http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=related&v=6VDhpFM2MMc

The Battle Rages on.

"He who lives in his own country and loves his own country defends his own country"

Anonymous Georgian Soldier

"I have never heard of anything so montrous and attrocious as a Russian Sniper firing with no warning on a female reporter from Free Tiblisi ." (31407 of Common Dreams)

I will , ON ONE CONDITION, You AND THE ENTIRETY OF DC watch this, IT WIL NO DOUBT MAKE SICK BASTARDS JUMP FOR GLEE

Video: Georgian TV reporter shot by Russian sniper during live broadcast carries on with her report with bleeding arm

By Sam Greenhill
Last updated at 7:27 PM on 14th August 2008

This is the dramatic moment a TV reporter was shot by a sniper as she reported live from war-torn Georgia.

Tamara Urushadze took a bullet to her left arm in the flashpoint town of Gori as Russian forces continued their illegal occupation.

Bravely, or foolishly, the 32-year-old brunette continued her report after a few moments as other journalists and aid workers dashed for cover.

Video: Georgian TV reporter shot by Russian sniper during live broadcast carries on with her report with bleeding arm

By Sam Greenhill
Last updated at 7:27 PM on 14th August 2008

Comments (2) Add to My Stories

This is the dramatic moment a TV reporter was shot by a sniper as she reported live from war-torn Georgia.

Tamara Urushadze took a bullet to her left arm in the flashpoint town of Gori as Russian forces continued their illegal occupation.

Bravely, or foolishly, the 32-year-old brunette continued her report after a few moments as other journalists and aid workers dashed for cover.

Siege-town Gori has become a deadly 'sniper's alley' with citizens at the mercy of rampaging militiamen - believed to be from the breakaway republic South Ossetia - looting and firing guns, some drunkenly.

The Kremlin stands accused of turning a blind eye to renegades bent on 'ethnic cleansing' in revenge for Georgia's ill-conceived invasion of South Ossetia last Friday.

But in turn Moscow blames the Georgians for abandoning their own people.

More...
Russians shatter Georgia truce and tell the West to 'forget talk of territorial integrity'
STEPHEN GLOVER: Yes, this war is wrong but after Iraq, the West's moralising is an outrage

Miss Urushadze, who reports for Georgia's equivalent of the BBC, was talking live to a TV camera about humanitarian aid arriving in Gori yesterday afternoon when the sniper struck.

In the footage, she gasps as the first bullet grazes her left arm, and instinctively jumps sideways as four more whizz past.

In shock, she slumps to the ground as the cameraman rushes to her side.

A still of Tamara Urushadze reporting live on Georgian TV shortly before she was shot by a sniper in Gori

A studio presenter's voice is heard saying: 'You can see that something has happened during live coverage. Unfortunately we don't know what.'

Then Miss Urushadze is on air again, sitting in a van a few yards away and showing the camera her grazed arm.

She tells viewers: 'I have been hit by a bullet. You can see I am scratched here. Most likely it was a sniper.

'It has most likely been a light weapon as it's a minor wound. There is no one to be seen here and I have no idea who shot me.'

She was later taken to hospital.

Meanwhile, Russia taunted the United States by blowing up its ally's military bases and boasting Georgia will never get back the rebel enclaves of South Ossetia and Abkhazia.

The Kremlin's troops sabotaged airfields and depots in Georgia to cripple the battered state's U.S.-trained military.

And the former Red Army humiliated their beaten foes by one minute withdrawing from Georgian territory and then re-entering it, just to prove that they still could.

At least five explosions rocked Gori as Russian troops went about disabling Georgia's ability to fight a future conflict.

Again it was the innocents who suffered most as the few remaining citizens in the abandoned city were targeted.

A steady, dejected trickle of Georgian refugees fled the front line in overloaded cars, trucks and tractor-pulled wagons, heading to the capital Tbilisi.

One Soviet-era car carried eight people, including a mother and a baby in the front seat. The open back door of a small blue van revealed at least a dozen people crowded inside.

There was also a tense stand-off between frustrated Georgian special forces, desperate to hit back, and battle-hardened Russian troops from Chechnya at a checkpoint on the outskirts of the city.

Around midday, Russian tanks sped towards the checkpoint and Georgian police quickly retreated behind their own forces.

Outside the town, hundreds of Georgian tanks, artillery and armoured personnel carriers massed on the main east-west highway.

Soldiers dozed in the sunshine by their vehicles awaiting the order to advance.

But in a throwback to darker Cold War times, Moscow seems intent on taking its time to withdraw its vastly superior forces, in a deliberate snub to President Bush's decision to raise the stakes by ordering U.S. forces to the region.

He sent American military aircraft loaded with humanitarian aid.

U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice issued another urgent call on Russia to honour the ceasefire as she headed to Tbilisi to have a final version of the truce agreement signed by the Georgian president.

But even as she spoke, Russian troops were making themselves at home in the country, including the Black Sea port city of Poti which hosts an oil terminal key to supplying fuel to Western Europe.

The Russian troops in Gori told us they would stay put 'until Mr Putin says so', adding they were in no hurry and mockingly praising the 'beautiful scenery' around them.

Moscow made it clear that the Black Sea state can wave goodbye to ever seeing its two breakaway provinces, South Ossetia and Abkhazia, becoming part of Georgia.

Russian foreign minister Sergei Lavrov rammed home the point by declaring that the world 'can forget about any talk about Georgia's territorial integrity'.

President Dmitry Medvedev vowed to act as 'protector' to the two pro-Russian regions and met their leaders in the Kremlin, telling them: 'You have defended your territory. The truth was on your side. That is why you have been victorious.

'The people of South Ossetia suffered genocide and it will take years, maybe decades, for these wounds to be healed.'

The incendiary talk a week after the war began dashed both Georgian and Western hopes that the region could return to the status quo before the bloodshed which has left hundreds dead and thousands of refugees on both sides.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1045030/Video-Georgian-TV-reporter-shot-Russian-snip...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eyQ5Maqf80

Watch this too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=moHvY-Y_ph0&feature=related

I am shocked what Guardian posted: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/aug/13/georgia.russia3
This is terrible. Russian government did big mistake not showing this from the beginning.
Remember what Saakashvili said? He wanted to bring peace to South Ossetia people. What a liar!
Looks like GWB didn't see that over his military satellites or he keeps playing a game.

Alexander,

thanks for the post.

I stopped believing the lying propogandist western media a LONG time ago..in this event, even the normally semi-rational BBC was playing the propogansist for a while, though the seem to be getting back to a less biased position today.

Sackoshitli is obviously a lunatic, mentally unstable US pawn. Just listen to the pure unadulterated BULLSHIT coming from his mouth every time he appers on TV....whenever he isn't cowering and crying like a baby that is. He sounds just like the mentally unstable Bush, making threats that he cannot back up like he is some kind of "Emperor of the Planet"..Like no one remembers that BUSH ordered the illegal invasion andf occupation of Iraq without the UN's approval, and in the face of MASSIVE world protest.

This entire mess was clearly orchestrated by the USA...Condi "The Butcher" Rice was just in Georgia and must have gave him the green light to ethnically cleanse Ossetia...just to see how the Russians would respond. She is supposedly an "expert" in Russian politicas

Now the sheer insanity of the Bush Criminal Cabal is clearly shown to the world.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080812/ap_on_re_eu/georgia_russia

what in hell fire and GOD ALMIGHTY FUCKING ASS DAMNATION IS WRONG WITH THE BIG BAD FUCKING ASS RUSSIANS?????????

IS THE GOD DAMN BIG BAD ASS IMPAILER SO FUCKING ASS GOD DAMN SCARED! HIS NATOIN IS TWICE AS GOD DAMN FUCKING ASS LARGE AS THE UNTIED STTATES AND THEY ARE SUDDENLY SO FUCKING ASS GOD DAMN SCARED OF SOMETHING AS LARGE AS THE STATE OF SOUTH CAROLINA!!!! WHAT THE HELL FIRE AND GOD DAMN FUCKING ASS WRONG WITH YA VLADI!!!!!! YOU SCARED ASS YELLOW LILL CHICKEN SHIT COWARD SON OF A BITCH!!!!!!

PS - this is a free speech forum ,
PPS (and I mean PP)
as for a Jaguara, better to be pissed off than pissed on,

Why is there no "report this post for abuse" option here at CD?

Spammers like 31407 are starting to piss me off.

Dear compatriots! In this very important, decisive and difficult period for our country, I want to describe the current situation and tell you about the ways of helping the country out of this situation.

First of all, I want to tell you that what is happening now against Georgia is obviously a military intervention planned months or years ago, which aims, at least, to occupy or annex South Ossetia and Abkhazia, and as a final result, to occupy entire Georgia.

That intervention force, which entered Georgia, is very big, very serious and of course, it contains a fatal threat to the Georgian statehood. Today the freedom and future of each of us is under a huge blow. An attempt of repeated occupation and enslaving of Georgia, depriving our country of its independence is underway. No doubt that it is real, against the background of latest statements. If previously they said that they responded to the operation launched by us in South Ossetia – and you know that we have not launched anything until the last minute – yesterday and the day before yesterday official statements were made that the operation aimed at changing the Georgian authorities, changing Georgia's course. It is translated from their language as the end to Georgia's independence. Attacks are carried out against the Kodori gorge in Upper Abkhazia, attacks are carried in the direction of Abkhazia and Samegrelo. Yesterday there was an attempt to occupy Gori, which was repelled by our armed forces. I want to say that our armed forces are fighting very well. Their moral is increasing. Of course, I regret greatly and this is the war. Of course, we have casualties, but our enemies have much more casualties. I declare about it basing on their sources. But this is a very serious test and in reality the success of our forces is based on their unimaginable heroism. Our enemies did not expect – and they themselves said about it in the official statement that they came across the resistance of the Georgian armed forces which was 12 fold more than they imagined.

But I want to say with full responsibility that we want to immediately end this military confrontation, we want to end the war, which we have not launched, we want to stop Russia's intervention. We are ready and I have confirmed my support to the plan of French President Sarkozy and Foreign Minister Kouchner. Kouchner was here; President Sarkozy will arrive tomorrow. We are ready to immediately sign the agreement on ceasefire and non-resumption of confrontation.

We are expecting the visits of several European leaders, tomorrow, as I already said, President Sarkozy will arrive. Many European ministers are presently visiting Georgia. Today a great amount of humanitarian aid will start arriving from the entire world. The first planes from France will land within two hours and others will arrive afterwards, including from Turkey, Ukraine, Germany, Denmark, other European states.

I want to tell to those people, who have left the conflict zone – we will return you all back and until this conflict is over, I gave the strictest instructions, not to leave even one person without attention. I want to say that of course, there was a chaos within first hours, we were not preparing for it and they attacked us treacherously. If you remember, I was constantly increasing the military budget and many used to say, why he is doing that - just for this occasion, for this unfortunate day. We failed to increase it as much as I wanted.

It is not worth saying but if we had not lost time on inner confrontation last autumn, we would have been much better prepared. But today we are well-prepared and we have a motivation to defend our country respectively, to save the independence and statehood of our country, to save the future of each of us, to give a proper response to our enemies.

I want to say with full responsibility, we should save our country ourselves. Nobody else will be able to do it. Of course, international support is important, international diplomatic involvement is decisive, but if we are not very mobilized, if we do not show heroism, if we do not resist this huge brutal force, without our dedication Georgia will not be able to stop this confrontation.

All what is happening now – bombings, especially those of civilian facilities, at nights, shelling - has the only objective, to demoralize our society, to seed panic in the society. I want to thank everybody, those tens of thousands of Tbilisites, who came out in the streets last night and expressed their huge support towards the Georgian statehood. I want to thank those people – I traveled from the east to the west and backwards – although Russian aircrafts were flying above us and although the highway was shelled during our movement, I saw Georgian national flags flying on the cars and I saw Georgian flags flying on the balconies - this is our response, our unity, our bravery, our endurance, and we will certainly liberate entire Georgia. This is what is happening now, this is Georgia's struggle for national liberation, this is a response to the war imposed on Georgia, a response by the Georgian society's resistance, the Georgian society's heroism in order to maintain liberty, statehood, and future of our children. The officials of foreign countries should never define the future of our children. The future of our children and our country should be ruled by the democratic government elected by the Georgian society, which will act in the interests of the people, in the interests of multi-ethnic society, and will never dance under other's pipe and time will never come, when we cleaned the shoes of foreign officials. We helped Georgia up from its knees within past years. We should not allow anybody to make us knee again. Georgia should find its way out of this situation. Georgia should manage to restore peace and to establish good relations, including with Russians, which attacked us.

I also want to address the Russian society – of course, all media outlets are blocked now, but information is leaking – we do not fight with the Russian people. We are not angry with the Russian society. Much injustice has been carried out against Georgia, against each Georgian. But time will come - I am sure - when we will have very good relations again. But we will defend the freedom of our country, the independence of our country – with our teeth, to the last drop of blood. God bless each of us. God bless freedom of Georgia. God bless our soldiers, our heroes. Long live Georgia.

Mikhail Saakashvili - State of the Nation address to the people of the Soverign Republic of Georgia - August 2008

http://www.geotimes.ge/index.php?m=home&newsid=11873

HEY VLADI! HEY LADDIE!!!!!!

WWWWWWWWWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!

HHHHHOOOOOOOWWWWWWWW FFFFFFFAAAARRRRRR SSSSSSSSSSSOOOOOOUUUUTTTTTH YOU WWWWWWWWAAAANNNNNNNNNAAAAAAAAA GO!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Book of the Prophet
Ezekiel
38

The Prophecy against Gog
1 And the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,

2 Son of man, set thy face against Gog, the land of Magog, Rev. 20.8 the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him,

3 and say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal:

4 and I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts of armor, even a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords:

5 Persia, Ethiopia, and Libya with them; all of them with shield and helmet:

6 Gomer, and all his bands; the house of Togar'mah of the north quarters, and all his bands: and many people with thee.

7 ¶ Be thou prepared, and prepare for thyself, thou, and all thy company that are assembled unto thee, and be thou a guard unto them.

8 After many days thou shalt be visited: in the latter years thou shalt come into the land that is brought back from the sword, and is gathered out of many people, against the mountains of Israel, which have been always waste: but it is brought forth out of the nations, and they shall dwell safely all of them.

9 Thou shalt ascend and come like a storm, thou shalt be like a cloud to cover the land, thou, and all thy bands, and many people with thee.

10 ¶ Thus saith the Lord GOD; It shall also come to pass, that at the same time shall things come into thy mind, and thou shalt think an evil thought:

11 and thou shalt say, I will go up to the land of unwalled villages; I will go to them that are at rest, that dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates,

12 to take a spoil, and to take a prey; to turn thine hand upon the desolate places that are now inhabited, and upon the people that are gathered out of the nations, which have gotten cattle and goods, that dwell in the midst of the land.

13 Sheba, and Dedan, and the merchants of Tarshish, with all the young lions thereof, shall say unto thee, Art thou come to take a spoil? hast thou gathered thy company to take a prey? to carry away silver and gold, to take away cattle and goods, to take a great spoil?

14 ¶ Therefore, son of man, prophesy and say unto Gog, Thus saith the Lord GOD; In that day when my people of Israel dwelleth safely, shalt thou not know it?

15 And thou shalt come from thy place out of the north parts, thou, and many people with thee, all of them riding upon horses, a great company, and a mighty army:

16 and thou shalt come up against my people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes.

17 ¶ Thus saith the Lord GOD; Art thou he of whom I have spoken in old time by my servants the prophets of Israel, which prophesied in those days many years, that I would bring thee against them?

18 And it shall come to pass at the same time when Gog shall come against the land of Israel, saith the Lord GOD, that my fury shall come up in my face.

19 For in my jealousy and in the fire of my wrath have I spoken, Surely in that day there shall be a great shaking in the land of Israel;

20 so that the fishes of the sea, and the fowls of the heaven, and the beasts of the field, and all creeping things that creep upon the earth, and all the men that are upon the face of the earth, shall shake at my presence, and the mountans shall be thrown down, and the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground.

21 And I will call for a sword against him throughout all my mountains, saith the Lord GOD: every man's sword shall be against his brother.

22 And I will plead against him with pestilence and with blood; and I will rain upon him, and upon his bands, and upon the many people that are with him, an overflowing rain, and great hailstones, fire, and brimstone.

23 Thus will I magnify myself, and sanctify myself; and I will be known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that I am the LORD.

The Book of the Prophet
Ezekiel
39

1 Therefore, thou son of man, prophesy against Gog, and say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal:

2 and I will turn thee back, and leave but the sixth part of thee, and will cause thee to come up from the north parts, and will bring thee upon the mountains of Israel:

3 and I will smite thy bow out of thy left hand, and will cause thine arrows to fall out of thy right hand.

4 Thou shalt fall upon the mountains of Israel, thou, and all thy bands, and the people that is with thee: I will give thee unto the ravenous birds of every sort, and to the beasts of the field, to be devoured.

5 Thou shalt fall upon the open field: for I have spoken it, saith the Lord GOD.

6 And I will send a fire on Magog, and among them that dwell carelessly in the isles: and they shall know that I am the LORD.

7 ¶ So will I make my holy name known in the midst of my people Israel; and I will not let them pollute my holy name any more: and the heathen shall know that I am the LORD, the Holy One in Israel.

8 Behold, it is come, and it is done, saith the Lord GOD; this is the day whereof I have spoken.

9 ¶ And they that dwell in the cities of Israel shall go forth, and shall set on fire and burn the weapons, both the shields and the bucklers, the bows and the arrows, and the handstaves, and the spears, and they shall burn them with fire seven years:

10 so that they shall take no wood out of the field, neither cut down any out of the forests; for they shall burn the weapons with fire: and they shall spoil those that spoiled them, and rob those that robbed them, saith the Lord GOD.

11 ¶ And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will give unto Gog a place there of graves in Israel, the valley of the passengers on the east of the sea; and it shall stop the noses of the passengers: and there shall they bury Gog and all his multitude: and they shall call it, The valley of Ha'mon–gog. 1

12 And seven months shall the house of Israel be burying of them, that they may cleanse the land.

13 Yea, all the people of the land shall bury them; and it shall be to them a renown the day that I shall be glorified, saith the Lord GOD.

14 And they shall sever out men of continual employment, passing through the land, to bury with the passengers those that remain upon the face of the earth, to cleanse it: after the end of seven months shall they search.

15 And the passengers that pass through the land, when any seeth a man's bone, then shall he set up a sign by it, till the buriers have buried it in the valley of Ha'mon–gog.

16 And also the name of the city shall be Hamo'nah 2 Thus shall they cleanse the land.

17 ¶ And, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood.

18 Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth, of rams, of lambs, and of goats, of bullocks, all of them fatlings of Bashan.

19 And ye shall eat fat till ye be full, and drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you.

20 Thus ye shall be filled at my table with horses and chariots, with mighty men, and with all men of war, saith the Lord GOD. Rev. 19.17, 18

21 ¶ And I will set my glory among the heathen, and all the heathen shall see my judgment that I have executed, and my hand that I have laid upon them.

22 So the house of Israel shall know that I am the LORD their God from that day and forward.

23 And the heathen shall know that the house of Israel went into captivity for their iniquity: because they trespassed against me, therefore hid I my face from them, and gave them into the hand of their enemies; so fell they all by the sword.

24 According to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions have I done unto them, and hid my face from them.

25 ¶ Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Now will I bring again the captivity of Jacob, and have mercy upon the whole house of Israel, and will be jealous for my holy name;

26 after that they have borne their shame, and all their trespasses whereby they have trespassed against me, when they dwelt safely in their land, and none made them afraid.

27 When I have brought them again from the people, and gathered them out of their enemies' lands, and am sanctified in them in the sight of many nations;

28 then shall they know that I am the LORD their God, which caused them to be led into captivity among the heathen: but I have gathered them unto their own land, and have left none of them any more there.

29 Neither will I hide my face any more from them: for I have poured out my Spirit upon the house of Israel, saith the Lord GOD.

BBBBBAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNZZZZZZZZZAAAAAAAAAAIIIIIIIIIIIII RRRRRRROOOOOOOOOSSSSSSSSSSKKKKKIIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEEE MUTHAFUKKAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

eeeeeerrrrrrr, WHERE are all the liberal puke supporting Vladimir the Impailer NOW! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH BRING IT ON!

PS - I formally challenge the upper to top managerial eschelon of CD to PUBLICALLY ENDORSE AND SUPPORT ANY AND ALL ACTIONS taken by the UNTIED STATES and ALL HER ALLIES, UN NATO EU ETC in the Defense of the Soverign Republic of Georig and Her president, Thank you

Russia now guilty of Ethnic Cleansing.......
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080811/ap_on_re_eu/georgia_south_ossetia

eeeerrrrr. Vladimir, Can you say "The Hague"

http://www.monstersandcritics.com/news/europe/features/article_1420682.php/BACKGROUND_The_UN_war_crime...

got a place right there for ya , boy

PUTIN IS A WAR CRIMINAL!

http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/4614/putinwarcriminalandcowagn7.jpg

Abraham Lincoln tried to stop the South from seceding and succeeded - and at least 620,000 Americans died. He's called our greatest President.

Milosevic tried to stop the breakup of Yugoslavia. Around 140,000 (former) Yugoslavians died. He's called a war criminal.

Saakashvili invades a province that seceded 12 years ago. I saw him on CNN saying that he received calls of support from Bush, McCain and Obama. That makes a clean sweep of imperial support for Georgia's attack on civilians.

"Aggressors aren't intimidated by diplomacy absent the credible threat of force; fanatics aren't deterred by the disapproval of men of moderation or refinement.

The good news is that today we don't face threats of the magnitude of Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union. Each of those regimes combined ruthless internal control, a willingness to engage in external aggression, and fervent adherence to an extreme ideology. Today these elements don't coexist in one place - Bill "Butthead" Krystol

"Aggressors aren't intimidated by diplomacy absent the credible threat of force; fanatics aren't deterred by the disapproval of men of moderation or refinement. DIDNT STOP THE USA's ILLEGALL INVASION AND OCCUPATION OF IRAQ, DID IT? SO I WILL GIVE HIM THAT ONE

"Each of those regimes combined ruthless internal control, a willingness to engage in external aggression, and fervent adherence to an extreme ideology. Today these elements don't coexist in one place ....EXCEPT IN THE US WHITE HOUSE..LOOK AT THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT FOR RUTHLESS INTERNAL CONTROL, IRAQ FOR EXTERNAL AGRESSION, AND THE WRITER OF THIS CRAP FOR EXTREME IDEOLOGY

IS KRYSTOL REALLY SO THICK AS TO BELIEVE HIS OWN DRIVEL, OR IS THIS JUST MORE PAP FOR THE MINDLESS NEOCON MASSES?

I feel big sorrow towards Georgian people now. But I pretty sure that Russia is not going to take Tbilisi. I think Georgian people will require the impeachment for their president and Russia will withdraw its forces after that.

I can assume either Georgia's president has a mental disease to start fighting Russia or he has been paid a lot of money to do that. I do not think that Bush needs that. I assume this is McCain's or someone else's election campaign. Now someone will try to use this to gain popularity.

Internet rules! Before Russians and Americans could read only their own lies in newspapers, but now we can read all different kinds of contradictory lies from both sides. I wish to know the truth! I was so surprised to read totally contradictory information about Russia, Russians and Balkans in the US newspapers being there in 1997-1999. I was so surprised about not seeing videos of NATO bombings of civil houses in Belgrade, the capital of Yugoslavia and crying children who lost their parents and homes. Basically both Russian and American people look alike but governments are really evil and always trying to brainwash their own people with lies.
But I have to note that Putin was one of the best leaders for Russia since a long time in history. Let see what we will have with Medvedev. I wish if America will have someone like George Washington or Abraham Lincoln again.

America lost their chance to become Russian friend in 90's. Russian people after communist era were so happy to see American people, freedom and springs of democracy and we thought America is our friend now. But actually American politics planned to finish Russian economics completely at that time. And they did it almost successfully. Now people realized that and now it is difficult to trust again.

But, being born in Russia, living in US for 2 years, and returning back to homeland I can say: do not mix Russian government and Russians and do not mix US government with American people. Both Russians and Americans are nice people with some cultural differences, but with the same life goals and values.

After all this oil wars I now start to think again about things that private property on gas and oil is evil. Imaging all the people sharing all the oil on earth and taking as much as they need? Sounds like Beatles. Or like Lenin? Actually Lenin was paid by German army headquarters according to new historical investigations. And during Revolution there were no Russian sailors taking Winter Palace, the residency of Russian Tsars, but they were masked Finnish chasseurs (some sort of commandos) paid by Germany again. But this is different story…

I feel big sorrow towards Georgian people now. But I pretty sure that Russia is not going to take Tbilisi. I think Georgian people will require the impeachment for their president and Russia will withdraw its forces after that.

I hope the russians cut the oil pipeline, if only just to see Bush and Cheney shit their pants live on TV, like their Georgian puppet Sackoshitli is doing...hahahaha

Mikheil "Lyin McHell" Sack-o-shit-li — A US Trained and funded LAWYER & PUPPET...no freakin doubt.

"The goal of this operation is regime change in Georgia."

Saakashvili then abruptly ended his conference call with reporters, saying, "We have to go to the shelter because there are Russian planes flying over the presidential palace here, sorry."

In an op-ed piece in Monday's Wall Street Journal, Saakashvili argued that the conflict is about "the future of freedom in Europe."

If Russia succeeds, Saakashvili said, it would mark the end of Western influence on any of the former Soviet republics.

"It is clear that Russia's current leadership is bent on restoring a neocolonial form of control over the entire space once governed by Moscow," he wrote.

The long-running separatist disputes, however, are just a pretext for Russia's aggression, he argued.

"Yet in reality, it is a war about the independence and the future of Georgia," he wrote. "And above all, it is a war over the kind of Europe our children will live in. Let us be frank: This conflict is about the future of freedom in Europe."

Georgia, he said, has "worked hard to peacefully bring Abkhazia and South Ossetia back into the Georgian fold, on terms that would fully protect the rights and interests of the residents of these territories." (BY MURDERING THEM I GUESS)

At stake, he argued, is much more than Georgia's future.

"If Georgia falls, this will also mean the fall of the West in the entire former Soviet Union and beyond," he wrote. "Leaders in neighboring states -- whether in Ukraine, in other Caucasian states or in Central Asia -- will have to consider whether the price of freedom and independence is indeed too high."

WE HAVE TO CONSIDER IF MCHELL SACKOSHITLI IS GETING TOO HIGH FROM SNIFFING GEORGE BUSH'S ASS???

By John Helmer in Moscow

One word explains why the United States, NATO and the European Union have obliged themselves to sit on their hands, while Russia's defends its citizens, and national interest in the Caucasus, and liberates Georgians from the folly of their unpopular president, Mikheil Saakashvili — Kosovo.

Eight hundred years of Caucasian history explain why Saakashvili has brought such destruction and ignominy on his countrymen over this past week. Queen Tamar, the greatest of the Georgian sovereigns (1184-1213), is responsible for the habit Georgian rulers have displayed for the past millennium of treating neighbouring Armenia, Azerbaijan, Ossetia, and the Black Sea coast of Turkey as protectorates. But as Tamar also taught her countrymen, Georgian ambition always runs out of gas when the neighbours prove to be just as ambitious, richer, or tougher.

The number 300 explains what tougher means — that's the count of Russian artillery pieces that have been deployed to South Ossetia alone, once Saakashvili despatched his US and Israel-trained troops into action at Tskhinvali, capital of South Ossetia. That push, according to Russian military thinking, was not intended to hold Tskhinvali for Georgia, but to destroy it, and withdraw swiftly back into Georgia — ending the South Ossetian secession by liquidating its people.

Just how tough Russia's war aims are now — as distinct from the methods –remains to be seen. According to Georgian sources, there is no safe haven for the attackers in Georgia itself, as Russian artillery pounds Georgian military units within range; the Russian Air Force bombs every military uit and depot on Georgian territory; and the Russian Black Sea Fleet counter-fires against Georgian naval vessels off Ochamchire, the Abkhazian regional port.

For all Russians, not only those with relatives in Ossetia, the near-total destruction by Georgian guns of Tskhinvali is a war crime. The deaths of about 2,000 civilians in the Georgian attack, and the forced flight of about 35,000 survivors from the town — the last census of Tskhinvali's population reported 30,000 — has been described by Russian leaders, and is understood by Russian public opinion, as a form of genocide. Ninety percent of the town's population are Russian citizens. To Russians, the Georgian attack of August 8 looks like the very same "ethnic cleansing", which the US and European powers have treated as a crime against humanity, when committed on the former territory of federal Yugoslavia.

But Russians view the international war that broke up Yugoslavia as a practice run for breaking up the Russian Caucasus, first by arming the Chechen secessionist Dzhokar Dudayev; then by financing anti-Russian terrorism in the russian provinces of Chechnya and Ingushetia; and now by the Georgian military thrust against Ossetia. Since the US and the European Union have so recently compelled Serbia to accept the Albanian takeover of Serbia's Kosovo province, the overwhelming Russian view is that this will not be allowed to happen again. "Ossetia is not Kosovo" is a widespread refrain in Moscow today.

"If [Yugoslav president] Slobodan Milosevic should be put on trial, the opinion here is — so too should Saakashvili," says a leading Moscow analyst.

But is it now a Russian war aim to drive Saakashvili from power? Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov reportedly told US Secretary of State Condoleeza Rice over the weekend that Saakashvili "must go". Bernard Kouchner, the French Foreign Minister on a mediation mission Monday between the Georgian and Russian capitals, will hear the same view in Moscow.

The Russian argument is that, since coming to power in 2003, Saakashvili has militarized his country with US, NATO and Israeli arms, military training, and money, for no purpose except to threaten Russia, and the minority nationalities of the region, who seek the protection of Moscow — the Abkhazians and the Ossetians. Saakashvili, the Russian argument runs, has initiated military escalation over the past year, because his political base has cracked, and his domestic support is dwindling. The Georgian political opposition at home, and in exile abroad, agrees. They charge the president and his family, including the powerful Timur Alasaniya, Saakashvili's uncle, of growing corruptly rich off the arms trade, and of seizing the country's resource, port and trading concessions for themselves and their supporters. Alasaniya, brother to Saakashvili's mother, holds the official position of Georgian representative to a United Nations Commission on Disarmament in New York (no relation to Irakly Alasaniya, Georgia's Ambassador to the UN).

The leaders of the Georgian opposition nearly succeeded in toppling Saakashvili last autumn. The president was forced to impose military rule in Tbilisi, while his former defence minister, Irakly Okruashvili, publicly accused him of murder and corruption. Okruashvili is currently in Paris, where he has been granted political asylum by the French government. In June, a French court rejected Saakashvili's warrant for the arrest and extradition of his former friend and now bitterest critic. Okruashvili is uncompromised by early career links to Moscow, unlike a number of political party leaders in Tbilisi. Okruashvili is a likely candidate to replace Saakashvili, if and when Georgian public opinion turns against the president.

But this cannot happen while Russian military operations continue against Georgian targets. Leading opposition figures inside the country, like Shalva Natelashvili, head of the Georgian Labour Party, believe they must remain silent for the time being. According to Irakly Kakabadze, an independent opposition organizer based in New York, "once the bombing stops, I believe Saakashvili will not survive." In the spring, Kakabadze was arrested and imprisoned in Tbilisi by Saakashvili security men trying to disrupt a street protest against the president's regime.

Public opinion in Georgia is already pinning the blame on Saakashvili for the folly and loss of the Ossetian adventure. Even before it began last week, the opposition leaders were calling for an end to the militarization of the country. However, as one opposition leader said today, the bombing has to stop — "otherwise, the Russians are making Saakashvili the victim".

The problem for Russians is that halting the military campaign doesn't put a stop to Saakashvili's menaces. Nor is there any confidence in Moscow, on either side of the Kremlin wall, that Rice and Kouchner can be trusted to control Saakashvili, even if they promise to do so.

If a ceasefire is agreed this week, Georgians and Russians might then be able to agree that Saakashvili bears personal responsibility for the war that began on August 8. However, neither Saakashvili's domestic critics, nor the Russian government, expect the Americans to abandon their man now — let alone escort him to the war crimes tribunal at The Hague.

With the Georgian presidential alternative Okruashvili under their wing in Paris, what the French do next may be able to bridge the gap which Saakashvili's artillery tore apart last Friday.

by John Helmer - Sunday, August 10th, 2008

Putin's comments reflected Russia's growing irritation with Western condemnation.

"The scale of their cynicism causes surprise," Putin said. "It's the ability to cast white as black and black as white which is surprising, the ability to cast the aggressor as the victim and blame the victims for the consequences."

Putin remarks also reflected deep anger at Georgia's President Mikhail Saakashvili.

"Of course, Saddam Hussein ought to have been hanged for destroying several Shiite villages," Putin said. "And the incumbent Georgian leaders who razed ten Ossetian villages at once, who ran over elderly people and children with tanks, who burned civilians alive in their sheds — these leaders must be taken under protection."

hehehe..suck on that one, Bushie!!!

In response to the Russian retaliatory invasion of Georgoia , Junior Bush announced today that he is ok with them occupying FDRs house in Warm springs, and the Jimmy Carter site in Great Plains, but to keep their hands off of The World of Coca-Cola, and the Okefenokee Swamp!!...Bush said he will defend Pogo's Homeland to the death!!

So Georgia was invading a sourthern province that had become independant 15 years ago...

And then they are upset that the Russians are now doing the same thing to them?

If they have a right to re-annex the southern province by force, then does Russia not have the right to re-annex them by force?

I have the image of a kid in grade 4 extorting a dollar from a kid in grade 2...but then complaining to the teacher when the grade six bully comes and extorts $10 from him!

Anyway, I am not saying Russia is really in the right...just that as is typical, there is no real "good guy" here.

They should have known that this attack would generate a Russian response...almost makes me wonder if GWB might not want this in order to distract Russia so that he can deal with Iran.

Scary.

Jaguara

AD wonders where all the saber rattling war mongers come from on this site...
They're the nasty other side of the Neo-Con coin. They are Zion-libs who promote 'humanitarian intervention' just as long as someone else's son or daughter has to do the fighting. They would have us driving tanks into Iran, Sudan, Burma, Tibet and Chechnya. They are still celebrating the victory of the Kosovo Liberation Army (thanks to the unrelenting bombing of Belgrade) and the subsequent ethnic cleansing of hundreds of thousands of Kosovo Serbs, Roma, Bosniaks and other non-Albanians in Kosovo. They will come back into their own with an Obama victory - expanding new imperialist wars for liberal values!

AND WHAT THE HELL IS RUSSIA DOING NOW SENDIN IN THE GOD DAMN ROOSIDE NAVY? GEORGIA OFFERED AND WAS HONORIDNG A CEASE FIRE!
GET THE FUCKING UN IN NOW! GET THE FUCKING EU IN NOW GET THE FUCKING NATO IN NOW LOADED LOCKED READY TO ROCK! THAT IS A FUCKING ORDER! AS I FUCKING SAID BEFORE SEALL THE FUICKING RUSSIAN EMBASSY EXPELL THE FUCKING STAFF RECALL OUR FUCKING STAFF FROM FUCKING RUSSIA THIS IS FOR REAL FUCKING ASS GOD DAMN DEAL WORLD FUCKING WAR THREE!

Vladimir the Impailer ........hhhhhmmm sounds like Russia demonized herself

http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/6996/serbogeorgiansgj1.jpg

serbio georgian flags

Where do all these neo cons who have this weird notion of Uncle Sam as some kind of tin damn god come from. This is supposed to be a progressive web site, not a hate Russia/restart the Cold War nut case discussion group. Give me a damn break! Do read Counter Punch take on all these damn lies about and demonization of Moscow, which are so full of that that flushing down the toilet would probably be too good for it.

Don't fall for all of the Neocon propaganda supporting Saakashvili. He is a corrupt, right-wing, thug who was installed in power via a CIA ("NED") organized coup: http://www.workers.org/2007/world/georgia-1122/index.html

remember oceania, eastasia, eurasia...

russian encroachment into georgia achieves numerous objectives...

- it sends a clear message to breakaway soviet satellites that they still are in the russian sphere of influence. don't contemplate participating in the imperial alliance NATO or else...

- it reaffirms putin's role as a leader (military leaders always glow) notice we haven't heard much from putin's replacement (dmitry medvedev).

- it reaffirms the internal russian power of russian oil/natural gas interests moguls.

- it directly checks the europeans who are dependent on russia's natural resources. it trivializes the US support for georgia.

- it indirectly lends credibility to russian support for the serbian nationalists on trial in the hague for the atrocities committed in the former yugoslavia. the military aggression de-legitimizes the role of the UN and the ICC (international court).

if there were problems w/ ethnic cleansing in ossetia. the issue should have been addressed in the international court. russia (like the united states and china) frequently violates human rights.

unilateral military action against georgia implies russia also is above the rules (like china in tibet, like the US in iraq). strength/power determine the outcome of geopolitical crises - not diplomacy and the rule of law. superpowers, b/c of their nuclear arsenals and security council membership are exempt from the rules they impose upon the rest of the earthlings.

- the action against georgia gives russian troops valuable experience fighting a real war (more valuable than war exercises). hitler's invasion of poland gave his army an advantage. US/nato troops have 6 years of experience waging war in afghanastan and iraq.

- the russian action was timed to coincide w/ the opening of the beijing olympics further demonstrating the world's inability to respond to imperial aggression around the world. russia's actions occurred as world leaders (bush,hu jiantao) were convened in the same location.

- finally a russian presence in georgia moves their military power closer to the real battleground, iran. russia wants a relationship w/ iran (providing nuclear technology). iran is the domino wedged between the three powers (remember 1984, oceania, eurasia,eastasia) US/europe - china - russia. whoever controls this region controls the world's energy (a russian response to the goals of the project for a new american century).

a few headlines from this mornings azerbiajan news service today (azerbiajan between georgia and iran on the caspian sea)

http://www.azerbaijannews.net/index.php

.. Azerbaijan Airlines orders four Boeing planes
.. Azerbaijan Halts Oil Exports Via Georgian Ports
.. Chinese president hosts breakfast for leaders from Central Asia and Transcaucasia

the last story was a link from the people's daily online

"Chinese president hosts breakfast for leaders from Central Asia and Transcaucasia
10:00, August 09, 2008….

Calling them old friends of China, Hu extended his warm welcome and thanked them for helping with the Beijing Olympics.

These countries are all traditional friends of China, and have been building mutual political trust and scored remarkable results in the cooperation in security, humanitarianism, economy and trade, and energy, Hu said.

"China values the traditional friendship with the five countries and is ready to raise bilateral relations to higher levels," the Chinese president said."

russia's (gazproms) actions just moved us one step closer to armageddon (the final battle of the energy war waged by national armies on behalf of bp, gazprom, exxon-mobil, shell)...

...peace...

Latest news now in! Russia wants to occupy/destroy Georgia by any means necessary!

For Russia is upset that Georgia wants to join NATO while not accepting the fact that Georgia is an independent sovereign nation now and wants to kill their separatists - in which Russia grants sympathy to! Boo-hoo-hoo Russia! I am almost certain that most human beings would want Russia to exercise some restraint; but, it is foolish for Georgia to ever desire such a thing! For although Georgia is an independent nation (as of ONLY 18 years now) since the Soviet Union collapse...Georgia should have known better! Yet, Russia should have demonstrated some restraint. We are talking about Russia here CD! Tommorow, or at any moment in the future, Russia has the military might to see to it that there is no Georgian left in existence! Let us understand, as the ultra-left community most of us are, what Russia is capable of! Russia has the power to do this. Russia needs to accept the fact that Georgia no longer belongs to them! Russia need to be mature enough to understand this fact - dfespite being the powerful nation that they are.

ALL the lip-service by the USA Government on this matter? Yes it is merely lip-service! What can the International community do? NOTHING! After all, we are talking about Russia are we not? Besides, Russia can turn around and say something to the International community something like, "why can not us go into Georgia but it is fine for the USA to go into Iraq?"

An American-educated thug named Saakashvili (dual citizen - no less) sends American-trained and American-supplied troops into Southern Ossetia killing hundreds of civilians and leveling an entire city. He's our thug and he wants to start a World War. Hey, guys, line up...we need a Neo-Con Abraham Lincoln Brigade of 'humanitarian interventionist' warriors to save poor old Georgia! In fact given our fellow compatriots' prowess at geography, most Americans probably think the Russians are entering Atlanta! World War, anyone?

WE need to think about something bigger than our economic meltdown!

A modern blitzkrieg war in which media PR and propaganda will have more global impact than shells, bombs, and rockets:

Reuters/Thompson headline reports,

"Russia and Georgia wage PR battle for hearts and minds"

http://uk.reuters.com/article/oilRpt/idUKLA53600320080810?sp=true

Russia probably has more media guns than little Georgia --- but in the global arena, no body out-guns the global corporatist Empire, which owns and controls all global media and information flow to the masses of the world.

Seems that some people recognize this conflict of empires for what it is:

VLAD, FROM SIBERIA

"It's all politics, they are just trying to divide the world again.

Russia is trying to get strong again, it is using this war to show how powerful it is.

Russia says it goes to defend its people but it's not about independence for some little country, it is about dividing the world again.

War is always wrong, people just want to live in peace."

Hopefully, the 2008 election will be a chance (perhaps the last chance) for Americans to vote for democracy and reject Empire. "It's the Empire, stupid".

Vlad, accurately said, "War is always wrong" --- and so is Empire always wrong.

Whether the ruling elitist empire is a traditional, thinly disguised, nationalist based empire (like most 19th and 20th century old empires), or this most modern 21st century global corporatist Empire, which emanates from the US, but has metastasized beyond the era of nation-states and nationalism, and is now global and corporate in scale, scope, and power.

Empire is always elitist.

Empire is always anti-democratic.

Empire is always economically oppressive.

Empire always causes wars.

Vote for political economic democracy. Only American citizens at the center of this new era of global corporatist Empire still have the voting power to non-violently confront and excise this new global corporatist era of Empire.

All the European developed peoples have rejected their empires, as have Japanese and Russian people (though Russian people may have to re-validate their choice against the old nationalist empire lies).

But the rest of the people of the world will not jump out of the frying pan of old nationalist empires only to be fooled again and jump into the fire by the slicker global corporatist Empire, that promises to be beyond nationalism, but only continues the inequality and oppression of empire now on a global corporate level.

Only Americans in 2008 can lead the way by rejecting empire and voting for full political/economic democracy and peace.

"At an emergency session of the United Nations on Thursday night, Russia failed to push through a statement that would have called on both sides to stop fighting immediately.

Council diplomats said a phrase calling on all sides to "renounce the use of force" had been unacceptable to the Georgians, backed by the United States and the Europeans."

Can you imagine Cuba allowing Russian missiles to be place in their country and .......

Oh' that's right we don't have to imagine what might happen when one super power attempts to intimidate another though a border country.

Are we to be surprised that the West would find the phrase
"renounce the use of force" to be unacceptable?

alexnosal (#1), you started off these forum posts exactly right.

This is imperialism with a thin humanitarian patina.

The global corporatist Empire, which is centered in the US and has totally taken over our government by hiding behind this two=party facade of a 'vichy' government, will probably prevail against the more traditional naked and nationalist empire of the resurgent Russian Empire.

The newer 21st century global corporatist Empire will likely win out over the older 19th/20th century style nationalist based empire.

The corporatist Empire's PR (propaganda) of "freedom agendas" and "democracy projects" are simply a better marketing and advertising campaign than the old nationalist empire promises of more land, resources, power, etc as war-booty for "our people", "our fatherland", etc.

Simply more modern and powerful PR -- not more honest. Because in the case of all empires, the old nationalist style empires, like British, German/Nazi, and Soviet, as well as this newest, evolving global corporatist Empire style, the ultimate truth of all empires is that the 'economics of empire' is based on ruling elite power and wealth --- not anything to do with benefits to the masses.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_alan_mac_070319__22economics_of_empire.htm

Workreno - Orwellian/Huxleyan dictatorship? Possibly.

Maybe for a little while. At least until world oil production drops below 50% inn 2015 as predicted by OECD and Britain's Chatham House.

Then things will get very quiet.

31407ladygodiva August 9th, 2008 10:38 pm

Are you taking your medication?

As many have already stated here this is all part of Z. Brezinski and the Globalists plans to turn the world into a Orwellian/Huxleyian Elite Dictatorship.

There are Brezinski men in both Obomba and McSame puppet shows.

31407LadyGodiva - The moment that the US gets officially involved in trying to drive the Russian forces out of Georgia (as Bush put it 'a sovereign, independent nation'... and he would know what it means to preemptively invade and occupy a sovereign nation or two), I hope you are ready to respond to the Russian ICBM delivered thermonuclear device that will likely detonate somewhere in your neighborhood...

Bush is responsible for the deaths of 1.2 MILLION Iraqis, and the displacement of 4 MILLION more. Not to mention the criminally vast increase in depositing Depleted Uranium on Iraq in the form of artillery shells. Depleted uranium is , and has been since the first Iraq War, causing massive fatal birth defects in the Iraqi population. These effects will last for some several million years.

There is also the matter of using White Phosphorus munitions on civilian populations in Iraq, an act of chemical warfare banned by the Geneva Conventions.

In whole, the US and the Bush Administration have been committing War Crimes and Crimes Against Humanity for the past SEVEN YEARS!

So don't point out the mote in Putin's eye without first removing the 10 X 10 support beam in Bush's.

RUSSIA IS COMMITING WAR CRIMES IN SOUTH OSSETIA!

THE UNITED STATES SHOULD SEVER ALL RELATIONS WITH RUSSIA IMMEDIATELY

CLOSE AND BOLT THE DOOR OF THE RUSSIAN EMBASSY IN WASHINGTON! EXPEL ALL RUSSIAN DIPLOMATS TO THE UNTIED STATES! RECALL ALL ENVOYS TO MOSCOW!

From:@comcast.net
[Add to Address Book]

To:withheld@un.org, withheld@europarl.europa.eu, withheld@hq.nato.int
BCC:withheld@withheld.xxx
Subject:Please forward if necessary, to th e applicable eschelon of your noteworthy organization
Date:Saturday, August 09, 2008 10:37:16 PM
[View Source]

To whom it may concern,
I, A Concerned American Citizen, Hereby appeal to the Untied Nations, The European union
and The North Atlantic Treaty Organation, That (A) - A United WOrld Nary, Army And Air Force Be Formed
in light of the Russo Georgian COnflict, and that (B) - this force, combined with the Armed Forces of Europe and Nato
be Deployed to the Former Soviet REpublic of Georgia IN THE DEFENSE of that republic to halt the illegal war attrosities being currently perpetrated
by the war criminal President of Russia, Vladimir Putin. Putin, Showing a disregard for Human Life similar to his Communist Predecessors, AS WELL AS Adolf Hitler
is breaking faith with his immediate prede3cessor BOris Yeltsin, of kind memories.
The UN, NATO and Europe must unite with any and all Military and Ballistic force necessary to put Putins attrosities to a swist and immediate end. Thank you, A COncerned American Citizen.

Sung425,

As far as I know, Brezinski is still an adviser to Obama on foreign affairs.

A 72 year old lady,

Good comments. I wish 27 year olds showed an interest in these things.

The Jakarta Times just reported that the Caspian Sea end of the Georgian oil pipeline was bombed by Russian warplanes.

With the bombing of the turkish end, and now news that the Caspian Sea terminal is heavily damaged, this means an end for the time being of the limited Caspian Sea oil supply to Europe, Asia and the US. And that makes control of the Straights of Hormuz even more critical. So I guess we now know why two more aircraft carrier battle groups are heading for that region.

Any bets that Iran is now firmly in the cross-hairs?

i am very impressed with what i read so far; how well informed you are. Here is my comment: the USA is operating as a third world country with nuclear weapons. USA has no money and owes everybody; in a desperate situation the US will not hesitate to use nuclear weapons; she will never
accept second place; the neocons have spent all the money in preventive wars without success; NATO will start losing member nations to do US dirty work; mercenary armies right now will not work for a worthless dollar.
We have a very difficult future, we are facing the last breaths of a very sick patient. Let us start thinking of ways to remove the feeding tubes.May
i recommend reading RIA NOVOSTI and ASIA TIMES?
Thank you for reading my comment.

As someone who has travelled extensively in Georgia over the past twelve years, I disagree with alot of the "informaton" being posted here by well-meaning but stay-at-home Americans. The Russians cleverly call their troops 'peacekeepers', let's wake up to doublespeak, its practised more widley than just CNN. Its child's play to stir up a nationalist feeling,even for and you only need a handfull of disgruntled folks who have no work and could more easily leave Georgia with a Russian passport than a georgian one. The law is that you must give up Georgian citizenship to accept another passport, there is no double nationality for Georgians, a sign of their pride and hence their tendancy towards nationalist feelings, even for a region of 70,000 people but does that make a nation ? Let's look at Abkhazia, the Russians have been issuing passports to anyone who wants one. Besides the fact that Georgians hat's illegal

I think rather then Oil, the dominance of this region is related more to Natural Gas. While there as not been as much oil found as comapnies had hoped, there are tremendous Natural gas reserves in the region.

Russia has been using GAZPROM to all but build up a cartel. The EU will be totally reliant on Russia for its own supplies of natural Gas.

The US had hopes of building gas pipelines through the area going through Afghanistan (Unocal and we will bomb you into the stone age unless you allow this gas pipeline..this BEFORE sept 11) which would allow the US to control another source.

The EU might well be expanding NATO but they are tied more and more to the Russians.

Brezinki indicated in the Grand Chessboard strategy that unless the US dominated the caspian basin, thus by extenion Africa, Asia and Europe, it would become a periphery state.

75 percent of the worlds population and resources are in this mega region and The Caspian is key.

"Z. Brezinski's "Grand Chessboard Strategy" is real and the game has begun." Thanks peaceman. I tried to post last evening on the very same subject. And isn't Brezinski on the Obama team as his foreign advisor?

AD: What in the hell has any white person done to you! Get a job and shut up!

alexnosal: Your comment is perfect and true!

All reasons for warring bullshit, now and throughout history, come down to one thing; guys just like to fight.

Z. Brezinski's "Grand Chessboard Strategy" is real and the game has begun, but possibly not to his liking. After the humiliating years of the Yeltsin/Soros years of carpetbagging and privatization, V. Putin restored Russian pride and has been instrumental in rebuilding their economy and negotiating alliances both economically and militarily in the region. As REBEL FARMER stated above, the Russian people do love him and he will do whatever it takes to defend the country. The Shanghai Cooperative Organization is the equivalent of NATO with Russia and China the key members. China also has ICBM's with hydrogen and atomic warheads that could land anywhere in the United States if push comes to shove.

Oil, natural gas, and minerals are finite and will be fought for by the imperialists, money lenders and the American Empire which will eventually be defeated in spite of the having the most powerful military force in human history. As some of you have said above, Europe should stand with Russia instead of being America's flunky. The whole world has been set back by the US "mortgage/banking crisis" so why should they continue in subservience to US demands? The people of Ireland get the gold medal for refusing to sign the accord several months ago on granting the EU more power than it needs.

Sadly, as I type, how many more people will be killed or maimed? Militaries in EVERY country on this planet must be eventually dismantled if humans ever want to establish a true brotherhood of people. We are long overdue to take up the pen and plowshare and not the sword .

Russia needs to understand that Georgia no longer belongs to them - that Georgia is an independent nation now. That Georgia wants to join NATO (Personally, I would not recommend that) is the business of the Georgia Government and not of Russia. Both scenarios seem difficult for Moscow, but it is a reality Russia needs to accept. Georgia should just order the people of South Ossetia to leave and go live in Russia if this is how the people of South Ossetia truly feel.

There should be cease-fire, if only for the Olympics going on.

I was in no way in my earlier posts seeking to canonize Moscow, but I would go back to Lord Action's words, "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely." That certainly held true of the USA when it became the sole international super power and completely corrupted by its power. With more of a balance of power retuning internationally, and the more the better, in this case with Moscow getting back to being an international super power, this gives hope for restoring more balance in international relations.

Armed Cossacks pour in to fight Georgians -
I wonder what they will do with any captured US 'advisers.' Treat them as 'unlawful combatants' just like George and Dick do at GITMO?

Source: Reuters
RUSSIAN FOREIGN MINISTRY ACCUSES UKRAINE OF "ENCOURAGING" GEORGIA TO CARRY OUT "ETHNIC CLEANSING" IN SOUTH OSSETIA BY PROVIDING ARMS

Maybe the Russian Bear will retake both Georgia and Ukraine.

Heckovajob, George, heckovajob!

Saakashvili attacked on the 7th day of the month under cover of a truce - a day of infamy?

"In Tskhinvali, the South Ossetian leader, Eduard Kokoity, claimed 1,400 civilians had been killed. There was no independent confirmation of his assertion, but witnesses said the city was devastated."

If it really is 1,400 civilians, that's two percent of the Russian population, then I doubt Russia will stand down soon. They might just go all the way to the Turkish border.

kendpotter: "they are having to pay for the sins of their fathers"

Those ready to accept privilege inherited from their fathers should be ready to shoulder responsibility for the sins of their fathers.

karlof: "they are totally dependant on Russia for current and future energy supplies"

Europe can fully supply its own electricity on 1% of its land area. Biofuels on another 8%. Is this too much land to dedicate to energy? The USA dedicates 20% of its land area to meat/dairy. So why should Europe let the warmongers drag it into world war over fossil fuels?

Just read elsewhere that the remaining Georgian oil pipeline has suffered an explosion in Turkey, and will be down for the count for at least two weeks... any bets the price of oil starts going up on Monday?

Too bad the Caspian Sea oil deposits (the real reason the US, Canada, and NATO are in Afghanistan. Just look at the map of where the bases are. They follow the abandoned UNOCAL proposed pipeline route) are more dry hole than oil. But Bush is VERY familiar with the whole 'dry hole' drilling method...

"Saakashvili, a U.S.-educated lawyer (Columbia Law School & George Washington University), came to power in 2003 backed by the U.S.

Most of the 70,000 South Ossetian residents hold Russian passports.

Georgia is a key link in a U.S.-backed "southern energy corridor" that connects the Caspian Sea region with world markets, bypassing Russia. The BP Plc-led Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan oil pipeline to Turkey runs about 100 kilometers (60 miles) south of the South Ossetian capital, Tskhinvali."

This looks like Cheney's Oily Cabal has been at work for some time.

Ditto McCane
WASHINGTON— John McCain's top foreign policy adviser, Randall Scheunemann, lobbied for the nation of Georgia for four years, including for about a year after he joined the Republican senator's presidential campaign staff in early 2007.

Ever since Sherman marched into Savannah, those Georgian rebels have been holdin a mighty grudge. Now look at what they done, stirred things up so much the Russians had to get called in to settle em down a bit, Russians for crimean sake! Bush's so damn busy pretendin he's Alexander and marchin off towards Persia that he's gunna end up loosin Athens.

Karloff1 - Hey back at ya. And yes, I did see that Bond(age) flick.

Reb- There is a major concentration of US/UK naval firepower building in the Persian Gulf. It should be ready to go by next week. And Israel said last week they were ready to launch an 'independent' pre-emptive airstrike against the Iranian nuclear reactor sites.

Most of the chatter I am reading on a number of sites says the game is on, and August is the month.

This has been a very informative discussion. Thanks all!

Galen, I think August is a little soon. I don't think that is enough time to get all the war machines in place. But I do agree, that this is going to be THE big one. And I think there are going to be war fronts all over the world. Here is my target list.

Venezuela coastline, Iran of course, something along the Russian border where the US is trying to put missiles (Poland?), and somewhere that will really piss the Chinese off and provoke a confrontation.

Bush and the EU have been going around poking a lot of nations in the eyes for several years. Especially Russia. And I think that Putin is going to make a very formidable and ruthless adversary. And his people love him because he truly loves Russia. And he will always protect Russia, no matter the means.

One thing that bothers me though. It is clear that we are reaching the tipping point of worldwide financial collapse. I don't know what inning we are in, but I know that the rich filth are behind all this. And they are going to have all their ducks in a row before they let the world explode into The Earths LAST War. I just don't know where they want their ducks. This club is euro centric. And I don't think Russia, China, So. America, or Africa have been allowed to be members of this rich filth club. That's the reason they have to be disabled. I also don't think Russia will ever be subjugated or disabled. I truly believe that they will blow up the planet rather than be serfs to the rich filth.

So, there you have it. The World According to the Rebel Farmer. Pretty dam* scary......

Courtesy of the Red White and Blue.

This is amazing. This is a huge story that I am seeking more information about. But all I can find on all for networks is John Edwards' affair. Jesus christ, this guy isn't even a Senator anymore, he's a former Senator. Who gives a crap!

The peceeding wasn't a full fledged endorcement of Moscow, but for now Moscow is standing up for the little guys getting pushed around.

The USA as it was in 1776 is fighting for slavery and calling freedom, as it kept slavery about 85 years after its fight for "freedom" in the 1770s and 1780s. The USA is for freedom for the rich white man to keep the rest of us in slavery. Let's stand up freedom and Moscow.

I'm thankful today Moscow has a first strike policy on nuclear weapons, and would love to see them use on the bad guy's military in Georgia. Appeasement of fascism has never worked.

I stand by my damn statement that Reuters is putting out a pack of lies, and much of the British press especially the Guardian/Observer did the same damn thing over the Balkans crisis and the BBC faked footage to bring US intervention in the Balkans. I know what I'm a talking about as I covered Balkans crisis as a real independent journalist, Mr Hot Air Maestro.

Georgias president is our lackey that we helped get into power, and a Harvard University graduate. The timing of Georgias invasion suggests the invisible hand that wants to start a war with Russia is at work and not waiting for the elections that will put Brzezinski in power (Gates is a Brzezinski man and will likely continue on as SOD under Obama).

Republicans give us the little wars, Dems give us the big ones. This has been true for over 100 years. Lets see what happens in China and surrounding territories these next couple of weeks.

Where are all the Free-Tibet bumpkins? South Ossetia desires independence from Georgia. Shouldn't Russia be supported?

"From The Times
August 9, 2008

Georgia's fait accompli failed
-Matthew Clements: Analysis

Georgia's main aim in its offensive in South Ossetia appears to have been a swift advance on the separatist capital Tskhinvali to seize Ossetian territory and achieve a fait accompli before Russia is able to respond."

Yet another Pentagram blunder???

Please look at Wordsofpeace.org for a free DVD about it. And Contactinfo.net. Also Peace is Possible by Andrea Cagan. It is an excellent bio. with 400 pgs. and 90 pictures of the last 50yrs from events on the most important things in Life. The Prem Rawat Tribute website is also excellent with audio samples to listen to. Thank you. Byam

Put your comment and URL link in with an underline instead of a . such as www_PaulKemp_info and readers will edit the link in the browser bar.
www.PaulKemp.ca

Hi Galen--Remember the Bond flick, The World is Not Enough? Anybody? I suggest you rent it as it's one of the most honest Bond films ever made, and covers the topic at issue.

If it wasn't clear, Russification happened both before and during the USSR's life. Indeed, it was doing nothing more than following an old Tsarist policy. In fact, a lot of what the USSR did were extensions and modifications of former Tsarist policies.

Georgia is the doorstep of the remaining Caucaus oil fields. If the pipeline out of this troubled region via Turkey is severed, that will make control of the Persian Gulf and the Straights of Hormuz that much more critical.

At the same time the US is moving two more aircraft carrier battle groups into the area, at the same time that Israel has all but announced it's intention to start bombing the disputed Iranian nuclear facilities.

News of this is all over the CBC and BBC, as well as the major European and Asian news services.

And the OECD has announced that it expects oil prices to jump to levels in excess of $200/bbl in light of drastically falling world oil production within 7 - 10 years, with 2015 being the time when world oil production is expected to drop 50%.

But in the US, the news is being dominated by the latest politician 'sex scandal'.

War for the control of the remaining large oil reserves will be starting soon, and I will be amazed if we make it through August without a war on Iran starting.

Gee--I was able to post that comment!

To get the map for yourself, you'll need to go to the CD mainpage; scroll down until you see "Tools" on the left. Click maps. On the lefthand menu, click Russia/Republics. Scroll down to Soviet Union--Administrative Divisions 1989 (422K) and click. Now, with that up in one window, you can read what follows:

Back when I was studying the meltdown and breakup of the USSR and the further travails of Russia in the early 1990s, I read Soviet Disunion: A History of the Nationalities Problem, and I was alerted to the Abkazians, Ossetians, Chechens, and many others. The reason Chechnya was termed a "breakaway republic," is because that's what it was, an ASSR. It wasn't "eligible" for independece as were the SSRs, like Ukraine, Georgia, Latvia, etc. What everyone needs is a good map. There you will see that Abkazskaya is an ASSR within the Georgia SSR, whereas Yugo-Osetinskaya is an Autonomous Oblast within Georgia. These administrative divisions had special meanings within the USSR's government that included particular levels of autonomy from the "parent" statelet/SSR. For example, the Abkazians declined to join the newly independent state of Georgia from the outset. The Ossetian question is far more complex and is tied up with the war agaisnt the Chechens. As the regions name--South Ossetia--implies, there is a North Ossetia, too--Severo-Osetinskaya--which would like to combine into one province within Russia.

Upon perusing a list of books published recently about the Caucasus, I'm not too surprised at the vast expansion of attention its garnered since 1991. When I did my research, I had access to a very good university library that had most of the then extant books published in English, and a few in Russian, about the region, mnost of whom I read. There are easily ten times that number now available. If I had to do it now, I would choose the older publications first, especially those detailing how Russia came into possession of the region and studies of its peoples. Then I would carefully screen the newer publications for objectivity and use those without a clear bias. And all the while, I would have a good map.

Yes, Russification was the name of the policy and it occurred throughout the USSR, in much the same way the WASPs settled the USA. Regarding the conflict between the newly independent states and Russia over the treatment of Russian nationals, that erupted immediately and Yeltsin was very much the bulldog--not Putin. And it should be clear by now that Putin doesn't have "lackeys," whereas it was quite clear that Yeltsin did, and that they were foisted on him by Clinton and the West.

Now lets see if this comment will be allowed.

I tried to post a very good map of the former USSR that shows its administrative divisions which will help folks understand a few things. BUT, the comment software will not allow it--AGAIN!!!!!

test--Word Press clearly sucks. It won't allow imbedded hyperlinks anymore and nukes your comment if you try.

I wonder if our Great White Benefactor (GWB) is behind Georgia's assault on the people of South Ossetia. Thousands are already dead.

VLADIKAVKAZ, August 8 (Itar-Tass) -- Georgian tanks are burning all round Tskhinvali, Ossetian peacekeeping battalion commander Kazbek Friyev said by phone.

As written by Stilba, "Russians are very sensitive to the small former-Soviet countries that surround it, from the Baltic to the Balkans, that are basically trying to ethnically cleanse Russians from their realms in order to be more of a "nation.""

I don't know about all the former SSR's but I do know that it was Soviet policy to 'settle' Baltic states with reliable Soviet families. "Russification" it was termed. It was coupled with "transportation" of idealogically unreliable elements - In other words, anyone who disagreed with the Soviet occupation was sent to Siberia. The theory was to enventually swamp and outnumber the indigenous populations and make the countries permanent parts of Russia.

With that historical context, I have little sympathy for the current Russian empire's complaints in regards to the Baltic nations. I feel for the Russians being imposed upon since they are having to pay for the sins of their fathers but not Putin and his lackeys.

Good points karlof1.
Russia controls Europe's gas supply and Winter will come.

I've been scouring the net for news on this all morning, and though everything you find has to be taken with plenty of doubt, it really looks like Georgie pushed for this more than Russia. What's Russia got to gain from this conflict? I've heard two arguments:

1. Territory. Sorry, but huge Russia's not going to become the worst pariah on the planet over little South Ossetia ....that's absurd. Last thing Russia needs is another little volatile basket-case province (with not a lot in the way of natural resources, no less).

2. Revenge for Kosovo. Even more absurd. Sure, there are Russians who'd love to see the west get a dose of its own medicine, but they're not going to start a war to do that. Wars are expensive, unpredictable, and almost never end up with the desired result.

These arguments aside, I'm not sure Georgia has much to gain from open conflict either, and maybe wasn't gunning for a full war as much as a flexing of its muscles in territory that it considers its own. Remember, a lot of Russians live in South Ossetia. Russians are very sensitive to the small former-Soviet countries that surround it, from the Baltic to the Balkans, that are basically trying to ethnically cleanse Russians from their realms in order to be more of a "nation." Ugly happenings in regard to this happen frequently, but we don't hear about them in western media. Russia maintains that it is only sending in forces to protect its people, and so far that's all they've really done. Georgia's done all of the bombing of its own territory. Yankees, Canadians and Brits ought to be fine with evacuating citizens - but CNN and BBC simply state "Russia Invades Georgia", like Stalin's at the helm and up to his old tricks.

"No mention of the 1,000 US Marines in Georgia training their forces."

Yup. This aggression is clearly instigated by the U.S. and another pliant ally does our bidding for us for scraps. Hopefully Russia will clobber these morons. Already there are 1000's of dead civilians in the capital ... small price to pay for Empire.

AD said: "isn't it "great" Reuters repeats this pack of damn lies"

Ah Reuters... they can always be counted on to write whatever the empire wants. They're one of the worst for propaganda, especially in their use of misleading language.

Let's not kid ourselves and view the Russians as saints. But that being said, the Russians are far more logical and reasonable in their geopolitical strategy. They're really not interested in war and are big on co-operation between nations. Frankly, we'd be better off with Russia as the sole superpower than we are with the US. I'm quite pleased to see Russia rebuilding itself after the western lead fire-sale that occurred in the early 90's. The United States drastically needs some counter-balance to keep them in line.

So since South Ossetia as been defacto independent since the 1990's, I think the Georgians are being played as patsies by NATO in order to drag Russia into a military conflict.

The Western big business puppet government has spoken, and isn't it "great" Reuters repeats this pack of damn lies.

Why is it Chechnya is referred to as a breakaway "republic," in the Western media, when it's never been a republic, but is moving toward being separatist fanatic gangster stooge
state for US neo cons, but South Osssettia the same media refer to as a "rebel territory"?
"Rebel territory" is just a way to attack the legitimacy of people seeking real democracy and freedom from being under the boot of US and other Western big business interests.

Moscow is fighting for democracy which the US Government is waging war on, again. You folks need to go see John Pilger's "War on Democracy," a documentary feature film about US foreign policy as it really is, not the fairy tale constantly passed off to us all by US media.

Georgia is an interesting case, historicly. Long ago it plead for the protection of the Russian Empire from the Turkic-islamic peoples that encircled it and the main road of support from Russia to Georgia was driven through the heart of what is now Ossetia. As I imply, the religious issue is still paramount--Ossetians and Abkhazians are Muslim, as are most peoples of the Caucaus Mountain region--a region far more balkanized socio-culturally than the Balkans. A writer for AsiaTimes online predicted this event several weeks ago, and correctly called it NATO aggression against Russia through the use of proxy Georgian forces. NATO/EU is very foolish to back the USA in this as they are totally dependant on Russia for current and future energy supplies. I certainly do expect Russia to veto any further UNSC sanctions on Iran.

Someone needs to awaken the Europeans to the fact that they've already lost in any dispute with Russia if they want to continue to recieve oil and natural gas to run their economies; indeed, they must realize their future is in some sort of cooperative with Russia, not the increasing antagonistic posturing forced on them by the US Empire through NATO. Russia will be just as happy to send its energy resources south and east instead of west, and a policy is indeed in place to do just that as the pipelines and pumping stations are already under construction.

The European-region independent states that were once part of the Russian Empire are starting to understand through the geopolitics of energy just how advantaged they once were as their energy sources are no longer subsidized and they must now pay higher, spot-market-related rates. The Central Asian states have no illusions that they are within the Russian sphere, and after a brief flirtation with the US Empire and NATO, they have mostly resumed their former SSR status regarding where the shots are called from--Moscow. It's easy to see just which factions within the declining US Empire would like to rekindle the Cold War as the Global War Of Terror is losing its public appeal.

This is another proxy attack by the US on Russia. It is a good thing that Russia is fighting back against this expansion of NATO aggression. Until Russia and China get their act together and unite to fight back against this constant joint US-Western European, we are just going to see a non-stop military advance by the US military-industrial-prison gulag complex around the globe. Russia and China can no more expect a reconciliation with the US and its allies than they could with the Germans and Japanese in the past.

No mention of the 1,000 US Marines in Georgia training their forces.

"renounce the use of force" had been unacceptable to the Georgians, backed by the United States...
What else needs to be said? The US cares not for diplomacy nor peacefully working out complex issues, only using people to gain imperial ends.

The US will not 'win' this. This is too close to Russia, they have much the bigger stake.
Only the warmongers will win because the fear level has been raised even more, just in time for presidential politicking.

What's wrong with balkanization? Anarchy leads to local self-determination.

Free South Ossetia has the same ring to it as Free Tibet. If they're ethnically different, let them govern themselves.

Perhaps South Ossetia is being used as a pawn in a much larger power struggle between East and West. Seems the simplest solution is to have Georgia just let them be.

What we are seeing here is the natural ebb and flow of the Russian Empire. This would have not come to pass if the West had heeded the warnings coming from the former Soviet Union that unless massive aid in transforming those nation's structures: political, economic, etc., came in, they would revert to doing business the "old way" and those who would hold power are very slimy indeed. That has now come to pass as Russia is now ruled by Czar Putin (enriched by oil and gas profits) and the empire has decided to flex its' muscle in a long term drive to regain "lost territories." Russia, along with China, India, & the EU (with Iran, Brazil Malaysia, & others scrambling to join), have become part of a multi-tiered, multi-power game not unlike the post Napoleonic order of Europe. The disturbing lesson from history is that order destroyed itself spectacularly in WW1. Now the weapons are of much greater scope.

This is a clear act of aggression by Russia against Georgia. Too bad we're too busy with our own aggressions to do anything about it.