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No U-Turn. Obama's Stance on Iraq Is Chillingly Consistent
As November's American presidential elections approach, Barack Obama's message on Iraq is being widely interpreted as "flip-flopping" and a "retreat" from a previously unequivocal stance of fully withdrawing the US occupation forces. This is to misunderstand Obama, who is not someone who shoots from the hip. There is much more to his words than cursory reading could unravel.
His remarks before the 2003 invasion resonated well within the American antiwar movement. His scathing references to the Bush administration's folly and his demands for "ending the war" were probably decisive in winning him the Democratic party nomination against Hillary Clinton, whose vote for war in 2003 ultimately crippled her credibility as the commander-in-chief who would bring it to an end.
Obama himself has reacted angrily to claims of a policy U-turn: "For me to say I'm going to refine my policies is I don't think in any way inconsistent with prior statements and doesn't change my strategic view that this war has to end and that I'm going to end it as president." Earlier this month he resorted to an op-ed article in the New York Times to emphatically state: "On my first day in office, I would give the military a new mission: ending this war."
As always in examining the words of politicians, let alone Obama (who now has 300 foreign policy advisers), the devil is in the details. Here, Obama's "ending the war" declarations begin to look far from reassuring, even before he "refines" his line after meeting the US commander, General Petraeus, in Iraq.
Obama sees Iraq as part of a wider theatre of war and potential wars engulfing the entire Middle East, where US strategic goals and interests are at stake. So his obvious shift on the "surge" operations in Iraq (underlined by deleting criticisms of it from his website last week) is strengthening his call for "redeployment" from Iraq to Afghanistan. His current strategy could be summed up as: de-escalate the war in Iraq, escalate it in Afghanistan, and talk to Iran. On Iran, his offer of talks was coupled with an alarming, Bush-style threat. "I'll do everything in my power to prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon. Everything," Obama told a gathering of the pro-Israel lobby group, Aipac, in April. He is echoing the sentiments of his famous anti-Iraq war speech in 2002, in which he repeatedly stressed that he was not opposed to all US wars.
It is worth noting that the term withdrawal, let alone a full unconditional withdrawal that will satisfy most of the Iraqi people, has never been part of Obama's vocabulary. His first carefully considered statement on Iraq was made in January last year, when he introduced the Iraq war de-escalation act to Congress. It was then that he envisaged stationing troops in Iraq on a longer-term basis: "A residual US presence may remain in Iraq for force protection, training of Iraqi security forces and pursuit of international terrorists." Using similar phrases, this is what he outlined in the New York Times last week.
To distinguish his policy from that of his rival for the White House, Obama declared: "Unlike Senator McCain, I would make it absolutely clear that we seek no presence in Iraq similar to our permanent bases in South Korea." But it doesn't require rocket science to know that keeping "residual" forces requires heavily fortified areas, installations and a state of readiness to go to war. Unless Obama has discovered something new, such areas are known as military bases. So it is the word "permanent" that separates the two, as McCain may want to stay "100 years" in Iraq. The comparison with South Korea is not heartening, considering massive US bases have been in that country for over half a century.
Obama has even pre-empted a possible line of attack from hawks by chillingly suggesting he would possibly invade Iraq again if necessary. His website states: "He would reserve the right to intervene militarily, with our international partners, to suppress potential genocidal violence within Iraq." The word potential is worth pausing over; it is salutary to remember Bush and Blair occupied Iraq and caused the death of perhaps hundreds of thousands of innocent people for "humanitarian" reasons.
Neither is Obama opposed to signing a military treaty with Iraq. He has two conditions to make Bush's current attempts to impose a pact acceptable: the pact should get Congressional approval, and renounce "permanent" military bases. However, leaked drafts of this colonialist-style pact do not mention the word "permanent" at all. And his "benchmarks" for continued support for the corrupt Iraqi politicians protected by US forces in Baghdad's Green Zone are strikingly similar to those of the Bush administration.
Tactical differences and issues of style aside, Obama's message on occupied Iraq is deeply troubling - not because it has U-turned but because it has been consistent. His 300 foreign policy advisers are making sure that he will not stray from protecting US imperialist interests, even if it does mean launching new wars and bolstering puppet regimes and corrupt dictatorships throughout the "greater Middle East".


82 Comments so far
Show AllTrue believers in the JFK Camelot myth still find it hard to believe that Kennedy had no "Exit Strategy" from Vietnam other than "victory". Obama seems to be enjoying a similar aura of Teflon myth-making and wilful Pollyannish misinterpretation even before he's elected and shows his true colors. When will Obama supporters learn to "take their candidate at his word"?
Gee, now I am so shocked. I don't know if I'll ever recover. America definitely won't recover anytime soon....stay tuned. If you thought white water rafting down the Colorado was a bumpy ride, well,...that was the Disney version. These bumps will kill you....
Boy do we need to keep up the Bring our Troops Home Now demonstrations.
As we keep the protests visible, it heartens rank and file soldiers who are turning against the war. Remember, a persistent Out Now movement eventually succeeded in forcing even conservative Republican President Nixon to withdraw all the troops from Vietnam. We can do it again.
There will be Out Now demonstrations at both national political conventions.
After the elections Dec. 9-14 has been set for coordinated protests in cities across the country. And then next spring a massive demonstration is being organized for Washington DC and a west coast city. For more information:
natassembly.org
Obama, continuing the Bush/McCain occupations? Gee, what to do, what to do… Well, in democracies, what we do is vote for parties that are against foreign conquest. That usually solves that problem. That's why we have so much money left over for universal healthcare and affordable education. But you guys? I'm stumped. I can't fathom the solution. Maybe you should try voting Republican or Democrat one more time?
Obama said to the NYT: "On my first day in office, I would give the military a new mission: ending this war."
Ooops. But its not a war; its an occupation.
With Obama parroting misinformation like this, who knows what other BS will escape his lips.
told you so liberals!!! but would you listen?
VOTE NADER 08
rasmus,
where is your self-respect?
from the beginning Obama was and is a fraud.
he belongs to the milton friedman chicago school of neo-liberal economy.
It's just so obvious at this point what a phony obama is. Jeezz!
Here's another thoroughly "consistent" point of view, expressed by the Green Party's nominee for President: Cynthia McKinney:
"The United States should and must engage the world, but not in empire, not in military."
We do have a choice in this election but it's not between Consistent Empire Builder I (McCain) and Consistent Empire Builder II (Obama.)
It is no surprise that an Iraqi exile is bashing the presumptive Democratic Presidential candidate. Iraqi exile BS was instrumental in starting the unnecessary war/occupation in Iraq.
What seems clear to me is that no one who is a true dove can be president. The government/media/corporate establishment will produce a president that will go along with the imperialist program. You can go and protest, or vote for Nader or McKinney, but it will have no effect on the outcome. Were Nader or McKinney elected (har har) they would swiftly be assassinated. Americans are, by and large, complicit in the imperialist program insofar as they depend on oil for gasoline and plastics and fertilizer, etc. There are too many of us to be able to effect an organized resistance.
I was listening to Pacifica radio station KPFK the other day when I heard Mumia Abu Jamal comparing Napoleon to Obama on the grounds that both were ridiculed in school while growing up (Napoleon was ridiculed because he wasn't French and Obama because he looked "Black").
He talked about how Napoleon later became more French than the French and hints that Obama is becoming more American than Americans in his possible new role as the latest emperor.
That Obama is turning out to be a staunch supporter of US "interests" (profits for US corporations and the MIC) is not debatable.
The difference between Saddam and the US government is not who is more interested in stopping the injustice thrust upon the Iraqi people, but who was going to be in charge of the injustices. Now the US is in charge.
As an Iraqi stated shortly after the US invaded Iraq, "Different jockey, same camel."
Vote third party, don't support corporate sponsored oppression and their candidates.
How we treat other countries is how we will treat the powerless within our own country whenever the corporate elite find it necessary. And most of us are the powerless.
Impeach.
boy howdy July 22nd, 2008 3:23 pm writes "You can go and protest, or vote for Nader or McKinney, but it will have no effect on the outcome. Were Nader or McKinney elected (har har) they would swiftly be assassinated."
-so what do we do boy howdy- vote for Obama?
What a thoroughly defeatist attitude. How weak.
Better to go out fighting for your principles and dying with your boots on than to lamely go along with the sold out democrats like Obama, bending over and cementing the status quo.
Wobblie, I'm from Illinois. You could not be more wrong. Barack Obama is a professor of constitutional law and grassroots community organizer. He is personally, the closest thing you will ever see to an absolutely exemplary individual human being.
rasmus11 July 22nd, 2008 3:40 pm writes "He is personally, the closest thing you will ever see to an absolutely exemplary individual human being."
-Really? -what a complete crock of shit! Please don't run away rasmus11, first I have a question.
Why did Obama:
1) vote to fund the illegal occupation/rape and plunder of Iraq?
2) vote to make it legal for the government to spy on us in violation of the 4th Amendment and grant Telecoms immunity for breaking the law?
I have yet to get an answer from a Democratic Party apologist that didn't involve the side-step-weasel. Will you be their champion rasmus11?
tailcap July 22nd, 2008 3:24 pm
I'm beginning to agree.
By the way, what exactly does a grass roots organizer organize and who pay's him to organize it?
Who did Obama work for?
Why do those who support Obama choose not to care about about his actions in the Senate?
The Hobson's Choice of Obama/McCain is only to decide what face will be used to enforce the wishes of our corporate fascist control mechanism - the U.S. Gov't.
Obama has great words, but his actions to date are MUCH louder - and scarier.
Sir Thomas More,
I Googled Obama's community organizing and concluded it's difficult to determine whether he was genuine or just building up a resume he could later use for political gain.
To me it doesn't really matter that much what Obama did in 1985. This is now and now he is a warmonger, a hawk, and a Republican-lite. Caterpillars should be morphing into butterlies not butterflies morphing into slugs.
That was then and this is now. Let's not give to much importance to 23 years ago.
There was no plan for Iraq because the plan has always been Iran. Now when the Iraqis signal that we must leave and America demands it, the sudden shift to Afghanistan. No we don't actually have to attack Iran but of course their are extremist forces that insist on that very thing at any cost to others.
Nevertheless, Obama who may very well be a decent human being such is possible for lawyers, but he will not be Bush the unilateral inept cowboy. Obama (who is not an outsider) will be a saner and much more intelligent president but not an outsider. He'll do a lot of good ...we hope! Since Bush did so much harm.
Nevertheless the endgame is a continuing USA presence in force in the middle east. If we could leave the middle east, we'd have more influence.
Extremists insist America must take down Iran. Their manipulative spin took us into Iraq to free them by taking down the country and setting it back twenty five years or more. But Iraq was already beaten and no threat to anyone.
Great location and it came with a chance to restore the ancien regime of imperial oil for the original players... but Iraq's failure may have been the plan ala lebanon (being set back by infrastructure damage)...the bases were for what level of troops? A lot more than any small remaining force would need.
Will extremists like Cheney... chance WW3? Especially with Putin to resupply Iran like China did Vietnam?
The no plan for Iraq was the plan for Iran. One can assume that the plan for Iran is no plan at all ...once again. Will a new war elect Mccain?
No. A return to Plan A (a for afghanistan) and bases for a war with Iran and if the WW3 scenario holds, the potential for a conflict with a militant Pakistan.
Obama not standing by us and our constitution on telecom immunity was him crossing his Rubicon ... as I'm sure he was advised by the status quo to do so.
The shift is to Afghanistan ... bigger bases ...with a few legions posted in castrum in what will remain hostile territory in Iraq.
Obama might even be wise enough to do the job Bush should have done and help the Afgahnis modernize their economy etc. instead of remaining focused on Iran.
Yes I said Obama crossed his Rubicon on our constitution and us...of, for and by us. Bush won't declare martial law nor will Obama. At least Obama is smarter.
Bush and Cheney were cynical extremist neo-fascists but what was scariest was that were inept and incometent as well, inviting disaster when ruin would have been enough.
Obama hopefully will be smarter which is the only change left that he seems able to make. Obama sounds over advised. Gee I wonder by whom? Yeah...change is hard to come by when you are advised by those whom America expected you to change.
We wanted new ideas... not just a new face.
and oh yeah... perhaps as an afterthought?
We wanted our constitution. Your Rubicon was a change in the wrong direction... back to the same old same old?
Just hopefully a little smarter ... than the 'no plan' for Iraq plan becoming the 'no plan' for Iran plan?
Obama stopped looking to the people as his advisors and ... well... the Rubicon he crossed was the constitution.
* such as is possible for lawyers*
What was Obama doing in Illinois? He was building his resume, just as Bill Clinton spent some time building his resume to gain the coveted position serving the global elites. If I remember correctly, Obama caught the eye of David Rockefeller along the way. Wow, just like Bill Clinton caught the eye of David Rockefeller, who was quite the mentor for Bill. One area we don't know too much about was Obama's stint at Columbia, to which Obama seems to omit most references. Was he really absorbed in being an overly studious nerd? Or was there some mentoring going on there? Rockefeller? Brzienzki? Columbia, like many prestigious universities is such a pit of vipers for slithering neocon/neoliberal globalists. Just curious.
I'm anxious to read a recent book by Webster Tarpley entitled, "Obama-The Postmodern Coup: The Making of a Manchurian Candidate". A candidate can say anything into a microphone or build any kind of veneer on an official website. It's time to just say, "NO!" to the abusers and would-be abusers who have incrementally led us every four years to the abyss we face at this moment. Why waste the time and self-humiliation of voting one more time for a republican or democrat who are already committed to an agenda not at all in the interests of honest people?
wobblie wrote, July 22nd, 2008 2:40 pm
"told you so liberals!!! but would you listen?
VOTE NADER 08"
Exactly wobblie!!
Obama seems to be reprising the role of 'Rebel' Al Gore in the summer of the 2000 campaign.
Through the spring and early summer of 2000 Gore had come down from the mountains in fatigues and a Castro beard and pledged revolutionary attack on "those corporate powers" aligned against the American people.
But by August, Gore was mugged by the DNC/DLC thugs fronting for the ruling-elite 'corporatist Empire' that runs this "Vichy" facade of a democracy, and quickly abandoned all his populist/progressive pledges.
Now, in 2008, Obama did not even make it to August before collapsing like a cheap suitcase!!!
rasmus11 at 3:40:
Succinct and well-said statement on Obama!
That's how I view him too!
I think this article is a little too critical of Obama. Personally, I would rather ALL USA forces in Iraq return to the USA. However, it seems that both Iraqi and Afghans in their respective countries do not seem to get along amongst themselves generally speaking. Now, what does this have to do with the USA directly? Nothing. But, I do not trust the Governments of Iraq and Afghanistan to get their heads together in their respective sectarian conflicts. After all, they have been fighting in these two countries amongst themselves for centuries. So, as the ultra left radical that I am, I must concede that both Iraq and Afghanistan are unable to get along amongst themselves as there is too much History and tradition to claim otherwise.
Regarding Iran, one needs to consider the setting of where Obama states, according to this piece, that "I'll do everything in my power to prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon. Everything." Obama will not do such action - I hope he understands this also. Obama is simply appeasing to AIPAC in this instance. Obviously he is going to say what he is going to say to AIPAC whether or not his statements correspond with any future events. If Iran truly want a nuclear weapon someday, they will have one, regardless of USA opinion on the matter - whether the Iranians manufacture it themselves, buy one on the Black Market, or steal one from unsecured areas worldwide, such as in Russia - where there are stockpiles of nukes unprotected by the current Russia Government. So the aforementioned quote made by Obama should not be taken as seriously as Ramadani seems to be doing.
With "residual" USA troops in Iraq after majority of USA brigades going home (where they truly belong) - this I kind of have a problem with becasue let the Iraqi Government handle their own affairs...COMPLETELY. Iraq belongs to Iraqi people. That is just all there is too it. Do I trust the Iraqi Government to create and maintain security, stability and dare I say a civilized nation? Both ironically and tragically, my answer is a resounding no. Irregardless of whether Iraq can function with or without USA support TRULY is of no concern to the USA. Any American today who claim that Iraq or Iran or Afghanistan will go all the way across the world to invade the USA simply needs to be locked up in an asylum because this scenario simply will not happen. If in the remote chance this scenario could happen, it would take many years. So my hope is that the USA nationalists stop being paranoid becasue I am tired of hearing it as it is becoming old.
Oh and ummmm... should, in the remote chance, Iraq becomes a nation in which all of its citizens get along with one another and not resort to horrific and unspeakable violence (characteristic of this part of the world for Millennia) - I see nothing wrong with USA making treaties with Iraq. Not really. Ummmmm...again I seriously doubt that there can be true and lasting peace in Iraq, unless it is strictly enforced.
As a constitutional lawyer, if Obama was indeed a moral, ethical politicians who believed in the letter of the law and really intended to provide a Change that we can believe in he would notd now be shifting the war to Afghanistan.
He would instead call the world's attention to the fact that Bush Jr. illegally and underhandedly set up Saddam Hussein for a betrayal and blindsided attack when he originally gave Hussein permission to attack Kuwait for reasons we all understand today.
He would call to the world's attention how Bush Jr. did the same to the Taliban when he boxed them into a corner they couldn't get out of no matter how much they tried to accomodate or placate the U.S. to try to avoid being attacked but still stick to their principles.
Obama would further call the world's attention to the fact that the unprovoked attack against the sovereign government of Afghanistan was a violation of international law that has yet to be addressed or rectified.
He would, if he were a moral, ethical man and visionary of a new direction, proclaim to the world that the U.S. henceforth would: abide by international law by removing his armies from the Middle East and instead replace them with a Marshall type Plan, humanitarian aid that emphasized peaceful diplomacy and respect; proclaim a unilateral decision to begin to undertake a nuclear/biological warfare disarmament policy and advocate that Isreal do the same so as to set an example for all other current nuclear powers and would-be nuclear powers.
But it would only happen in your dreams, mate, because Obama is light-years away from that kind of enlightened policy.
Tailcap wrote:rasmus11 July 22nd, 2008 3:40 pm writes "He is personally, the closest thing you will ever see to an absolutely exemplary individual human being."
-Really? -what a complete crock of shit! Please don't run away rasmus11, first I have a question.
Why did Obama:
1) vote to fund the illegal occupation/rape and plunder of Iraq?
Rasmus11 answers:
He voted to fund the troops while they are in harms way.
2) vote to make it legal for the government to spy on us in violation of the 4th Amendment and grant Telecoms immunity for breaking the law?
Rasmus11 answers:
This is what Barack Obama said about that:
"Given the legitimate threats we face, providing effective intelligence collection tools with appropriate safeguards is too important to delay. So I support the compromise, but do so with a firm pledge that as president, I will carefully monitor the program,"
Calling all people of conscience. Get Barack Obama into the White house or spend the rest of your life wishing you had.
McCain Camp "Frustrated" With Obama's Trip: Reports
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/07/22/mccain-camp-jealous-of-ob_n_114251.html
Two questions: 1) can anyone name a single, black progressive leader with a significant following who was not assassinated and/or politically castrated?
2) Seeing has how even America's Gandhi -- Dr. King -- took a bullet in the neck, why would Obama base his campaign on an openly radical political program, as demanded by more than a few CD posters?
Rasmus 11:
Forgive my sarcasm, but "Polly want some crack?!"
You can't just parrot Obama's illusory craft in fashioning comments for the media. You may have a conscience, but don't be so naive about Obama. Even if Obama has a shred of conscience remaining, it won't be of any use to him, since he has already chosen his master--and the master will decide what is useful in herding the believers. If you do want to develop your conscience, you'll take a closer look and analyze why many of us are so irate about Obama's murky deceptiveness. We've been shepherded over decades to want to be "smart", to run with the "smart" crowd, to vote for the "smart" guys and gals. Try digging into Obama's history. This has been the most disgusting campaign in my memory. Obama wants this job; he chose to serve a system drenched in blood and hell-bent on an agenda of global control. In the past few years, Obama has actively worked with the likes of Pelosi, Reid, Hoyer, Emanuel,etc. to thwart the campaigns of truly progressive candidates, especially anti-war candidates, in favor of BUSINESS interests, most of the same business interests so dear to Bush and Cheney. So, voting for a third-party candidate, irregardless of whether you think it meaningful or effective, is still one way of saying "NO" to our abusers in the WAR PARTY.
No matter how you vote later, tell pollsters right now you plan to vote for Cynthia McKinney and do it in big enough numbers, and Barak Obama fearing defeat will do the right thing whether for the right or wrong reasons.
Fear of defeat concentrates a politician's mind!
From the article above: "Obama's message on occupied Iraq is deeply troubling - not because it has U-turned but because it has been consistent."
You leftists just eat this crap up without even blinking don't you?? For months now it has been the left wing saying O was flip flopping in Iraq.. now he is "consistent" wtf?
Make up your friggin minds will ya. Kind of sounds like the left is now flip floppin' their views on Obama.
Flipppp Flopppers , Flippppp Flopperrrrsss
"That was then and this is now. Let's not give to much importance to 23 years ago."
I don't really, I was just curious. I'm compling my list of questions/changes for myself to see why I have this uneasy feeling.
But a person is the sum of his experiences and his associations from then form his pedigree and resume.
testing 1,2,3
-sorry about the double post folks, the first one disappeared.
of course Obama would be one more puppet....what's new folks? wake up and smell more than your armpits people......this is 2008. 24 years After 1984....how long can we continue having this conversation until word gets out?
The forces of misinformation have controlled almost all media almost all the time since the invention of...media! There never has been a "solution" for "imperialism", except drastic population reduction....not a happy thought I know. Mostly we bloggers are doing this as a form of art and political engagement allowing us to sleep better at night....those who protest publicly sleep even more soundly, I guess. And believe it or not one day the truth will come out on the insanity of these recent years.....and a few students might even read about it.....sort of a history thing.
Or maybe I'm wrong and tomorrow the inevitable reaction will begin: the people will awake from their slumber and demand an end to the abuses, detentions, wars, missiles, the whole 9 yards....just remember that these things TAKE TIME.
You are right rasmus 11, but it won't do you any good to argue with tailcap or his ilk, as nothing short of a third Bush term in John McSame will satisfy them.
Sami Ramadani:
To distinguish his policy from that of his rival for the White House, Obama declared: "Unlike Senator McCain, I would make it absolutely clear that we seek no presence in Iraq similar to our permanent bases in South Korea." But it doesn't require rocket science to know that keeping "residual" forces requires heavily fortified areas, installations and a state of readiness to go to war. Unless Obama has discovered something new, such areas are known as military bases. So it is the word "permanent" that separates the two, as McCain may want to stay "100 years" in Iraq. The comparison with South Korea is not heartening, considering massive US bases have been in that country for over half a century.
Sami Ramadani:
Tactical differences and issues of style aside, Obama's message on occupied Iraq is deeply troubling - not because it has U-turned but because it has been consistent. His 300 foreign policy advisers are making sure that he will not stray from protecting US imperialist interests, even if it does mean launching new wars and bolstering puppet regimes and corrupt dictatorships throughout the "greater Middle East".
Some people are born fools but can learn and do. Others remain fools by choice.
No matter how careful and smart one may be..when you get that close to the pigs feeding at the trough, you get pretty dirty yourself.
Rasmus11, I think tailcap and others here who are pushing for support to waste votes on Nader and other unelectable candidates are working with Rush Limbaugh in his "Operation Chaos" program to split the vote and get McSame elected. Hell, they may be getting some of that $400 MILLION contract Rush just closed with ClearChannel Radio to continue spreading right-wing propaganda for the next eight years. If you want to see a partial list of the other ditto-heads, check out the comments on this article here at CD-
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/07/19/10478/
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2008/jul2008/obam-j23.shtml
The presidential campaign has evolved into a foreign policy conflict between sections of the American ruling elite, with the Republicans and Democrats debating the best means for maintaining the US military presence in Iraq while dealing with an escalating war in Afghanistan. The desire of millions of Americans for an end to the Bush administration's neo-colonial wars will be given no expression within the two-party system.
To describe Obama as "antiwar," in any sense, is an exercise in either deception or self-delusion. His visit to Iraq makes clear that he speaks for those who believe that a tactical reorientation of US strategy is required to re-direct American military forces to deal with challenges to US strategic and corporate interests elsewhere.
I agree with the author of this article that Obama did not do a foreign policy u-turn. Much of Obama's positions on Iraq are carefully hedged. He will leave a force there to deal with the "security situation" in perpetuity. He will be ruled by General Petraeus' (i.e., Bush's) assessments on the ground.
Obama wants to bomb Pakistan and divert the troops to Afghanistan.
His Iran stance is unclear, if I recall right.
He backs Israel's illegal occupation of Palestinian lands, without criticism.
He "doesn't oppose all wars" - the author here correctly quotes Obama from his so-called antiwar speech. (Obama said that phrase three times in the speech, if you didn't get it the first time.)
For folks having a discussion above about Obama's embrace of the vile Chicago School of Economics and its murderous adherents, take a listen to Democracy Now's recording of a debate between Glenn Greenwald and Cass Sunstein.
Sunstein is one of those "reformed" Chicago Boys and an Obama advisor. In the debate, Sunstein defends Obama's FISA vote that violates the Fourth Amendment. It is really disgusting to hear his poor reasoning (he should have been flunked out of law school). I recommend all Obamamaniacs to listen in and hear the Constitution burning, as well as the smugness and classism of Sunstein. If Obama keeps creeps like Sunstein around, how can you vote for Obama or even think he represents your views?
Sunstein's "Nudge" book concept is just Milton Friedman's unrestrained "free market," in which even murder is OK, as long as investors make a profit. (See Naomi Klein's "The Shock Doctrine" for the ugly details.)
President Barack Obama is a drastic improvement over "100 years in Iraq" Bush/McCain 2012.
For Example:
McCain: "Reform of the Palestinian Authority — finally underway — can only be strengthened by the demise of the suicide bombers' paymaster in Baghdad. Change in Iraq and elsewhere will increase Israel's security, indispensable to achieving an enduring peace with the Palestinians."
John McCain, 'A Fight for Freedom', March 23, 2003
Reality: Removing Saddam Hussein did not bring Israel or Palestine closer to peace
"Mr. Abbas has been ruling by decree since the Hamas takeover of Gaza. The Hamas-dominated Palestinian parliament has been paralyzed for months, with about half the Hamas legislators detained in Israeli jails. Palestinian officials in the West Bank said over the weekend that they had received a new list of 110 fugitives to be offered amnesty by Israel. A month ago, Israel and the Palestinians agreed on the names of 178 militants to be taken off Israel's wanted list, all members of the Fatah-affiliated Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades militia.
"
Isabel Kershner, 'Palestinian Leader Fires Dozens of Hamas Civil Servants', The New York Times, 8/19/07
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/19/world/middleeast/19mideast. html
or how about this one?
McCain: "The force our military uses will be less than proportional to the threat of injury we can expect to face should Saddam Hussein continue to build an arsenal of the world's most destructive weapons."
John McCain, 'The Right War for the Right Reasons', March 12, 2003
Reality: "The Bush administration said the war would cost $50 billion. The U.S. now spends that amount in Iraq every three months....
But statistical studies of death rates before and after the invasion tell some of the grim reality. They suggest additional deaths from a low of around 450,000 in the first 40 months of the war (150,000 of them violent deaths) to 600,000."
Joseph Stiglitz, 2001 Nobel Prize Winner in Economics, former Chair of the President's Council of Economic Advisors (1995 – 1997). , The Toronto Star, March 12, 2008
http://www.thestar.com/comment/article/339461
----------------------
Calling a withdrawal without (1) provisions for residual military training of Iraqis, (2) a focus on political decentralization (we ourselves were a political confederation before we were an economic constitution), and (3) support for democratically engaged Iraqi political parties against nondemocratically engaged political parties (Al Qaeda) as somehow "making sure that [Obama] will not stray from protecting US imperialist interests" strikes me as extremely manipulative seemingly suggesting that somehow Obama's commitment to withdraw from Iraq is hamstrung by some innate desire commitment to "launching new wars and bolstering puppet regimes and corrupt dictatorships throughout the "greater Middle East"."
The reality is that what's happening in Iraq today happened in the wake of many political revolutions where hierarchical power (for example like Iraq, where the power structure is centralized in Baghdad) was redistributed on a sectarian basis- as is the case in Iraq. (Consider for example, the violent political revolution premised on sectarian reapportionment of hierarchical power that established the United States: "The exodus of roughly one hundred thousand loyalists from what became the United States between 1775 and 1784, often after the expropriation of their property, eliminated perhaps one-third of the thousand largest prerevolutionary wealthholders." (Kevin Phillips, 'Wealth and Democracy: A Political History of the American Rich', (New York: Broadway, 2002), 12.)
Obama has said he will be as careful getting out as Bush and other Democrats were careless getting in. What part of that policy suggests he envisions new wars in Iraq or permanent bases like in Germany and Japan? Al Qaeda is a legitimate threat. Saudi-Iran war is a legitimate possibility. Turkish invasion of Kurdistan already happened. It is naive to think a newly forming government can face every challenge facing it without some outside help.
It is simply false to state that removing every single American troop (even those providing humanitarian aid and guarding the US embassy?) will solve the Iraqi political crisis in and of itself. As Obama has said "We have to be as careful getting out of Iraq as we were careless getting in." There are no easy solutions, and it's simply dishonest for anyone to imply there are. It is not in the interest of Iraqis that Americans simply withdraw without enabling them to envision their own future as we do so. What does anyone think will happen if we simply weren't there? You know what, they don't know. And it is in the interest of Iraqis that there are timelines so that they can as people in small and large groupings and solidarities properly evaluate what the withdrawal of Americans will mean to the future of their state/lives.
We should focus on who voted for this war, and who opposed it. Obama opposed it people. Get your head out of your ass.
Dogenwagner:
"We should focus on who voted for this war, and who opposed it. Obama opposed it people. Get your head out of your ass."
Sure, he "opposed" the war (sort of). But during his most recent opportunity to do so (the supplemental appropriations bill) unlike his then-opponent Hillary Clinton, who voted against it, he took a pass on voting because he had to hurry off to Boca Raton to a synagogue to pander to some more Jewish voters. Cute terms like "get your head out of your ass" don't change this fact.
The slight and only tactical differences between Obama and McCain/Bush do not seriously address the fundamental difference between Empire and democracy --- they both fully support Empire.
I have long argued that, "The most important question that the American people should be asking any candidate for president in '08 is not, "Where do you stand on the war?", but, "Where do you stand on the EMPIRE that has taken over our country --- an Empire of which the war in Iraq is only the biggest and most visible crime?"
The revolutionary issue for OUR 2008 election needs to be a clear choice of, by, and for the people for democracy instead of this 'corporatist Empire' which is hiding behind the facade of a two-party 'Vichy' government --- of, by, and for the corporate Empire.
The following article (by Corey Walker in counterpunch) is the best articulation of that need for revolutionary democracy in the US today that I have ever read:
"Getting Beyond the Either / Or Choice
A Kinder, Gentler Imperialism?"
http://www.counterpunch.org/walker07182008.html
waterboard dumpsterdive u.s olympics knew this guy is no good no strait talk from start not asked more on all troup withdrawll all bases closed impeachment war crimes carlyle group pentagon papers redcross hearings need ralph nader dennis k. gravel ron paul
Here's another great new article, by Justin Raimondo (of Antiwar.com) further explaining why Obama is as much a militarist imperialist as McCain --- albeit with an ersatz 'change' rhetorical patina:
"Is Obama the 'Antiwar Candidate'?
Two words of advice for the antiwar voter: Caveat emptor
http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=13183
S-U-R-G-E! The Surge! Rah-rah The Surge!
So, John McCain, when you win in Iraq, what will the final score be? 86-14? 13-10? 34-9? 14-7?
And how will you employ the new culture of sequin-wearing hookers that you've created-- the cheerleading corps-- in greater American society?
No offense intended! Nothing gender-specific implied! We know that all neo-cons are hookers whether female or male. That don't matter!
Given that there's never been a black progressive leader who has NOT been assassinated the minute they seem to have a significant following, all of you so-called progressive posters are asking him to commit suicide by declaring an openly radical political program BEFORE he even gets elected. I guess, white skin privilege knows no bounds. That may seem counterintuitive to suggest many "progressives" are blind to white skin privilege but the fact that not a single poster has even addressed the suicide of a black politician telling The Man how it really is, says a lot. The silence is deafening.
I get the feeling that if Jesus, Gandhi, Mark Twain or even the Dalai Lama were running for prez, there would be posters on here accusing them of being evil "manchurian candidates." Actually, there hasn't been a single president in U.S. history who would past the sniff test of most posters on here, which points to something every true progressive knows: change doesn't come from voting the right person in office. Change comes when huge numbers of people organize and act in concert to force the "leaders" to change. Obama has said as much in a number of campaign speeches, which tells me, he gets it, on some level.
It would be more interesting to have a STRATEGIC conversation about how progressives can bring pressure to bear on Obama. Instead, we get the here's-the-real-Obama "analysis," which clearly generates more heat than light. It's a dead horse that died a thousand deaths. Can we move on?
Is there a pragmatic progressive in the house or do you have to be a purist to post?