BIDELO: I sympathize with your experience, as I live in the Bible belt and generally meet people who hold this attitude. Shakespeare said (of war and its supporters, evidence based on pretense even then), "How can thinking men think so wrongly." You mention the "Rush Limbaugh set," but it's pervasive. This dumbo is vastly syndicated. He is EVERYWHERE brainwashing. A lot of blue collar guys feel their pay has been diminished by jobs going overseas, they are angry but don't have a target for their anger. With sports pushing the idea of team loyalty, and churches often suggesting Bush has an "in" with "the big guy" they identify with simplistic black-white rhetoric and don't even LET themselves look deeper. If Bill O'Reilly says it's happening, they generally go along. These faux news morons know how to press emotional buttons and as Lakoff pointed out, they recognize the best framing of issues to elicit intended responses. Think Pavlov crossed with PT Barnum.

I am seeing a younger man right now whose family is Republican/Christian and he likes me enough to enter into inspired debates. When I tell him I believe 911 was an inside job, he has nearly a gag reaction. I met an attorney overseas who I shared this assumption with in 2004, and he just couldn't get near it. Then the Downing Street memos were published and anyone who's really put together the preponderance of evidence, what this one said, or what this earlier report published, it sure LOOKS like far too orchestrated to be a mere coincidence. If so, what god would have blessed Bush/Cheney's illusions of empire? No God any sane person would worship! The evidence is clear in the form of a million innocents slain, countless more rendered refugees, the situation deteriorating on the border with Turkey, and next door with Pakistan, etc. Just a blood bath of vengeance unleashed. Tragic! The guys on that website are CLUELESS to the truth. Remember that. If they had the balls and brains to bear witness to the truth, they would not try to slay you as its messenger.

I know, PJD, it's incredible, isn't it? I had heard similar comments to your example, many times, but I had hoped it was mainly confined to the Rush Limbaugh set. I had know idea it was so pervasive in the mainstream. I guess that's what I found so disappointing and depressing. It must be something in social evolution, whereby warrior nations can easily convince the masses to serve up their offspring as cannon fodder. But isn't this mindless sacrifice exactly what they accuse terrorists of doing? Isn't it the same psychology?

In the forum in question, I asked several times, "What does the Iraq War have to do with protecting the constitution?" I never got an answer. All I got was comments insinuating I was a traitor. I also got a lot of "It's the politicians and there's nothing we can do about it." They throw their hands up in the air. I would pretty much guess that many of those people voted for the politicians they now disdain, and probably would vote for them again. But they completely absolve themselves of any culpability, and take it out on people like us.

bidelo,

The thing is: how does American exceptionalism become so incredibly effective at blinding people to the in-front-of-your-eyes obvious fact that these foreign imperial wars having nothing, NOTHING to do with defending our "freedom" much less the US Constitution?

Yet, how often have you heard "you should thank out boys fighting in Iraq for your freedom to criticize the the war in Iraq"?

It is positively LOONY TUNES! A thousand doctoral psychology students should be doing their dissertations on this phenomenon.

Oh and tj, you're so right about the food. Maybe the one and only good thing about imperialism - the waves of immigrants that follow that add spice and color to the country, literally. I heard that chicken tikka masala is now more popular than fish and chips!

Thanks, tj.

I think fewer Brits are these days. That was a small spike of nationalism around the start of the Iraq war, but mainly it's been bemusement, wondering what in his right mind Blair was thinking.

I do know that at the height of empire and afterwards that British people had the same sense of exceptionalism. Back then, people would think we were bringing civilization to the "savages", and we were somehow more benign than the Spanish/French/Portuguese, pick your empire.

I think there was a change of attitude after WW2, which bankrupted us essentially. It was the culmination of two huge wars over empire, and even though we won, we lost really. Britain became famous as being the "poor man of Europe" and for Irish terrorism - the troubles - both consequences of an imperial past.

I just feel pessimistic because I think America is ending up going through the same motions as all empires do, in spite of all our knowledge of hsitory. I think America will need to bankrupt itself, destroy its constitution, and millions will die, before someone says, "What happened?"

bidelo:

You are much too modest. Your piece said things as well as they can be said. It is stronger than Eiland's and certainly stronger than the essay that leads this particular string. So, Thank You.

Though I am native-born, I am a grandson of immigrants and often dream of leaving for those places that are so much more sane and beautiful than here. Not Paradise. Not perfect. But certainly better.

I probably will never pursue those dreams, though Canada or Mexico still seem realisitic to me. In any case, I hope that you do seriously consider the return to your birth-land: as you say, for the sake of your children, if nothing else.

Besides, you can still get health care there and the food has gotten a whole lot better in recent decades with the waves of immigration. Not Paradise. Not perfect. But better.

And possibly fewer Brits these days are plagued by their own feelings of supremacy and imperial superiority.

Peace, health, luck.

Here's a nicely-written article, that perfectly articulates my point. http://www.consortiumnews.com/2006/041106a.html

Arvy, PJD and others, I agree with you. While the Cotes have good intentions, are tremendously worried about their son and feel cheated by the system, their article is laced with what Chomsky calls "American Exceptionalism". The idea that every single American soldier can do no wrong and America's intentions are fundamentally noble (it's just the execution of the War that was wrong). Why not mention the 1 million + Iraqi dead? It's on omission that is very revealing, I think.

About a week ago, I got myself caught up in a horrible discussion on a web forum. This forum is supposed to be completely apolitical, it's just an auto hobby site from people all over the world. So a guy from Texas posts an article about how proud he is that his son has just graduated from military school, and that is son is an idealist who will be helping to "protect the American constitution". I couldn't help but take the bait, and wrote back that I thought he was deluded to think that (yes, strong language, I regret it).

Boy was I raked through the coals! Dozens of replies from angry people saying they were ashamed of me, lots of swearing, lots of name calling, etc, etc. Not one person wrote in my defense. The overwhelming opinion of the replies was that I "was not supporting the troops". I actually never said that, not once. All I said was that most American military operations do not involve protecting the constitution, they involve protecting and expanding the empire. I used the Iraq War as a poignant example of this. I didn't get a chance to elucidate further. I wanted to say that the war serves to undermine the constition, if anything. I also wanted to ask the man, if your son gets deployed to Iraq, and he gets seriously injured, are you going to be able to look him in the eye and say he was "protecting the consitution".

The problem is folks, it that Ameican Exceptionalism is all-pervasive in this country, in spite of all that has happened. Your average Ameican has not budged one inch from this position, and I don't think they ever will. Every single empire in the past has had this problem, and it always leads to the inevitable collapse. The only reason why most Americans want to end the war is because they know it's lost - but they still think the premise is one of honor.

I got seriously depressed about this interchange, and it's changed many things for me. I am an Anglo-American, but I have lived most of my adult life in America, and I am a naturalized American citizen. But now I am contemplating more that ever of going back home, maybe when my kids grow up. I am coming to the realization that I will never "fit" in America. I think I would rather live in a failed empire than a failing one.

Thanks Siouxrose. You must be a very strong person to live in the Bible Belt with your progressive views. I'm hunkered down in San Franciso, I live a sheltered life!

I'm not entirely convinced that 9-11 is an inside job, myself. I have always said, contrary to popular opinion, that the neocons have never been interested in counter-terrosism and never will be. At the very least, I think 9-11 was an example of gross negligence. Remember the ignored warning memo, Richard Clark and of course the way Bush immediately cancelled the weekly counterterrorism meetings that Clinton had been holding for years?

I do think there is a horrible conflict of interest, however. If there's another attck who wins? BushCo, because they're supposedly string on terrorism. So what would motivate them to stop it happening? Certainly not for the good of the county.

Coyotita wrote,

"Troops are not to be blamed just because they are young and idealistic"

That is the strangest use of the word "idealistic" I've ever heard. Were the troops of the Waffen SS "idealists" too?

Idealism starts with rejecting the idiocy of patriotism, knowing what the word "imperialism" means, having enough of a history education - and plain common sense to know when a US president calls you to war, it is (with one arguable exception) against a land and people that are no threat whatsoever to anyone in the US, and often anywhere else, and don't even have a quarrel with the US. The only threat the targets of US aggression present the continued growth in the power and wealth of those who run this so-called democracy.

Our troops in Iraq know what is going on out there and their only way to inform the American public is to get their families to speak up for them. Thanks to the Jamison Cotes.

I applaud the moms and dads who speak up for their brave soldier sons, and no amount of heckling from those sitting on the sidelines with a computer convinces me otherwise. Today's soldiers are victims of a mad president and vice president. Young men have always been willing to fight the good fight of protecting and defending their loved ones. Sincere young men brought up by honest and loving parents have always been easy prey for the liars and shysters of this world, whom today may very well be the military recruiters who must meet their quota.
Sham wars, lying recruiters, and lying generals are doing military service a dishonor. Troops are not to be blamed just because they are young and idealistic and find out ultimately that their Commander in Chief is not to be believed, but rather know what is really happening by what they see with their own eyes.

ARVY: I agree with you entirely. So long as militarism is glamourized, a nation's sons (and some daughters) will be sent as useful fodder for war. So long as MSM defines war as the ultimate sacrifice for country, and INVENTS compelling reasons for fighting said war, parents will send their children or support the decisions of young persons to particpate in these travesties.

As the dancer said, it takes two to tango. I have some compassion for the soldiers being placed face to face with hell's image and likeness; and I realize many otherwise would have held depressing jobs due to economic constrictions, but there ARE always other options. I once met this pathetic, good looking guy who was a male prostitute but thought he was spiritual. He tried to convince me there were no other job opportunities than selling his flesh. I would not accept this "argument" from either gender, it's debasing. War is the ultimate prostitution that turns sacred lives into blood baths.

Winnetou: "The Cote's son is also just being exploited by an abusive system ..."

Sorry, but I just don't buy that 'killer as a victim' stuff. His family to some extent, perhaps. But, as far as I'm concerned, there is far too much empathy in the US for those who volunteer to do the (corporate) state's killing and other dirty work.

With all the TV/Hollywood glamorization of criminals in general, I think I can understand some part of why that is so. But that excuse (if it can be so called) just doesn't cut it for me when I consider all the charred and bloody results. My empathy remains where I think it truly belongs.

Arvy,

Yes I agree with most of what you say, but the people being tortured and bombed are not the only ones who are victims of this war. People like the Cote's are also affected, especially when their son eventually comes back from Iraq, broken and confused. It is definitely important to empathize with his and their pain as well, if only to educate people in order to prepare for the next time a deranged president is calling on the nation's young men to 'defend the homeland'. The Cote's son is also just being exploited by an abusive system, and they have to learn to fight back.
Shatter all the illusions about the grandeur of war.

"we will either run out of money, bodies to send, or friends to support us, or maybe all three".

It seems that the U.S. government ran out of money long time ago. The debts are immense and the next generations will have to pay for it (and Chinese workers at the present). The only thing they still have in large supplies is nuclear weapons and you can nicely force your will upon others in that way and steal and invade as much as you want.
But I don't know whether that will ever settle your debts. Karmic debts, that is.

y2kcockroach November 12th, 2007 12:32 am

"Well, bubble boy is gone in thirteen months, no matter who is elected, and I cannot see the situation possibly getting worse with his departure, so at least that is something to look forward to."

It will be worse, or at least as bad, if either Guiliani or Clinton is elected POTUS.

Lobo Gris

How sad.

Another nail in the coffin of liberty and freedom.

O Roe - Thank you for trying to enlighten "some others" about the Cote's situation. I sometimes feel that there are a lot of smart well-educated kids on this blog who have great theories but no empathy for others. I myself have no theories, but I do sympathize with the Cotes. I've lived through too many wars not to know that they are experiencing about the worst that can be.

Your advice to the Cotes that they join CodePink is good - or any other peace group in their area they can find. Sometimes the best you can do is to find others who think as you do - and then you're not so alone. And you may find that as part of a group you can actually make a difference.

I thank the Cotes for their courage in writing their article and wish them and their son all the best.

Yes, the way the Mr. and Mrs. Cote chose to express themselves may have been not the way 'They Should Behave', they are learning, allow them that.
They have a son there, their priority is getting their son home ALIVE,per chance Cindy Sheehan could make you, who tag and flag, try a tad of the empathy you insist upon in understanding their angst.
Do you think they are unaware of the immense loss of civilian life? Do you know what it feels like to have your child involved in such an immense atrocity that you no longer feel there is anything that you as 2people are able to do to end it? They need to become knowledgeable in what it is they are actually capable of doing. They need to be shown how and where they can seek others that will show them how, while remaining empathetic to their ignorance and feelings of helplessness. Go to the CODEPINKsite, Mr. and Mrs. Cote, I would be happy to give you your power back to ensure others children referred to as so much 'Collateral Damage'will not continue to be murdered.
Your foremost concern is for your child while you must also remember there aremany civilians of these countries we invaded are already dead. There are many peace activist's willing to educate you without judgeing or childish name-calling, for many of us are serious when it comes to that word PEACE, and will respect you in a most peaceful manner.
Peace

The Iraq war was a war of aggression, and by its very nature an illegal, immoral, unjust, unnecessary, pointless, and racist war. The war failed before it even began. Even though people will not recognize it as lost, the war is already lost. American taxpayer money bleeds straight into the pockets of the corporations and the rich, but not before it makes a long detour to Iraq and back.

The oppressor class in this fu**ing country are masters at outsourcing. Ultimately, they will even outsource the failure of this war to the middle and working classes. Already, this is beginning to happen: money for public services are cut while the rich pay for the services of private firefighters in California, to give but one of many examples. To believe that we all live in the same country is a naive, foolish, and dangerous delusion.

I too have serious problems with Mr and Ms. Jameson-Cote's view that the Iraq war is a "failed" endeavor, rather than rather than a murderous crime against humanity. Protesting from this perspective ends up just being a call for an air-war of even greater ferocity and indiscriminate slaughter, so the "failed" war can be turned into a "success" - even if it means a "final solution" so they can "bring the troops home".

This isn't speculation, this is exactly what Nixon/Kissinger did - in Cambodia, Laos and North Vietnam in response to similar calls to "bring our boys home". somewhere between 1 and 3 million died under their bombs.

You cannot get the right result if you argue with wrong reasons.

Win?
I think the goal is to bankrupt America and steal the retiremant and healthcare we have been paying for all our lives while providing endless wars for the Merchants of Death to establish global hegemony.
Win?
If we aren't there yet then just a few more lies and a little push on Iran should do it.
Win?
What's global warming when the world's back to the Stone Age and we're eating Dali's 'boiled beans' for supper?

THIS MUST BE SEEN BY ALL OF AMERICA..
SIMPLY COMPELLING..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJYbgouqlMw

Well, bubble boy is gone in thirteen months, no matter who is elected, and I cannot see the situation possibly getting worse with his departure, so at least that is something to look forward to. As far as characterizing the debacle in Iraq as a "civil war" however, that is of course nonsense. it is far more complicated than that. It is a sectarian and religious war certainly, and it is also a war against occupation. It is a conflict involving actors both within and without Iraq. At some point the occupiers will get run out of there (we will either run out of money, bodies to send, or friends to support us, or maybe all three). At that point the sectarian and religious-based war will continue, as an "enduring gift" of sorts from the people of America to the Iraqis and the Middle East in general. The current generation of Shiites (and Sunnis, for that matter) will need to be long dead and gone before anyone over there is going to forget what we have done..............

I do not know the anguish of having a son in the hellhole WE created, but it has to be unbearable. It took guts to make a stand against this war while having a son serving in it. But, I think the letter openly shows how little many people understand about WHY we entered this nightmare to begin and WHY we are still there and WHY we will be there for years to come. We didn't build the biggest embassy in the world in Iraq just for looks. We didn't build enormous bases in Iraq for practice building. The so called civil war was triggered by our Occupation, and probably what the architechs of this mess would call collateral damage.

Israel itself and the Jewish people relocated there after the Second World War are themselves just pawns in the game of the Imperialists and their goal of domination of the oil fields of the Middle East. Israel was little more than a big advance base for U.S. Imperialism. BushCo decided the time was ripe to expand to Iraq as well.

This is no civil war. Indigenous people are fighting to expel an aggressor that controls the skies and possesses massive amounts of murderous weaponry. It does not matter. At some time the occupiers will be ejected and will retreat in defeat and shame.

If you have not done so already, you should listen to Dennis Kucinich present his Privileged Resolution introducing Articles of Impeachment against Dick Cheney last week in the House.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJYbgouqlMw

If we had media that was other than an Orwellian newspeak echo chamber Congressman Kucinich's presentation would have been broadcast preemptively in real time and repeated that evening and he would have been the lead guest on all the Sunday talk shows this morning.

The case against Cheney is compelling and appalling. After listening to Kucinich's presentation it is shocking and disgusting to consider the position of the Democratic Leadership in the House.

The case is so compelling, however, that the truth of it may be so powerful that in the end it will break through regardless of the compromised nature of the House leadership.

While this is another scream from the heart of a "typical" US family that has sent a child off to the horrors of the occupation of Iraq, it is extremely naive, filled with myths, dismissive of the sacrifices of hundreds of thousands of brave US activists -- and yet again ignores and demeans the plight of millions of Iraqis who have been brutalized and murdered by more than a decade of Clinton/Bush 1 sanctions/bombings and nearly five years of outright US occupation under Bush 2.

Others have addressed some of the worst fallacies in this piece (though I may have used different language, I understand their profound anger and frustration at reading so many similar articles); so I want to confine my comments to these:

"This is not a small group of activists calling for an end to the war; it is not the typical anti-war crowd."

The underhanded attack on anti-war activists by those who describe themselves as not being "political," is a vile and hypocritical kind of reasoning that is at the heart of the problem of the US occupation of Iraq and nearly all else that ails us.

Politics -- the art and science of the exercise of power -- is central to the human experience.

Those who would disavow and deny this key human behavior(as do the vast majority of the US public)enable those who would misuse and abuse power to have their way over the rest of us. Sometimes they call themselves the Silent Majority. Other times the Moral Majority.

Of course, they are neither. They are simply the "silent" soldiers in the war of the rich and powerful against the rest of humanity. And when one of theirs is threatened by the bloodshed, they squeal the loudest at the unfairness of it all.

I hear tell that the Maine woods are pretty darned pretty this time of year.

Maybe the Cotes should take take a nice long walk and ponder the misery, insults and grief that sentiments like theirs bring to so many who sacrifice so much in the US and Iraq.

Maybe they'll even pen an apology on these pages for their silent support of the US corporate empire and the misery and destruction that it brings to our planet.

Maybe they'll even admit to the basic fact that human beings and societies are, among other things, political entities.

Maybe...

Iraq is not about trying to quell a civil war. It is about a U.S. invasion of the whole ME.

Kernel: "Arvy___ Nice comment there. Very inspiring. Next time tell us why you disagree so strongly."

I would have thought that the realities of the US invasion and occupation of Iraq have been articulated here so many times that reiteration would be unecessary and superfluous. If not obvious, read the comment by Little Brother that follows mine.

This is just one more case that attempts to characterize the US invaders as the good guys doing their best to help those ungrateful sand niggers to resolve their silly sectarian squabbles. Policing someone else's war, for gawd's sake!!! I guess the 'avenging 9/11' meme ran out of steam.

If you don't like 'bullshit', try pure, unadulterated, fantastical, but typical, self-delusion.

Mr. and Mrs. Jamison,

I strongly would urge you to follow your son's advice not only to put a more qualified candidate in the White House, but also to urge your friends and family to vote Susan Collins out of office and replace her with someone who is willing to stand for the truth instead of worrying about doing what she thinks is popular to get reelected.

Arvy___ Nice comment there. Very inspiring. Next time tell us why you disagree so strongly.

It is highly unlikely that Craig and Kathie`s son will be chosen to participate in Bush-Cheny`s next photo-op in Iraq telling us all how much progress they see and how glad the people over there are for all we have done for them.

"We have American men and women dying while prosecuting an illegal, imperialist war of aggression and occupation."

Not to put too fine a point on it.

"We have American men and women dying while policing someone else's religious civil war."

BULLSHIT!

This is a powerful example of how frustrated Americans are with the war in Iraq. It's dividing this country just like the Vietnam War did 40 years ago. I'm proud of all the members of the Cote family. The son for giving witness to what he sees firsthand, and to his parents for believing him. He's right up there with Lt. Watada in his honesty and patriotism. If we could get CODEPINK elected as the Mom of the country the Cote family could be in the new Department of Peace.
Hoa binh

y2k, do not think Shi'i or Sunni are going to be gone for quite awhile. Shi'i and Sunni will always be two more sects of their religion, that in some ME and Asia Minor countries there are no reactions in a violent manner towards one another.
My Goodness, this country with the Evangelicals, Baptists, N., S. and American, Episcopalian's, Lutheran's, Methodist's, Roman Catholic, Orthodox Catholic, Orthodox Jews, Hassiddic( or is it 1 d)pardon, if mispelled, NOI, regular ol'Muslim's like my Turkish husband that becomes Muslim, only if pork is on the table, Atheist's, Agnostic's, Bhuddist's, Baha'i, Coptic Christians, I think you got the point. It was and always will be........