defiance January 10th, 2008 3:38 pm

"I love the DK platform, but is this all I have to look forward to in 2012, 2016? One percent of the primary vote? THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY IS NOT GOING TO REFORM. Forget about them. Please, move on and support some sort of worthy 3rd party. It is our only hope for true change."

You hit the nail squarely on the head!

RichM January 11th, 2008 12:28 am
I'm with you, WSWS (SEP) is brilliant but their party advocates violently taking over the government if necessary and in these Orwellian times that scares the hell out of me. Seems nowadays just THINKING that should be enought to have you tossed to Guantanamo.

Correction. I met a SEP member at a peace rally who said that the "powers that be" will never reliquish power willingly and that violence may be necessary. Perhaps that was just his opinion. I never read any advocacy of violence from the website.

Go boy!

GO, DENNIS, GO!!!! Dennis Kucinich is the ONLY candidate who has the right messages on ALL of the important issues. He has a wealth of experience, more so than anybody else running right now. If you believe, as I do, that this country can have a bright and sustainable future, that we can heal our world and bring peace to troubled nations, that we can have single payer health care for every single person in this country, that we can have a clean and sustainable environment that will also create millions of new jobs to replace those gone forever overseas, that this country belongs to THE PEOPLE and NOT to the Corporate Elite, that poverty has no place in the richest nation in the world, that we can restore our country to being a beacon of hope and justice for everybody, then your candidate is Dennis J. Kucinich.

http://dennis4president.com/

KUCINICH '08!!!!!

Dennis Kucinich is a pretty face mask on a dead mummy.

This isn't a surprise. Kucinich stayed in the 2004 race all the way to the convention, long after losers like Dean had bailed. He's got a commitment to principles that makes winning or losing a secondary consideration, although winning would certainly bolster his chances of implementing those principles.

The other candidates talk about "change" all the time but haven't come across with any real proposals for policy changes like Kucinich has been advocating for years. Instead their supporters ironically label people like Kucinich, Paul and Nader as egoists, as if losing a campaign is good for one's ego. These Davids that continually battle the Goliaths in charge are the best hope we have for this country, but they aren't going to make any progress without our support.

If Kucinich had *any* integrity at all, he'd be working for John Edwards, who *does* differentiate from Obillary with the most progressive positions and could be elected. Despite Edwards' loss in NH, I am proud of having worked for his campaign. *My* integrity is intact. I talked to an Ohio resident working for Edwards. He plans on working for a Democratic rival of DK in the 2008 Ohio Congressional primary because he feels DK has not worked for his constituents.

It is seriously bizarre that Kucinich gets so little support in these primaries.

It really cries out for a good explanation. His views match the public better than any other candidate for President.

These results are mysterious. My guess is it has something to do with the mechanics of the primary process.

Can anyone solve this puzzle?

In the article is the phrase:

"Some of Kucinich's other proposals, such as impeaching Vice President Dick Cheney for "leading the country into an illegal war with Iraq" and creating a Department of Peace to replace the Department of Defense, have sometimes been viewed as controversial."

But, this is not a controversial idea. More than half the public supports it, and Kucinich is its champion.

Lack of results for Kucinich in these primaries is a real head-scratcher for me.

He has to continue for as long as possible. He's the only voice representing the public interest.

mirf59,

You pose good questions. Could it be the public has been "convinced" by MSM not to vote for Kucinich because he wants to end "the business as usual" status quo?

Dennis will get my vote next month.

I have decided to support Kucinich. There is no other voice in the Democratic Party that I can trust. For myself, I would rather go to defeat being right than to support the status quo. It is my firm belief that nothing less than an authentic paradigm shift can save America from collapse. I will not vote for collapse.

Fuggedaboutit! Americans will never wake up to the fact that social democrat Kucinich actually represents a sizable chunk of the American population, or that libertarian Ron Paul represents the next sizable chunk -- which adds up to a sizable majority. Between the MSM-supported status-quo propaganda and the narcotizing effect of empty hope-and-change rhetoric, the American electorate has been put in its usual election-year coma.

Time to make the 2 party system, a 3 or 4 party system because that is the only way to make change. Dennis should join the green party because they have a platform that most fit his and his supporters.

Dems & Repugs = same thing when it comes to foreign policy, environment, and health care.

I have worked here in NH for Dennis for two election cycles now. We have faced so many obstacles, not the least of which is the MSM misrepresenting his positions. Foster's Daily Democrat (actually, it's just another Republican mouthpiece, not unlike the Manchester Union Liar)has totally misrepresented his position on the Department of Peace. Dennis never advocated having the Department of Peace REPLACE the Department of Defense. His plan is that the two agencies work together to increase the use of diplomacy and peaceful dispute resolution to reduce the "perceived" need for use of military force to address our "perceived" security interests. If these reporters would actually read the proposal (which actually dates back to the founding of the Republic) they would understand how it would actually work. But then, that's too much like real investigative journalism. Sad.

It amazes me that Kucinich is so little regarded by members of his own party. He's the only candidate who could really change the US for the better, whatever the rhetoric of the leading candidates. They are far more concerned with not losing corporate backers than proposing policies that could transform life for ordinary Americans and the world as a whole.

YES! Kucinich for President! Or is it that he is just too decent to become the leader of this country?

I would challenge anyone critical of Dennis Kucinich to look up his political history and bio, research his and the other candidates' records and not-so-well-known shinanigans from credible sources (say, DemocracyNow and Jim Hightower) and THEN make your comments. Or are some of you just too lazy to find out enough of the truth to make wise decisions? I heard from Dennis K. himself (via emailings) that John Edwards made $500,000 from Fortress Investment Group LLC, and is 'up to his ears' in Wall Street. Here is what I found on it: http://michellemalkin.com/2007/08/17/john-edwards-predatory-lending-beneficiary/ Doesn't sound like a 'champion for the people' to me. DK claims his (DK's) stance on single-payer insurance is what is locking him out of caucuses. Edwards apparently has no ire from 'the system' to speak of since he has actively supported 'the system.' It's not easy to maintain political integrity, so I think Kucinich deserves all the support he can get. He deserves our support if we value the heart of this country. Assuming he doesn't win (I don't assume the negative easily), we should at least support his voice to hold the new administration's feet to the fire. And, yes, we need impeachment of Cheney to move forward for the sake of saving our country as a Democracy.

"Dennis should join the green party. . ."

NO NO NO!

Dennis is doing the right thing by his bid. He brings up important issues glossed over by superficial candidates and the lazy press that would not even be addressed if he didn't share the stage with other candidates. He forces the other candidates to reveal more to the voters than they ordinarily would

Until progressives gain power and enable instant-runoff voting, third party candidates will remain spoilers assuring NO progressive voices in government. Were it not for Ross Perot, Bill Clinton might not have entered the Presidency in 1992. That was a rare case of conservative candidates splitting the vote, but most times its progressives like Nader, that damage the better candidate.

He has the position of the majority of Americans but gets ridiculously little cash or media coverage. I donated money to him -- he's a hero in my book.

Dennis, keep fighting until there is nothing left to fight for.

One point of clarification:

"Some of Kucinich's other proposals, such as impeaching Vice President Dick Cheney for "leading the country into an illegal war with Iraq" and creating a Department of Peace to replace the Department of Defense, have sometimes been viewed as controversial."

The Department of Peace is not intended to REPLACE the Department of Defense, it is intended to work in compliment with existing agencies. 2/3 of the focus of the Department of Peace would focus on issues of violence in the United States- domestic and family violence, gun violence, gang activity, and focuses heavily on prevention. The other 1/3 of the D.o.P would work with the Department of Defense on issues relating to international violence, also focusing on prevention.

You can read more about the Department of Peace (including the full text of HR 808) at: http://www.thepeacealliance.org.

PS- Dennis, you have my vote!!

Maybe the only disagreement I have with Dennis Kucinich is his passion to change the democratic party. It is too obvious that the DLC dominated whore club is beyond the pale of acceptablity. Dennis, please grow up, to the point of understanding that you are now expected to leave the house, and begin your own family. Never mind endorsing Obama, as his "change" talk only associates you another lying whore.

P.s. I deeply respect your whisper, in a cartoon, played at high volume.

I'd like to touch on a couple of different topics here:
Firstly, all of you who have such great support for Dennis (who I also think is a hero of a politician), why have none of you ever mentioned Mike Gravel? To be honest, neither of them have a chance, but that's not what's important. Gravel, in my opinion, has an even more progressive platform than Dennis, just think of the beauty of the National Initiative. As much as I support Dennis, Mike Gravel is, I believe a better candidate for President.
Regarding the multiple party system: Please! These two candidates, along with other few worthwhile from the past (such as Nader), demonstrate the need for a multi-party system. Although, I doubt it will ever happen with the current stranglehold the Dempublicans have on our political process.
Also, when it gets down to the primary voting, I doubt Gravel will make my ballot in IL, I'm not sure if Dennis will or not. That being said, I plan (as of now) to vote for Edwards of the Big Three. My dream election result would be Mike Gravel as President with Dennis as his VP. However, a more realistic dream would be Edwards as President with Obama as VP, with Edwards tough rhetoric on corporatism becoming action, while Obama would be in a good position to take over after four years.
I have a hunch that in November from the Democrats we will see an Obama as President with as Edwards VP for the nomination. The Republicans, as we all know, would be much harder to predict, but can some of us here agree that if a Republican were to be the next President, let's hope for Paul, then McCain?

If we must have a leader/president, then let it be Kucinich. He and McKinney would be a dream ticket.

mirf59

"It is seriously bizarre that Kucinich gets so little support in these primaries...It really cries out for a good explanation. His views match the public better than any other candidate for President... These results are mysterious. My guess is it has something to do with the mechanics of the primary process. Can anyone solve this puzzle?"

There is no mystery. The posiions of Kucinich are not wanted by the establishment of the country. The fact that they are wanted by majorities of the population makes them threatening to the establishment. So Kucinich and his program must disappear. Both, the two-headed political party and the propagandists of the system, disguised as journalists, are doing just that. They black out DK. He must disappear in order to make the propaganda against him effective.

In the past I have done just like everyone else and voted for someone I did not support only because I didn't want the "alternative" in office. I don't know about you but that hasn't worked very well for me. I figured out part of the problem and want to share it here.
The problem is I HAVE BELIEVED THE LIE. I've been constantly told that my candidate "doesn't have a chance", that American isn't "ready" for him/her, that I'm (and my candidate) are "too idealistic", etc. And I'm sure after I write this someone will feel compelled to set me straight with more LIES. We are lied to every day in so many ways through so many sources. The DLC, and other corporate interest has a vested interest in being sure you don't hear Kucinich or Gravel and if, by some miracle, you have heard them you are told (as though it were fact) "they don't have a chance". They are the ones behind the LIE. If everyone I've ever heard say "yea, but they don't have a chance" were to vote for the person who most closely reflects their beliefs and ideals I have no doubt Kucinich would be our next President. It's only their belief in the LIE that holds them back. I would ask everyone to BELIEVE that you can have someone who reflects your values and interest. What do you have to lose particularly in the primaries?
As for me I will vote for Kucinich in the Primaries regardless of what the LIEING polls tell us in the LIEING media. And if Hillary becomes the candidate for the Democratic Party and is able to LIE her way into that position with the help of her LIEING friends like Rupert Murdoch I will vote for Cynthia McKinney. Take that you LIEING SOB's at the DLC, AARP, MSM, NPR, etc!!!

goner January 10th, 2008 12:41 pm

"These Davids that continually battle the Goliaths in charge are the best hope we have for this country, but they aren't going to make any progress without our support."

They are our ONLY hope! Kucinich is getting my vote on February 5th.

It's unfortunate for this country that the majority are still sleeping. If they would spend more of their time finding out which politicians are passing legislation for the benefit of the citizens they would undoubtedly cast their votes the "Davids".

Concerning the 'spoiler' factor, note that Nader, in his book "Crashing The Party" reports that he found only 38% of the votes he got from registered Democrats. The rest were bail-outs from other parties, come-out-to-vote votes, etc. I wonder how many of the 38% were even consistent Demo voters that would have voted their party's candidate consistently. This is a good book to dispell some misperceptions about a number of topics, including tort 'de-form' (aka Lieberman etal) etc. Vested interests are accomplished at deflecting mass attention from underlying facts of issues. Always assume there are generally 3 levels of 'reality' in political / financial / economic / military issues. Condie Rice's 2nd cousin, Connie Rice, avers this truth clearly (she was privvy to some inside knowledge due to her Father's work as I recall). btw, Connie is like the split-off good side of Condie the storm trooper (serving at the behest of Darth Cheney).

I'm supporting Dennis Kucinich. Call it a "principle's thing".

Kucinich is the bravest man in this country.

He is taking on the super rich cowards who run this nation like a crackhouse.

The problem is retards who just dont get it.

When the nominees are selected in two weeks, unfortunately Dennis will not figure in the short list.

Keep up the goodwork, Mr. Kucinich!!!

mirf59, here's my answer to your question, which was: "It is seriously bizarre that Kucinich gets so little support in these primaries. It really cries out for a good explanation. His views match the public better than any other candidate for President. These results are mysterious. My guess is it has something to do with the mechanics of the primary process."

What seems even more bizarre is that John Edwards, a major candidate, got less than 20% of the NH primary vote -- until you realize that most voters have NOT made the connection between where the candidates get their campaign money and how they will create change (or not) if elected. It's a simple concept, but if even Edwards, who's whip-smart and a fine speaker, hasn't gotten it across to the majority of Democratic primary voters yet, it's no mystery why Dennis is hovering around 1%. (And while physical appearance shouldn't matter, it does. As with Ron Paul, DK just doesn't look presidential.)

Edwards is the only ELECTABLE progressive in the field. Those who want REAL change had better realize that before it's too late.

Like James G said, I'm voting for the person I believe in - Dennis Kucinich - rather than who is perceived as the most electable. I'm not buying into that again, like I did in 2000 and 2004. I'm voting my conscience. As to why Dennis isn't getting more votes, time and time again he's been told by people how much they love him, but they're voting for (pick one) Edwards, Clinton, Obama, Richardson... When asked why, they say Dennis can't win. But as Dennis and others have stated, if we all voted for him and forgot about who's supposedly electable or looks presidential or has nice hair or has charisma, etc., he would win. Unfortunately, Americans are too stupid and treat the Presidential race like a popularity contest. We're screwed. And even if Dennis was getting all the votes, the Roves and Diebolds of this country would take care of that on election day. Like I said, we're screwed. Even worse, the people of Iraq and other victims of our misdeeds are even more screwed.

Mr. Kucinich's low numbers are not suprising.
You have to have an IQ of at least 110 to be intelligent enough to see through all the lies and media hype to even WANT to vote for Kucinich.
75% of the population simply isn't intelligent enough to vote for him.
Just the opposite is true for bush. Since no intelligence is required at all to jump on his bandwagon, he attracts the gun-toting redneck racists and the witless religious hypocrites. They make up the majority of the country.
It's simply boils down to intelligence. America just isn't smart enough to elect Dennis.

And yes I am saying that every American that cast a vote for bush is in fact an idiot.

Go Dennis, any thing less than him is asinine.

Coke, Pepsi or D.K
Mumps, measles or D.K.
Is there really any choice?

I support everyone who votes for Dennis, or for principles rather than an "electable" candidate (which we all know is just smoke and mirrors from MSM). But, when Dennis doesn't get the nomination, what will you all do then? I ask this because I'm asking myself what will I do if Gravel isn't an option. By the way, no one has yet commented on Mike Gravel. I understand that many people who support Dennis have supported him from some time, while Gravel hasn't been around for a couple decades. But I still think more Kucinich supporters should give a closer look at Gravel.

I don't know why Kucinich's numbers are so low. I think it's a combination of what others have said-they think he's unelectable, and of the voting machines.

I personally know 2 Republicans who voted for Nader in 2000, and both for the same reason- they thought Bush was an idiot, and unqualified to be president. Unfortunately, they both voted for Bush in 2004.

I personally know 3 Democrats who voted for Nader for the same reason-that Gore came out for Elian Gonzalez's psycho cousins to keep him instead of giving him back to his father. I don't think you political junkies realize what a big deal that was. That was played like Natalie Holloway, or Brittney Spears, and even republicans were pulling for the little boy to be reunited with his dad. So who knows how many other people voted for Nader instead of the father of 4 who put politics over family?

And when I saw An Inconvenient Truth and saw Gore talk about his love for his son and how life-changing it was when his life was threatened by a car, I almost puked. Shouldn't he have had some empathy for another father whose child almost died? Or maybe not, since 500,000 Iraqi children died on the Clinton-Gore watch, and that didn't seem to bother him.

And you arrogant democrats think I owe my vote to the Democrat who will be selected for me this year? I think not!

Why not prove to me that you're for real Dennis. Grab Cynthia Mckinney as a running mate and run independent.

Vote your heart and go with Kucinich. Vote your head and go with Edwards. If the primaries are to whittle down the candidates to a few *viable* ones, you won't feel bad about yourself if you support the progressive positions of Edwards over the status quo candidates of Hillary and Obama. I don't mean to support the main stream media, but this was DK's second run for the presidency in NH and both times he got around 1%. I will let you decide whether that is DK's fault for being *too* progressive, or the media and/or the electorate's response to his positions or his personality (and you can't deny that personality is an issue with many, if not most, voters).

If Dennis were truly concerned about this country, or stood firmly behind his principles and positions, he would have told his supporters to support Edwards in the Iowa caucuses. As it stands, he's a politician just like the rest, looking out for himself and his own ego. Don't kid yourselves, a vote for Dennis is a vote for the status quo.

I think if Arnold the Governator could Run, and his position was the same as Dennis, He would win in a landslide, even as an Independent.

Dennis has great ideas almost all progressively Correct, and he will run next year too if his people in Cleveland think he is doing good for them.

8 years of running for Prez can take lots of time from his duties at the House and home turf.

A leader for Prez needs the majority that will follow the leader.... after 8 years his positions are pretty well known, but it takes animal magnetism to win a presidential election.

Folks want a leader who not only agrees with them but who can get the military and the big corporations to at least not block them out.

Who thinks Dennis can do that...Please stand Up!

When we are in grade school we are told that anyone can be Prez... and yes if everyone thought that Dennis could win, he would have been elected last time.

Now you have to convince those that agree with Dennis that he can win.

I just think in the real world not everybody can really be Prez.

But vote your heart out anyway...

I still haven't decided who I will vote for and think I will keep it to myself... everybody likes a mystery.

rmax --- If EDWARDS had any integrity at all, HE'D bail out and support KUCINICH. For all the boohoo'ing Edwards said about the evil corporate funding of candidates, he sure accepted a huge amount of that corporate dough for his campaign and now he's beholden to those corporations.

Kucinich is the only one who deserves to be President. He's the real deal. HE LIVES WHAT HE SAYS. He is the ONLY one who remembers he's a PUBLIC SERVANT and not a Corporate Servant. But the populace of this country is dangerously asleep, and when they wake up, they will find Fasciscm has taken a hold of their lives.

Come on people. Wake up. You are wondering why his numbers are low? Kucinish IS electable by the people -- but the Corporate-owned media won't let him speak or be seen! ABC even cut him out of the picture of all the candidates last year claiming it was a mistake. And at debates while Clinton & Obama get about 27 and 29 minutes eat, Kucinich gets a measly 7! He won't take corporate money, so they won't talk to him. WAKE UP! Don't you see that the media is playing you all for fools??? They are controlling your thinking and opinions and you're confused on why people don't know who he is?? Not to mention the corporations control our voting machines and the vote counting machines and they can do whatever they want. We saw hundreds of votes disappear from Kucinich's totals that night of the NH primary! His count was going backwards!

RichM:

"The Democratic Party uses Dennis as an "Left Ornament," simply to prevent antiwar types from defecting to the Greens or socialists."

I agree. Obviously, Kucinich is fully aware of this. He claims he is trying to reform the party. He is too intelligient to think this is truly possible. BeaverCleaver wrote something along the same lines. It just doesn't make sense. We don't need somebody to keep the dems "in check", because it doesn't work. I love the DK platform, but is this all I have to look forward to in 2012, 2016? One percent of the primary vote? THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY IS NOT GOING TO REFORM. Forget about them. Please, move on and support some sort of worthy 3rd party. It is our only hope for true change.

I was 18 when I cast my first vote in the year 2000. I think we got off on the wrong foot.

Dennis Kucinich regularly wins or gets more votes in the polling than he is credited with. As of an hour ago, he was running at 2.7% in the LA Times poll. It is at http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/front/la-na-campaign9jan09,1,4414257.story?coll=la-headlines-frontpage&ctrack=2&cset=true&vote34617362=1
If you are not registered on that site, you will have to register to vote.

If the election were today, who would you vote for?
32.2% Hillary Clinton
6.7% John Edwards
2.9% Rudy Giuliani
3.9% Mike Huckabee
2.7% Dennis Kucinich
6.8% John McCain
30.9% Barack Obama
6.0% Ron Paul
1.0% Bill Richardson
5.3% Mitt Romney
1.6% Fred Thompson
9110 total responses

As you probably know, when he won the ABC poll after that earlier debate, ABC took the poll down. Other CD commenters are certainly correct that the MSM seeks to cut him out of any discussion, publicity, etc. This is the first part of the fixers plan.

The second part is the actual ballot fraud that is done in the counting. When the computer programs are fixed to give any election to their candidate, they move votes from other candidates to theirs. So, like Ron Paul's 31 votes not being reported in one NH precinct (He is having the election reviewed or contested.), then DK's votes are siphoned to the winner in the primaries. This goes on in both primaries and general elections. And this is the true reason that non-establishment candidates and third party candidates finish so low in the count.

Until we all think our elections are important enough to work on fixing them as hard as we work on our candidates' campaigns, we will continue to get the fixers' choice.

The mainstream media seem to have one project---teaching people to vote on something as vacuous and easily manipulated as "like-ability" rather than on well-founded facts and policies, and that to me is why Kucinich is exiled: there will be no unpredictable voters here any more than unpredictable consumers are wanted, encouraged or recognized. Great idea above, that Kucinich should run as an Independent and spoil the party at least. Look at people's comments about Kucinich on YouTube---except for the troglodytes who can't spell anyway, they are incredibly energized and positive. STICK WITH IT DENNIS, your numbers will go up with the passage of time and with the droning dull Dems all around you!

I had everyone in my office take one of the polls today to pick the candidate who would best serve their beliefs. Every single one picked Dennis K. (to their surprize.)Strange that he meets the criteria for so many. I also listened to his financial advisor and got the impression that closing all of the tax loopholes would eliminate the entire elite voting block from voting for Dennis. But, these things definitely need to be addressed/ The rest of the candidates are hollaring for Change, but not too many are laying out plans for Change. The MSM is going to do the electing and we will be stuck with the same junk politics we have been seeing for the past decade. Time to break the cycle and pour in some new blood, give our country the transfusion it needs desperately.

Safiyyah, your comments bring down the whole level of discourse here. Is that really your aim?

"safiyyah January 10th, 2008 12:38 pm
Dennis Kucinich is a pretty face mask on a dead mummy."

Truthseeker58, you say: "Not to mention the corporations control our voting machines and the vote counting machines and they can do whatever they want. We saw hundreds of votes disappear from Kucinich's totals that night of the NH primary! His count was going backwards!" Has this been written up anywhere? I would like to read more about it.

We are in desperate trouble with these voting machines!!

That the American press so ridicules and dismisses an intelligent man with great ideas and a great record of public service makes me ashamed to be an American.

Websites like Commondreams, and the blogosphere may be our only hope.

I have come to the conclusion that Common Dreams is a beautiful site to exchange views and important info.

When we start getting on the soapbox and telling each other who to vote for, we just pick fights with each other... I have done that in the past, and I really want to break the Habit.

PS when the Media trashed Arnold for bein a sex maniac... He got more votes!

OOps there I go again... the Ugly American.

Gravel and Kucinich, two of the most honest, compassionate humanitarians. No wonder they have been shuffled out the door. Totally against the grain of american politics.

I'm bummed. At the end of primary, Dennis probably personally knew every one of the people who voted for him. Just the same, when our primary comes up (2/12) I'll vote for him, for my last, best (for now) chance to vote for an America that would have him as a frontrunner.