn Greenwald, for exposing the sheer hypocrisy of the Iran-bombing set who now voices its alleged concern for the Iranians! These people are unspeakable monstrosities.
Thank you, also, for the opening sentence of your article, which exposes an even larger set of prejudiced and prejudicial individuals:
"I'm going to leave the debate about whether Iran's election was "stolen" and the domestic implications within Iran to people who actually know what they're talking about (which is a very small subset of the class purporting to possess such knowledge)."
Iran only? The neocons still want us to be the world cop and bomb anyone they don't like. "Do as we say, not as we do." is their motto, now and forever. BTW I do believe Iran's election was stolen.
And your hard evidence that the election was stolen is what...?
Do you believe it because it was in the Mass Media?
Do you NOT believe it because it was in the mass media?
I do NOT believe it because Zionists have lied, distorted, and demonized so much that I no longer believe up front anything that promotes the Zionist agenda.
The US did this before in Iran, toppling a democracy and installing the Shah. If you knew the history, this would sound strangely similar.
Not to mention, if you actually read this site, there is polling reason to believe that Ahm was actually the will of the people.
Now, I don't know for sure what happened, and I'm suspending judgement either way.
Got it?
hiccup - apologies
Some believe that the Earth was created six thousand years ago. Beliefs are a dime a dozen.
True justified (by evidence, that is) beliefs are much rarer.
None of us know for sure if it was stolen, but if the millions of votes were cast on paper ballots, declaring a winner 3-4 hours later would be quite a feat I'd say.
And I'd say that here they can declare a Presidential winner before the west coast and Hawaii even vote.
You really lack either imagination or are incredibly naive or if you didn't know above incredibly ignorant or if you're pushing an agenda probably a Zionist.
Put that in your pipe and smoke it.
It is incredible that when anyone doesn't follow the company line here they must be "zionists" or naive or ignorant.
I believe you have just defined exactly what you are buster. I don't smoke but you obviously are smoking something.
If you can't see more than one side to a problem or discussion, what does that say about you?
Your rudness and incivility do you no credit.
Gosh, methinks thou doth protest too much. You're the one being insulting.
Wonder why...
Podhoretz should assuredly be included in the species known as Pond Scum.
sy hersh reported last year that special ops had been sent into iran with fistfulls of cash and weapons
they were giving it to any lunatic who they thought might raise an inserrection within iran
this is an international war crime - hey but in the torturing uited states - who cares
one wonders how many of todays's protesters are in fact on the cia payroll
this is a replay of the 1953 coup against another democraticlly elected iranian government - that of mohammed mosedeq
from wiki:
"The 1953 Iranian coup d’état deposed the democratically-elected government of Iranian Prime Minister Mohammed Mosaddeq.[1][2][3]
"The prime minister and his nationalist supporters in parliament roused Britain's ire when they nationalised the oil industry in 1951, which had previously been exclusively controlled by the Anglo-Iranian Oil Company. Mossadegh argued that Iran should begin profiting from its vast oil reserves," Dan De Luce wrote in The Guardian.
"Britain accused (Mosaddeq) of violating the company's legal rights and orchestrated a worldwide boycott of Iran's oil that plunged the country into financial crisis. The British government tried to enlist the Americans in planning a coup, an idea originally rebuffed by President Truman. But when Dwight Eisenhower took over the White House, cold war ideologues - determined to prevent the possibility of a Soviet takeover - ordered the CIA to embark on its first covert operation against a foreign government." [4]
The coup was organized by the United States' CIA and the United Kingdom's MI6, two spy agencies that aided royalists and mutinous Iranian army officers.[5]
CIA officer Kermit Roosevelt, Jr. carried out the operation planned by CIA agent Donald Wilber.[6] One version of the CIA history, written by Wilber, referred to the operation as TPAJAX.[7][8]
During the coup, Roosevelt and Wilber bribed Iranian government officials, reporters, and businessmen.[9] The deposed Iranian leader, Mossadegh, was taken to jail and Iranian General Fazlollah Zahedi named himself prime minister in the new, pro-western government. The British and American spy agencies returned the monarchy to Iran by installing the pro-western Mohammed Reza Pahlevi on the throne where his brutal rule lasted 26 years. The story is detailed in Stephen Kinzer's All the Shah's Men : An American Coup and the Roots of Middle East Terror. Pahlevi was overthrown in 1979.[10]
The overthrow of Iran's elected government in 1953 ensured Western control of Iran's petroleum resources and prevented the Soviet Union from competing for Iranian oil"
In Stephen Kinzer's "All The Shah's Men : An American Coup And The Roots Of Middle East Terror",(c2003) Kinzer points out that one of the motivations for the nationalization of the Iranian oil fields was the British refusal to allow Iran more than 14% of the profit from the petroleum production while Her Majesty's Empire took the 86%.
Don't forget the mosque in Iran that was blown up just last week, right across the border from Pakistan.
And we can go back to the 1988 shooting down of the Iranian airliner, killing 290, including 66 children, an act for which the Captain of the USS Vincennes received the Legion of Merit.
The USA has never stopped bombing Iran. It's just done as secretly as possible.
If the "bomb Iran" contingent is vociferously defending Moussavi, that in itself is a strong indication that he's our corporate man in Iran. If the Iranian voters are anything like American voters, it's likely that many of Moussavi's supporters have let themselves be manipulated by a self-interested charlatan. They may have noble goals, but there's no reason to believe that they're any less gullible than American voters.
Sioux Rose
JOHN: Good post. The right wing has a tendency to get very anal about letter-of-the-law applications, like making sure the inmate on death row gets his last supper before being executed. They have no problem with the punishment itself. This could also explain all the hoopla around this election.
I thought Greenwald was going to say something a little bit different. If McCain had been elected, it would have been very favorable to Ahmadinejead being re-elected. If the people of Iran are afraid of the United States, then they are more likely to back the candidate with the more aggressive (and more anti-American) foreign policy rhetoric. I can picture a campaign ad showing US president McCain singing "Bomb Bomb Iran".
I think that Obama being elected after campaigning on opening up dialogue with Iran (which was a strong contrast to McCain) had an impact on the younger generation of Iranians. It makes it harder for Ahmadinejead to cast the United States as evil and unworthy of negotiations with Obama in office. His much criticized speech in Cairo probably helped too. On the same note, it probably would have helped had Livni been elected over Netanyahu in Israel.
Don't worry, I understand that it is my duty as a "progressive" thinker to hate Barack. I am just making a point who feel that it is better to have McCain elected but not succumb to lesser-evilism.
"I think that Obama being elected after campaigning on opening up dialogue with Iran (which was a strong contrast to McCain) had an impact on the younger generation of Iranians."
If I recall correctly, in one of their debates, McCain accused Obama of wanting to have "high level" talks with Iran "without preconditions", Obama denied this and said he simply wanted diplomatic relations with Iran to engage in a dialogue, to which McCain agreed. Their respective positions (excluding McCain's frighteningly bizarre bout of singing-dementia) were not that different. Take a look at Obama's speech at AIPAC for his own hawkishness on Iran and endorsement of "regime change".
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=91150432
Obama was much more adamant in criticizing Bush's unwillingness to engage in dialogue with Iran. McCain effectively endorsed Bush's policy. The McCain camp was constantly trying to portray Obama as weak, soft, and too given to palling around with enemies of the US.
So are you saying that the people of Iran likely see Obama, McCain (and Bush) as effectively the same? I have a hard time believing that. Look at Ahmadinejad vs. Mousavi. They are very similar with their nuclear policies and I am sure plenty of other things that most Americans would consider bad, yet the people of the US see one guy as a holocaust denier and the other as a progressive reformer. The true progressives in Iran probably know better but public opinion is what determines elections.
Thanks, hopedup. Your link padded my unscientific, random collection of the "wipe Israel off the map" quotes attributed to Ahmadinejad due to the false translation of his October, 2005 speech. Current count: 51
For the most accurate rendition, see
http://www.antiwar.com/orig/norouzi.php?articleid=11025
I don't know if these elections were stolen or not. I tend to think NOT because 1)I know I don't have a full internal picture of Iran, so I think it's possible the population like the declared winner. 2)In the meantime, as others here have noted, it seems to be the bomb Iran faction chickenhawks who are ssooo concerned about the stolen elections of these brown people. What about the stolen elections of the brown people directly south of us? Mexico's fiasco merited a couple of peeps on the evening news and hasn't been mentioned since. Very telling.
Dear netminnow, Speaking of stolen elections, let us not forget our moribund electoral system. In 2000, theft of the Florida vote and then a judicial coup which halted any analysis of it. In 2004, theft of the vote in Ohio which took the election. We had the Shrub, a two-term president who lost both elections.
Tony Vodvarka
Great article.
Let's see -- A close election and a ruling body rules that the right-winger wins. Hey, they're more like us than we care to believe!! Talk about inconvenient truth...
Of course, no one was talking about bombing the US if we appointed a president and didn't elect him -- unless that had something to do with the whole 9/11 thing, of course.
camus13
First we whould google Moussavi and Iran contra....very interesting.
Second, Iran election results aside for the moment, I really can't recall millions of American on the streets after Bush stole two election 00 and 04.
We did the "Oh gosh, that they way it goes."
Indeed, camus13. Check out this link: http://revolutionaryflowerpot.blogspot.com/2009/06/mir-hossein-mousavis-irancontra.html
BTW, Jeb wants his voting machines returned to Flarduh by 2010, Ahmadinejad.
Way LOL!Tony
Ha ha! : )
"the linchpin of our militarism"
Whos militarism? It's the elites' militarism, not the people's. Mr. Greenwald needs to help we the people drive a proper wedge between ourselves and the elites. Neither do the people own the public debt! When the foreign creditors foreclose the USA, we're pointing them toward the elites' offshore bank accounts.
Dear rtfrury, If I had my way (ha!) and we were able to master this rotten system, those trillions of dollars that have been printed up and shifted around between our financial "elites" like Monopoly money would just be a bunch of zeros on paper which they could stick where the sun don't shine.
Tony Vodvarka
I'm still worried about the missing nuclear armed cruise missile. A black op in the making?
Bla bla bla; I could say plenty in this comment, but will simply say, especially now that it's two days, or three days, after this article was posted, that I appreciate this article by Glenn Greenwald. The "bla bla bla" opener is with respect to what I could have written; not with respect to Glenn Greenwald's article.
I have not forgotten about the Iranian factions in the U.S. and Canada supporting war on Iran over recent enough years. They, like Zionists demonstrating on U.S. and Canadian streets in support of hellishly criminal Israeli government; they all make me sick.
We should all meet face-to-face. Throw in the KKK, ... too. Let's have a "festive", energetic face-to-face encounter.
I have my Herman Survival boots on; because the left boot of my hiking boots is too small now and I have nothing else, so have to wear these Hermans (for winter during summer, but, hey, the situation could be worse).
In any case, I'm tired of all of the pro-violence people demonstrating on streets of the USA and Canada. I'm really disgusted by that ... crap.
So it's good that someone as read as Glenn Greenwald, besides the good piece by Chris Floyd, who's written about ex-PM Mousavi's past oppressiveness worse than under President Ahmadinejad, has reminded us of these pro-war on Iran persons original of Iran, but living in the U.S. (and while the same applies with their similars in Canada, I'll again add).
I figured there was something questionable about Mousavi and Chris Floyd provided on this; and perhaps, hopefully, other people also did, but the history should be verifiable anyway. And Glenn Greenwald has brought up the point that I mentioned over the past recent days, about Iranians in the U.S. who supported the threat of war on Iran, were cheerleading for this. Only very insane, criminally insane people could do that.