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03.12.10 - 5:20 PM
To Wipe the Spit Off His Face, Biden Had to Say It Was Only Rain
From Haaretz, a look at the PR debacle - and illuminating moment - that was Biden's visit to Israel. The dance was delicate: Netanyahu apologized, not for another illegal incursion into East Jerusalem but for announcing it while Biden was there; Biden obligingly said thank goodness said incursion won't happen for a few years, and went on his way; within hours, Netanyanhu closed the West Bank, fearing protests. Most likely, the U.S. will continue to turn a blind eye to Israeli excesses. Still, some argue that the incident exposed in a newly raw way the need for Israel to deal with its "settler-occupation demon" before it's too late.
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61 Comments so far
Show AllBiden, the ultimate Israel whore!
To talk about reigning in Israeli excesses while US media is domiated by people whose allegiance is to Israel to the detriment of US political health is to put the carriage before the horse.
What COULD Biden do? What CAN Obama do? One more peep about Israeli excesses and Obama can kiss his second term good-bye. Obama's admin. will ignore the issue until the end of his first term. If reelected, he MAY throw a bone here and there at the Palestinians. At best.
No politician seeking reelection or a lofty place in the history books is going to criticize Israel in any substantive manner. I'm sure Biden got an earful from his people for taking such chances as to criticize, however timidly, Israeli policies.
Until Americans realize that through the media Israel has our elected officials and hopefuls by the marbles, and unleash a backlash, we can all forget about foreign policy that has any root in logic.
STOP MEDIA CONTROL!!!
Israel no longer tries to hide the fact that it intends to make the Occupied Territories its own and that it will use any means available to accomplish this. Unfortunately, no one has answers to all and everything, and with such an attitude of intransigence, Israel is bound to lose what it wishes most. It's the way of the world, or nature, if you will. At this point in time, wisdom is not Israel's strong point.
At the time of the Balfour Declaration the founder of modern Zionism, Theodore Herzl, was asked whether he was satisfied with "half a loaf" because the Declaration did not give all of Palestine unconditionally to the Jews. Herzl is reported to have answered "yes and we will take the other half later".
Abby Zimet reports, "Still, some argue that the incident exposed in a newly raw way the need for Israel to deal with its 'settler-occupation demon' before it's too late."
Alas, the returns are in on this one. Israel is, repeat, is, its named "demon"; while the proper name for the "demon" is Zionism.
It is already "too late" for any justice under the aegis of Zionism.
Time for the US to stop flying the Stars&Stripes, because apparently it's over.
I am not a Jew, I am an Anthropologist. Accurate history is very important to me as I must teach my students factual information as their abilities and careers depend reading the past accurately.
I have no horse in this race. Anthropologists don't take sides. We refuse to spy for any government for which the US hates us.
I do have a few questions to ask if any wish to read or research.
Who lived in East Jerusalem in 1947? Jews! Who took their land from them? Jordan in 1948. What happened to all the Jews that lived there? They were expelled. What happened to their most sacred cemetery? A highway was built on top on it using headstones as building material and the construction of latrines.
This was the worst result of the attack of the five armies when the U.N. declared Israel a nation. At least in Israeli thought.
Perhaps this a prime motive for Israeli action in East Jerusalem. I am guessing as any accurate information is very difficult to obtain from anyone in the region.
Just declaring yourself an anthropologist doesn't make it so. Please provide some credentials ( you know, like where did you obtain your degree, where do you now teach etc) and also some credible references for your claims.
I'm a little teapot....and I apparently know more history than you.
There was no "East Jerusalem" prior to 1948
Prior to 1948, the population of Jerusalem was 1/2 Arab and 2/3 Jewish.
1n 1884, it was about 50/50
http://focusonjerusalem.com/jerusalempopchart.html
The 1,500 residents of the Jewish Quarter of the Old City were expelled and a few hundred taken prisoner when the Arab Legion captured the quarter on 28 May, 1948
"Prior to 1948, the population of Jerusalem was 1/2 (50%) Arab and 2/3 (%66) Jewish."
Hrmmmm, that adds up to 116%.
You say, "Anthropologists don't take sides. We refuse to spy for any government for which the U.S. hates us." But surely you must know that this is not true, since the U.S. has a long history of hiring anthropologists to help in war efforts. Here are two examples:
"How US Anthropoligists Planned "Race-Specific" Weapons Against the Japanese."
http://www.counterpunch.org/price11252005.html
"Anthropologists help U.S. Army in Afghanistan and Iraq."
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/04/world
/asia/04iht-afghan.4.7755039.html
It is not hard to find information about East Jerusalem in 1947. For example, see
http://www.palestinemonitor.org/spip/spip.php?article5
"In the 1947 UN Partition Plan Jerusalem was declared a ‘corpus separatum’ to be placed under a special international regime administered by the UN. The UN Partition Plan was not accepted by Palestinians, nor the larger Arab world, resulting in the 1948 war in which Israel captured up to 85% of the city, primarily in the west, while the Jordanian army held onto 11% primarily in the east. The remaining 4% was considered ‘no man’s land’.
"64,000-80,000 Palestinians were forcibly expelled from their homes in West Jerusalem and 40 of the surrounding villages, which were destroyed by Israeli forces to preclude the return of their inhabitants. The property, homes and possessions of Palestinians who fled were considered ‘left’ by the previous inhabitants under Israel’s 1950 Absentee Property Law and transferred to the Israeli state.
"The remaining 15% of Jerusalem, including the ‘Old City’, remained in the hands of Palestinians until it too was captured by Israel in the war of 1967. After having ‘unified’ the city, Israel began to implement a complex series of policies and regulations meant to control or expel the remaining Palestinian population, so as to build a strong Jewish majority in the city.
"In 1980, the Israeli government officially annexed East Jerusalem by amending the “Basic Law” to extend Israeli jurisdiction to the occupied area of the city. This act unofficially, but quite effectively, severed the remainder of the city from Palestinians living in either the West Bank or Gaza Strip. Travel to and from East Jerusalem today requires special permits from the Israeli authority which are often difficult or impossible to get for the majority of Palestinians.
"The annexation of Jerusalem by Israel has had two important consequences for Palestinians revolving around culture and economics. Culturally and historically Jerusalem was the original capital of Islam, where the Prophet Mohammed not only began his ministry, but from where he also ascended to heaven. After the center of Islam moved to the Arabian Peninsula, Jerusalem, or ‘Al Quds’ as it is known in Arabic, remained its third most holy site.
"Economically, the severing of Jerusalem from Palestine can be likened to the removal of the hub of a bicycle wheel. The cities of Hebron, Bethlehem, Ramallah and Nablus to name only a few, developed as suburbs over time like the spokes of a wheel - all connected to and dependant upon Jerusalem as the center of trade and commerce. The removal of the hub has left each of the spokes disconnected and economically impotent - greatly hampering the economic development of the occupied Palestinian territories...."
It's easy to find information on the internet, using the google search engine at the top of your screen, so I am not going to look up anything else for you. If you're really teaching anthropology, you know how to do research, anyway, and if you're just a troll, I don't want to feed you. You will notice that Israel ethnically cleansed the Palestinians in and surrounding Jerusalem in 1948, just as Israel has continued its policy of ethnic cleansing until the present day.
What we are discussing right now is Israel's ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians in East Jerusalem. The article that is referred to, from Haaretz, points out that the U.S. supports Israel's ethnic cleansing of East Jerusalem:
"U.S. gave Israel green light for East Jerusalem construction."
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1155895.html
You are to be commended, petrkrop, for your streak of leaning into the ambiguous little flutterballs that get tossed in on Israel-related comments threads and knocking them out of the park.
Lately, you and Progressive101 have been like Ruth and Gehrig. I could watch you work all day. ;)
Thank you, Obedient Servant!
Outstanding rebuttal petrkrop!
Many thanks, ThomasJefferson!
May I add that the UN Commission which studied the so-called "Partition of the Mandate" declared King Farouk of Egypt the spokesperson for the Palestinians!
"Anthropologists don't take sides."
I think native peoples worldwide would have a problem with that assertion.
If I remember correctly the orthodox Jews that lived in the Mandate of Palestine were opposed to the formation of the State of Israel. Anthropology is not merely a summation of who lived where but what these people wanted and did.
And how many jews were in the Palestine before 1900? A few hundred?
Are these East Jerusalem jews the same ones that blew up the King David Hotel? Killing 33 Brits 33 Palestinians and 33 Jews?
Are these the same jews that killed Brits because the Brits realized that jews and Palestinians could not coexist andd the Brits tried to halt the zionist influx and the zionist state creation?
It's true that a lot of bad things have happened to the poor Jews. But there are two stories in every abusive relationship. The question might be asked why they have historically attracted such universal animosity. Not the hysterical question "Why? Why?" (accompanied by waving the hands in circles) entertained by the people in question, but the serious question "Why?" that admits of an answer. I'm unaware of a sober piece of Jewish scholarship that attempts to understand what it is about Jewish culture that generates this "virulent antisemitism." To return to the simile, it's never nice to beat up your wife, but it's also not inappropriate to ask what she did to put you into such a rage. They are like that weird kid in eighth grade who could never figure out why he rubbed everybody the wrong way, why he was the perfect scapegoat, why people beat him up every chance they got, and why nobody had any sympathy for him at all.
Oh, i love macho bullies! Especially on a 'progressive' site.
As an ardent anti zionist and supporter of a ONE state solution. As a protestor for the past twenty years standing against the state of israel, i think certain posters here are more into their own hatred and less into truly caring about human beings.
They also sound like american jingoists who are pissed off because the u.s. looks like it has a smaller 'one' than israel. Amazing.
The male principle out of balance. Send in the marines......And the REALLY big guns. Yeah Baby.......
Peace.
rita
This is baloney, voxclamantis!! This is so offensive that if I were the owner/administrator of this blog, I'd give you a "3-strikes-and-you're-out" policy, and if you still didn't clean up your bigoted act, out you'd go.....for good!
Don't tell me... you're a middle school principle, right?
I think you folks are reading swastikas between the lines that aren't there. More important than my supposed bigotry is why even independently minded people never ask the perfectly legitimate question I raised, and why it will likely never get an airing. That Jewish people have suffered from an abrasive relationship with other ethnicities is pretty much a historical fact, and given the consequences of it you'd think it would pique their curiosity. The bugaboo of antisemitism is so effective that even a whisper of criticism gets you in hot water. No need to apologize. Hot water is my natural element.
In my small town a fellow came to live a few years back who was indeed a macho bully (to use rita's strange assessment of my post as an example.) He bullied all the guys and hit on all the woman, and before long he didn't have any friends left and had to move away. He briefly considered getting counseling, since it was hard for him to maintain that he was the only normal person surrounded on all sides by idiots who didn't understand him. That finger of blame pointed everywhere except at himself. He was fine. It was everybody else who needed therapy. Wherever he is today he's probably still telling himself that story.
Congratulations Vox,
You have bravely stepped into the Lion's den with your daring to bring up the taboo subject of "why do countries expel Jews".
I will answer you. The answer is the same is why are Christians "persecuted". The answer is the illogic of religion.
Judaism and Christianity are innocent practices of faith at the membership level, but if you delve into where all that offering plate money goes you will find that little of it is non-violent. The high priests in both those mind-control temples pro-port to speak for God, and since their is no God, make up life or death decisions as they go along.
Religion is really just organized crime wrapped up in a fairy tale.
And the two most powerful religions are so powerful they interlocked centuries ago, so that the verse of chants in the tomb of "Skull and Bones" is all about placing the flag on top of Babylon and freeing Jerusalem.
I mean the first rule of Mafia behavior is to either wipe out the other mobs or merge them into one.
And this Christian/Judaism mob is so powerful now, it virtually dictates policy to the Congress (supplanting Democracy).
Controversies
Former Senator William Fulbright, in the 1970s, and former senior CIA official Victor Marchetti, in the 1980s, contended that AIPAC should have registered under the Foreign Agents Registration Act (FARA).[25] FARA requires those who receive funds or act on behalf of a foreign government to register as a foreign agent. AIPAC is a registered American lobbying group funded by private donations, and maintains it receives "no financial assistance" from Israel or any other foreign group.[26]
In 2006, Representative Betty McCollum of Minnesota demanded an apology from AIPAC, claiming an AIPAC representative had described her vote against the Palestinian Anti-Terrorism Act of 2006 as "support for terrorists." McCollum stated that AIPAC representatives would not be allowed in her office until she received a written apology for the comment.[27] AIPAC disputed McCollum's claim, and McCollum has since declared the incident over.[28]
[edit]Steiner resignation
In 1992, AIPAC president David Steiner was forced to resign after he was recorded boasting about his political influence in obtaining aid for Israel. Steiner also claimed that he had
met with (then Bush U.S. Secretary of State) Jim Baker and I cut a deal with him. I got, besides the $3 billion, you know they're looking for the Jewish votes, and I'll tell him whatever he wants to hear ... Besides the $10 billion in loan guarantees which was a fabulous thing, $3 billion in foreign, in military aid, and I got almost a billion dollars in other goodies that people don't even know about.[29]
Steiner also claimed to be "negotiating" with the incoming Clinton administration over who Clinton would appoint as Secretary of State and Secretary of the National Security Agency. Steiner stated that AIPAC had "a dozen people in [the Clinton] campaign, in the headquarters... in Little Rock, and they're all going to get big jobs."[29]
NY real estate developer Haim Katz told The Washington Times that he taped the conversation because "as someone Jewish, I am concerned when a small group has a disproportionate power. I think that hurts everyone, including Jews. If David Steiner wants to talk about the incredible, disproportionate clout AIPAC has, the public should know about it."[30]
[edit]Espionage allegations
Main article: Lawrence Franklin espionage scandal
In April 2005, AIPAC policy director Steven Rosen and AIPAC senior Iran analyst Keith Weissman were fired by AIPAC amid an FBI investigation into whether they passed classified U.S. information received from Franklin on to the government of Israel. They were later indicted for illegally conspiring to gather and disclose classified national security information to Israel,[31][32]. AIPAC agreed to pay the legal fees for Weissman's defense through appeal if necessary,[33] but charges were subsequently dropped.[34]
In May 2005, the Justice Department announced that Lawrence Anthony Franklin, a U.S. Air Force Reserves colonel working as a Department of Defense analyst at the Pentagon in the office of Douglas Feith, had been arrested and charged by the FBI with providing classified national defense information to Israel. The six-count criminal complaint identified AIPAC by name and described a luncheon meeting in which, allegedly, Franklin disclosed top-secret information to two AIPAC officials.[35][36]
Franklin pleaded guilty to passing government secrets to Rosen and Weissman and revealed for the first time that he also gave classified information directly to an Israeli government official in Washington. On January 20, 2006, he was sentenced to 151 months (almost 13 years) in prison and fined $10,000. As part of the plea agreement, Franklin agreed to cooperate in the larger federal investigation.[37][38]
[edit]Supporters
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIPAC
You want the truth?
YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH BABY!, (because the whole society is now enslaved to the church!)
TJ
More of the Christian/Judaism Mafia:
AIPAC has a wide base of supporters both in and outside of Congress. Support among congressional members includes a majority of members of both the Democratic and Republican Parties. According to American Prospect magazine, "AIPAC's 2002 annual conference included 50 senators, 190 representatives, and more than a dozen senior administration officials."[35]
Many political leaders have addressed AIPAC conferences, including Presidents George W. Bush, Barack Obama and Bill Clinton, Vice Presidents Dick Cheney and Joe Biden, House Minority Whip Eric Cantor and Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton. Other speakers have included prominent Senators such as John Kerry, Joe Lieberman, John McCain, as well as and current and former members of the leadership of both parties in Congress, and current and former Prime Ministers of Israel.
Historian and current Israeli ambassador to America, Michael Oren argued in his 2007 bestseller, "Power, Faith, and Fantasy", that strong American support for Israel derives from Puritan-Republican roots of the United States itself.
Sen. John McCain said in his speech to the 2008 AIPAC Policy Conference "[T]here are ties between America and Israel that critics of our alliance have never understood, /../ that's because they do not fully understand the love of liberty and the pursuit of justice."[4]
Rep. Robert Wexler (D-FL) has argued that America supports Israel because they share fundamental values as "freedom-loving people" who "deserve to have a free and secure state.'"[39] Nancy Pelosi similarly stated that "America and Israel share an unbreakable bond: in peace and war; and in prosperity and in hardship."[40]
[edit]Criticism
Protesters at AIPAC conference in Washington, DC, May 2005
AIPAC has been criticized as being misrepresentative of American Jews who support Israel and that AIPAC is solely in favor of right-wing Israeli policy and viewpoints. [41] [42].
Among the best-known critical works about AIPAC is The Israel Lobby and U.S. Foreign Policy, by University of Chicago professor John Mearsheimer and Harvard University Kennedy School of Government professor Stephen Walt. In the working paper and resulting book they accuse AIPAC of being "the most powerful and best known" component of a larger pro-Israel lobby that distorts American foreign policy. They write:[4]
"AIPAC's success is due to its ability to reward legislators and congressional candidates who support its agenda, and to punish those who challenge it. ... AIPAC makes sure that its friends get strong financial support from the myriad pro-Israel PACs. Those seen as hostile to Israel, on the other hand, can be sure that AIPAC will direct campaign contributions to their political opponents. ... The bottom line is that AIPAC, which is a de facto agent for a foreign government, has a stranglehold on the U.S. Congress. Open debate about U.S. policy towards Israel does not occur there, even though that policy has important consequences for the entire world."
AIPAC has also been the subject of criticism by prominent politicians including Representative Dave Obey of Wisconsin,[43] former Senator Mike Gravel,[44] and former Representative Cynthia McKinney.[45] UNQUOTE.
What's the answer?
Make sure all of your neighbors know about AIPAC and it's unholy grip on the congress.
TJ
"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent." - Thomas Jefferson
You did a great job with the Declaration of Independence and I am pleased to have prompted such a feast of information re: the abominable AIPAC. I wish I had your aptitude for documentation. I just look at the news year after year and am left with a general viewpoint that I can't always defend. I tend to agree with your friend kogwonton that religion is taking a bad rap these days (though "organized crime wrapped up in a fairy tale" is as eloquent a statement of the freedom from religion viewpoint as I have heard. If some of us are inclined to search out our metaphysical underpinnings, who could have a problem with that? It's the mixing of religion, guns and money that produces the evil brew. Human institutions are culpable enough, but the human nature from which they originate is also sort of questionable, having resulted in many piles of human skulls without any assistance from Jesus.. Best regards. Vox
pro-port should be 'purport' .
While I agree with you that organized religions have always been used politically, and that the leadership of such organizations invariably ally themselves with political and economic power brokers, I would have to add that spiritual faith is not, by itself, the single greatest cause of human misery. I would ask you what could make a spiritual leader sell-out to political and economic power? Why, the same thing that would make anyone do so. Greed.
If you want to contend against religious institutions I'm with you, but when it comes to spiritual faith I think you would do better to beat your head against a brick wall. 80% of the U.S. claims some form of spiritual belief, and I'm sure that percentages only rise as you look outside the U.S. You'll never get people to renounce spiritual faith by calling them idiots in the control of evil. And if you believe in democracy, then you should really take a logical look at how you deal with people of a spiritual perspective, simply because they outnumber those without, and they vote. And I'm sure you would never advocate removing their right to vote.
If you would rather use reason to make your case for social justice (and many would argue that social justice is the heart of spirituality, regardless of your particular brand of religion) by understanding your ideological opponents, and begin by addressing the heart of matters which you can both agree upon. It isn't enough to expect them to 'see reason'. You have to show good faith by trying to see what it is that convinces them to keep a spiritual perspective. It might even help to read, and sincerely try to understand, the texts they look to for guidance.
As for 'evil', The book of Ezekiel, chapter 28, deals specifically with the origins of the Christian Devil. Every Christian sect uses this book to form their doctrines of the great adversary. It is also contained within the Hebrew Torah. It speaks of the causes of the violence within the heart of this high ranking spiritual being, whose responsibilities were that of priest. Specifically, it was COMMERCE which caused this. It was commerce and wealth which led to pride, which led to rebellion against Truth, and the Logos.
And I say this truly as someone with no belief in any God promoted by any religious organization on this planet. There is too much division, and it doesn't matter if we're played by cold warriors, racists, partisans, or religious separatists. We're still being divided and manipulated.
kogwonton,
Stellar, invigorating posts on you part; as usual.
Thanks for the 'purport' correction. I see many other mistakes in my post now; but once someone replies to a post in Wordpress, apparently the "edit" button disappears. Bad for me since it reveals my Reagan-era education!
I agree with you.
I'm actually not trying to get people to renounce their spiritual beliefs, because, as you inferred, that's never happened in the thousands of civilizations in recorded history. All civilizations have embraced some kind of religion, even WWII Germany, although that is not known by most religious Americans.
What I am trying to do, is to get them to quit dropping money into offering plates without an accounting, or without at least an audit, a tax, so that the odds of that money finding it's way into arms dealers hands will diminish. "Faith-Based-Initiatives" is code for: Machine gun sales to "Freedom Fighters" (which is code for murdering mercenaries hired by CIA.) What I am trying to do is to get them to question religious authority in the hope that we will spark a new Enlightenment; a period where citizens substitute religious superstition in leu of education and science, as happened in the 1700's, which is what gave birth to America and it's unique secular government.
Innocent citizens are caught right now in the MSM Matrix. An artificial world of consumer shopping (COMMERCE) as you so accurately pointed out, where the wool has been pulled over their eyes to blind them from the truth: That they are part of a global slave empire (which is increasingly sucking them into the role of slave, e.g., the demise of the middle class in America.)
I just want to free their minds.
Perhaps you can help me do that at www.planetliberty.wikidot.com. It's a free site that preserves our comments longer than three days since they stay on the wiki outline like index cards instead of these comment boxes which are like a roll of paper. It's pure Democracy since anyone can edit anything.
Would you allow me to quote you on it?
Thanks kog,
TJ
I just think that we're all being victimized by divisive tactics, and intelligence or awareness is simply a matter of degree. Tactics of fear used against one person may not work against another. I think that most people who actually choose religion (rather than being born into it) do so because they want to try to be better people. It is good that they acknowledge that they're subject to temptation just like those in power. It is possible to find common ground, but only if you can learn what is important to them, and why. That is peacemaking.
Thanks for the kind words. I'll have to take a peek at the site you mentioned. I don't mind if you quote me.
And then ignoring or because of Franklins damning testimony against the two Aipac agents, the USA dismissed charges and let them flew off to israel.
Are you really going to try to claim that East Jerusalem was strictly Jewish in 1947?
I really doubt your credentials or your objectivity.
Biden isn't a wipespittle; he's a lickspittle.
Lets us be honest. Israel owns Congress, and has owned Congress for a long time. So, Israel knows they can get away with doing whatever they want, and the United States will turn a blind eye.
hey Joe..you have a little shmutz on yer face.....hmmmm I dont think that is spit....yeeck!
I can sure understand why the Romans kicked the Jews out.
Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton on Friday delivered a stinging rebuke to Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu - who snickered, yawned and dialed the Mossad...
> I can sure understand why the Romans kicked the Jews out.
So, what is this if not plain anti-semitism? But thanks for acknowledging the long history of Jewish presence in the land of Israel (which, judging from your previous comments, I suppose you'll be quick to deny once I have pointed this out).
Yes, there were Jews living in Israel when the Romans arrived but if you had been honest you would have added that the so-called "Diaspora" is a false construct because nearly all Jews left voluntarily.
What in the world are you talking about? Pontius Pilate vs. Jesus?
Joe
It never ceases to amaze me.....
It is alive and well. With or without an israel.
Great response, Joe.
The notion that the Romans "kicked the Jews out" is a fabrication used by Zionists to justify the return because "we were kicked out". Every person living in that part of the Roman Empire was a Roman citizen free to leave and return. The overwhelming majority of Jews left "Palestine" voluntarily to settle elsewhere in the Roman Empire.
Why? Because making a living was much easier and rewarding "elsewhere" than in the mostly desert-covered backwater of Palestine.
"Every person living in that part of the Roman Empire was a Roman citizen free to leave and return."
This is not true. Roman citizenship was complex and was not extended to males in conquered territories till the 3rd century AD.
For most of the Republic and Empire there were three (roughly) legal classes. Roman Citizens who were children of Roman citizens regardless of where they were born, some few that bought citizenship, or auxiliary soldiers that survived a 20 year enlistment in the Roman army (they could not be legionaries because they were not citizens). The second group, those under Roman Right, which was extended to some regions and not others had proscribed rights in the Empire. And of course there were slaves.
The residents of Iudaea Prefecture of Syria Province were not citizens by virtue of being controlled by Rome although some were undoubtedly born of Roman parents. In fact technically Judea was a separate kingdom till the Macabee revolt in the 1st century AD.
Many many Jews were killed during the two major rebellions. Perhaps as many as 2 million total from 50-150 AD. Many others left the area at that time and all the captives of the Romans were sold as slaves. By 400AD Hebrew had ceased to be spoken in the area.
To say that the Jews were expelled by the Romans is partially true but to say that they were all forced out, is not true in the least.
"In fact technically Judea was a separate kingdom till the Macabee revolt in the 1st century AD"... what???
Governments and political bodies (religions included) have always found personal conscience a threat to state (or religious) power. And whether you're Christian, Jew, or Muslim, all of them claim to put allegiance and obedience to God ahead of the state or 'Man's Law'.
The great argument for the extermination of Jews from Germany was specifically about this fact, because it was thought that Jews would never truly be obedient and loyal citizens. That many had come to Germany in large numbers, seeking refuge from the Bolsheviks, wasn't the original problem. What was the problem was an economic depression, and the increasing popularity of socialism. The Balfour declaration was deliberately used as propaganda, claiming that the Jews were the cause of Germany losing WWI, leading to this economic exploitation and depression. Imagine if the U.S. had lost WWII to Japan because Japanese immigrants and refugees within the U.S. had aided the enemy?
Germany's economy was a wasteland after WWI, and Western industrialists exploited German labor the way it does East Asian, Central/South American, Indian, and African labor. Fat cats got rich from the blood and sweat of those trying to subsist in a collapsed economy, and Bolshevism started looking pretty good to a lot of people. Of course there were a lot of simple folks who bought the Nazi conservatism, just like is happening here in the U.S. Nazism grew precisely because of support from those same Western industrialists as a reaction to the spread of Socialism as a viable and preferable democratic economic system. Part of that reaction was the divisive use of racism, and whatever 'other-ism' could be cooked up to divide people. Some of those Western supporters of Nazism continued to provide aid to the Nazis even up till the end of the war, and at least one of them went on to become a senator after his bank was shut down for 'trading with the enemy'. And that man's son, and grandson, went on to become U.S. presidents.
there lived in the building in n.y.c. where my family lived in the late 30's/40's, a german-jewish millionaire who used to say to all and sundry, "one day hitler will realize that jews can also be good germans and nazis..."
"The great argument for the extermination of Jews from Germany was specifically about this fact, because it was thought that Jews would never truly be obedient and loyal citizens."
The irony is too brilliant for me to even formulate a response.
Israel has no intention of giving up on its apartheid policies. Only withdrawal of our millions in aid can prod them in a different direction, if then.
"Still, some argue that the incident exposed in a newly raw way the need for Israel to deal with its "settler-occupation demon" before it's too late."
Too late for whom?
As long as Israel has operatives in the U.S. Congress and the White House, they can do as they damn well please.
It is disgusting how the airhead pundits talk about timing, as though this were a fine point of etiquette, and not part of a dogged campaign of genocidal acts, both large and small, cynically designed to drive out every last Palestinian from their native home.
Joe
Where did the Anthropologist kingpaddy go? Sure would like to hear more.
If you are so concerned with accuracy than better start the analysis of the situation farther back than just 1947!!! The state of Israel is an old colonial construct used to permanently create a sore spot that keeps one set of gangster rich on the conflict and the rest chasing their tails. The British, French, Germans and the Russians know this game well.
This problem could be solved very fast, it is simple to do. Stop the Money.
As history shows us over and over, imbalances must come back to balance. Hell will be payed for this mess eventually as Nothing is permanent.
Bring America Back !!!!.....!!!!...Look, Abby, Israel is not about to deal with any of its "demons" on its own accord !! Esp occupied settlements==Israel's entire existence is as an occupier of others' lands. !
****As long as big sister USA spreads a wing over Zion
and vetos world complaints at the UN, the Zionista are free to Genocide, Occupy, Spy, False Flag and yes, Spit in the Face of it's own Big Dumb Benefactor !
****AIPAC controls US Mideast policy, and owns most branches of the US Govt., and the lackeys who are supposed to be our so-called Representatives.
****The massacre and Genocide at GAZA should have been the turning point in history when Israel slaughtered 15oo human beings, including 300 to 400 little children. m Not one word of Protest from King Bush, from King Obama, or our Sec/State !!!! Big Sis America was a co=war criminal in the Gaza Attacks.
****If the collateral drone human damage has not proved it, then Gaza surely is the monument that we, as a Nation, are wanton Killers of Children !!!
If we cannot cry for dead children, then we cannot cry for anything, period !!!! Period !! It is way past time to Spit Back !!!!!