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Fox News "War Games" the Coming Civil War
Bill Clinton's election in 1992 gave rise to the American "militia movement": hordes of overwhelmingly white, middle-aged men from suburban and rural areas who convinced themselves they were defending the American way of life from the "liberals" and "leftists" running the country by dressing up in military costumes on weekends, wobbling around together with guns, and play-acting the role of patriot-warriors. Those theater groups -- the cultural precursor to George Bush's prancing 2003 performance dressed in a fighter pilot outfit on Mission Accomplished Day -- spawned the decade of the so-called "Angry White Male," the movement behind the 1994 takeover of the U.S. Congress by Newt Gingrich and his band of federal-government-cursing, play-acting-tough-guy, pseudo-revolutionaries.
What was most remarkable about this allegedly "anti-government" movement was that -- with some isolated and principled exceptions -- it completely vanished upon the election of Republican George Bush, and it stayed invisible even as Bush presided over the most extreme and invasive expansion of federal government power in memory. Even as Bush seized and used all of the powers which that movement claimed in the 1990s to find so tyrannical and unconstitutional -- limitless, unchecked surveillance activities, detention powers with no oversight, expanding federal police powers, secret prison camps, even massively exploding and debt-financed domestic spending -- they meekly submitted to all of it, even enthusiastically cheered it all on.
They're the same people who embraced and justified full-scale, impenetrable federal government secrecy and comprehensive domestic spying databases conducted in the dark and against the law when perpetrated by a Republican President -- but have spent the last week flamboyantly pretending to be scandalized and outraged by the snooping which Bill Moyers did 45 years ago (literally) as part of a Democratic administration. They're the people who relentlessly opposed and impugned Clinton's military deployments and then turned around and insisted that only those who are anti-American would question or oppose Bush's decision to start wars.
They're the same people who believed that Bill Clinton's use of the FISA court to obtain warrants to eavesdrop on Americans was a grave threat to liberty, but believed that George Bush's warrantless eavesdropping on Americans in violation of the law was a profound defense of freedom. In sum, they dressed up in warrior clothing to fight against Bill Clinton's supposed tyranny, and then underwent a major costume change on January 20, 2001, thereafter dressing up in cheerleader costumes to glorify George Bush's far more extreme acquisitions of federal power.
In doing so, they revealed themselves as motivated by no ideological principles or political values of any kind. It was a purely tribalistic movement motivated by fear of losing its cultural and demographic supremacy. In that sense -- the only sense that mattered -- George Bush was one of them, even though, with his actions, he did everything they long claimed to fear and despise. Nonetheless, his mere occupancy of the White House was sufficient to pacify them and convert them almost overnight from limited-government militants into foot soldiers supporting the endless expansion of federal government power.
But now, only four weeks into the presidency of Barack Obama, they are back -- angrier and more chest-beating than ever. Actually, the mere threat of an Obama presidency was enough to revitalize them from their eight-year slumber, awaken them from their camouflaged, well-armed suburban caves. The disturbingly ugly atmosphere that marked virtually every Sarah Palin rally had its roots in this cultural resentment, which is why her fear-mongering cultural warnings about his exotic, threatening otherness -- he's a Muslim-loving, Terrorist-embracing, Rev.-Wright-following Marxist: who is the real Barack Obama? -- resonated so stingingly with the rabid lynch mobs that cheered her on.
With Obama now actually in the Oval Office -- and a financial crisis in full force that is generating the exact type of widespread, intense anxiety that typically inflames these cultural resentments -- their mask is dropping, has dropped, and they've suddenly re-discovered their righteous "principles." The week-long CNBC Revolt of the Traders led by McCain voter Rick Santelli and the fledgling little Tea Party movement promoted by the Michelle Malkins of the world are obvious outgrowths of this 1990s mentality, now fortified by the most powerful fuel: deep economic fear. But as feisty and fire-breathing as those outbursts are, nothing can match -- for pure, illustrative derangement -- the discussion below from Glenn Beck's new Fox show this week, in which he and an array of ex-military and CIA guests ponder (and plot and plan) "war games" for the coming Civil War against Obama-led tyranny. It really has to be seen to be believed.
Before presenting that to you, a few caveats are in order: There is nothing inherently wrong or illegitimate with citizens expressing extreme anger towards the Government and the ruling political class. There isn't even anything wrong or illegitimate with citizens organizing themselves into a movement that -- whether by design or effect -- is threatening to entrenched elites. If anything, we've had too little of that. In fact, it's only a complete lack of fear of a meek, passive and impotent citizenry on the part of political and financial rulers -- a certainty that there will be no consequences no matter what they do -- that could have given rise to the endless corruption, deceit, lawbreaking, destruction, and outright thievery of the last eight years. A political and financial elite that perceives itself as invulnerable from threat or consequence will inevitably vest itself with more power and more riches. That's what we've had and, largely, still have.
But this Rush-Limbaugh/Fox-News/nationalistic movement isn't driven by anything noble or principled or even really anything political. If it were, they would have been extra angry and threatening and rebellious during the Bush years instead of complicit and meek and supportive to the point of cult-like adoration. Instead, they're just basically Republican dead-enders (at least what remains of the regional/extremist GOP), grounded in tribal allegiances that are fueled by their cultural, ethnic and religious identities and by perceived threats to past prerogatives -- now spiced with legitimate economic anxiety and an African-American President who, they were continuously warned for the last two years, is a Marxist, Terrorist-sympathizing black nationalist radical who wants to re-distribute their hard-earned money to welfare queens and illegal immigrants (and is now doing exactly that).
That's the context for this Glenn Beck "War Games" show on Fox News this week -- one promoted, with some mild and obligatory caveats, by Michelle Malkin's Hot Air. In the segment below, he convened a panel that includes former CIA officer Michael Scheuer and Ret. U.S. Army Sgt. Major Tim Strong. They discuss a coming "civil war" led by American "Bubba" militias -- Beck says he "believes we're on this road" -- and they contemplate whether the U.S. military would follow the President's orders to subdue civil unrest or would instead join with "the people" in defense of their Constitutional rights against the Government (they agree that the U.S. military would be with "the people"):
They don't seem very interested in bipartisanship and in transcending ideological divisions.
Immediately prior to that segment, Fox viewers were warned (as usual) that the unruly, uncivilized, violent Muslims are coming, and only Benjamin Netanyahu will be able to subdue them with a massive attack:
In one sense, all of this drooling rage is nothing more than the familiar face of extreme right-wing paranoia, as Richard Hofstadter famously described 45 years ago:
The paranoid spokesman sees the fate of conspiracy in apocalyptic terms—he traffics in the birth and death of whole worlds, whole political orders, whole systems of human values. He is always manning the barricades of civilization. He constantly lives at a turning point. Like religious millenialists he expresses the anxiety of those who are living through the last days and he is sometimes disposed to set a date fort the apocalypse. (“Time is running out,” said Welch in 1951. “Evidence is piling up on many sides and from many sources that October 1952 is the fatal month when Stalin will attack.”)
But it's now inflamed by declining imperial power, genuine economic crises, an exotic Other occupying the White House, and potent technology harnessed by right-wing corporations such as Fox News to broadcast and disseminate it widely and continuously. At the very least, it's worth taking note of. And I wonder what would happen if MSNBC broadcast a similar discussion of leftists plotting and planning the imminent, violent Socialist Revolution against the U.S. Government.
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147 Comments so far
Show AllMy rational side says 'Huh?'
My slightly paranoid side says otherwise.
If anyone thinks the military would side with the people - think again.
Think - Patriot Act
Think - Military Commission Act
Think - Presidential Security Directive No. 51
Think - KBR constructed detention centers in every state.
Think - Northern command - 1st acive duty military command structure created
for continental U.S. to maintain order
Sieg Heil, everybody
But I hope I'm wrong !
I hope you're wrong, too, but I have my doubts given the creeping institutionalization of fundamentalist Christianity in the military. Recall the abuses in recent years of non-christians at the Air Force Academy in Colorado; recall General What's-his-name saying, "Our god is bigger than their god"(not an exact quote, but most will remember it). As a non-believer, I have no doubts about what an overly christian military would have in store for this American.
But I hope I'm wrong!
Just go back in history to determine whether the US Military would turn on its own.
Between the wars a group of Veterans from WW1 marched on Washington as they were owed monies from the Government for their service.
The US Government called out the military who were willing to fire on their own in support of the Government.
Shays rebellion, the Civil war also saw the miltary used against their fellow citizens.
Remember they will not see themselves as firing on fellow citizens with families.
They will be shooting at "terrorists", "Communists", "Socialists" , and "liberals".
Good examples...I would also put Kent State up there...Naitonal Guard, more or less local troops, firing on people about their same age, same place of birth. Also, thanks to the conservative agenda of militarizing the country and its youth, I doubt the soldiers would care too much they're shooting Americans.
I have always felt that National Guard was sent to Iraq so that they wouldn't be here.
Consider that no Guard units were activated for the Vietnam conflict.
The corporatists needed the nat'l guard troops out of the way in order to justify use of Blackwater in NOLA after katrina ...
Now the 3rd infantry are positioned in case of martial law or a march on Washington...
Posse comatitus has gone the way of the rest of the constitution... We will miss you...
I think we are screwed either way. Draconian crackdowns would be terrible, but the sort of neo-fascist brutal society that is likely to arise out of any kind of popular revolt in the US would be terrible also.
---USAn---
I think "the people" who these right-wing extremists are referring to are the right-wing extremist element of the population, which they imagine to be much larger that it really is. They are saying the right-wing Christianized military will mutiny against the Obama administration.
I would say they are delusional as usual. They will become more shrill and unhinged as the Obama administration continues, and the loudness of their protestations will exaggerate their actual numbers.
"They don't seem very interested in bipartisanship and in transcending ideological divisions."
Bingo.
Why, then, is it more important for the Dems to silence Kucinich and to legitimize right-wing crazies than the other way around?
The Authoritarians
In much the spirit and tenor of Michael Moore's approach, free on-line book about studies on the dynamics of authoritarian tendencies in US society. University of Manitoba.
Gist: authoritarianism transcends left/right designations
http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/
The fundamental difference to the vocal opposition to Obama by the right as opposed to the fundamental opposition to Bush by the left is that the opposition to Bush gets airplay on the cable news networks while millions could take to the street in opposition to Bush and it was ignored by the press.
Secondly while these scared little white boys are wetting themselves while on the airwaves something far far more important is not on the airwaves; THE COMPLETE AND UTTER FAILURE OF THE REPUBLICAN AND NEOCON IDEOLOGY.
Fox "News" is the neocon puppet. It will do everything possible to oppose any liberal advances in this country, even to the extent of FOMENTING a clash between conservbatives and liberals, between Republicans and Progressives, regardless of what deaths and bloodshed might ensue.
Barrack Obama ran for the Senate against fundamentalist Christian Republican Alan Keyes. Keyes' foaming at the mouth rabid attacks against Obama, including calling Obama the Anti Christ, seemed to create a backlash and a landslide win for Obama.
Barrack Obama ran for president and the old swiftboaters and Rove staff were back and up to their dirty rotten tricks. Did it cause a backlash? Obama won by a substantial margin.
Insanity is attempting something you have done before with negative results, then attempting it again and expecting a different result. So here we are with Republicans insanely trying yet again the formula that resulted in two substantial losses against Obama. The track record would suggest the are committing political suicide.
The bottom line is you can't expect to strut around engaging in hate smears while pretending to be the party of Joe Sixpack and win. Engaging in that type of propaganda campaign will lose the cross over voters and eliminate the independent voters. And having their votes is the only way to have substantial numbers and win. In short, a more centrist and moderate position is the only formula that will result in Republicans winning back the white house and congress.
Obama had, on his side, not the truth but the money. Had he been an average fundraiser the lies of the right wing would have been made stronger. Obama's victory, I believe, was won on a two edged sword, disgust with all things GOP ( thanks George) and the seven hundred million dollar purchase of the White House Obama negotiated.
The GOP seems to be conducting the same strategies as ever, pretend cooperation, refuse to vote without concessions that weaken the proposed legislation and then smear the result as imperfect. It should be noted that every single republican, from Mayor to Governor to Congressperson to Senator parrots the same exact mantra about the stimulus package. No coincidence there....Repeated often enough the critiques, however much truth or lie they contain will begin to ring true to the average voter, and when the stimulus falls on its bloated and misguided face who will benefit? Yup, those strutting GOP'ers....
"Most people would sooner die than think, in fact they do so." Bertrand Russell
"It should be noted that every single republican, from Mayor to Governor to Congressperson to Senator parrots the same exact mantra about the stimulus package."
Almost, but not quite. Republican governor of Florida, Charlie Crist was very much for the stimulus package. I'm sure Republic governor Schwarzenegger of California also wanted it, but Obama didn't tour that area while promoting it. Although it is true that every GOP member of Congress from Florida voted against it.
I stand corrected, and thank you for that. Living in California I should not have made that universal claim, but I was darn close!
"Most people would sooner die than think, in fact they do so." Bertrand Russell
Awww, poor "Ardee" living in a state about to go bankrupt. Too much stimulus money for you wasteful spenders out there. Move over to the Dakotas and get a new refreshing life. You'll love it.
Terrance Mitchell
Redfield, South Dakota
I must say that having a stalker is sort of cool...Not for his reputation though....
"Most people would sooner die than think, in fact they do so." Bertrand Russell
These people do not and I emphasize do not care about the majority of the people or this country and only wish to be MUSTHAVES.I'm 73 but if they want to get it on lets do it cuzz I'm pissed.
The MUSTHAVES and getting Economically Stimulated
I was wondering to myself how I could get with the program and get myself economically stimulated in these trying times for the MUSTHAVES there in the biggest privy in the world. The one with the name of Washington D.C. there are others and the one in New York City is right there. Of course there are others but it would take to much of my time and patience to list them all
In all these privies the MUSTHAVES take care of their biological needs and maintain a superb style of living by shitting on all the Don’thavesomuches which are more numerous and lack the little things in life that would put them at least closer to the MUSTHAVES and those thing are big greed, and of course with greed there are always lobbyists and bribes.
Now the MUSTHAVES were going merrily along stealing, bribing and lobbying for more when there was a more greedy entity out there and they had to go begging the Donthavesomuches for the means to keep on being the greedy cretins they are. Since this privy is like a big public house and has differing parts and has more than one loo and MUSTHAVES change names but do maintain the status quo they think it is the duty of the Donthavesomuches to keep the privy clean by taking all the shit on themselves so that the MUSTHAVES don’t have to wallow in all the shit and we are talking muncho.
This was bad enough but now the MUSTHAVES in other privies and the same one as before want to spread the shit a ton more by asking the donthavesomuches to carry more of the shit left by the MUSTHAVES lying, cheating and bribing thru the banks using bank usury, auto license fees by other MUSTHAVES, A mileage tax and other methods that have not been brought forward yet and since the Donthavesomuches are all so full of shit anyway they think it is only fair that they take care of this also
If the is what getting Economically Stimulated is then I think it is time for me to go into rehab. Tony 2/20/09
If you get the idea that this word is expressive and on my to write list…You are right.
Out here in the wilds of the northwest, we have an interesting thing going on. Those ultra conservatives talked about in the article seem to be realizing, along with the very few leftists around here, that big business greed has taken over their government. And they all kept quiet and watched in disbelief as Bush destroyed what was left of our ideals.
I had a 77 year old ultra conservative christian militant, the exact personality described in the article, tell me, we've come full cirlce. The leftists and the extreme right are now standing for the same things. And we must band together to fight.
Fight what? We don't want our guns taken away and we want the government to stay out of our business and stop taking our money as taxes when we get nothing in return.
As I watched the Palin rallies all I could think was, holy shit, this is like Nazi Germany in 1930.
Now we have a liberal president. And he has inherited a horrible mess that will get worse. And he'll be blamed by Fox and the rest of those amazing idiots that our public loves to watch and rant with.
Yes, civil war is coming I think. But make no mistake about it. It's not gonna be conservative vs liberals. It's gonna be the wealthy against the poor. And it's gonna make Civil War 1 look tame.
Exactly. Those on the left need to be more open-minded and adaptable and use some creativity. The corporatists are intentionally inflaming all the joe sixpacks without recognizing the inherent danger in that. People on the left need to do all they can to co-opt the joe sixpack political movement and turn it into an anti-Wall Street, anti-plutocrat movement. The possibility is there. The nonsense like that on CNBC will only go so far, where multi-millionaires try to convince working class slobs to join with them in a populist uprising against a president for giving something to other working class slobs, instead of giving everything to multi-millionaires on Wall Street. The plutocrats assume it will be easy to convince the joe sixpacks that it is unfair if the government gives any money to working class people because the plutocrats own the government and paid good money for it! I do not believe the joe sixpacks are as stupid as the plutocrats think. It is just that the poor slobs trust Limbaugh and other propagandists of the corporatists. But the corporatists sometimes overplay their hand, and when they do it is the time to break that trust and get the joe sixpacks to turn on them.
Don't forget, the nonsense on CNBC was with market traders in Chicago...not exactly representative of Joe 6-pack.
Outstanding post Kivals.
You nailed it. New legislation is being crafted to fingerprint and monthly permit gun owners to death. The red neck south and other hillbillies won't stand for this.
Who cares why they're up in arms? They now hate big brother more than we do.
Big Brother made a big mistake trying to tear up the second amendment and it's going to cost them. Our two groups: progressives and redneck hillbillies should coalesce together and see to it that the bloated self-serving government is cut down by 90 percent.
Remember, the reason progressives never got anywhere is we couldn't form one party. Now's our chance. Put some skoal in your mouth, marry your sister, break out your grandad's shotgun and go shootin with your redneck neighbor.
Ugh....
Oh well, nobody said fighting for freedom was going to be safe or fun.....
Remember, no law that is in violation of the constitution is legal.
"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent." - Thomas Jefferson
I have heard conservative media report that a law in Illinois is being written that would require $1 million liability insurance for each gun owned by someone...might make it a little expensive..
Thank you zmann,
I forgot to mention that. Expect it to go countrywide. Sounds like a new scam by the insurance industry to fleece the public yet again. When five hurricanes ripped through florida in 2005, insurance lobbyists got mandatory coverage by only one company Citizens required for anybody who lapsed coverage (like a billing dispute.) This resulted in double coverage for many. Rates tripled accross the state, even though the paths of the "canes" was narrow and did not cost insurance companies very much. After jacking the rates statewide, the insurance companies turned in record profits for the whole history of insurance. They were one of the biggest campaign contributors for the chimp. I suspect they gave Obummer a lot of cash also. Anybody know?
TJ
"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent." - Thomas Jefferson
I actually used to be for more gun control...I never saw a need to own a gun, I've never feared for my safety (I'm rather large). But I changed my mind a year or two ago once I saw how much power the Bush administration had taken for itself.. Al Gore's Assault on Reason is what did it for me.
Cash anyone?
http://www.opensecrets.org/news/2009/02/special-interests-to-listen-ca.html
n what appears to be a strategic move, the health sector has been shifting its campaign contributions toward Democrats. In the 2008 election cycle, an unprecedented 54 percent of the recently Republican-leaning sector's nearly $162.3 million in contributions went to Democrats. Compare that to the last presidential election, in 2004, when Republicans collected 61 percent of the $123.7 million that the health sector gave. Obama collected $18.7 million from the sector, compared to the $7.3 million that his opponent, Republican Sen. John McCain, got (McCain, however, accepted only public financing for the general election, while Obama continued to raise private funds).
Obama has already signed a bill supported by health professionals that former President Bush vetoed: the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP). After extending insurance to more children, Democrats in Congress are spearheading efforts to expand Medicaid to cover more uninsured adults. Two influential lobbying groups, the American Medical Association, which represents doctors, and AARP, which advocates for retirees, supported SCHIP's expansion. AMA gave at least $1.7 million in federal campaign contributions in the 2008 election cycle (Obama received $19,650 from AMA employees, more than any other recipient). AARP does not operate a PAC, but its employees gave candidates, committees and parties $53,200, with Democrats receiving 90 percent of that.
Insurance companies, represented by groups such as America's Health Insurance Plans, will be fighting any proposals that could take business away from the private sector. This includes any reform giving Americans the choice to opt into a government-run plan, which could become a reality under Obama's administration. The insurance industry gave at least $46 million in campaign contributions in the 2008 election cycle and gave the president $2.2 million. Pharmaceutical companies will also be on the defensive. Led by lobbying powerhouse PhRMA, the industry will try to fight off measures requiring drug companies to disclose all of their gifts and payments to doctors, and other legislation that would give the FDA the authority to ban direct-to-consumer advertising for new drugs. The drug industry gave at least $28.6 million in contributions in the last election cycle, with Obama collecting the most, at nearly $2 million for his presidential bid.
"Most people would sooner die than think, in fact they do so." Bertrand Russell
"Fight what? We don't want our guns taken away and we want the government to stay out of our business and stop taking our money as taxes when we get nothing in return."
Well, I guess the "when we get nothing in return" part represents a bit of concession of the usual rabid right wing viewpoint. Does this mean that the right might be acknowledging that government could give us a lot of stuff in return for our taxes if it wasn't running a war machine and bailing out banks without conditions.
But I assume they are still opposed to any kind of environmental, consumer, or workplace laws, public land and water management and of course, labor organizing, right?
I won't be banding together with these fascists.
---USAn---
Actually, real, genuine conservatives make some of the best environmental and public land advocates/activists. Many of them actually use public land for personal recreation, and see a vested interest in keeping it free of toxins. Check out the book The Riverkeepers by RFK Jr, it was great.
Yeah, right; "personal recreation" - i.e. tearing it up with their noisy, smelly four-wheelers and throwing litter around.
I've seen what "stewerdship" means to the redneck right. On Cape Hatteras national Seashore - there are few places where you can enjoy a walk on the beach without the danger of getting run over by an SUV. Even brief closures so rare sea turtles can breed get them upset.
And those 4 wheelers can often be found over the Dolly Sods and now, the Roaring Plains wilderness areas. It's illegal, but they know that Monongahela National Forest is so defunded and understaffed that they have little danger of getting caught.
---USAn---
The power elites in the US are making sure you only have to choices -- a tepid Weimarian centre-right and an extreme proto-fascist right. Nothing else is tolerated or given air time.
It's a dangerous game that ended in near oblivion for the Axis powers half a century ago.
Factual caveat:
The "militia" movement was in full swing when Clinton took office. Remember, Ruby Ridge happened under Poppy, Waco at the very beginning of Clinton's term. Bush I's administration, in particular, treated them as a serious threat. The Aryan Nation went way back. They recruited heavily from dispossessed farmers: remember the LAST "foreclosure" crisis? In the farm country. We'll probably see another there, now that commodity prices have plunged.
Oregoncharles
Don't forget Oklahoma City.
If Obama wants to survive the right wing blitz, he'd better reinstate the Fairness Doctrine now.
I think many here underestimate the vast differences between the far right and everyday leftists. Just because we may all agree on the iniquity of Wall Street thieves, corrupt government, and our taxes only going into the coffers of the very rich, we agree for very different reasons. Can the left ignore the endemic racism and background classism of the right wing? How do we undertake to educate these crackers so we can at least organize around anything vaguely coherent? They're just as convinced everything's the fault of blacks and Jews and welfare cheats that we are about the oligarchy and plutocracy. How do we reconcile such disparate views?
I grew up with the "crackers" and live among them now. They are certainly open to arguments about the oligarchy and plutocracy, especially with regard to bankers and Wall Street. And if they want to rail against Hollywood and "limousine liberals," let them. I would add that the racist attitudes are mostly on their last legs anyway, and not anything that could derail a movement with real momentum. And really, without joining forces with them, it truly is hopeless.
I also grew up with them and am still surrounded by them. You may be right about some of them being open to our arguments, but certainly not all of them. The word "liberal" is as toxic to them now as it was over the past 8 years, as GG clearly says. They still listen to Limbaugh, Hannity, Beck and that crowd of fascists, and so are well armed against any hints of deadly liberalism creeping into their alliance against the government. I suspect it's far more of an uphill battle than you think. And it wouldn't be the first thing to come along that seemed "truly hopeless."
Mostly, I mostly find that the right wingers I encounter have perspectives so different from mine that we speak different languages. Many of them view Obama as the left-end of the imaginable, so when I criticize Obama from the left, it is incompressible to them.
It does keep us from getting into heated arguments.
---USAn---
When I chat with the right-wingers I know, many of them are quite open to bashing the bankers and the CEOs, though some of them have already been conditioned by Limbaugh and his fellow travelers to shut out such talk. I try to keep the word "liberal" out of it and talk about the common people against the elites. That seems to get a positive reaction. The populist Jim Hightower in Texas has been exploring these possibilities for decades. Maybe it is something to think about in fashioning a movement to go forward.
A people's movement against elite rule has to include the majority of people, so this means lefties and righties have to come together. A lefty can easily convince a righty to switch from a commercial bank to a credit union, and make similar changes all around to help starve the elites down to size. As mentioned in other posts, righties are open to alternatives to elite rule if those don't restrict them too much. First, lefties should suggest the less restrictive items, and save the more restrictive for last. To convince the righty to accept restrictions, i.e. environmental, and economic regulations, and social freedoms, the lefty points out the benefits using the facts that are more accessible now with the internet. Righties usually value personal freedom far more than lefties, so lefties should convince righties to become independent of the elites' private enterprises and rely much more on local enlightenment, responsibility and ownership of production. Lefties have to convince righties that the AVERAGE human being's capacities are THE THING to value, not the exceptional capacities of the few. This is the motivating principle behind the people's movement. Lefties should give up unconditional support for central authority/regulation and focus on enlightening/empowering the people.
You're correct. Unfortunately, a lot of the so-called "lefties" on this site are no different from the rightwing brownshirts. They think they can talk down people they perceive as "dumb". Their communications skills is very poor and all they can worry about are grammar and spelling all the while everything else crumbles around them. The know-it-all snobs need to learn to motivate others and not piss them off. This former conservative knows.
Terrance Mitchell
Redfield, South Dakota
And yet you sound no less rightwing in your attacks than those rightwingers themselves. It's not an uphill battle. You're just making a mountain out of an ant hill and condescending hardworking people who just happen to be conservative. Let's see how successful you are than me in trying to convince the Limbaugh dittoheads in embracing single payer healthcare, Employee Free Choice Act, getting us out of Iraq and Afghanistan, etc ...
Terrance Mitchell
Redfield, South Dakota
"They're just as convinced everything's the fault of blacks and Jews and welfare cheats that we are about the oligarchy and plutocracy. How do we reconcile such disparate views?"
By getting equal time.
Oh please. What do you know about conservatives or even working class liberals? You've probably never met one to begin with. In fact, I notice on the board that the further extreme the Far Left gets, the more they have in common with the Far Right. So to answer your questions, why not spend some time in the Deep South or even the Heartland and then you'll learn.
Terrance Mitchell
Redfield, South Dakota
Fox News is on Obama's side, this is simply a coordinated effort to continue the lie that he's a liberal when we know he's anything but. Plus it's excellent for their ratings in these slow-news times.
It works, it fools the rabid right and naive Democrats into believing the left is in power, that we have two parties in the US, etc.
Slow news times? Are you kidding or something? Worldwide systematic economic collapse, skyrocketing unemployment and foreclosures and bankruptcies and poverty, unprecedented white-collar theft, near-daily reminders of increasing environmental destruction and catastrophic climate mutations, continuing and/or rising violence in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, and a dozen other countries...
Slow indeed...
lol do you think it's in Fox News' interest to cover economic collapse, skyrocketing unemployment, foreclosures, bankruptcies, poverty, white-collar theft, environmental destruction or rising violence in Iraq, Afghanistan & Pakistan? Since when does Fox News really cover anything relevant?
Don't be naive, they'd rather cover this phony "Civil War" and keep this irrelevant right vs. left war going.
I guess you don't Frank, yet. There's nothing naive about him!
The Civil War bullshitte is nothing more than another diversion by the MSM.
For the most part, the Common Dreams responders are far from being naive.
Seems funny that Mr. Greenwald didn't mention the high water mark of the angry white male movement - their terrorist bombing of Oklahoma City Federal Building.
---USAn---
With their hands being held by elements in the FBI...
OKC was an inside job like 911, where they needed domestic patsies to pass anti-terrorism legislation (& riders)...
And for 911, the CIA needed foreign patsies to pass the patriot acts and congressional approval to launch wars of aggression...