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TechnoratiGJP Protests Defense Contractors At Career Fair
BOSTON, Mass. - A group of 20 Boston College students stood out from the throng of suited undergrads who crowded Conte Forum during Tuesday's career fair. Those students, clad in "Who Would Jesus Bomb" T-shirts and kneeling silently, were protesting the presence of weapons manufacturers at the annual BC career fair.
![[Members of the Global Justice Project kneeled in front of the Raytheon table at the career fair. (Media Credit: Ian Thomas)]](http://www.commondreams.org/files/article_images/bostoncollege.jpg "bostoncollege.jpg")
The protest was organized by the Global Justice Project (GJP), a non-hierarchical organization whose mission is to educate and advocate for justice and democracy at BC. Fifteen student demonstrators knelt at the recruitment tables of military contractors Raytheon and BAE Systems. To the side of the kneeling students, six others participated in a satirical theater demonstration, posing as recruiters from a fictitious competing weapons manufacturer, the Civil Liberties On-Line Weapons Network Services (CLOWNS). The protestors actively tried to recruit career fair attendees to work for their company, offering "frequent buyer airfare packages ... to defend and promote democracy abroad." Midway through the event, students unfurled a banner, reading "Do Jesuits support cluster bombs? Kick Raytheon and all war off campus!"
"I feel that by refusing to un-invite Raytheon, the BC administration is condoning the company's policies, which to me is clearly contradictory to the Jesuit philosophy of this institution," said Tim Dingman, a member of the GJP and A&S '11.
Student demonstrators elected not to apply for a University-issued demonstration permit, citing the administration's "frighteningly clear" pattern of censoring student groups and infringing on their right to dissent and free expression on campus. They instead issued a "student demonstration permit" to members of the University. The permit read, in part, "not only do we believe we have an obligation to peacefully demonstrate the presence of weapons manufacturers on our campus, but we believe that dialogue and freeexchange of ideas are vital to the academic setting of any university that claims to espouse the values of scholarship and higher education."
The permit said that weapons manufacturers reap financial gain from violent and deadly global conflict, and asked whether BC supports organizations that are "helping to build the Kingdom of God," or ones that "create the deadly bombs to destroy it."
This is the fifth career fair protest that has taken place in the last five years, but past demonstrations have not been conducted as peaceably.
In 2005, the GJP's plans to protest the presence of Raytheon included a display that was to include faux Raytheon workers who were assembling a missile, as well as a bomb scene complete with bodies and debris. Though the organization sought and obtained permission to stage its demonstration, the University was unaware of the dramatic display the group had planned; the protest was cancelled at the last minute.
In 2004, 12 students staged a "pray-in" at the career fair at the Raytheon without University permission. Two of the demonstrators who refused to leave after the BC Police Department and the dean for student development arrived faced disciplinary action.
"As people of conscience, our faith demands that we actively work toward peace and justice," said Kathryn Bishop, a student demonstrator and A&S '10. "Today's prayer and protest is a small, but important step on the road toward nonviolence and disarmament."
70 Comments so far
Show AllManufacturing weapons to kill people with and to make money off of is a moral abomination. It brings bad karma to people who work in that industry. "Karma" is reaping what you sow.
In most big cities across the nation, defense contracting jobs dominate the job market. Judah made a wise point on simply protesting. The non-military jobs in this nation are often outsourced overseas or given to illegals in this country when they cannot force their American worker to accept the job at very low wages when these same workers are going to need a decent pay to pay off their mortgages on their car(s) and house and other standard monthly bills. Ever since WWII ended, the Military Industrial Complex has slowly been empowered by both parties to PRIVATIZE good paying jobs. Add to it, Wall $treet generally benefits a lot from wars including the one in Iraq which is why they bankrolled it big time. My cousin who lives in Shenandoah, VA works in Washington near the Pentagon and her local areas in the northwestern part of VA where she lives offer virtually no well-paying jobs for her education and skills. Even in Washington where there are more government jobs or long term contracts, the non-military jobs don't even cover the well-educated as they used to. Getting a security clearance and being able to work in a defense contracting company is the only way she and her husband were able to stay afloat.
What needs to happen is that we need to start creating jobs closer to where we live and make them well-paying and with decent benefits if we are to counter the military industrial complex that has been successful in joining the vested corporate interests in povertizing and depopulating rural areas. I recall when the BRAC issue in my state of SC came up and people were conditioned to protest the removal of the military base for fear that jobs would have been lost. Well, it was removed and non-military jobs did indeed replace the military ones but people still grumbled like hell. Yet these same people were "happy" when NAFTA and CAFTA displaced 10 times more jobs than the removal of BRAC could ever do. War and "free" trade are strong allies against the working class no matter how one spins it. Believe it or not, South Carolina would happily vote Democrat if more voters could look forward to Democrats cancelling those "free" trade scams such as NAFTA, CAFTA, China PNTR, etc ... and stand up to the GOP on economic and foreign policies that have been stifling real job growth on the local front. The Republicans and fake "libertarians" lie about being against Big Government intrusion but in the end, they pull the rug out from under and stealthily invade and rob.
Good points about how the defense industry provides jobs. The same applies to military bases and the prison industry. They are the mainstay or sole large employer in many a local economy. It is a real problem that should be faced, because no matter what people think about a policy or institution, they are not going to voluntarily choose to end the weekly paycheck with no alternative and look at the kids with nothing to offer.
We need a "Swords into Plowshares" economic plan that creates training and green jobs in energy, transportation, construction and local agriculture to replace jobs that will be lost by closing. Meanwhile, since the taxpayer is paying these men and women anyway, we could continue to pay them full salary and let them do community service, go to school or sit around playing cards. At least it would do no harm. We would save money by eliminating the CEO's and ridiculous profits.
Joe
How far will defense contractors go once peak oil hits us all? It's all only going to last so long anyway.
In Houston we got a small sample, not of what Peak Oil will be like, but the decline slope after peak oil. Here's a small sample; long lines at gas stations, tons of meat, dairy products and other perishable foods thrown out into dumpsters, price gouging on produce i.e.: paying 2 dollars for a stalk of broccoli, flaring tempers from standing in lines for food, gasoline, etc, No work, People walking outside of their homes and talking to their neighbors for the first time, People volunteereing their skills to help others, i.e. red cross, ham radio operators, etc, People playing music on their guitars and other personal musical instruments, No distractions from TV, radio or the Internet, Being able to find the time to read, do important house work. Life after Peak Oil will be messy and unorganized
That doesn't sound good. About the perishable foods, I don't think they'll be thrown out just like that. As I have learned from others on this site, all these plastics are made from oil or natural gas. I think people learned their lessons from the 1970s and didn't oil production in your state peak at that time?
As for my state, corn is unfortunately the main cash crop although I stood up to Big Corn by cutting my earnings from corn. Unfortunately, most people in my state are desperately clinging to corn despite the cold hard truth that it is very energy intensive and uses up more water and fossil fuels. In 2006, my earnings from corn peaked at 80%. I've transitioned away since mid 2006 and now only 45% of my earnings come from corn. My state is already on the long term economic decline and peak oil will slowly but steadily erode the corn sales although over production in corn has lead to massive destruction of the soil. As a matter of fact, since the Niobrara River is drying up at a rapid rate and I put the blame on corn which causes more global warming.
The TV, radio, and Internet may still remain oil or none from what I hear.
"One of the most popular and simple-minded myths relentlessly fed and eagerly accepted by active and discharged military persons is that their service was offered and accepted primarily to protect, preserve, and defend Our Freedoms and Way of Life. Buying into this noble myth is a sublime form of denial, a defense mechanism which allows the militarized person to feel pride, satisfaction, and self-worth that amounts to permanent superiority over civilians."
Perfect. Great description. And great description of John McCain. If he had any sense he would emphasize sides of himself that have nothing to do with the Military at all. The way that Patton was able to do with his classical references for instance. To be a Military hack and nothing more might get him
elected-- I sincerely hope not. People have such inferiority complexes that they're looking for someone with a big stick or big arm or good outside shot.
American males whose interest is limited to sports are a dreadful cliche, a sorry example of suspended lifetime adolescence. And McCain with his perpetual refrain of "winning" qualifies. Sports and the Military have always had so much in common, except people get killed in one more than the other.
I love sports. But God help anyone whose life consists of nothing more.
I truly feel that the younger Obama is much more mature.
When positions of high leadership are considered, you want someone with breadth of interest, education, and viewpoint-- like Jack Kennedy. He'd actually read books and was able to refer to them. Or consider George F. Kennan, the greatest American "diplomatist" (his own term) of the last century. This man was such a good observer he could have been a poet or writer or philosopher, maybe even a painter, but committed himself to internationalism and politics.
I feel that Barack Obama is a much more well-rounded individual than John McCain, despite McCain's obvious attributes (which he seems to be steering farther and farther away from, incidentally).
"How is a military drilled and trained to defend freedom, peace and happiness? This is what Major General O'Ryan has to say of an efficiently trained generation: 'The soldier must be so trained that he becomes a mere automaton; he must be so trained that it will destroy his initiative; he must be so trained that he is turned into a machine. The soldier must be forced into the military noose; he must be jacked up; he must be ruled by his superiors with pistol in hand.' This was not said by a Prussian Junker; not by a German barbarian . . . but by an American major general. And he is right. You cannot conduct war with equals; you cannot have militarism with free born men; you must have slaves, automatons, machines, obedient disciplined creatures, who will move, act, shoot and kill at the command of their superiors. That is preparedness, and nothing else." — Emma Goldman
________________________________________________________
Military training exists to convert human beings into homicidal, and not infrequently sadistic, sociopaths. Such souls, consciences, or moral centers as recruits have are reprogrammed and incorporated into the military hive mind.
The evil in this institutionalized crime against humanity is all the more horrific because the common soldier does not own his or her life; the Ultimate Sacrifice may be required at any time, regardless of whether it is spent in the course of a carefully-planned operation or because of the mistake, whim, arrogance, or stupidity of a commander or comrade.
To compensate for this loss of humanity, soul, physical and mental health, and life itself-- a horrific, obscene state of affairs-- over the centuries military authorities in ALL nations and culture have built up a culture, a formidable array of myths and customs to confer redeeming appreciation and glory upon its members, enlisted and conscripted alike. High-minded ideals and sentiments-- Duty, Honor, Country, are preached; medals and ribbons are awarded for gallantry and achievement; ideals and decorations alike glitter like ornaments and tinsel on a Christmas tree. And like the present under the tree, all of this is tied together with fraternity and fellowship: the "band of brothers", exclusive and set apart from ordinary inferior citizens.
One of the most popular and simple-minded myths relentlessly fed and eagerly accepted by active and discharged military persons is that their service was offered and accepted primarily to protect, preserve, and defend Our Freedoms and Way of Life. Buying into this noble myth is a sublime form of denial, a defense mechanism which allows the militarized person to feel pride, satisfaction, and self-worth that amounts to permanent superiority over civilians.
To abandon the self-serving faith in the profound virtue of one's military service is to face up to difficult truths, as those few possessing great integrity and merciless self-examination and insight have done:
________________________________________________________
"I spent thirty-three years and four months in active service in the country's most agile military force, the Marines. I served in all ranks from second lieutenant to major general. And during that period I spent most of my time being a high-class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. [...]
I suspected I was just part of a racket at the time. Now I am sure of it. Like all members of the military profession I never had an original thought until I left the service. My mental faculties remained in suspended animation while I obeyed the orders of the higher-ups. This is typical with everyone in the military service.
During those years, I had, as the boys in the back room would say, a swell racket. I was rewarded with honors, medals, and promotion. Looking back on it, I feel that I might have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate a racket in three city districts. The Marines operated on three continents." — Maj. Gen. Smedley Butler (former Commandant, U.S. Marine Corps)
________________________________________________________
The True Believer, whether active serviceperson or veteran, doesn't necessarily exhibit or express this abiding one-upmanship in everyday situations, or when encountering respectful and admiring civilians who tacitly acknowledge the True Believer's moral authority. But when confronted with critics, or merely those who don't buy into the myth of the Noble Warrior deserving of adulation, the True Believer reacts with towering rage and self-righteousness.
Snow Wolf snarls with the same strident superciliousness of Colonel Nathan R. Jessep in "A Few Good Men", another colorful work of fiction. Pass the popcorn!
Hittin' the nail firmly on the head...
you're an idiot, Sir
In retrospect, I did tee off more than I'd intended.
But MY button gets pushed at the veteran's conceit that the rest of us ought to be beholden to them-- "owe" them, really, which is what it boils down to.
So I figured I'd air out the other side of that story.
You really put me in my place, though. Have a nice day.
This is Winston Smith - fight Big Brother before it's too late, please
I agree with much of sentiments expressed in the last post...the U.S. military and their weapon merchant co-conspirators are not defending America's freedom, as their self-serving, after the fact, illegal, attrocity producing war justifications would have us believe.
During a future 'national emergency' the standing army would be a dire threat to our civil liberties, all while claiming to be preserving, defending, and upholding the Constitution
People should protest, boycott, and speak up about these companies.
These offensive weapons contractors build bombs and they don't just sell to one nation. Equal opportunity explosives. Bombs create more enemies than they kill, i.e. the families of the dead. Intelligence, diplomacy, creativity, and being nice to people is how a country should protect itself. Make friends. No one wants to fight the nice guy at school, but everyone wants desperately to gang up on the bully. If some government actually attempted to attack the U.S., they have plenty of weapons to 'defend' themselves, as well as turning the attacker into glass and dust. The world doesn't need new weapons, it needs new policies and better intelligence sharing. The 'terrorists' need to be brought to justice lawfully, not by being blown up by unmanned drone missiles along with all the members of the household and village they were hiding out in. If someone builds bombs for a living, how do they answer the question: What is your product designed to do? is the answer "to kill the enemy (people)"? or "Bring democracy and freedom to the world and protect my family from violent death from the invaders and/or terrorists?" The real answer is "blow up".
I really don't see the point of a protest like this, because it doesn't have a plan for change. Sure, it might make a couple people without power uncomfortable with their superiors. The main function of this type of protest is making the protester feel better about his or her positions and is ultimately a from of bragging from moral high ground.
It reminds me of a group of creationists who crashed a science fair I went to. No one there liked them, and even the people of similar faith felt sorry for them and apologized for their presence.
I'd actually argue this type of protest hurts the cause these protesters find so important, in terms of negative publicity.
Bothering private employees trying to do their jobs seems more like harassment than protest. This type of action does nothing about high-level decision making, except earn the contempt of people trying to make a living, who may someday be making decisions. If these students wanted impact, they should be protesting against the career services offices of their own college who invited the company grunts, not the company grunts.
That's my opinion, which I doubt will be popular.
Q. How do you eat an elephant?
A. One bite at a time.
The protesters may have had proposals. The article does not say much about any literature or signs. The college students who witnessed this may draw their own conclusions about what it means and what should be done. Such protests are important to disturb passivity, encourage questioning and to start a critical train of thought.
I believe you are correct that follow-through with the college is in order. This will not be easy. Colleges depend on funding from these guys for all kinds of research. (Which slants and weights the kind of science and psychology we have and often taints the results through selective reporting.) Students probably want jobs with these large prosperous companies. Colleges will argue for their freedom to advertise. If that is the case, then it can be turned around on them with a demand for space to advertise careers in peace or the concept of peace. College is a place where ideas and concepts thrive, right?
So the first bite out of this behemoth is to show more students the extent of defense contracting and the harm that defense contracting is doing to the world they are about to enter.
Joe
"I really don't see the point of a protest like this, because it doesn't have a plan for change."
And yet here we are, discussing the subject of arms manufacturing and its impact (no pun intended) because they protested. And how many more are reading the articles and news reports about the protest?
Ignoring the issue doesn't make it go away.
There is absolutely nothing PRIVATE (all hail! the sacred words of capitalism!)about military contracters who get no-bid contracts because they give huge amounts of blood money to both parties inthe govt. Of course, if I worked for one of htem (like Snow Wolf), I guess I woul dhave to rationzlize ti somehow. They "back the troops" not at all!!!
Blackwarter gives the troops a bad name. Halliburton wont let the troops fix their jeeps flat tire--they have to wait ( and get shot at) for privateer mercenaries to come and do it (if you get shot in the process--at least you died being able to CHOOSE betwen McDonalds and Burger kIng!!) That is what one young soldier actually said, on a tape from Iraq--"They have the right to go to McDonald's without getting blown up too. Yes, that's what we're fighting for. Freedom." How sadly naive and ironic is that?!
What a scam!! "Thansk you for your service" is SOO bogus, when the GOP just voted DOWN a 3.9% raise for the troops.
YOU GUYS can stop a bullet as well as a poor guy. GO DO IT!!
These armchair soldiers of fortune make me nauseated.
Yo, Judah, and a few other...ejits? on this list: Boston College is one of the oldest JESUIT universities in the United States. Hello? What is it about the concept of the Catholic Jesuit order that you don't understand? Obviously, the author of this article assumed that most intelligent people would realize the import of the demonstration -- and the success of the demonstration -- based upon the fact that Boston College is run by Jesuits.
I applaud these kids, for that is what they are, to recognize the truth in spite of the BS that is thrown at them on a daily basis. I would not want to see them, or anyone, end their lives fighting for a LIE. Which, in the end, killing is always a lie of some kind.
It does make the students feel a LOT better about themselves. It may also piss some of their mommys and daddys off. That is what this is really about.
Horse hockey!
They're asking for YOU on other threads as well.
Your contempt for these kids is sad. People like you are always bleating on like sheep about the military and defense contractors bravely standing watch out on a lonely frontier just so our kids can enjoy their freedom. But then you become incensed when they actually exercise some of those few remaining freedoms.
"Shut up and be happy!" isn't freedom and it certainly isn't patriotic.
"Shut up and be happy!" isn't freedom and it certainly isn't patriotic
Know who the problem is would be a good first step...and its not the Military
" "Shut up and be happy!" isn't freedom and it certainly isn't patriotic "
And yet you support the same Republican Party that pushes for it.
"Know who the problem is would be a good first step...and its not the Military"
You're right. It's not the military. It's the politicians who misuse the military for their own political fodder such as the Iraq war based on lies. The military is now getting stretched too thin, casualties are mounting at faster rates, and the requirements are being desperately lowered to the point of allowing skinheads to join. The military is in shambles thanks to your party. I can now see that all the so-called "defense" spending was spending to nowhere. And as some others have pointed out, all that wasteful spending can only come from cutting the budgets for maintaining public infrastructure and borrowing from other nations. No wonder the US is falling faster than Rome.
I think I share your opinion because this form of protest is too safe. None of these students have to risk getting their head's bashed by the police and getting arrested. What we need is real protest, loud enough that nobody can escape the clamor.
What we need in this country right now is a draft. Something to kick start the real outrage.
Btelfare
Our diligence prayers will confuse the opponents of evil intent. Remember we wrestle not against flesh and blood but powers of darkness in high places. Our lights of protest can flood the power of God to change the present situation.
Wow. What gives you the idea that God can change the situation when he/she/it has no history of changing any situations?
How disempowering. WE the PEOPLE are the ones who make change, not some abstract notion of a supreme being. One hand and mind engaged in real action will accomplish more than thousands clasped in prayer.
This viewpoint boggles my mind. I mean, what, so God's going to change the situation that he/she/it allowed to happen in the first place? Please, Almighty one, stop this war and suffering that you've allowed to transpire so we can credit you when good things happen but pretend you are not responsible for anything bad... Please, Great and Powerful Imaginary Friend, allow my paradoxical thinking make sense.
What kind of black and white duality do you live in?
Ramen
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" -Epicurus
Amen
Here...I have a thought
you want to be a Pacifist?...fine with me...but I want you to recognize that your position is delusional at best because SOMEBODY is on watch right now "Out There" protecting your happy clueless butt and giving you the opportunity to be a moron if you so choose
and that goes also for the people who supply them the tools of the trade...
so think on that a little bit before you try to shut down a recruiting office or rail at a McDonnell Douglas/Boeing recruiter...
Somebody is paying the tab for YOUR Bill (of Rights)
I know some of you here are Vets...and I Salute you for doing your bit...maybe you can talk a bit of sense into the more misguided...when they attack the Military they are misplacing their anger
I'm sorry, but when you say "protecting your happy clueless butt," are you referring to my ability to go munch on a Big Mac or purchase a flatscreen at Walmart? Because I am quite aware that our bourgeois consumer culture is being defended.
Or are you referring to protecting the widening gap between the rich and the poor? Or maybe the right of CEOs to spoil the air that we breathe and the food that we eat?
However, if you are referring to my general security, happiness and freedom, maybe these hired thugs you speak of should be laying siege to DC or Wallstreet. If they did that, I'd don yellow ribbon lapel pin in no time.
I appreciate that soldiers THINK they are protecting my freedom, and I am grateful that they THINK they are doing something noble, but, unfortunately what they (and you) have been brainwashed into believing isn't reality.
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" -Epicurus
The activities of the American military have absolutely nothing to do with defending our right of free speach or the safety of our families. To suggest otherwise is ludicrous. The American military builds empire. It meddles in other countries and provokes retaliation against us. It endangers us and creates an atmosphere of fear here at home that results in the government taking away our freedoms.
I am not a pacifist. I believe in defending my country.
its Speech not Speach
and America is not a Colonial nor an Imperialist Country...
The Military protects the Interests of America and makes the high standard of living that you enjoy possible...
We have to spend more than the rest of the World because they are not reliable...period
"The Military protects the Interests of America and makes the high standard of living that you enjoy possible..."
That's about the first truthful thing you have said here on CD. However, that does not make it ethical. From Smedley Butler's 1935 book "War is a Racket":
"I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street. I helped purify Nicaragua for the International Banking House of Brown Brothers in 1902-1912. I brought light to the Dominican Republic for the American sugar interests in 1916. I helped make Honduras right for the American fruit companies in 1903. In China in 1927 I helped see to it that Standard Oil went on its way unmolested. Looking back on it, I might have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents."
What was true then, is most certainly true today.
I'm expecting the troops to charge in at any moment now to shut down the Federal Reserve Bank. Pray that it's SOON!
The military protects the interests of wealthy war profiteers, as I mentioned previously. "High standard of living?" Is that why there are more and more tent cities springing up in the U.S.? And have you ever traveled to other countries, for god's sake?! (be truthful, now) Oh I forgot, you're a Republican; truth is not in your vocabulary, and you think the U.S. is so great that there's no need to travel to other countries.
Maybe the U.S. shouldn't make enemies -- then it wouldn't have to spend "more than the rest of the world" on its military and weapons. Actually, it's all just to dominate the world and enrich the war profiteers, let's be honest Wolfie.
Why don't you go to a right-wing site. I'm not going to waste any more time on replies to you or even read your posts. You're just a waste, period.
"and America is not a Colonial nor an Imperialist Country.."
Wrong. I see you're in denial mode but given what you are, no point in getting a pee brain such as yourself to understand reality.
"The Military protects the Interests of America and makes the high standard of living that you enjoy possible..."
Too bad that isn't the case when pols such as your party ABUSE it for political fodder. The costs of living have only gone up and the military has been wrecked thanks to this Iraq war based on LIES which even the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld folks admitted was false. Even General Betrayus recently admitted that the surge in Iraq was really not a success.
"We have to spend more than the rest of the World because they are not reliable...period"
That doesn't make any sense. There's no point in worrying about other countries when your own country is in shambles. Critical non-military budgets in this country have been cut for the most part and now the only reason this wasteful "defense" spending is going on is borrowing from other nations. That cannot last forever. Besides, if those nations can't be reliable, let them crumble. There are already enough problems to take care of both within and on the borders. Excessive military spending and misusing it to control the costs of living was what caused Rome's downfall and is happening to this country. The next time you want to talk about military spending, show some honesty on where the money is really coming from, sir.
Where in the Bill of Rights, does it say that the "president" and Congress have a right to go against the will of hte people and invade another country that has never, ever attacked the uS?
They're asking for you over on the "Wall Street Socialist" thread.
As far as this topic is concerned, I feel your logic is flawed and terribly out of date. The "Out there on watch" dogma disappeared with the USSR. To keep clinging to such outmoded ideas is to bring catastrophe since you're not seeing the new, REAL dangers that face us. Dangers, I might add, of our own construction.
For now, defense contractors have it pretty sweet. They're still rattling the old sabres and getting people like you to feel fear. But as far as "Bill (of Rights)" is concerned, we have fewer rights now than we did 8 years ago. My grandchildren will be paying the rest of the bills your heroes Cheney, Bush and the rest of the criminal gang racked up.
I applaud these students. Now I ask the question, what would have happened had they not been wearing "Jesus" t-shirts, but were wearing instead t-shirts with the names of war dead and "Bush Lied - They Died" caption? No, they would not have been awarded a door prize of a non-metallic M-16 or DARPA's latest giga-watt particle cannon (though they may have been target practice).
Frankly, after having read a number of comments, I have to hazard a guess that "snow wolf" is a troll. It offers little (I'm being kind, I meant nothing) to the dialogue and always puts commenters down as being, well, a sissy.
The bottom line is that our blue mother, the earth which gave us birth. is being destroyed -- no, desecrated in ways that even the word "rape" doesn't encompass.
Eric Blair sits at my shoulder and reminds me that when "defense" means "offense", "preemptive" and "ultimate war", we have gone light years beyond 1984
____________
There's a glory in the morning because the earth turns 'round and a promise in the evening when the sun goes down
Gotta agree with you there Chuck Cliff. Also watch out for petertheok, seems to have a similar agenda. Lots of name calling and won't/ can't address questions that don't drive that agenda. Just ignore and they'll go somewhere else.
No baby..I'm one the one's here with the Truth
Why do I get the sense that SnowWolf will have morphed into petetheok by the end of this thread??
You mean a bald faced liar like Rush Limbaugh. Besides, it's not as if you have anything meaningful to discuss. You're only wasting your time here. Go to a rightwing site.
I can see why turd blossoms like SnowWolf would call these miscreants "Defense" contractors, but does CD have to, also? "COLLEGE STUDENTS PROTEST DEFENSE CONTRACTORS AT FAIR".
I suggest "Bloody Agressive Fascist Imperialist War Contractors", or something like that.
[aggressive has two R's]
As an employee of a defense contractor, Snow Wolf OWNS oil interests, herb.
The military industrial media complex has a vested interest in assuring that the US occupation of other nations for the purpose of controlling resources, including petroleum, proceeds unabated to assure that their companies remain on US government corporate welfare.
Yeah...I bathe in the Shit
Well, we do perceive that you ARE full of it....
Peggy
Thank god peak oil will put the war machine out of business.
Oh...and the reason that after 8 years of War the Anti-War movement hasn't taken off is unlike Vietnam most people (with a brain) understand WHY we are at War...they may question WHERE we are fighting but not Why
heh i do know where and what they are fight for and whom, .. it ain't you and me buddy ..unless you own oils interests..
a small criminal group attacked the us.. not a country..go ahead and drink more of that kool-aid...
"only 2 things are infinite" opined Mark Twain.. "human stupidity and the universe,..only i'm not as sure about the latter"
Nothing gets me "Safety Wired to the Pissed off Position" Quicker than Children of Privilege (your precious College Students) who owe all the good things in life that they enjoy to the Men who sacrificed to make and keep them free, whining about them when they live under the umbrella of safety provided by precisely those men...
Take a look at what Russia is doing to Georgia...and they wanted to do it here
Without a Military this Country would be lost in short order...
"Without a Military this Country would be lost in short order..." What BS. The role of the military in this day and age is to guard the interests, in foreign lands, of wealthy war profiteers.
As for Russia and Georgia, the Georgians attacked Ossentia --- unprovoked --- and killed Russian peace keepers and Russian citizens, with U.S. and Israeli backing by sending the Georgians weapons. No wonder you side with Georgia......LOL......weapons = $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
(This is off the topic, but could you please change your name from "wolf" to "weasel?" That would be more fitting. Members of the Native North American Wolf clan are offended that you're using their name.)
snow wolf = Troll
What Russia is doing to Georgia? Dis-Arm a War Driven Government bent on the destruction of thier own break-away region? Have you read anything about the start of the Russo-Georgian conflict? Georgia bombarded South Ossetia killing upwards of 2000 civilians. Civilians who also have a citizenship in Russia.
"The only means of strengthening one's intellect is to make up one's mind about nothing, to let the mind be a thoroughfare for all thoughts."
-- John Keats
SnowWolf,
Can you tell us the second time that the U.S. was attacked by a foreign power? Sorry, none.
I think you're posting nonsense either to see other posters' reaction, or else, you really should go post on Fox News where you may be appreciated by like-minded people.
As an Employee of a Defense Contractor let me just say:
Who would want to hire a bunch of smelly Hippies anyway?
Go back to tree sitting in Berkley and pretending Man Causes Global Warming...maybe they can make a career of that
Oh...and the reason that after 8 years of War the Anti-War movement hasn't taken off is unlike Vietnam most people (with a brain) understand WHY we are at War...they may question WHERE we are fighting in some cases but not Why
So tell me, do employees of defense contractors not have access to history books? I assume you know how to read (selectively) since you are posting on this site.
Or maybe you've somehow developed the skill to shut down entire parts of your brain in order to ignore the information that would break your machismo worldview open like the fragile porcelain facade it is.
I feel sorry for you. Your inability to grasp or comprehend the simplest of facts must be a huge burden.
Maybe you could to go back to college and take a few courses. Environmental Science, Sociology, Psychology, American History, and Government come to mind. If your murderous employer doesn't pay you enough to afford the tuition, there's always these new-fangled things called libraries you could visit as well.
But I suppose your steady diet of Faux News and government propaganda probably leaves little room for anything else in that thick skull of yours.
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" -Epicurus
snow wolf::Not sure why you're here on this site , but I can tell you that with most people it's not that they support what's been going on. If you think they do support this madness, you're more delusional than I already think you are. It's that most people don't have a freakin' clue what's been going on. Please don't interpret that as widespread support for it. We here at this site already pay attention. It seems you just want to argue. You'd have better luck trying to convert someone on a street corner.
Snowwolf,
I'm a tad slow. Could you please indulge me, and repeat WHY we are at war. That must have slipped by me.
SnowWolf wrote: "Oh...and the reason that after 8 years of War the Anti-War movement hasn't taken off is unlike Vietnam most people (with a brain) understand WHY we are at War...they may question WHERE we are fighting in some cases but not Why"
Maybe they should considering the fact that King George lead this country into war based on a pretense of Bold Face Lies and Fabricated Evidence.
"It's astounding, time is fleeting
Madness takes its toll
But listen closely, not for very much longer
I've got to keep control
I remember doing the Time Warp
Drinking those moments when
The blackness would hit me and the void would be calling
Let's do the time warp again...
Let's do the time warp again!
It's just a jump to the left
And then a step to the right
With your hands on your hips
You bring your knees in tight
But it's the pelvic thrust that really drives you insane,
Let's do the Time Warp again!"
From "The Rocky Horror Picture Show"
"...a bunch of smelly hippies..."
SnowWolf isn't just a troll, he's a time traveler.
I have a brain (probably much larger than yours) and I know why. We are fighting a war so that rich corporations can steal all our tax money, and oil companies can reap huge profits.
Only small-minded, brainwashed idiots like you would think that we are fighting for freedom or some b.s. like that.
Now, it's okay for you to have the opinion that murdering thousands of children is an okay thing to do to make pompous, rich assholes even richer, but personally I think you lack moral character, and are just another employee of evil, spreading misinformation and preying on peoples' base patriotism to justify your own desire to be a rich fraud, too.
You elitist, privileged "defense contractor employee of the month" prick. I lost over a dozen close friends either in Vietnam, or as a result of PTSD. And for whom did they die? No, they didn't die so that we wouldn't be fighting "them" over here. They died for elitist, privileged pricks like you.
You and your ilk are the only people who benefit from war, and that's WHY we are at war. It doesn't take a brain (and a reserved parking space) to figure that out. Time for you to leave. I think I can hear your mommy calling you for dinner.
Sorry about your losses.
Ignore SnowWolf. He is not a wolf. He is a mosquito. Someone should fix the screen
Joe
Thanks for the condolences. Two Purple Hearts and nearly 40 years later I'm still working on my anger. The VA doesn't help, and my "benefits" amount to $20.19 per month. But know-nothing punks like snowolf (unless he/she is a LOT bigger than me) are easy to crush.
Snow Wolf, why is it that you chose to use insulting language instead of addressing the actual concerns of the students described in the article? I have observed countless times that the folks who support the war machine tend to resort to insult rather than discuss the substance of issues raised.
This indicates not only a lack of maturity, but a lack of vision.
So is posting here part of your job description, or are you doing it on your own time? In other words, are you a mercenary or a true believer? In any respects, I would hope your employers at least pay you well or offer stock options, because if you are doing this gratis, then you are one of the ripped off in more ways than one.
As for the WHY, why do your employers continue to put out obfuscation as the actual root causes of Islamic fundamentalism? Could it be that they are knee deep in the causes (such as doing business with the corrupt regimes that mid-wife al-Queda directly and indirectly) and do not wish to call attention to that inconvenient truth?
Also, if you are going to indulge in character assassination, at least get your tired cliches right. The protesters at Boston College were East Coast (Berkeley is on the West Coast) & were religiously inspired (They actually take the peace talk attributed to Jesus seriously, unlike the power mad evangelical charlatans who dominate the scene).
As for your casual be-bunking of Global Warming, haven't you got the memo from Dubya, Cheney, & Co.? They too are no longer going along with oil buddies on this one anymore (at least in public). Where is your message discipline?!
Cameiros
God bless those young students...
History buffs will note that the anti-Vietnam War movement began in as modest a manner as well. Whether or not the follow-thru will be taken up this current generation of students remains to be seen.
One reason it took off faster--was the draft. SnowWolf--are you a military veteran as well? Because otherwise, youre just peddling death that youre afraid to face yourself.
The one lesson from history that the American right wing learned from the Vietnam nightmare was not to fight a colonial war with a conscript army. Colonial wars are better fought with professional armies.