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Gaddafi Loyalists Resist and Say NATO Kills 354 Libyans
BANI WALID/SIRTE, Libya - Libyan interim government forces licked their wounds on Saturday after a failed assault on the town of Bani Walid, and a spokesman for Muammar Gaddafi accused NATO of killing 354 people in overnight air strikes on the city of Sirte.
An anti-Gaddafi fighter fires a multiple-rocket launcher near Sirte, the hometown of deposed leader Muammar Gaddafi, September 17, 2011. (REUTERS/Goran Tomasevic) Moussa Ibrahim, the deposed leader's spokesman, contacted Reuters by satellite telephone to say Gaddafi was still in Libya, leading the "resistance" against his foes.
He said NATO air strikes on Sirte, Gaddafi's birthplace, had hit a residential building and a hotel, killing 354 people.
"We are aware of these allegations," Colonel Roland Lavoie, spokesman for the Western military alliance, said in Brussels. "It is not the first time such allegations have been made. Most often, they are revealed to be unfounded or inconclusive."
The death toll could not be verified as communications with the coastal city have been scant since Tripoli fell on August 23.
More than 700 people were wounded in air strikes in Sirte on Friday, Ibrahim said, and 89 were missing.
"In the last 17 days more than 2,000 residents of the city of Sirte were killed in NATO air strikes," he added.
Ibrahim, who put his own location as near Sirte, said Gaddafi remained in the country and was confident of victory.
"We will be able to continue this fight and we have enough arms for months and months to come," he said.
Gaddafi loyalists have repelled assaults by forces of the ruling National Transitional Council (NTC) on Sirte and Bani Walid, launched after failed negotiations for their surrender.
Grumbles replaced gunfire outside Bani Walid as NTC fighters debated the failure of the previous day's attack and the town's defenders lobbed mortar bombs at them.
"It was difficult," admitted one fighter, surprised he had survived sniper fire and rockets when his brigade raced into Bani Walid on Friday. "We'll do it differently next time."
After hours of fighting, the NTC men had retreated almost as fast as they had poured into the town, in a serious setback to Libya's new rulers, trying to exert their grip across the country and seize remaining Gaddafi-held towns.
TRAITORS, SNIPERS, OIL SLICKS
On Saturday, NTC fighters blamed traitors, snipers and oil poured by Bani Walid's defenders down steep streets leading to the town center for their defeat.
"When we entered the city, snipers shot at us from the front and traitors shot at us from the back," said fighter Abushusha Bellal. "They always play tricks and shoot us in the back."
Others blamed a lack of troops, coordination and discipline among the different attacking brigades.
One fighter, Nuraldin Zardi, told Reuters his brigade had missed the order to retreat and had found itself trapped and isolated inside Bani Walid hours after their comrades had fled.
"We will not rely on our commanders any more," he said, reflecting growing dissent in NTC ranks. "We will do everything ourselves and take our own decisions."
The first of what NTC fighters said would be an extra 1,000 men from Tripoli and elsewhere began arriving near Bani Walid.
A Reuters reporter on the western highway leading to Sirte said he could hear gunfire and shelling as NTC forces advanced.
But Gaddafi loyalists were holding out in Sirte on Libya's central Mediterranean coast, a day after their opponents captured the city's airport on its outskirts.
"Gaddafi's troops are between the houses, there are a lot of snipers on the roofs," NTC fighter Mabrook Salem said.
Nearly four weeks after Gaddafi's foes overran Tripoli, Libya's interim council is unable to declare all of the vast North African nation "liberated" and begin a timetable for drawing up a democratic constitution and holding elections.
Despite their frustrations, the council is getting on with the business of government, seeking to impose order on various irregular armed forces and revive the oil-based economy.
Those efforts received a lift on Friday when the U.N. Security Council eased sanctions, including those on Libya's national oil company and central bank, and voted to establish a U.N. mission in the country.
The latest foreign visitor was Turkish Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan, who hailed the fate of Gaddafi as an example to Turkey's neighbor Syria whose autocratic president has resorted to tanks and troops to try to crush popular unrest.
Erdogan also called on the people of Sirte to give up the fight and make peace.
Contact has not been possible with Gaddafi loyalists in Sirte, Bani Walid or in Sabha, deep in Libya's southern desert where several senior Gaddafi aides have been lately.
Gaddafi, 69, remains at large and commands loyalty from at least hundreds of armed men, concentrated in areas from Sirte through Bani Walid and Sabha, creating a corridor in the vast empty spaces of the desert through which members of Gaddafi's family and senior aides have reached Algeria and Niger.
Niger's justice minister said on Friday it would not send one of Gaddafi's sons, Saadi, back to Libya, saying he could not get a fair trial there and risked the death penalty.
But Marou Amadou indicated that it would be different if Gaddafi, his son Saif al-Islam or intelligence chief Abdullah al-Senussi showed up. All three are wanted by the International Criminal Court for alleged crimes against humanity.
"If that person was, however, wanted by an independent tribunal or a state that has universal competence to try them, then Niger will do its duty," Amadou told a news conference.
(Additional reporting by William MacLean and Joseph Logan in Tripoli, Sherine El Madany in Ras Lanuf, Emma Farge in Benghazi, Barry Malone and Sylvia Westall in Tunis, Bate Felix in Niamey and Juliane von Reppert-Bismarck in Brussels; Writing by Alistair Lyon)
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58 Comments so far
Show All"In the last 17 days more than 2,000 residents of the city of Sirte were killed in NATO air strikes,"
goodness!
I hope they weren't civilians!
Geez, I hope the UN gets cracking on authorizing a "no-fly zone", and even a "humanitarian intervention", against NATO!
The Virtuous, Civilized, Free Nations have a "responsibility to protect", you know.
And by the bye, doesn't "responsibility to protect" sound so much nicer and loftier than the euphemism it replaced: White Man's Burden?
"Most often it is revealed" that Kaddafi's backers are wrong. Actually most of the times the evidence shows the West is in the wrong, which really fits the West since the Second World War as Martin Luther King Jr pointed out in reference to the USA being on "the wrong side of world revolution."
"The death toll could not be verified as communications with the coastal city have been scant since Tripoli fell on August 23."
Why is that? Now that the NATO and the western recognized "rebels" control the area shouldn't access be more "accessible"? Who's controlling communications?
""We will not rely on our commanders any more," he said, reflecting growing dissent in NTC ranks. "We will do everything ourselves and take our own decisions."
That sounds real promising. The UN will recognize these "yahoos" but not the Palestinians?
Carl, the majority vote at the UN will be in favor of Palestinian statehood. It's the US and it's puppets who will be able to block it.
"Loyalists" is one of the most clever pieces of slander I have ever come across, implying that fighting and dying for a cause that is your own and others is contemptable and shameful. I'll put it on the shelf next to that other masterpiece of mind-prop "insurgent". Nice one, media, I'm impressed.
remember the alamo.
insurgents can be defeated.
"But Marou Amadou indicated that it would be different if Gaddafi, his son Saif al-Islam or intelligence chief Abdullah al-Senussi showed up. All three are wanted by the International Criminal Court for alleged crimes against humanity."
Crimes against humanity, you say?" Oh, how they do pick and choose over at the good old ICC. How very fortunate for Cheney, Bush, Obama, Clinton and the NATO goons that carpet bombing sovereign countries, indeed, the entire Middle East, does not seem to enter into whatever criteria is used to define crime and criminals.
Not mentioned in comments is the oil and banks have made the deal that was the only reason they went in. That and the water France nees.
Good thing we protected the libyians, Iraqi's Afghani's ect. Shock and Awe was the same act of terrorism as done on the WTC.
NATO entered the Libyan war to prevent civilians from being slaughtered.We try to do this by killing civilians.
NATO entered the Libyan war to prevent civilians from being slaughtered.We try to do this by killing civilians.
No one seems to talk about the incompetence of American military leaders. After the debacles in Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, and now Libya, can no one stand up say that we have morons in charge of our military? Since 1945 the US has "won" two wars -- Grenada and Panama. Both countries have one thing in common -- they didn't fight back and surrendered.
When NATO first attacked, Gadaffi handed out weapons to 3 million civilians. These people won't just disappear. Years from today these people will continue to fight against the imperialist running dogs, or as Mao said, "Now U.S. imperialism is quite powerful, but in reality it isn't. It is very weak politically because it is divorced from the masses of the people and is disliked by everybody and by the American people too. In appearance it is very powerful but in reality it is nothing to be afraid of, it is a paper tiger. Outwardly a tiger, it is made of paper, unable to withstand the wind and the rain. I believe the United States is nothing but a paper tiger." (July 14, 1956).
This interview really cuts to the core of what's going on: http://youtu.be/HESrMrx3fIg
True! - That's good use of 6:41 mins on RT.
Long live the king,, errr, Long live Gadaffi and his thousands of loyal to Gadaffi hired Arfrican mercenaries.
Several years ago Gadaffi reported an air strike had killed his adopted daughter. He gained the sympathy he desired... Gadaffi is crazy but he isn't stupid.
His long "dead" daughter recently fled the country with other family members... Anyway; if Gadaffi or his backers report something, it must be true.
Quite the binary blinkers you have there. Speaking of 'truth', is there any reason everyone here should believe you?
You have weird obsessions.
Arctic methane and Gadaffi.
If the Arctic methane is gonna kill us all, why the hell does a 3rd-rater like Gadaffi matter so much?
I have weird obsessions you claim.... Ha Ha haa... You seem to be obsessed with WayneWR ~matti~... That really is weird.
Hey; I never have said the release of trillions of tons of the Arctic methane into our atmosphere, which is soon going to happen as the Arctic's permafrost continues to rapidly melt, is going to kill us ALL... The people on the International Space Station won't die from that disaster. And it may not happen ~matti~, we have a million to one chance it won't .
The Gaddafi issue?__ Ahhh, I find it fascinating of how many love that "good ol boy" and his thousands of hired killers... No obsession at all really, just one of the old retired guys sittind near my personal cracker barrel having fun discussing the current events.
How about you ~matti~, you having fun here too? __ Hey, aren't you one of the obtuse, insulting GW deniers, or have I mixed you up with someone else?
What are you?
No seriously...what are you? Do you really think the people doing this need to be ENCOURAGED? As if they might falter? Please...Americans may be many things but I would never say they refused an oppertunity to test their weapons out on live targets, hey, only way to keep that stuff calibrated, right? Right now there are weapons manufactureres hastily updating their websites, pamphlets, and show-room booths to say "As Used In Libya". To Americans, I guess, this is the meaning of the word 'legacy', I'm not trying to insult you, but your posts are giving me the same scary vibe I got from watching Jared Lee Loughtners youtube videos and reading his online posts: pell mell, slightly schitzo, basically non-sensical. I don't think you really belive what you are saying, but I get the impression you feel you 'have' to. OK. Fine. So once again, why the dead Libyans? Why do we and the world need more of them and not the live Libyans, because, honestly, and let's be really really honest about this now...This is what you and others defending this have to sell to people like me. You need to sell me on the idea that they are better off dead, that they deserved to die, that they won't be missed, that they were all bad in a sort of 'atomic' sense (bad to the core, impossible to talk to) that our bombs are being dropped "lovingly" and "with care" as if warfare were like surgury to remove a tumor and didn't leave behind any resentment. Well is that true? Do all the Iraquis love us? I'm nearly 31 years old, and I have lived in the south of the US all of my life. Let me tell you something, I have had my butt kicked. I mean really, really kicked. Buddy, I've had the tar beat out of me. But you know what? At no point during any of the beatings I took, did I magically snap and end up LOVING THE PERSON(s) WHO BEAT ME. I have a nagging suspicion that all human beings might, just might, be that way. Just a thought.
Yep ~~Watts~~, the UN should never have allowed any NATO action... Leave Gaddafi alone, he is a good ol boy, his thousands of African mercanary troops would't hurt a fly.
What am I you ask? __ What difference does it make to you? __ Can tell you some things, I'm not a Gaddafi fan, an Obama fan, Brush/Cheney cartel fan, or a fan of our disfunctional 536 DC elected, or our corrupt Pentagon personnel, our CIA or wars, our now Facist form of government ruled by big business. I am a fan of cleaning up our horribly polluted planet. Howzs that for satisfying your curiosity?.
I won't ask you (what you are) ~Watts~, because I really don't care. But I do wonder if yo are in any manner connected to the infamous ~Anthony Watts~?
BTW, where do you see me encouraging anyone here?
I'm still not convinced that Libyans need to die because you disagree with their head guy, a person you have never met and know entirely through second and third hand accounts. In fact, it looks like you dodged the question entirely. So let's try this again, tell me why ordinary Libyans, be they black, brown or blue, need to die right here, right now, by OUR hands. I want you to convince me. Try again, please. I mean this sincerely.
"Sock Puppets" never explain or elaborate. Their sole goal is to deflect and distract. To totally take the discussion off track. Some are more successful than others. Wayne seems to follow the Karl Rove method. Say it loud enough, with authority and often enough, and someone maybe lots of people will believe you.
~~gardenernorcal~~ why don't you tell me exactly what I have posted here that isn't true? __ Spit it out.. Yes I fully support the citizens of Libya who wish to have Gaddafi step down and allow them to try to have a democratic form of government instead of a dictatorship.
That is my choice. What is your choice? You disagree with my position but you refuse to cite an opinion, but fnd it necessary to criticize mine. Is that being honest, reasonable or fair?
If the ones posting comments here aren't taking sides on the issue they certainly are fooling me,,, and themselves... I'm not afraid to say thet I fully support the rebel forces and the UN action to assist them by taking out Gadaffi's high tech weaponry and allow the people of Libya to have that chance of freedon from a dictator.
Many posting insulting commetnts here directed at me because I have stated my position, say (they don't) have a postition on the issue, except apparently to leave Gaddafi alone to rule as he has for the past 41 years. I do not support that, so we disagree, no need to get rude,obnoxious and start spouting off assumptions and outright lies about me..
Whom have I attacked here? __ Show me.. I have replied to some uncalled for insults with sarcasm.
I have heard many times that Obama is going to (steal the oil) of Libya. The only one who has been stealing there is Gadaffi and his family... They sell the oil and take most of the profits for themselves.
It is quite obvious most here haven't been following the current news from the hundred plus journalists from all around the world who are in Libya and reporting what is happening there... The vast majority, over 95% of those polled in Tripoli, 3,000+ citizens last week, fully support the UN and NATO actions and do not support Gaddafi or his brutal, mindless, well paid murdering Arfrican mercenaries... Check it out..
Comments that I am an Obama supporter or any other such nonsense are invalid. I also do not ever "sockpuppet". So too say or to imply that I do that is a lie.
I only use the postering name ~WahyeWR~ here. I did agree with Obama asking the UN to authorize NATO forces to assit the protesting citizens of Libya, which is about the only thing Obama Has done I fully support.
Any wish to have an honest, fair debate on the issue, fine, but the uncalled for childish insults are just childish, low brow ignorance... And I do not believe I have taken the discussion (off track).. I did (reply) to ~matti's~ comment to me about the looming Arctic methane threat, but I did not initiate that issue which is off topic.
So where do you guys and dolls stand on the Gaddafi issue? "Duhhh, I don't know ~WayneWR~ ,but you are a murdering swine, a neo-con shill, a terrorist, an Obama lover, etc." __ Are you really that ignorant?
A reply to ~~AlanWatts4Ever's~~ fair question.
First; I take it you are In Libya, or have been, or you know Gaddafi personally... No I do not know Gadaffi, have heard him speak and know he's a 41 year dictator who has surrounded himself with more than two thosand hired mercenaries for his protection and that he has stolen more than $90 billion dollars from the Libya coffers for his personal use.
I will ask you a fair question, a questin for anyone here... Would you have preferred that when the civil war began in Libya, that the cries for help against Gadaffi's tanks, heavy weapons, aircraft, helicopter gunships, artillary, gunboats, scud missiles were ignored,,, and no one helped the rebels? ___That is a fair question.
I've never been to LIbya or the Mid East. I have been in the Congo once helping to rescue missionaries and having at least a hundred armed men run up to my aircraft holding out large tin buckets demanding their "freedon"..Scary!! That was probably before your time.
LIbyans are dying, rebels fightere, innocent civilians, Gaddafi suppporters and his mercenaries... The (citizens of Libya),__ (*chose*) __to__ fight__ Gadaffi, and have the civil war and end a 41 year long dictatorship... I support them.
And indeed NATO acton has killed many LIbyans, NATO forces are there (at the request) of the rebels... War is never good, NEVER ,,, but sometimes it is the only solution for the citizens of a country to gain their freedon from a dictator... Libya is not Vietnam, Iraq, or Afghanastan... There is no comprrison to those illegal, unjust wars which were started by us.
So until Gadaffi steps down, or is run out of the country, or perhaps killed and his hired mercaneris surrender or flee the country, or Gaddafi should win the Civil War, Libyans will be killed, die fighting for their freedom, as has happend in other countries in the past,,, Scotland, France Russia and America come to mind.
Should Gaddafi prevail, many Libyans will die, likely thousands.. We just won't hear about it.
Btw,,, for those who have offered speling lessons, I do appreciate it... I'm no the best typist.
You do realize don't you Libya is located on the continent of Africa?
You are scary!
When you say "African mercanary" what exactly do you mean?
I mean LIbya is a (seperate) country on the continent of Africa with legal borders... The African Mercenaries Gadaffi hires are from (several) different African countries located on the contnent of Africa... Try Googling Gadaffi's African mercaneries.
And I am certain that you are well aware of that fact, if not, you are either extremely ignoorant, or you are just being rudly argumentative and obtuse.
Why do we call the citizens of Libya, "Libyans", the citizens of Egypt, Egyptians, the citizens of Mexico, Mexicans, the citizens of Canada, Canadians? The citizens of China, Chinese?
Btw,, when one is replying to many others, one has many comments posted.
"To Americans, I guess, this is the meaning of the word 'legacy', I'm not trying to insult you, but your posts are giving me the same scary vibe I got from watching Jared Lee Loughners"
I would have to agree.
Use (<*p><*/p>) at the end of your paragraphs for breaks. It takes some getting used to, but it makes your post much more readable. Remove the asterisks.
Wayne is a sock puppet, paid and installed on the board to discourage intellegent and reasoned discussion.
http://www.pridesource.com/article.html?article=49163
I don't think most of us love him anymore than we loved GW when he granted him normalized trade status.
I don't think I am obtuse or a denier.
What "cracker barrel" is that you are sitting next to? I'd like to know.
The "cracker barrel" was a joke... Many long years ago, old guys sat around the country store on stools and rocking chairs and ate crackers for the store's cracker barrel and argued politics, women, crops, dogs and the weather.
We have a countrywide chain restaurant here in the US named "Cracker Barrel" for that very reason and their porches are loaded with rocking chairs and a cracker barrel. .. They also sponser NASCAR race cars.
Your outright lying assertions that I'm a "sock puppet" for anyone is offensive... I am my own person, hired by nobody.... And for you to whine that I am not reasonable because you disagree that I support the rebel forces in Libya is laughable... You have offered nothing of substance here except to insult and write lies about me.
I love these crackers, yum, yum. .
1986 is a little more than "several" years ago. Reagan bombed Gaddafi's compound in retaliation for the 1986 Berlin discotheque bombing. Reagan seemed to have revelled and gloried in the kill. Twenty years later we now seek to discredit Gaddafi by asserting we didn't kill her? I remember that. I remember asking myself how we would feel if someone bombed our "Whitehouse".
When GW took them off the "terrorist" list and granted them normal trade status, Why weren't we informed she had survived?
"Why weren't we informed she had survived?"
Ask Gaddafi.
I'd prefer to receive an answer from the republican administration that took them off the "terrorist" list and re-established trade and diplomatic relations. Didn't she attend diplomatic dinners? Do we have DNA evidence she's still living?
What's with the custom paint job on the military rocket launcher? Something isn't right here.
You know pictures like that remind me of how we used to popularize and publize the exploits of the Afghan "rebels" that held off the Russians in Afghanastan. And we all know who the poster child of that restistance was.
http://www.g2mil.com/afghanexpert.htm
It would appear those foreign import pickups come with missle launcher accessories.
Uhh ~~Smallbear~~ that pickup truck with the fancy paint job is not a military designed vehicle... You see when the majority of the citizens of a country decide they have had enough of a 41 year long dictatorship and decide to change or even overthrow the powers who be if necessary and that form of government, they begin with peacefully protesting.
Then if the crazy dictator who has stolen over $90 billion dollars from the country's treasury wants to keep control of that stolen money and won't negotiate with the protestors and instead has his hired mercaneries attack them, a civil war may break out, as was the case in Libya.
When the protesters, called "rebels" after the civil war breaks out fight back, they use whatever weaponry they can get their hands on and they use their private vehicles for use as military vehicles, so nothing is wrong with that photo.
The rebels do not have Russian made tanks, helicopter gunships, jet fighters, heavy artillary, Scud missiles, heavily armed troop carrier vehicles, gunboats, thousands of well armed, well paid and trained soldiers and African mercanies, so the rebels requested assistance from the UN, which was finally granted, but no UN or NATO ground forces were allowed... Therefore; private vehicles with mounted machine guns, etc, are quite common in the civil war being fought in libya.... Does that answer your fair question Smallbear?
They may not have what you have outlined, but they have every bit as much as the Afghans did with US assistance when fighting the Russians.
And actually they did have planes. During the cease fire, before the "no-fly" zone was called, it was the rebels flying planes not Gaddafi forces flying in the "no-fly" zone.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRlVyXm4oQc
Doesn't really answer my questions Wayne. Where did they get the missile launchers, where did they get the new pickups to mount them on? Who provided the ammo? Who taught them how to use them? We know where the Afghans and Bin Laden got theirs.
Well for one thing, thousands of Gadaffi's (Libyan) troops deserted and many joined the rebel forces and they took their weaponry with them... Rebel forces also managed to capture many of Gadaffi's weapons arsenals and storage areas... But you really are not up on the issue, so you don't know the truths, nor do you care as shown by your comments here. .
So Libyan rebels have enough money to buy fancy pickups with custom paint jobs?Even I can't afford that.
You really don't know much about Libya ~Smallbear~.
I think they got their arms and pickups from the same place the Afghans did in their resistance to the Russians.
http://www.g2mil.com/afghanexpert.htm
Trucks and equipment are very similar.
What you (think) is irrelavent... What the Libyan citizens' an the hundred + journalists who are there on site say is far more credible to intelligent reasonable people..
" Most often, they are revealed to be unfounded or inconclusive."
What are they in the rare instances when when they aren't "unfounded or inconclusive"? I find it hard to imagine that NATO isn't well aware of their targets and the damage their bombardments can and do cause. I am certain armaments are purchased based of efficiency and efficacy. I would find it strange that someone doesn't have the accurate figures based on the death and destruction caused by them.
The Pentagon is in Mexico, the Pentagon is in Libya. US out of both countries! End the US made, so-called 'War on Drugs'!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
US Northern Command Team Visits Mexico
September 18, 2011
-----------------------------------------------------------
PETERSON AIR FORCE BASE, Colo. (AP) -- Personnel from the U.S. military command responsible for homeland security have met with members of Mexico's military in a visit to that country. Army Gen. Charles H. Jacoby Jr., head of U.S. Northern Command, writes in his blog that the visit occurred last week. Jacoby doesn't identify the personnel who made the trip.
He said they used the trip to strengthen what he called an "already strong relationship" between Northern Command and Mexico's military. Northern Command is based at Peterson Air Force Base, Colo. It was formed after the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, to work with civilian authorities during emergencies as well as defend U.S. soil. Like his predecessors at Northern Command, Jacoby also heads the North American Aerospace Defense Command.
We also just gave a couple of "blackhawks" to Mexico. Probably fully armored and with extra ammunition. But hey this is hold over agreement from the a part of the "evaporated" SPP agreements, that we now deny ever took place.
(Hey learn to use <*p><*p> for paragraph breaks here at CD, until they get their web site scripting straightened out. Remove the asterisks and copy and paste at the end of each paragrph.)
Yep, learned how to seperate the paragraphs in June when I first noticed that strange computer program. When did you figure it out ~~gardenernorcal~~?
It is strange that you won't say whom you support, if any, except to show (you are against) the Libyan rebels forces in the Libya Civil War and attack any who do suport their justafable desires and goals.
However; you do post your "thinks" on the issue and pander to Gadaffi by your words and your opinions,,, but you are not suporting Gadaffi... Is that so?__ You working for any of the far to the right GOP idiots, or the Tea Party nutcases? __ Just askin, because you and your sidekicks here sound exactly like them.
A person cannot stand on one side of a fence and claim they aren't there and be credible.
There again you ASSUME! __ "The blackhawks are armed" yakity, yakity yak. Rush Limber brain all over again.
Wayne, whatever you are, all I can say you sure carry a grudge. A vague, outwardly projected grudge, not really rooted in any definable form, but it appears to take the shape of piles and piles of dead human beings, whom you have never met and now never will. And gardenernorcal is 100% correct to ask why for the love of our savior do you keep harping again and again (I've noticed this too whenever you comment on Libya) that there are "African Mercenaries" involved. Libya is in Africa! Technically any paid member of the Libyan army is already, by default, a paid "African" fighter, and I guess "mercenary". So what?!
You previously asked me a fair question and said you were sincere about it. I replied and answeered your fair question... I won't bother to answer it again.
I will say your assumptons about me in repect to me having a "grudge" is just an assumptrion on your part and what you base that sssumption on are further rude, lying assumptions on your part.
LIbya is on the Continent of Africa. So is Egypt, etc... There are many different countries on that continent... The citizens of libya are called Libyans as you have called them... Why didn't you call them Africans?
Gadaffi has hired thousands of mercenaries from several different Afrtican countries. Those loyal to Gadaffi mercenaries are nor Libyans, it is not necessary for sensible people to name every single different country his mercenaries come from to describe them as his mercenaries.
They are "African mercaneries", not (Libyan) citizens, or French, or Dutch, or Korean mercanaries, they are from many different countries in Africa.... The press and media term them "African mercanaries", so do I... Do as you please.
And "so what" you ask __ in obvious ignorance of the issue... The citizens of Libya with ample justification fear the African mercanies, they hate and despise them... That is "so what" and is one (major reason), the (citizens of Libya), Libyans, wanted Gadaffi out.
You have not answered any of my fair questions and I am not surprised. .
Ample justification? What exactly is that justification. Please, I'd like to understand your viewpoint.
http://libyancivilwar.blogspot.com/2011/05/anti-black-racism-among-libyan-rebels.html
http://mrzine.monthlyreview.org/2011/forte200411.html
I am wondering exactly who you consider "mercanies"?
You don't know what the word "mercenaries" means? And if I mis-spelled it with a typo, and I did, you know what I meant.? Buy a good dictionary.
You Wrote, ("Ample justification? What exactly is that justification. Please, I'd like to understand your viewpoint")... No you wouldn't, you asked me a similar question here previously and I answered you and you have ignored it.
Google: Gadaffi's mercenaries and read the many credible articles about them and what those hired killers have done in LIbya... You obviously do not care at all about the vast majority of the citizens in Libya, who are fighting for their freedom from a crazy dictator who has robbed the country of their wealth for his personal use.
BTW, do you have an opening in your typing and propper speloling classes, or do you only teach those subjects here at CD? .
I find it strange WayneWR can do paragraph breaks but he seems to have problems with racial concepts and the basic spelling of mercenary, and never provides supporting links.