Giant Antarctic Ice Shelf Breaks Into The Sea
A vast hunk of floating ice has broken away from the Antarctic peninsula, threatening the collapse of a much larger ice shelf behind it, in a development that has shocked climate scientists.
Satellite images show that about 160 square miles of the Wilkins ice shelf has been lost since the end of February, leaving the ice interior now "hanging by a thread".
The collapsing shelf suggests that climate change could be forcing change much more quickly than scientists had predicted.
"The ice shelf is hanging by a thread," said Professor David Vaughan of the British Antarctic Survey (BAS). "We'll know in the next few days or weeks what its fate will be."
The Wilkins shelf covers an area of 5,600 square miles (14,500 sq km). It is now protected by just a thin thread of ice between two islands.
Vaughan was a member of the team that predicted in 1993 that global warming could cause the Wilkins shelf to collapse within 30 years.
The shedding of peripheral floating ice shelves has occurred elsewhere on the peninsula, allowing inland ice to move towards the sea and cause rising sea levels.
Some areas of the frozen continent have been cooler in recent years, and have added ice through accumulated snowfall. This year, the thin floating layer of sea ice that forms each austral winter and fades in summer has in fact been larger than usual, in contrast to the Arctic.
But in other parts - such as the West Antarctic ice sheet - ice is being lost to the sea.
Climate scientists around Antarctica were taken by surprise by the new find. "Wilkins is the largest ice shelf on the Antarctic peninsula yet to be threatened," Vaughan said.
"I didn't expect to see things happen this quickly. We predicted it would happen, but it's happened twice as fast as we predicted."
The retreat of the shelf was first spotted from satellite data by Ted Scambos, a glaciologist at the University of Colorado.
He alerted the BAS, which sent an aircraft to assess the extent of the damage.
Jim Elliott, who filmed part of the breakup, said: "It was awesome. We flew along the main crack and observed the sheer scale of movement from the breakage. Big chunks of ice, the size of small houses, look as though they've been thrown around like rubble - it's like an explosion."
The Antarctic peninsula, which stretches north from the frozen continent towards South America, has experienced unprecedented warming over the past 50 years.
Six other ice shelves have already been lost entirely - the Prince Gustav Channel, Larsen Inlet, Larsen B, Wordie, Muller and Jones shelves.
But the Wilkins shelf is farther south than other ice that has retreated, so should be better protected by colder temperatures.
Vaughan said: "It's bigger than any ice shelf we've seen retreating before, and in the long term it could be a taste of other things to come. It is another indication of the impact that climate change is having on the region."
© 2008 The Guardian
Delicious
Digg
StumbleUpon
Newsvine
Facebook
Google
Yahoo
Technorati
101 Comments so far
Show Allmethane othewise known as clean burning natural gas. if its going to poof out of the artic we should drill now and put it to use.It is much less of a greenhouse gas after it has been burned. dont fear, think.
Kem - Are you asserting that Greenland is now warmer than it was during the mideveal warm period?
Very few of the Vikings who first went to settle "Green"land, stayed for more than a year. Some did build small outpost villages on the southern shorelines. The vast majority migrated to Vinland, some settled in North America for awhile, most returned to Norway, Denmark and Sweden.
The Aleut's, or Eskimos, lived there and in Alaska, the Hudson Bay region for centuries, they still do. Those hardy people learned how to cope with nature and lived with what it provided. Of course when the missionaries arrived, their life style altered dramatically and those true Aleuts are almost extinct if not already.
So anyway OBVIOUS, please do not write that Greenland was nice and warm a few hundred or a few thousand years ago, because it is just not so. Certainly some years, even epochs, were more mild than others over the centuries, but NOTHING to come CLOSE to compare with what is now happening.
Http://www.energybulletin.net/3647.html
Mr. ~Obvious~ A very serious and infornative read, takes about three minutes. It's good to be well informed.
Well Mr. ~Obvious~. You see the Vikings, Eric THe Red and his son, named it "Greenland", it was anything but green. But they wanted settlers to move there and they succeeded by that mis-information. The current weather and climate conditions on Greenland have not been that way for at least 50 million years. The thousands of ice core samples taken from there prove that fact.
While we are doing all we can by planting trees and picking up trash, the global warming from burning fossil and oil fuels continues. That's the major problem.
sunny24 - There is a solution. Do what you can yourself to improve things. Plant trees, pick up trash, reduce your footprint. Lead by example and don't expect others to follow words. Leave your little bit of earth better than you found it.
When over 1.4 Billion people on this planet have to suffer with little access to drinking water and sanitary conditions and the G.O.D of the ruling class is Greed, Oil and Drugs to opiate the people, it is beyond my comprehension that our survival mentality has sunk to an all time low. I myself as far back in the 1960's was told that I was a quack and nick-named "Queen of Gloom and Doom", by some of my peers, who just wanted to have a good time. As millions are being spent to put someone in office in this country, and others we are missing the point, as usual. Solutions are not being sought or backed up financially. When we can pay millions just for pictures of celebrities children, to sell a magazine and let the biggest holocaust imaginable happen to billions I feel totally insane in an insane world. I am running out of hope and solutions, because this nightmare is real and only getting worse.
Kem - What caused Greenland to warm up during the mideveal period - You know, when the vikings lived there?
Well ~ME ALSO TOO~, did you read ~Paul K's~ blog? Do you think he's stupid, or trying to decieve us?
BTW, The ice shelf which is melting the fastest in Anarctica is in the far south of that continent. That's where the very importnat cold ocean river begins too.
I just do not understnd why ANYONE would deny global warming, when a five year old can see with their own eyes the melting glaciers all over the planet, the barren mountain tops all over the planet, and the hundreds of drying out lakes in the Arctic. Greenland is now rapidly becoming truly "green" and their mountins no longer are ice covered as they have been for the past 50 million years.
It's a myth, alright, those mountain tops are actually covered with snow and ice, it's a mirage.
Kem...the sweeper they approach-with IS 'loaded' (and an 'AA-12')! They will fool folks 'scared enough' about 'methane' and other 'bogymen' to allow more-Nukes and Carbon-Taxing/Caps to institute their long-sought-after 'NWO' -- while they all continue to make 'more $ than G_d' by further Propaganda and exploitation about 'energy/food/defense'...and this 'Environmental-nonsense'...
"MeAlsoToo_ARealist:
interesdting article, I agree with the biofuels argument: it is about demand issues not supply, ie getting out of 2 many cars rather than supplying them with another power source"
Bio-fuels for small-trucks/vehicles/stationary-engines/car-fleets is NOT much of an 'answer' -- nor are 'hybrids' or electricity [however, converting to cheap-to-refine/cleaner LPG IS a good&Practical partial-Answer -- ask Ahnold about his Hummers!].
And -- the Antarctic is 'breaking-up' ONLY due to intentional 'warming' in the Arctic/North...the Truth is that the artificial/deliberate-Warming in the North is currently ADDING ice in the South (NOT 'melting-it').
Do some Googling, and you'll all know that Fact...
[Or, read comments here: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/03/28/7943/
and find out 'why' all this crap is 'happening', and improperly motivating most-here -- including the well-intentioned, like Kem]
Hey, if you all want to see a site on where the aliens have landed, I could find one for you. I'll start by seeing if their is a link on the site that coco posted. My point is that if you want anyone with any influence to take you seriously, then point to the scientific evidence (e.g. scientific journal papers, education sites, etc.), not wacko sites.
Hi CoCo, thank you for the link. That doesn't cover the methane release thoroughly though, which is the real serious problem.
The Bible doesn't give the whole story babe, there were lots of others here besides Adam and Eve. The entire history is lost. Remember Cain went to the land of Nod and took a wife and God tatooted him with a special mark so no one would kill him because he was a murderer. We come from the fallen angels.
Sorry about the bird but cats have to eat too.
How much will the ocean rise, from the tears shed?
and if anyone still doesn't believe kem then take a look at:
www.planetextinction.com
and start acting..................
KEM PATRICK
i didn't want to think about the cat scenario..............
however, according to the 'bible' it only took 2. does that mean we are all inbred??? no wonder the world is crazy...........
CIVIL BEHAVIOUR
thanks for the book link. i always like to hear of different books as i a an avid reader. i'm waiting for one from the u.k. 'the world without us' by david weisman. sorry you can't sell your home and get out of the rat race........
CHEEKY
'as a species i think we humans have been rather spectacular'......yeah, spectacularly stupid............
It seems to me the inevitable fact that at some point we're all gonna die. It could be artic methane farts or an aneurysm in your sleep. At some point we're all gonna go and there may not be a whole lot we can do to dictate how. As a species I think we humans have been rather spectacular and it would seem we are likely to come to a spectacularly avoidable end. I am sad for this because I rather like the idea of having grandchildren and a reasonable belief that they will have the blessings of friends and family and longevity on a beautiful planet. But as so many before have very eloquently stated, given our wildly unsustainable living habits this isn't likely. So it seems a choice needs to be made on how to respond in the living of whatever life we do have. Quite often I notice people shy away from hard choices especially when they aren't extrinsically rewarding or offering an easy solution. There are simple solutions, but do not be so foolish as to mistake simple for easy. Simple is rarely easy despite the common misconception and I think misuse of the word. It is a simple thing to grow a vegetable patch from which to feed yourself and your family, but it's not an easy thing to do. It is a simple thing to eat healthy and exercise to stay fit but it is not an easy thing to do if it is not your existing lifestyle. If simple really were easy, many more people would live simply, but they don't hence our issue of questionable existence. We have not been good company to the earth and are rapidly wearing out our welcome. As with any unwelcome guests, we risk loosing our invitation. Just because we're gone doesn't mean the earth will be. It was here before us and will be here long after us. I think it was George Carlin who said, the earth isn't going anywhere, the humans are. it will just be earth with plastic.
Since this thread is still going I am going to add a book I read a month or so ago which sheds a lot of light on the connection between paleontology and what the carbon emissions did in the last greatest extinction that resulted from the gases in the atmosphere.
I think you'd like it Kem.
Under a Green Sky by Peter Ward Just think of a green sky and you get the idea of what he covers. Your methane from permafrost is a huge danger but if the conveyor shuts down the hydrates will bring to a close humanity as we have known it.
What is scary about this book is the work has been done and is verifiable. Rocks don't lie.
And SuZen we have been trying for close to two years now to sell this wonderful historic little bungalow in West Palm Beach so we could move to a place to buy some land to farm and getting away from this madness. Can't sell and feel more trapped than ever what with the economic situation the way it is.
This is all so much more serious than 99% of the world can even imagine.
Is Biosphere 2 still for sale? Sounds like the perfect place to weather the coming storm. Sorry for the rest of the world, but maybe about six of us humans will be able to survive.
KEM PATRICK
anagram of methane: hate men. so mother nature will get her revenge.......
SUZEN
costa rica sounds like a wonderful idea and if i hadn't just moved to southern europe i might have joined you there. i love the frogs and the hummingbirds and the butterflies. and as i walk to the village i listen to all the sounds of the wild birds. and three days ago a tiny sardinian warbler was sitting by the side of the road. i don't know what ailed him but he wasn't moving. so i picked him up and took him to a safer place in the hedgerow, promising him that if he was still there when i returned i would take him home. he must have recovered...............
We need to stop propagating one portion of the methane releases - animals raised for human consumption.
http://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2006nl/dec/061200.htm
It's global warming and the result will be methane gas releases. Nothing else is of that importance. ___ NOTHING ELSE.
I'm done.
The very and perhaps most important aspect of this Anartic ice shelf collapse is this:
The ocean water beneath the shelf is very cold, a cold river flows northward in the Pacific towards Alaska, much like the Gulf stream of warm water which flows northward in the Atlantic towards Greenland and Europe.
The cold water helps to maintain the methane clathrates in the sea beds in the northern area of our planet. Those clathrates are safe from allowing methane gas to escape into our atmophere, if under BOTH pressure AND cold temperatures. Add that to the Arctic perma frost thaw. ___ Bye-by all.
That cold water is also where the vital to ALL life, ocean's phytoplankton bloom, those microscopic plants supply the vast amount of our oxygen, from 60 to 70% or more.
http://www.whyplankton.com
Rebel Farmer, JohhnyCanuck, et. al.........Come on down to Costa Rica and help me build a sustainable farm. I'm out of the insanity they call the U.S. and living happily in the jungle. Really, it's time to face the facts, folks, the world is falling apart and time to head for high ground. Why is it for the most part it's only the ANIMALS that are smart enough to fly/run/swim away from tsunamis and such while the humans sit around and argue the pros and cons? There's GOT to be a few out there with some inherent common sense still intact, a few that haven't succumbed to the climate of fear and FOX. If all the true progressives left the country and headed south, we could form our own little sustainable country, be an example of something that works. Really, it only takes a few brave souls to begin.....
The Forbidden Fuel
Alcohol Can Be a Gas by Dave Blume, published by the
International Institute for Ecological Agriculture, 2007, 630 pages, $59 hardcover.
In the forward written for this book in 1983, when the project was first started, R. Buckminster Fuller writes that it is possible to harvest enough energy to sustainably meet humanity's needs through solar sources while completely phasing out all fossil fuels and atomic energy. Many know Bucky Fuller for his work on geodesic domes. Few are aware that he was also in charge of alternative energy research for the U.S. military during WWII, and held ethanol fuel in great esteem. The author was inspired and mentored by Fuller in the 1980's, and it could be said that this book is the culmination of Fuller's work in this field.
The intent of the 600+ pages of Alcohol Can Be a Gas is to act as a complete tool kit to revolutionize our transportation fuel system, from the grassroots up. It combines sweeping vision with intricate ecological and mechanical detail, starting with a thorough history of the use of alcohol as a fuel for internal combustion engines.
The Model T car was designed as a flex-fuel vehicle, and got 34 MPG on alcohol until prohibition put an end to small-scale ethanol production. "There's a lot that goes on in the world of energy that you never see on the 11 o'clock news" writes the author. "The control of a country's energy is the ultimate control of its people."
Part of the beauty of this book is its ecological sensibility. Blume is an organic farmer and brings 20+ years of bioregional wisdom to his writing. Two chapters contrast the nightmare of America continuing on its present energy course vs. retooling the way we do agriculture and energy along the regenerative principles of Permaculture design. There are sidebars on the restoration of degraded prairie farmland using highly complex fuel crop polycultures, and the practice of swale contour farming to replenish groundwater and topsoil.
His vision for a grassroots ethanol revolution is ambitious but conceivable: "A nationwide switch to organic farming is in order, but it can't work if we maintain a monoculture-based system, with its present emphasis on corn farming."
More here: http://peakoil.ning.com/forum/topic/show?id=674788%3ATopic%3A2207
"Wake up and feel 'less scared and more resolved' will ya." From MeAlsotoo_A realist. A Realist???
You know that's sort of like a family of four is watching a murdering madman race towards their house, armed with a 12 gage street sweeper shotgun. The mother yells out, "Do somethng, ___ quick,___ he's going to kill all of us."
And the father says, "Well, MAYBE the gun isn't loaded, or MAYBE he'll stop and forget it, or MAYBE he'll shoot and miss us all, don't be scared, __ be resolved. Let's sit down and plan on moving to Michigan where it's safer. Oops, he's getting close, better toss the kids in the tub and fill it and tell them to hide underwater.
Maybe the corporatists and right-wing won't need nu-q-ler war for Armageddon. Global warming could accomplish this task, and all they have to do is what they've been doing for the past 30 years - nothing (or at least nothing to remedy the situation. They've all been working pretty hard to make sure that their coffers stay full).
Everyone better teach their children and grandkids how to breathe underwater also I suppose. Of course if one really loved their kids, they may wish to prostest the real cause of the problem instead of denying and or ignoring the true facts.
Anyone here ever stuck their head into a cess pool? That's the smell of methane gas, or a horse's ass fart.
It is a real "pleasure" to have the privelage of being able to converse this way with so many, who are SO, SOOOO intelligent and KNOW soooo much about the issue. I do wish someone would argue with the scientists by name and state why those scientists are wrong.
Oh, ~PAUL K~, the other two methane releases were not caused by sunbeams, the cause was global warming however, from volcanic action. Our present man made C02 releases into the atmosphere are equivelent to 17,000 large volcanos spewing all at the same time.
MeAlsoToo_ARealist:
interesdting article, I agree with the biofuels argument: it is about demand issues not supply, ie getting out of 2 many cars rather than supplying them with another power source.
Im stil gonna have a go at the breathing though
'Premier ne puis, Second ne daigne, de Rothschild suis'...
"Next, can humans fight back, even at the last minute?"
Yes -- we can nuke Mercury into shielding-dust/rubble, or orbit Mylar-shards to reflect-out (but, we won't need-to...and you can take that prediction to your Reserve-bank!).
CO2 actually helps in COOLING the planet (it's the other-garbage you need to worry-about -- NOT a "carbon-cap"!). And, CO2 allows trees/plants/algae/plankton to 'respire' your needed O2. Coal and gasoline and petrol-diesels are NOT needed, economical, beneficial (why the eugenicist-Rockefeller's from JDR [who got his initial-funding the 'old-fashioned way' -- just like JPMorgan and the University of Chicago and Straussians/'economists' there and Yale] has 'pushed' them at us since the 1800's -- these only allow massive-privatization/monopolization and BS 'shortages' supposedly due 'peak oil' and 'sulfur-content', but REALLY due to refinement/shipping controls&price-Jacking'. And, due to coal-fired/unregulated massive/distant AC-Utilities [who do you think killed Mr's Diesel and Tesla?]. And, blackmailed Wilson and killed Garfield/Lincoln/Jackson/native-Americans and the Czar? Who won the 'Revolution' or the War of 1812 (read the Jay or Paris/1783-Treaties), or the 'Civil'-one? [Or Click my Name].
Do SOMETHING besides the 'wrong thing'...for Pity's-Sake.
Wake up -- and feel 'less scared, and more resolved'...will ya?
"A mind is a terrible thing"...[to waste] -- Quayle [a PNAC-signatory, like Cheney/Jeb/Karizai]
Industry's blitzkrieg against Al Gore has triumphed. Even progressives wrote him off.
"Im gonna have a real stab at adapting to breathing under water, I'll let you all know how it went…"
They beat you to it in "Waterworld"...(which will also 'never-happen').
What will-happen is worldwide starvation/panic/'shortages'/migrations/strife due to intentional climate-degradation/desertification/water-shortage/chaos and a whole lot of 'sudden population control' (thanks to Disney and others pushing the Mythos of 'environmentalism' -- instead of people waking up to the Interests of 'Western Capitalism and Central-Banking').
Enjoy your "eco-activism" and carbon-taxation into a NWO [and this, too: http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=7693 ]
Seaweed has pointed out that Alaskamaid is looking forward to the day when Alaska warms up. What Alaskamaid may be missing is the fact that there will be little productive topsoil available for agriculture. A layer of rich topsoil is a prerequisite. With peak oil here or imminent, we know we won't have fuel-based fertilizers to compensate for non-existent rich soils (or onto depleted soil, as is the norm in agri-business now).
I looked at the methane gas article. My quick thoughts:
I can't say that it's wrong.
The historical evidence is of course not at all conclusive. For example, these days most of the carbon is locked up in coal deposits. Was there far more free carbon on the polar surface, in the form of polar permafrost methane-releasing chemicals, 250 million years ago?
We need to also think in terms of a mini-disaster. What if a 1/10 version of this disaster comes to pass?
Next, can humans fight back, even at the last minute? Could we cheaply powder Siberia with a thin layer of white reflective dust or white pebbles every spring, to increase the land's solar reflectivity? Could we paint 90% of the land areas on rocky peaks with reflective white paint every 50 years? Could we shield the edges of the Arctic Ocean ice to reduce wave action destruction, again to change the earth's albedo? Could we put more water vapor into the stratosphere each morning, creating cirrus clouds, cooling the earth, much as we now do absent-mindedly over the U.S. with our jet contrails?
Next, instead of going into space, we'd probably think about building our own spaceships on earth.
This is an unpleasant thought, but why can't humans build six billion oxygen extraction machines on earth? My sister had one for home care, and an oxygen tube.
My sense is that for a mini-disaster, annual plants can reasonably evolve to handle much higher CO2 emissions. For a full-fledged disaster, well, we'd have a lot of air-enclosed greenhouses.
Humans adapt. A very few humans will always decide to die, but most will put up an appropriate shelter against trouble.
Very sci-fi here.
However, the moral is, we'd be much saner if we cut human CO2 production now.
I do not disagree with the impending methane gas theory. I actually believe that it makes sense. The other theory about the sun's natural cycles also makes sense to me. I believe that the methane gas AND sun cycles caused global warming in the past - and will do so again. Does this give the corporate greedsters the right to further exaccerbate the situation by spewing even more carbon into the atmoshere just to line their pockets and egos with more gelt and power? At least when methane and sun warming occured before, they weren't made even worse by carbon emissions.
Im gonna have a real stab at adapting to breathing under water, I'll let you all know how it went...
~ENN~ You said better than I did. That's reality.
This is funny. ___ Sad also. I just read ~ME ALSO TOO, A REALIST~ and ~SEAWEED'S~ comments.
I don't know why I bothered to post any blogs here. Evidently neither one bothered to read an experts opinion on the subject of the Arctic methane gas. It is going to happen, any time now and no one wishes to believe it, so the possibility is ignored.
Here's another very good book on the subject. ___Michael J. Benton's book ___ "When Life Nearly Died" ___ It tells in detail, how almost all life was eradicated within hours, when methane gas bloomed out into Earth's atmosphere and life suffocated. It took several million years for the atmosphere to stabalize and life to begin evolving on this unique water world once again.
So before you start writng about what is going to happen in 40, 50, or a 100 years, perhps you should read it. And it don't matter if the rich neo-cons have stored seeds, wine, cheeze and toilet paper to last twenty, or a hundred years, unless they have lots of bottled oxygen stored with it. __ LOTS!! Enough for several million years.
"The collapsing shelf suggests that climate change could be forcing change much more quickly than scientists had predicted."
The truth is they don't know. Their predictions and models are inadequate to the task. But Nature is telling us. And Nature is what we should listen to. Forget these other guys and focus on the local. Watch and listen and see what nature is telling us, loud and clear.
@Rebel Farmer and KEM you guys are saying it the way I read the signs of Nature.
The scientists will speculate and because of scientific method and peer review systems and special interests and economic "realities" (Pfft!) will be forced into debates and proofs and doubts and whatnot ad infinitum until the proof finally drowns them in reality. Such will still be speculating on causes and whatnot as the water laps their ankles and soaks the laboratory carpet. Crikey, they'll be measuring rate of rise and comparing notes until the power goes off and still debating! It's crass is what it is. But that's exactly the thinking -- the ideological thinking -- that has got us into this mess in the first place. Speculating on what is rather than seeing what is.
If the human race want to survive at all, then we have to act to create peace, end war, fix planet. Those are the priorities.
However, I hold no hope that those priorities will occur. The ideological "thinking" that passes for intelligence simply isn't thinking at all. There is no intelligence behind it, just a false economic imperative that grabs, clutches, pillages and plunders everything in sight.
Alaskamaid is looking forward to the day when Alaska (and other such 'cold' states get longer growing seasons due to global warming. At first, this might sound like a good thing. However, one must realize that if the whole planet warms, then places like Texas will become uninhabitable. Now just what do you think those power-crazed Texans will do when they see that there is good land and climate in Alaska and Maine for the taking. They will do just what they're doing now: Take it by force! Alaska and Maine; prepare yourselves for shock and awe.
I do want to thank Alaskamaid for her comments. For a while there I was thinking that all the morons lived in Maine. Alaskamaid proved me wrong.
Kem...the 'methane threat' is real-enough, but is being used/exploited for an agenda counter to 'what we really want/need'.
The 'powers that be' are WELL aware of 'climate-risks' (and Yes, they 'skate the edge' to achieve their Goals). BUT, they will NOT destroy THEIR grandchildren's-world -- and Proof of that is the Norwegian-Vault into which they invested-so-much to save 'real food' for _their_ great-grandchildren (after they get the massive 'die-down of poor' Monsanto and friends are working-towards). Look at the List of supporters/'donors'/backers for that Vault...you'll recognize-some!
Yes, it's the methanes/sulfurs/nitrates/etc. that DO cause 'warming' (and HAARP, and nuke-testing, and unregulated/coal-Utilities/industries, and more)...but NONE of that was by 'accidental human mistake'. It was all pre-planned generations-back, to achieve EXACTLY what we see today -- for 'their' purposes. Carbon-taxation (and 'central-banking') will usher-in a 'NWO' infinitely more efficiently than a League of Nations or U.N. ever could. Baron David Mayer de Rothschild isn't just an 'adventurer/environmentalist/friend-of-Gore's' -- he's a banker who also owns/controls most uranium-mines, the Rhodes-scholarship neo-lib nonsense at Oxford, and more other 'assets' with his family and the other 'Bilderbergers' and associated 'think-tanks' than I could list if I typed all-day.
Are 'those' Interests the ones you'd like to support -- do you think THEY will 'save you' from your dreaded Methane/D.U. (when they are the same-ones who profit from them and instituted this-mess)?
This collapsing of the Wilkins ice shelf seems to be happening 15 years early (links also have video):
Huge iceberg collapse threatens Antarctic shelf: British scientists
An iceberg two-thirds of the size of Toronto has broken away from an Antarctic ice shelf, leaving the shelf in danger of imminent collapse, scientists with the British Antarctic Survey said Tuesday.
The berg is still moving, leaving a large part of the Wilkins Ice Shelf on the Antarctic Peninsula supported only by a thin strip of ice hanging between two islands. ...
In 1993, Professor David Vaughan of British Antarctic Survey predicted the northern part of Wilkins Ice Shelf was likely to be lost within 30 years if climate warming on the peninsula were to continue at the same rate. Climate warming increases the volume of summer meltwater on glaciers and weakens ice shelves.
"Wilkins is the largest ice shelf on the Antarctic Peninsula yet to be threatened. I didn't expect to see things happen this quickly," Vaughan said in a release. "The ice shelf is hanging by a thread — we'll know in the next few days or weeks what its fate will be.
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2008/03/25/iceshelf.html
Jack Layton at the Take Back America conference - Part 1
http://youtube.com/watch?v=lbZtRJ4494Y
Jack Layton at the Take Back America conference - Part 2
http://youtube.com/watch?v=XdPf-Za2UD0&feature=related
GOOGLE arctic methane gas, scroll down to the article titled______"Methane Burps, A Ticking Time Bomb"___.
If you don't like what the author reports, ignore it. There are other articles on the subject, such as the ones Rush Limbaugh quotes, read those if you wish to feel better. Maybe your younger children and grandkids would have a different opinion however. The world we are leaving them is our doing. But,they aren't old enough to vote, so who really cares what theiy may think?
We may have less than ten years before the Arctic methane "burps", we may have twenty or fifty years. The credible scientists who study such, all agreee it will happen, they disagree on the time frame.
It may be two years, or one, or twelve? The world leaders should not be guessing and taking serious chances and start a massive world wide program in an attempt to stop it from happening, ___ that's MY opinion on the subject.
"Rebel Farmer is right, start (or keep)doing your part and engage your neighbors in conversation and conservation.
I'll add another..."
And I'll add this: http://12degreesoffreedom.blogspot.com/2008_02_01_archive.html
Most of these 'Warming/carbon' concerns are 'ill-based' and Propaganda encouraged by the same fraudsters who CAUSE most-our-problems...
[The 'elites', the Oil-'owners/producers', the privatization/'free-trade'-crowds, the NWO and bankers, and neo-'everythings', and the uranium-mine/nuke-development-'owners', the Defense-'promoters', industrialists/Globalists shifting to 'poorer-labor areas where they can pollute-freely also', some high-profile 'environmentalists' always pro-CarbonTaxing/Nukes...and all the rest in those related-Cabals...]
CO2 is not the problem -- nuke-testing above-ground, unregulated coal-burning, gasoline-instead-of-LPG, petrol-diesel-instead-of-veggie/bio-diesel (from organic-waste/surplus), HAARP, exploitation of 3rd-world, wars over control of Resources (that are abundant, not 'scarce' at-all) -- THESE are the 'problems'.
GREED is the problem behind ALL 'problems'.
The 'answer' (?) -- includes LPG-conversion, bio-diesel, regulated-Utilities (and local DC-power/community-based-generation&mini-Grids), heritage/organic-foodstuffs, Co-op's (agricultural&urban), and Yes -- technology (we need focus on Fusion-power, NOT 'fission').
And 'you', getting 'sustainable'!
And -- 'political-reforms' based on Humanism more than Capitalism.
[Throw in some birth-control, voluntary abortion on-demand, human-rights, cooperations, job-creation re: infrastructure, alternative-energies, etc. -- "it couldn't hoit"...]
Hi ~CHUCK~. I have Jacques Costeau's book "The Ocean World" and it states 90% of all fresh water is in the Anartic ice cap, I've read the same in other books also.
According to some scientists who study such things their entire adult lives, 50 million years ago, the Arctic methane and methane in Russia burst out into the atmosphere and almost all life was eradicted within 48 hours. We're talking billions of TONS of methane.
But if you wish to debate it, cite the author I suggested, or others with his scientific credentials and come back, because it is not what "I" think. I trust his and many other scientist's opinions.
"Rebel Farmer is right, start (or keep)doing your part and engage your neighbors in conversation and conservation.
I'll add another-move to where the fresh water is and away from flood prone areas."
Make yourselves 'liquid' and move to N.L. Michigan...
For a few-hundred, you can buy a nice/treed-acre around here -- on
secondary/paved road with electrical-access...and, you can be set up
with a septic/well for under 2k (inclusive of all Permits/etc.).
You'll then have 'infinite'/easy-sweetwater via a 35'-/shallow-pump
well, wildlife strolling-through and bald-eagles soaring above, and a
mix of hilly-or-flat hardwoods and pines, often NO Zoning restricting
parking/using-RV's/etc., nice neighbors, access to a hundred-lakes,
and reasonable shopping/proximity to 'whatever' -- and, a
property-taxation of about 300. per year -- doubled when having a house.
[But, one needs a snowblower 4-months per year, also...unless into
cross-country skiing However, at 'advanced-age' of 60, our local
Council on Aging will shovel your drive 'free' -- like they do mine!
And when you age-further, they will come to shower-you, provide a
visiting-nurse, and hook you up with 'meals-on-wheels'...all courtesy
of our low PropTax...]
A book can show you how to easily build a local-pine/energy-efficient
loghome shell of 3k-sq-ft "under-good-roof and well insulated" for
less than 4. per-square-foot and some minor 'sweat-equity' (add-on for
window/door-choices). Also, all tradesmen/we-retired-builders and
plumbers/electricians work cheap around here (little/no 'work'/employment).
Get good-Title/Land-Patent, and enjoy clean/fresh-water everywhere (93 of the country's!) while at 1,600-elevation in 'bucolic-bliss', with abundance of cropland, game, fish, etc. -- and progressive/independent neighbors.
Only 'catches' here is 'willingness to be a good-neighbor' and 'staying
Legal' while in-counties/State (our court-systems are 'strict').
Oh...and 'independent-means' (or, willingness to work-hard for 'less') -- no jobs/employment, remember? [Bring liquid-cash/gold/assets -- just none of that 'phony-gold' Smith and his Mormons brought once, to what they thought would be their "promised-land" -- before we 'drove them out by mob' to MO&UT!]
@ Kem Patrick -- my understanding that the Antarctic continent holds 90% of global ICE, not freshwater -- it contains "only" 70% of the fresh water. That said the sea level rises if it all should melt is correct -- but not likely. The ice which could melt first would "only" raise sea levels by some 20-30 feet.
But what I don't get is why the release of methane from the Arctic permafrost would do us in - yes, it's a monster greenhouse gas, but the way you say it, it sounds like you think it would asphyxiate us -- that's not what you meant, is it?
Can the end of the world just hurry up. The plantet is screwed and we all know it so can we just skip the next 4 years and get to it.
One child policies, encouraged drug abortions, discourage pregnancies, contraception free in schools, encouraged vegitarianism, and renewable energy (solar, wind ect.) should be implimented in all countries to help a little bit
And if ~RIVERMAN~ shows up here, I'm gonna throw this computer out the loft window, just like Evelyn did a few months ago. ___ I still have her teeth.
~BBR~ I'm concerned about time, the clock is ticking.
Hi ~Rebel~ I love you. But I sold the 64 Pontiac Bonny. ___ Sorry gal. I love BeForKids, Siouxrose, Cindy and CoCo too.
BTW, Where are those good garden seeds you are getting?
I've been staring at this article and comments all evening. We don't know how much damage is done. Are we already past the point of no return? How long will it take for the mainstream to really get on board? The cool weather in China and elsewhere this winter gave the deniers a field day. No discussion of a carbon cap, even from Obama.
I guess things will have to get worse before we get a consensus to take real action on a national or international scale.
~PAUL K~ Thank you for an excellent bit of rather sobering information.
For any who may not know this, melting sea ice will not raise sea levels. Melting fresh water ice will. ___ The fresh water ice in Antartica holds 90% of all of the fresh water on Earth. If it melts and it is is doing so very quickly, the sea waters will rise some 200 plus feet.
Hard to fathom, that 90% of ALL of the fresh water on Earth is iced up in Anartica, when one considers the Great lakes, all of the world's great rivers, all of the other lakes, rivers, streams and hidden aquifers. Nevertheless, it is so.
We will never see the ocean's waters rise even 30 feet, for before that occurs due to global warming, the Arctic methane gas will have entered our atmosphere and the only ones who will see that disaster evolve, will be those in the space station. Sorry for the dooms-day crap, but facts are facts.
Well ~MATTI~. I do believe you were speaking of me in your blog and that's fine if so. However, I am not one who wishes to die, nor do I wish for my children, or theirs, nor anyone elses to die, or to see the end of all life on Earth. __ I love life, especially I love my wife, women and children, beer and wine, flowers, birds, animals and neat old cars. ___ I don't like Cheney or Bush.
What I do wish to see and see very soon, is a MASSIVE, world-wide effort initiated, to greatly reduce the Co2 in our atmosphere and massive efforts made to eleminate the use of burning fossil fuels and atomic energy. For unless that is done and done soon, no matter what each and every one of us may do as individuals, the Arctic perma-frost will continue to thaw at an alarming rate.
Whether you MATTI, or anyone else wishes to believe it or not, when that happens, all life, save perhaps some deep sea creatures and bacteria on this planet will blink out almost overnight.
Now that's a fact and not my dumb opinion. It happened here some 50 million years ago. ___ ZAP, almost EVERYTHING died within a day or two. This is not some story I heard as a child and had it drilled into my head. I didn't know of it until a few short months ago.
So your cute comments may sound good to you ~MATTI~, but they don't have beans to do with the thawing Arctic perma-froat. Your words, or my words, will not cause that to stop. World leaders working together can do somethng about it, but I fear they won't, at least not in time to help the situation.
Now your suggestion to have fun I agree with totally. __ I do enjoy life and I have fun.__ Today I worked in our garden and this week we're going fishing and last weekend I had four beers with six good friends and we played our monthly poker game for eight hours. I won $87 bucks. __ Sadly, all winnings go to the local food bank.
My eye doctor told me today that my one good eye was fine, the macular degeneration has stopped and it won't get any worse. I hugged and kissed her, ___ gosh she is a beauty too.
So I love life ~Matti~. That Friggin Methane gas is the MAJOR problem for ALL of humanity and it's not a joke, or something that is "irrevelant", as you stated, with a rather sad bit of ignorance.
GOOGLE arctic methane gas. There are hundreds of articles on the subject. On the first screen is a very good one, titled ___"Methane Burps, A Ticking Time Bomb". ___ Read it, and if you disagree, argue with the highly regarded geologist who wrote it. I personally won't argue with him, I'm not smart enough to do so, ___ perhaps you are.
Let's say that human activity -- and no other organic activity in the past 4 billion years -- has had any impact on "ordinary fluctuations" whatsoever. Then what has? And why are organic molecules somehow removed from that system?
P.S. Poet: You really need to get to higher ground. And take anyone you care about with you!
Thank you to those who seemed to understand what I was trying to say. And to KEM, who I really like a lot, informing us that things are actually worse than we thought doesn't really change the way we have to approach this disaster.
I appreciate the whole mirror power generation idea and all the other technical wonders that we can use to make the transition to a very changed planet. But the fact is that we have to get beyond thinking that there is a fix, a solution, or anything else that is going to get us out of this mess. We have to collectively get beyond any hope that life can be carried on as we have know it. We have to go through the process of grieving for all the mistakes that we have made as a species. We have to get beyond the blaming, finger pointing, and despair.
It is time for us to return to the knowledge that we are no different/better than any other thing on this planet. That we have a natural place in the ecology of mother earth. Only in that place of being will we find purpose and happiness.
Humans are by nature social beings and prefer to live in "tribes" for structure and survival. Just like the other primates that we decended from. Much like wolves live their lives in packs. And the groups, tribes, or packs can only be as large as the immediate environment or territory can reasonably sustain.
So, I'm get back to my original thoughts on this matter. That is that we have to form groups within our local communities that can be sustained in a way that operates with nature and the local resources. When the whole thing comes apart, I'm sure that we can add hemp to our arsenal of crops. And the community can build whatever they want without caring about what the building codes may have been. The key is to start NOW to live the life you want. Gather around you the folks that share the same values of cooperation.
We all have a part to play in this drama. Some will just die, either figuratively or literally. Some will go mad because they can't accept living life as they have always known it. Some will be immobilized by fear and despair. Some will become murderous criminals to survive. Some will become hermits or backwoods survivalists. There will be a multitude of ways to cope, or not.
I believe that most humans are essentially good. And please don't give me any flak about how naive I am. Those that truely care about their children, grandchildren, and beyond, are the ones I am referring to. These are the folks that are going to want to create a livable future. These are the ones that are going to want to prepare for the inevitable. These are the ones that don't have to be cattle prodded into giving up an unsustainable consumptive lifestyle for something better.
If you want some insight into what local community may look like 15 or 20 years from now, pick up a copy of James Howard Kuntsler's new fiction book "World Made by Hand". It's short and very well written. It doesn't have all the technical data right, but it certainly has the human element on target. More info on this book, with a chaper excerpt at: http://www.worldmadebyhand.com/
Look folks, I certainly don't have many of the answers. I just know that I have to have hope. I have to know that my efforts are being well spent and that I'm actually doing something worthwhile for my kids and grandchildren. That means that I have to learn to actually live the way I am going to be forced to live in the not so distant future. I might as well learn how to do it really well NOW. And hopefully a lot more of my neighbors will join me in this project that will force us "Back to the Future"!
Actually, Biosphere 2 did not work anyway. Too much CO2 built up for humans to survive. Sound familiar?
And seriously, I thought that for a viable gene pool you need significant numbers. I do not remember the figure, but I thought that it was on the order of 10,000 to 100,000 or so. Could be wrong. But if the predictions are correct, we are all screwed anyway unless we start taking action now. Who will listen? Let me go ask Mr. Exxon. He wouldn't lie, would he?
Hilarious. Turns out homo sapiens are the virsus.
Jokes on us, my drouggies.
The vanity of wishing to see world cataclysm in order to comfort the Narcissist's fear of their own deaths is now rubbing up against objectively measurable climate change.
It's starting to seem like "Science's" gift to all of those unwilling to believe in the more classic religious Apocolypse.
Some, despite their obvious intelligence, are not satisfied with mere sea-level rise and floating bear corpses, they now look forward to the "Killer Gas from the Unfrozen North", ooooh scary.
Please note that I am in no way attempting to refute any observations in regards to Methane Release or anything else, frankly I'm not interested enough to attempt it, and I doubt I'd succeed in convincing anyone including myself.
My point is simply that it is irrelevant.
--------------------------------------------------
As has been pointed out by several here, there have been a multitude of reasons to end some of the more ridiculously wasteful and destructive practices of the Industrial-Technopoly Age, yet here we are.
As has been pointed out by several here, there are many practical measures that on can take within one's community and household to begin to ADAPT to the changing climate.
But some wish to carry on like humorously impotent gods and concern themselves with the "Fate of the Wold and Humanity".
Why in the world do so many materialist-type progressives believe that people will be induced to change their behavior just because of a plausibly worked out Doomsday scenario?
Religious leaders have been yapping about that since the dawn of time and everybody STILL covets their neighbor's wife and steals and lies and kills.
Hypothetical pain just doesn't work that well as a persuasion method.
The Holy Inquisition figured this out:ya gotta actually show people the hot irons and give them an actual taste of the pain, then the survival instincts kick in.
Can people so otherwise clever really not realise this?
Or has Materialism so insulated them from any knowledge of religious history, that they have become partially blind?
Or some other answer?
------------------------------------------------
Either way itsimportant to remember that both these fears and this continued faith in scientist to solve the problem (by the public, the scientist themselves know that their process is unlikely to yeild understanding BEFORE observation, which is what the "listen to the science" types seem to hope for) are based on our inability to control the situation, which is in turn based on the ending of the Age of Control and the dawning of the Age of Co-operation.
Nothing could be a more explicit message to "Get over trying to run everything" than Global Climate Change, but the dream of Star Trek Style Total Mastery of the Material World continues.
Which just goes to show, as this view becomes more and more self-evidently irrational, that some people can't help it. These dreams were blasted into their Minds at a young age or at a tender time, they are no more able to abandon them through reason than a Mesmerist's victims.
In keeping with this kind of "screen-dream" understanding of reality, might I suggest the Tyler Durden Zen-Enlightenment technique:
If you wish to prepare for the Aquarian Age, you should "Know, don't Think, Know that some day you ARE GOING TO DIE."
--------------------------------------------
Life eats Death.
There's a whole lot of New Life on the way.
When the four Elements are out of balance, it is the task of Storm to intevene.
Storm doesn't see your silly little life only Life and Death and the Elements.
You might not be important to Storm, but you could be important to your fellow people.
It is possible that it is time to stop shouting "DANGER! DEATH! SCARYness!" and begin to get to work on a Useful Task.
-----------------------------------------------------
Of course, I could be way off, so keep doing whatever you want to.
Just make sure its actually YOU that wants to do it.
And remember to have fun, this ride is supposed to be FUN.
-matti.
I've been watching the temperature at the antarctic connection all austral summer. Yesterday (four days into their autumn, mind you) it was 32 degrees Fahrenheit but sunny, so the ice was still melting underneath the surface at Palmer Station on the peninsula.
As you look at that picture, remember that those square ice barges are hundreds of feet above the sea.
The loss of sea ice means the ocean will absorb heat, which means more sea ice loss later. The heating of the Antarctic peninsula means more bare ground, which means more air heat, which again accelerates the heating.
The other state-sized chunk popping off for 2008 was the last few miles of the Pine Island glacial flow. The flow is starting to melt on its (under sea level) bottom, farther and farther back, which is lubricating the flow and accelerating the speed of the glacial flow. This glacial flow drains a reasonable part of the West Antarctic Ice Sheet. Even if the ice sheet itself isn't melting, which it is a little bit, It's not good to see part of the plug come out.
That rupture of the ice shelf was reported a month ago, but not on nationnal news. There is another crack in the Anarctiic ice which burst open overnight about eight weeks ago, which is wider, deeper and longer than the Grand Canyon. We may see sea levels rise by well over 30 feet within a couple of years,___ maybe less.
However, nasty as that will be, it is not the MAJOPR problem that global warming is creating for life on this unique water-world. The MAJOR problem is the THAW of the Arctic perma-frost. When those millions of TONS of methane gas, which has been trapped in the perma-frost for the past five million years escapes into our atmosphere, we won't be here typing opinions.
As it is presently going, that may occur ANY time within the next ten years, perhaps even by 2009 or 10. That's not speculation, it is already happening and at an alarming rate and as so many have noted here, shock and surprise, "Oh my, it's happening faster than we projected".
There won't be any need to plant hemp, cut back on television, reduce shopping or worry aobut anythinng else, except attempting to suck in enough oxygen to stay alive. That will be so for ALL of us and our children and their's. Sorry to sound like doomsville, but facts are difficult to alter.
Now, if I'm wrong, and I do hope that I am, then the opinions of ~BeForKids~ and ~Rebel Farmer~, are most appropriate. We may have twenty or more years, but by then there won't be a Florida, an Atlantic City, A New york City, and thousands of other shore-line cities around the globe. We have asked for it and we go it.
Maybe we could land Bushco on the shelf before it melts utterly away.
Writers, reporters say the scientists are shocked. Is that what the scientists are saying? Or is that the misinterpretation of the writers? The scientific community where they have been long observing the evidence for this course of events are certainly distressed about the speed. They were hoping to buy a little more time, as we all were. Best case scenario is not to be. And on and on.
We've known for how many decades now that "pollution is bad?" Long before the theory of global warming we had plenty of reasons to reduce pollution, and all along various industries have vigorously fought any attempt to force them to reduce pollution. Industry lobbyists contribute millions to our elected officials and IMO anyone who thinks it's not quid pro quo has a screw loose. We do not have time for science to prove that global warming is the cause of these things, nor can we pin too much hope of that proof having any effect on controlling pollution. We must reduce pollution now, because it is inherently bad.
solarmirrors
I saw the website fine. Some great technology there.
Hey solarmirrors, I went to your website, clicked on the symbol in the upper left hand part of the mpostly blank page and nothing happened.
I see two alternatives for why this is not big news. 1) There is a conspiracy to hide golbal warming. 2) This is actually no big deal and is not a precurser to gloom and doom.
To add a few words to Rebel Farmer's excellent analysis--Articles like the one above are like turning to see a horrible collision at the point of no-return and being unable to change it and unable to keep from staring in anticipation of the tremendous impact that will occur.
As a Floridian who lives on the east coast of the state, this is more than an academic exercise. Rising sea levels will drastically redraw the boundaries of this part of the world as well as many other places.
Our choice is between reaching out to help others or continuing on the juvenile pursuit of "every man (or woman) for themselves". Personally I opt for the former rather than the latter.
Community and relationship are the keys to the survival of the most life from this irreversable disaster unfolding before our eyes.
may i suggest a massively mirrored future
http://www.pointfocus.com
Anney March: yes, in the coming years it's about local.
Eschew transnational corporations. We're all local, we must support local. This includes paying the absolute minimum in federal taxes as the law allows. We are near W.B. Yeats tipping point. Arab terrorists will be the least of our problems.
For those in the LA area, you might be interested in this study group starting Sunday:
http://www.studiesforglobaljustice.org/?q=convergingstorms2
Studies for Global Justice has organized this great workshop/discussions on the issues of localism, strategies for the coming climate crisis, peak oil, capitalisms central role in climate change, etc.
The question is not about the survival of the Earth. The Earth will be fine. The question really is about the survival of humanity, and what our impact will have on the millions of species we are likely to take down with us. Technology will not save us at this point.
Rebel Farmer
"As far as I can figure out, there is no "solution" to the problem of global climate change. There is not going to be any nation, government, or other savior that will come forth to save the planet and its inhabitants. As individuals, all we can do is start now to conserve, live simply, and work toward community sovereignty in all things. We must reengage with our neighbors and our local communities to secure interdependent long term survival."
This is probably the most sensible post I've seen about what humanity is doing to the earth.
We could perhaps take heart and learn a lesson from animals, too:
=====
So long, and thanks for all the fish
No, I'm not going anywhere. But that seemed an appropriate title for this warm and fuzzy story to end all warm and fuzzy stories:
THEY famously attempted to warn mankind of the Earth's impending destruction in The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, only for their behaviour to be dismissed as playful acrobatics.
But now, solid evidence has emerged of the dolphin's altruistic nature. In a act of selflessness which has astounded experts and confirmed the friendly nature of the species, a bottlenose came to the rescue of two whales stranded on a beach in New Zealand.
The dolphin – nicknamed Moko by local residents, who said it spent much of its time swimming playfully with beachgoers – helped two pygmy sperm whales, facing imminent death after becoming stranded on a sandbar, swim to safety.
Until Moko's arrival, rescuers feared the mother and calf would have to be put down to prevent them suffering a prolonged death on Mahia beach, about 300 miles north-east of Wellington.
Malcolm Smith and his team from the New Zealand Conservation Department had tried in vain to rescue the animals for an hour-and-a-half. With their effort faltering, it seemed only a matter of time before the operation was called off.
"They kept getting disoriented and stranding again," Mr Smith said yesterday. "They couldn't find their way back past (the sandbar] to the sea."
Just as it seemed all hope was lost, Moko appeared. The dolphin approached the whales, leading them 200m along the beach before navigating them out to the open sea.
Mr Smith believes the dolphin heard the whales' distress calls and came to their aid.
"It was looking like it was going to be a bad outcome for the whales ... then Moko came along and fixed it," he said. "They had arched their backs and were calling to one another, but as soon as the dolphin turned up, they submerged and followed her.
"I don't speak whale and I don't speak dolphin, but there was obviously something that went on, because the two whales changed from being quite distressed to following the dolphin willingly and directly along the beach and straight out to sea."
Another rescuer, Juanita Symes, added: "Moko came flying through the water and pushed in between us and the whales. She got them to head toward the hill, where the channel is. It was an amazing experience. The best day of my life."
Indeed.
http://brilliantatbreakfast.blogspot.com/
what about the mass production of hemp? fast growing, not water intensive, and good for the soil, doesnt need chemical fertilizers....when are people going to demand their right to this plant? when will the USA be forced to 180 their position and make another gov propaganda film ala "hemp for victory"
its going to be a bumpy ride
I suspect what we will have to do is create self sustaining communities that can defend ourselves against predators and somehow have access to water. I sense that down the road civilization will seriously break down. I may not be here by then, but our grandchildren and future generations are in for hard times. We have forgotten what the Bible and Native Americans have lived by; think ahead for seven generations. I think we should start doing that.
kathyodat
Rebel Farmer is right as usual.
And Stiv Whitman, Americans aren't paying attention because they don't care about anything that doesn't directly affect their lives right now. You know, sort of like infants.
Scientists will always be behind the curve because as a living organism, Earth is far more complex than humans cam understand, and scientists have only a limited understanding of the positive feedback mechanisms at work here. More surprises to come.
kathyodat
johnycanuck... yer gonna need more than a weapon or two to hold off the hordes. I got four more who can shoot straight and work hard who are, thanks to Countrywide's foreclosure while pretending to help policy, recently homeless and will work for food and shelter.
I always said to my neighbors, ''arm yourselves, the day is coming when your kids will need to hold off the bands of starving thirsty people from the south and the cities, combing the countryside searching for food and water''
I was wrong. It will be sooner than that.
Turn off the TV
buy only the necessities (locally from your neighbors if possible)
DO NOT drive ,whenever there is an option to bike bus or carpool
I fortunately have 2 sections of land well above sea level and still forested but for the 12 or so acres i farm.
The last few yrs, many wealthy Americans have been nosing around up here looking for land to buy ... makes ya wonder if they are as dumb as most think, luckily not many locals are selling there lives down the river for a quick (soon to be worthless) buck.
Rebel Farmer is right, start (or keep)doing your part and engage your neighbors in conversation and conservation.
I'll add another-move to where the fresh water is and away from flood prone areas.
Weird weather is coming-here in Madison, we just went over 100 inches of snow for the season-about twice as much as usual.
a good time to be getting yerself some personal adaptability skills; be lightfooted.
Have Native Americans been proven right about almost everything in nature, when you come down to it? (Maybe there's something to 26,000 years of continuity in one place.) When "man" destroys things around him, he destroys himself. Having come so hard, we're gonna fall hard too. The sorrow we should feel for the Earth, the animals, and people born into this future.
kent shaw, I don't think you have to worry, I'm sure that's already been budgeted for and might be an explanation for the billions of hard cash that went AWOL from Iraq.
And just what exactly is the elevation for that Bush hideaway in Paraguay? Just wondering.
Start making your peace. It has begun.
As the oceans rise an awful lot of very expensive real estate is going to be lost by some very wealthy individuals and businesses. We taxpayers should bail them out now, instead of later as will certainly be required. We should pay now to move them all to higher ground and compensate them for the abandonment of their current properties. It will be much less expensive if we bail them out now instead of later.
The administration and other republicans are not worried about this because it's liberal propaganda. And besides even if it is true God will save us by letting us build a boat to float on until the earth naturally corrects itself. Just like Noah did. (sarcastic)
A cat probably got the bird ~CoCo~. The poor thing was probably just preparing to pee when you arrived and moved it.
For a viable gene pool you need four females and three males. One example: Of all the clean animals, Noah boarded seven. Only two of the unclean. You may disregard Noah, but you still need at least seven, six won't hack the program.
LOOK LISTEN CAREFULLY. All animals, including humans put out methane, termites actulally contribute the greatest amount. ___ Does anyone get it? It is almost unbelievavle the amount of methane trapped in the Artcic, which will eradicte all life, if the Arctic perma-frost thaws. ___ IT'S BEGINNING TO THAW!!!!!
The danger will not be in the Arctic alone, it will be every place, where there won't be suffecient oxygen for life, including Michigan and Costa Rica. BTW, if we have a depression, any American money you have will be useless in Costa Rica. If the perma-frost melts, no money or gold will help anyone. A biosphere will work for awhile. Our planet is a biosphere and we're killing it with excessive Co2 emitted from burning fossil fuels.
Here's a small, but notable point:
Why are we only hearing about this ONE MONTH after it happened?
And secondly, HOW WERE THEY ABLE TO KEEP IT A SECRET FOR ONE MONTH?
Vinlander is at the right end of this beast. This ice sheet crack up, to me, is the final wake up call that climate change is at the "tipping point". We now need to focus on what we are going to do about the carnage that is going to happen.
My sense is that those that have remained in low lying areas will drown or die of starvation as they try to migrate. The lack of a planned rescue for victims of global warming is like a planned genocide by the powers that be. Just less mouths to feed for the survivors of the first floods.
This lack of planning is really no different than the planned starvation of the world's poorest populations due to declines in world staple crop production. It's a planned genocide by the world's elite. Same goes for oil wars all over the planet. The civilian "collateral damage" is just another form of planned genocide. Less people using up the planet's finite resources, leaving more for the elite.
As far as I can figure out, there is no "solution" to the problem of global climate change. There is not going to be any nation, government, or other savior that will come forth to save the planet and its inhabitants. As individuals, all we can do is start now to conserve, live simply, and work toward community sovereignty in all things. We must reengage with our neighbors and our local communities to secure interdependent long term survival.
It's back to basics folks. NOW! Stop shopping! Turn off the TV. Get to know your neighbors. Form local groups that can organize the community with the will to plan for a pretty diffecult future. And by all means develop a skill that will contribute to the welfare of your community as a whole. Maybe learn how to make candles or soap from local materials. Begin by planting a home garden. Maybe learn how to raise a few chikens. Start sharing and trading with your neighbors NOW. Build the networks that will be needed.
Good luck.
do they really have high security bunkers? where are they? what will they do in them? will they get 'american idol'? can they ring out for takeaways? do they have doctors/medicine/food/water/air? i don't get it.
what's the point? anyway, it's a big problem and we are all (scientists included) in for a big surprise................
it is good to remember from our high school physics- if a small flame underlies a beaker of water with ice, the temp of the water will not rise till all the ice is melted. once the ice is melted , the temp of the water in the flasks will increase rapidly.The ice in this world, as well as the oceans, constitute an enormous heat sink for the fossil fuels that are being burnt and the increased heat retention due to CO2 and, soon to come, methane.
Many climate models are based on known past observance of climate. But if a substantial component of earth's ice melts, there will be a new paradigm.(a reduced heat sink)
Additionally, climate is a high inertial system. The CO2 that is being put out will be causing heat retention for decades if not centuries, as it takes that long for the CO2 to recycle. And we will be ' surprised' once again as to how fast and how much the average global temperature has arisen.