It sounded like a concession.
Hillary Clinton, after what came across more like a valedictory statement than a rallying cry, turned to the man who so soundly defeated her in this week’s Wisconsin primary and said, “No matter what happens… I am honored to be here with Barack Obama. I am absolutely honored.”
The statement, with which she closed Thursday night’s 19th Democratic presidential debate, was so heartfelt, so sincere, that Obama put one arm around his opponent’s shoulder and reached a hand across the table to warmly shake her hand.
It was an oddly disarming moment that belonged to the New York senator but not in the way that she or her supporters could have wanted.
Clinton seemed to surrender, graciously.
Obama seemed to accept that surrender, equally graciously.
And rightly so.
In a debate where Clinton needed to deliver a knock-out blow in order to renew a candidacy that faces a make-or-break moment in the March 4 Texas and Ohio primaries, she made little progress for a campaign that seems to be broken.
Clinton even observed during the forum on the University of Texas campus that “you can tell from the first 45 minutes, you know, Senator Obama and I have a lot in common.”
True enough, but not exactly the call to action for a low-on-funds campaign that needs to come from behind after 11 straight primary and caucus defeats.
Worst of all, she threw a wild punch that missed completely. When the subject of Obama’s borrowing of speech lines from Massachusetts Governor Deval Patrick came up, Clinton mocked her foe’s campaign slogan, saying, “you know, lifting whole passages from someone else’s speeches is not change you can believe in, it’s change you can Xerox.”
The audience, which was generous to both candidates through most of the debate, moaned.
There were a few boos for Clinton.
Obama was never booed.
Indeed, he owned the moments that were supposed to expose his weaknesses.
The senator from Illinois actually won the debate about plagiarism.
“I’ve been campaigning now for the last two years. Deval is a national co-chairman of my campaign, and suggested an argument that I share, that words are important,” said Obama, “Words matter. And the implication that they don’t I think diminishes how important it is to speak to the American people directly about making America as good as its promise. Barbara Jordan understood this as well as anybody. And the notion that I had plagiarized from somebody who was one of my national co-chairs who gave me the line and suggested that I use it, I think, is silly.”
Obama was even more effective when he turned the suggestion that his campaign is weak on substance into a ringing defense of the movement that supports his candidacy.
“Senator Clinton of late has said: Let’s get real. The implication is that the people who’ve been voting for me or involved in my campaign are somehow delusional…” said Obama. “You know, the thinking is that somehow, they’re being duped, and eventually they’re going to see the reality of things. Well, I think they perceive reality of what’s going on in Washington very clearly. What they see is that if we don’t bring the country together, stop the endless bickering, actually focus on solutions and reduce the special interests that have dominated Washington, then we will not get anything done. And the… reason that this campaign has done so well is because people understand that it is not just a matter of putting forward policy positions. Senator Clinton and I share a lot of policy positions. But if we can’t inspire the American people to get involved in their government and if we can’t inspire them to go beyond the racial divisions and the religious divisions and the regional divisions that have plagued our politics for so long, then we will continue to see the kind of gridlock and nonperformance in Washington that is resulting in families suffering in very real ways. I’m running for president to start doing something about that suffering, and so are the people who are behind my campaign.”
That would have been the best statement of the night.
But then there was Clinton’s close.
Asked to describe “the moment that tested you the most,” Clinton began: “Well, I think everybody here knows I’ve lived through some crises and some challenging moments in my life.”
The crowd applauded, enthusiastically.
Then she continued.
“But people often ask me, ‘How do you do it?’ You know, ‘How do you keep going?’ And I just have to shake my head in wonderment, because with all of the challenges that I’ve had, they are nothing compared to what I see happening in the lives of Americans every single day.”
Recalling a visit to a medical center designed that provided rehabilitation for wounded soldiers, Clinton said, “You know, the hits I’ve taken in life are nothing compared to what goes on every single day in the lives of people across our country. And I resolved at a very young age that I’d been blessed and that I was called by my faith and by my upbringing to do what I could to give others the same opportunities and blessings that I took for granted. That’s what gets me up in the morning. That’s what motivates me in this campaign. And, you know, no matter what happens in this contest — and I am honored, I am honored to be here with Barack Obama. I am absolutely honored. Whatever happens, we’re going to be fine. You know, we have strong support from our families and our friends. I just hope that we’ll be able to say the same thing about the American people, and that’s what this election should be about.”
That was Clinton at her very best, at her most poignant and powerful.
Unfortunately, it sounded like the sort of statement that a candidate makes when he or she is concluding a campaign - not turning it around.
John Nichols’ new book is The Genius of Impeachment: The Founders’ Cure for Royalism. Rolling Stone’s Tim Dickinson hails it as a “nervy, acerbic, passionately argued history-cum-polemic [that] combines a rich examination of the parliamentary roots and past use of the ‘heroic medicine’ that is impeachment with a call for Democratic leaders to ‘reclaim and reuse the most vital tool handed to us by the founders for the defense of our most basic liberties.’”
Copyright © 2008 The Nation
I have to give Hillary the edge last night. I think she hit a home run at the end. The debate helped her in my opinion. Whether it will be enough to turn things around remains to be seen. I hope not, because I am an Obama supporter.
Well said. Now we’ll see how the Corporate Media spins this. I think the War Machine is dumbfounded by Obama. Although not fully trusted by progressives for his war funding votes, I’m sure he’s seen as a loose cannon by those powerful pro-war interests… an odd contradiction.
Obama polled 50-50 on the eve of the Chesapeake Sweep. He did far better… the polls were wrong.
He polled 50-50 on the day of the Wisconsin Vote and did far better. Again, the polls were wrong.
He’s polling 50-50 in Texas right now with two weeks till the Primary and Caucuses. His upward arch on the charts is astounding. John McCain is ignoring Hillary Clinton and focussed on Obama. He knows the score. She needs to know it too.
The Right Wing, Rovian filth machine, is posting anti-Obama tripe all over the internet right now. The National Polls have Obama winning the General Election and Clinton losing… or winning by a nose. It’s obvious to anyone who the Republicans would prefer to run against.
If the Clinton campaign doesn’t bow out gracefully, and plans on heading to the convention, demanding to seat the Florida and Michigan Delegation as one of her managers suggested recently… it will grievously split the Party. This is a recipe’ for disaster, especially if she succeeds.
Hillary, it’s time to step down. Don’t even wait for Texas… just stop, ok? You made your point… now get with the rest of us. We have a gnarly old Dragon to Slay.
Win or lose, Hillary came across in the Texas debate as a decent, caring person, especially in her closing remarks.
Some will, of course, maintain that her words mean nothing, and that she is a terrible example of humanity because of a few previous events .
However, if we can discard Hillary`s words as meaningless, then we also need to wonder if Barack can be judged on his great oratory, and realize it may not all be possible to attain.
Right, great oratory skills mean nothing. Take that one trick pony Lincoln. Take away the Gettysburg address and you have nothing left but an empty suit.
I got the same impression: Hillary’s valedictory at the end was a concession. If you do the math, Obama performed well last night, and at the end of the debate, she realized that he is too solid. The question now is: will Obama live up to his promises in the White House? We will see, but I have my doubts.
What I see is that our political process corrupts people with decent intentions. Not all get corrupted, and most of those don’t get very far. With publicly financed campaigns, our political system wouldn’t be so perverted and our politicians wouldn’t have to sell their souls.
kathyodat
Tom Joad, I’m assuming that was tongue-in-cheek. If I don’t know someone, I tend to believe they mean what they say. But that remark is over the top. I’m not ready to compare Obama to Lincoln - yet.
kathyodat
BeForKids - I think you missed Tom Joad’s point. He wasn’t comparing Obabma with Lincoln.
In a way, I have been disgusted at Hillary’s negative ad campaigns and her Republican line of attack that a Harvard Law graduate and a dedicated public servant is just and “empty suit” not ready for prime time.
Then again, it has been nice to see Obama rise above the attacks and show himself as a skilled statesman. Hillary is providing a minor league test before Obama moves on to face the major league attack machine waiting for him in the general election.
the one thing no one here will mention is the fact that many people (those supporting the democratic ticket) in texas will vote for hilarious simply because obama isn’t the right color. it is indeed a fact that racism is alive and well in texas. the problem with these racists is that they are, for the most part, also sexist. pity their dilemma. of course, with a bit of thought and in all fairness, most (most) of those racists/sexists are bent toward the right. excluding the small pockets of open-minded people here (as discussed w/another poster in a previous article - hope that invite to northern ca. is still open!), it is still a solid red-neck state.
in a show of desperation, i thought hilarious’s claws and fangs were a bit too proudly on display last evening.
“DALLAS, Feb. 21 (UPI) — The Secret Service told Dallas police to stop screening for weapons while people were still arriving at a campaign rally for Barack Obama, a report said.
Police stopped checking people for weapons at the front gates of Reunion Arena more than an hour before the Democratic presidential hopeful appeared on stage Wednesday, the Fort Worth (Texas) Star-Telegram reported.”
http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/Top_News/2008/02/21/report_security_relaxed_at_obama_speech/8649/
The less he has in common with Lincoln OR JFK for that matter, the easier I’ll sleep.
RMM, I may have missed Tom Joad’s point, but I didn’t think he was comparing Obama to Lincoln. That was my idea.
kathyodat
Perhaps one small part of Sen Obamna’s appeal is his ability to use the English language.
This in very sharp contrast to the national emabarrassment in the White House for last seven years.
Remember “putting food on your family”…”they misunderestimated me”…”fool me once, uh, uh, uh, fool me again”…etc, etc. The Dems beat this dimwit twice and Still Managed To Lose.
Gore and Kerry both folded up like a cheap accordion.
As Peace Coup said at 120p, Obama will face a “big league attack machine” in the fall.
I think Obama is a fighter and can give as good as gets.
Is he?????
cranky_chatter,
Thanks for the link. This actually is something that concerns me and several others with whom I have been talking: someone will try to assassinate Obama. I privately have harbored this concern, but it looks like it could become a reality. God help us.
Obama’s campaign says there is a rumor of 100 Clinton supporters to donate $100,000 each for a swiftboat-style ad blitz of $10,000,000 in Texas and Ohio. Our good ole Supreme Court last year may have made this possible with a “527″. I don’t think Hillary was conceding one thing last night at the end of debate.
We’ll see.
Being as how we are talking about Texas, perhaps remembering how Molly Ivans would describe a candidate as either having Elvis or not. She was of the opinion that some ‘Elvis’ was a required quality for a successful election result. It is pretty obvious to most just which of the two has the Elvis and which clearly does not.
‘It was like watching behavior modification take place in real-time.’
Regarding the booing following Hillary’s Xerox moment in the debate last night. (Not to be accused of plagiarism, this is a post by RJ Eskow over at Huffingtonpost today.)
That’s how I read it too. I don’t think playing ‘nice’ later in the debate was spontaneous. I think it was planned out before hand to counter what was expected to be a direct hit on Obama, but one that didn’t deliver as planned. She is going negative, but does not want to take the heat for it so I expect the run up to March 4th will have alot of surrogates for the Hillary campaign going very negative, to little avail.
(Tired of the plagiarism theme, but how can she accuse Obama of that with her blatant use of ‘Fired Up’ at the close of one of her rallys? You’ll notice in the debate she presented her charge with a built in disclaimer saying that she is not guilty of the same by saying Obama (paraphrasing) ‘copies whole passages’, obviously trying to pre-quiet any critisim of using ‘Fired Up’.)
I don’t think she had a change of heart somewhere in the debate that spoke to concession. But I think that if things go well for Obama in March, there will have to be a real concession on Hillary’s part. Especially if she wants to remain viable as a Senator.
Nobody in this business is totally clean, but Obama hasn’t been around long enough for all the leeches to have mapped out their blood areas on his ass. He still has personal and political mobility - something I doubt Hillary retains.
Case in point: The Repugs were crucifying Obama while he even spoke last night - notice they did not go after Hillary! In truth, CNN has been supporting Hillary, albeit very indirectly, for a very long time. Wolf (AIPAC) Blitzer had guest on two or three nights ago issuing the warning that if this opportunity (Hillary’s candidacy) slips away, it might be another fifty years before it happens again - now that is the kind of journalistic equilibrium we all love isn’t it!!! Clinton is the establishment - Obama is not. Hence, the hysteria.
Hillary is not a bad person - she just is not what this country, or the world, needs at this point in time. It has nothing to do with gender, it has nothing to do with Bill, it has everything to do with a desire to significantly alter the catastrophic course that Bush has mapped out for the U.S. HIllary voted for the war; Hillary voted for the Kyl-Lieberman bill - then tried to double-talk her way around the vote and say it was something that it wasn’t. This disingenuous, not Obama, is what has cost her the nomination.
Here is an actual Valedictory, from John Edwards.
“Today, I am suspending my campaign for the Democratic nomination for the Presidency. But I want to say this to everyone: with Elizabeth, with my family, with my friends, with all of you and all of your support, this son of a millworker’s gonna be just fine. Our job now is to make certain that America will be fine.”
This saying was familiar to all debate watchers. It’s OK with me that Clinton lifts Edwards’ populist lines and his entire heath care plan. Edwards borrowed from FDR.
I took it as a ‘possible’ forerunner speech, when she selects Obama to be her V/P running mate. Of course if she doesn’t take Texas by at least 50-50, that may be an optomistic hope on her part. Now she still leads in Ohio by 7%. IF, if that lead in Ohio holds, and after the Teamsters endorsment for Obama it may not. But if it does, the Ohio voters will be voting two hours ahead of Texas and if it shows she is winning in Ohio, that may very well have a direct influence on the voting in western Texas in her favor.
If Hillary wins Ohio and is close in Texas, she will close the gap and take Pennsylvanis by a wide margin. Then when the Demo convention is held, She will have more super delgates than Obama will have. Gonna be interesting, __ but Texas is the key.
I thought they both looked very good last night, and don’t see how McCain could win against either of them, especially if they are teamed up, with either as the VP choice. I don’t think Obama would necessarily need Hillary as the VP if he has another good choice. But I do believe Hillary would almost have to have Obama as her running mate, for if not, it may spilt the Demo party wide open.
An interesting side note, I understand that The secret servicve told the Dallas police to stop checking the people at the entry doors for possible weapons. Of course it was in Texas, so it is rather unlikely anything could go wrong there.
Maybe I have just grown too cynical in my old age, but I didn’t buy a word of Mrs. Clinton’s final statement. Is lachrymose the word I’m looking for, or simply implausible?
“you know, lifting whole passages from someone else’s speeches is not change you can believe in, it’s change you can Xerox” Hillary Clinton
“Ya’ll know I ain’t in no ways tie-yad….” Hillary Clinton
Pot…meet kettle…its black…Hillary is not
canuckcheck: What the hell is that supposed to mean? Maybe, something happened to the end of your post and you were trying to say something about what Hillary is not?
Lino: It’s true that there are white people who will not vote for a black person, there are also
men who will not vote for a woman. I also have a bad feeling that if Obama becomes president that
someone will try to take him out. As much as I don’t care for Hillary, having her as vice-president
may be a little bit of insurance for Obama. If you take out Obama, you get Hillary as president.
Kem, it wasn’t at the debate where they stopped checking for weapons, it was at an Obama rally. Scary. Flashed me back to the JFK assassination.
kathyodat
Rudyjo, I think Obama would have more insurance with Edwards than with Hillary. She’s pro-establishment, even with all her recent populist talk.
Actually, he would probably be safest with his own private security, as long as it isn’t Blackwater.
kathyodat
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RernchYH-Ec
Hillary’s boffo closer was the most shameless and disgusting part of the debate. She coldly and cynically used wounded veterans of a war she voted for to set up a heart-tugging sentence ripped off verbatim from Bill Clinton’s 1992 campaign speeches, and a follow-up heart-tugger ripped off from John Edwards.
This after she had been booed earlier in the debate for insistently and stridently worrying her plagiarism talking point like a dog with a pantleg.
Sorry, guys, I don’t think that was a valedictory; there’s a 527 in Ohio working on swiftboating ads, and there’s this:
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/02/hillary_advisers_privately_rea.php
That was Hillary making another cynical and transparent play for sympathy and, briefly, getting away with it. At least she didn’t cry.
Obama is like an indie rock band on the climb towards a top 40 hit: he has the “feel good” vibe going on & a lot of the public are pulling for him. The media (with the exception of the blatantly corporate / republican shills) are still generally enraptured with him (the camera loves him & he provides great audio) and he has created and mobilized a political operation that is great at the nuts & bolts while getting value for the dollars spent (the Clinton operation, in comparison, is bloated and overpaying). What remains to be seen is if the timing of his rise is calibrated to the upcoming general election (it should crest on the day after the election), and if Obama has a follow-up if he becomes the occupant of the White House.
What the hell does Nichols mean by saying Hillary’s campaign is a “low-on-funds campaign”? Both she and Barack’s campaigns are spending way more than any campaign should ever be allowed to spend. Kucinich or some other progressive would be the Democrats’ presidential frontrunner if the campaign spending wasn’t so high that only the campaigns of the candidates that the corporations and the rich are okay with can get enough funding from them to be in the running.
“Clinton’s rarely been the threat to the business community that many on the right typically allege… She advocated weakening the McCain-Feingold campaign finance reform law, telling Feingold to “live in the real world.” Unlike Edwards and Obama, she accepts campaign contributions from lobbyists and corporate PACs. “Ask them why they don’t take money from lobbyists,” Wolfson retorts. “We’re proud of our support.”
“Hillary, Inc.”
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20070604/berman
The Honest Leadership and Open Government Act of 2007
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d110:s.00001:
“Senator Barack Obama, an Illinois Democrat who was tapped by leaders to oversee ethics overhaul, said the legislation would “ensure that committees aren’t slipping in earmarks in the dead of night.”
After overcoming resistance inside his own party, Mr. Obama pushed for a provision requiring, for the first time, disclosure by lobbyists who bundle political contributions of more than $15,000 in six months.
“My argument was that it was worth it for us to try to be aggressive on this front, particularly since we were just coming into power,” Mr. Obama said, adding that he wished the rules could be enforced by an outside group. “I do think that the public would have more confidence in the process if we had an independent enforcement mechanism.”
The legislation is designed to limit the social interaction between lobbyists and lawmakers, making it more difficult for them to get together at sporting events, parties at national political conventions and other social activities.
The bill also deprives former members of Congress who now work as lobbyists of some of the privileges that critics say give them an advantage in pushing legislation. The measure revokes floor privileges to former lawmakers who are lobbying, and denies them access to the House and Senate gyms, other exercise facilities and members-only parking.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/03/washington/03lobby.html
“A Chance to Change the Game” by Barack Obama
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/01/03/AR2007010301620.html
“The Republicans who controlled the Senate last year refused to let it come up. And on Jan. 12, before the details of the proposal had been disclosed, Senator Charles E. Schumer, the New York Democrat in charge of his party’s fund-raising as head of the senatorial campaign committee, used a run-in on the Senate floor to deliver an angry rebuke to the disclosure idea’s lead sponsor, Senator Barack Obama, Democrat of Illinois, several people present or briefed on the confrontation said.
In a subsequent conversation, Mr. Schumer said he worried that the proposal could cramp fund-raising by placing an undue burden on potential bundlers, said aides who were briefed and a lawmaker familiar with their talk, speaking on the condition of anonymity because of the nature of the talks.
“Senator Obama has not been the most popular person in our caucus in the last couple of weeks,” said a Democratic aide involved in deliberations over the bill. ”
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/20/us/politics/20ethics.html
“Ethics Fencing in the Senate”
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/15/opinion/15mon4.html
“Bundlers in ‘08”
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/19/opinion/19fri3.html
BeForKids,
MLK was most likely taken down because of his “poor people’s march” and his opposition to the Vietnam War, not because of racism. It was just that the rampant racism at the time provided the government with the opportunity to explain his assassination as the result of racism. The same is true with Obama — it is extremely unlikely a real racist would have the guts or ability to take him down, but what is likely is that some rogue elements of the government would try to take him down if he gets too progressive and would blame racism for the attack. So it is critical that he chooses a VP more progressive than he is. That is what would give him insurance. Edwards would be a good choice.
I’m a Texan voting for Obama, but I think Hillary came out early in the debate strong. As the night went on, I think Obama got better. By the end, I wasn’t sure how she was playing.
I do think she had more vocal supporters than Obama packing the house, evidenced by the amount of applause and cheers for her.
Usually, by the time primaries get to Texas, it is a done deal. It is exciting this time that we may be the ones to significantly influence the outcome of this nomination.
Texans are not as monolithic as some posters here seem to think. This is a big state with quite a diverse population. I sense a lot of surge going for Obama. He may not win, but it will definitely be close. I do not think Hillary will pull off a 65% win.
Early voting started Tuesday, and many will take advantage of that.
We also have precinct caucuses right after the polls close on March 4, and about a third of the delegates will be determined through those and the subsequent county conventions. So, whoever can dominate there will gain a significant share of delegates.
Y’all stay tuned on March 4-it should be a wild ride!
zazmo, Obama’s campaign is funded by the people who support him. I agree that it shouldn’t be necessary to spend millions of dollars on a campaign… but unfortunately it is. Recognize the fact that Obama’s raising his money the right way.
Hey, have a question. Do US Senators have Secret Service protection? If they do, I was unaware of it. I believe ex-presidents family members do, and if so Hillary would have it. So is that story about the Secret Service ordering the Dallas police to stop checking people at an Obama rallly have any credence? I know presidential candidates don’t have Secret Service protection unless they are already the president and campainging for a second term.
There been a lot of claims about who is funding various campaigns. Given that Obama has obtained relatively small contributions from nearly 1,000,000 people, it seems highly unlikely that much of this is due to Republicans or others that are trying to prop up Obama so that he can then fail in the general. All you need is a 1 million people giving $100 each and you’ve got $100m. This is pretty much the description of Obama’s campaign contributions. If the Reps are this good at organizing they don’t have much to worry about. On the other hand, if this is really the Obama campaign, then maybe John has something to worry about. There are many more untapped voters that will turn out and vote for Obama then there are voters for McCain. Remember that conservatives and older voters already vote in much larger percentages than do the young and Blacks. If Obama can turn out the youth and Black vote McCain is doomed.
I also like the idea of Obama/Richardson.
How does that sound?
Especially if it is Obama/Richardson against Mccain/Renzi.
Hope ~Riverman~ doesn’t know what “Valedictory” means. Get ready for some wierd shit if he show up here. He might, think he lives on another planet, he usually doesn’t post till after 4 pm Pacific time.
Kem: Obama receives Secret Service Protection.
John Nichols has a tin ear. Hillary’s closing was a heartfelt paean to people who really suffer the consequences of failed policies while either of the candidates’ struggles pale in comparison. It was a wonderful note, showing her grounded sense of reality mixed with humility and light. Valedictory, please!
Nichols tin ear continues, when Hillary called Obama on his incredible plagiarism, a true sign of a weak and unimaginative candidate. The booing Nichols wanted to hear from Obama supporters actually came from Hillary supporters who were supporting her and booing the dishonest Obama. And really for Obama to lift from MLK, Jefferson and Franklin and FDR based on his thin record deserves the severest sanction. Zeroxing words was much too kind a charge from Hillary.
Lastly, at the close Obama was asked about his defining moment. Most of the evening the CNN mouthpieces forced Hillary to answer first in attempts to embarrass her and give Obama a chance to prepare his answer which was usually a page taken from Hillary’s answer. This time, forced to answer first, he hummed and hawed and, finally “like a deer in the headlights” fell back on his hardscrabble youth (yeah, right!).
jimm_barr, I’m OK with Obama-Richardson , just not Obama-Clinton.
rbrooks, did Hillary really lift her entire defining moment from others’ speeches? Now that’s funny! And one breath away from calling Obama a plagiarist!
kathyodat
As a texan in Austin, I rated the debate a draw. Hillary needed a knock out. As for claims of racism amongst the dems in texas not being able to vote for obama, give me a break.Do you know what its been like to be a democrat in texas? race is not an issue for the party , a large majority of the elected democratic positions in texas are held by minorities. I am a middle aged white male ,small buisiness owner in the construction industry,raised in small town texas.Those democrats in Texas that could not vote for a candidate because of their color or gender are long gone and republicans by and large. Texas is going to put the stake in the heart of the clinton campaign. Good candidate , very articulate , good policy positions , just not the best candidate . Sorry folks you in the punditocracy spin it away, We are gonna solve the issue of the nomination march 4th for the democratic party ,and dayumn proud to be of service.
Great post, clovis buford. Too bad the Democrats in Texas won’t be choosing the president come November. I predict Texas will go for McCain. Still, primaries are important, at least this time around, COMarc notwithstanding. Just think: without them we’d be stuck with Hillary.
kathyodat
Good point, maryinbelltown, all politicians borrow shamelessly from one another, just as writers sometimes unintentionally borrow from other writers. If you listen closely, most of Hillary’s speeches are recycled from Bill Clinton’s 1992 campaign, as was the first part of her ‘finest moment’ at the end of the debate; the second part was, as rbrooks noted, from John Edwards channeling FDR. Accusing your opponent of practicing plagiarism while you are doing the same thing? Priceless.
Kem, I read that frontrunners (sorry, Mike Gravel) in the presidential election campaigns now receive Secret Service protection and that it was an SS decision to suspend checking for weapons at that rally in Texas, supposedly because there were so many people lined up it wasn’t practicable within the time frame before Obama’s appearance.
Poor Clinton. When will she figure out that we groundlings don’t care about plagiarism in political speeches? She’d have better luck hitting Obama on the lack of mandates in his health care proposal. She might even go so far as to call it an “underfunded” plan.
RSJ I read that as well I also read that Obama has had Secret Service protection since last May, the earliest of any candidate for president.
kathyodat
Three cheers for Senator Clinton: the fat lady has done her “thing” (sung) and Senator Clinton has now surely seen the light and been, so far, gracious in her impending defeat.
We in no way expect her to go through sour-grape throes but rather, use her 35 years of experience to benifit the Democratic Party positively by coalescing around the new presumptive winner, Barack Obama.
Congratulations are in order for Senatror Clinton for having put up such a sterling challenge: a challenge that would quite likely have met with success at an earlier time. Unfortunately however - NOT this time - the moment belongs to Barack.
The world and America need CHANGE and I, as a Jamaican, am certain that under Prseident Obama well deserved and positive CHANGE will come to a UNITED States America and, by extension, the rest of the world.
YES WE CAN.
Ja, es ist sehr moeglich und wir (die Leute der Welt)fruen uns darauf.
Yes, she made a serious error to mention plagiarism. That didn’t help her at all. There were other issues she could have broght up as differences and not have been making personal and petty attacks. I don’t believe Hillary will win Texas, and if not she may drop out of the race. If she’s close and wins in Ohio, she will likely stay on for Pennsylvania. Unfortunantly, it is often the one with the most TV ads who wins, except that didn’t work for Romney. Of course most of his campaign funds were his own money, reported now to have been $96 million. People don’t like that.
Yeah, sure — Hillary hit a home run at the end, but unbeknownst to the standing ovation, she used a corked bat: the words she used were John Edwards’.
Unlike Duval Patrick, who works on Obama’s campaign and suggested he use his words, I don’t believe Edwards, who hasn’t even endorsed Clinton let alone work for her, asked Clinton to use his words.
Hillary has also been plagiarizing Edwards’s “this is personal for me” — ever since he used that phrase (over & over & over).
2) to “deutsch,” How do you think you know that this is true: “The booing Nichols wanted to hear from Obama supporters actually came from Hillary supporters who were supporting her and booing the dishonest Obama.” I didn’t hear it that way …
3) “deutsch”: “Xeroxing words was much too kind a charge from Hillary.” I think the charge was petty, and also false. Plus it had been cleared up already. It really made her look bad, in my opinion.
Hillary’s attack on Obama was sheer hypocrisy. Like all politicians, she has advisors, focus groups, consultants and speechwriters whose words she uses without attribution. Obama did it and she attacked him because she is both vicious and desperate, and a phony smile and conciliatory words don’t hide the facts.
Hillary sheds crocodile tears for Iraq veterans, even though she is one of the Senators who placed them in harm’s way on obviously fraudulent grounds. She has the blood of the million Iraqis and 4000 Americans who have died, and at least 10 times that number who have been injured, on her hands. She has never expressed remorse, and while her visit to the family of the officer killed in her motorcade was a nice touch, it doesn’t wash off the blood of the others.
Obama did well to nail her on how her high-handed ways, which continue to this day, screwed up health care reform and led to another 15 years of no health coverage for above 40 million people. So let’s not take her air of superiority on this issue seriously.
“We in no way expect her to go through sour-grape throes but rather, use her 35 years of experience to benifit the Democratic Party positively by coalescing around the new presumptive winner, Barack Obama.”
I have never been able to figure out how being married to a governor and president & a corporate lawyer translates into “35 years of experience” in public service. Talk about “creative accounting”.
Her husband, who has now graduated to status of another Bush son according to Bush Sr., talked, in sheer Rovian fashion, that Obama’s claim that he opposed the war was a “fairy tale”, when his spouse & their friends were responsible for freezing out the anti-war movement in the 2004 and tried to do it again in the 2006 elections.
Obama has been unfailingly gracious towards Hillary, who has behaved like a sorority hostess trying to cut the unwelcome guest who is stealing the spotlight from her. It’s been the ONE gracious remark she’s made, and it came after all her underhanded comments failed.
clovis buford, i believe the comment was that “many people in texas will vote for hilarious…” living in austin affords you the luxury of being smack dab in the middle of one of the small pockets of open-minded people i previously referred to. i’m not sure which small texas town you grew up in, nor do i care, but if there was no racism in your small town, consider yourself fortunate. racism is definitely alive today throughout much of the state, including austin texas. just check the track record for your city police department over the last 18 months. i won’t even mention east texas where white boys still think it’s a game to hook a young man of color to their rear bumper, dragging him thru the woods, swilling their beers and chewing their tubackey, and “dayumn proud” of it.
beforkids, you are very astute. don’t be surprised to see the mad bomber do well in texas, if for no other reason than the racist/sexist issue previously posted. it might sober us all up just a bit to remember how texas (”it’s like a whole other country”) voted in 2000 and 2004. those voters are not going to vote for a woman or a man of color. period.
For those who are interested
We are offering positive thoughts or
support or prayers as your beliefs suggest
for Sen. Obama at 8AM Pacific time each day.
I like Obama but I think Hillary has more substance and is better informed. I think she would make a very good president. I know there are many on this board that totally dislike her for whatever reasons. But I’m really tired of everyone nitpicking her to death. “We see through different eyes .. that’s why we have different wives and live different lives”
I’m still grieving for Edwards.
Octotroph,
I’m actually rather disappointed in Edwards. He bowed out of the race gracefully after a good fight, but since doing so he has pretty much left all his supporters twisting in the wind. I think that by now he should have endorsed one of the other candidates and lent his support to their campaign. Waiting to see how things go between Obama and Clinton smacks of self-serving political caution. It gives the appearance that he’s more concerned about making sure he does not back a loser, instead of supporting the candidate he believes best represents his own principles.
Just doesn’t sit right with me.
As usual, the damned edit thingy here doesn’t work!
“instead of supporting the candidate he believes best candidate best represents his own principles.”
Should have read:
“instead of supporting the candidate he believes best represents his own principles.”
grumpyoldlady I agree with you.
I reflected on Hillary’s Texas debate performance and I think she’s mending fences to get the vice presidency. Party bosses used to make that pick, but now the presidential nominee does. Be interesting to see who Obama chooses.
kathyodat
OBAMA, OBAMA, PARA NUEVA MANANA!
That means that Obama presents us with a new opportunity for a new dawn.
For too many years the forces of greed, those who pathologically seek wealth, power and prestige, have ravaged middle income and poor people as well as our planet.
Their principal tool is the publicly traded for-profit corporation. Their path to power is the flawed US election system. Regulation and tax reform will help limit the damage they cause to people and the planet.
I believe Barack Obama and a Democratic Congress will begin this good work. Hillary Clinton will not do what is necessary, regardless of her rhetoric.
Oscar Priem
Kem, I get a nice warm feeling knowing that empty-suit GOP hypocrite Romney lost $96 million of his own money on his vanity candidacy. I was even mildly proud that the Republicans didn’t fall for this ‘Mormon with one M’ snake-oil salesman, even though he would have been easier for a Dem to beat. Not that McCain’s much better these days; Ted Rall pretty much summed up Cap’n Crunch’s goofy neocon campaign in a cartoon of him with “Straight Jacket Express” in the background. And that photo of McCain tightly embracing Emperor Junior with his head on Bush’s shoulder as if for salvation says it all. All the Dems have to do is run that image in their TV spots and it’s a Blue landslide in November.
Hillary’s one shot at derailing Obama in this last debate was not out-debating him but making him lose his cool and she couldn’t do it. She wanted a video clip of him responding in anger that would be played repeatedly on free media for the next two weeks, showing he was just another politician, and instead she ended up with one of herself getting booed. He was a calm Zen master while she burbled policy statistics and her tedious ‘Ready on Day One’ chant. Who looked more presidential — the poised and dignified Obama or the chattering Hillary and her pressing that phony ‘plagiarism’ charge that no one really cares about outside of her campaign staff and the Big Media? (How many here remember that Martin Luther King was also hit by charges of plagiarism?) Obama also engaged in some subtle verbal judo, answering Hillary’s attack points and turning them back at her, without resorting to name-calling or bile.
Her supporters have now been whittled down to four sub-groups: The Diehard Clinton lovers who fondly recall the days of President Bill; upper middle-class white women over 50 who fought the good fight for women’s liberation in the ’60s and see a Hillary presidency as their ultimate victory; the DLC Democratic Party Washington establishment; and those who think it’s ‘too soon’ and America won’t vote for a black president this time around, which is really just a polite cover for their own bigotry — that’s just not enough warm bodies to net her the nomination or elect her president.
Hillary must be sorely frustrated than none of her negative campaign ads in Wisconsin turned the tide there, and are not likely to help her anywhere else either. Lacking the charisma of Obama and with deep money woes, I think she realized, at the end of the debate, that she can’t out-campaign him and she can’t rattle him so she decided to exit gracefully — she can always run again in 2012 if Obama loses, or she might have been angling for a VP nod. I know her campaign vehemently denies it, but that last part sounded like a concession speech to me.
I think Hillary understands herself that she should concede. “I am honored to be on the stage with Barak Obama.” That statement said to me that she is starting to recognize that he is already an historic figure, which is something she could never quite be because she will always be “the wife of.”
If you read her autobiography you can see between the lines that she was manipulated by her husband into taking the lead, and hence the fall, over National Health Care in 1993. You can be sure that if Bill Clinton saw victory at the end of that he would not have let Hillary have that one. He saw that it was going to be a loss, and he let Hillary be the pigeon.
I believe that he is manipulating her into continuing this race in much the same way. He has nothing to lose and everything to gain.
Judging by what was in her autobiography, Hillary never figured out that she had been set up by Bill to take the fall in the health care fight of 1993. Does she now realize that the position she is in is one that will only get increasingly disastrous?
Since Bill has whored himself into hundreds of millions based upon his electoral success as a Trojan horse for Republican ideology, would it come as a surprise to learn that he doesn’t really care what Hillary’s decisions do to the Democratic Party or Hillary’s reputation?
For a smart woman, she is really stupid when it comes to Bill.
re:linos remarks ” but if there was no racism in your small town, consider yourself fortunate. racism is definitely alive today throughout much of the state, including austin texas. ” err I never suggested such a thing it helps if you actualy read my post “Those democrats in Texas that could not vote for a candidate because of their color and gender are long gone and republicans by and large.” and thats verified by the number of minority democratic officials in texas. we are a red state , I never implied it was a majority view which by and large is republican in Texas. The glass is not half full in texas on voters ,but your implication that the democratic party and austin is full of closet bigots is misinformed at best and disengenous . I note NY city which is considered blue as hell has had a few broom stick incidents and 40 something shots at unarmed immigrants from police make it clear its not necessarily a red state blue state issue . thanks for your concern
The two remaining Dem candidates are not far apart on most issues. Their speeches have both been vacuumed clean by their handlers, so they are not saying very much more than the standard platitudes. And they are BOTH DLC. Obama is very close to Lieberman, got his ‘let’s all be bi-partisan’ schtick from Lieberman, and campaigned for Lieberman AGAINST the Real Democrat in 2006. Remember, Harold Ford is now the DLC head. These are not very progressive people.
I just hope that, if it is Obama, he can pull it off in the general election. He has been on friendly liberal territory for a long time now. But as Mr. Buford points out, the Red states are Republican states. I believe that Obama will be faced with a horrific barrage of swiftboating from the Rove machine, which remember morphed even war veteran Sen. Max Cleland into Osama Bin Laden. AND IT WORKED!
So what do you think Rove will do with Barack Hussein Obama? Tailor-made for scaring the doodoo out of the Republican base and other conservatives, and making them run for the protection of John ‘Wayne’ McCain. Rove doesn’t give a shit about winning over liberals or the Blue states, or their criticisms about what he does with his outrages. He just cares about ‘energizing’ his base so they turn out en masse with enough fear of and hate for Obama that they elect the Republicans. And he will do just about anything to ‘win’ because winning is everything to him.
The Red states are hostile territories for Obama, and for Clinton. Which has the better chance of defeating warmonger McCain? That is the burning question. Republicans must not be elected, or else the country will continue its downward spiral and continue to suffer greatly.
Heavyrunner wrote: “If you read her autobiography you can see between the lines that she was manipulated by her husband into taking the lead, and hence the fall, over National Health Care in 1993. You can be sure that if Bill Clinton saw victory at the end of that he would not have let Hillary have that one. He saw that it was going to be a loss, and he let Hillary be the pigeon.”
I’ve heard that she was picked to insure (no pun intended) that universal health care failed in 1993. Bill had made it one of his centerpiece promises in the ‘92 campaign, as the majority of the public wanted it, and he didn’t want to have that enormous unkept promise to interfere with his re-election in 1996. So he had Hillary do everything she could to derail it — in secret, of course — and then when it tanked he just shrugged his shoulders and said ‘well, we tried.’ Meanwhile, both he and Hillary have taken big bucks in contributions from Big Pharma and the for-profit health care industry.
FVHorn wrote: “And they are BOTH DLC. Obama is very close to Lieberman, got his ‘let’s all be bi-partisan’ schtick from Lieberman, and campaigned for Lieberman AGAINST the Real Democrat in 2006.”
That’s just plain wrong, FV: Obama asked that his name be removed from DLC literature and he has disagreed with the goals of that group; in 2006, he made some speeches for Lieberman when he was the sitting Dem senator, but supported Ned Lamont when he got the nomination. (BTW, Lamont is now backing Obama’s run for president.) Obama was ‘bipartisan when he was first elected to the Illinois State Senate, and Lieberman was chosen by the party as his mentor when he came to the US Senate. In fact, Obama has had a very progressive career in politics and is currently listed by the National Journal as the most liberal member of Congress.
FVHorn wrote: ” I believe that Obama will be faced with a horrific barrage of swiftboating from the Rove machine, which remember morphed even war veteran Sen. Max Cleland into Osama Bin Laden. AND IT WORKED!
“So what do you think Rove will do with Barack Hussein Obama? Tailor-made for scaring the doodoo out of the Republican base and other conservatives, and making them run for the protection of John ‘Wayne’ McCain. Rove doesn’t give a shit about winning over liberals or the Blue states, or their criticisms about what he does with his outrages. He just cares about ‘energizing’ his base so they turn out en masse with enough fear of and hate for Obama that they elect the Republicans. And he will do just about anything to ‘win’ because winning is everything to him.”
Things have changed in the past few years — the latest poll says Bush now has a record low presidential approval rating of 19 percent, and 78 percent are unhappy with the way he’s handling the economy. The country is sick and tired of the GOP and the fractured Republican base isn’t enough to get any national candidate elected this year. The enthusiasm and the energy is all on the Dems side — hell, half the GOP hate McCain. Already we’ve seen the Swift Boaters aim for Obama: Every negative trial balloon has been dumped on him - young; inexperienced; naïve; Islamic madrassa education; ‘Hussein’s my middle name’; Muslim heritage; questions if he’s ‘black enough’; accusations of plagiarism; charges of dirty campaign tactics; even that he’s some kind of Manchurian candidate for Al-Qaeda - but none of it has stuck; he just keeps adding voters and winning primaries. Meanwhile, McCain is pathetically trying to unite his party and isn’t appealing to independents.
Stop being so scared of the Big Bad Wolf: Rove is persona non grata in the party after 2006, when he couldn’t deliver on his promise to maintain the GOP majority in Congress.
2008 may very well be the year that the Dems have a ‘teflon’ candidate for a change.
clovis buford: i believe the comment was that “living in austin affords you the luxury of being smack dab in the middle of one of the small pocket of open-minded people i previously referred to.” i can see how some would take that as a reference to austin being full of “closet bigots” as you suggest. goddamn, read the words. try to comprehend, if you can.
lino you stretched my original post which was about democratic voters in this primary ,then made reference to my small town upbringing ,which I had mentioned merely as background without giving specifics . When I was a small child there were still segregated drinking fountains ,still signs saying “dont let the sun set on your black a** ” so I am well aware of the small town texas you speak of , but thanks for informing me again. here is what you say ” i’m not sure which small texas town you grew up in, nor do i care, but if there was no racism in your small town, consider yourself fortunate. racism is definitely alive today throughout much of the state, including austin texas. just check the track record for your city police department over the last 18 months.” I never made claim to any thing on racial issues in Texas other than to say the democratic electorate was past those hotpoint issues you are pushing. I am calling this as the point where i am wrestling with the pig and both of us are getting muddy and only one of us is enjoying it . You of course are of scintillating moral clarity and intellect and I bow before your moral superiority.
lino, clovis buford is being honest and you are being insulting.
kathyodat
hey kathy, go back and re-read the posts, at the same time paying attention to the current events of which i speak. if you find truth to be insulting, so be it.
Mr. lino ,or ms . I am still trying to figure out what brought out such a visceral reaction to what was a fairly innocuous post to start with. The supposition on my part was that democratic voters in Texas would vote for a black man , or a woman a few examples by past history , think anne richards , think barbara jordan ( double bonus points to make you crazy ,black and a woman ) Votes in texas elected a black mayor to Dallas , Ron Kirk. Is it just merely a reaction to someone in texas actually supporting barrack obama vs Hillary , or xenophobia on your part? You obviously know about Texas from the outside looking in but are willing to school residents who live here on conditions here . Thats kind of you , I am not sure we actually need it . We have produced plenty of inner critcs and progressives on our own , think bill moyers and molly ivins, james Mcmurtrey, Jim Hightower. I can tell you however where not to spend your hard earned vacation dollars , dont bother here , you obviously would not enjoy a place you have such disdain for. Like lyle Lovette sings “Thats right you arent from texas” Thanks for all your input, its been educational and yes by all means I would sugggest anyone reading this, read all the posts in their entirety and make their own judgement. Its what rational people do . I am still not quite certain of what truth lino is speaking to other than a difference on which progressive candidate I support and which state I chose to live in. Lino if by chance you do live here , do yourself a favour , move , you are obviously unhappy.If it was the fact that I use words like “dayumn ” get over it ,everyone has a dialect, I tend to express mine, if it was the fact that someone dared to have a different conclusion to the race than you had , get over it , march 4th will tell the tale and till then its all opinion.