The Stakes Could Not Be Higher. Everything Hinges on Stopping Coal
The climate camp must succeed. In the absence of political backbone, our only hope is an avalanche of public revulsion
As soon as I have finished this column I will jump on the train to Kent. Last year Al Gore remarked: "I can't understand why there aren't rings of young people blocking bulldozers and preventing them from constructing coal-fired power plants." Like hundreds of honorary young people, I am casting my Zimmer frame aside to answer the call.
Everything now hinges on stopping coal. Whether we prevent runaway climate change largely depends on whether we keep using the most carbon-intensive fossil fuel. Unless we either leave it - or the carbon dioxide it produces - in the ground, human development will start spiralling backwards. The more coal is burnt, the smaller are our chances of future comfort and prosperity. The industrial revolution has gone into reverse.
It is not because of polar bears that I will be joining the climate camp outside the coal plant at Kingsnorth. It is not because of butterflies or frogs or penguins or rainforests, much as I love them all. It is because everything I have fought for and that all campaigners for social justice have ever fought for - food, clean water, shelter, security - is jeopardised by climate change. Those who claim to identify a conflict between environmentalism and humanitarianism have either failed to read the science or have refused to understand it.
Our government could lead the world in one of two directions. Roughly one third of our power stations will come to the end of their lives by 2020. It could replace them with low-carbon plants or it could repeat - this time in full knowledge of the consequences - the disastrous decisions of the past. E.ON's application to build a new coal-burning power station at Kingsnorth is the first for many years. At least five other such proposals hang on the outcome. Between them they would account for 54 million tonnes of carbon emissions a year: as much as the entire economy would produce if the UK, in line with current science, were to cut its emissions by 90%.
The government seems determined to make the wrong decision. It has inherited the party's traditional love for coal, but, being New Labour, now supports the bosses instead of the workers, and has colluded with them to make the case for a new generation of power stations. It has one justification for this policy: that one day dirty coal will be transformed into clean coal by means of carbon capture and storage (CCS). All that is needed to effect this transformation is a sprinkling of alchemical dust, in the form of the future price of carbon. The market, it claims, will automatically ensure that coal plants bury their carbon dioxide, as this will be cheaper than buying pollution permits.
Last month the House of Commons environmental audit committee examined this proposition and found that it was nonsense. It cited studies by the UK Energy Research Centre and Climate Change Capital which estimate that capturing carbon from existing coal plants will cost €90-155 (£71-£122) per tonne of CO2. Yet the government predicts that the likely price of carbon between 2013 to 2020 will be around €39 (£31) per tonne. Even E.ON believes that it won't rise above €50. "The gap between the carbon price and the cost of CCS," the committee finds, "is enormous." The energy minister, Malcolm Wicks, confessed to MPs: "I hope that the strengthening of carbon markets ... will bring forward a sufficiently good price for carbon that it will provide some of the financial incentive for CCS. Will it be enough? I do not know."
This is the sum of government policy: to cross its fingers and hope the market delivers. If it approves a new coal plant at Kingsnorth, it will do so on the grounds that the power station will be "CCS-ready". CCS-ready seems to mean nothing more than this: that there is enough space on the site for a carbon capture plant, should the developer deign one day to build it. The committee warns that this meaningless promise could be used "as a fig leaf to give unabated coal-fired power stations an appearance of environmental acceptability".
The government has already shown us what it wants to do. In January, Gary Mohammed, a civil servant at the Department for Business, emailed E.ON to ask whether he should include CCS as a condition for approving its new coal plant. (This gives a fascinating insight into how government works: companies are asked to write their own rules.) E.ON replied that the government "has no right to withhold approval for a conventional plant". Six minutes later Mohammed answered thus: "Thanks. I won't include. Hope to get the set of draft conditions out today or tomorrow."
There is a simple means by which the government could ensure that our future electricity supplies would not commit the UK to stoking runaway climate change. It would do as California has done and set, by a certain date, a maximum level for carbon pollution per megawatt-hour of electricity production. This would have to be a low one: perhaps 80kg of CO2. Then, in line with the government's precious principles (or absence thereof), it could leave the rest to the market. I have now reached the point at which I no longer care whether or not the answer is nuclear. Let it happen - as long as its total emissions are taken into account, we know exactly how and where the waste is to be buried, how much this will cost and who will pay, and there is a legal guarantee that no civil nuclear materials will be used by the military. We can no longer afford any rigid principle but one: that the harm done to people living now and in the future must be minimised by the most effective means, whatever they might be.
But I believe the likely response would be more interesting than this. Several recent studies have shown how, through maximising the diversity of renewable generators and by spreading them as far apart as possible, by using new techniques for balancing demand with supply and clever schemes for storing energy, between 80% and 100% of our electricity could be produced by renewables, without any loss in the reliability of power supplies. Unlike CCS, wind, wave, tidal, solar, hydro and geothermal power are proven technologies. Unlike nuclear power, they can be safely decommissioned as soon as they become redundant.
A policy like this requires both courage and vision. So look at the current cabinet - Brown, Straw, Darling, Hutton, Blears, Kelly, Hoon - and weep. Every man and woman with backbone was purged from this government years ago, leaving those who know how to appease the interests that might threaten them. These people won't stand up to business, even when the future prospects of mankind are at stake.
If fear is the only thing that moves them, we must present them with a greater threat than the companies planning new coal plants. We must show that this issue has become a political flashpoint; that the public revulsion towards new coal could help to eject them from office. You could do no better than joining us at Kingsnorth this week.
monbiot.com
© Guardian News and Media Limited 2008
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56 Comments so far
Show AllC/Ders, marc melchiori doesn't make sense because you probably haven't told him something he wants to hear. First you have to find out what his situation is and very likely you will find common ground. But if you'd rather be right there's no chance for dialogue.
What's the whole point of this board? It's to affect change. Change has occurred when people of diverse backgrounds like marc and your's and mine were in common ground with the goals toward positive change. You saw the exchange we had. If you come from a position of respecting the other person you can get them to approach an issue from a perspective that they had never considered before. If you demonstrate your enthusiasm and hope for the future they may want to know why you feel that way. Then you have an open opportunity to change opinions a person at a time. But if we just hurl insults at each other than our egos just get in the way and change becomes out of reach.
Now marc and I may not agree on a number of issues but on this one issue we agreed and it is a position I believe in passionately. My whole life has been dedicated to technology and its ability to make a better life for everyone. If we use our resources reasonably there is plenty for everyone on earth. I believe that there is enough technology off-the-shelf to build a clean energy future free of carbon emissions that we can be proud of. When people from that future vantage point to today they will wonder, in awe, why there was any controversy over greening our electrical grid and transportation system in the same way we wonder why there was controversy over creating municipal fire departments, (Fire departments were privatized for subscription services. If your neighbor subscribed and you didn't when the fire came your neighbor's house was saved and your's burned down) sewage treatment systems and flood control at the turn of the 20th century.
The change toward this better future is happening now and the train is leaving the station. I believe marc is onboard the train and he's waiting for the rest of us to get on too.
marc melchiori never makes sense.
Agree with you? No.
So you agree with me - great. Love ya.
marc melchiori August 7th, 2008 8:25 am
...
"Tell me dummy where all you yanks are moving and where your business is movin'. I can't tell you how many of y'all have come down here. And ol kentucky was not a confederate state we split just like maryland did't ya know that or did't that good lib education teach you that in Ct, or Ri or Ma?"
I think most of us knew that KY was considered "neutral", but that's not the point when you're talking like a redneck. News for ya marc: I've lived in FL, TN, TX, and VA, and except for the mild winters I don't miss them much. Businesses move to the South because of the anti-union and "Right To Work" laws, which has created a modern form of slavery - and it's nothing you should be bragging about.
Got any other stupid comments?
Well, when your right your right. I can't disagree with anything you said. Texas has wind Ky has rivers. The solution seems to be found by a combination of private interests and businesmen. Now all you have to do is convince the folks here at CD and you get the hero of the year award. Good luck
A bit touchy here aren't we marc. I wasn't telling you what to do. I'm just passing along information that you might find useful. Your perfectly right. You can run it down to 62 °F if you like. So when your electrical rates go up you can also decide whether you'd rather make the utility company richer or keep the money you've saved by setting the temperature to a reasonable level in your pocket.
Here in Texas we're building wind turbines faster than the old pump jacks went in decades ago. It's exciting to watch those wind turbine blades being trucked west down interstate I-10 toward the desert. We lead the nation in wind generated electricity. They're being built in places where the wind never stops and our governor, a Republican governor I might add, signed a bill to fund the construction of high tension power lines to get that electricity to Austin, Dallas/Fort Worth, San Antonio and Houston. Even an old oil hand, T. Boone Pickens, knows that the future is in renewables. When T Boone Pickens sees a good future in renewable energy, it's become mainstream and now fossil fuels like coal, natural gas and nuclear are the alternative energy.
Tell me dummy where all you yanks are moving and where your business is movin'. I can't tell you how many of y'all have come down here. And ol kentucky was not a confederate state we split just like maryland did't ya know that or did't that good lib education teach you that in Ct, or Ri or Ma?
Radio tec, ky aint texas. Outside air is around 93-96' so I'm not wasting my money. Besides, its my ac unit, my house and my $. I don't tell you what to do, do tell me.
Sees as though you folks are racist.
marc melchiori August 6th, 2008 11:12 am
...
"Now adays a project like the TVA could never get underway. Why? idiots like the bloggers on CD scream bloody murder when man exerts his influence on nature. For all you folks in the northeast and westcoast - go ahead keep on paying .25CKWH see what I care. I keep my AC on 67′ all summer long - four long months - because I can afford it you F-in' sweathogs."
-----
Spoken like a true redneck.
marc, grow up and get with the new millenium here. You Yee-Haws got your asses handed to you 143 years ago for a reason: you were insolent racists. Well, that's over now, or don't the schools there in ol' Kaintuck teach that yet? "The South's Gonna Do It Again" was just a brainless Charlie Daniels pop song, not a prophecy. Don't worry, if y'all get too far out of line the Yanks will just whup your asses again.
Get over it.
marc,
I live in Texas and we have had record temperatures of 102 °F - 104 °F this July and my wife and I set our air conditioner to 80 °F to 82 °F for two reasons. The first is we are quite comfortable with that temperature and the second is if it is as hot as we have had in Texas and you are setting your thermostat to 67 °F you are only wasting your money. The best residential air conditioners will cool 20 °F cooler than outside air temperature.
And by the way, if the aztecs did not enslave other tribe members and sacrice each other then white men never treated any indian poorly or stole their land because "I have no proof of that". and please stop littering the reservation with all those beer cans and cig butts. HOOOOOW beeeatch
shadow dancer,
look to the east I will be sending you a coded message.
Oops, i forgot how to spell 'your not native"
Listen, honey, are you so sure you were here first? I believe not. But thats not the point. If you injuns want to get back to your roots please do the following:
1. get off the computer - its not indian
2. get off the booze - its not healthy
3. get off the casino money - its not your forte since asians bankroll your operation.
4. stop with the indian racist attitude - ya know we were here first and our way is better.
Baby, if your way is so better what the hell happened to the mighty indian tribes/
Listen sweety, good luck with the AA meeting this weekend and look for the smke signal comin' your way. It says i love you!
I will believe we are not suicidal and we will try to save our planet and our children will not bake in an overn, warmer than those at Auschwitz, when some provisions are made for the coal miners in the world.
What are coal miners supposed to do? Die?
How about their families? Here, in China, India and Russia!
Up to now, not one single candidate for any office (except for Sen. Edwards) has said one single word on the subject. A million or two Americans have no options but to continue to mine coal.
The solution of Environmental Problems must begin with the basic reason for fighting any disaster: THE PEOPLE. How will miners survive?
Sen. Edwards proposed (roughly) Federal incentives to build Electric windmill components and solar cell panels in factories in West Virgina and other coal states with the help of Federal Loans or Gurantees.
All GW solutions must begin by taking care of the human survivors, and then the Polar Bears.
Kem:
Funny you should bring that up:
http://discardedlies.com/entry/?2521
I do not believe it would be a swell idea to have "little" nuclear plants in every city in the country. Little nuclear reactors are just as hazardous as to radiation hazards as big nuclear reactors when they have a serious accident. The fallout would cover less territory, but any living downwind within a hundred miles or so would be in big trouble.
We cannot insure safety with 100 nuclear plants. In 1987 there were 2,810 reported nuclear accidents in commercial nuclear power plants and some were very serious.
http://www.lutins.org/nukes.html
Marc:
Just having fun. That was a bumper sticker down south during the gas "crisis" of the 1970s-80s. When imported oil refined in the northeast was still more expensive than the Texas and Oklahoma stuff, and so were gas prices. Why share with those uppity Yankees?
Your "A/C at 67 all summer" post just struck me as a repeat of that old attitude.
~PARALLAX~ you may be correct about that, but tell it to the ones who are planning on building the solar plant in the Sahara desert. It wasn't my idea.
My point was and is, we CAN have clean energy and stop using coal, as the technology is available.
marc,
I am not an Azetc. I have no proof Azetc's ever enslaved anyone, or used anyone as human sacrifices. Regardless I am not an Azetc. You certainly don't appear to me to be a superior race of people. All the problems of America were caused by the Europeans who came here. All the environmental problems of America were caused by the Europeans who came here.
I am not concerned about the environmental destruction of the earth in the least. Seems to be the white folk who are weeping, wailing, & gnashing their teeth about all the problems of their Nation (usa) & about the destruction of the earth.
That's what happens when you don't live simply with nature.
You appear to be a racist? I am not a racist. I know many white people who would have lived like the Tribes used to live upon the earth.
So solve all your problems of your world that the Europeans made (usa) , marc, but the mathematical probabilites are slim & none, & mostly none that you ever will so spout off your top all you desire.
The human race if left to their own devices would come close to pretty much destroying themselves either through their modern day weapons or their destruction of the earth. The probabilities at this time is around 99 percent they will do this thing either one way or the other or by a combonation of both things.
No, you never appeared to me to be any to bright at considering the long term affects of Cause & Effect here upon the earth. So if this world of yours built by you so called Superior People (marc the white racist) just keeps turning into an even greater festering Hell on Earth as time continues in the time continuim then just look at who is running things here upon the earth.
Marc, your not only a racist you can't even take responsibility for all the problems your people have created. (usa) In Europe how Europeans live is how they live & how they've been living a long time. If it isn't working out how they thought & becoming the same growing greater festering Hell on Earth white folks in the USA weep, wail, & gnash their teeth about then they have to look for their own solutions.
Strange isn't all these sites are mostly devoted to all the problems of European Societies including the USA that is a Society patterned after Rome.
Strange, Marc? Well maybe you people will start World War III like you started the last 2. One thing I can say about European Govts is they are real good at going into other people's lands, murdering them off, & stealing their land. Then they weep, wail, & gnash their teeth in the USA about the problems they themselves created & they don't have any solutions at all.
I don't get it
Marc Melchior:
Do you still have the "Drive Fast - Freeze a Yankee!" bumper sticker on the '74 Dodge Dart?
KEM PATRICK August 6th, 2008 8:53 am "... current plans to have a solal/wind combination plant constructed in the Sahara, which will produce enough electrical power for ALL of Europe."
Reliance on North Africa for electricity is in the same category as reliance on Russia for gas ... both will be used for political purposes.
The mathematics just does not add up ... the EU could get 25% or so from NA, but for reliability it would probably be best to have major production facilities in Southern Europe.
Yes shadow dancer. If only we could be more like the indians. More like the aztecs who were known to enslave conquered people, or worse, use them in human sacrifice ceremonies. If only we were like the natives all of our troubles would be wiped away.
If only we were like the natives, instead of you making pathetic and moronic statements on the internet, you could send them to people unsing smoke signals. oops i'm sorry I forgot how smoke contributes to Global Warming.
No the indians, when they came in contact with White, Christian Europeans knew they had met a superior race of humans and over time have decided to adopt our culture, law, philosophy, system of government and religion. Never before in human history has a race of people prospered and contributed so much to Earth and his fellow man.
One day, shadow, you and I can get together and smokim' biggim' peace pipe and have a good laugh. Until then, you will have to be content to use western technology and western language to communicate with me and fellow CD bloggers. However, should you want to use smoke signals, please direct them my way, I am fluent in many languages including smoke signal. PS I also know jive, so if the blackanarch is reading this we can also have a long talk. Can you dig it!
If the Europeans coming to this land had learned from the Native Tribes (Indians) how to live with the earth wisely & properly then man would not be destroying himself by his own hand through the destruction of the had all people lived that way upon planet. Nor would he destroy himself through his modern day weaponry as that is also a possibility.
China is building 400 new coal plants. Don't know if the USA is planning to build more? Some Climatologist named Hansen warned his Govt they should stop using coal.
The Plant orbits going nowhere & getting nowhere while the human race merely destroys it's self upon the earth through it's own pollution or through it's modern day weapons. Who could've ever predicted such a thing?
Coal miners and their families have fought and died for our way of life no less so than army veterans or fire-fighters. My own grandmother had to raise 5 children alone in dirt road, wooden company shack avec outhouse, union-free, no-jobs-for-women, teeny tiny burial benefit, no social benefits, no child welfare, no ESL classes Bumblefuck PA after her husband was killed in a mining accident.
However I agree that burning coal is now a serious threat to us and our children. Communities that have provided coal in the past and have sacrificed and worked to build our country must be first in line for green energy projects and job training for the same. Otherwise we are once again asking those who have given the most to suffer the most.
How is the USS ronald reagan, and nearly every other capital ship and submarine powered? Using small reactors. The ronald reagan is a floating city of nearly 6000 sailors and airmen and its power comed from a small plant located deep within the vessel. Here in KY 6000 people is a large metropolis, think one small ractor could provide energy to an entire small town - two or three to an entire county.
But here in KY, we pay only 7 cents a Kilowatt hour because 50 years ago, when men had spines, some smart folks decided to dam up the TN river and create hydropower for the entire upper south. Not only did they create power, but some of the most scenic lakes and rivers in the US - not to mention fishing and water sports.
Now adays a project like the TVA could never get underway. Why? idiots like the bloggers on CD scream bloody murder when man exerts his influence on nature. For all you folks in the northeast and westcoast - go ahead keep on paying .25CKWH see what I care. I keep my AC on 67' all summer long - four long months - because I can afford it you F-in' sweathogs.
New coal-fired or indeed any new fossil-fuelled power station should not feature in the plans of any rationally-motivated government. The nuclear option, also, is just too dangerous – the last I read, only a year or so ago, was that the fall-out from Chernobyl was still contaminating the Cumbrian fells in Northern Britain a thousand miles away.
We need to push the alternatives as hard as possible. Any permanent decrease in the use of fossil fuels that we, as individuals or groups or organizations, can make should be encouraged – even if it doesn't always involve a decrease in the use of electricity.
In Northern Europe, enormous quantities of fossil fuels are burned to heat homes and offices in winter.
In this context, NASA gives a figure for average daily incidence of solar energy in southern UK that equates to almost one megawatt hour per meter squared per year. So, the roof area of any residence or commercial building with a significant Southern exposure will receive many times the amount of energy necessary for winter comfort. But, of course there is the problem of storage. In this context, Drakes Landing Solar Community (http://www.dlsc.ca) offers a possible solution of underground storage of heat if the geology is suitable.
The DLSC system is relatively low-tech and, if found to be viable, could be implemented very quickly.
thundermoon:
you sheer idiocy and lunacy compels me to share my favorite quote from George Bernard Shaw in defense of vegetarianism:
"A man of my spiritual intensity does not eat corpses."
...but please, if you must eat rancid carcasses, have fun with that. I'm with Shaw.
ACTUALLY, I'm with Monbiot, too.
``
What confused me about you ~MIMICCS~ was you support nuclear on one thread and say, "No nuclear this thread. Which is it that you support? Perhaps you are dizzy, or have two left feet? ___ LOL.
The technology to have solar and wind power is already well proven. Perhaps some missed the recent article here where there are current plans to have a solal/wind combination plant constructed in the Sahara, which will produce enough electrical power for ALL of Europe. That's one example.
A 2007 MIT report stated that there is enough Geo-thermal available in the U.S. to produce all of the electical power required for North America, for the next 50,000 years and that could be initially developed for 15 billion dollars. How much are we spending for the Iraq occupation every month?
In addition, there are wave and tidal power plants in operation now and that technology is well proven. Tides are consistant and can be predicted for centuries to come. All of those type power plants are affordable and there is no atmospheric pollution or cost for fuels. Human caused pollution of our atmosphere andour ocean is the most serious issue we face. We either clean up our act, or we don't survive. It's only a matter of time.
There will always be some, the pesty deniers, who offer arguments against solar, wind, Geo, tidal and wave power. Their arguments are weak, because there is nothing humanity cannot do if we put our money where our mouths are and just do it, perfect it and enjoy the benefits.
Great article and comments.
I appreciate Mr. Monbiot's pragmatic approach to nuclear power. It is crucial to put soaring CO-2 levels at the top of the priority list, and global warming as the problem that will render moot the issue of radioactive waste.
Many environmentalists will say that both must be stopped, but what the past 30 years have brought us is:
1. No new US nuclear power plant.
2. A full 50% of electricity provided by the worst source, coal. And another 19% from the also carbon
intensive natural gas.
3. A slew of new coal plants in various stages of development.
Nuclear power is providing a paltry and stagnant 20% of US power needs, even though it has enormous advantages over coal in terms of both air quality, and most notably, carbon.
As for particulate matter providing a counterbalance to global warming through global dimming...sure, probably, who knows. We're in unchartered territory. Climate change is spiraling out of control far beyond our ability to predict its many implications. We could use an Einstein or an Oppenheimer today. What modern scientist exists to fill those shoes in this age of stifling corporate control and manipulation?
We aren't going to know how the climate scenario will unfold, but it makes sense to stop contributing to the problem immediately.
The NOVA episode was not being disingenuous. In fact, two top climate modelers, Hansen himself and Cox, were part of the discussion, and they did add conventional air pollution to their models some time ago. They had to tweak things when they found out how big the dimming effect really is, and probably found out this was partly why some older models predicted stronger warming than observed. The effect is huge. Something between 2 and 10% less sunlight is being measured at the earth's surface compared with 1950.
The point is that global dimming does not do anything to disprove global warming. It has been obscuring and mitigating warming. If some calamity greatly reduces human activity, the "pollution" would drop out in a few years but the CO2 would stay for a century. The "business as usual" predictions for 25, 50 and 100 years could happen in just a few. Including the methane calamity. As more CO2 accumulates, the worse this risk gets.
Some day we might have to experiment with artificial dimming by spreading sulfates, soot, fly ash... in the atmosphere to keep the lid on temperatures until CO2 falls back to 350 ppm. (If ocean acidification gets bad enough, can we pepper it with limestone to keep the phytoplankton, shellfish and coral going?)
The one advantage nuclear power and hydroelectric power have over all our other sources of energy is that they alone are mature technologies that produce NO greenhouse gasses.
Which is why I support their expansion.
MiMiCcs is correct that cutting off our energy usage will indeed make life very hard. And it will result in a Malthusian world where death rates start to exceed birth rates (this is actually needed anyway, but I'd prefer that it were done by human choice, where people have access to birth control, rather than by the Darwinian forces of starvation, exposure, war, and disease.)
Wind is becoming a mature technology, indeed it is right on the cusp and worthy of substantial investment. I've also seen some very encouraging news on the energy storage front. With wind farms (which DO exist) and a very good battery (which doesn't exist) then a wind farm becomes viable....we cannot ask the wind to blow at our convenience and this is what makes wind farms inefficient.
Solar power is also almost there. It needs a factor of two price reduction and an increase in efficiency. Again promising work is happening in this area but it isn't quite there yet.
Using economics against itself...it is precisely BECAUSE a coal plant is so relatively cheap that these climate-saving technologies are so far behind. Economically there is no incentive to ever develop renewable resources until you essentially run out of the non-renewable ones.
So I very much support this idea of protesting and fighting the building of coal plants. This worked for nuclear power, making it expensive and thus slowing down the rate of their building. The same could be done for coal plants. It would slow down the rate at which they are constructed driving the price of energy ever higher. As that price goes up the less-objectionable renewable resources become viable more quickly. And speed in their development is important.
So far I'm not sure I've said anything the MiMiCcs would really disagree with. Except perhaps protesting the building of coal plants in order to make their construction more expensive.
Where we part ways is when it comes to the science surrounding global warming.
bbr-001 makes a good point. I had also read about this effect of 'soot' in the atmosphere several years ago. Another interesting fact was what happened to North America's average temperature right after 911. YOu might remember that there were 3 days where NO airplane was allowed to fly. The average temperature of the North American continent shot up by something like 2 degrees centigrade. It was the lack of contrail cloud cover.
Our efforts to clean up all the dirt that coal threw in the air have been very successful. They have improved the health and air quality all over the western world. This is a very good thing and if you do not agree then all you have to do is ask yourself why are there all these concerns about air quality in China for the olympics. They do not bother with expensive pollution controls there and the 'London fog' has returned to Bejing and Shanghai. Indeed in London the smog was so bad once in 1953 that 15,000 people suffocated in that city that year. London had a huge coal fired power plant in Battersea right in the centre of town at the time which was the source of this pollution.
As we have cleaned this soot up the true effects of global warming are being felt more acutely though.
The TV show you watched is disengenous to the climate scientists. They have been including the effects of eruptions and aerosols and soot since the mid 1990's. At least quite a number have been and it's certainly accepted as an important factor today.
But the thing the MiMiCcs seems unable to accept is that, despite this, the climate models are all predicting global warming of varying severity if we do not do something radical and do it essentially now. Kem Patrick points out that this is not either his 'opinion' nor is it my 'opinion', we are merely repeating what climate scientists, who spend serious time and effort studying our planet, are trying to tell us. That's all.
We have seen the incredible resources that can be brought to bare on a 'problem' if there is the right political will. Look at Iraq. Look at Iran. If we spent even 1/3 of that kind of money tackling our climate/energy problems we could very neatly side-step the disaster scenarios that Kem Patrick is concerned about and the number of jobs and the new economy would be chugging along nicely. There would be a completely new set of corporations we could all protest as well. :)
We would be living differently, to be sure, but not with a lower quality of life by any means.
It is highly unfortunate that people like MiMiCcs choose to ignore the evidence and cling to a set of economic models that are about to become obsolete by the laws of physics....because ultimately these are what are driving climate change and the finite energy reserves our planet has spent 3.5 billion years storing away. What would be more fortunate would be if they could recognize the multiple benefits to the US that energy independence would bring to us, not just climatic, but politically and economically as well, and even if they cannot bring themselves to believe our best scientists at least recognize that energy independence and substantial reduction in the burning of fossil fuels would be a generally good thing for other reasons.
If such people could then join in the pressure for energy development I believe it would be possible to accomplish almost anything.
To he who shall not be named. Those against coal, oil, nuclear, etc tend to be the same people, who say no, no, no. They say no, I say yes, because no energy, and people will die. Confusion seems to be your normal state of mind.
Also, bbr-001, you do know of course that Mt Pinatubu eruption caused global cooling for a couple of years. Heck, even Gavin over at RC admits that.
But one thing we have found is that soot on the ice in the Arctic increases the amount of radiation absorbed by the ice and causes melting (somebody is going to lie and say I denied there is melting, ignore him).
Don't expect elites to serve your interests. Just look at organic food. Did the elites push that on you? Nope. You shifted your demand from franken-food to organic food. Now shift your demand from fossil energy to renewable energy.
oops.
Revulsed? Heh, I'm scared shitless. It's way too late to be merely sickened.
Scare the populace. Scare them with the possibilities. Show them that what's happening to the wildlife will happen to us.
Hey I'm all for hemp. You can use it for lots of things, and we can retrain people for what I would imagine to be less dangerous and stressful work. Ax Men would probably be cancelled though.
What about windmills? I don't hear a lot of talk about them anymore.
Here's a story about a professor in my city who is researching polymers and how they can be used in our rivers to generate electricity...
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08210/899996-298.stm
I just watched the NOVA "Dimming the Sun" episode. In a nutshell, "global dimming" was discovered by technicians around the world measuring sunlight intensity and water evaporation over decades. The data flew in the face of warming, but the climatologists finally recognized it and are incorporating it into models...
Ash and aerosols both block sunlight and cause more and smaller droplets of water in clouds, making them more reflective of sunlight. The effect is much larger than anyone had imagined. As much as half of global warming is countered by dimming. The 0.6 deg long term temp rise often cited could have been over 1 deg, and some of the recent temperature rises could have been from sulfate and ash capture, catalytic converters... reducing the dimming effect.
This raises the alarming possibility of what could happen if we suddenly clean up particulate and aerosol pollution, and contrails as CO2 remains in the atmosphere. Pollution would start dropping out right away, but CO2 will take decades or a century to fall to pre-1950 levels. There could be a huge GW increase.
Less than 10 years to achieve global consensus and turn this thing around? Not gonna happen. Climate engineering anyone?
If you go down to Harlan County, you better be brave, or very tough. ___ VERY. That's were the term "BAD-ASS" originated.
~MIMICCS~ you are confusing, You say "NUKES -NO" here, but write a blog supporting nuclear power on the thread about McCain's plan to build 100 more nuclear power plants.
Come on down to Harlan county. Coal country - take away a mas job and you got trouble. Take away a people electricity anf you got a revolution.
When you all are finished beating the dying horse that is coal, come right over and learn about industrial hemp for a change. It's not your typical ordinary biofuel like corn-based ethanol. Think of it as the best biofuel you won't regret using but that you're only regret would be that you fell for fossil fuels while buying into the reefer madness propaganda.
www.votehemp.com
Here in Wisconsin-our Governor Doyle is working toward the cessation of coal burning in the state.The conversion process is very expensive initially-but what a hopeful start.
The coal companies have operated like Vandals for over a century and likely never will be held accountable for the horrific damage they've done. Thirty years ago I thought strip mining was as bad as it could get-now hundreds of topless mountains sadly prove how nasty these companies truly are.
thundermoon - eat comfrey for B12 - http://www.herbsarespecial.com.au/free-herb-information/comfrey.html - there is iron in dark green leafy vegetables - you can now switch to plants
Best thing an individual can do is to conserve energy and if possible find an alternative energy source. If desperate enough one could even walk instead of drive once in a while.
I thought the article was about coal, but I can reply as to why 97+% of us keep eating rotting animal flesh. It's because rotting or fresh, plant matter contains no B12 or usable iron, and humans need both, especially young women who are or intend to become pregnant and nurse the baby. Otherwise, I'd be glad to switch to all rotting plants, instead of the rancid carcasses I consume exclusively now.
FIRE and the Dead Peasants
Follow the lemmings to the sea you see
we're worth more dead than alive
This ain't a jest or some FIRE jive
it's just were getting short of carbon or anything that burns
so lay your self down in the sediment
and in a few eons hence you'll provide
for more than a little warmth
perhaps a plastic bag or two
for future shoppers who survived
the toxic stew from the clean coal crew
So follow the lemmings to the sea
dead is better for profit than alive you see
That goes for the planet too,
so let's bathe us in our toxic stew
those non elected too
as corporations bottom line on profit
and we all turn blue
Coal- no. Nukes - no. Drilling - no.
WTF, lets have a lottery and the 5 billion losers can be put down. Volunteers from the malthusian camp gladly accepted, but you must pay for your own bullet.
People are strange animals. We want to avoid any discomfort, so we don't have to worry about coal burning if it's not right in front of our faces, blocking out everything else, and if we can't step around it to ignore it, even then. Same with the consuming of rotting animal flesh - we aren't really that nice to animals, either, most of the time. Just ask the billions of animals that are tormented until we savagely "put them down" so we can gorge ourselves :)
Unfortunately, widespread public revulsion only seems to occur if there's animal abuse. If it could be shown unequivocally that the burning of coal was harming puppy dogs, then there might be enough outrage to get something done.
Denial is likely to continue until it's too late.
lexington:
The coal and steel jobs are already gone. It doesn't take a big workforce to blow up a mountain and scoop up the coal. Continuous Casting and recycling of scrap allow a few dozen steelworkers to do what once took thousands. Ask a Bethlehem Steel pensioner. Don't need coal and coke to recycle scrap, either. Can power the electric furnace with a low GHG emission nuke.
My poser is ALL the value added jobs are gone (or going). Gone to China, Mexico... We sell each other insurance, work in retail, and speculate on real estate, stocks and futures, while our money goes abroad. The post-industrial society is going broke (with a lot of help from Dubya's war and tax cut and spend policies).
I think once the reality sinks in world wide that 11 billion people burning fossil fuel for energy, making toys and trinkets for each other, driving around in circles, and ripping up natural resources is unsustainable, we will have to develop some sort of postmodern society where having a job is not necessary for survival or even a decent basic lifestyle.
How do we do that? I'm a child of free enterprise, but I think its had its day, at least as practiced in the US. Would we have some sort of socialist super European Union that provides medical care, housing and food rations, while somehow encouraging the talented and "best and brightest" to pursue careers and start worthwhile businesses? What is ahead?
Making horse shoes is a fine old American tradition as well. But that doesn't mean that opening a new horse shoe factory to mass produce horse shoes today wouldn't be completely idiotic. The world changes.
I agree 100%. Mass street demonstrations, work stoppages, Bus rides to Washington.
They don't dare dismiss us if we are united.
Everything they do is designed to pit black against white, old against young, citizen against immigrant.
The ruling class would become apoplectic if a work stoppage cost them .0000001% of one day's stock earnings.
Surely about the dumbest thing we could be doing now is to build more coal power plants.
From what I can tell, the science argument is about whether or not we've already gone so far into Global Warming that we might have already passed one or more key 'tipping' points.
Just in case we haven't, lets build some new coal plants to make dang sure we've completely screwed things up.
Maybe Americans will take heart from the Brits and start getting real about how serious it all is. If the powerful dismiss everyone else then a free people will insist on being noticed. How free can you be if they can do what they want but you have no say and yet pay taxes?
I remember when back in the sixties the university students in France ...and then came the Columbia sit ins...
People are hungry for something to be done that makes sense for the long term and fast. Maybe we should all take a good look at these ordinary people who are insisting on being seen and heard.
Maybe what people in this country need is to see other people doing the doing again? Maybe they'd wake up... from the numbing spell that is fast making our democracy comatose.
Hip hip... the Brits in Kent!
While the protest is admirable (and probably essential), without an appreciation of the role of coal (and steel)in the historical and cultural lives of many communities, any attempt to raise the awareness is going to be less than successful. See Brassed-Off for a good story to illustrate this point. Talk with miners and their families cast aside by Thatcher's attack on the unions. Then discuss the future.
Thatcher was a heart surgeon who seeing Britain as a patient with a weak heart declared, 'I know what to do with a weak heart!' She ripped it out and declared 'see! no weak heart'. Sure Britain no longer had a weak heart, it had no heart.
Unless you replace coal and steel with jobs that are comparable to giving people a good standard of living, they will cling to the good old days.
A thorough googling of english folk song relating to mining might give a clue. Start with Byker Hill, but don't forget the Gresford Disaster.
Police Block Food Supplies To Power Station Protesters
by Mark Hughes
Kingsnorth, England - Hundreds of riot police pushed back protesters at the Kingsnorth coal power station "climate camp" in Kent yesterday, as officers raided the site and made eight arrests.
To Preserve and Protect the Corporate Right to Abuse People? These are what people call Corporate Goons!