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Today's Top News
Pakistan: No Justification For US Drone Attacks
Pakistan has said that US drone strikes in the north-west have "neither justification nor understanding".
ISLAMABAD: Pakistan said Thursday there was "no justification nor understanding" for US drone strikes on its soil that have ramped up to record levels in the past month.
"We believe that they are counter-productive and also a violation of our sovereignty," foreign ministry spokesman Abdul Basit told reporters, adding:
"We hope that the US will revisit its policy."
Basit said that the drone war was "not serving the larger strategic interests, especially in the context of our efforts to win hearts and minds, which is part and parcel of our strategy against militants and terrorists".
Eight people were killed Wednesday in the latest attacks by the pilotless planes against militants in North Waziristan tribal district, security officials said.
The US has launched a record number of strikes since September 3 - a total of 26 drone attacks that have killed 149 people, according to officials.
Since August 2008, 142 strikes have been launched, killing more than 1,100 people.
Officials in Washington say in the past drone strikes have killed a number of high-value targets including former Pakistani Taliban chief Baitullah Mehsud and it has branded the remote border region the global headquarters of Al-Qaeda.
However, the attacks fuel anti-American sentiment in the country.
Pakistan's ambassador in Washington, Hussein Haqqani, told the BBC that the increase in strikes in North Waziristan came after intelligence agencies uncovered the plot to "attack multiple targets in Europe".
He also said that a drone strike on Monday in the district which killed eight militants, including five Germans, was linked to the plot.
The United States does not as a rule confirm drone attacks, but its military and the Central Intelligence Agency operating in Afghanistan are the only forces that deploy the pilotless aircraft in the region.
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45 Comments so far
Show AllOilybomber is a moron he took a bad war and made it worse.
Is that the $40 per gallon ( 0r is it $400) fuel the Pashtuns are setting ablaze?
As if almost everyone with half a brain did not tell Oilybomber that Afghanistan = Vietnam.
Looks like Pakistan is starting to choose ethics over bribes.
Glen ,I don't know the answer to that question but ... maybe it is $40 at the border ,and $400 if it makes it through the Khyber pass and Kush mountains.
peace
Well, here is why this long long war can't end yet according to the plan: You see before anyone in the world does damage or an act of terror in the USA or Europe they must first travel to AfPak to get training and orders, so only then can we fight them over there so there can be no terror here.
Problem is this is insanity because War is not how you defeat terrorism... War is fucking terrorism!
AS Noam Chomsky had said:
"people often say or ask : how can we defeat Terrorism?...it's simple...Don't participate in it".
I thought it was Afghanistan = "tar baby".
We the American people should restrain from name-calling, because our heroes cannot last 5 minutes alone with a Muslim prisoner without sticking something in their anus.
Perhaps it is optimism, but I took the comment here to be ironic, not a statement of what the commenter actually believed, but how he perceived them to be treated currently on the international scene. The choice of the anachronistic phrase and the use of quotes around it are what indicated this to me.
As far as the "restrain from name-calling" bit - that is a pretty broad thing to ask, should I not be entitled to say, for instance, that Rupert Murdoch is a festering pile of elephant dung? (No offence to any festering piles of elephant dung who may be reading this, it's just what came to mind)
No shit, the United States should "revisit the policy" of using Predator drone attacks (and special ops death squads) as a standard operating procedure in waging a global "war on terror." No shit, the repeated missle strikes on Pakistani soil or in the tribal border areas between Afghanistan and Pakistan are "counterproductive" and a flagrant violation of well established international law defining Pakistan's sovereignty.
The 2001 Authorization for Use of Military Force resolution, rushed through Congress at the height of the post-9/11 hysteria and anthrax scare, specifically limited the use of US military force to the individuals who took part in the terrorist attack of September 11th, 2001, and any nation state or other entity harboring those individual conspirators. The AUMF as written, and as perfunctorily "debated" by the Congress in the fall of 2001 before it passed with overwhelming bipartisan support, was not an open ended authorization for the Pentagon and/or the CIA to kill terrorist evil doers in general, wherever they might be lurking, anywhere on the globe.
Clearly, mission creep has taken on a life all its own. Sending clandestine special ops "kill or capture" teams onto another nation's soil is an act of war, regardless of whether the commandoes are spies dressed up like soldiers, or soldiers dressed up like spies. Pressing the button to launch a cruise missle strike on another nation's soil, too, is an act of war, whether the button is pushed in Afghanistan, Creech Air Force base, or at Langley. That the affected nation's government may tacitly approve the military intrusions by the US with a wink and a nod (or not) is beside the point.
The formal winding down and eventual withdrawal of US forces from Iraq and Afghanistan is an important component of restoring the rule of law - US constitutional law as well as international law. Yet what sort of trade off is it if Uncle Sam the superpower instead creates a dystopian landscape in which the distinction between acts of war and acts of murder have been consciously blurred beyond all recognition?
What the RAND and Pentagon think tank strategists label "low intensity warfare" such as that going on in the northwest frontier border regions, Pakistan, Somalia, Yemen, and elsewhere needs to be openly debated by the Congress. Commission of murder (or "targeted assassination") across international borders is not simply a foreign policy "option on the table" for the Commander-in-Chief to pick up, or to leave in place, as a matter of executive whim.
If the United States government continues to use its soldiers, its spies, and its hi tech drone gadgetry to kill people abroad (with or without deniability, with or without Congressional authorization), what sort of blowback should we all expect in return for the world we are creating?
Bill from Saginaw
Bill, You raised the best questions for the future.
From your revealing of CD Locust's DAFT war Declaration.... I see why it was necessary to not find or prove a kill on OSAMA.
The main cover for this long long war is any country where Osama and friends (Bush gang included) may be hold up (Dallas) is fair game to kill even total war if they want.... according to DAFT.
Our MIC and the MIC Banksters are realizing that the Racket of War is being exposed by Intel whistle blowers and folk paying attention to the suffering in the blow-back of the long public secret war criminal records.
It seems Obama is trying a bit of some of the same decisions that JFK faced and died for and what Ike warned about.
We got a yuppie CIA vetted in his youth prez faced with catchup of what they should have done back when us beat hippie folk were revolutionizing... They killed us and coped the scene.... but WERE BACK!
"That the affected nation's government may tacitly approve the military intrusions by the US with a wink and a nod (or not) is beside the point." –(Bill from Saginaw)
No, it is not 'beside the point,' it is the point. Certainly America should 'revisit' its drone policy, but everyone knows it won't, in fact, cannot; nor will Pakistan act to seriously challenge their continuance.
If it were not 'the point', the drones would be shot down and the fascist death squads making the 'illegal' incursions into Pakistan would be killed or at least, resisted on the ground. Neither is a remote possibility. What is happening here is another geo political 'feint,' another 'dog and pony show' of ineffectual, faux anger–a toothless protest, that in the end, will signify nothing– except 'business as usual.'
Pakistan allows both implicitly and will continue to do so. What other choice does it have but risk the further enmity of the imperium? America would like nothing less than the full on saturation bombing and escalation into an expanded war, if its hegemony is directly challenged. Pakistan is an American 'client state' infested with C.I.A. and newly minted fascist embassies.
If the drone terror was ever going to stop, it would never have began.
Your postings are measured, well written and informative but your chimerical adherence and continued belief in the 'rule of law,' constitutional or International, in retrospect, risks becoming an egregious fatuity. Neither American 'Constitutional' law or 'International' law exist. They are shibboleths, pretensions. There is only Imperial law, which is the rule of force. It cannot be 'de-legislated back into compliance,' or 'restored,' once it has been breached.
That can happen only when the imperium itself ends.
First that, then the 'laws.' Put the horse, before the cart.
It is your opinion that the USA would love to carpet bomb Pakistan.
But, the Generals are not insanely suicidal and I hope you are not projecting.
Iran does not have the bomb but the USA knows unacceptable destruction when they see it.
Did you ever have a course in military strategy?
"but the USA knows unacceptable destruction when they see it." –(Jim Glover)
Oh yeah? You sound like a resident 'alien.' What fatuous planet are you living on? In Vietnam, they wiped out, literally incinerated, nearly all my wife's ancestors by making scorched earth of the valley where they had lived peacefully for over 400 years. The adjacent valley was carpet bombed into non-existence, leaving only atomized craters. Tell me the USA knows what is "acceptable destruction!" By whose 'standards?'
Do you actually, for one moment, believe that this atrocity could not happen again? Do you understand the first thing about America– that which the most ignorant peasant in Afghanistan understands implicitly?
"Unacceptable destruction," my ass! America has no idea what that means. That is what makes it America and you an 'American.'
Can the barbarity of the Iraq war's in anyway be deemed 'acceptable?' Perhaps to you? Did that fit into your 'course' in strategic considerations of acceptable standards of military destruction? I don't have to put words in your mouth, as they are already there. Swallow your own defecations.
"Your ideas are terrifying and your hearts are faint. Your acts of pity and cruelty are absurd, committed with no calm, as if they were irresistible. Finally, you fear blood, more and more. Blood all the time." –(Paul Valéry)
Death is its own 'military strategy.' Why take a course in its strategy? Only blockheads and crypto-fascists would do that.
"It is not to be thought that the life of darkness is sunk in misery and lost as if in sorrowing. There is no sorrowing. For sorrow is a thing that is swallowed up in death, and death and dying are the very life of the darkness."
–(Jacob Boehme)
–Vashkar.
VashkarKim...
your remarks and the quotes you gave to support your remarks made me recall a few statements I read over time that somehow connect the "kinship" between
TORTURE and WAR, in that both are Cruelties.
where , say, socrates had said:
:"Wars are waged for money and power" (easily can be understood as cruelties)
and where some have said, particularly the lead US "interviewer" of the Nazi war criminals in his conclusion about Evil: "it is banal, it is the absence of conscience"...again a cruelty
and then how some looking into why people torture others...(I think it was recently said by an american official who whistleblew about guintanamo tortures)...
: "the REAL REASON to Torture, is ..........TO torture"....it seems that the "reason" for these things are no other than JUST THESE THINGS, in and of themselves.
NOT about 'defense'...or "saving a city before the terrorist blows it up, so we must torture for information"...
in other words -- the EVIL is ITS own reason.
"in other words -- the EVIL is ITS own reason." –(Teddy)
Thanks Teddy. You see into it here.
That is why one should avoid courses in military strategy.
The quote "evil is banal" reminds me of a phrase that was used as a CD title:
"Constant Shallowness Leads to Evil"
that all so seems appropriate to throw in there.
I can see why one might want to study a military strategy course, of course.
If one wanted to have a good idea in advance as to how they would be coming at you.
Life in chess or go or any other strategy game, regardless of the type of strategy you choose and plan to follow, knowing in advance what the opposing side is most likely to do puts you at an advantage.
Kim 1:28 your posting is very much accurrate.
Except Pakistan is starting to show some sense and independence by halting the convoys, if they continue the war is over unless Russia helps the USA.
I do not believe Pakistan could reach the USA with a nuke, they could reach USA bases in Afghanistan (harm to nearby Afghans?) and most likely Iraq bases in some instances far from Iraq civilians. But I believe the USA could first strike any country except China,Russia and France hard enough to eliminate any serious retaliation, except by what is often refered to as "terrorism".
Glenn,
I was referring to Pakistan's ability to deploy its Air Force to destroy the drones in flight, not the launching of a nuclear attack on America.
I hope you are right that Pakistan's 'government' is serious in stopping the convoys.
That is one thing I would take delight in being proven wrong over.
–(Kim)
Pakistan needs to continue stoppage of the convoys and it needs to begin shooting down drones.
Correct. This goes without saying. We applaud you for saying it.
In truth, if the drones are not shot down and the convoys are not stopped, Pakistan as a sovereign state does not exist.
Which means?
Pakistan as a sovereign state does not exist. The drones will not be shot down and the convoys will commence in due time.
Rarely are choices ever so clear. There are no other options.
"Except Pakistan is starting to show some sense and independence by halting the convoys, if they continue the war is over unless Russia helps the USA."
If the Afghan supply lines were cut off, I believe the Russians would be delighted to help the US.
Not only would they make a profit off of the use of their facilities, but more important, they would get the incalculable reward of payback in the form of the US going bankrupt in the same Afghan swamp that the USSR went bankrupt. Hard to imagine how delighted they would be to hear us thank them for their help in pushing us off a cliff.
They'll get more than cash for their help. I'm sure that when the US eventually collapses from imperial overreach, one of the first things they will reclaim is Alaska. It looks big on the map, but in population, it's roughly the size of Ft. Lauderdale ... easy pickins.
Nah, the Alaskans are more likely to secede from the states and join Canada than be re-absorbed by the new Russian Empire... not that either is a very likely thing to happen I don't think.
{"There is only Imperial law, which is the rule of force."}
thanks, for a well written anaysis. we often hear the expression, "puppet government" but few back in the hu-ass-hey see the strings which yank congress by the short hairs. just another puppet show brought to you by the international chamber of commerce.
empires rise and fall. feeding upon its host nation in order to expand ever outward, crumbling from within the empire eventually implodes. yet each new generation of imperialists, drunk on power, fails to note the constant pull, the absolute law:
what goes up must come down!
Drone on American empire !
We have a hopelessly ignorant western media, and an ignorant and criminal U.S. military and government.
An interesting example of this ignorance is that the tribal regions of Pakistan are often referred to a "lawless".
But in fact, the traditional tribal laws and Islamic laws of this region are more tightly structured than law and social practices in Amerika. And our government becomes more criminal every day.
The ancient Pashtun code of law and honor called Pashtunwali, is very exacting law covering every aspect of life from birth to death and governs the 40 million Pashtuns in Afghanistan and western Pakistan. And there are also Pashtuns in the Pakistani military.
Kill someone in the Pashtun family or clan or tribal group and you have made enemies of everyone interrelated by this system. Pashtunwali code demands an eye for an eye, with no time limits, and is also supported by similar Islamic ethics.
More drone strikes mean more resistance and an endless supply of motivated Pashtun fighters to bleed the criminal American corporate empire.
But of course the drones are very expensive and turn a profit for the MIC. I would imagine the sociopaths who make the drones have a very active lobby in Washington.
The sociopaths who make the drones live not only in the boardrooms of the manufacturers but also on the assembly lines. $28.50 an hour assembling drones ain't bad work if you can get it, and provides a nice middle class life. Of course, there IS that CONSCIENCE thing, but that's been bred out of most US citizens by now.
$28.50/hr sounds like a nice upper lower class wage, but it's hardly middle class.
I agree.
Evidently, it all begins to make sense after awhile . . .
Adultery, car accidents, malpractice and the drug war all keep lawyers busy --
Halloween candy and teeth rotting sodas create wealth for dentists --
Some lawyers and doctors can also be moved to assist TREASON and TORTURE
by corrupt government officials, corrupt MIC leaders.
.
"According to all myth, the female - not the male -- gives life"
The endless wars continue because the military-industrial-infortainment complex and their whores in WARshington are making money. Wikipedia reports that each one of those predator drones costs $4.5 million.
Insanity... Utter insanity.
Can you imagine the reaction of the us government if it were Cuban drones that were bombing Florida based anti-Castro 'terrorists'?
The reaction of the Pakistani government is very mild considering the gross violation of its nation's sovereignty. Almost any European country would have declared war by now.
Declare war against the US? That would be suicidal.
Maybe, maybe not. After all, how many more countries can your economy afford to send troops to? Of course, I suppose you could just nuke 'em... (grin)
How quickly the drone has become the leading symbol of death and all that is sinister. The Republicans and the Democrats should jettison the elephant and the donkey and adopt the drone as their symbol. The Republicans can add shark's teeth like the Flying Tigers of WWII. The Democrats can add a smiley face.
I am not a cost expert on the drones, but I would bet that the estimate of $4.5 million per drone is just the current manufacturing cost of the drone itself minus all the research and development costs leading to the creation of drones.
Then there are the missiles they fire and the cost of deploying and maintaining this system around the globe and the control centers and communication systems involved and the manpower needed every step of the way including so-called military intelligence.
This might be the most expensive dollars per human killing machine in history. And some estimates say ten civilians are killed for every suspected "insurgent". This is billions and billions of dollars robbed from the taxpayer.
Duh, how about using our tax dollars for real national health care like the rest of the developed world or affordable higher education or clean alternative energy ?
And of course the whole mess is in violation of international law and and making more and more enemies. This means very expensive blowback in many forms in the future.
What a human and economic price to pay for a private corporate Pipelineistan ! Big Oil has their sights set on providing oil and natural gas to the one billion consumers and growing economy of India and other Asian nations. This energy is now confined within Central Asia.
How strange, due to wasteful war oriented spending to further corporate agendas, the American economy and energy consumption are in decline ! Big Oil is looking to expand their global international markets and bottom line.
But it appears for now that the drone is the weapon of choice for the globalized corporate war criminal puppets in Washington.
Al Qaeda supports the continuation of drone warfare because attacks against Muslim civilians are good for recruitment. Is this why the US continues with the drones?
US drone attacks in Pakistan are state sponsored terrorism. Every citizen, myself included is guilty of funding this terrorism with federal tax dollars.
Welcome to the planet.
Americans have been funding state terrorism since their Military committed genocide against the Native Americans. Check out how the Military used atrocity to "break the spirit" of the Philippines "insurgents" back in one of the early imperial wars. The US National Security State was using "terror" long before Operation Phoenix in Vietnam, and long after. "Covert Operations" are covert from the American public, not the countries where their women and children are being killed.
http://www.alternet.org/world/39416/
You've been funding State Terror since your first paycheck.
comment deleted by its author
Do you deny, using your inferior intellect, that the US national security state employs terrorism routinely, and is funded by paycheck taxes ?
No ?
Good. That's step one.
Step two is either leave the system (Americans become citizens of other countries all the time, but it is not mentioned much in the US), or work to change the system. I'm not calling for you to wander into the woods to forage to survive - just don't pointlessly wring your hands in guilt over every revelation of US evil, like killing a few dozen civilians with drones in Pakistan. A million Iraqi's dying after the illegal "shock and awe" Invasion was no more my fault than was Rome's invasion of Gaul the fault of a farmer in Siena 2000 years ago. Being born into an evil system is not the same as running it.
If there were a widely viewed alternative to the propaganda of the corporate News, that would be a good start to changing the widespread American belief that victims of US force deserve it:
http://www.therealnews.com/t2/
@katrine October 9th, 2010 10:40 am
I can see why a Western European country would not take an unskilled person like yourself, but don't presume that applies to everybody.
No, I'm not retired - that's just more of your lazy reasoning.
"But duh, I'm well familiarized with Real TV "
It's "The Real News", or "Independent World Television". You being 'well familiarized' with them doesn't help their funding, now does it ? If you wanted to work to change the system, you'd have to actually do some work and give some money...
You don't seem too inconvenienced by being part of a system of State Terror - gee, it pays well, and living in Saudi Arabia would be unpleasant and take too much work packing.
"Dude, I don't hand wring."
Well isn't that special. I'll let my Iraqi friend know you've moved on, and are feeling fine.