US Weighs Stepped-Up Military Forays Into Pakistan
WASHINGTON - Top Bush administration officials are pressing the president to direct U.S. troops in Afghanistan to be more aggressive in pursuing militants into Pakistan on foot as part of a proposed radical shift in regional counterterrorism strategy, The Associated Press has learned.
Senior intelligence and military aides want President Bush to give American soldiers greater flexibility to operate against al-Qaida and Taliban fighters who cross the border from Pakistan's lawless tribal border area to conduct attacks inside Afghanistan, officials say.
The plan could include sending U.S. special forces teams, temporarily assigned to the CIA, into the tribal areas to hit high-value targets, according to an intelligence official with direct knowledge of the plan.
Such a move would be controversial, in part because of Pakistani opposition to U.S. incursions into its territory, and the proposal is not universally supported in Washington. It comes amid growing political instability in Pakistan and concerns that elements of Pakistan's security forces are collaborating with extremists.
Senior members of Bush's national security team met last week at the White House to discuss the recommendations and are now weighing how to proceed, the officials said.
The top agenda item at the meeting of the so-called deputies committee - usually the No. 2 officials at the departments of Defense, and State, plus the intelligence agencies and the National Security Council - was to "review and potentially revise cross-border strategy," a person familiar with the session told the AP.
"What the deputies committee has raised is, given the possibility that political fragmentation in Pakistan is going to continue, do we need to change our strategy?" the official said. He and other current and former officials spoke on condition of anonymity because sensitive foreign policy matters are in play.
The deputies committee is two levels down from the president, so its recommendations would not immediately affect policy.
White House spokesman Tony Fratto declined to comment.
Pakistan's army spokesman Maj. Gen. Athar Abbas and Foreign Ministry spokesman Mohammed Sadiq also refused to comment.
The current strategy - relying on Pakistan to keep a lid on the tribal areas along the border with Afghanistan - was meant to support Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf, a strong ally of the U.S. who took control of Pakistan in 1999 in a bloodless coup. Musharraf was sidelined this spring when a coalition government trounced Musharraf's allies in parliamentary elections. He remains president but with vastly diminished influence.
Pakistan's governing coalition announced Thursday it will seek to impeach Musharraf, cranking up pressure on the U.S.-backed former general to resign.
In Washington, the State Department and some Pentagon officials are leery of the new proposal, warning of repercussions from the Pakistani government, which they fear could be further destabilized, while some officials in the CIA are pushing the plan.
Officials closer to the front lines in Afghanistan also are pushing for a newly aggressive stance. The rules currently limiting U.S. incursions into Pakistan when in hot pursuit of enemy fighters or targets would not be stretched under the plan. But U.S. forces would be encouraged to use that authority liberally.
The Associated Press reported last year that U.S. rules of engagement allowed ground forces to go a little over 6 miles into Pakistan when in hot pursuit, and when forces were targeted or fired on by the enemy. U.S. rules allow aircraft to go 10 miles into Pakistan air space.
Afghanistan's ambassador to the U.S. supports the plan.
"The argument that we may destabilize Pakistan has taken us to where we are right now," Ambassador Said T. Jawad told the AP. "Pursuing the policy of public praise and private pressure on Pakistan doesn't work."
But defense officials say they are cautioning against stepping up military operations in Pakistan without specific approval from Islamabad. They say violating Pakistani sovereignty would anger the Pakistani people and could affect U.S. use of the country as a base from which to resupply U.S. forces in Afghanistan.
Jawad said U.S. and Afghan forces know the location of training camps, places Taliban extremists live and where there have been large gatherings of al-Qaida members, but the current rules of engagement have hampered attacking those targets.
"We need to enhance the capacity of hitting these targets," he said.
The recommendations also call for developing direct relationships with Pashtun tribes on the Pakistani side of the border. That engagement has largely been left to Pakistan's security service, which U.S. officials increasingly fear is riddled with extremists and militant sympathizers.
Pakistan and the United States have somewhat contrary short-term interests in the Federally Administered Tribal Area, a Maryland-sized swath of ungoverned territory bordering Afghanistan.
It is home to about 2 million Pakistanis, representing between 20 and 30 fiercely independent tribes, several with well-armed, militant branches. The region also is increasingly home to al-Qaida terrorists and a growing network of foreign fighters, according to Defense Department officials.
Bowing to U.S. pressure, Musharraf three years ago directed a military crackdown on the tribal area to root out al-Qaida fighters. The tribes resisted the intrusion into their affairs. Prior to 2007 there were around a dozen tribal attacks a year in Pakistan. Last year there were nearly 100, according to U.S. defense officials.
Many tribes have decades-long associations with al-Qaida leaders, dating back to the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan that they fought against. Al-Qaida leaders have intermarried with the tribes and are a source of arms and weapons.
Now, the defense officials said, Pakistani officials are primarily concerned with negotiating an end to the attacks outside the tribal areas. But the U.S. concern is primarily al-Qaida in the tribal areas, and the negotiations are unlikely to affect al-Qaida's increasingly free rein throughout the region.
© 2008 Associated Press
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47 Comments so far
Show AllUSA incursion into Pakistan in reaction to attacks... OK???
Russian incursion into Georgia in reaction to attacks...not OK???
hmmmm...does not compute
The thought of invincibility drove Russians to their demise in Afghanistan. US will meet a similar fate if it doesn't realise that the policy of invasions and killings is only creating more resistance, more hatered for US and fuel for radical organizations.
As for Afghanistan one only needs to refer to its history. No one has ever totally conquered these Pashtun tribes from Alexander to Moguls to the Russians. The same live in Waziristan, NWFP and the whole tribal belt of Pakistan. Infact Waziris were resposible for a large massacre of Colonial British troops in a gorge in Waziristan.
911 was an inside job. There's Youtube for that! Search for lectures from MIT Engineers.
"Senior intelligence and military aides want President Bush to give American soldiers greater flexibility to operate against al-Qaida and Taliban fighters who cross the border from Pakistan's lawless tribal border area to conduct attacks inside Afghanistan, officials say."
Would this be the same group of senior intellgence and military aides who are encouraging Bush to condemn Russian incursions into the sovereign nation of Georgia?
Don't let the Associated Press twist your mind. The USA has NO legitimate unilateral interests in Afghanistan or Pakistan or anywhere else on the planet outside its own territory.
Please, is it too much to ask that people like SnowWolf at least read a book or newspaper or two to learn the facts before speaking out of turn. Plus knowing the facts shows respect for the people who died on 9/11 and their families.
SnowWolf: 3,000 Americans did not die in the attacks on 9/11. Look it up.
Nationalities of the people who died in the 911 attacks included:
American
Australian
Belgian
Brazilian
British
Canadian
Chinese
Colombian
Congonese
Ecuadorian
Filipino
French
German
Ghanaian
Guyanese
Haitian
Honduran
Indian
Indonesian
Irish
Israeli
Ivory Coast
Jamaican
Japanese
Lebanese
Lithuania
Mexican
Moldavian
Nigerian
Peruvian
Portuguese
Russian
Swedish
Taiwanese
Ukrainian
Uzbek, and
Venezuelan
I could supply the actual numbers for each nationality, but if SnowWolf is truly interested in facts, he/she will LOOK IT UP.
I apologize, I did not know where to post this update. I receive them every day, or 2. Please keep up with and help these brave people, from Palestinian's to Holocaust survivor's, hopefully they'll have room for me on the next voyage. I've been invited and spots fill up quickly, money honey. We'll see.
_______________________________________________________
Dear Gaza Friends:
Well, today is the opening of the Olympics, and it's also the day the boats have set sail for Crete. After solving several small technical problems and waiting for the weather to clear, FREE GAZA and LIBERTY are on their way to Chania, Crete, arriving there tomorrow. We will have a press conference, and it will be the first time photographers will be able to take photos of the two boats as they sail into the harbor.
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
SS Free Gaza and SS Liberty Arrive in Chania, Crete, Saturday, 9 August at 21:00 p.m.
For further information, contact: 6932 766496 for directions, or Greta Berlin, 00375 99 08 17 67
Nicosia/Lefkosia, Cyprus, August 7. The Free Gaza Movement announced today that their boats, destined to break the Israelis' siege of Gaza, will arrive in Chania, Crete, on Saturday, August 9, at 9 p.m. and that a press conference will be held to welcome their arrival. "Internationals are gathering across the world – in Beijing and Cyprus – with the common dream of peace and justice for everyone."
Human rights activists Lauren Booth, journalist, (sister in law of former British Prime Minister Tony Blair), Huwaida Arraf (a Palestinian-American residing in Ramallah, Palestine), and Jeff Halper (an Israeli Jew who was nominated for the 2006 Nobel Peace Prize for opposing demolitions of Palestinian homes) will be available at the press conference for interviews.
"This will be the first time that our two boats will be publicly displayed and photographers are welcome to come, take photos and post their images." said Paul Larudee, on board the boats sailing toward Chania.
The Free Gaza Movement is endorsed by an impressive array of international groups and personalities including South African Archbishop Desmond Tutu and Former Prime Minister of Lebanon Dr. Salim Al-Hoss. For additional information, www.freegaza.org
We are a week late, but we are more determined than ever to go to Gaza. By now, almost half of the people are on board or traveling to the boats, and those of us left in Cyprus are finishing up our training, working on banners and trying to control our impatience. When we called the people of Gaza to tell them we would arrive a week late, their reply was, "Don't worry. We know you are coming. And we are waiting," a testament to their confidence that 40 Internationals, two small boats, and tremendous media attention can somehow defeat the Israeli Navy.
Some of the survivors of the USS Liberty have written to us and asked us to be on one of their programs tomorrow night. They wrote this request of us:
What is the possibility of you and the crew of the SS Liberty throwing 34 long stemmed roses into the sea as a memorial to the 34 Americans who were killed aboard the USS LIberty? We will pay for the roses or whatever else you have in mind. I guarantee you our newspaper American Free Press will give a HUGE spread in the paper for it. The survivors of the LIberty and their familes would be eternally grateful to you and your ship mates for this gesture as no one has ever done anything like this before.
Another wrote:
I am one of the survivors of the USS Liberty. A very tired man who woke up somewhat when I heard of the
SS Liberty. I was the petty officer in charge of the body recovery and identification, and I remember it almost like it was yesterday.
May God Be With You
So, when we leave Cyprus next week, we hope to have a ceremony for all of those Americans killed by the Israelis on board the ship in 1967.
The media attention has been intense in Europe, people calling constantly asking for interviews. If you GOOGLE Free Gaza, Cyprus, you will see dozens of stories about us and the boats and the response from here. So many angels have stepped in to help, from offering us their homes, feeding us, and driving us around to media appointments. One man called us today and told us that he would loan us the money to cover our expenses for the boats and the equipment, because, "You are making history."
Greta Berlin
The Free Gaza Movement
http://www.FreeGaza.org
The current problems that Musharref is going through is proof positive of the stupidity Dubya, Cheney, & Co. displayed in putting all their Pakistan eggs in the general's basket. Pakistani history has shown that no military strongman has ever ruled indefinitely, and that siding with whatever general has set themselves up in Islamabad is a bad bet long term. Considering how things went with Zia, one would have thought the USA would have learned its' lesson.
Thanks, Hollow point at 11:18am.
I also work with Muslims and I have sat at table with them where pork was served. In my experience the Muslims present simply and discreetly ate other foods.
It's hard to believe that eating pork was posted as a reason to vilify Muslims.
Hollow Point...you're a Truther? ...
no wonder nothing I say gets through
I would wager that millions are going to die before this war is over...and it doesn't matter whether its Obama or McCain (Or Hillary the way things are going)
we had that spare Army before Clinton cut it from 18 Divisions to 10...everyone seems to forget that fact
SnowWolf August 9th, 2008 8:24 am
I have to take a kitten to a vet appointment
I bet THAT post cemented my reputation as a Hard-ass...*wink*
Actually one of my dogs found two 7 week old stray kittens under my shed...the weaker one didn't make it but the other is thriving ($125 vet bill..*sigh*)
snowwolf
Well I have Muslim friends and don't take a fit at all at anything I do. They in no way try to get me to join their religion. You don't see Muslims knocking on your door with Watch Tower in their hands do you? Or Muslims going into a village in South America or Africa and try to reform everyone.
As for the 3000 wow you sound like the minority that think it wasn't an inside job. Attack a country for one man with a liver disorder calling the shots from a cave with his cell phone?
As others have said, it was 2 buildings falling over with little or no private investigation and look what Americans have given up to be now even more controlled.
Oh forgot the 5000 troops that have died and the 20,000 that are braindead or missing limbs while fighting a noun.
Everyone knows that the U.S. and CIA helped create and empower the Taliban and Al-Qaida during the Carter and Reagan administrations, as it was believed by those administrations that there was enough in common with these jihadists to support them.
It is clear that some re-thinking is in order!
There can be nonviolent reconciliation with our separate camps, and most of the above posts accept that. Dave Dubya at 6:55pm makes a fine statement.
Diplomacy will work when it is seriously attempted! MLK believed that up to his final breath; that is what led him to Memphis.
There are extremists of any faith, however this world contains 1.5 billion Muslims who are every bit as conciliatory and accommodating as any non-Muslim.
I hope we have another army somewhere down in the cellar we can thaw out and use because if we mess with Iran AND Pakistan we will have ourselves a FOUR front war.
Does ANYONE in this administration read history?
HEYYYY, you guys!!!! Someone up there fire up a computer and Google "Hitler, Adolf Eastern front" and spend about ten minutes reading the material. OK, now ... that was just TWO fronts ... are ya with me here??!!
Interesting that just a little while after Musharraf politely tells the U.S. that he'd prefer it if we didn't invade his country at ALL, he's facing impeachment.
Just a coincidence. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.
you were speaking of Musharaf weren't you...My Bad
Oh
We'll Impeach Bush when he commits an Impeachable offense and not till
I agree that the World was a safer place during the cold war...
and there is nothing wrong with Islam per se until they force their views on other cultures...I have known many Jews in my lifetime and not one has had a problem with me eating a Ham and Swiss in front of them...Muslims will throw a fit
and To answer your question...yes..I have heard of the Afghan Pipeline deal but are you saying thats why we went into Afghanistan?...that is preposterous ...we went into Afghanistan seeking justice for 3000 dead Americans and the Taliban was sheltering the people who ordered the hit
I have to take a kitten to a vet appointment and cannot reply further at the moment...but I will read your reply when I get home
At least they have the guts to impeach a leader that goes wrong.
As others have said the US is afraid of their appointed former CIA boy getting the boot and who knows who runs Pak after that.
Isn't there a little country that wants a pipeline through Afghanistan?
Snow wolf
What is wrong with Islam or any other religion? Multi culture is fine with me. If the US wants to try to be the world police then go ahead as the economy and US falls apart at home. They will stop when Russia starts to kick its butt. The world was a safer place with the cold war.
no tisn't
SnowWolf -- That is hogwash.
Looks like we need to outsource the US military.
Pshaw
its not just a U.S. problem...Western Civilization is at stake...Europe is about to be rolled into Islam...its almost too late for the U.K. and probably IS too late for Holland...Multi-Culti has made Europe so politically correct they are barely fighting back..
The oil issue really doesn't concern me...if the price goes up much more the people will drop kick the Pols that are in radical environmentalisms pockets and we'll drill our own...I am concerned that Civilization as we know it will be relegated to the dustbin of history...welcome to the 7th Century...Allah Akbar
Why do you feel that it is the US's duty to eradicate the Taliban? Or anyone, for that matter? What is the US, the world's policeman?
Instead of simply accepting what you are told, if you looked you would have seen the Taliban were never in control in Afghanistan anyway, and never likely to be.
What is the US doing there anyway? Fighting them over ther so they don't have to fight them over here? Or perhaps there might be a gas pipline involved there somewhere, do you think?
The alternative is to let the Taliban do their little incursions, blow something up and slip back to safety across the border...
even Obama is for pursuing them into Pakistan when they do this...it would be NICE if the Pakistani Army would go in there as a blocking force...but they got stomped the last time they tried it
What is your solution to eradicate the Taliban?...I'm curious
Unlike Russia, who can DRIVE their tanks to their new war, the US has to drag it's sorry Imperial Stormtrooper ass halfway around the world to get into a fight over oil.
Better that than turning on it's 'ally' Canada like a rabid pitbull...
And on the chance that the war criminal Musharif is expelled, who then will be controlling Pakistan's nukes?
One problem is that Musharraf is likely to be impeached, and decided against going to the Olympic Games and leaving the opposition to it for two weeks for that very reason. Maybe he will be removed and maybe he won't, depending on a whole lot of factors but, if he is, his successor will not be so beholden to the US. Which is not to say he or she will not be corrupt, merely someone else's dictator.
Hey stop it you guys, fo rgods sake THINK!!!
Think "Domino Theory". If we don't stop them there, Pakiston will fall, then India and China. If China falls, Wal-Mart and Home Depot, Hallmark and Lowes fall. It's the economy stupid.
Buy stock in weapons and munitions it's a solid investment.
This is because the US is not winning in Afghanistan, and is losing control of Pakistan via Musharraf the pawn of Pakistan. This is because the US is losing, the US is a bad loser, and just wants to kill more people. Any remote nation full of third world people will do. The Al-Qaida myth referred to by the US departments of Greed, Black Oil Lies and Imperialist Propaganda are the peoples who do not want to stand around and be killed by invading US, NATO and Australian Terrorists and Murderers.
Another potential violation of Rule #1: Do not mess with what you don't understand."
Definition of insanity played out again in yet another country. Our 'forays' into countries have been an abject failure each and every time. The occupations of all nations throughout history have always been failures. Reliance on military to secure resources and excessive military spending has not worked out, ever.
Here comes Bu$h the inferior who has defined all problems as nails, because he believes that the hammer (military) is the only tool available.
The doomsday clock people are cockeyed optimists.
Here we go again. We are going to wind up like the Soviet Union in Afghanistan, only we are going to add Pakistan to our list of enemies. We may be able to control the established government of Pakistan, but not the their military or the ISI. The chances are that it is the military, or the ISI, that controls Pakistan's nuclear arsenal, and they will not need a missile to deliver a nuclear attack on the U.S. They can deliver it in a shipping container or a suitcase. And, we cannot prevent it.
And when that all goes down, we will be at war with 1.5 billion people, with not one ally. In fact even the neutrals will likely turn into enemies.
And we will surely deserve it - just like Hitler, and Togo.
Yes, that's brilliant. Administration officials and military "intelligence" know what's best. When have they ever been wrong?
Let's expand war in the name of peace and security. Let's keep bombing more countries and killing more people until they stop hating us. Flawless plan.
That'll teach 'em.
As draft-dodgers and deserters during the Viet-Nam war, perhaps it's understandable that Republicans have failed completely to learn the lessons of that conflict. Namely that spilling the conflict over the borders into neighboring countries is NEVER a good idea, it only leads to more conflict and solves none of the problems while simultaneously making more enemies.
We've created a giant mess that we do need to clean up. Creating another Cambodia and Laos in the region is not a good way to start.
And the growing war between Russia and georgia is how far away from Pakistan?
I can see the *slim* possibility that US and Russian aircraft could trade shots...
So now George Warmonger wants to wage an illegal war on the Islamic Republic of
Pakistan? How does he find the time and I've lost track - who is America at 'war' with now? Or who isn't might be a shorter list.
Since when have invasions been called "forays"?
"because of Pakistani opposition to U.S. incursions into its territory,"
How about "violations" of it's territorial sovereignty.
How would we react if Cuba started sending "forays" into to the US to kill Americans?
Where are the Obama supporters defending this policy that Obama, McCain, and Bush all support?
"The current strategy - relying on Pakistan to keep a lid on the tribal areas along the border with Afghanistan - was meant to support Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf, a strong ally of the U.S. who took control of Pakistan in 1999 in a bloodless coup."
And the future strategy of pursuing rebels into Pakistani territory will only further strengthen Musharrafs grip on real power in Pakistan. The civilian government is in paralysis and their writ doesnt extend outside Islamabad. The Military and the ISI have real power in Pakistan.
We need to cut off funding the Pakistani Military and ISI. Nothing will change if we dont do this ASAP.
What happened to getting our troops home?
Excuse ouselves and LEAVE NOW rather than later.
Just do not kill or capture Osama!!! It will make the Saudis angry and Cheney nor Bush will make their weekly billions.
Yeah, yeah, that's what we need. Strike, strike, strike! Because that's all we got. Surge, surge, all over the planet.
From the perspective of those fiercely independent tribals dwelling in the volatile border regions of Pakistan (Waziristan, FATA) it seems the CIA are to be given power to declare war.
Tribes will strike back at the US and it's allies, causing much grief for Pakistan and it's leaders. Maybe even civil war.
The US is clueless and is meddling again.
Have we not dug this hole deep enough?
So, we have Musharraf on very dodgy ground (he may be impeached), and the US want to pursue a tougher military line in Pakistan. Please remember that Pakistan have nuclear weapons, and although they are our "ally" at the moment, things will change very quickly with a new leader. Perhaps the US wish to start a whole new conflict, not just in the Middle East, but the whole of Asia.