They worry so much about dust being handled and care little about keeping those who end up as dust out of harm's way(or those that are to be killed by those sent in harm's way). or the mental problems they get when they come back.

Yep-let's not have a dust mix up. What a terrible thing.

Being buried with nonhuman dust should be considered a great honor.

Perhaps the military SHOULD have its own crematory at Dover AFB (or somewhere.) Seems entirely fitting to me that this is a sober responsibility of government that should not be outsourced at all. For respect of soldiers. And, to keep the Pentagon constantly reminded of WHY these cremation incidents are needed in the first place.

To my thinking bodies are of interest only when they are inhabited, The disposition of corpses is strictly an issue of public sanitation, and should be accomplished with as little fuss as possible. Our burial customs betray a certain necrophilia, prompting us to keep bodies around beyond their shelf life, to lay them out on tables, to put pennies on their eyes, to sprinkle them with flowers, to take them apart to find out why they died, to dress them up in suits and invite everybody over to look at them.

NPR just did a piece about a Marine whose job it is to deliver the remains of fallen soldiers back to their families. "Remains" is often very descriptive of what is left of people from the time they kiss their mothers goodbye through the process of boot camp, mental indoctrination, apprenticeship in the art of homicide, transformation into steely eyed killing machines and finally full participation in the ritual of death when the IED with their name on it puts the finishing touches on their military careers. As practitioners of death, the Marines carry the fascination for dead bodies to romantic extremes. The connection between their deceased buddies and the stuff inside those flag draped boxes is one they will never relinquish. Semper Fi. They hang around and talk to the families as long as necessary to provide support and closure and the assurance that being blown to smithereens while stealing oil is a good and honorable thing, that whereas it might be said that enemy soldiers are simply greased, ours make the ultimate sacrifice. Marines stand vigils by their dead. They talk to them. They pin medals on them. They perform rifle ceremonies and play anthems for them. Like all cultists, they have no doubts about their propriety or their sanity.

Crematoria are nice because they allow us to put junior on the mantle next to his picture and his medals and his flag, rather than having to visit him in some public bone yard. I guess it wouldn't do to have the ashes of dogs and cats mixed in there, knowing that even if you tried to fish them out with a spoon you wouldn't be able to tell them apart. But that's death for you. Nature's way of telling us where not to look for departed souls.

"Being buried with nonhuman dust should be considered a great honor."

Just by having once been in the American military should classify them as dumb animals . The above quote is very fitting.

Well said, voxclamantis. Disposal of remains...Let's not forget the importance of honoring and sanctifying those remains. They have performed such a critical function in our society...keeping us safe from the terrorists and those who would steal our freedoms, while we steal their oil and cheap labor. When the military begins to honor those they have killed, maimed and deprived of their freedoms and livelihood with the same pomp and circumstance, I will begin to believe they believe in Truth, Justice and the American Way.

Any organization whose function is the killing of other human beings, for any reason, is not to be trusted to honor even their own rules and regulations. If they could save a buck or get a kickback from the pet cremator, they would probably use the pet cremation facilities. Look at how they justify the VA's lack of full service delivery. That is all!

I am committed to Oneness through Justice and Transformation

peace,
st john

At least they're not being cremated with the remains of their victims, the humanity of whom seems open to some question.

My dog occupies an important place in my house and I would have not problem whatsoever sharing an urn with him.

However, I do think the this government's lack of concern for its soldiers shows up even in this story. Cheney's comment of a few weeks ago, "SO ???" fits aptly here as well.

Having to creamate our returning troops who died in an unust and illegal war and occupation should be the concern. Not where or how they were finally 'obliterated'.

The Pentagon should be far more concerned about what happens to live returning troops who are medical patients, or far more concerned about sending troops over there who have been sent several times, or who are National Guard troops, or in-active reserve troops who are up to 55 years old when they're forced back into active duty.

RE: US Stops Cremating Troops at Facility That Also Handles Pets

I guess that "supporting our troops" doesn't entail the dignified treatment of remains.

The optics are very bad - the idea that American soldiers who risked their lives and lost them deserve no better than we give our pets. Whatever you think of the war, this is just pathetic!

Then again the American Health Care system for humans is very much like its health care system for pets - if "mommy" is poor, you don't qualify for care.

Good call on segregating the remains of troops. I would not want to dishonor the memory of my dog by having his remains cremated at a facility that also does killers.

Are you guys kidding?
It's WRONG to dispose of our troops' remains in such an undignified manner.
This just shows how disposable the governement views members of the military. Not any surprise- VA hospitals STILL suck, etc. Cut all costs when it comes to the troops, while the warmongers grow rich in the process.
If that were my kid cremated in such a facility, there would be some motherf@cking heads ROLLING.

So, freefood, are your threatening our government? Be very careful! They are "your kids".
peace

The capitalist beast allows its human subjects their death rituals, which help them to vent steam and avoid riots/revolts.

For my own corpse to be, I tend to go along with voxclamatis. And for me, I would love to have my ashes mixed with those of any animal or fish or plant. But I am not everyone, and I have noticed that most people would find such views flippant.

Treatment of the dead has profound cultural and emotional importance for many. The body is still identified with the living being. The rituals are a way for the living to mourn and remember the loved one who has left or to assure passage to some afterworld. This has been true since the days of Neanderthal people and has nothing to do with the military or the funeral industry. Even elephants seem to cry when they visit and touch their dead relatives.

For the military to dishonor the cultures and family feelings of those they sent to die proves that they do not care about them or their families.

And Cheney would say, "SO".

bush has never, except when a Japenese journalist got in, to take shots or allow cameras to witness the remains of the murdered troops and created high security, NO ENTRANCE shit after.
I remember watching during Vietnam, flag draped caskets(now cardboard boxes), being rolled off and removed ceremoniously by the brigade that does just that. To show honor to the dead and to honor their families(as if anything but their child could do that).
Animals are far better than the human species. Cremating them without prior familial alongside pets consent, no.

We need to have a military we can be proud of, people fought and died or you would not be here....

As an animal lover (4 cats, 2 dogs, all rescues) I have no problem with a shared facility. Except I'm not sure I want my furry babies contaminated by brainwashed Pentagon baby killers. Sorry, but I don't think military service is anything to be proud of.

I can't understand why people so preoccupied with such morbid thoughts. There is wedding going on down in Crawford.

People have their pets cremated? Wow. Well if I wanted to have our pet cow cremated, which side of the facility would they use?

Frankly, I think they should have installed a crematory adjacent to the Oval Office back in 2002... and made Bush go through it to get to his desk each day.

Ronald White/WTF/Sandyk77: A lack of empathy is not a virtue.

"Don't bury me, in the pet cemetary"

The story being reported on is further than this merits being treated. There's no reason that the military and civilians must have our own, separate crematoriums. And there's nothing wrong with an individual business providing separate crematoriums for humans and other animals.

However, the story seems like there's a little detail that's omitted, maybe this issue, which should vanish quickly, is due to the sign entering the overall crematorium, etc., property indicates cremation of both 'human' and 'animal', but without also saying that humans are burned in a distinct building or furnace, say. That distinction instead is indicated only on each crematorium building or furnace, but while they're not within view from the road or property entrance. (The article doesn't describe the layout of this property, so I don't know what it is.)

It'd then be expectable for people using this business for their first time to think that all animals are burned in the same building or furnace. That, or either way, shouldn't be a problem anyway, but plenty of people would then and easily assume that the same building or furnace is used for all animals, human and other, and this offending their "senses" and/or beliefs.

But the solution is simple and it's that the only thing the military must do now is to inform everyone that all of this was only due to an innocent and understandable mistake, confusion, mistaken assumption, due to ambiguity in a business sign; and that the military base will continue to use the same cremator since there's no-longer a cause for concern. It's a mouthful, but I think it covers the essential points and is easy to quickly do.

My only question about this story is only related to it, and it's whether or not the families of the soldiers cremated by the military have any say about this? And if they don't have a say, then do they at least get the chance to see the bodies before cremation? Do they get to learn of it before it's done?

I remember it being reported a few or more years ago that families of U.S. soldiers killed in line of service were denied the right to see the bodies of the soldiers brought back to the U.S. And I don't recall having ever read or heard that this rule of the Bush-Cheney cabal had changed yet.

If the families are denied the right to see the bodies of their loved ones, then this is makes the whole of this very peculiar. Either, the Bush admin. would enjoy being damn (literally) stupid, inane, asinine, ... which I guess or think they are anyway, so more stupid, ..., then; or they love being sadistic at any time, for there's absolutely no strategic (criminal of course) need that corresponds to denying this right, and dignity. Even if the govt "saved" money from not covering the expenses of families traveling to see the bodies of their loved ones by denying this right, and for Bush et al to pilfer the money for themselves or their "friends", then this could not amount to enough money for it to be an issue for the govt. It should be trivial for the govt to cover such expenses; and it would also show some dignity, for denying the right is not sub-human, it's sub-animal(ian), it's ... complete offal.

It'd cause me to question what really is inside the coffins when flown to the U.S., and what do the ashes of the remains of the burned bodies and given to the families really originate from?. I'd definitely be curious, because this would be a story that makes no sense at all (outside of black market "business") for there's no justifiable reason for denying rights.

It's the sole issue that I see as specific to the topic of what's done with the bodies of these soldiers. Govt outsourcing the cremation work is not an issue, except when there isn't a suitable or quailfiable business near enough for the military base to not need its own crematory, or when the govt signficantly overpays for the cremation service. In the latter case, the govt only needs to RFPs, requests for proposals, letting different business bid for contracts.

And instead of worrying about whether or not the military should use business cremators, the military needs to gete with finally abiding by the Constitutition and therefore international laws and conventions the U.S. is co-signatory to or of; no more resource wars, no more wars for 'global empire', and that means at all phases of these wars and which begins like John Perkins says, with the 'economic hit men', and so on. These are the real issues.

Maybe Vetranarians should be allowed to take human patients!

Let's not condemn the soldier for the cause. If Obama decides that we should end the war in Iraq and send peacekeepers to Darfur, then what may be the same guys will be heros. But it is politicians who decides whether they are heros or zeros by deciding the mission.

A person can act worse or better than command dictates, but it is still the command which dictates.

There was a letter in today's paper where someone who bombed during WWII said that if they could not clearly see the target (ie cloudy) to return to base and bomb it another day. For ever commander who set that standard was another commander who had a quota of targets to be hit hell or high water. In both cases, the pressure was on the soldier to comply with command.

Let's give our peacekeepers better orders. And all we need, if we are being legitimate, are peace keepers.

Three things stand out in this article:

1. The military-industrial-media complex has screwed up priorities!

2. Single individual complains and is able to galvanize the DoD into rapidly responding..amazing!

3. Unlike ordinary complaints to the DoD, this one was handled sans the customary bureaucratic SNAFU or FUBAR...what gives? who's the poobah?

The hidden message here is they really don't see us as any different than animals.

We live in a pathocracy, a nation run by psycopaths. Stuff like this is their idea of a joke.

Read the Politics of Ponerology. The term "ponerology" came from the Greek word, poneros, meaning "evil". These are not normal people in that they do not consider you people, you are animals to them. They are the chosen people
who believe it is their role to control the animals, otherwise known as normal people.

vaudree:

I think you're confused as to the definition of a peacekeeper.

People who serve in the military are not peacekeepers, they are trained as killers, not as peacekeepers!

A peacekeeper can be defined as an individual who maintain peace, specifically to reduce or eliminate armed conflict by the use of neutral troops to enforce a truce or separate hostile groups! By that definition, American troops haven't yet sought to reduce or eliminate the armed conflict in either Iraq or Afghanistan; and they're hardly neutral to boot!

sandyk77 May 10th, 2008 11:15 pm
As an animal lover (4 cats, 2 dogs, all rescues) I have no problem with a shared facility. Except I'm not sure I want my furry babies contaminated by brainwashed Pentagon baby killers. Sorry, but I don't think military service is anything to be proud of

I am sure persons such as Cindy Sheehan and my friend Celeste Zappala, both Bronze Star Familys for Peace must feel a hell of of a lot better hearing that. You animals, normally this is true, have more humanity in their tails than you.

MiMiCcS May 11th, 2008 5:35 am
The hidden message here is they really don't see us as any different than animals.

We live in a pathocracy, a nation run by psycopaths. Stuff like this is their idea of a joke.

Read the Politics of Ponerology. The term "ponerology" came from the Greek word, poneros, meaning "evil". These are not normal people in that they do not consider you people, you are animals to them. They are the chosen people
who believe it is their role to control the animals, otherwise known as normal people.

Ponerology is a Scientific study of pure Evil. The author believed that, there are no opathys involved, superceding Sociopathology and other pathologys of the mind was Ponerology. He used a word derived from an older religion it referenced. They are Ponerologists to the nth degree by far.
The Politics of Ponerology was authored by permission by the original author of The Science of Ponerology when it was refused admission into the US, it allowed it to be published here as the Politics of.

Kem
Agree this story is just another side track filler that is not the real issue.
Dust to dust is what they say, even if you are mixed with a little sheba or king or pepper....

Why is the military necessary when we, as the world's superpower, have thousands of nukes, missiles, weapons of mass destruction, etc. to use if a foreign country ever attacked us? I seriously doubt that any country is insane enough to do that.

It seems the military is only useful if we want to occupy and colonize a country (based on "faulty" intelligence), war profiteering, and provide jobs for otherwise unemployed persons.

Wasn't it Henry Kissinger, who never served in the military I'm sure, who called soldiers "dumb animals?" Bet Bush, Cheney, and the rest of the war profiteering pigs who never served in the military and never went to battle -- are getting a good laugh about that.

No I don't lack empathy, but I DON'T understand why otherwise intelligent people would allow themselves to be totally brainwashed by the military industrial complex; especially now just to be used up by the masters of war pigs.
I've been anti war since I was 12 years old (Vietnam) and in my day there was no shame in skipping off to Canada or Europe and telling this government to f--- off. If you find it offensive that I value my animals over brainwashed humans, so be it. And I have military in my family and I think they are stupid too!

If this does not clue people as to how disposable American soldiers are perceived to be by the Bush, Cheney, & Co. in their insane scheme, then nothing will. It is confirmation that the Bush crime family, in addition to their various outrages, are also a bunch of sanctimonious hypocrites for whom a just fate would be being dropped off in Sadr City with nothing but the clothes on their backs.

SandyK77, I agree. Animals kill just to survive, unlike humans who kill because of malice, hate, greed, jealousy, etc.

"My only question about this story is only related to it, and it's whether or not the families of the soldiers cremated by the military have any say about this?"

We have not heard from family members, so maybe this has been hidden for a reason. How do we know that they pentagon has not misreporting the numnber of Iraq soldiers killed and cremated?

Just read this comment elsewhere...and I agree....
"How do we know that the pentagon has not been cremating untold numbers of US soldiers, who have no family to look out for them? I have long felt the pentagon was not telling the truth about the numbers of soldiers killed in Iraq. Vietnam proved that the pentagon would lie about these things and they have only gotten more corrupt in recent years.The only reason this was discovered was because a friend wanted to attended the cremation of his buddy and saw the "'Friends Forever Pet Cremation Service.'on the outside. How do we know they have really been reporting the truth about how many they have cremated at this pet crematory in DC? Judging from history, we know that the pentagon does not tell the truth. If it were only 200 soldiers, why did then need to use a pet cremation services? If they weren't doing anything sinister, why did they suddenly halt this when it came to light? This screams Mob hiding the bodies to me.

canuckchuck May 11th, 2008 3:09 am
"Don't bury me, in the pet cemetary

Damn, THAT'S what happened to bab's boy!!! They went beyond the boundary.....

lillulu May 11th, 2008 1:52 pm
SandyK77, I agree. Animals kill just to survive, unlike humans who kill because of malice, hate, greed, jealousy, etc.

Just short of the 7 deadly sins, thanks lillulu!
Old soul kindred spirits do tend to find each other, don't they...

WTF - there are reasons that the American courts refuse to accept that Omar Khadr was a child soldier - much of the recruiting is done while the American kids are still in highschool. Others join because because it pays more than working at sev.

I hope that Omar Khadr is shown a little bit more respect in death than he was in life. And I hope the same for each and every soldier serving in this illegal war.

RE: People who serve in the military are not peacekeepers, they are trained as killers, not as peacekeepers!

DiabloRojo, I've heard the "one dollar for rebuilding for every 10 dollars spent on combat" to think of Afghanistan as a peacekeeping mission. They do just enough rebuilding to pacify the public but are more concerned about occupation. The most generous description of the mission is a Jeckle-Hyde mission where one day you are handing out candy to children and the next day you are shooting at their parents (ok, maybe not that sweet).

Peacekeeping is more noble a calling that combat, you agree, though? Though even a peacekeeper can come back in a body bag.

RE: - And for me, I would love to have my ashes mixed with those of any animal or fish or plant. (jclientelle)(trang says something similar)

But you can do that by choice - would you be ok with your ashes being mixed with Ronald Reagan's or mixed with gun powder to make bullets?

RE: - I remember it being reported a few or more years ago that families of U.S. soldiers killed in line of service were denied the right to see the bodies of the soldiers brought back to the U.S. And I don't recall having ever read or heard that this rule of the Bush-Cheney cabal had changed yet.

I think if the TV is on during the right time of night, the general public sees ours. What we usually see is a few seconds of it as they do the three minute news update every hour. They try to keep the cameras away from family members who are crying too much - out of respect. From Tuesday, May 6 2008 (see video to right):

Canadian soldier killed in southern Afghanistan

An Alberta-based soldier has been killed and another Canadian wounded in a gun battle after militant fighters ambushed their foot patrol in a rural area of southern Afghanistan, the military said Tuesday.

Cpl. Michael Starker, a reservist with 15 Field Ambulance, was killed by enemy fire at about 11:45 a.m. local time Tuesday in the Pashmul region, in the Zhari district outside Kandahar city.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/calgary/story/2008/05/06/afghanistan.html

Paramedics offer condolences to soldier's family

Hundreds of Calgary paramedics shared their memories and tributes in a book Saturday for the family of Cpl. Michael Starker, killed in Afghanistan this week. ...

The fallen soldier returned to Canada on Friday on a military plane that landed at Canadian Forces Base Trenton in eastern Ontario. His wife, Nicole, and other family were on the tarmac for the repatriation ceremony.

A public funeral is being planned for Calgary, but the time and location have not yet been released.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/calgary/story/2008/05/10/starker-condolences.html

U.S. soldier dies in CFB Wainwright accident

An American soldier based near Seattle, Wash., was killed Monday during a Canadian military exercise at a base in east-central Alberta.

The U.S. army reservist died during a training exercise dubbed Maple Guardian being conducted at CFB Wainwright, 200 kilometres east of Edmonton, Canadian Forces Capt. Tom St. Denis said on Tuesday.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/edmonton/story/2008/05/06/wainwright-death.html

RE: - Just short of the 7 deadly sins

A few of the new sins are a bit to - er - inconvenient to be reported in the American Press:

KEM PATRICK May 11th, 2008 12:35 am
People have their pets cremated? Wow. Well if I wanted to have our pet cow cremated, which side of the facility would they use?

The one on the left because the right is brainwashed...

There is good and bad in every conflict - those who take more liberties than allowed and those who show more humanity than allowed:

Canadian contractor faces U.S. court martial in Iraq

The United States military has ordered a court-martial for a Canadian civilian contractor who has been charged with aggravated assault while working for the U.S. army in Iraq.

The last time there was a similar military prosecution was in the Vietnam War.

Alaa "Alex" Mohammad Ali is accused of stabbing another civilian contractor four times during a fight in February on an army base west of Baghdad.

Ali holds Iraqi-Canadian citizenship and was working as a translator. The victim suffered chest wounds.

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20080511/cdn_iraq_080511/20080511/

WW2 German fighter pilot saved U.S. bomber crew

That's when Stigler saw the bomber overhead, trying to limp home.

"I went after him (to) finish him off," Stigler said.

But when Stigler got close enough to see the American bomber, he saw Brown's bleeding wounds and realized he couldn't shoot. Instead, he did something that could have seen him court marshalled and shot for dereliction of duty -- he guided the B-17 out of Germany.

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20080511/franz_stigler_080511/20080511?hub=Canada