Knocking Hillary for All the Wrong Reasons
I watched Hillary's supposed "crack up" and the interview afterward on Fox yesterday.
Today, it is front-page news in the New York Times. This just in: Hillary Clinton is a human being! The horror! After months of bashing Hillary for being a cold, calculating, machine, we now get the pile-on for her show of emotion under extreme stress. This is not the way I want to see the first female front-runner for President go down.
Let's call the focus on Hillary's brief teary-eyed moment what it is: pure sexism. If it's national news when her voice cracks for a moment and her eyes well up, but no tears roll, it is only because reporters have been waiting for her to act like a girl. Mitt Romney, you may recall, looked nearly hysterical in his speech in Iowa after the drubbing he took from Huckabee. He got all emotional about the campaign and switched between giggles and near-tears several times. Fox didn't play that clip over and over and ask whether Romney was too weak to be commander-in-chief. (In fact, Fox played a boring clip of Romney opposing "amnesty" for illegal immigrants and claimed he hit a "home run" in the debate that was almost universally viewed elsewhere as a disaster for him. That's "fair and balanced" for you.)
There's no question that Hillary Clinton is, as John Edwards cleverly put it in the New Hampshire debate, the candidate of the "status quo" among Democrats. Her fundraising, her ties to business, her hawkishness, her advisers from the first two Clinton Administrations are hardly harbingers of a progressive revival.
And the enthusiasm Barack Obama has tapped--particularly among young voters--is infectious. But on policy matters and fundraising, Barack and Hillary are actually not that far apart. The race comes down to style and personality. A rather unpleasant current runs through the contest: girls-versus-boys. You don't have to be a Hillary supporter to feel it.
So while the Obama phenomenon is exciting for what it means about bringing young voters and African-Americans to the polls--something progressives have hoped to see from Democrats for a long, long time--watch out for the cheap-shot version of Hillary's demise.
All of the candidates are looking weary. And no wonder. In the first few minutes of the New Hampshire debates, the strain was showing on all the Democrats' slack, frowning, sleep-deprived faces. Now, more than ever, with the condensed primary season, they are pressed to super-human feats of nonstop campaigning. John Edwards campaigned for thirty-six hours straight up until the Iowa caucuses. Events at 3:00 and 4:00 in the morning are followed by midnight appearances on Larry King, followed by breakfast at crazy hours in small-town cafes. The whole thing takes on the appearance of one of those leering reality shows about a group of people living under unbearable conditions. Running for President is now an extreme sport, with all the cattiness of American Idol thrown in. You would be on the verge of tears, too, if you were going through all that and it looked like you were about to lose.
The writing is on the wall for Hillary. Obama is running a better campaign. By going negative, by using the phrase "false hopes," Hillary set herself up for blistering attacks. Obama's eloquent speech in New Hampshire invoking Martin Luther King, Jr.'s "I have a dream" and condemning Clinton's "false hopes" comment resonated.
But here, again, was a phony slam on Hillary. On his blog Politico.com, Ben Smith accused Hillary of deriding Dr. King, and comparing herself to Lyndon Johnson, who, Smith said she implied, was the real force behind civil rights legislation. The blog got quite a bit of attention. A string of comments expressed outrage over Hillary's dis of Dr. King. One post suggested that she was using "dirty tricks" (although she herself seems to be the main casualty here). Another poster said it was almost as if she were trying to lose. Black voters in South Carolina would never stand for it.
I watched the Fox interview in question--with Major Garrett, the same reporter who captured the now-famous teary moment. Actually, Hillary does a good job of addressing the question about her teariness and goes on to discuss Obama's MLK speech at length. The point she makes about Lyndon Johnson is not that he is uniquely responsible for civil rights, but that he was a master politician who got things done. It goes to her argument that she, while not an inspiring figure like MLK (or, one supposes, Obama) knows how to "work hard" and achieve real results--that's the job of a President. Fair enough. Besides the bully pulpit, a President must know how to use the levers of power to get legislation passed. It would be nice to think Clinton could achieve sweeping, civil-rights-movement-scale reform in government. But not even Obama is promising that. Both Clinton and Obama eschew a single-payer health care system, for example. Both are talking about incremental change. Obama, like Clinton's husband, just says it better, in a way that appeals to our more hopeful, idealistic feelings.
That might be reason enough to vote for him. But beware the misogynist subtext of the stories of Hillary Clinton's demise.
Ruth Conniff covers national politics for The Progressive and is a voice of The Progressive on many TV and radio programs.
© 2008 The Progressive
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87 Comments so far
Show AllHuck, if voters can be mobilized to vote for Kucinich in Michigan, he has a chance to get into the race in a bigger way. Edwards is not on the ballot there but Kucinich is, and write-ins don't count.
EDWARDS '08
Huck, I did read your comment, but neither I nor anyone else can give assurance that ANY candidate will do what they say they will do.
Your previous comment did not mention your voting for Kucinich, and it also did not mention your voting for Edwards if he wins the nomination. You also have my pledge to vote for Kucinich if he gets the nomination, as I have told you before I like Dennis.
I know Dennis did not get a fair shake from either the MSM or the Democratic Party, but then, neither has Edwards, nor any candidate from either party with progressive rhetoric. I just wish Dennis had really tried to compete in the early contests.
While I think your vote would be more helpful by adding to the delegate total for Edwards, which is substantial after his second and third place finishes in Iowa and NH, if we do end up in a brokered convention. I do respect your right to vote for Kucinich in the primary. Yours is one more vote cast against the status quo of Obama and Clinton.
With only 1% of the people having spoken, this race is still wide open. If the Edwards/Kucinich vote totals in those early contests were reversed, I would be voting for Kucinich in my primary. I'm not selling out Edwards or Kucinich at this point, I think that they are both in it for the long haul, and IT AIN'T OVER 'TIL IT'S OVER!
Excuse me Mike and with all due respect did you read my comments? I affirm that Obama and Clinton are OWNED BY CORPORATIONS. And if Edwards wins the nomination (and that is now a longshot) I will vote for him. Conversely, if Obama or Clinton win, I will vote for Nader or other third party candidate. I do intend to vote for Kucinich in my primary, if for no other reason than to send a message to the Cave Party.
Huck, you should give yourself a chance to win by voting for Edwards. If Edwards doesn't win, you're going to get Obama or Hillary anyway, and a brokered convention might not be a bad idea. If Edwards stays in the race and nobody gets a clear majority, all the issues will be on the table.
John Edwards is not in the pocket of Wall Street, but Obama and Clinton are, period. Edwards is also the only one accepting PUBLIC FUNDING for his campaign.
Here is the list of top contributors to Obama -
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.asp?id=N00009638&cycle=2008
And here is the list for Hillary -
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.asp?id=N00000019&cycle=2008
Now, you look at that list and tell me who is bought and paid for by Wall Street. They dont fear Obama and Hillary, they own them! But they do fear John Edwards!
US Corporate Elite Fear Candidate Edwards
By Kevin Drawbaugh
Reuters
Check out the article over at TruthOut -
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/011108T.shtml
As much as I think Obama is every bit as bought and paid for as Clinton, and despite Edwards current rhetoric to the contrary to his PAST ACTIONS: Edwards is equal to Mitt Romney. In the Senate Edwards stood for everything he now says he is against. Edwards is talkiing the talk of a progressive but does that mean he will now deliever what he says he stands for? All that aside, Edwards is not going to win the nomination given his showing in NH and Iowa.
If Clinton and Obama continue to alternate wins, my money is on a brokered convention and the Party turning to Al Gore.
Doug, John Edwards is not the one who is bought and paid for, that distinction goes to Obama and Clinton, they represent the status quo. They are not the ones that Wall Street and corporate America fears. John Edwards is the one who scares them, and for good reason.
Here's the link again, read it this time!
US Corporate Elite Fear Candidate Edwards
By Kevin Drawbaugh
Reuters
Check out the article over at TruthOut -
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/011108T.shtml
"Bought'n'paid for" and "Barack Obama" - Kinda rhymes doesn't it Doug?
It should, tis true!
And Hillary Too!
VOTE EDWARDS '08 for a WORLD OF CHANGE!
I organized against the Iraq War from 2002 to 2004. It does matter to me what politicians said and have done since. Obama and Kucinich have been CONSISTENT which is more than I can say for Edwards or Clinton who voted for the war.
"Of the 22 senators who reported reading the full NIE, eight are Republicans and 14 are Democrats. All but one Democrat on the 17-person Intelligence Committee in 2002 recalled reading the NIE: Former Sen. John Edwards (D-N.C.) told a campaign-trail audience earlier this month that he had, but later recanted. Edwards voted to authorize war."
"Vermont Democrat Patrick Leahy, one of the senators who read the report and a staunch critic of the war, said the findings were "enough to have me vote against going to war in Iraq."
http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/few-senators-read-iraq-nie-report-2007-06-19.html
'What I knew before the invasion' by Senator Bob Graham D-Florida
www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/18/AR2005111802397.html
Top Contributors to Edwards Campaign
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.asp?id=N00002283&cycle=2008
#2 Contributor
Fortress Investment Group
"The hedge fund that employed John Edwards markedly expanded its subprime lending business while he worked there, becoming a major player in the high-risk mortgage sector Edwards has pilloried in his presidential campaign."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/05/10/AR2007051002277_pf.html
How old are you Mike? Old enough to forget who voted for the war? Old enough to turn a blind eye to all the evidence pointing to the fact that Edwards is a professional sell out? Maybe this country doesn't need people old as you, considering where this country is.
Mike,
as I'm sure you're aware by now:
Edwards is part of the status quo that says anything to win. That's what I'm pointing out. He voted for the Iraq war (now he says he's against it), he voted for MFN status for China (but he says he supports fair trade), he dishonestly characterizes Obama's healthcare plan's focus on affordability while omitting the law enforcement costs of his own mandate proposal, he say's he against predatory lending yet when he worked at Fortress Investment Group (the #2 contributor to his campaign) they enlarged their investments in predatory lending, in February he refused to reveal who his bundlers were, but after being shamed into doing that, he still refuses to disclose his largest bundlers (unlike Obama and Clinton)or any estimate of how much any of his bundlers raise. Is he the agent of change? I don't think so.
I don't agree with Obama on every issue but at least he is CONSISTENT on the issues. Which is more than I can say for a sell-out like Edwards whose campaign is bought and paid for by a trillion dollar hedge fund.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132×3969318
Dennis Kucinich: "In answer to your questions about why I didn't support former Senator John Edwards on the second ballot in Iowa: I have serious concerns about his connections to a Wall Street hedge fund, Fortress Investment Group. While attacking others for accepting campaign money from Washington lobbyists, he is up to his ears in money from Wall Street special interests.
He made half a million dollars in a single year for attending a few meetings for Fortress and has invested a substantial part of his own personal wealth in the hedge fund whose portfolios are responsible for sub-prime predatory lending practices, Medicare privatization, and an entire range of corporate sharp dealings that are driving the middle class into poverty."
rmax said:
>> Frankly, I prefer a candidate with some emotion. Look
>> how "compassionate" the Current Occupant has been.
>> I'll take tears over stubbornness any day.
The present occupant of the White House is not short of any of those histrionics. May be not tears, but he has produced more thunder, falshlights, smoke & mirrors to stoke a whole nation into killing innocents some 6000 miles away, while losing her own sons & daughters and digging a trillion dolloar deficit for itself.
So, I would submit that this discussion on whether HRC's tears were for the real or imaginary is besides the point. What matters is her record, her cohabitation with corporate kleptocrats and her support for a cruel war.
How many of us realize that every inch & every moment of this presidential horserace is rehearsed, premeditated and enacted so as to extract the maximum "votage" from us the sheeple?
Hari
US Corporate Elite Fear Candidate Edwards
By Kevin Drawbaugh
Reuters
Check out the article over at TruthOut -
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/011108T.shtml
"Bought'n'paid for" and "Barack Obama" - Kinda rhymes doesn't it Doug?
It should, tis true!
And Hillary Too!
VOTE EDWARDS '08 for a WORLD OF CHANGE!
Why diss Hillary because she cries? Lots of politicians have cried; some have become President. Just look at Nixon in his "Checker's Speech." Despite his crying, he went on to such historic acts as refusing to challenge the election he lost to Kennedy on the basis that he didn't want to create a Constitutional crisis even though he probably would have won! He then went on to recognize Red China. Something no other politician could do. He also ended the Vietnam War.
Meanwhile, Kennedy lurched from one disaster to another, the biggest being the aborative invasion of The Bay of Pigs, the erection of the Berlin Wall, authorization of the assassination of Diem, and the Cuban Missile Crisis. (One could also mention the repeated public failures to assassinate Castro. BUT Kennedy didn't cry!
How ironic that someone purporting to represent progressive views is singing the praise of Hillary. Clinton has little in commone with the true progressives like Nader, Kucinich, Edwards, and Gravel. She is in bed with corporations and is taking money from Ruppert Murdoch of all people. Her environmental record is pathetic. In fact, her husband remarked recently that climate change is inconclusive! Besides, Bubba was president for eight years and did little by way of leadership on the issue. Sexism? She may have a point, but if that is all this author is worried about and Clinton wins the nomination, God help us all!!!!!
If Hillary wins the nomination, i will be voting Third Party/Independent again and hopefully, for Nader for the 4th time.
Since the theft of the elections in 2004, when Edwards wanted to fight over the Ohio vote, and was stopped by John Kerry, Edwards has undergone a metamorphic change, as evidenced by John Kerry's endorsement today of Barack Obama, fellow ivy-leaguer(hopefully not skull and bones).
Edwards was a one-term senator in a very red state, in fact he took the seat of the infamous Jesse Helms. Even before the 2004 election theft, Edwards was preaching the message of two Americas. One for the wealthy and privileged and the other one for the rest of us.
He's not perfect, but he is sincere, and he recognizes that corporate money is the problem with our government, and he will work to give government back to the people. As I said, he is our last best hope to stop our slide into Fascism.
If Edwards is not telling the truth, he's a bigger liar than Bush and Cheney combined, and if Edwards doesn't win, you're going to get either Obama or Clinton anyway, no real difference between them, so why not give yourself a chance to win and
Vote EDWARDS '08 for a WORLD of CHANGE!
rmax,
thanks for establishing that you are a Clinton supporter if you have to be to make sure a TRUE PROGRESSIVE like BARACK OBAMA doesn't get elected. Be sure to thank her or Edwards (does it really matter?) for the Iraq War next time you see her or him. As someone pointed out before, Edwards is losing his voters to Hillary. And as no one has yet pointed out, Kucinich endorsed Obama over Edwards in Iowa. Think about it. Think about it hard.
Question: On the Joint Resolution (H.J.Res. 114 )
Vote Date: October 11, 2002, 12:50 AM
Required For Majority: 1/2
Measure Number: H.J.Res. 114
Measure Title: A joint resolution to authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq.
YEAs —77 Allard (R-CO) Allen (R-VA) Baucus (D-MT) Bayh (D-IN) Bennett (R-UT) Biden (D-DE) Bond (R-MO) Breaux (D-LA) Brownback (R-KS) Bunning (R-KY) Burns (R-MT) Campbell (R-CO) Cantwell (D-WA) Carnahan (D-MO) Carper (D-DE) Cleland (D-GA) Clinton (D-NY) Cochran (R-MS) Collins (R-ME) Craig (R-ID) Crapo (R-ID) Daschle (D-SD) DeWine (R-OH) Dodd (D-CT) Domenici (R-NM) Dorgan (D-ND) Edwards (D-NC) Ensign (R-NV) Enzi (R-WY) Feinstein (D-CA) Fitzgerald (R-IL) Frist (R-TN) Gramm (R-TX) Grassley (R-IA) Gregg (R-NH) Hagel (R-NE) Harkin (D-IA) Hatch (R-UT) Helms (R-NC) Hollings (D-SC) Hutchinson (R-AR) Hutchison (R-TX) Inhofe (R-OK) Johnson (D-SD) Kerry (D-MA) Kohl (D-WI) Kyl (R-AZ) Landrieu (D-LA) Lieberman (D-CT) Lincoln (D-AR) Lott (R-MS) Lugar (R-IN) McCain (R-AZ) McConnell (R-KY) Miller (D-GA) Murkowski (R-AK) Nelson (D-FL) Nelson (D-NE) Nickles (R-OK) Reid (D-NV) Roberts (R-KS) Rockefeller (D-WV) Santorum (R-PA) Schumer (D-NY) Sessions (R-AL) Shelby (R-AL) Smith (R-NH) Smith (R-OR) Snowe (R-ME) Specter (R-PA) Stevens (R-AK) Thomas (R-WY) Thompson (R-TN) Thurmond (R-SC) Torricelli (D-NJ) Voinovich (R-OH) Warner (R-VA)
NAYs —23 Akaka (D-HI) Bingaman (D-NM) Boxer (D-CA) Byrd (D-WV) Chafee (R-RI) Conrad (D-ND) Corzine (D-NJ) Dayton (D-MN) Durbin (D-IL) Feingold (D-WI) Graham (D-FL) Inouye (D-HI) Jeffords (I-VT) Kennedy (D-MA) Leahy (D-VT) Levin (D-MI) Mikulski (D-MD) Murray (D-WA) Reed (D-RI) Sarbanes (D-MD) Stabenow (D-MI) Wellstone (D-MN) Wyden (D-OR)
"There are those who offer up easy answers. They will assert that Iraq is George Bush's war, it's all his fault. Or that Iraq was botched by the arrogance and incompetence of Donald Rumsfeld and Dick Cheney. Or that we would have gotten Iraq right if we went in with more troops, or if we had a different proconsul instead of Paul Bremer, or if only there were a stronger Iraqi Prime Minister.
These are the easy answers. And like most easy answers, they are partially true. But they don't tell the whole truth, because they overlook a harder and more fundamental truth. The hard truth is that the war in Iraq is not about a catalog of many mistakes - it is about one big mistake. The war in Iraq should never have been fought…
Some seek to rewrite history. They argue that they weren't really voting for war, they were voting for inspectors, or for diplomacy. But the Congress, the Administration, the media, and the American people all understood what we were debating in the fall of 2002. This was a vote about whether or not to go to war. That's the truth as we all understood it then, and as we need to understand it now. And we need to ask those who voted for the war: how can you give the President a blank check and then act surprised when he cashes it?…
We thought we learned this lesson. After Vietnam, Congress swore it would never again be duped into war, and even wrote a new law — the War Powers Act — to ensure it would not repeat its mistakes. But no law can force a Congress to stand up to the President. No law can make Senators read the intelligence that showed the President was overstating the case for war. No law can give Congress a backbone if it refuses to stand up as the co-equal branch the Constitution made it.
That is why it is not enough to change parties. It is time to change our politics. We don't need another President who puts politics and loyalty over candor. We don't need another President who thinks big but doesn't feel the need to tell the American people what they think. We don't need another President who shuts the door on the American people when they make policy. The American people are not the problem in this country - they are the answer. And it's time we had a President who acted like that."- Barack Obama, probably the next President of the United States
http://www.barackobama.com/2007/10/02/remarks_of_senator_barack_obam_27.php
EVENING LAND: Thank you for adding such an elaborate and profound analysis to my comment.
POET: Excellent points about what makes us human!
For those who don't think that the Hillary tearing up episode illustrates sexism, you need to do some research on Edmund Muskie, former vice-presidential candidate with Hubert Humphrey in '68 and subsequently running for the presidential nomination inb '72.
While in New Hampshire (intersting irony don't you think?) Muskie's wife was slandered in the Manchester Union Leader, the leading right-wing rag publication in the state.
Muskie was quite furious and during a press conference seething with indignation over the assault and lying on his Mrs., he seemed to break down into tears. Instantly the feeding frenzy started--he's weak (womanly?), he lacks self-control, he is unfit for presidential consideration.
This despite quite a considerable career in public service prior to that time. Thete was no sympathy vote for Muskie from either gender and his candidacy was finished off by a sightly cruder version of te swift boaters aocut 32 years prior.
Human beings are given emotions for a reason--they help to energize us in the face of provocation. But to a culture trained on the Clint Eastwood or John Wayne type of character such humanity is unacceptable. We would rather have machines than people runniong for office. The results of this preference can be seen over the past 8 years in the White House.
As Conniff points out, there are plenty of other solid reasons to oppose this poor little rich girl (who was born on third base and has gone through life thinking she hit a triple) other than her gender or emotionality. Twenty years of Bush-Clinton (which is really Bush-lite) is enough, send Hillary back to New York where she belongs.
One does not govern a community of human beings with emotions, but with policies, preferably policies responsive to the needs of the community in its entirety and its diversity.
In my phone canvassing in NH for Edwards, I found the sad truth to be that the majority of voters I spoke with are, for whatever reason, un(der)informed. Many told me they liked Hillary because of Bill. Others were charmed by Obama's "charisma" (which I don't get). Others said they didn't know the differences between the candidates. When I gave them the differences between Edwards and the others, many were swayed (sadly, not enough). Certainly voting for or against someone due to race or gender is not smart, but that's what it often comes down to (or personality in general). I don't want Hillary as the nominee any more than most here, but if she's the Dem nominee, I will have no recourse but to vote for her. My hope is that the energized Democrats (and independents desiring change) will see a Democrat in the White House (and a woman) as preferable to any of the lame (and scary) Republicans running. It also may end up being a case of the devil you know being safer than the devil you don't (I think that may have been true in the NH primary). Here in NH there remains much good will towards the Clintons, and I think that had just as much to do with her win as her showing emotion. The candidates (and their workers/volunteers) were exhausted. I happened to believe that Hillary's choking up was a sincere, human (not necessarily female) response to a sympathetic overture. Call me naive, but I'll give her a pass on that one. Frankly, I prefer a candidate with some emotion. Look how "compassionate" the Current Occupant has been. I'll take tears over stubbornness any day.
Siouxrose 1/10, 10:50 am wrote:
"Anger is a HUGE emotion in US society and it channels into violent body contact sports, which given their team logos, lust for top dog status, and too easily segue into winner/loser contexts (so apropos to the modus operandi of our warfare state)."
So very true!
The violent contact sports -- supported, promoted, rewarded, endlessly glorified and commented upon in our corporate media -- are in fact one of the ways in which the martial needs of the military-industrial complex are stoked: they not only provide an outlet to a population of (primarily) angry men, but they also feed anger, violent attitudes, and ruthless competitiveness back into the population. As such, they are central means of breeding the violent individuals required by a state that maintains its structure and the privileges of its ruling elites through warfare and the threat of such. Violent contact sports maintain our society in a state of preparedness for the violence the U.S. oligarchy has been perpetuating for decades in the world. They also regiment the entire society insofar as they contribute to forming the cut-throat competitive ethos needed by the nasty brand of capitalism cultivated in this country.
Democracy is pointless if we use it to elect people who will represent power, big money and an unpopular foreign government that endangers it's own people as well as the rest of the world. Former Republican Hillary Clinton has a long list of people, corporations and of course Israel that she owes allegiance to, and guess what. We are either last on that list or not on it at all. We need to learn how to do democracy. If we simply answered how we feel on the issues and matched that to the candidate that best reflected those positions, Dennis Kucinich would win by about 87 percent.
Oh and how about a full on article from Eileen Fleming, great post Eileen.
MIRF 59 said, "This might be one of the greatest tragedies of the human condition. Hyper-rational people are relentless grinders. They will grind down anything and everything in their path, which makes this the dominant state of being." Let me preface my response with a remark cast by Carlos Casteneda's teacher, Don Juan: "You confuse the world with what people do." I would agree with your comment IF society could only organize itself around ego, competition, and the modes we take for "reality" because they are the most immediate in terms of modern times, or recorded history. In societies that organize around different principles, like shared nurturance and cooperation, the might-makes-right dictate of ego and how the rational mind serves it would not trump all.
HIKER WOMAN: Thank you for the anecdotal info on brain scans as per empathy. A friend of mine managed to get her very aggressive husband into counseling and the shrink showed him many different pictures always asking after each one, "what do you feel?" The ONLY response the guy could articulate was anger. Anger is a HUGE emotion in US society and it channels into violent body contact sports, which given their team logos, lust for top dog status, and too easily segue into winner/loser contexts (so apropos to the modus operandi of our warfare state).
As for LAWFUL health insurance, it is so clearly extortion for the mafia-like profit motives of these disgusting corportations that truly operate on the basis of blood karma.
Rocker Babe,
Hell, yeah! I'm voting for Hillary because it alarms me that there are still mothers and daughters in Fallujah with a heartbeat. Hillary can finish the job Cheney and Rumsfeld started. Grrrrrl power!
After watching the sinister, sneering visage of the lovely Cheney and the stupid arrogance of Bush for seven long years, I found Hillary`s show of emotion no big thing to worry about, whether real or contrived. If it helps her out, so what , as the religious, moral Repubs will do absolutly anything they feel will work, no matter how unethical. We have more to worry about than a few tears in this election, if we even get to have one, because of a new well timed conflict.
That coverage was raw bigotry. Unbelievable. Even I, an Anyone But Hillary type, was taken aback. However, the worst that it did was inspire voters who *already favored* HRC to vote for her. From the exit polls those who made their decision within the past 3 days--when the press hyenas pounced--favored Obama by a very strong margin. Oh, and contrary to others on this site: Obama didn't lose any votes (Edwards did).
I just hate this idea that somehow women can't vote for HRC without them being trivialized and denounced as being stupid or silly. I hate that. I may disagree with it, but I won't engage in bigotry to tear someone down.
Internet bloggers and the main stream media have failed to consider the reality of what happened in regard to the NH primary voting for the Democratic candidate for President. Hillary Clinton won solely because of the last minute dirty campaign tactics of her staff when they sent out flyers and made phone calls deliberately intending to distort the pro-choice record of Barack Obama.
The Democrat Demimondaine and Consummate Pandering Politician: Hillary Clinton
On February 1, 2007 Senator Hillary Clinton prostituted we the people of America in her pandering address to the American Israel Public Affairs Committee/AIPAC.
Senator Clinton claimed, "Both Israelis and Americans know so well, a democracy is far more than just holding elections. Democracy has to spring from an active and open citizenry dedicated to tolerance, to respect for differences, to the rule of law, to policies that lift us up not tear us down as fellow human beings, and to the value of human life."
American Israeli, a 2006 Nobel Peace Prize Nominee, the Founder and Coordinator of ICAHD/Israeli Committee Against House Demolitions has consistently affirmed that, "Israel is a not a democracy but is an Ethnocracy, meaning a country run and controlled by a national group with some democratic elements but set up with Jews in control and structured to keep them in control." [Chapter 2, "Memoirs of a Nice Irish-American 'Girl's' Life in Occupied Territory" by eileen fleming]
When Israel became a state in 1948, it was contingent upon upholding the UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights which guarantees in Article 13 that:
(1) Everyone has the right to freedom of movement and residence within the borders of each state.
(2) Everyone has the right to leave any country, including his own, and to return to his country.
Israel encourages any Jew without any pre-existing historical tie to the land to migrate under the Law of Return and all receive immediate citizenship and all rights and privileges including state-financed language and Jewish history immersion, free and subsidized housing, job placement and welfare assistance while seeking employment, medical, dental and other benefits.
Israel abetted by USA blind allegiance has blatantly refused to uphold UN Resolution 194, which guarantees the Right of Return-or compensation to the indigenous population which was forced from their homes in 1948 and 1967. Clinton is unmoved by the facts on the ground that the indigenous peoples of that land have been denied human rights and dignity and that they are illegally dominated and oppressed with the aid of USA's "$1.8 billion a year in military aid and $1.2 billion in economic aid, plus another $1 billion or so in miscellaneous grants, mostly in military supplies, from various U.S. agencies. Tax exempt contributions destined to Israel bring up the total to over $5 billion annually." [Page 24, Understanding the Palestine-Israeli Conflict, Dr. Phyllis Bennis. www.tari.org ]
Clinton continued to satisfy the ignoble lusts of AIPAC as she continued to deny the truth, "Israel is a beacon of what's right in a neighborhood overshadowed by the wrongs of radicalism, extremism, despotism and terrorism. We need only look to one of Israel's greatest threats: namely, Iran. Make no mistake, Iran poses a threat not only to Israel, but to the entire Middle East and beyond… U.S. policy must be clear and unequivocal. We cannot, we should not, we must not, permit Iran to build or acquire nuclear weapons. And in dealing with this threat as I have said for a very long time, no option can be taken off the table."
On Feb. 10, 2007, Dr. Phyllis Bennis, a secular Jew, journalist, prolific author, Mid East analyst and Co-founder and Co-Chair of the US Campaign to End the Israeli Occupation stated, "Iran has signed the NPT, which allows them the right to have nuclear power and to enrich uranium. The 185 non-nuclear states have agreed to give up the right to have nuclear weapons and the five nuclear powers that signed the NPT agreed to get rid of their nuclear weapons... Iran is not in violation of the NPT, but America is! The USA has been in violation ever since the day they signed it. The USA is acting like a rogue state. The rhetoric out of Washington, the arresting of Iranian diplomats in Iraq , are deliberate provocations hoping that the Iranians will take the bait and respond." [WAWA blog Feb. 13, 2007]
At her AIPAC fundraiser, Clinton continued her pimping for AIPAC funds and denied the facts on the ground, "We also know that the dangers posed to Israel have been compounded by the rise to power of Hamas, an avowed terrorist group that has assumed the reigns of the government in the Palestinian Authority and Hezbollah, the terrorist group that is represented in the Lebanese government. I have long said that Hamas must not be recognized until it renounces violence and terror and recognizes Israel's right to exist…Hamas terror campaigns have claimed the lives of hundreds of innocent civilians and its leaders have refused to disarm, to reject violence, or even to recognize the right of Israel to exist. We must insist that Hamas and indeed all Palestinian parties renounce terror and recognize Israel"
Not only did the Palestinian Authority agree in 1988 to recognize Israel and reaffirmed this in 1993 during the Oslo Accords, Israel instead, persisted in its unabated relentless seizure of Palestinian land and resources.
On November 15, 2005, Senator Hillary Clinton stood on the Jerusalem side of The Wall and was quoted in Ha'aretz, expressing support for The Wall because it "is against terrorists" and "not against the Palestinian people."
Senator Clinton,-as most of Congress- have NOT ventured to the other side of The Wall to view the economic and psychological effects of The Wall, which has been deemed illegal and must come down by the International Court of Justice in the Hague. [I addressed this in detail in MEMOIRS of a Nice Irish-American 'Girl's' Life in Occupied Territory ]
After reading Senator Clinton's inaccurate, insensitive and pandering remarks in Ha'aretz, I immediately contacted her through her website, but my email bounced back, for I am no longer a New York constituent. This really got my Irish up, for unlike Senator Clinton, I was born and bred in New York and I am more New York than Hillary will ever be.
Not being one to ever give up, I then snail mailed Hillary a respectful letter expressing my distress over her obvious pandering and blatant denial of International Law and informed her of the many gaps and lack of 'security' along The illegal Wall that I knew about from my visits to Israel Palestine in June 2005 and in January, March and November 2006. Every taxi driver, would be 'terrorist' and I knew the way into Jerusalem from Bethlehem without going through security checkpoints and The Terminal.
The only response I received from Senator Clinton was to be put on the DNC's mailing list soliciting funds.
Clinton has continued to fuel the fire of my Irish ire during her hustling of AIPAC votes: "I was deeply saddened and outraged by the suicide bombing in Eilat this week. Some are saying that Eilat was bombed because Israeli's efforts at self-defense through its security fence have been so successful. But Eilat is a tragic reminder of the threats that Israel faces everyday and underscores the importance of our continued support for Israel's right to protect and defend her people. The highest priority of any government is to ensure the safety and security of its citizens and that is why, as I have said, I've been a strong supporter of Israel's right to build a security barrier to keep terrorists out. I have spoken out against the International Court of Justice for questioning Israel's right to build that fence of security."
If The Wall were actually built on Israeli land, Clinton could get a pass on her procuring for AIPAC funds, but a map of The Wall super-imposed upon Palestinian aquifers clearly illuminates that The Wall is all about grabbing land and resources from the indigenous peoples of that land.
Reported in the august, Washington Report on Middle East Affairs, "Financed with U.S. aid at a cost of $1.5 million per mile, the Israeli wall prevents residents from receiving health care and emergency medical services. In other areas, the barrier separates farmers from their olive groves which have been their families' sole livelihood for generations." [Page 43, Jan/Feb. 2007]
In Jeff Halper's April 2005 edition of Obstacles to Peace, A Re-Framing of the Palestinian-Israeli Conflict, he wrote, "Missing from Israel's security framing is the very fact of occupation, which Israel both denies exists…and that "security" requires Israel control over the entire country…rendering impossible a just peace based on human rights, international law, reconciliation." [Page 1]
During one of my four interviews with Jeff, he told me this joke:
"The Israeli government simply does not want to take responsibility and the USA government ignores the situation. Do you know why Israel does not want to become America's 51st state? Because then they would only have two senators!"
They certainly have one vocal demimondaine and ultimate craving consummate pandering politician who is currently lusting for the American Presidency.
e
http://www.wearewideawake.org/
"Mitt Romney, you may recall, looked nearly hysterical in his speech in Iowa after the drubbing he took from Huckabee. He got all emotional about the campaign and switched between giggles and near-tears several times."
Based on the link, Ruth is confused. I despise Romney, but he displays none of the emotions she attributes to him-- just the usual head-bobbing, smarmy bs we can expect from him.
Yes, as Greg Palast says in his book we have the best government money can buy, and without an Edwards presidency, NOTHING WILL CHANGE!
So, what it all comes down to is more of the same meddling in other countries affairs for the benefit of multinational corporations and American hegemony, using the military not for self defense, but to unilaterally advance our foreign policy by other means, spending your tax dollars on larger military for empire, which means NO CHANGE.
What we really need is RADICAL CHANGE. Radical change starts by changing the decision-makers, taking control of our government away from corporate lobbyists and big money special interest groups. Obama and Clinton have already sold out to them. John Edwards is the only candidate offering radical change who has a chance to win.
So, if you want business as usual, Obama or Clinton will be fine, or you can shift paradigms and
VOTE EDWARDS for a WORLD OF CHANGE.
I just watched Bill Hogan on Dan Rather via 'The Buying Of The President 2008'.
The guy sums it up like nobody else has done before.
"We really don't have an election anymore. We have an auction."
Bill Hogan
With all due respect, but whoever believes this is about who 'may be the best' President is a naive
dreamer. I do try to come up with some positive and inspiring thoughts here, unfortunately I am
obviously not too good with that. Might have to do with all those news...
Check this out:
http://www.buyingofthepresident.org/index.php/multimedia_center/video/bill_hogan_on_dan_rather_reports...
formernadervoter,
Paul Street is a Znet hack who doesn't understand how the world works. He's some kind of New Left neo-stalinist.
"[Obama] praises the architects of the Cold War for checking the Soviet Union's nefarious designs "to spread [in Obama's words] its totalitarian brand of communism."- Paul Street
http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?%20SectionID=72&ItemID=12928
Obama's words? Give me a break. They were also Trotksy's words. The fact that "the USSR modeled the possibility of independent national development outside the parameters of U.S.-led world-capitalist supervision" does not dismiss the fascism that made it possible. Hitler also modeled a possibility of independent development outside the parameters of British-led world-capitalist development and the fascism of Mobutuism 'modeled a possibility of independent development outside the parameters of US-led world-capitalist development'. There is nothing intrinsic to that outsider status that is inherently good.
"The so-called friends of the Soviet Union (left democrats, pacifists, Brandlerites, and the like) repeat the argument of the Comintern functionaries that the struggle against the Stalinist bureaucracy, i.e., first of all criticism of its false policies, "helps the counter-revolution." This is the standpoint of the political lackeys of the bureaucracy, but never that of revolutionists. The Soviet Union both internally and externally can be defended only by means of a correct policy. All other considerations are either secondary or simply lying phrases.
The present CPSU is not a party but an apparatus of domination in the hands of an uncontrolled bureaucracy. Within the framework of the CPSU and outside of it takes place the grouping of the scattered elements of the two basic parties: the proletarian and the Thermidorean-Bonapartist. Rising above both of them, the centrist bureaucracy wages a war of annihilation against the Bolshevik-Leninists. While coming into sharp clashes from time to time with their Thermidorean half-allies, the Stalinists, nevertheless, clear the road for the latter by crushing, strangling, and corrupting the Bolshevik Party."
"Only the creation of the Marxist International, completely independent of the Stalinist bureaucracy and counterposed politically to it, can save the USSR from collapse by binding its destiny with the destiny of the world proletarian revolution."- Leon Trotsky
http://www.marxists.org/archive/trotsky/germany/1933/330715.htm
Paul Street's cynicism is not refreshing and is exactly why I am not voting for the warmongering Edwards or the Clintons.
The Taliban, Saddam, and Milosevic are all alike in that they push or pushed militant ethnically exclusive forms of political ideology, were not elected, and committed genocide.
Where their situations differ is in who their neighbors are or were, logistical geography, and in who opposed them. In addition, they differ signficantly as regimes in that the Taliban harbored Al Qaeda. The United States should never surrender people to genocide. That it happens is because of either lack of political will to intervene to stop it or because it is realistically impossible to act alone to stop it. However, we should always oppose it, and be realistic about how politics actually works in towns across world.
It's the same situation everywhere in the world. One group acts, the other doesn't. The group that acts takes power. How Paul Street can think that the Taliban is not pressuring Pakistani politics is beyond me. If we don't act, the Taliban will. Get real.
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1650518,00.html
Obama is not against political Islam. I'm against antidemocratic political ideology. I'm for rule of law. I'm against rules written by antidemocratic ideologies.
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1628168,00.html
VOTE OBAMA. CHANGE THE WORLD.
latte lenya: so, if change is "not going to come from the top". Sounds like change should be coming from the "bottom".
Now tell me - what kind of "buttom change" do you favour ... while you keep continuing to support the top that wont change?
Doesnt sound very logical to ask yourself to change something ... and not change something?
rockerbabe1: yeah, best candidate. Of course yeah.
Dont come back in two, three years when the middle class is still going down and nothing at all changed. Because the people that mess "the people" for 50 years now ... are still in power and messing you up the best they can.
Thedeed, I agree with most of what you said, the pubs are in full self-destruct mode thanks to 7 years of W and the Neo-Fascists.
They know that it would take an awful lot of time and money to rebuild the base, so I think that they have decided not to work at it too hard.
I think they have decided to buy into the dems candidates to limit the damage to their agenda. I think that is why Rupert Murdock is backing Hillary and Wall Street is giving to both Obama and Clinton.
They don't need to turn the dems into pubs, all they have to do is limit the change and speed of change to their agenda that is already in place, at least until the spin machine can fix the problems with their base.
Losers? My boy, lay off that "reaper", I see you've forgotten what happened just over a year ago...
I have to agree that all in all, we could do a lot worse than Hillary... like, Obama, for instance. I can't name a single clear position I've understood from the guy - his healthcare plan is every bit as hodge-podgy as Clintons, and on top of that, it doesn't even make financial sense. His position on the Iraq war *has* changed, it's just the media's conveniently forgetting to remind us of that right now...
You can't just call yourself the "change" candidate and shout "yes we can" without anything to back it up - yes we can what? Yes we can have 4 more stagnant years? No doubt. Clinton's no angel, but even for the people for whom the 90's were not the greatest decade, the 00's have been far worse. I'd take 8 more years like the 90's any day.
Reaper,
You will reap what you sow. You are right that you pubs know better how to win elections than dems. But those days are over. That's why you lost the house and the senate last time out.
As you point out, both our leading candidates are a lot tougher than Kerry. You pubs shredded Kerry, but you won't have such as easy time this time. We know you control the media, but we are learning to deal with that. We will probably have more money and a better field operation.
On the pub side, you are going to be divided. Despite your attacks on Ron Paul, he has an ardent group of supporters that think he makes sense. Those libertarians are normally your voters, and even though your libertarians are attacking Paul's libertarians, the libertarians are going to be split and you'll lose those votes.
Second, you have to contend with a split between your evangelicals and your neocons. Your Christian wing is defecting to Huckabee, despite your best efforts. Once you finish trashing him, it may be hard to get those people out of the churches.
Third, you are going to have to deal with a possible third party attempt from Bloomberg. Its looking more like he wants to do it, if for no other reason than to prevent Mitt or Rudy from winning. Try to stop that, losers.
Whoever the Dems nominate is going to be tested by fire and backed by a highly motivated base, thanks to W. It just isn't going to be your year, Reaper. Times are changing. Doom is upon you.
There's a far better chance for Obama to be the next Premier of China than to be elected president of this country. For that reason the repugs will do anything possible to help him become the nominee.
I just watched the video of Hilary's supposed "crack up." Sorry, kids, but that did not qualify as an emotional display. You want to see emotional, how about tears rolling down your face in front of your entire high school class because many of them had been teasing you relentlessly during the entire period? THAT is sadness overflowing, and it has nothing to do with female manipulation. Hikerwoman made a very good case against the "female manipulation" theory of tears.
Three additional points:
1. If Hillary gets elected, she will continue the disastrous agenda of her corporate masters. Then it will be our turn to cry, from the littlest child to the biggest, toughest man out there.
2. The powers that rule this country care nothing about our sadness and anger - whether or not expressed in tears.
3. This disgusting "horserace" of a presidential election (swamped with videos about who cried, who hiccuped, etc.)serves the same purpose that reality television does: It conveniently distracts us from much worse crises: Global warming, U.S. warboat provocation off the coast of Iran, the wars in Iraq & Afghanistan, the continuing attempts to reinstate the draft . . . do I need to go on?
Let's get our priorities straight, folks! CALL FOR THE IMPEACHMENT OF THE PRESIDENT & VICE PRESIDENT!
And that's just for starters. Otherwise it won't matter who is in the White House.
Obama is the master triangulator. He is no real deal. Folks, don't turn off your brain. Read Paul Street's fine essays devastating Obama's false claim to be a progressive. He is worse than Hillary.
The corporate mainstream media drives the agenda and sets the bounds of thinkable thought. Most voters do not vote on the issues, preferring to make their choice on "personal qualities." Policy wise this is foolish. Look at the moron in the White House. It was very clearly what kind of president he would be if you only looked at his record and policy proposals.
Same with Clinton and Obama. They are free traders, the public opposes it.
They are for nuke power, the public opposed. They are against single payer, while the public supports.
Obviously, voters are not only not voting on the issues, its clear they don't know the candidates' positions on them.
And don't fall for Hillary's 'mandate' nonsense. I'm currently paying for mandated health insurance I can't afford to attend college. $1,500 a year on top of $9,000 a year. The issue is NOT MANDATES. ITS AFFORDABILITY.
Oh, and guess who I have to buy loans from. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18040824/
You think this doesn't happen with mandated health insurance?
As Obama says, "Cost is the number one reason that 47 million Americans do not have health insurance and thousands more are edging toward bankruptcy every day…What I have said repeatedly is that the reason people don't have health insurance is not because they don't want it, it's because they can't afford it." He has never ruled out a mandate, he has said we have to take on the health insurance corporations and address the underlying costs of healthcare first, before we can legislate an affordable mandate for ALL AMERICANS.
What good is an unaffordable health care mandate? What are we going to do, throw everyone in prison who doesn't have health insurance when they're caught speeding?
The Massachusetts Plan
"But the reluctance of so many to enroll, along with the possible exemption of 60,000 residents who cannot afford premiums, has raised questions about whether even a mandate can guarantee truly universal coverage.
Additional concerns have been generated by projections that the state's insurers plan to raise rates 10 percent to 12 percent next year, twice this year's national average. That would undercut the plan's secondary goal of slowing the increase in health costs."We're going to be very aggressive in trying to get those numbers down to single digits," said Jon M. Kingsdale, executive director of the Commonwealth Health Insurance Connector Authority, the agency that markets the subsidized insurance policies. "If we continue with double-digit inflation, I don't think health reform is sustainable."…
Senator Barack Obama of Illinois sees it a different way. He argues there is danger in mandating coverage before it is clear it can be affordable for those at the margins. While Mr. Obama does not rule out a mandate down the road, his emphasis is on reducing costs and providing generous government subsidies to those who need them. He would mandate coverage for children. " [Because children don't have a choice, they're not adults.]
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/25/us/politics/25mass.html
Obama is the real deal. Clinton will sell you out.
"Judge Him By His Laws"
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/01/03/AR2008010303303.html
"Obama Forged Political Mettle In Illinois Capitol"
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/08/AR2007020802262_pf.html
"In Illinois, Obama Proved Pragmatic and Shrewd" (Graphic of Illinois Legislation)
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/30/us/politics/30obama.htm
The antidote for rigged elections is direct democracy.
GREAT POST from ms.conniff.it seems like a 100 years since we elected that normal guy from texas who now appears to be,er, delusional.which may be the point-appropriate emotion is fine-dissociative ideation is clearly not good.consider that a meloncholic lincoln,charged with smashing a rebellion,and grieving for his dead children,often paced the whitehouse floor far into the night-but his policies were reality based -the beneficiary of his own genius,and the counsel of acrack cabinet of men chosen for their abilities,not their blind personal loyalty,and ideological rigidity.by the way,if you want to see rage,and anger,unleashed,raw and to the brink,i'm told one ought to stand in front of mccain when things are out of kilter on the "staight talk express. just sayin....
Obviously none of the posters here saw Jon Stewart's take on the 'tears", or his images of various male politicians in tears. Don't waste any more of your own tears (or whatever) on this subject. The reality is that it is really hard to get a clear sense of what a candidate stands for because so much of the information we get comes through the media, how long a clip they give a candidate, where in a speech they edit, and so on. It is my fervent hope that people will go back to looking at the evidence of where each candidate stands on the issues. At the very least, I hope that will drive home to folks that Ron Paul (even if he opposes and opposed the war in Iraq) is one very dangerous dude. There is no legitimacy for anything that isn't mentioned in the Constitution? Pul-leeze. Say good-bye to any sort of reasonable healthcare with that guy!
If she is stoic, she is calculating; if she cries, she is calculating. The frame fits everything she does.
That "leftists" perpetuate the frame is disgusting. Clinton is far, far better than any Republican, and unlike Obama, is not full of shit. She may not be progressive enough for your tastes (or mine) but she'll get things done. Obama would be a cork on the water. He's not beloved by the media for nothing.
Let's see. The voters are tired of the partisan, militaristic status quo, so a plurality of New Hampshire Democrats vote for a candidate who is at least as hawkish and divisive as George W. Bush--a fortiori, at the same point in her career, far more. I'm sure her new personality du jour, cooked up from the menu proposed by consultants, has helped. No one cares that she hasn't shed a tear for the 4000 Americans and million Iraqis who have died in a war, founded on a patently fraudulent casus belli, that she has always gleefully supported; it's enough that she choked up about the difficulties of campaigning, riding on her husband's frayed and semen-stained coattails while portaying herself as a feminist, a strong and self-sufficient women while Bill talks as if he were running for reelection. At least she seems to have discovered the first person plural.
I am male, and I believe the greatest hazard of maleness is the traditional rule that says boys don't cry. Someday maybe we'll evolve to the point where a candidate who cries, male or female, is the norm and not a freak show for the media.
That said, I eagerly await the day that I can cast my vote for a woman or a person of color who is truly progressive. Maybe that will be this year with Cynthia McKinney as the Green Party candidate.
Dear COMarc,
I totally agree with you about Obama (see below). Wonderful oratorical style, but not much substance ...
"I just keep waiting for Obama to actually say something. His mouth moves a lot, and the sounds that emerge sound pleasant. But I keep listening to him trying to hear him actually say something, and I just don't hear anything. Lots of drivel about hope and change and how we need to be united. But his lack of content or any real plans that would tell me that I should 'hope' to have a fair single-payer health care system, or that I should 'hope' he'd have our troops out of Iraq in six months, or many others are just missing."
Murf59,
Please do not confuse emotional with spiritual.Gandhi ground the British out of India.
For obvious reasons spiritual leaders will not participate in U.S politics. They will wait until Mother Earth grinds down the wealth and power of the misguided hyper rationals.This will happen sooner than people think.
As a matter of fact, a candidate apparently crying did play a role in another New Hampshire primary. In 1972, Edmund Muskie appeared to cry when defending his wife from charges that she drank and swore (he claimed the tears were 'melting snowflakes'). The alleged tears were a disaster for the Muskie campaign. Many people are now saying that Hillary's tears won her votes. This seems to suggest the impact of 'free to be you and me/it's okay to cry' culture in the US over the last 35 years. Bill 'I feel your pain' Clinton probably had a role in this.
HER HUSBAND...BILLY...IS HER BIGGEST LIABILITY
I can't believe how many women I have heard say they are voting for Hillary because they want to have a woman for President. This is beyond stupid. I can understand why an oppressed group would want representation but women in America are simply not oppressed anymore. There are more women college students than men. Hollywood does not hesitate to show a woman punching or slapping a man because he said something she doesn't like. There is a line of clothing for girls that says things like "Boys are stupid. You should throw dirt at them." Can you imagine how the converse would be accepted?" I am a woman, yet I find this very offensive.
The world is full of people who try to manipulate others with deception. Of course women cry at times for effect. Men would also except that it usually doesn't help any male cause. Hillary's tears were on cue and contrived, most likely.
Hiker Woman,
You are an honest person and you have a good heart. That is to your credit.
Sadly, you are only one woman. Not all people are as honest as you are, certainly not all politicians.
Yes, men lack empathy. No argument there. I am a man, and I say "guilty as charged."
There are many Kissingers and Nixons, Reagans, Cheneys, Rumsfelds, Bush 43s.
But, there are also Margaret Thatchers, Madeleine Albrights, and other women whose advocacy of the knee-jerk projection of force no matter the human cost is every bit as nasty as the "hunting-accident" Cheney types.
I believe Hillary fits right in with this crowd. Her votes and her speeches are hawkish. Word from the Clinton White House was she was a very hawkish advisor to her husband, who found a way to keep the military quite busy.
Anyway, if lack of empathy equates to hawkish foreign policy, one might be forced to say that Hillary lacks empathy.
Remember, individual differences are always more pronounced than categorical differences.
One woman and the next woman will always differ more in the ability to empathize than the average woman compared with the average man. The fact of the supremacy of individial difference has been proven decisively in Psychology research.
Similarly, one man and the next man will always differ more in spatial skills than the average difference between men and women.
mirf59
"Boys learn in Junior High and High School that girls sometimes cry dishonestly to manipulate them."
I'd be interested to learn how these boys distinguish between girls crying "dishonestly" or girls crying because they are genuinely upset by something the boys have done. Maybe the boys are lacking in empathy and can't accept that the girls are not crying in order to manipulate them.
Interestingly, I recently watched a British TV program where couples who were experiencing problems with their relationships had their brains scanned. The experiment was to demonstrate how men and women differ in the ways they empathize with others. Each man and woman of each couple was shown a situation of other human beings suffering in some fashion and then their brains were scanned to see how the part of the brain that deals with empathy was reacting. What was really scary (to me) was the comparative lack of empathy in a large proportion of the men compared with the women, with some of the men experienced no empathy whatsoever towards the humans in the distressing situation.
I cry very easily. I cry when listening to a piece of music that moves me, when cuddling my 20-year old cat prior to having to euthanize her, eg. However, I really have a hard time faking it. I am trying right now to cry, and it isn't happening. It only happens when my emotions are involved.
I think men have to accept that it's part of life for women to cry and that women are just being themselves and not neccessarily trying to manipulate men (poor things! I mean men never try to manipulate women do they?). If men think it's somehow a bad thing for women to cry (which seems to be the case), then it's their problem and they should just get over it!
Tex Shelters
"Hard and firm Republican women wouldn't have been fooled by such an emotional appeal."
I don't know whether Tex Shelters is being serious or indulging in irony. If serious, now we have a man telling us that Republican women don't cry! Incidentally, why is it that men are always telling us how they think we should behave?
Women Crybabies vote for Crying Hillary
Dear Patriots,
Hillary cries, and the crybaby democratic women of New Hampshire gave her over 54% of the vote. On a Monday broadcast with Brit Hume, she cried when talking about how tough her campaign was, saying that she really cared. On Tuesday, she wins the New Hampshire primary due to the Monday cry fest. Leave it to a woman to emotionally manipulate votes from other women instead of using a firm hand.
Hard and firm Republican women wouldn't have been fooled by such an emotional appeal.
Stop emotions in politics, it's un-American!!
Yours,
Tex Shelters
(Check out my blog for my real right news at MySpace/texshelters: http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.ListAll&friendID=266473317)
Chelsea is a vegetarian so Hillary can't be all bad.
Siouxrose, there is no Divine feminine or masculine. Nothing is holy.
The first post in this thread, by mirf59, says it so well that I have little to add.
I don't care whether Hillary is a woman or not, and I am not interested in the inner recesses of her mind, her private states, her emotions, but I do care about her behavior, her positions, and her utterances in the public arena (all of which can be verified and documented), and all of the latter point to the fact that she is a crypto-Republican, and that, since she is vested in the Democratic cloak, she is an extremely manipulative individual. As such, I would not put it beyond her to use her lacrymal glands, or her gender, to political effects.
mirf59
Yes, it's always 'reason' against 'compassion' and humanity.
SiouxRose,
Those governed strictly by the mind and by reason will always dominate those governed by emotion and spirituality. This is so because people that need emotionality for sustenance will always be ground down to zero by those who don't need it.
This might be one of the greatest tragedies of the human condition. Hyper-rational people are relentless grinders. They will grind down anything and everything in their path, which makes this the dominant state of being.
Those people given to such dominance will be best served by rationality. And those that are rational naturally will always have a leg up on those that don't in the struggle for power and influence in places where a lot of power is at stake.
Apologies, but I think your dream of a balance is not realistic.
Those that seek balance -- the best they can do is try to carve out an independent slice of the action where a more balanced set of rules has the chance to flourish. Mainstream politics is not going to be that game in the United States of America -- a place where 25% or more of the world's wealth and power is concentrated.
Hillary Clinton is not a viable candidate because she is a woman, but rather exactly because she epitomizes the characteristics commonly associated with the male gender role.
There seem to be two possibilities to describe the discrepancy between the polls and the result in NH. One is that the voting machines had some of the old Ohio magic.
The second is that Women Changed Their Minds at the last minute and voted for the woman-in-distress in a strictly sisterhood, sexist way. Maybe both.
Hillary's breakdown came at that exact last moment, and the news and views of it were very widely disseminated. This seemed to have created anger towards the male candidates, especially Edwards, that seemed to be beating her down, and women's natural empathy to another woman getting "beat up by males" changed their vote instantaneously. Edwards is now probably out of the race, and his gender vote numbers seem to indicate that he was abandonded by women, for his Hillary-bashing.
No one is pointing out however that just a short time ago, it was supposed to be a Hillary landslide. That she has just eked out a win from Obama says something about her as a candidate. But all the pundit-sters on the tee-vee say it was an "amazing comeback". So a 20-percentage-point drop is an amazing comeback?
I think women's empathy was in play, and look for the Clintons to grasp this politically/cynically. Look for Hillary to play the gender card more and more. I wish Hillary were worthy of being the first woman President, I really do.
And I wish politics was about issues, but it is not about those things anymore. Witness the rise of George Bush... liar, charlatan, sociopath, warmonger, hypocrite, criminal, dullard, traitor... but perceived as a "straight-shootin' rock-solid he-man 'Merican cowboy" with a brush ranch and a codpiece.
So substance doesn't matter anymore I guess. It's just about celebrity and personality. Hillary as a female iconic personality was backed by women in the end. That she is part of the corrupted DemParty Machine did not matter. That she would be yet another Clinton Administration did not matter. That she represents Bob Rubin of Citibank and the Corporate interests did not matter. That the Clinton years marginalized the liberal and progressive parts of the Dem Party "in order to win" and thus eroded all the Democratic Party stood for, did not matter. That the rise of the radical Far-Right Neo-cons and the takeover of the Republican Party by stone-age Regressives, religious Fundamentalists, Neo-Con-men and drooling 'liberal' Haters happened under their watch, did not matter. She was a woman in distress, and the women of NH responded with their support. This is the Kabuki Theater that American Politics has become.
No, COmarc, it isn't a predictably female tactic to break out the tears at a key point. It's what humans do naturally when they haven't squelched their emotions. And the media did attack her for it.
HIKER WOMAN: Good points. The key missing emotion is EMPATHY, the ability to walk in someone else's moccasins. We know that most candidates represent the status quo and launch campaigns on the basis of big money's interests and "largesse."
MIRF 59: Good rebuttal. As to your navigational analogy, you might agree that much of history (the past 3000 years) has allowed the male perspective/male power to operate the wheel. There are interesting theories pertaining to a very different style of sentience embodied in women, as living symbols of the Divine feminine. There has been precious little input from women with respect to law, government, academe until about 100 years ago. The emphasis on macho posturing, war/weapons, force first, might makes right, ego/individualism over community, art, the ways of peacemaking, seeking shared ends rather than atomic ones... well, a basis assymetrical paradigm has been such that now all our systems face collapse. There is a wisdom to utilizing 2 oars, both sides of sentience, the very code writ into our DNA... that dancing doubled helix of MUTUAL engagement. And when it's based on love, well, that makes all the difference, may even make war one day obsolete.
P.S. I am no Hillary supporter, not due to gender, obviously, but due to her policies.
Wake up idiots. The tears were phoney. So were the "Iron my shirts" protesters. Paid for by the Clinton Campaign no doubt. Say or think whatever you want. There isn't an ounce of sincerity in either Bill or Hillary.
Check out Wall Street. Stocks have been getting hammered since Obama won Iowa. Today they are up. Why? Because their bought and paid for candidate has made a "comeback".
Hikerwoman,
Boys learn in Junior High and High School that girls sometimes cry dishonestly to manipulate them. That's a generalization which does not apply to all women, but does apply to some.
The evidence that Hillary is guilty of it is, in my mind, somewhat weak. Basically, it's that she seems like a cold and calculating person who would loathe displays of weakness and sentimentality. If that character mythology is true, it would make her tears of the dishonest and manipulative variety.
It's not that it is wrong to cry, it's about honesty and character, and what Hillary Clinton as Presidential candidate is willing to do to get elected -- and by extension what that says about how she would govern in office.
Generally, I agree with the spirit of your criticism. Back to Ancient Greece and probably before, there is an ongoing battle between those governed strictly by reason, those strictly by passion, and what is the proper balance.
My personal opinion can be explained by analogy. If my life journey is the voyage of a ship, I'm going to steer it with my heart, but I'm going to operate it with my mind. The heart plots the course, but the mind executes and makes it happen.
"i'm a new hampshire voter, and i voted for hillary for 2 reasons. 1) because the right wing hates her so much and 2) because she's female. i recognize that those aren't very good reasons for voting for anybody, but who says you need good reasons?"
That's it. We're screwed.
The first comment from mirf59 nails the election. Mirf seems to have figured it out largely on his own.
The late Walter Karp gives a framework for similar clear thinking about American two party politics. He divides the political world into, not left vs right, not R vs D but rather "Hack" vs "Reformer". Hillary is clearly the Democratic party hack and Obama only slightly less so.
Where Karp gets interesting is talking about the fact that the hacks of both parties have more in common with each other than with the reformers of their own party.
The paramount goal of the hack is to keep reformers out of power.
The hacks of both parties will work together to keep reformers out of power. Look at the Rs and Ds working to keep Perot, Nader, out of the debates. The two parties co-opted the debates from the League of Women Voters in order to control the content.
In "Indisspensable Enemies" Karp refutes all the axioms of politics you learned in 9th grade Civics and replaces them with the Civics of the Smoke Filled Back Room.
Karp was a protege of Hannah Arendt and Bill Moyers and Chomsky liked him very much.
Asking whether someone is a hack or reformer will bring most of politcs into sharp focus. Kennedy, Clinton, Lieberman, all hacks. Jimmy Carter, Paul Wellstone, Howard Dean Bill Bradley are all reformers.
I think John Edwards may be the viable reform candidate in this race.
Bo
i'm a new hampshire voter, and i voted for hillary for 2 reasons. 1) because the right wing hates her so much and 2) because she's female. i recognize that those aren't very good reasons for voting for anybody, but who says you need good reasons?
i wasn't going to vote at all, but in the end lost my nerve and went to the polls.
change is not going to come from the top. it doesn't matter who's driving the damn frieght train, it's still a freight train, and the tracks are a permanent part of the landscape, and go in one direction only. the more obama was presented as a 'rock star' the more the whole carnival started to look like what it is, a 'weapon of mass distraction,' detonated every four years.
Whether or not Hillary cried is immaterial to the big questions. But the posters here claiming that it is a female "tactic" to cry betray their shallow relationships with women.
As to whether Martin Luther King or Lyndon Johnson was responsible for the civil rights gains of the 60s, the answer is: neither.
There were a lot of people working for civil rights, and a lot of people died for the cause. And we're talking since the Civil War. So, what caused the gains of the 60s?
After WW11 there were liberation struggles around the world, many supported by the Soviet Union. African Americans here renewed their struggle. The hypocrisy of US government propaganda around the world speaking of "freedom" contrasted to the abysmal treatment of Black people here was getting embarrassing. The Soviet Union was using the discrepancy with great effect. The US ruling class decided to dismantle the most obvious signs of American apartheid. Lyndon Johnson was in office at the time.
We have listened to the self-congratulation since. It reminds me of the boasting about the Civil War. The claim is that the US is the only country to have fought a war to end slavery.
Well, half of the country did. The other half fought to keep it. And the rest of the world ended slavery without a war at all. They just outlawed it.
The fact that the most outrageous forms of American apartheid were ended at great personal cost to many people (especially Martin Luther King) doesn't seem that praise worthy to me.
I don't know if the truth about the 'tears' will ever be known, do we yet know the truth about previous candidates tears?
It seems to me what is more certain is the history of American Politics, where just about anything goes.
Given the money involved and the corporate penchant for protecting investments and the human inclination for believing that "winning" is everything, how could it be otherwise?
Were the Kennedy brothers shot down because they were raised Catholic, or because somebody bought an election? Or because others were manipulated into believing they were someone other than who they were?
It just seems that the entire US election process is a contest between vested money interests that will do anything that is required to win, especially if their research suggests that some accusation, regardless if it is 'true' or not, will have the desired effect.
Attitudes, prejudices, values, religion, gender, race, beliefs, morals, ethics, appear to be nothing more than hooks for the manipulators, to see how it will play in Peroria.
Hillary, Peloski and all the ones in our military have proven -- without a doubt -- that the American Woman can do anything a man can do, including treason, murder, butchery, looting or any other high crimes known to humankind.
I'll never vote for a murderer again in order to see a fictious "changing" of administrations.
The cheering by their supporters makes me want to puke my guts out.
Boo Hoo! I can't believe anybody bought her crocodile tears. Doesn't anybody remember Bill's emotional machinations? Like other moments in her campaign, I suspect the question was planted and her "emotions" rehearsed.
She has been investigated for Whitewater and travelgate, she has watched Bill make an ass of himself and dealt with his infidelity on numerous occasions, has been savaged by the press and Republicans countless times, and it is being behind in the polls that finally brought a tear to her eye. What does that say?!
As for her 35 years of change. HA! If she wants to talk about her pre-political office history of change, lets look at her tenure on Wal-Mart's board of directors and Tyson's as well.
Ridiculous!
Hillary uses the oldest female trick in the book. "When all else fails cry, and you will get what you want." And the stupid voters fell for it.
The sexism charge is used cynically though when she is called into account for her record and claims she is being picked on or bullied by the boys. In addition she is defended by the same team of NOW league feminists, Katha Pollitt or Gloria Steinheim who, if not turning away from MrBill's behaviors that would have put any other male politician in hot water, they openly belittled at least one of the woman as "trailer trash". Sexism you say? What about leisure class liberal elitism?
Tearing up was one thing--and for a variety of reasons it may be genuine enough--but the Clintons again used it cynically to garner sympathy. Not only was there just a handful of supporters present--there were far more media filming and she notably used Edwards lines about it being personal and then the airwaves grabbed it as some soap opera performance tugging at the sachrine heartstrings. Same goes for her feeling being hurt act--all the while strutting like a big neocon cock of the walk.
As for her record--well she failed at healthcare--and her record reveals poor judgement--calculated for personal advantage from Bush enabling to causes like flag-burning or violent movies--or even triangulating on abortion. Just because she has been around doesn't mean her experience is stellar.
In the town I live in I hear these upper middle-class women and their what-about-the-children causes that think little of taxing the struggling working class out of their homes. It never seems to occur to them that shiny new toys--new football equiptment, cheerleaders outfits, new playgrounds in their neighborhoods impose a tax burden on the families of poorer children. What about those children?
Hillary strikes me as a what-about-the-children type.
"Actually, isn't it a predictably female tactic to break out the tears at a key point?"
CoMarc, I don't know whether Hilary's tears were calculated or not. However, speaking as a women, if I get upset or emotional about something, I cry. This is not a "female tactic" but something that I can't help. It seems to me that it's an understandable response to something that has upset me.
I'm tired of men pointing out that women are "too emotional." Men are judging women by a male standard because generally men don't cry as easily as women. I also reject the male notion that women are incapable of making rational judgements because their emotions get in the way. Maybe if men had stronger emotions about things they wouldn't make "rational" decisions that result in the death, injury and displacement of thousands of other human beings.
Maybe CoMarc should consider the idea that what is wrong with the world is not that women are "too emotional," but rather that men are not emotional enough!
Hillary Clinton has the most experience, hands down, and also the most "contacts"--a few too many of which, are corporate "contacts." Nonetheless, she can start fast on day one. John Edwards has the most "fight."
Barack Obama has the most balance and the best possible face (literally and figuratively) to represent America to the world in foreign affairs and helpfully influence and advance progress for our minority subcultures (yes, Hispanic too.)
ALL of them, by slightly varying degrees, are more liberal (that is, respectful to individual citizens) than any Republican and we should hope one of them is elected and work hard to see that it happens.
Barack said "change." Hillary copied. John Edwards said "this is PERSONAL to me." Hillary copied--in her now famous emotion moment at New Hampshire. Hillary will continue to copy whatever good behaviors these guys put up. We'll ultimately decide between one of the two superior speechmakers (Obama and Edwards) or their fast-learning imitator. Electing any of them would be OK. Bashing any of them, so as to contribute to ultimate defeat by a Republican is not OK.
Barack's big win in Iowa may have been a statistical fluke. NH did not confirm, though Barack's loss there was MUCH smaller than predicted there a couple of months ago. Nevada and South Carolina will tell us more about which one the voters believe can best win.
Hillary's tears were clearly calcuated to "humanize" her. It apparently worked. Forget the sexist media who dumped on her. She played the sexist gender card that she needed, and it worked.
Mitt Romney "looked nearly hysterical in his speech in Iowa". Please click on that link in this article and watch that U-tube clip because Romney looks totally calm and self assured. Don't bother clicking the "crack up" link for Hillary crying because the clip has been removed from U-tube.
Actually, isn't it a predictably female tactic to break out the tears at a key point?
If a male candidate were to show tears when talking about the state of their campaign, they'd be clobbered in the media. This is more Hillary trying to play the gender card for like the 20,000th time. Isn't it the Hillary campaign that tries to constantly push the message that people (mainly women) should vote for her just because she's female?
Actually, it reads like Ms. Conniff has never been around an election before. Its not at all unusual for candidates to run very long days and nights before an election. A candidate staying up all night working dinners and late night gatherings and then starting the next day before sunrise meeting workers at a factory gate before going to a breakfast meeting with supporters is a pretty typical schedule the day of an election. That Ms. Conniff makes it sound like this is unusual in this election is a bit bizarre.
I just keep waiting for Obama to actually say something. His mouth moves a lot, and the sounds that emerge sound pleasant. But I keep listening to him trying to hear him actually say something, and I just don't hear anything. Lots of drivel about hope and change and how we need to be united. But his lack of content or any real plans that would tell me that I should 'hope' to have a fair single-payer health care system, or that I should 'hope' he'd have our troops out of Iraq in six months, or many others are just missing. Combine that with his constant message that we need to have 'unity' with everyone in the nation leads me to believe that what he's really saying is that we need to stop opposing the conservatives and we need to stop opposing the corporations in order to create this unity. We damn well know they won't compromise, so apparently its us that have to compromise.
My feeling is that anyone who cares about the same issues I do and who votes for Hillary or Obama will find themselves out in the streets alongside me protesting a year into their administrations.
We know Hillary is the pro-war, pro-corporate government candidate. She's got a record of 20 years of being the DLC's poster candidate that she can't hide from, despite all the BS she spews trying to do so. Or any phony tears she sheds (per script) in a coffee shop. Elect Hillary and the Lincoln Bedroom and the White House will be for sale to the highest bidder (cash only please) just like it was all through the 90's. Watch the corporations screw you on health care and send your jobs overseas while she counts the re-election contributions as they roll in. Just like in the 90's.
In a way Ruth is right but not in the manner she would like to be. Screw worrying about and focusing on HC's personal quirks which are manifold worry about her policy positions and how she intends to betray democratic voters once in office.
Ruth says the fact that Hillary is a cold calculating triagulator obsessed with her own political aggrandizement should be overlooked because people especially the wingnuts don't like her as a person either.
S
I have to laugh at the false dichotomy Ruth poses. It's as if one can't hate Clinton for her positions and her personality. I am in that category because I see how one is reflective of the other.
Apparently Someone forgot to tell Ruth the people who actually examine the issues...or even read well...anything let alone political publications like "the progressive" would never vote for HC anyway.
hirtsleeves,
Whatever it is your puffing on I want your to mail me some because that is some Mr. Bake-o shit. yeah let's vote for Clinton to show the corporate media a thing or two...LMAO.
Tonight! Midnight EST Fox News capitulates and goes off the air because voters cast their ballots for Clinton just to spite the fair and balanced network. Why don't you join the GOP while your at it. You know...show them baby killers at thing or two...douchebag.
I'm still appalled by that chilling cackle from some months back...
I was pleased and inspired by Barack Obama's decisive win in the Iowa caucuses last Thursday. And between then and yesterday, I've been put off by the near-orgy of ageism and especially misogyny that many of his supporters have been engaging in. How ugly. (And "misogyny"--hatred of women--is exactly the right word, not the more polite, less accurate "sexism.") Hillary is not my candidate--Edwards is, for now--but I probably would have voted for her yesterday in New Hampshire, as a backlash not just against the arrogant, pontificating media but also against some of Obama's even more arrogant, pontificating backers. Anyway, Obama needs to be tested. Remember the rush to crown John Kerry? That turned out well.
I don't like Clinton myself (far too "conservative"), but don't Americans have a more important set of criteria for determining their political representatives?
~
"If for some reason you are not willing to lead, leave it to the rest of us. Please get out of the way." (Kevin Conrad)
Consider the following pre-conditions:
1. Hillary is a conservative in blue clothes.
2. Hillary is a cold and calculating character.
3. Fox news is a conservative network.
4. New Hampshire is a conservative state where even the blues are purple or even red.
5. The MSM likes the status quo.
What would happen under these conditions?
Hillary would win in New Hampshire. Hillary would feign tears after Iowa, and it would only be shown on Fox. MSM would tout Clinton's red victory as a blue victory and overstate it.
Now, plenty of evidence exists to back the first pre-condition. She is hawkish even by Republican standards. She grew up Republican. She was a star performer as General Counsel for Sam Walton in Arkansas. She pushed her husband to the right while he was in office.
Evidence for the second pre-condition is not strong. She certainly appears to be cold and calculating superficially, and in all reports about her campaign tactics, working behind the scenes, etc. I recall a rumor about her that she would berate Chelsea when Chelsea was a girl and reduce her to tears to toughen her up. If this is true, certainly her breakdown episode is pure manipulation.
The third pre-condition is common knowledge and needs no discussion. The fourth and fifth are also factually based.
It is highly likely that Hillary is the candidate of the GOP, of the MSM, and that her failure in Iowa has Fox and others working overtime to prop her back up, including consenting in her emotional ploys.
Hillary as Democratic candidate would guarantee that the next President is right wing, a friend of corporations, a friend of the Pentagon, and ready to continue the current plan or even escalate it in Iran.
Hillary is my choice for President of the United States. She is simply the best candidate running in either party.
The fact that the Boys' Club is all a flitter over her success, makes the success so much sweeter.
Go Hilliary Girl, GO!
FVHorn:
Nice analysis.