Most times when a taser is used, a simple net gun would be all that is needed. Tasers are a perfect tool for sadists. There seems to be a lot of those around. i.e., most of those in the bush administration.

The special on Tasers on The National

http://www.cbc.ca/national/blog/video/crimejustice/a_stunning_debate.html

Just when you think that nothing can shock you about Tasers any more.

shakker - Very good.

40 seconds! Anyone want to stick their fingers in a socket for 40 seconds! I thought tasers were a quick touch and release to interrupt violent behavior?? What are current police practices? 40 seconds!!

OINK OINK! DON'T SHOOT!!!!

Does anybody think of how the pigs feel? Being tied up attached to machines and then electrocuted before being killed to find out how it affects the insides or shoved in a tiny filty cage. That is the real torture here.

If a person is charged with a crime severe enough that they need a zap, give it to them, along with the "scientists" who get off and paid to the cries of innocent animals.

I think escaping criminals should be shot with THC - active ingredient in pot. That way the criminals will stop to eat at about 5 consecutive fast food places or stop to stare at lava lamps and regale the arresting officers with slow philosophical rants.

Congratulations, wardanna. It's nice to see that every now and then, someone wakes up. Lots of places sell delicious veggie burgers. There is absolutely no excuse in the 21st century for meat consumption.

"pig studies?" please, let us move beyond such treachery.

How can anybody even work in a place that does this.I sat and cried tonight when I saw the bull dozer pushing the cow that had fallen down.Hamburger is the only beef I eat and as of today that is over.I will no longer eat beef. How an animal has to suffer so we can eat.It is horrible. I hope that all these places end up having to close down and all those people go without a job.They deserve it for treating any animal that cruely.

Tasers may have limited, very limited, uses just as guns have when there are threats that cannot be handled otherwise. The big problem is that the purchasers are being instructed that this is a safe defensive alternative, when, in fact, it is often not. The exceptions are when people are on drugs, legal or otherwise, or have some unknown pre-existing condition such as a heart condition or epilepsy perhaps or, as one poster pointed out, the luck of when in the heart beat the taser was applied. So those with medical conditions that are causing agitation or disabled such as autistic or such as the deaf man, wet from the shower, whose apartment was mistakenly raided the other month who died because he could not understand what the police were ordering him to do. According to Amnesty International, people across North America are dying every month now that these tasers have been widely enough marketed. And the temptation to use them to torture is all too seductive. Testing on some less than 100 lb. pigs with 40 second bursts is absurd. What they need to do is take a hard look at every case of death or permanent injury already inflicted to end the argument. The trouble is that this corporate marketing is making some people a whole lot of money. We could go on for decades with this stupidity as the death toll rises.

Tasers should only be used on Bush & Co and other proponents of torture, after we're done playing the harmless prank of waterboarding them.

THEY SHOULD TEST ON THEMSELVES. JERKS!!

Stop the Tazing

> Alternatively, someone could find the gene responsible for violence and eradicate it from the genome

Yeah, and that'll work just so well because everyone will be more then happy to have someone come by and say "I don't like your genetics so I'm going to tinker with it". Those who participate in "direct action" against animal researchers will no doubt be eager to have the Feds remove their violence gene. What could possibly go wrong?

>Eliminate the slaughter of animals for consumption (and product-tesing etc),
>you go a loooong way to eliminating the need for war and violence against people.

Right. Just think of what might have happened had Hitler not been a vegetarian.
He might have done something just really awful.

All one need do to understand human violence and cruelty is to look at how humans treat animals. Federal law now brands direct action by animal rights advocates as "terrorism" while researchers such as these can torture animals in laboratories with impunity. One day all the cruelty, hypocrisy and lies will cause our society to simply implode upon itself.

In medical circles, it has long been noted that a well-timed, precisely measured and accurately delivered jolt of electricity to a fibrillating heart can restore it to it's normal rhythmic patterns.

Since the mid-eighties, collaborating researchers of mathematics, physiology and physics have discovered to much surprise, that the reverse is also possible.

They discovered a dynamical heart whose perturbations and rhythms could be mapped using the tools of a new science named "Chaos".

[Read: "Chaos" James Gleick. Chapter 10. "Inner Rhythms".]

Notable was a scientist, George Mines, who tested this electrical shock hypothesis upon himself (I wonder if he had considered testing upon pigs?) and was proved quite correct.

And terminally so. His machines were later noticed to have recorded the fibrillating last trace of his faltering heart.

Oops! It is live here!

http://www.cbc.ca/news/

Taser inquiry on cpac.ca right now live!

The fact that hundreds of people have been killed after being subjected to tasers is not part of this review. In 2007, there were more deaths in Canada from the use of taser guns than people shot by police. And it seems police are using stun guns even without being physically threatened by the persons they are tasering. Just one example is the most recent in the news of the Polish man at Western Canadian airport, who did not speak English was left in the airport holding area for 11 hours and could not reach his mother to let her know where he was. No one paid any attention to him as he sat there for hours on end. He was frightened because he could not communicate with anyone. When he became frustrated and angry and threw a chair, police came and tasered him -- twice. He died on the spot. He did not have a weapon and did not threaten the airport police. This has become common practice against people who do not have weapons, simply because of the misleading data stating they are safe and non-life threatening. Most of the deaths do not make the news.

" BeForKids January 30th, 2008 10:24 am

Torturing animals is also obscene."

YES. Otoh, using the dumb animals occupying the White House and their ilk for testing these types of weapons might be an interesting experiment; might, or [would] be.

I agree that this is torture of animals and that this should be banned. Besides, there's evidently NO need for these weapons. I have not yet read any stories about productive uses of the tasers; only bad stories, including many deaths, and mostly people who were either innocent, or innocent enough.

It is another illustration of how DEPRAVED these types of people are. It's sort of like they have neither minds nor souls.

There have been MANY enough abusive uses of these damn weapons over just a couple of years, so the signal should already be LOUD and CLEAR that these damn things need to be abolished. There's NO good use for these instruments; and maybe after years of these being used, the statistics, if recorded honestly, may possibly prove that the use of these weapons cumulatively is worse than guns (the bullet kind). Maybe?

I have an impression that we already have the answer and it's YES, these are more dangerous, for the cops are damn idiots, vicious, can't think at all intelligently, etc. Based on what I believe to recall reading, well over 100 people have been already killed with these damn weapons, and many of these people were very to entirely innocent. The cops are damn NUTS; taser-happy goons.

Human beings should test tasers on each other to see whether they are harmful to pigs.

I'm reading a wonderful book by Alan Weisman called The World Without Us, about how infinitely better off our planet would be absent our detestable species. A good start for activists who want do do something about the evils of the world could start by not reproducing.

I forgot to mention that if somebody does have a legit reason (if such can even be found) for tasering another person, there's absolutely no excuse for leaving the thing turned on through its entire 30-second cycle. They can be turned off as easily as they can be triggered. Leaving the thing firing once the person has dropped is where the cruelty really comes in. Part of the issue really is the irresponsibility of the police.

Taking the word of the seller, Taser International, for this killing machine as being "among the safest use-of-force options available" is like still believing George W. Bush that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction instead of the oil that was the real target. Taser International would say anything to not stop the sale of this deadly weapon's profits to its shareholders.

The police have relied too much on this weapon and the word of the seller that it is relatively safe and have behaved just as a child does who is given a hammer, suddenly everything looks like a nail!

If the Vancouver police hadn't this weapon at the time, the Polish immigrant would still be alive.

kelmer, I agree with what you say, but you have to read what I said. Even most CDers don't get it is a long way from calling CDers "supremacist morons". That is quite a leap of logic.

I stated that most (not all) CDers don't see the big picture. If a person is predisposed to violence, it matters not whether they are holding a taser, or a gun, or a sharpened matchstick.

The CD staff "get it". They see violence of anykind as a kharmic crime, and so it gets reported here.

Remember the following rules for progressives:
- Kill your TV
- Stop spending
- Get involved
- Get informed
- Live with our eyes open

Just don't read snippets from the media and assume you know everything.

Tasers need to be outlawed. Period. Anyone who uses a taser should be open to civil suit: and they should be sued for everything they own-and everything they ever will own. If the cost goes high enough-they will simply become economically non-feasible.

Humans often treat each other worse than they treat animals. Bear, deer, rabbits, squirrels, migratory birds, etc. may enter and leave Canada or Mexico at any time. But all humans need to be branded with a passport.

I contend that advocates of violence against animals (e.g., meat-eaters) pre-disposes such people for advocating violence against people. Yes, meat-eaters will swear blue that they are peaceniks, but that is just lip service.

Eliminate the slaughter of animals for consumption (and product-tesing etc), you go a loooong way to eliminating the need for war and violence against people.

Typical cowardly sadistic scientists with their useless experiments.

Human research is the only thing that has weight. you dont try to cure elephant diseases by experimenting on giraffes. Any non human animal study can be spinned to get whatever results you want. It happens all the time.
This article just shows once more than non human animal research doesnt work.

It only demonstrates the sadism of people working in research.

Pig transplants dont work--its just a venture capitalist research scam so the scientists can make $$$. Heart valves is all they can do.

Pigs however, are certainly among the most intelligent of domesticated animals. Much smarter than dogs. How ironic that they endure among the most vicious treatment by that embarrassment of Nature called humanity.

"Even most CDers don't get it."

**are you saying that most Cd'ers are supremacist morons when it comes to non human issues?
Say it aint so. The CD staff must be supportive since they ran a title like this. That's the reason i send them money. Because they show enlightenment in this area--especially when they ran articles on SHAC,

The tasers should be tested on the scientists.
I will be willing to do it without a government grant.

If anyone needs a jolt of electricity it is the science community.

"Weapons are tools of violence; all decent men detest them." * Lao Tzu

Strange that they got their information from the CBC but failed to mention that there will be a special on Tasers on The National tonight!

There is also going to be something in Committee on Tasers today. Penny Priddy (NDP Public Safety critic) and Ujjal Dosanjh (Liberal Public Safety critic were talking about it. Seems as if they are chomping at the bit to ask Rick Smith questions today.

BTW - Did anyone see the discussion of Tasers in Cougar's Corner (spoof of Coach's Corner)

http://www.sketchcom.com/seasons/season15/080118.html

You all know what a Cougar is and now you know what lengths they will go to get themselves some young meat.

Let's try out the tasers on the real pigs.

Where in the fuck is the Chicago Sun-Times AND the Chicago Tribune on this story???? Let's see: Tasers made in the USA, study done by actual doctors at Cook county (Chicago IL), and the fucking story is done by the Canadians? This is it, I'm looking into becoming an expatriot, fuck this shit!!!!!!!!!! And as far as Police goes, most cops are dumb, fascist, sadist motherfuckers that in some documented cases have actually shot themselves with their own gun.

BeForKids wrote: Torturing animals is also obscene.

I just want to reiterate that statement. Torturing Animals is Obscene.

Even most CDers don't get it. It's not tasers ("tasers dont kill, people do" BS). Its not guns, knives, billy-clubs, garottes, sticks, stones, it is people that are the problem. You could outlaw all of this, but people will find a way to inflict harm, pain and fear on innocents. People suck.

The extent of human violence, cruelty, greed and selfishness is unparalleled on this planet. What this planet needs is a healthy outbreak of an especially virulent ebola virus.

Alternatively, someone could find the gene responsible for violence and eradicate it from the genome.

We purchased a C2 Taser six months or so ago for use in case we or one of our three dogs were attacked by another dog during our frequent walks. It has and does happen all too frequently, and Taser markets their devices for this purpose, among others. (Oddly, it's illegal to carry pepper spray in our parks, but not tasers.) I truly hope never to have to use it, but tasing an attacking dog would be preferable to huge vet bills and possibly a dead pet. I can't imagine using one of these things on a human: they're very nasty.

Having admitted to this, we would never have bought a taser today given the information that has emerged over the past few months. I agree substantively with the foregoing comments.

Citizens can now carry guns, and tasers. It's just another sign of the militarization of America. Next it will be my taser is bigger than your taser! A taser arms race is a predictable result. My taser can be used at longer distances than yours; my taser delivers more power than yours; my taser can zap two people at once. Taser blockers will then be sold along with automatic tasers that respond in kind when you have been tasered. Kids will bring them to school. Babies will get tasered from misuse. Bullies will taser cats and dogs for fun. The wireless phone taser and blackberry taser will soon be available and instantly notify police as to your location automatically. Automatic tasers will be placed on your home near doors and windows as a protection against intruders. Store clerks will be tasered by irate customers. Teachers will be tasered for giving bad grades. The rich will taser the poor for walking too close to them. It must be good though because it will create jobs.

"Rick Smith, the CEO of Taser International and company co-founder, doesn't think much can be concluded from the Chicago study because it focused on pigs that weigh less than 100 pounds and have a very different physiology from humans."

infact pig organs have a very similar physiology to humans. this is why they are currently the focus of xenotransplantation studies.

Everyone wanting to carry a taser around for use should have to undergo a tasering themselves to get an idea of what they are really doing to people. Anyone, including law-enforcement officers, could in stressful situations, forget they are not just an amusing toy to handle people with. We have seen cops using them on women that are already down---for what reason? Also, now they are being sold to women at parties in all colors as if they are nothing to take seriously. Anyone could make a dumb or awkward move and finds themselves on the ground getting fried by some scared women or unthinking cop. These things could be a worse threat than guns to average people as they may be used with little thought of consequences.

Just think what a lovely country we are turning into, where anyone can have a concealed gun on one side and a concealed taser on the other, all ready to take someone down at some slight provocation, or suspicious move. What is next, bulletproof underwear for all, or just stay home and watch people being tasered on the boob tube.

Tasers should be outlawed PERIOD..... End of story. They are to easy to use as torture devices.....and too often and readily used simply because they don't leave marks. And they KILL

Howard

If they're so safe then maybe the cop that's trying to taser you won't mind if you use yours on him too.

It would be bad enough if the police were the only people packing Tasers...at least some of them might be half way trained and subject to some accountability.

Unfortunately, Tasers are now being heavily marketed to the public as personal protection devices. The ditzes who talk on their cellphones while driving 3 ton SUVs around town are rapidly arming themselves with Tasers, not to mention what will happen when theirkkids get ahold of them.

So maybe a 40 second jolt to Rick Smith would help clarify the safety issue?

If Tasers were to be used instead of bullets when a serious criminal is fleeing or in the midst of committing a felony, that would sound right instead of killing the person outright with bullets.

But what is to be feared is Tasers will be used to control political protesters, as we're already seeing and that's abhorrent!

Torturing animals is also obscene.

I read a study that being hit by a taser during a very brief interval of the heartbeat can cause cardiac arrest. Apparently, it's initiating an electrical charge at that critical moment that causes the problem, so the incidence is low, but catastrophic. But it appears to me the police are treating tasers like a toy. It's a weapon of torture, and when they use it they can see people writhing and screaming in pain. What's wrong with them?

kathyodat

Nothing like being treated like cattle. Get out of line and Zap! You've been prodded.

They need to take these things off the streets. If they kill anything whether it be a pig or a human, they should not be used!